Blueberry
Blueberry
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First of all, map wide. No need for a distance cap on mediocre effects.
Second aura reading, not some measly location ping.
Lastly the aura reading lasts while they are within 12 meters of any chest. Will Persist for 10 seconds after leaving the area.
This all would be a good start.
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A tier at minimum. I’d even argue most A tiers are not viable against equally skilled top tier survivors. S tier is where the killers actually have a somewhat fair chance of winning in a match of equal skill. I agree the main premise of the post though.
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-High skill requirement for mediocre payoff
-Survivors have too much control over his power
-Weak killer that's getting nerfed even further
-NFT's
Killer I see the least is probably Twins. No surprise there.
-Boons have gutted their only viable play style
-Nerfed unnecessarily and in a way that makes them unfun to play
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I'd put Billy, Oni, Doctor, Freddy, Clown, DS and Trickster down with Hag and Bubba.
Spirit, Nurse, Huntress and Plague at the top.
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I run "silent" builds pretty often for the fun. They realistically aren't that good as they usually aren't making a difference against killers that are actually good, but they're memey and make things more interesting.
Iron Will, Balanced Landing, Quick & Quiet, Dance with Me, Self Aware. Some combination of those.
Stack on your Claudette with her camo gear and throw on Saloon. It's got some of the best bushes for insta vanishes.
Wish they'd give a little buff to Q&Q and DwM. Cut the cooldowns further and increase the scratchmark hidden duration on DwM.
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Should work on special attacks and not even have a cooldown. The amount it regresses is already extremely minor. 8% is literally seconds of a survivors time, that's it. We also know base regression is basically near worthless so there isn't much value there either.
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If killers realistically had actual separate mmr we could enjoy the lower tier killers more. However for the people at top mmr unless we like being masochists we really can't. Not much fun to be tbagged, taunted, mocked and destroyed no matter how good you play.
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They just need to make snuffing a boon out break the totem, then they'll be fine since they will be strong but on a limited resource.
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You vastly exaggerate how much of an effect most hexes have on the game, while vastly downplaying how easily boons are dealt with depending on the map.
Most hexes are High Risk/Average-Mediocre reward. The vast majority of hex perks in the game are not strong enough to warrant being hex perks in the first place.
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@GoshJosh said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2635333#Comment_2635333
Hmm... where have I seen this before? Oh yeah, just about every killer play style.
Basically lol.
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Spirit.
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He's pretty bad now, just not bottom 5.
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I find playing against Hag pretty boring. Every game is already played out from the beginning.
He's gonna pick a 3 gen, put his web there and never leave it. First guy down gets put in the web. Every single unhook after that will be a forced hook trade. Zero chases. The end.
I don't blame Hags for this, it's just how she's played.
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@GentlemanFridge said:
I mean, ackowledgement is a first step. We haven’t even had that yet.
^ This is what I think many want.
Just simply an acknowledgement of the issue and a statement that they are working on a solution to the problem. It doesn't need to be anything specific or even come with a timeline.
Just making people feel heard goes a long way with gaming communities.
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It's "supposedly" Thrill of the Hunt. However realistically we don't have one as Thrill is pretty mediocre.
Now if Thrill wasn't a hex itself, then it would be pretty decent. It's not good enough to warrant being a hex.
I'd like to see more boon counters too, but honestly boons need to be adjusted at base. We shouldn't need to waste another perk slot as a bandaid fix for bad design.
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I've actually thought this for years. Surprised they haven't made a killer that utilizes the fire pits on every map for warmth from a killer with a cold power.
You could also use the fire pits for a killer that plays with darkness, "The Boogeyman". The light sources on the map are safe havens from when the killer causes a black out on the map.
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@The_Krapper said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2631775#Comment_2631775
If that's the case then survivors should get to see which hooks are scourged in exchange so they don't attempt to sabo them and send a bug report
Totally fine.
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Pre boon totems they were doing quite well. However boon totems have completely destroyed their only viable play style and it’s about to get worse once the new chapter gets here. We at least need better boon counter options. Currently all we have is ToTH which is quite mediocre itself. Honestly ToTH shouldn’t be a hex perk itself. Then it would actually be decent boon slow down. The even better fix to boons without requiring a band aid fix of wasting one of our perk slots would be to make totems break after snuffing out a boon. This keeps them strong but on a limited supply. I really dislike the continuous hits to Twins when they’re already the least played killer in the game. Aside from myself I don’t think I’ve played against a Twins in over a month and I literally play all day, every day.
