Devil_hit11
Devil_hit11
About
- Username
- Devil_hit11
- Joined
- Visits
- 0
- Last Active
- —
Comments
-
@Predated said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2197670#Comment_2197670
"you do save time with the swing but not by a lot"
Enough to hit the survivor the second time you drop down, which is only 2 meters difference. But 2 meters is also the difference between baiting a Dead Hard or getting baited by a Dead Hard. I mean, if a survivor runs along the wall of the map, I can cut them off by cutting the corners. It might not save me a lot of time, but it does save me enough to hook them and go back to the gens that I need to pressure. "not a lot" can be the difference between a win and a loss in this game. Considering he did the same mistake 12 times(yes, I counted as he got looped on the same window 12 times), if he had swung instead, the loop would have lasted 5-6 windows at best. Since every 2nd or 3rd window it would have been a hit, instead, yknow, 12 windows with 0 hits. "not a lot" turns an infinite into a very finite loop.
"the map is still broken. trust me"
Ah yes, the biggest source of trust that trumps all counter evidence. I agree it needs alteration, after all, even with my sweatiest plays on my strongest killers I sometimes barely get a 2k. But to call it broken? I mean, would you call Hawkins broken? Haddonfield is to survivors what Hawkins is to killers.
Myers house isn't even worst loop on haddonfield. There are these houses in haddonfield where..... a rng window spawns on top floor and the window does not have a balcony to the side so basically the strategy is to camp the window until the killer goes about 4/5th of staircase up than you just vault the window. there are more god loops windows than just middle on one in Myers House. The other loops consistent of beach loops that sometimes spawn a fance window facing the pallet(Creates a jungle gym on the map) or garage loop which you tend to predrop the safe pallet on corner, make 2 turns for killer to attain bloodlust 1-2 than you just drop the garage pallet and hard camp pallet. even if the killer has bloodlust 3, you react to the killer going on either side. Its infinity, even at bloodlust 3, you need to break it.
I don't know, survivors historically always had busted loops on most maps so you just need to get used to it.
-
@MadLordJack said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2197422#Comment_2197422
The OP was specifically calling out big maps. Also, people want Trickster to be 4.6 because they absolutely suck with him and don't want to adjust their playstyle or admit they cannot aim.
Seriously, for a killer that looks spray'n'pray, you really do have to be as accurate as Slinger or Huntress to do well.
I completely agree with this sentiment. 4.6 m/s is bail out for trickster having poorly balanced power and killers not taking the time to master his spray& play play style.
My issue with Trickster though is his ability being unrewarding even when your aim is on point. that's why my changes that i proposed when he first came out were following:
-Knives requirement to injure a survivor 8->6.
-Movement speed while holding a Knives increased to 105%.
-Laceration doesn't decrease passively, nor is decreased by m1
-Main event can be activated by secondary button when fully charged.
The idea was that the lower knive count would allow him to take a full health state when survivors animation lock themselves into a window. The movement would give him more opportunity to throw knives around corners more frequently. The laceration meter would allow him to bail out loops that are unfavorable for him without punishing him for previous knives hit on a survivor. The main event would allow him to use his power-up ability when it mattered instead of randomly. From playing a lot more, i feel like amount of knives is not needed anymore and just ability to abandon chases for split pressure would be enough. I think he would be good as 110% with last 3 changes.
-
@MadLordJack said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2196277#Comment_2196277
You don't dodge hatchets or harpoons, the killer misses their shot. There is a huge difference.
your movement affects their ability to aim and hit you. they missed their shot because you predicted where they were going to shoot ahead of time. Its called making reads. its what mindgames are. they're games within games that revolve around prediction over reaction.
I know its foreign concept because this game has so many loops where you can run around in a circle perfectly predicting the exact movements of a killer thus you are not tested on making reads and can just react to whatever the killer does.
-
@MadLordJack said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2196189#Comment_2196189
How the ######### are they going to sidestep the knives? They can't turn a corner any faster. Trying to "sidestep" anything is going to make them take even more knives than they had to.
I less you're assuming the Trickter has terrible aim, which... no. Just no.
The same way you dodge huntress hatchets and deathslinger harpoon shots. they don't turn corners faster, they turn corner slower but don't take damage. even if they do take damage, its still not as punishing as other range killers. that's whole point for why he's weak, he gets just as many chances to take shots, but his shots deal 1/8 damage. there has to some kind of advantage to playing this killer over other ranged killers but there just currently isn't and your promoting him as if he has "significant" advantages that make make "good".
-
@MadLordJack said:
He's not weak. You're overthinking him and playing him like an m1 killer or Huntress.
You do not ever m1 healthy people. You do not ever mindgame. You do not do anything but walk at people and throw knives. You chase them with knives, you injure them with knives, knives are your life.
You do need to learn his timings. You do need to be a very good shot. Jungle gyms and main buildings are his only counterplay and you can still down survivors there much quicker than an m1 killer no matter how good they are. You just learn when to ready your knives and throw them as you are turning corners.
all the survivors have to do is side-step the 2-3 knives he throws at each corner. for killer you claim that survivors helpless vs, he sure has some of longest chases.
-
I'd just want M1 not reset his stalk meter so that you can stalk people to 99% and injure them than 1 shot them when they fully heal. cooldown is easily fixable through add-ons. his stalking is too niche and too punishing so you rarely see him.
-
@MadLordJack said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2195784#Comment_2195784
And eight here is where you show your inexperience.
What you do at high-wall tiles as Trickter is ready your knives as you are turning corners and throwing them as the survivor is ahead of you turning their corner. You have to be extremely precise, because you only have the opportunity to land 2 knives, but if you do then that's 4 corner turns, or about 15 seconds, before they have a health state stripped away. If they try to leave the loop, you barrage them. If they take a window or pallet, you barrage them. Each of those barrages, if you are precise enough, is 4-5 knives depending on your distance. If you time your knives right, you don't lose enough distance for it to matter, though if you keep missing or only landing a single knife then you loose too much distance and you have to do a half-circuit without attacking to catch up.
Going for mindgames is wasting your own time.
have ever heard of this concept called "dodging knives"... side-steping. you make it sound like trickster has homing knives and that he is facing bots. everything you stating, huntress and deathslinger already do better. For example huntress can throw hatchets and hit you behind objects because her hitbox on hatchets are big enough to do so. Deathslinger has instant ADS so he can prefire as he turns corners without seeing the survivor and you know what, these dudes take a full state for succeeding. Trickster isn't good man. the small opportunities where he gets to hit 2/8th of health state are predictable and easily side-stepped. its why every tier has him at such low tier. he's worse at high walls than just moving at 115% which is the reason why many people ask higher M/S because its litterally more useful than his entire ability in some cases.
-
@Mister_xD said:
its still a very strong perk.
after all, paired with iron will all you need to escape a chase is some LoS blockers and the killer pretty much autmatically loses you. and that is a very strong ability to have.
yeah the issue is that if your chase <30 second long than it didn't hurt the killer and you wasted a perk slot for nothing. part of what made it strong is that you could get chased for 75 seconds which is decently long chase, than lose the killer in 15 seconds denying them the hook. I hope they buff it back to 90 seconds. I was looking forward to watching killers get 0 hook games from IW+LB gamers for some good laughs.
its pretty weak perk sadly, the numbers too bad even though the effect is really good.
-
@gibblywibblywoo said:
Playing more of him I'm seeing the complaints. From both sides.
As survivor, if you get a map with no or very few high walls there is NOTHING you can do to escape him or not get downed. He's like a weaker Deathslinger/moonwalk Legion. If you get a ton of high walls he may as well not exist and you won't see him all game as he tries to get just 1 hook. His "counterplay" is the same as Deathslinger pretty much. And I don't know anyone that really finds him fun to play against.
As killer his 110% with no mobility and a mediocre ranged attack means he's powerless at high walls and gets looped to death.
There is isn't a single map that does not have at least one high-wall.
What is this concept of juking/dodging daggers? there's clearly something you do. its just not as braindead as run a loop tightly 2 times and than drop pallet. Trickster definately needs some big help. too bad you won't see a mid chapter patch till like 4 months from now, so have fun playing vs weakster if you ever play against him. adding walk speed would be like worst change he could get.
