C3Tooth
C3Tooth
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Early days as survivor main, I thought Blood lust rewards killers' failure.
Later days as killer main, I thought Blood lust was needed because there were a few infinities.
But nowaday, I think Blood lust is a good mechanic, because it close the chase time gap between bad and good survivors. Though I really think the number should be harsher to both sides to make the gap even closer (to extend chase time for bad survivors and decrease chase time for good survivors). It could be BL starts later at 25sec but passively increased by 5% every 5sec (still keep 15% speed boost at 35sec chase), and not losing BL after kicking pallets.
I really think there should be base mechanic to helps the losing side has a chance to comeback. Though currently only killers have it, while survivors dont.
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@GolbezGarlandGabrant said:
So when I run a killer for 5 gens is it a skill issue on them for overcommitting or some excuse like perks or pallets?
5 Gens chase should be the standard skill for average solo.
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@radiantHero23 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3564757#Comment_3564757
I dont intend to remove hatch without a trade off. I just dislike the boring rng-based gameplay it provides. I prefer an action based ending to matches rather than the snooze fest we currently have.
Tbh, I really like the feeling of stealthly finding the hatch, and stealthly to open a gate then escape.
I really miss the feeling of stealthing together with a random teammate finding the hatch with a key, especially reworked Lery when it was really dark.
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@Krazzik said:
I mean there are better perks than NOED that help you during the entire game. NOED is strong, yeah, but if there's still 4 survivors at endgame, unless they made some big mistakes, or you get lucky and can hook right next to your totem, NOED isn't gonna do much for you.
If there are still 4 survivors alive, Noed doesnt mean much. If there are 3 survivors alive, they may only have enough time to find Noed but not healing to make a rescue. If there are 2 survivors alive, Noed isnt needed, the last one would not go for the save.
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Overall, survivors say that slugging is waste of time, killers say that hiding is waste of time. Point is, for both the hiding survivor and killer, its not waste of time, they're still playing.
Its the slugged one that they dont play the game for 4min. These are the one that complain about the slugging part, not the hiding survivors
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@Sava18 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3564831#Comment_3564831
Demanded what? Hatch being removed or something to counter survivors hiding for 2 games worth of time?
I remember that killers demand to remove the hatch. As you said, survivors told that hatch doesnt solve the problem of 2 survivors hiding. Which killers demand aura.
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@Sava18 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3564757#Comment_3564757
I genuinely don't care about slugging for 4k but if you remove hatch what stops the survivor from stalling forever? Maybe aura reading after 60 seconds?
Actually killers also demanded that in this same topic long time ago.
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@radiantHero23 said:
The problem in my opinion is the hatch, forcing a Rng-based situation.
I wish to have a 1 month test without Hatch mechanic to see how much kill rate is increased. And the possibility that killers' nerf just by removing the hatch alone. There are alot more behind that one extra kill
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@MeanieDeeny said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3558674#Comment_3558674
Really? And what is your experience?
Because if you're not a high level killer or survivor, then you're playing babies and you are not going to see a struggle.
MMR is suppose to put you against higher skilled opponent if you win more. Which, if they dont struggle and win more, they should be at high MMR.
If you're struggling and lose frequently, it should be you dropped MMR to play against weaker opponents, not them.
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@Tsulan said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3564389#Comment_3564389
Nah, 10k match won´t be a pip. Neither for the killer nor for the survivor (who escapes with that amount of points)
Fast matches usually don´t award pips on the higher ranks. Since the requirements are higher. So if people don´t earn bloodpoints, don´t earn pips for bloodpoints and and only want to play matches that end faster than their queue, i really don´t see the fun in that.
Fun is subjective to everyone.
Many killers see only 4K is fun, dying as survivor doesnt matter.
For some survivors, 8 hooks, meme around and let everyone escape is fun. But escape as survivor is fun.