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I don't particularly like those changes to basement hooks as I think they're fine. That said, The Scourge Hook perks should be 5 instead of 4 and should include the basement hooks. 4 hooks just isn't enough. Scourge hooks should also be permanent, IE no breaking from perks, toolboxes, or a survivor dying on one.
Gift of Pain should apply its slow every time, not just the first as well. 9% isn't that significant.
They probably just don't know what to do with Monstrous Shrine for your last question. Good design would probably be to make it incentivize leaving the basement. It would have to be a pretty good incentive though seeing as you're intentionally then giving up the advantage you gain of having someone down there. Something like, "You gain Undetectable while at least 32m from the basement until the person is unhooked. Persists for 15 seconds after an unhook." Rewards you for letting them be rescued safely essentially.
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Bubba and Hag I would say are the top campers. Bubbas just tend to but Hag it's basically her required play style.
Outside of those 2 probably Billy. Every single Billy match is a game of pretending to chainsaw away from the hook just to instantly chainsaw back and pretend it's not camping. Quite boring.
Surprised anyone would say Twins. Outside of myself I legit don't think I've even had a single match against a Twins in the past month...and I play literally all day, every day. She was already extremely rare before, but after her nerf, CoH meta, and the boon unbreakable coming they've essentially killed off what few there were as her play style is essentially dead.
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Not too much of a fan of how the new perks coming into the meta are making split pressure/slugging non viable. Firstly most the split pressure killers in general are the weaker ones, so we're nerfing killers that already aren't that great. Secondly, slugging is the least annoying way to actually pressure good survivors. Against good survivors it is mandatory. You are not 12 hooking good survivors. If you take slugging off the table you leave camping/tunneling, aka the least fun play styles that we try to avoid doing.
A split pressure meta is the most fun meta for survivors compared to the alternatives.
At least if we had some counter play options for this new meta it would be something, but we don't. Closest we have is ToTH and that's mediocre itself.
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Myers, Trickster, Legion, Ghostface come to mind. All need buffs/QoL changes.Trickster actually needs mechanical changes, he's a mess.
I still think Pig, Trapper and Clown are a mess as well but seeing as they've supposedly already had their fixes I can't imagine we'd see more.
Lots more killers need buffs but those are the more dire ones in my opinion.
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Stomping a boon totem out should break the totem, then boons would be fine. It keeps them strong but on a limited resource.
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The boon meta has really gutted all the killers that rely on hit and run split pressure strats or slugging to win. This said, I'd move all those killers lower than they are on this list. The boon meta especially after the new chapter hits has knocked these killers down at least one tier minimum. It's significant.
Pinhead, Nemesis, Doctor and DS I'd move down as well.
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@throwaway79465468797 said:
I think the reason people dont use it more is because it is a hex. So theres no benefit after its cleansed
^ This is the biggest one. It's not worthy of being a hex.
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It still feels underwhelming given it's a hex itself. It should either not be a hex itself or give the notifications back. In an ideal world where ToTH never gets found and they're forced to do all their boons slower it looks nice, but that's just very rarely what actually happens.
That said, it's basically the only counter play we have for boons, so it is what it is. It helps some.
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@Devil_hit11 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2631772#Comment_2631772
tell that to the dude that balances off kill rates.
I don't think they intended Pinhead to getting 10 chainhunts per match and franklin demise+Hoarder makes that easily possible.
At the same time, Its far too easy for survivor to disable chain hunt. you activate it, the box respawns in like 10 seconds and the aura of the box gets survivors to run to it like flies. Survivors really need to use their brain and hold the box until pinhead picks up a survivor before solving it.
I think a good change to chain hunt would be that iri should be base-kit and box should not have aura reading by default for survivor. In exchange for killer side, Franklin and Hoarder should not affect the box. The iri add-on could be reworked to give killer a 24 meter aura for searching the box.