-
@supersonic853 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2194323#Comment_2194323
Oof you wound me. But it was a doc who your not meant to loop for prolonged periods of time. Also he did have docs best anti loop addon combination. And even then i lasted 70 seconds. Coulda lasted longer if i went to the pallet besides the big building instead of running straight to the building. Also the fake left into vault. Personally i thought it was fun though i had a blast. Please don't make fun of anyone else who participated we were all doing it in good fun and im sure they are all good people.
ehhh, doctor is tricky, a lot of people consider B-tier average or something but a good doctor is very hard to loop. My tip to looping a doctor is to not drop pallets when doctor is far away from you. A lot of survivors tend to get conditioned into being denied a pallet drop that when they do get to drop a pallet, they end up dropping the pallet into animation lock which results in doctor walking in your direction and smacking you after the pallet drop. Another tip I'd say is that if your further than like 16 meters away from the doctor, you can often side-step his shock on purpose, but you will lose distance because your not running the loop optimally, but this can be good if your goal is to drop a pallet. Dead hard is really good vs doctor, a lot of survivors save their dead hard, but than realize they've been shocked thus unable to dead hard, use dead hard to dodge electricity on the floor instead for distance. I'd say you can do a 2 minute chase.
I am not sure why people think that this isn't a real simulation of the game. the real similuation the game is even easier because killers have to find survivors manually, put survivors on a hook and you get 3 chances each to achieve this result.
Rip the people that got Nurse, they shouldn't play the lottery. they won't win.
-
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e5-JbEJirqE
fracture cowshed is 2nd most busted map for survivor. I think zubat said this at the end but he actually could lasted longer. he didn't go to cowshed that has a god window until you break the breakable wall and there are plenty more pallets behind the barn, in front, to left of it, there is also jungle gym that usually spawns moving left of the barn, a pallet to top-right and all these pallets are safe(all M1 killers will never get a hit) if the survivor plays it perfectly. I'd say you can run cowshed for about 5 minutes straight on average in your first chase.
you know what's hilarious though? they don't balance for high-level. instead they balance for what Dowsey survivor-level. most of the survivors could barely run a killer for 30-60 seconds. why do they balance for this? No clue.
Its not like this on every map but a good chunk of the maps are minimum 3 minute+ that are full of safe pallets.+holding W. its why you need to learn to break off chases and utilize deadzones to cut your chase time vs better survivor players.
-
@MadLordJack said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2194277#Comment_2194277
The fact that you think that wouldn't completely break her kind of shows how hard she really is.
i don't think she needs buffs, i think she's already really strong. no clue why people think a ranged attacking killer is weak. many killers could only dream to have access to ranged attack.
-
@MadLordJack said:
Are you seriously complaining about survivors cleansing? I know Plague is hard, but come on.
Plague is the least picked because she's insanely ######### difficult in every way. She might be the hardest killer in the game. She's certainly much harder than Nurse, the girl you spend a couple hours failing with then suddenly 4k every trial.
Plague requires precise mechanical skill, amazing power knowledge and practice, very good map knowledge, amazing m1 skills, the ability to make snap decisions and formulate complex plans based on information you glimpsed from the corner of your eye, and of course, not playing like a saint.
really? i find her really easy to play. I just kinda wish her cooldown-post puking wasn't there. maybe they want to really buff her, they could make the action of charging her puke not have any movement speed penaltiy and allow her red puke to double hit survivors in single stream. I think those would be way more impactful than OP suggestions.
-
@Skysair said:
I like Death Throes Compilation.
I don't know why everyone shits on it. It's quite powerful if you know how to aim and land your knives consistently.
It's an addon that is high-risk, high reward.
If you're confident with your knives, you'll do fine. If not, maybe pass on using this specific addon.
Iridiscent Photocard is worse than Death Throes Compilation, can't change my mind.
wow... you like speed limited as add-on for trickster? you realize this add-on is like paying for iridescent version of speed limiter for Billy. If your so good at aiming without missing, than you will down survivors fast enough without add-on and if you miss at all, than this add-on makes your blades do 50% damage. probably worst Iri add-on in the entire game. there are a bunch of useless killer add-ons in the game but none are so bad to the point that cripple your power with half damage.
@KiaTheDead I think the add-on is suppose to increase the damage of your knives so that you down quicker but the drawback of 50% starting laceration is far too penalizing. ideally add-on should improve the killer without negatives. maybe if the add-on started at 100% laceration and ramped up by 50% to 200%, it would be good. It would still penalize you for missing but at least you wouldn't do half damage.
Also I am not sure if this tooltip error or it is part of add-on, but the add-on states that your suppose to do more damage if your hitting knives from further proximity of the target... but this aspect makes zero sense because trickster does very little damage with his projectile and the further the target is away from you, the more likely you are to miss from recoil.
-
@whycantIwin said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2190551#Comment_2190551
That's why I added the movement speed buff for each hit, making it way easier to hit multiple survivors even if they split up, and this isn't meant to be something that will happen every single time, it's just to give the "opportunity" to down someone with your power if you managed to injure everyone with it.
and I am glad you like the Idea
what will occur is that survivors will be encouraged to split up vs legion but suppose legion lands 2 consecutive hits, the 3rd person just has to camp any pallet and wait for Legion to swing, during his recovery, just drop the pallet(preferably unsafe) on his head to end his feral frenzy preventing the 4th person from ever going down. Legion will rarely ever get to activate his blood drunk to get downs but he force survivors to waste pallets.
this was how you countered old legion with frank mixtape, you camped pallet so that when he hits, he can't second-hit you so now it takes 3 feral frenzies instead of 2, 4 without add-on, loop the 110% killer.
I don't know, legion is not very good so I think he'll take any change he can get that makes his power impactful in any form.
-
@Blueberry said:
I'd personally rather just lower the fatigue out of FF by 1 second and apply Deafened with the Deep Wounds effect.
This essentially ups their skill cap and mind game potential.
I feel like regardless of what the fatique timer is, the sprint burst that a survivor gets from getting a feral frenzy hit will always result in them getting to a loop at which point the fatique has no meaning.
I think biggest issue regarding his rework is how it removed all the lethality away from his power and how survivors don't really need to heal against Legion to beat them(with proper looping skill). I think what I would do is make the feral frenzy deplete 1/4th of the bar per stab(Downing someone puts you into fatigue) and make it so that when a survivor mends their deep wound, they suffer from the oblivious status effect for 60 seconds.
The first change would discourage survivors from ever grouping up because after his stabs the 3rd person in feral frenzy, the 4th stab would be a down so he can actually get some "big" reward for using his power. The second change would discourage survivors from staying injured the entire game because they would very tease while injured. It would be like, "do I risk working on the gen injured?", "Do I look to find healing?", "Do I look for a safer gen where you have vision coverage?", I think it would make Legion way more challenge to escape against.
I really wonder what would happen if killers got a perk like STBFL that lowered the TR passively by 3 for hooking obsession(max 3 tokens). That perk+M&A would be super strong on Legion.
-
@Reinami said:
MMR is going to do one of 2 things, and it entirely depends on how the devs react to it.
It is pretty clear to anyone who has played this game for a long period of time. That if you were to take the 4 best survivor players in the world, and pit them against the best killer player in the world for each killer. The only one who stands a chance is Nurse, and MAYBE spirit. The reason for this is simple. The game was made with the idea that it is a "hide and seek" game, where survivors don't want to be found. Then it became apparent how strong looping was in this game with all of the infinites. Since then, there are no more infinites, but basic math will tell you that survivors can waste far too much of a killer's time allowing all the gens to get done. Literally by just holding W and running in the opposite direction. No pallets, no windows, no looping, no nothing. A survivor can waste 46 seconds of a killer's time assuming the killer doesn't have a power that can counter holding W, like spirit or nurse. Now when you factor in optimal looping and pallet usage, it becomes extremely difficult. The survivors can just waste too much time.
Against solo queue survivors, the game is tilted too far in the favor of the killer. If survivors DON'T play optimally, they are going to lose most of the time. We all have experienced it, the guy self caring in the corner of the map. The people urban evading when the killer is on the opposite side of the map in a chase, the survivors who just waste shack pallet immediately. Most Survivors typically don't play efficiently, and they play more "immersed" and are "afraid" of the killer, so they tend to try and hide, and not repair generators as much as they could because they are worried the killer might show up. They often hide until they know the killer is chasing someone else, wasting precious seconds in the early game that are so crucial to winning.