You cant put your 32.000 BP and dying as survivor is fun, into anyone else. And demand other survivors should do totems, open chests just to guarantee the whole team dying with more BP, because its fun for you, mean it should be fun for others.
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Wraith's look like spanking...
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@Nazzzak said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3564399#Comment_3564399
They've said that playing in a swf can increase your chances of escaping by up to 15%. So if survivors have an escape rate of 40%, and that includes swfs, then I'd put solo at around 25% average escape rate.
I dont want to nitpick, but it should be 32.5% for Solos and 47.5% for Swf. Which the gap between them would be 15%.
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@Tsulan said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3564322#Comment_3564322
Thats the thing i don´t understand. I´ve seen survivors complain about a 12 hook match, where everyone died with 25k+ bloodpoints but be happy about a gen rush match, where they all escape and barely make 12k bloodpoints. With no killer interaction at all. Where is the fun in that? Its a pvp game. The more interaction both sides have, the more fun it should be. But turns out, that this also doesn´t make people happy.
Im sure killers be happy with 10.000 BP when a match ends in 3mins with 4K, than 30.000 BP with 4 escape. BP is what players earn in progress of a match, not the final goal, escaping is the goal. Same to killers, BP does not matter, but earn at least 3K.
Before EGC, survivors could stay in the trial for another 20min with killers after 5 Gens done, make a few loops, down, flashlight save and repeat until batteries depleted, there may be 1-2 extra hooks in the end, but then 4 survivors escape. Alot of interaction for both sides. Now tell me, does it fun for killers? Forced to play knowing you can not reach your goal.
As I said, everything has alot of gray zones.
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@mecca said:
The skill required to play survivor is so ridiculously high that everyone on the teams has to be like pros. It's insane. Matchmaking will never fix that. Survivors need buffed in all aspects.
In coordination with randoms aspects*. If I could simply chat "killer is camping, pls do gens, I will stay on hook", AFC mechanic would not be a thing. Without Kindred, its easy to see at least 2 teammates coming to hook, even if they come to acknowledge the camping and go back, survivors already lost at least 1 Gen time.
No one can ever fix the will of survivors when they want to DC though, its the most toughest part of solos
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@Tsulan said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3563741#Comment_3563741
But it still requires the killer to constantly switch mid chase. Which should be considered a good thing.
But somehow it seems survivors are complaining that they don´t get tunneled.
Everything has gray zones. Depends on how much progression people can make.
If Gen time is increased by half, but pallets increased by double. Yes Gens become much slower, but you cant make progression with hooks, you would not like it.
Old Ruin/Undying giving similar thing when killers put pressure, yes killers dont tunnel, its only my Gen regressed by ~40% when I go for unhook/heal a Dwight. It doesnt matter if survivors have 10 hooks state and killer play fair if they cant make a progress toward their goal.
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@radiantHero23 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3564278#Comment_3564278
I see losing as survivor not as bad because I'm not getting insulted at the end. Most of the matches I lose as survivor I also go down for the team. (Steve main)
Losing as survivor doesn't feel as bad to me.
Also. I see survivor as the more chill role because there are downtime from the action. When playing killer there aren't downtimes.
I have a total opposite, I dont feel bad when losing as killer, even against toxic squads, Im quite immune to survivors' toxic. I have more relax when playing killer because Im the one control the match
Survivors are newbies? I injure them and let them a chance to play.
Survivors are decent? I play normally, most of the time I meme with them.
Survivors are great? I know they're better than me and accept defeat, not because the game is survivors' sided. And honestly I could win against them by simply putting 4 slowdown, playing Blight and tunneling. But my life isnt depended on how many 4k I can get in a day.
As survivors, Im not a good looper, plus I dont use meta. I may get stress if killers tunnel me.
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In the last weekdays, I played for 8 matches and 6 of them went 8 hooks before kill, the other 2 werent tunneling either. It was mind blowing for me.