The anti-loop? Its everything i said since day 1 about his power
-Breaking chains takes too little time
-Pinhead breaking chains hurts his own power
-Objecting breaking his chains hurt his power
They're more interesting in just slashing all the killer good add-ons so pinhead mostly doomed after his changes go live which we know they will.
Agree with pretty much everything.
It feels so bad they're nerfing his only decent addons. The vast majority of his addons are just completely terrible.
The counter play for survivors and the chain hunt feels very "hand-holding" in its current state.
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@Devil_hit11 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2631734#Comment_2631734
" In other words, 4 good solos can be vastly advantageous as we both said, as while as simultaneously not being able to reach the same mmr as swf. You can have both those things be true without being contradictory."
ahh but that is issue. You see, it is not reflective in stats and results. The average survivor is still dying too much. Even if we look at our survivor games, I am looking at killer players and they're like getting 3 hooks in 5 gens. Many of killer players are actually really good too from my interaction with them in a chase. Obviously, we know that the game for our survivor games is massively one sided as we play it, but dev do not. Most of the kills that killers are getting are in EGC when gates are 99% and its from survivors trying to unhook teammates when a killer is literally standing still at a hook. Sometimes they're successful, other times they mess it up. I hate to use term but you know the killer getting kills by facecamping hooks in end game.
I don't mind challenging matches either, Its lack of input in outcome of the match that can be unfun for killer. The lack of input is produced from manufacture unviable killer powers that dev keep purposely balancing against the killer towards survivor's fun.
Unwinnable games are product of poorly balanced killer powers. Losing should still be fun, but its not. Its just aggravating. Losing with old deathslinger was at least fun. now it is just painful and it makes you not want to play diverse set of killers. Negative killer changes like reduce killer diversity and incentive playing like same killer over and over. I am like only confident now a days in winning with Nurse/Blight and Bubba. I don't think that is how it is suppose to be but its like that for now.
"You see, it is not reflective in stats and results."
Which is why I hate when we see balancing based on that stats and data we are presented with as it's quite flawed.
"Most of the kills that killers are getting are in EGC when gates are 99% and its from survivors trying to unhook teammates when a killer is literally standing still at a hook." "The average survivor is still dying too much."
Yeah as you eluded to this is one of the many things artificially skewing the data. It puts kills on the stats that aren't reflective of balance.
"Obviously, we know that the game for our survivor games is massively one sided as we play it, but dev do not."
I actually think they do know, they just don't care. I think they know they are balancing for low ranks and it's intentional. I don't think I could imagine that at this point they actually think it's even remotely balanced at high mmr.
"I don't mind challenging matches either, Its lack of input in outcome of the match that can be unfun for killer. The lack of input is produced from manufacture unviable killer powers that dev keep purposely balancing against the killer towards survivor's fun."
Exactly.
"Unwinnable games are product of poorly balanced killer powers. Losing should still be fun, but its not. Its just aggravating."
As you mentioned with a lack of input in outcome for matches, that is where this lack of fun even in losing stems from. In a game with good balance you can still have fun even when losing because you can see where you played bad or got outplayed in order to improve your input for the next game to change that outcome.
However with poor balance as we have now you can lose without having actually been out played or making a mistake. You lose no matter your input and you didn't have fun because there's nothing to change the outcome next time.
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Realistically never happening in an even skill match. If you get 4 man slugged that means y'all are either at an MMR you shouldn't be at or you just really made a lot of mistakes to get to that point.
That said is it kinda toxic? Yeah I'd say so if he's refusing to hook. This scenario happens basically never though.
If he slugs you all and then starts to hook that's totally acceptable and not toxic at all.
4 man bleed out isn't against the rules though for your question and is intended.
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Yeah I'd say the typically "stop wiggling I'm trying to give you hatch" signal is to do a quick head shake after pick them up if they start to wiggle. Kinda says no, stop it. If they continue to wiggle I just kill them.
If you're a survivor and want a chance at hatch don't ever wiggle on pick up if you're the last one left. That's typically how I decide if I'm hooking you or letting you take hatch. You have to submit to defeat. Wiggling says you haven't given up.
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Still skeptical on Pain Resonance. 4 hooks is just so pitiful, especially on larger maps. You're gonna miss a lot of potential value.