The average player, killers are too strong.
The highest level play, survivors are too strong, especially SWF.
The dev's red rank stats prove that its not even a red rank vs others thing. In red ranks, nurse is the lowest kill rate killer in the game. It is pretty clear, red ranks don't really mean anything.
Now, because the devs are very data focused, we can assume one of the following 3 things about how the devs are looking at this problem.
1) The devs know this is a problem, and don't care
2) The devs know this is a problem, and don't know how to fix it
3) The devs don't know this problem exists.
Now let's imagine a world where MMR becomes a thing. When it happens, you will see a few things happen. Matches will get more fun and balanced for everyone on average, for a while. However, because MMR is tied to killer, the top level survivors will only ever go against nurse and spirit every single game since they are the only ones who can compete at that MMR. Eventually those players start to get bored of the game, and will quit. Then, as the number of high level survivors dwindles, queue times get longer, and in order to match people, lower level survivors get matched with those top level nurse and spirit mains. Given that those survivors already are brushing that line where killers are OP for them, they won't be able to handle it. And eventually it will spiral out of control.
Now, when MMR happens, they will be able to see from the data that only nurse and spirit are able to compete at high MMR, they will have data that proves this. Additionally, they will have data that proves that the average survivor can't handle most killers, this comes back to the 3 points i mentioned before.
1) If the devs know this is a problem, and don't care, then the data will show there is a problem and they won't be able to ignore it. If they continue to ignore the data, then they go back on their ideas and methods of using data to make decisions. Because the data is showing them a clear problem, and ignoring it and doing nothing, would be extremely hypocritical. Eventually people will catch on, and it will cause some problems. If they don't ignore it, then they start fixing the problem, and the game gets much better for every one.
2) If the devs know this is a problem, and don't know how to fix it, they will now have more granular data that will allow them to better see what exactly is going on. They might start being able to identify these top players and ask them what they feel the problems are. The hope there, is that with MMR it will allow them to better see the discrepancies between the levels. They will see what solo average survivors are doing wrong, and be able to make changes to that. They will be able to see what high level SWF tryhard survivors are doing and nerf those aspects that make them too strong. Hopefully leading to a better game.
3) If the devs don't know the problem exists, the data will now make it clear that the problem exists and they can start working on fixing it.
The reality is, depending on the reason this problem has existed for so long, that will dictate what the result of MMR will be and what their attitudes toward it will be.
Personally, i am optimistic that it will ultimately make this game much better. The devs will either, finally see the problem, figure out how to solve the problem, or stop ignoring the problem, and will finally fix things. That is my personal prediction.
first, they already know its a problem. Marth 3 years ago made a depip squad where his entire objective was to find out whether killers on average or survivor are stronger. the result was that he depiped 200 out of 197 killers and only 3 of them black pip. I am guessing that every game was 0-1 hook game if its using current emblem system and if it wasn't, than they must been using that old system that either worked off bloodpoints or the one that worked off kills. either way they know its problem.
It being problem does not matter and SBM will not fix the problem or encourage fixing the problem. What SBM does is reorganize matchmaking pool according to skill. Suppose you have 16000 players in a matchmaking pool and lets imagine this is entire playerbase of DBD(It is not). 12,000 must be survivor and 4000 must be killer and anything else or more would be too much killer or too much survivor. If i had to take a guess, I'd say that killer queues are instant and survivor queues are slower so there is definitely more survivors on average than there is killer.
Statistically, your skill on both survivor and killer is denoted by a percentile graph in statistics. 0th percentile = the worst player in DBD and 100th percentile=the best player in DBD. If emblem system worked correctly, there are 4 ranks so in theory, if the emblem system was perfect denotation of skill, each color would denote 25% of percentile of skill for a survivor. Matchmaking would be as simple as find 1 red rank killer and 4 red rank survivors and the game is balanced(skill-wise). If there shortage of one in either side, like suppose in the most extreme case, a red rank killer faces 4 purple rank survivors, if the killer loses, he would lose an insane high amount of MMR/rank because he is expected to win and the survivor would lose nothing if they lose but gain a lot if they win. Unfortunately emblem system is not a perfect description of skill and I believe they use emblem system to do current matchmaking as it is now and it is the reason why the majority of your killer matches/survivor matches(if your good) are very easy. bottom line, your not getting matched by equal opponents. that is why its so easy.
Ok, so does that mean that rank 20 is same as rank 1? that is 100% FALSE. a rank 20 is NOWHERE near the skill of rank 1. if you think this, your crazy. a bran new player who doesn't know where a gen is, doesn't understand looping or chases in general or any killer is definitely not equal to a player that has moderate understanding of the game. When developers said that "Rank does not matter", it was one of those, "We did pretty good job moments". Rank does matter and emblem system does separate skills, but it does so in a way that is not practical. What the current ranks do is they seperate skill-levels by the LOWEST possible common denominator. In essence, rank 20-15 is equal to 0-15th percentile in the graph and there are no players who are 15th or higher percentile in 20-15 and if there are, the rank system will currently rank you up to be past these ranks. rank 15-10 is say 15-30th, 10-5 let say is 30th to 60th and than we get to red ranks where..... it is like 60th to 100th percentile. You have to understand that suppose I am a 90th percentile killer, If i face a team that has 60th percentile across 4 survivors, this is like a challenger player in league of legends fighting platinum players. you have to understand that if I am playing a killer with full meta build vs these survivors, its like... not even a challenge and they're very certain to lose and this is like the majority of red rank matches for killer if your good at said killer. It is not that the killer is overpowered or anything, it is that your facing such a discrepancy in skill that if i was running no add-on or perks, the match would be closer but still slanted in my favor due to skill difference. we're both red ranks but we do not play at the same-level.
what this means is that there are levels within the ranks themselves. you could think of it like bronze-red rank, silver-red rank and gold-red rank and let say that bronze is 60-70, silver is 70 to 90 and gold is 90 to 100. this exists in all ranks. There is just huge range of skill within same rank from emblem system. The reason why there are so many red ranks in red ranks but do not belong in red ranks is because threshold to get to red ranks is low enough that most people can get to it but not everyone has same skills within red ranks. This has everything to do with it being easy to win but not so easy to lose pips assuming your threshold of skill reaches a certain percentile. Basically, as long as you win more than lose, than your better than the percentile your in so you will eventually hit red ranks whether you like it or not through playtime. Its hard to track for how good you are, but the faster you get to rank 1 on average is how good you are compare to your competitors.
What SBM will do is it will take all red ranks and it will pair the best killers with the best survivors(on average) until it runs out. The leftovers for killer or survivor will be face lower skill players which means the matches will be imbalanced but they should theoretically never be landslides and losing/winning in these matches will not give or lose much MMR. I am unsure how they will base MMR and how the skill will be calculated. If you ask me, the better players are the players that make few mistakes, Its like chess, if you never make wrong moves like an engine, than you'll never lose but we're all human so everyone makes mistakes, the one that makes fewest mistakes is the better player. so In my opinion, the survivor team that completes most possible gens(or all of them), takes fewest amount of hits overall and suffers least amount of hook states will be the team that survives the most and will escape more often than a team fails to achieve these objectives. Its same for killer really. The killer that gets the hits the fastest will get more downs on average. it means they will hook faster, kill faster and win faster in a more consistent manner.
Personally, I find this system extremely convoluted and if I was designing a ranking system, this emblem system would definitely not be it. I am not going to go in detail to why you will not face Spirit/Nurse every game as survivor but just note that if your playing a weaker killer, you will likely be a lower SBM on that killer than you will be on strong killer unless your exceptional.
-
last year, the image of the 4 show cased a hat like figure that ended up being pyramid head. This year, the 5 showcases another hat like figure within the 5. The first part of the 5 looks like MR X hat. I think its very unlikely they would choose a new villain from RE franchise. I am curious for how they will deliver the chapter. For one, The only notable time where MR.X was playable character was in RE Resistance and in that game, he had an ability where he dashes forward while gliding along walls and you'd press a button for him to perform a finisher swing. In this game context, that would most likely be an instant down. Will that be his power or will DBD invent more along his power? He also had a Mori animation in that game where he grabs a survivor, picks up their head and severed their head than dropped them on the floor similar to Myers Mori. Will that be his Mori animation?