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@NerfDHalready said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3563126#Comment_3563126
personally the chance to get hatch/door doesn't motivate me to play a lost match because it's pointless, a waste of time and wouldn't satisfy me even if i could escape like that. and i absolutely hate when teammates/opposing survivors play with such motives.
killer getting a 4k is un-earned but a complete rng 2nd chance, and even a further 3rd chance to escape for the last survivor is earned somehow apparently.
balance-wise; you are arguing that hatch escapes have an impact on kill rates so it doesn't reflect the true balance in the game right? how is that a good thing then?
Hatch doesnt count escape, but the other 3 death still counted with 3/4 kills? Everything does effect balance, its only those match with 3/4 instead of 4/4 make the killrate abit lower than it should, which benefit killers.
Even if 1 survivor hatch escape every 10 match, but if its not possible anymore, the kill rate would be increased by ~2.5%
But its just not only about hatch escape, but mostly the suicide rate would also be increased if there is a sight of 5 Gens can not be done (mean 0 escape). At least currently people still play the game if they know 5 Gens cant be done and try to play for hatch.
If you dont play for escape, its up to you. As I dont play killer for kills. But not everyone has the same goal.
The game currently already has a bad design that 2 survivors escape require the same objective as 4 escape. We dont want to bring down that to 1 escape requires equal objective to 4 escape.
@Xernoton said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3563117#Comment_3563117
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3563126#Comment_3563126
Fair points, you two. I must admit that I hadn't considered all of this. Thank you for pointing that out.
However, I have my doubts that dcs or hook suicides would be that much higher. It's already pretty bad. Many survivors will give up very winnable matches just because something doesn't go their way, so I have my doubts, that the people who would quit don't already do that.
With that being said, I can't say I blame killers for slugging for the 4k. You get more points, you pip more easily and it's literally your objective to kill as many survivors as possible. So I think it would be wrong to simply tell killers not to do that. As @radiantHero23 pointed out, they could change the hatch to be based on the outcome of a chase. If a survivor can last long enough without getting hit, they get the hatch and escape. If they get hit, they die.
Thing is, if 1 suicide early game, its either you get 3 or 4 kills. Without hatch, it will always 4 kills. Even if only 1 survivor hatch escape every 10 match, but if its not possible anymore, the kill rate would be increased by ~2.5%. And hatch escape isnt that rare.
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@Xernoton said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3563104#Comment_3563104
How do you figure?
It would definitely remove the whole slugging for the 4k thing. The only problem I could see would be survivors hiding for all eternity and that could be fixed as well.
More kills may lead to killers nerf (if removing hatch increase the kill rate high enough).
Survivors usually suicide if they think they dont have a chance to escape. At least the hatch keep them play if there is no chance to finish Gen, and try to play for hatch. Without it, anything less than 5 Gens complete means 0% chance to escape, lead to more suicide and increase even more un-earned kill rate.
Further more, if 1 survivor escape requires 5 Gens done, the game has to be balanced around 5 Gens have to be done every - single - match.
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@Xernoton said:
Easy solution: Remove hatch.
Removing hatch hurts killer more than survivors.
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@Spare_Them_Mori_Me said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3562962#Comment_3562962
You mean ability to self get on her feet? I'd rather a mechanic come that lets survivors fight end game slugging. Suicide is just helping the killer, even if they want that 4k for their ego.
Everyone wants to be able to suicide in this game. Why are we playing again?
If Dwight being chased and Meg slugged, then able to get up, then Dwight is down, Meg being chase, Dwight get up, Meg down, repeat. That mechanic is really pointless. I would just tab out and draw.
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@xEa said:
Its annoying, but no big deal overall. If you think this game is not that serious, why do you bother? Grab a snack, watch some videos on youtube or go to the forum while the killer is wasting his time to get his meaningless 4k.
If I have 1 hour to play games, and there are 15min left, I would like to start another match than another 5min laying on the ground.
Jake died, Clau on hook is close to death. If there are Dwight and Meg left and Meg being slugged for 45sec (only start counting the time after moment Clau died), Meg gain ability to self kill.