Now if it was 5 hooks we might be talking. Or even better, keep it 4 but make it also include basement hooks. That would have potential as well. QoL change as well, but Scourge Hooks shouldn't be breakable by any means, toolboxes, perks, dead player ect. They should be permanent.
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@Pulsar said:
That's not his biggest issue but it would help.
His two main issues are that his actual Possessed Chains offer about the same slowdown as Clown's bottles but require astronomically more skill to pull off. You have to be good, but you get basically zero reward for it. His Chains also break instantly on objects, their spawn logic is awful, Pinhead can break them instantly and other Survivors can too. All of these combine to make his Possessed Chains very weak.
His second issue is that he relies on RNG way too much. If your chains spawn wrong, they instantly break. If they spawn wrong, you have to break them to hit the Survivors. You also need to be getting Chain Hunts up reliably to have meaningful slowdown.
^ This sums it up pretty well.
Very high risk and skill requirement for a mediocre payoff even if you do pull it off perfectly with his possessed chains.
I also think survivors have too much control over his chain hunt. You're basically required to run the Franklins/Hoarders build if you even want to get a chain hunt off. Without running both those perks you're realistically lucky if you even see one hunt happen all game if that. We shouldn't need perks like that to make his power function as intended.
I really like the high skill requirement killers, the payoff just isn't there. For how high his skill requirement is they could realistically buff him a lot without hurting lower tier players as those players aren't able to play him properly anyway to take advantage of it.
Pinhead not breaking his own chains and having the chains slowly break from object collision rather than instantly would help a lot. In regards to chain hunt, not seeing the box aura until the hunt starts would be what I'd recommend. However seeing as they even nerfed his Irididescent Lament Configuration I don't see that happening. The box typically having a set spawn near the survivors probably isn't a good idea either, maybe more rng on that.
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Enjoyment wise.
Best: old spirit
Worst: Billy or Hag
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Every time we get some kind of new innovative way to use a new perk with an old killer or old perk with a new killer it gets gutted. Hence why throughout the years we still end up using all the same perks on nearly every killer.
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@Devil_hit11 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2631544#Comment_2631544
Don't you see your contradiction? your saying that 4 good solos is vastly advantageous, yet your also tallying up your games and saying that like 90% of your games are you facing swf assuming your high MMR killer. doesn't that say something about solo survivor for how getting high MMR with solo survivor is not exactly easy? Few solo players can play as well as swf teams. My reason for solo being still advantageous over solo is poor killer balance and favorable map design, so much so that you can 1vs1 the killer if your a skilled at looping if the killer power is weak and the map heavily favors you. Too many safe loops that behave like god pallets for most killers.
"Games are way less fun since SBMM."
I would change that to games are way more challenging for killer to win since SBMM for high MMR. they ain't getting any easier with negative killer changes every patch, not helping.
"Don't you see your contradiction? your saying that 4 good solos is vastly advantageous, yet your also tallying up your games and saying that like 90% of your games are you facing swf assuming your high MMR killer. doesn't that say something about solo survivor for how getting high MMR with solo survivor is not exactly easy?"
No, they are not mutually exclusive. In other words, 4 good solos can be vastly advantageous as we both said, as while as simultaneously not being able to reach the same mmr as swf. You can have both those things be true without being contradictory. Even when solo's reach "high mmr" they still are not higher than the swf, hence primarily getting them at top mmr. So solo's aren't necessarily unable to get to high mmr which is what you're referencing but more the results I'm mentioning are a representation of simply not being as high as swf. It's also easier to raise mmr on killer than it is survivor with their new system even if you didn't necessarily "win". We could also make the argument that the type of player pushing to high mmr is also generally speaking much more likely to want to swf as well hence less solo's in general from mindset.
"Few solo players can play as well as swf teams. My reason for solo being still advantageous over solo is poor killer balance and favorable map design, so much so that you can 1vs1 the killer if your a skilled at looping if the killer power is weak and the map heavily favors you. Too many safe loops that behave like god pallets for most killers."
I agree with this.