Than there's question of what survivor will be. I think logically, they will release 2 survivors like demogorgon chapter, I think one of them will be Chris and the other one will be Jill and every other character will be a skin behind these two characters. Jill is likely to have characters like Claire Redfield, Ada wong etc. and Chris will probably have a skin for Leon and any other characters they decide to include.
I am more curious of what the perks of this chapter will bring more so than the characters.
-
@MadLordJack said:
You've got to be kidding. Certian Blight mains still have the easy way of doing things? Come on
I think its increatibly stupid for a killer to get countered by standing in certain positions where you physically can't hit the survivor due to restrictions. At least Blight is S-tier now and the difference between good blight that uses his power at loops and a bad blight is night and day. they said they were going remove the 5000 DPI that enables Jflicking. they never said they were going to remove flicking itself. now everyone is playing the same version of blight instead of two different versions.
-
@Moundshroud said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2177826#Comment_2177826
I'm pretty sure Yords understands the purpose of Borrowed Time (both the current and recent version); I suspect he understands it better than you. What was the point of explaining the basics of trades to him? What he is talking about (and NOT complaining as another poster incorrectly stated) is that bad and inexperienced Survivors are not understanding the purpose of the Perk. They are literally using foolish, suicidal tactics. Myself, I'm an optimist and have faith the idiotic, misuse of the change in the Perk will self correct. He is a bit more cynical about it. He is correct, however, that time will tell.
I'm not trying to gut check you, I just don't see the point of your explaining that when it:
- Doesn't really address the problem he is speaking to...
- He obviously doesn't need a basics lesson.
What point of yours am I missing here? I'm assuming there is something?
he is complaining that the change to borrow time makes survivors become less mindful of safe hook saves(misuse of the perk) and that he's facing rank 5-20 survivors as if it was low MMR. Perks and Killer powers are tools. The tool is only as good as its wielder chooses to use it. BT is good tool and if you use it right, it can help you. Misuse the perk and it will hurt you. Its not BT change, its how people use BT at low-level. Its kinda how hoe people say dead hard is useless perk that makes you exhausted on the floor 99% of the time but its true strength was never dodging hits, rather its dash to get to safety and its use to take risky 50/50s that can be corrected if the killer reads it or how people say sprintburst is perk that makes you walk entire game when its true strength to 99% the sprintburst and use it mid-chase or to have it ready on deadzone generators to avoid early hits. you see my point?
-
@Yords said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2177719#Comment_2177719
While that may be true, newbies still did this before the BT buff, so I am pretty unsure on this theory. We might have to wait and see, but I don't think it will sort itself out.
DS discourages you from chasing a recently hooked survivor and encourages you to chase the unhooked person. by doing so, it makes that killer is prompted to spread hook states on on survivor teams thus discouraging the killer from tunneling a single person out of the game(only hooking that person repetitively).
Suppose 2 people on deathhook, 1 gen remaining, and one person is hook in the basement on 2nd state. you can hook trade in the basement saving the person that was on death-hook so that you preserve 4 survivors alive as opposed to 3 survivors alive. This can be done a total of 4 times in this situation giving you ample time to complete last generator and forcing the killer to either chase a BT person in a favorable survivor loop or go through 4 additional hook states before a single player dies. BT is really good anti-tunneling perk if used correctly, but when used poorly, it gives free hook states to the killer where he progresses the game faster than you progress your objective. Its also one of those perks where its stronger the more stronger your entire team is at the chase as the cost of chasing a survivor with BT is high when survivors complete their objectively quickly while it is very low when the survivor goes down immediately/does objectively slowly.
-
@ItzZane_ said:
Nope, but instead of exposed i think it should make you recover from exhaustion even while running but it will make the exhaustion effect stay for 80/70/60 not 60/50/40 secs
I think smarter version of the perk is to make you immune to the next exhaustion status effects once every 75 seconds but it bans you from using the same exhaustion perk twice. This would allow survivors to use multiple exhaustion perks at the same time. So for example, if you run sprint burst and dead hard. Once you use sprintburst, sprintburst goes on 75 second cooldown(Greyed out) and you can use dead hard when it becomes available.
Currently only reason to use Vigil is if you wish to weaken clown's power(Hindered) or Freddy Snares(Hindered) and nobody ever runs perks this specific to counter a killer. instead they moan about them like freddy instead of learning to play against them.
-
@Yords said:
Wraith even with his buffs is still pretty weak. He is still very easily countered by windows, pallets, proper positioning, and of course exhaustion perks. He also has quite a bit of addons that just aren't good and don't give him much. They are fun to use, but they aren't really that useful for the most part.
I play quite a bit of Wraith so I think I have a good say in this, but he is still weak. Even when playing very hit and run, he still struggles against any good survivor or a survivor who is aware of their surroundings.
I think he could use a decent rework, or a new mechanic to his power that is simple and easy to use without being unfun or too strong. I don't really know what it could be, but my concept for it could be a new status effect for when he hits his bell. A secondary action that could help him with map pressure.
So what could he use that would put him into the higher tiers? I would love to see Wraith being much more of a threat at the higher ranks.
And of course them most important new addition, he needs his own chase music.
The general layout for what a killer wants is that stealth killers have a very strong first strike but become very weak for 2nd hit as they lack any outplay mechanic at safe loops when the survivor is effective at using the loops. common way to counter stealth killers is healing so that you can brute force generator without the risk of being instant down from injured states.
That's principal of hit & run. If you injure a survivor on first hit, leave them, than find them again when injured, your first hit becomes an instant down as if it was an exposed-hit.
If there was an add-on that increased double effectiveness of mangled to like 40% or an add-on that when you come out of cloak, your stealth strike is an instant down. his hit & run would be very oppressive but he'd definitely be A-tier.
They did implement some mechanics to potentially give chances for wraith to outplay at loops but they're currently not very good. Like for example, he has pig's ambush charge after uncloaking but uncloak time takes too long and the duration is not really practical at most loops to get hits if the survivor knows how to play around it. Maybe if they buffed his swift-hunt add-on from 0.3 seconds to like 1.2 seconds and increased speed boost by another 0.25 seconds, he might have some play at loops in conjunction with body-blocking. They also gave him this strange Shadow dance add-on that you combine with his grey serpent add-on, with some perks like Enduring+Spirit fury or Brutal strength, you can break pallets quickly potentially giving you hits before survivors make to the next pallet but its not really practical for wraith to brute force loops. your better off just learning Bubba whose entire playstyle centers around this as base-kit.
-
@MadLordJack said:
It is my new favourite perk.
Its like the best killer perk ever. I thought self-care was an amazing killer perk, this one is even better. With pyramid head, at loops, it gives me free I'm all ears. It gives free aura reading purple add-on for huntress so I can snipe better in like corn maps. It allows me to deduce where entire team is because suppose I have 1 person on a hook, 1 person i predict in on x gen and i see OoO aura working on another gen. it tells me where 3/4 people are. At loops with blight, it gives me free compound 21. The information is really good for hit&run on Wraith and Ghostface. With Nurse, it makes my blinks super easy in a chase.
If I could equip a perk that gives me passive aura reading on all 4 survivors every 30 seconds on killer for 5 seconds. definitely would use over most tracking perks.
-
@Reinami said:
Ruin and corrupt together is terrible, while survivors aren't working on the gens they have nothing better to do then go for totems.
Pop+Ruin is good because pop is there when ruin gets cleansed and if ruin lasts the whole game then you probably won anyway.
Also, there is a reason that every killer runs those perks, because if you aren't running at least 2 game delay perks, you are going to lose.
The logic behind the combo is that corrupt saves you a single generator's worth of completion in early game. so if you were going to lose 3 gens, you will instead lose 2 gens. you could say corrupt intervention's worth is equal to 4 pop goes weasels in early game. Ruin is used to pressure generators at the start, as long as it exists, you can hold back the survivor's progression on generators and pop goes weasel is for late game 3 generators.