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I really think the dark overlay doesnt have to be that dark, just a bit of it to show the effect, the most important part is the black fog that limit LoS. The whole screen gets really dark stress my eyes
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@Venusa said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3562366#Comment_3562366
You drew this?😱 Love it, you're so talented!
I drew alot of them, shirt or shirtless…
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I just have enough old drawings for this one...
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@Hunkulese said:
You're definitely not playing chill. Survivors don't enjoy being slugged. There are plenty of reasons to slug stratigically, especially if you're playing Twins, but it sounds like you're being a jerk just to be a jerk.
Depends, everything has alot of gray area.
- If killer downs Dwight, then see Meg picks Dwight up, then down Dwight again before chasing Meg, its not fun for Dwight.
- If killer downs Dwight, then see Meg picks Dwight up, then chase Meg but not down Dwight. I somehow had a few matches like this against a GF, a Wraith, a Clown. And those were insainly fun.
Recently I play like (2) killers. And able to put alot of pressure on survivors with Trapper and Myers, GF, I only hook a survivor if the bleeding bar reaches to half, and 2nd hook if close to death.
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@H2H said:
"We just want you to get rid of 5 blinks! And no cooldown on the blink! And blink distance addons! And blink recharge addons! And blinks being basic attacks! And and and and and and and and..."
Can we have extra 50sec Gen, and less weapon cool down, and less distance on hit, and COH, and DH, and DS, and self healing speed, and Medkits, and BNP, and WoO, and and....another 50sec Gen basekit please?
It goes both sides. The grass is always greener.
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Since her blink attack is now special; Sloppy, Noed, Franklin, Hubris....dont work with her. And half the times I dont face great Nurse, I can live with that.
@crogers271 said:
I'd rather a rework Go ahead and buff her base speed but make her blink either have some time of limit or be much slower to charge. Have it so she plays under the normal game rules with a teleport she can break out on occasion.
One of the problems with Nurse is that there are lots of ideas for perks that need to get thrown out because 'Nurse could just use this to massacre survivors'.
The only thing thats possible to nerf Nurse left is getting into fatigue makes her power token to 0. Which either 1 or 2 blinks, she will get the same time to refill 2 tokens.
Currently if she hit you with a single blink, you sure dont have enough time to go anywhere since it takes half the time to regain her power.
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I play survivors like that, its alot more fun for me. These are a few builds I have, some are definitely weaker than others, which I play alot less.
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Do you mean Party Clowns are killers power designing, or the players' skill?
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Step aside, I have my own one
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@pandorayr said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3561225#Comment_3561225
MFT has to be changed if u have a better idea (balanced) let me know but this perk cannot continue in the current state.
If survivor is on last hook, they gain 7% haste for 1min and only disable with the same condition as DS (do Gen, heal...and disable when gate is powered). It become anti tunneling perk, but with haste. Remove endurance.
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Stupid me, but when you think about how top tier Killers "reload their powers", you will see
Death slinger has to reload and slowed down every shot, Clown does the same even if he's just 1 bottle short.
Blight, Nurse, Spirit, Wesker just reload their power automatically. The moment they manage to hit survivor out of power, pick them up to hook, powers are ready to go.
What if Blight doesnt stab himself after finishing a rush but has to manual reload his power like Clown?
Spirit short phase is also abuse-able at loops for it doesnt take much of her power, which gains back power really fast. Instead of 5-15sec regaining power depends on how long you phased; make it fixed to 10sec? No matter if its 2sec phase or 5sec phase?
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@[Deleted User] said:
People didn't realize what they were asking for when they said they wanted the fastest queues possible, so here we are. I still think the whole implementation of SBMM has been overwhelmingly goofy. Match players according to their skill level. If that isn't fun, adjust the fun factor from there. Don't make the matches worse to compensate, because that fun factor isn't going to go away. It's just kicking the can down the road.