"I would change that to games are way more challenging for killer to win since SBMM for high MMR. they ain't getting any easier with negative killer changes every patch, not helping. "
I don't know if I'd use the word challenging per say as much as "unwinnable" probably. I'm obviously being a tad hyperbolic here but I think we, as well as most anyone with a large amount of hours on both sides would agree that there are matches in DBD with its current balance that are literally unwinnable for the killer. Pretty sure I've even seen most the popular streamers with heavy hours all agree to this at some point as well.
I don't mind challenging matches. What I do mind is losing matches that there was literally no way to win even if played perfectly. Now we can say these matches are rare, and they were, in the old matchmaking. However, SBMM has exacerbated this. You have these games much more often now once you're trying to push into top mmr with "nonviable" killers. This is the conundrum of SBMM as it is treating the game as competitive when it's not. The game is not balanced around this.
I also agree about weird nerfs to killers/perks/addons that are already unviable in the first place. Doesn't make much since. This isn't anything new though.
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@Labrac said:
Why is everyone so salty lol? OP never claimed he got 60 wins in a row with high MMR. He might just play in a time of the day where there's not really many good players around, but it's still an impressive feat. He also has the DBD statistics website to back him up on being an amazing Demo.
"OP never claimed he got 60 wins in a row with high MMR."
He did if you read further posts which is why it was brought up.
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@Devil_hit11 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2631261#Comment_2631261
I mean the game does not need two games modes though. I personally playing killer do not really mind playing against swf or facing strong survivor players. what is upsetting is not being able to win or show any skill expression with said killer when playing vs strong survivor's from negative killer changes/killer changes related to poor survivor gameplay.
Solo survivor is not that weak either. Assuming equal skill among killer and survivor player, survivors are still largely favored to win even as solo. The only real pitfall in solo is lack of information and coordination. SWF are better able to optimize saves, better optimized to bodyblock and utilze team-oriented items/perks such as Flashlights. Their general efficiency on generator is also a lot better. If solo just had global bond, I think solo would be as strong as SWF. I do not see why it would not be. they would be able to know what survivor is getting chased, what pallets are being broken, which survivor is working on what generator, and whose going for hook saves.
I'd say there would still be some gaps for example, a large reason why some killer users think Trapper is worst killer in DBD is because SWF can call out his trap placements rendering his ability ineffective. This problematic issue for many killers where having coordination about their ability suddenly make them a lot worse. It is difficult problem to solve because for example, if you allowed survivors to point at the killer during special interactions such placing a trap where killer aura is revealed for 1 second, you would need find a way to rebalance trapper as his ability would lose a lot of power. This isn't even talking about all killers that either had or still have secondary objectives such as Pinhead box, Pig's reverse traps, Wraith, pre-weakened freddy, so on who have high killrates because these killers require coordination to defeat where solo lacks coordination and SWF has plenty of it.
on side note, If solo is like a little favored to win vs killers if playing well|, swf is very favored to win. I mean just look otz's experiment. He had 86% escape rate when playing 4 man swf with no perks with strong items. Some people said that otz wasn't at the top of his game but like average escape rate is like 47%, so he is almost 40% above average. If only he did experiment using perks with no items, we would be able to figure out how often does average 4 man SWF team win. I bet its around 65%.
I am not so sure that killers would enjoy playing auto-lose matches vs otz level swfs where their chances to win are like less than 15%. Not with current killer balance. This is why improving solo to the level of SWF is ultimate very scary. A lot of killers changes would really need to be reverted and many of them would need major improvements for such gamemode.
I think the 2 modes would be the better route for solving the issue given the options available. That said, I generally agree with most everything else you said. People act like swf is the only issue, but even 4 good solos is vastly in the advantage to win matches against an equally good killer, I don't even think it's close. What makes solo queue weaker is the rng of if you get those good teammates, something that used to be an issue but not so much after SBMM. I've been tallying swf groups from my games and at high mmr it's 3 or 4 man groups greater than 50% of the games with 40% being at least a 2 man and solos or 2, 2 man groups. Less than 10% of the games are actually solo's...
For a game that is not even remotely balanced around swf that is a ridiculous number and one of the many reasons people detest SBMM at high mmr. We may see lower swf rates when we average all ranks, but they pile up at the high ranks from being boosted by swf. Games are way less fun since SBMM.