The basic idea is that you trade your perk slots for survivor hook states, like for example you win 4 chases but keep 5 generators from ruin+corrupt early game. with 4 hook states, suppose you hook play A twice, player B once, player C once and play D no times. Although you have lost 2 perks slots in Ruin+Corrupt, you have 5 generator remain so you have completed 24% of your total objective while they completed 0%. Now you can "slowly" trade-down the many generators that you are unable to defend from no ruin into remaining hook states to get a single player killed. If successful, you would have traded your perk slots for a survivor killed. Now you have pop goes weasel and an easy 3 gen setup from early corrupt intervention, all that is left to do is finish the match.
welcome to new killer meta. Its no surprise that new meta is 3 gen defense slowdown perks as hardest aspect of killer is managing your time and racing against the clock from the survivor's super-fast objective. If the survivor objective wasn't as fast, maybe there would be more killer perk variety. oh well. funny how weakening undying just made people use ruin and new undying is corrupt+pop.
-
@MadLordJack said:
That was a very good showcase of how not to play Trickster.
His power is deceptively simple. You hold W at survivors and they go down. Their skill doesn't matter. You don't mindgame, you don't go for fancy nonsense, you just walk at people with knives and the best they can do is loop a high wall. That House of Pain play was perfect from Tru3, but to be honest Otz was massively overthinking it.
clearly the survivor's skill does matter. If it didn't matter tru3 would went down. Its why Trickster is regarded as extremely bad and very low-tier. When the survivor is good, you won't down them regardless of your skill-level as killer. You'll see when MMR is implemented. When you face 4 Tru3-level survivors on one team, Trickster and a lot of other weak killers will often be an auto-lose. Currently Matchmaking has.... those Dwight level people at red ranks due to bad scoring/emblem system so it makes Trickster and a lot of other killers look a lot better than they're suppose to be.
-
you realize that all the killers would catch up quicker with 115% looping debris with no pallet than trickster would and that 4 wall loop is already unsafe and all killers with no power will land downs.
his counter-play is same as all other ranged killers, juke knives until he runs out. if your using this logic, than no killer has counter-play as every survivor will eventually go down if they get chased for 10 minutes straight. From few trickster that I've played against, they get very low hooks and usually 3 or 4 man escape. 52 second chase vs this guy is amazingly bad.
-
A killer perk that reduces sprint-burst when hitting a healthy survivor.
A survivor perk that allows you to fast vault windows from any direction. Exhaustion perk.
-
@Reinami said:
Seriously, look at some of these:
Deerkskin gloves:
- Moderately decreases hatchet reload speed
Flower Babushka:
- Considerably decreases hatchet wind up time
Manna grass Band:
- Moderately decreases hatched wind up time
Oak Haft:
- Moderately decreases cooldown between hatchet throws.
Shiny Pin:
- Slightly increases movement speed while winding up a throw.
And then we have, the glorious:
Rose Root:
- +20% Hatchet flight speed.
THANK YOU. Finally!
JUST.
GIVE.
US.
THE.
NUMBERS.
The argument for not giving exact percentages and numbers has always been: "Well it's hard to know what a 10% increase is because you have to know the base speed." But that is a terrible reason because it saying something "slightly increases speed" doesn't tell us a damn thing either.
Rant off.
It's 20%. a fully charged hatchet moves at 1000 m/s. with this add-on, it moves 1200 m/s. Uncharged hatchet moves at 625%.... let's see 625%*0.20 is .... 750%. a uncharged hatchet will move at 750%. Moral of the story. Flower Babushka+Rose root is new best add-on for huntress. The rose root effectively allows you to mid charge hatchets at new "old" max charge speed and fully charged hatchet with... these huge hitbox might as well be hitscan <15 meters.
I like how these giant hatchets hitbox now move faster than deathslinger's tiny harpoon gun with like the smaller hitbox and than you have trickster who has knives that move 1350 m/s or so but only deal 1/7-8th damage with same hitboxs as harpoon guy. balance at its finest as they say.
-
I mean survivors like where billy and freddy are happy where they at now. no reason to change them if other side is happy. they asked for billy and freddy nerf and they got it. The only way I can see those two ever getting changed in the future is if their pickrate goes to like <1% and nobody play them anymore. only than might they consider revert/revisiting them but its very unlikely.
-
@Blueberry said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2166493#Comment_2166493
"I think you were missing my point. what i meant was that spirit without stridor can consistently be juked wiith Iron will by skilled survivors making it a hard counter to her. The truly strong killers can can overcome their pitfalls(drawbacks), in her case the lack of vision to reap the rewards of 180 m/s-220 m/s phase walk. Stridor removes hard counter towards her and makes it a soft counter making her a powerful killer. survivors don't like this full access of control and power and therefore complain she is "too strong"."
I see what you're saying, I agree.
"I don't think agree with your last statement. The odds are stacked against the survivor against a strong spirit player with strong add-ons which is how killers should be. Its why scottjund at one point requests anyone to 1vs1 the his spirit to see how long they could last in a chase. the result would be obvious that the chase wouldn't last very long. With most of the other killers, their chases can last very long depending the pallets/resources used because the fundamentals of looping and loop design hard counter them in a chase. With spirit, they do not. This is why its impressive to escape a strong spirit player with good add-ons as opposed to other killers that consistently get destroyed with minimal effort with their best add-ons(if they have any)."
I disagree here about Spirit specifically. Spirit against a good group of survivors is nearly a fair a match, I'd even call it slightly in the survivors favor. That's even assuming no items so it could tilt in their favor even further. Scotts example isn't exactly a fair one. You can 1v1 decently fast with Spirit but good survivors will still generally come out on top simply through objective time disparities. We don't judge this game through a 1v1, we judge it through a 1v4. It's impressive to escape a strong Spirit because most survivor matches are against potatoes but that's not how we judge strength.
I agree about the issues with the other weaker killers though.
"I disagree here about Spirit specifically. Spirit against a good group of survivors is nearly a fair a match"
I find it slightly killer favored at least my play style with her. Most of the time, Spirit can completely kill a survivor within the duration of corrupt intervention. her unrivaled 1vs1 potential allowed her to effectively tunnel anyone out of the game very quickly. Due to her speed, she doesn't care about decisive strike as the distance that survivor would get from a stun is easily made up by her phase walk(with best add-ons). Now a days, survivors run Decisive Strike a lot less, so often you do not even get hit by it. I think the reason why scott said that was purely because he doesn't consider the game as 1vs4, rather he considers it more of 1vs1vs1vs1vs1. For the most part, if a killer is good at 1vs1, they end up having good 4vs1 as they can easily turn the match into 1vs3 very quickly. As fast objective time is, its pretty hard for spirit to lose if her phase walks are on point.
With weaker killers, they need to play around the perks, play around with many of the free time waste loops, do a lot of split pressure and micro management vs strong teams and still barely get a 6 hooks vs strong team even when playing near perfectly as humanly possible assuming a possible to win map while also fighting against their own power with these new drawbacks they keep inventing every patch. Spirit is like a breath of fresh air at this point.
-
@Blueberry said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2165489#Comment_2165489
"Its almost like she gets counter-play. who woulda gussed?"
She already has tons of counter play if they understand how she works.
"See, truly strong killers do not have hard counter-play."
They do have hard counter play.
"They just look at you and you die. That is what true power and control looks like. Its why survivors complain about her."
They complain because they're bad and just make excuses instead of taking responsibility. There's lack of accountability.
"It is why looping a spirit is so much more skillful than any of the others killers."
I agree.
"Its winning when the odds are stacked against you. Its very impressive."
I don't think it's stacked against them. It does show a high skill level to know how to juke Spirit though.
I think you were missing my point. what i meant was that spirit without stridor can consistently be juked wiith Iron will by skilled survivors making it a hard counter to her. The truly strong killers can can overcome their pitfalls(drawbacks), in her case the lack of vision to reap the rewards of 180 m/s-220 m/s phase walk. Stridor removes hard counter towards her and makes it a soft counter making her a powerful killer. survivors don't like this full access of control and power and therefore complain she is "too strong".