Should they have a weekend test with strict MMR? To see how it goes.
My match making time is really fast, even with +100% BP on one side, its usually not taking over 2min.
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A match progression of a survivor may never touch a gen, may never heal others, may never touch a totem. But they will always be chased.
There are many good perks, only its so depended on how killer play. I can use healing build, only to get tunneled out with nothing to defend myself. I can use 4 aura build, only to get tunneled out with nothing to defend myself. I can use totem focus build, only to get tunneled out with nothing to defend myself.
Only chase perk and 2nd chances are always be used, being tunneled or not.
Oh and, do you know how survivors get rewarded by use off meta perks?
"Its smart to tunnel the weak link"
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@[Deleted User] said:
I wasn't programmed to play Chess.
But playing chess harms the crew
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If I WAS the game itself, I would be "that was very smart of you tricking killer to mind game themselves like that, here is a free unhook for your teammate, you earned it"
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@xltechno said:
No matter the situation, even a soloQ gathering. Rescue in this case is possible.
It would be strange if SWF couldn't do it.
There are 6 escape paths from the main building
- Stair
- Window behind the stair
- Door 1
- Door 2
- Main door
- Window next to the main door
With 4 traps along the basement stair. The better way to counter is leave survivor to die and do gen. More effective, no risk, no effort.
Which is why I always think purple bag basekit without downside is really bad for his game play. People still can do it with the right perks and addon. Devs dont want Trapper can also do it without perk/addon effectively.
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@[Deleted User] said:
I think that's the issue. How to the change a core mechanic like generator repair.
To achieve 2 escapes, 5 Gens have to be done. 40% escape rate means the game is actually balanced around 5 Gens done over half the match,
thing is the requirement is the same for 4 escapes, and thats really the issue.
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@AmpersandUnderscore said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3559649#Comment_3559649
Killers will always say gens go too fast. We heard it even during the CoBruption meta when killers could force every game to go 30 minutes to an hour.
'Gen speed' is the popular outcry for two main reasons: it's easier than admitting you aren't there literal best killer in the game, and the devs seem to consistently make the mistake of listening to killers, so everyone is convinced of they ######### loud and often enough that they'll do it again.
First it was 'gen times', which was increased in 6.1 by request.
Then it was 'dead hard and DS' buy too much time. So they were gutted. Dead hard is such a popular excuse this happened twice.
Then it was 'healing is too strong' and thus medkits and circle were deleted.
Then it was 'prove thyself and BNP are OP' until those were deleted too.
Now we're back to generic 'gen times to fast'.
Seeing a pattern? The only thing most killers haven't considered is their own gameplay. Slap on 4 slowdowns, kick every gen, and wander blindly around the map looking for survivors. Then when you finally get a down 3 minutes into the game, but 2 gens have popped, you come over here and scream about gen times because you think it's been 45 seconds.
Literally any excuse to avoid the thought that you could improve your gameplay in any way. And why should you? Just complain on the forums loud enough and you'll probably get the nerfs you want. Those nerfs won't matter, because A) that wasn't the issue the whole time, and B) you'll just continue moving the goal post every time this happens.
I surprised that after 6.1.0 the kill rate increased from ~53% to 61% (iirc), then with all those nerf the the kill rate currently dropped down to ~56%. Thats pretty impressive that how survivors are actually getting better.
While most killers are too used to 4 slowdowns that work for themselves and cant hold survivors after slowdown nerfs. I never use slowdown, camp or tunnel while using Trapper, the buff from 6.1.0 really helped me alot because I didnt get a single nerf in my game play, only get the benefit of 50sec Gen and general buff.
Same to survivors, the hard nerf on DH and Coh didnt bother me, I never use them, I just feel they were so broken
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@Tsulan said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3559554#Comment_3559554
Oh yeah: Lithe, SB, SC, DH, Adrenaline... So much variety over the last 5 years. Yet they are still in the top 10 most used survivor perks.