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@GannTM said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2631348#Comment_2631348
All I’m saying is I have gone against good survivors and I’ve been able to win some because I have good experience with the killer. Just practice the killer and just because you get clapper doesn’t make the killer bad. She moves at 176% movement speed which is pretty significant.
There's nothing I can say to change your mind so there isn't much point here. When you're actually playing her regularly at top mmr she isn't going to do very well. I'm not saying she's anywhere near the worst killer in the game or anything, but she is absolutely not competitively viable whatsoever anymore. Good teams will clap her. She's basically a noob stomper now.
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@GannTM said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2631337#Comment_2631337
Interesting because I 4k’ed against a good team as her with my 8th hook being my first kill. I had three hexes with Lethal Pursuer as well and they cleansed all of them early so I was perkless for like 75% of the game.
Your anecdotal experience doesn't mean anything objectively. She still destroys bad players but against actually good survivors she's a play thing now. The average player is bad so on average you will do well, but against average players isn't her level of strength objectively. You judge power on good vs good, not good vs average player.
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@GannTM said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2631329#Comment_2631329
Probably played against bad Spirits. I’m still doing fine with her.
Say what you will but at top mmr in solo queue even she's getting trashed on. She's quite weak now.
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Snuffing a boon should break the totem. This keeps them strong but on a limited supply. The killer already loses a lot of time going out of the way to get rid of them, they shouldn't have to do this repeatedly.
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@HelloYou said:
Balanced versus noobs but a joke versus above average players.
^ This. She got trashed. We literally pallet loop her now.
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@SonicOffline said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2631269#Comment_2631269
Oh. Do you have a link to the comment?
I do not, unfortunately I just remember the comment. Can't remember where it was from though, it might have been the recent Q&A that McCote did with King. I would probably check there. The questions on the recent survey mentioning having two modes seemed to support this as well.
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@SonicOffline said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2631099#Comment_2631099
Where's your data? I'd love to see how you came to this conclusion.
This is actually from a dev statement I believe where they made a comment about the community size being large enough to possibly support that type of system. They didn't mention an exact number, just the comment.
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@Bwsted said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2631118#Comment_2631118
It's a terrible (non)solution.
Before swf people used to lobby hop to play with their friends. That would simply happen again.
And nobody would willingly play solo ranked where they would go against sweatlords who think they're at the DbD Olympics.
All survivors, solos and swf, would go unranked. All killers would go ranked. Nobody gets lobbies. The change gets reverted faster than the blinding the killer during pick up patch.
"Before swf people used to lobby hop to play with their friends. That would simply happen again."
I really don't think that happened that often to where it was actually much of an issue. Even if they do, I don't think that really matters much.
"And nobody would willingly play solo ranked where they would go against sweatlords who think they're at the DbD Olympics."
They absolutely would. This is literally how any competitive mode in any game works. People actively go in with sweat to increase their rank for ranked rewards. I think you also underestimate what people would play if it gave extra blood points. "Sweat" also probably isn't even the best word we should use here either seeing as you wouldn't have swf in ranked anyway. Without having SWF the sweatiest you could get in ranked isn't really that sweaty honestly. Especially seeing as then we could actually properly balance high mmr because of this.
"All survivors, solos and swf, would go unranked. All killers would go ranked. Nobody gets lobbies. The change gets reverted faster than the blinding the killer during pick up patch."
As mentioned before I think this is underestimating the competitive nature of players as well as the level of incentive in ranked rewards/queue time bonus blood point rewards.
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@StarLost said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2631233#Comment_2631233
You won't get rid of or nerf SWF, sadly. BHVR have been emphatic about this - they don't want to 'punish people for playing with friends'.
The best that can be hoped for is a system to detect smurfing (if a player is AFKing or suiciding multiple matches in a row, they may need an audit), the various weirdness that happens with SBMM to get fixed and for SWF to be put up against better killers by default.
That said...a lot of SWFs, especially 2-3man groups are fine. It's the smurfing ones (or however I'm getting matched up against 4000+ hour stompcomps) that cause grief.
Well I'd never even want SWF to be nerfed or got rid of, people should be able to play with their friends. What I would want however is ranked/unranked modes to separate them. I think the player base is large enough to support it. IE SWF in unranked but only solo in ranked, something like that. Dynamic alternating blood point bonus for wherever the larger queue is to help keep them balanced in wait times. (something that should also be applied to survivor/killer queues for that matter).