I don't think agree with your last statement. The odds are stacked against the survivor against a strong spirit player with strong add-ons which is how killers should be. Its why scottjund at one point requests anyone to 1vs1 the his spirit to see how long they could last in a chase. the result would be obvious that the chase wouldn't last very long. With most of the other killers, their chases can last very long depending the pallets/resources used because the fundamentals of looping and loop design hard counter them in a chase. With spirit, they do not. This is why its impressive to escape a strong spirit player with good add-ons as opposed to other killers that consistently get destroyed with minimal effort with their best add-ons(if they have any).
Moral of the story. use Stridor on Spirit, it makes her good.
-
@Blueberry said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2165038#Comment_2165038
"but you have to be good at listening out for footsteps, and knowing when to stop the phase early to catch a double back."
Good survivors will not be giving you footsteps and early double back is not reliable, it's still guessing. Those ending scratch marks could have got in multiple directions.
Its almost like she gets counter-play. who woulda gussed? See, truly strong killers do not have hard counter-play. They just look at you and you die. That is what true power and control looks like. Its why survivors complain about her.
With other killers, Its like opposite, the good survivors look at you and you get looped from seemingly endless string of safe pallets and relatively safe window vaults. With spirit, they aren't so safe and you have to make reads using the resources. I'd say any form of Juking is probably highest skill-expression that a survivor has for DBD. It is why looping a spirit is so much more skillful than any of the others killers. Its winning when the odds are stacked against you. Its very impressive.
-
@Blueberry said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2162363#Comment_2162363
"it already had niche uses with med-kit. 180 seconds is a lot of time."
Way too niche. Requires medkit of perk use to play around it.
"You could even make an arguement that the perk is in fact worse than it was before its changed if you were only using it to hide blood marks."
My argument wasn't about how good or bad the new Lucky Break is, simply that I would have preferred the other change which would've made it better for people interested in hiding blood.
"I don't think people equip boil over to have 1/20 game chance to escape the killer shoulders just like you won't equip lucky break to have a.... 4/30(?) in seeing it do something."
That's not an accurate comparison. Apples and oranges.
Not saying hiding blood is crazy strong or anything, you're just undervaluing it.
are you saying that 90 second lucky break wouldn't need med-kit to get multiple uses out of it?
Its not that it is niche, it is that old lucky break was ineffective perk with irrelevant effect. The no scratch marks is relevant effect in new one, though sadly it might not get used much now. It's ok, most chapter add very little perk wise anyhow, so we're used to it by now. Sort of miss old days where we were excited for new perks/changes. Now a days, its more like "cool zanshin tactic is better" or cool "Any mean Nessacary is better" neither of which I really see get used unless its tome challenge.
-
@Blueberry said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2162122#Comment_2162122
"Not really, following scratch marks is an essential skill to playing killer."
This has nothing to do with what I said.
"No blood marks is only hard counter to Wraith's perk "BloodHound", Hemorrhage status effect most often applied from the perk sloppy butcher or Spirit's father glasses add-on. Hemorrhage is most useless status effect in the game that nobody cares about and BloodHound is another one of those garbage killer perks that only get used by new players for tracking injured survivors that have trouble following scratch marks."
It has more use past all this. I'm not calling the perk meta, I'm simply saying it would be good enough to be considered for people that like stealth builds.
"The only way i can see the effect being good is if you have iron will in an indoor map like lery where blood is really easy to see and you walk around corners which makes very little sense in the middle of a chase most of the time."
Exactly and there are many indoor maps these days.
"In the end, Iron will is mostly used on loops that have wall blockers and what it does is it makes killer have huge risks for attempting to do red glow mindgames on outer parts of the loop as they may leave the loop, gain a lot of distance and hold W against you without having to use precious pallet resources from their juke, so even if you can track scratch-marks/blood, it is often too late. Worth the perk slot? Maybe, but I'd say slightly overrated. Its definately good in its magical moments. It often conditions killers to "brute force" loops with bloodlust because they're afraid that they could lose you."
I never said it was amazing/meta/better than Iron Will. I feel like you're comparing it to meta perks. I'm simply saying it would have some niche uses, not that it's gonna break into the meta.
it already had niche uses with med-kit. 180 seconds is a lot of time. You could even make an arguement that the perk is in fact worse than it was before its changed if you were only using it to hide blood marks. I don't think people equip boil over to have 1/20 game chance to escape the killer shoulders just like you won't equip lucky break to have a.... 4/30(?) in seeing it do something. some indoor maps it does not even work on. like elementary school, killers generally always have vision on you.
-
@Blueberry said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2161907#Comment_2161907
The whole point of the no blood isn't for sprinting, IE there won't be scratch marks with it. I do think they got overly scared as you mentioned but I do think you're undervaluing no blood permanently.
Not really, following scratch marks is an essential skill to playing killer. No blood marks is only hard counter to Wraith's perk "BloodHound", Hemorrhage status effect most often applied from the perk sloppy butcher or Spirit's father glasses add-on. Hemorrhage is most useless status effect in the game that nobody cares about and BloodHound is another one of those garbage killer perks that only get used by new players for tracking injured survivors that have trouble following scratch marks.
The only way i can see the effect being good is if you have iron will in an indoor map like lery where blood is really easy to see and you walk around corners which makes very little sense in the middle of a chase most of the time.
In the end, Iron will is mostly used on loops that have wall blockers and what it does is it makes killer have huge risks for attempting to do red glow mindgames on outer parts of the loop as they may leave the loop, gain a lot of distance and hold W against you without having to use precious pallet resources from their juke, so even if you can track scratch-marks/blood, it is often too late. Worth the perk slot? Maybe, but I'd say slightly overrated. Its definately good in its magical moments. It often conditions killers to "brute force" loops with bloodlust because they're afraid that they could lose you.
-
@Blueberry said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2161487#Comment_2161487
Iron will for blood, that’s all this perk needed I agree. They overcomplicated it.
Don't think so, following scratch marks is super easy. they needed both effects for it for to impact gameplay. they just chicken out because for some reason, they think meta perk =bad when meta perk just means it will get used unlike majority of the perks in the game that go unused due to little no to effect on gameplay.
as I said in previous discussions with you. the perks either have impact on gameplay or not have no impact on gameplay and it effects whether you see the perk or not. nerfed lucky break can probably get used one time on first chase but I do not think its worth the perk slot. I think I'd rather use Spine+Resilience over it. Chances are, if you lose the killer even a little bit, iron will already did its job in giving you distance.
-
The anniversary is around may 25th-28th, the killer is usually released like 2-3 weeks after which is like June 15-22. The earlier you can expect to see trickster change if any is August/October.
Weak killers like Weakster usually take a long time to get changed. Wraith was released in 2016 as part of original 3 killers. It took him 3 years to get invisibility for open maps and windstorm base-kit and now he is quite decent. Trickster could take 1 year or could take 3 years before he becomes decent. In the mean time, you get to play beta version of him.
-
@lagosta said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2156796#Comment_2156796
No, but him deducing a falsehood with incomplete prior information is a naive fallacy at best or malicious speculation at worst.
In his argument, he says he is in accordance with the nerf of billy addons that made insta saw and crackhead billy viable, but the impact of those addons was never disclosed by Behavior. Furthermore, the statistics of Billy without those addons were never disclosed, just the average pick and kill rates of the killer on all ranks/red ranks. That info alone was not sufficient to isolate Billy's performance as a killer.
Also, I said that there were possibly ulterior motives for his nerf (possibly motivated by corporate decisions IMO). That doesn't make Scott's argument more meritable in any way tho.
they were disclosed through deduction of both graphs. in 2019, his average killrate at red ranks was 75%. in october 2020, His average kill rate was 70%. The add-on changes impacted his average killrate by 5%. Default base-kit billy did not change, he is still the same. Even if you have problems with overheat mechanic, there is like grey and purple add-on that reduces overheat.
No clue for what scott is complaining about. The reason why he play rate went down from like 6-7 to like 3% is because billy can't compete vs good teams as the add-on that allowed him to compete were erased/plagued with unreasonable drawbacks. I am sure if those add-on returned and they got rid of the baby mode roar at the start of his sprint that give free information to dodge blind curves, he'd go back to where he was.