Only Adrenaline, DH are 2nd chance, SB really help when do Gen in deadzone but still easier to deal against DH.
Lithe for me is never 2nd chance perk
- If you hit survivor when they vault, you hit/down them with or without Lithe.
- If you dont hit survivor when they vault, they will be on the other side of the wall, with or without Lithe.
Lithe is more like giving me a small break mid chase to think what I should do next. Lithe being the most used perk because Exhaustion is always a must for survivors, and it can be used on command without requiring skill as other 2 perks.
Gen perks seem fine currently, still 4 Gens but at least its not copy paste like Ruin/Un/Tinkere/Pop. Current survivor meta is needed a change.
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I use Selfcare not to heal, but to mind game killers with Bite the bullet.
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@RaSavage42 said:
Again it's Gen efficiency
Survivor can put in 1.0-2.2 charges per second... then add in great skillchecks , perks, Items and addons
Then Gen regression
Killers spend 2 seconds (round about) to kick a Gen to start the regression process at .25 charges per second
So Gens have 90 charges
Survivors can do it in 45-90 seconds
Killer can regress a 99% Gen (so 89.9 charges) in 360 seconds (round about)
I wish someone would do a video of all of the progression V regression... that way we can all see what it all looks like (in a vacuum)
The ability to make a 99% Gen down to 0% is already stupid by itself. Its like a Survivor losing a hook stage after not chasing them for a while.
Even if a Gen regressed by 10% (9sec progression), where it took 36sec to do that. But think about it, survivors dont do Gen for 36sec plus 9sec extra added to the Gen. Its already in Killers' favor, Killers dont sit at a Gen to keep it regressed.
Im up for Gen regression goes up by 3 times (0.75 charge per sec), but if only Gens have check points at 33% and 66% where it can not regressed further.
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@[Deleted User] said:
From my experience Killers don't struggle near as much as they make it out to be.
Usually the complaining happens are from a defeat after 20 win streak.
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@AmpersandUnderscore said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3558011#Comment_3558011
Since gen regression was gutted
Since healing was gutted with medkits and circle.
FTFY.
There's literally no relationship between gen regression and staying injured. Killers complained, got healing nerfed to the point that it isn't worth the time to heal anymore, and now complain instead that survivors aren't 'wasting time by healing inefficiently'.
That's what actually happened.
Base Gen increased from 400 to 450.
Then self healing nerfed by half.
Because getting healed is harder, survivors dont heal, but focus on Gens.
Gens go faster than usual because of no healing, then they wish for 2nd Gen time increased
So survivors have to do with killers' wish to have 2nd Gen time increased ; on top of the healing nerf ; on top of Base Gen 450.
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Remove the wiggle strength, but make killers stunned for extra 1.5sec if escape from carrying.
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I think the extended time to heal should be fixed by 4sec, not 25%.
Self healing is rare enough, and with 24sec already, adding 6sec extra is too much, while multiple healing perks can make a healing take 10sec, and the extra time is only 2.5sec
With the extended time is fixed by 4sec. It would extend more time against healing build, while its not overkill against self healing.
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@DemonDaddy said:
Not that bad, it encourages team altruism which is something even solos should focus on.
When you make something harder to do, people likely want to do it less. Encourage is to make it easier so people do it more.
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@Brimp said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3556583#Comment_3556583
Traps that are way easier to take care of.
He can deny 10 windows/pallets around 3 Gens.
If survivors disarm traps, he will go back for them and Gens
If survivors dont disarm, survivors will take hit, then heal, before going back to Gens.
Or able to down 1 survivor and hook in basement, then he can set 10 traps around.
Certainly it will not as pain as SM in 3 Gens or Bubba in camping. But people will use the easiest way to win, 10 traps around 3 Gens and basement are always the easier than planning survivors' path.
I have 10 ideas to buff him since I main Trapper, but starts with all traps is not one of them.
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10 traps around 3 Gens, welcome to another SM.