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@StarLost said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2631200#Comment_2631200
Ah.
Frankly, what BHVR should do is what other games do with premades.
If you queue up in an SWF, you get a stacking, temporary and proportional increase to your MMR. Say 1.1x for a 2man, 1.4x for a 3man and 1.7x for a full 4man. This would mean that SWFs would face proportionally more skilled killers to counteract the incredible coordination and information sharing bonus.
The elephant in the room though is the fact that clearly the 'floor' and 'ceiling' for matchmaking break down sometimes, and that sometimes the system seems to be offline entirely.
I don't mind waiting for a minute or two extra for a good match. I don't want to be pooping on newbies and I don't want to get skunked by a crazy TTV premade.
"If you queue up in an SWF, you get a stacking, temporary and proportional increase to your MMR. Say 1.1x for a 2man, 1.4x for a 3man and 1.7x for a full 4man. This would mean that SWFs would face proportionally more skilled killers to counteract the incredible coordination and information sharing bonus."
The issue with this idea even though it sounds good on paper is that it wouldn't matter because of how unbalanced the game is at high mmr. IE you can put them against as high an mmr of a killer as you want and he's still getting destroyed. SWF is just too much of an advantage to add onto an already extremely unbalanced game. If the game was actually balanced at top mmr then yes your idea would work.
I agree I'd also wait triple even the current wait times if it meant I never had to play against SWF. I care more about a "fair" match than I do a fast queue. I want to lose because I was outplayed, not because of balance issues. I can do something about being outplayed (improve), I can't do anything about balance issues. Feeling helpless to an outcome isn't a good feeling in a game.
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@bm33 said:
They need to incorporate the emblem system with their SBMM because just kills/escapes doesn't work and is not fun. I had decreased my playtime because of performance issues but continued to play a bit because I atleast would have fun. Now if I hop on it's for couple matches and then I go play something else because SBMM has killed all the fun.
Yeah this is why the old system worked a lot better. You could play well as a survivor, die, but still rank up for how well you played. Current system it doesn't really matter how well you played if you die. That isn't good design.
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@StarLost said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2631101#Comment_2631101
I'd love to be able to see my own MMR and the MMR of my opponents.
Same. I'd like to see who was SWF as well even if it's just in the post game lobby so can accurately gauge my expectations of how well I should have done.
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@StarLost said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/294143/mmr-needs-to-be-better
Yeah, this happens.
SBMM is actually a great idea - when it works. It's supposed to assign you a 'floor' and 'ceiling' to your matchups, so that regardless of wait times, you'll never be matched with people far worse or far better than you.
However, sometimes you get bonkers match-ups regardless of your own MMR. Then you spend some time reading around and realize that the system often just...doesn't work.
- If you are inactive with one killer for 3 weeks (if I recall), the MMR of that killer resets. However, when you play with that killer next, it assigns a new MMR, pegged just slightly below your best MMR. Why this is the case I have no idea.
- If a killer dodges a lobby, it grabs the next killer available. I'm not sure if the 'floor' or 'ceiling' applies here.
- A lot of SWFs smurf their MMR down, usually to either farm grades more easily (you can't lose grades, so you can push it until you hit a point, then smurf down, then push it again) or to look better on streams. Sometimes they just want to stomp. If you see an obvious SWF with fancy skins, dodge that lobby immediately.
- BHVR seems to sometimes take the system down entirely, probably to make changes or fix a problem. You'll have a day where you just get insane matchups - signaled by instant queues. This is usually a sign to go do something else for the evening.
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2631180#Comment_2631180
What do you mean by it boosts you?
Do you mean that it makes winning easier so your MMR inflates, or that simply playing in an SWF increases your MMR?
"Do you mean that it makes winning easier so your MMR inflates"
^ This.
It allows you to win matches that you aren't necessarily winning threw skill but more artificial advantages. IE gen efficiency as one example. The group can be completely terrible loopers (<15 seconds) but as long as they don't waste time and sit on gens holding m1 they can still win because of how imbalanced the objective times are on each side.
MMR is supposed to represent your skill level, but using SWF doesn't allow it to do that accurately.