-
@Blueberry said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2155361#Comment_2155361
"your crazy, they can't buff killer perk like that. Some people literally run Corrupt+Ruin+POP on killer builds and even though these perks have absolutely zero synergy in terms of slowing down generators. Its literally better than most of killer perks individually. so ideas of adding more.... of those like brutal strength with 200% regression, dying light, thanotophobia....oppression...surge. Its why freddy got gutted pretty much even though he wasn't that bad at least compare to what your suggesting."
There's a limit of 4 perks. You act like you can stack all this stuff when you can't. All this does is make more variety of perks. You also are overreacting to these perks power levels, they aren't that crazy.
"Its like if i suddenly started improving potentially powerful survivor perks. Like second wind no longer requires you to heal a full health state and instead just heals your automatically after an unhook, Deliverance no longer requires a safe unhook, It works automatically from the start of a match. MoM activates on safe unhooks and only requires 2 tokens."
You aren't understanding power levels appropriately. The changes I made are not as significant as the examples you're providing. My changes only gets them to reasonable power levels while your examples are making busted perks. Apples and oranges.
"I am unsure but I feel like a lot of the perks that are not great numerically but have great effect might be bad because they're afraid that the stacking of the same effect might prove to be too powerful, so their mechanic/number are set to a very under-performing value. 7% fire up might not seem all that bad for individual perk slot, but if you combine it with brutal strength at 2 generator remaining, Its 41% pallet break. Funny enough a lot of the perks that have useful effect but a bad mechanic behind simply end up not getting used at all in the end."
Those stacking isn't that big of a deal because by the time Fire Up gets that high there aren't many pallets left anyway. Part of the reason people just stack gen slow down perks currently is because it almost always has a higher impact that the games chase perks. We need those chase perks numbers high enough for their impact on the game to be relative to the slow perks and make them worth considering instead.
"There's a limit of 4 perks. You act like you can stack all this stuff when you can't. All this does is make more variety of perks. You also are overreacting to these perks power levels, they aren't that crazy."
I think you under estimate those perks. the fact that you see at least one generator related perk on average if not all 3 of them in tandem shows how prevalent those perks are and how much the game gets baidaid fixed by them. Like i said, those perks do not have any synergy and yet you see people run ruin+pop+corrupt as their main builds.
"You aren't understanding power levels appropriately. The changes I made are not as significant as the examples you're providing. My changes only gets them to reasonable power levels while your examples are making busted perks. Apples and oranges."
your changes are significant. I play both survivor and killer and I rarely see Deliverance, Second Wind or MoM past someone doing adepts. those changes wouldn't be any different from your suggestions in making those perks meta compare classics of dh, ds, bt, iron will, spine+resilience etc.
"Those stacking isn't that big of a deal because by the time Fire Up gets that high there aren't many pallets left anyway. Part of the reason people just stack gen slow down perks currently is because it almost always has a higher impact that the games chase perks. We need those chase perks numbers high enough for their impact on the game to be relative to the slow perks and make them worth considering instead."
I personally use gen perks so I can go for many chases and play less lame. Of course, some of the killers, I am forced to slug because the generator perks are either unreliable or do not mend well with some killers(Like Twins or Nurse for example). Chases perks are well-balanced and they're probably 2nd most reliable perks to run to boaster most M1 killers, They just do not used purely because generators fly to fast vs good players. I am sure they're afraid of killers stacking a bunch of chase perks together and being really good in in 1vs1.
I do find it funny that some of the perks like fire+up brutal strength get put into killer powers like Billy,Leatherface, Blight and soon to be demo, but the perks themselves end up being so far behind from their killer counter-parts. Even looking at coup de grace, The new wraith has that perk in his uncloak now with no restrictions and yet the perk is bogged by limited tokens. so they're afraid to make good perks but end up making killer powers from those perks.
very comical.
-
@Blueberry said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2154322#Comment_2154322
Perks should not be countering specific killers. The devs have already been rectifying this and do not want it to be a thing.
Spies point is not to get there in time. The point is have information of where the survivors are on the map for micromanaging. Its current state is worthless.
Your technician change would make it still be worthless. The silence wouldn't be OP on certain maps it would be a niche stealth build.
your crazy, they can't buff killer perk like that. Some people literally run Corrupt+Ruin+POP on killer builds and even though these perks have absolutely zero synergy in terms of slowing down generators. Its literally better than most of killer perks individually. so ideas of adding more.... of those like brutal strength with 200% regression, dying light, thanotophobia....oppression...surge. Its why freddy got gutted pretty much even though he wasn't that bad at least compare to what your suggesting.
Its like if i suddenly started improving potentially powerful survivor perks. Like second wind no longer requires you to heal a full health state and instead just heals your automatically after an unhook, Deliverance no longer requires a safe unhook, It works automatically from the start of a match. MoM activates on safe unhooks and only requires 2 tokens.
I am unsure but I feel like a lot of the perks that are not great numerically but have great effect might be bad because they're afraid that the stacking of the same effect might prove to be too powerful, so their mechanic/number are set to a very under-performing value. 7% fire up might not seem all that bad for individual perk slot, but if you combine it with brutal strength at 2 generator remaining, Its 41% pallet break. Funny enough a lot of the perks that have useful effect but a bad mechanic behind simply end up not getting used at all in the end.
I don't know, I think community is very fragile when it comes to perks being very impactful to gameplay which is why you see very little perks changes in general.
-
cheap gin bottle and cigar box are his best add-ons now. I don't think they need to be base-kit, if you want them base-kit, just spend blood points and use them every game. The issue is that without these add-ons, yellow antidote speed-ups are underwhelming and the speed boosts are very hit or miss. I just wish he did not have activation delay on them, he would have so much more control over his power. He wouldn't been seen as D-tier after that.
-
@supersonic853 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2152406#Comment_2152406
Honestly i feel bubbas downside addons arent even that punishing. The worst ones for him were the engravings but with a good bubba even thats not much of a downside.
meanwhile one engraving on billy and you basically overheat after 2 saws. Bubba don't really care.
Na bubba has bad add-ons too. Carburetor tuning guide is bad because you lose ability to control when your chase saw ends and it reduces your movement speed. Depth Gauge Rake makes your chainsaw go longer.... but it also reduces your movement speed and whats the point if you can't catch up to anyone. Light Chasis aura-reading is too little range and it would be better if it worked during chainsaw sprint. Most of chains have pointless effects. Shop Lubricant is the perk knock-out with a million conditions to activate. Knife scratch does not add enough movement speed for the negative of longer reving and most of the other add-on are related to tantrum.
Billy most important add-ons were charge time reduction and doom engraving which required him to run a charge time reduction to mitigate the negatives. Bubba add-on are Chili's and Beast marks. he uses those because of how his acceleration and duration works with his speed. both of them curve objects, but they do so differently. Their add-on list might as well just be 3 add-ons as nothing else really matters for them.
Nobody faces good billy anymore, they all quit.
-
@Crowman said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2150687#Comment_2150687
Freddy isn't going to be d tier after his nerfs. People really got to stop overreacting considering the worst nerf Freddy got wasn't even a direct one, it was the bt change.
I think BT change is least of Freddy concerns. I think he's going be C-tier because they forgot to nerf his teleport at generators. maybe they should double cooldown so it becomes more apparent.
Dream world for post-nerf Freddy has no effect. he gets slowdown when holding a fully charged snare and slowdown for about 0.75-1 second after placing a snare which entirely counter-acts the hinder effect for walking over a snare and they removed swing chains and jump rope which were only add-on that punished you for being in dream world and if that wasn't bad enough. Clocks gives 30 second immunity to dream world while also extending the automatic sleep timer by 30 seconds for total of 90 seconds, so passively, Freddy will have less survivors in the dream world even if his other powers weren't touched.
People will figure out his C-tier status after a year. its same as billy. It just takes a while.
-
@CantDeadHarder said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2151003#Comment_2151003
surely doesnt feel that way to me. It usually just feels like I'm getting punished because of not knowing information I'm not allowed to have.
She can hear me, has an addon which allows you to see blood so it's more accurate tracking, and she can hear the little "umpfs" you make when you slow vault things. While all I hear is blaring chase music and/or the loud terror radius which covers up any sound she might make.
tbh I'd rather go against a nurse cause atleast with nurse I dont feel like I went down because of bs, I went down to a killer who has great muscle memory and has good game sense, so when I die to a nurse I don't feel as miserable. But I hate Spirit because I have to use more brain power to try and not get hit while they can just hold W at me and use their ears. I just feel like she's too easy to play for her to be that good of a killer.
"She can hear me, has an addon which allows you to see blood so it's more accurate tracking, and she can hear the little "umpfs" you make when you slow vault things. While all I hear is blaring chase music and/or the loud terror radius which covers up any sound she might make."
Father glasses is iri add-on. Funny enough, if you ask popular opinion for what people believe is the best spirit's add-on, They'll say Mother Daughter Ring+Yakuyoke Amulet. Father glasses is really rare to face in my experience but it is no doubt a very strong add-on that is often paired with the perk sloppy butcher. I understand why people think Mother Daughter ring+Yakuyoke Amulet is stronger and it has to do with how blight plays the game. The ring allows you to move at 220% and Blight's power moves at 230%, This amount of speed is fast enough to hit survivors before they make it to next loop after a pallet break. It is important to remember that Spirit retains full control unlike blight where you can use objects to dead angle his swing that many players fail to utilize. The father glasses on other hand.... gives you very precise information and removes a lot of the mindgames if you utilize information correctly so I would say that both of these add-ons really ascend spirit similar to how 5 blink nurse and omega blink ascended nurse in the past. I'd say these add-on are basically the reason for her S-tier status.
"tbh I'd rather go against a nurse cause atleast with nurse I dont feel like I went down because of bs,"
I don't really enjoy good nurses because her power is too raw and very direct. Also a lot of good nurses generally slug because its extremely advantageous to do so. Nurse can win worse teams without it, but she becomes a lot easier to gen-rush due to inadequate amount of map pressure being exerted. I'd say it depends what you consider "bs" hits. If you think saying that in the context of ultra-weak loops, for example the car loop directly outside of badham school, realize that most of the killers would get same hits as spirit would at these weak loops. those loops are practically joke loops. If your talking about the stronger loops, I'd say spirit power plaster fixes a lot of badly designed tilesets for killer and you have fair shot at wasting spirit's power gauge as much she has the chance to hit you.
I personally do not really mind losing to killers, I think that's big part of playing survivor is accepting your losses when another player is clearly playing better than you, though a lot of survivors has huge egos with the teabag at exit gate at weak killers rather than actually learn to play against a good challenge.
-
@swager21 said:
shes still more enjoyable to verse than a red rank 7k nurse. i feel like i stand a way better chance against spirit than i do against a nurse
Its because she has inherent counter-play, a lot more than people give spirit for. Spirit is such well-designed killer. Its crazy. Most of spirit's gameplay revolves around making predictions around the survivor's movement, her mechanical skill very low meaning she has a very good skill-floor but high-skill mastery as her skill allows her to beat any team with good prediction and solid tracking skills. Its like perfect formula. The reason why survivors feel like they can't beat her is because their movement is too predictable and no single action done repetitively will work against spirit. you need mix it up and she has answers to what you mix up but you also have answers to their mix-up. I wish more killers were like spirit where either side could make a good play.
With nurse, She's more raw mechanic skill and raw power, you can make nurse miss few blinks from extremely far away but eventually you'll get zoned in the corner and a lot of her blinks will start become more reactional than prediction based if your too close to her. She is just as fun to face as spirit when you go on Hawkins,Lery and like Rotten fields as the large amount of wallblockers makes her closer to prediction based killer. Ironically these maps are.... very hard for nurse compare to the others.
-
@reeves7 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2149889#Comment_2149889
You described EVERYTHING PERFECTLY. I truly hope a dev will look your post and make a change.
they won't. you know what else is high on Otz tier-list? Freddy, He's B-tier. He will be joining Billy in C-tier. He might be so bad to the point that he joins D-tier or even F-tier but people won't realize this until .... 1 year later after the change. Billy has been low-tier for.... a long time, just community is slow to adjust. Too many bad survivors in solo-queue.
I mean they could give back Billy's instantsaw add-on by removing their drawback and freddy changes... but they won't because survivors asked for these changes and killers have to live with consequences with them. Its just how cookie crumbles.
-
@Blueberry said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2145989#Comment_2145989
Firstly, let's not talk about Pig. Nothing I have said is about Pig and nothing of this topic is about Pig.
Yes Myers has a lot of issues that need reworking but that's completely unrelated to this addon topic.
The only time the Tombstone Piece is an issue is when the survivors are bad. I can't think of a single time this addon has mori'd me. It takes long enough to charge with zero map pressure that gens would be flying if the survivors were decent. Also, as soon as they realize you're running it they are going to pre drop pallets. There are more than enough pallets to have the gens done before they run out, especially with how little map pressure you're actually generating by running this. It's for meme's, nothing more.
I think that's a problem with map design and loop design for M1 killers being unfair that in theory, you could win the game vs an M1 killer as 3vs1 if your REALLY good but your very unlikely to get teammates this good in solo queue. for reference i have done it but... I do question my opponents skill-level on that killer. Early pallet dropping and the fact vast majority of tile set are imbalanced against the killer on the majority of maps is separate manner altogether.
This is not true at all. Whenever Myers is in range to M1 survivor, he can stalk a survivor instead and in tier 2, he moves at 115%, this is how you charge your T3, you give up hits for stalks and many loops have no line of sight blockage so saying that you can "stop" myers from tier up is not realistic. Also this add-on has very little telltale that it is being used. He has 16 base-tr and its often an instant kill before you ever notice.
Its very rare you face this because the add-on heavily deducts your emblem points for moring survivors but no doubt that it is practically an instant win button. If someone told me that they use this add-on every game with the green add-on to justify Myers being good, than yeah they're correct but like otz said, "what kind of a win is this really?". 99% of the survivor teams will not play 3vs1 very well as survivor and you can freely farm emblem points to black pip, even pip as killer with this.
-
@Blueberry said:
Fun for memes, that's about it. You wouldn't actually be running it if your intention was winning.
Your zero map pressure from focusing on all the stalking you'll need will result in an ultra fast gen rush if the survivors are even semi competent.
It crushes bad survivors but so does everything else honestly.
lol, no. those mori add-on are insanely overpowered.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Aaq1z2gzMBg&t=16sThe thing is, Myers and Pig have some of the worst base-kit abilities in the game. they almost full rework on their abilities. Myers having a completely detrimental Tier-1, M1 version of tier-2 and loopable tier 3 makes his entire power-up power a huge time investment for no reward, but this reward of this add-on that instant mori people is not fun for the survivor and it is not really enjoyable for the killer. Its too strong. Myers should be centered more around undetectable and aura reading, high base stats(fast pallet break, longer lunge, fast window vaulting, instant downs, lower stun from pallets, low tr etc.) in his various tiers and not around a single add-on that instantly mori's people.
Pig is no different, her stealth is the worst in the game, her ambush charge is barely usable in most situations if the survivors play around it...... but than you look at these jigsaw boxs that straight up mori people. I don't even want to talk about it with pig problems. she needs way stronger stealth and way better ambush charge... but less of this mori-instant kill stuff that inflates kill rates.
-
@Bard said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2145883#Comment_2145883
Honestly I think it would feel more natural for survivors to spend 8-12 seconds performing an action than spending 30 seconds faffing about waiting for a bar to go down.
I just think it shouldn't decay at all. I think trying to put a number on decay is bad. 1.5*6 knives is 9 seconds. there is no real risk vs reward when the action takes almost no time to remove damage away from the killer. Every survivor will pull out the blades with such a low time. you need like 5 seconds per knife for survivors to actively decide whether they would pull out the knives or not which would take around 30 seconds but they'd complain about m1 mending simulator. Its just better to not give option. It should work like ghostface stalk meter. it never goes down from anything.
As GodofTerror states in his post, The laceration meter RARELY comes into play if Trickster just commits to every down. Its just that he has no split injure pressure. he has no ability to 4vs1. he just plays the game as 1vs1vs1vs1 until he wins or loses from chases. There is some play in high-wall loops but its very timing consuming.
Removing his laceration meter decay would really help his 4vs1 potential and it would give him unique strength from Huntress and Deathslinger.