AMOGUS
AMOGUS
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@Nos37 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3371930#Comment_3371930
Have they fixed Corrective Action yet?
I was next to a survivor repairing a gen (I was not repairing). They failed a skill check, I lost a token, yet the gen still exploded since I was not actively repairing the gen. The perk should either work and cost me a token, or not work and not cost me a token... 🤷♂️
Literally just make it radius based perk like Leader, Prove Thyself and Streetwise. Would change nothing at all, honestly.
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@SOULWARRIOR71K said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3367942#Comment_3367942
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3368074#Comment_3368074
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3368155#Comment_3368155
Yes it is abuse. I view it no differently then when the devs overbuffed boil over and survivors were running to the library on the old RPD to make themselves unhookable. It isn't strategy when it doesn't require any thought or skill to do. There is no way to justify how this is good "strategy" on maps that have built in 3 gens (like dead dawg) that can be defended from the moment the match starts. I'm just going to assume you haven't played against this as a solo survivor yet because if you had, you'd realize how dumb it is to know the game is lost from the beginning if the SM does this and has slowdown perks stacked on top.
Sorry, but that is the definition of a strategy. Strategies do not require skill, they require thought, and strategies by definition require thought. Just because you and others didn't like it or think it's "not a strategy" because it was consistent to set up does not mean it isn't a strategy since strategies can indeed be, or be seen as, cheap... for lack of a better word.
Running to that spot is using the perk effectively. It's a flaw in the map that it can be done consistently, it's not "abuse".
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@Gandor said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3372105#Comment_3372105
Slinger has shots that no huntress could ever dream of. Like sure. Huntress is tough (especially with her across the map shots), but slinger can find shots in places that huntress would not even consider.
Saying that ds is just worse huntress is just pure unfair and wrong. It's just that slinger is harder to learn (try to look at all the tiny holes in the map and go for those cool shots - slingers can do insane stuff if you put in the time).
Instascope was pure BS. There was no counter to it (only macro play and dying in map corners). Current slinger is much better. But it's still true, that he could get some tweaks to make him feel better. Most of the stuff @BlueHorkew mentioned goes in this direction and it sounds reasonable.
You mean those small holes that don't secure downs because Slinger is not true ranged... again?
No, he IS weaker, 100%. Lower range to use his power, needs to get a close hit to down someone, has travel time like the others, etc.
And of course, the focusing on instascope because if I am complaining about current nerfed Slinger, it must mean that I want instascope back. Surely I can't want a Killer buffed without bringing back what the playerbase complained about, surely?
"Current slinger is much better."
Don't talk up a weak Killer please, it's spreading misinformation. Everything I said still stands, you just brought up the fact that his shot can go through holes and get those INSANE shots (if the Survivor isn't paying attention) that only allow for injures and don't get downs (which is what truly matters).
And it sounds reasonable because you don't see anything that could make him actually dangerous, that's all. "I can accept these changes because they won't actually buff him at all."
Which is pretty much proof of what the community sees as "balanced"... and most likely why the devs don't listen to the forums. :)
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@DBDVulture said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3371871#Comment_3371871
-"You're aware that the second part is actually playing those pallets correctly, right?"
I'm extremely good at getting people to waste pallets. To this end I bring Bamboozle which usually forces the survivor to give you a hit or use a pallet immediately on the first loop. Almost everyone I play against hates the way I play because I often drive them instead of the other way around.
-"You're still going to get outplayed by a good looper regardless of WoO, sorry about that."
My favorite Killer is Nemesis. I rarely get outplayed at a pallet. But when I see someone pull some nonsense that would shut down something like 50% of the killer cast it raises a huge red flag for me about this game's balance.
-"Which means the focus of this topic should be on maps... and not blaming perks."
WoO makes existing map imbalances worse. It allows the best players in the game to chain tiles more efficiently. WoO almost exactly matched the old pick rate for Iron Will (looking at some perk use sites) and has an effectively similar function in chases.
This is the exact opposite of Bamboozle. I bring Bamboozle on most killers as insurance because sometimes you get two windows that would be a near infinite if you didn't have the perk. That's complete nonsense.
And okay? That's their problem, you're shutting down what they're doing, you're dealing with good players in an efficient way. Ofc they're going to hate how you play, it's DBD, people can't take losses.
I also figured your favorite Killer was Nemesis, I remember scrolling down this topic and saw a tentacle mentioned at one point and formed an idea based off of that, but I've dealt with people using said ideas in arguments, so.
And it's more like 85%, if you're referring to shift+w and pre-dropping. Problem is, again, that style doesn't work unless in comp or you're on a map like The Game, but that map is somewhat unique in that it's an fairly enclosed space, and shift+w isn't quite as strong there.
"WoO makes existing map imbalances worse. It allows the best players in the game to chain tiles more efficiently. WoO almost exactly matched the old pick rate for Iron Will (looking at some perk use sites) and has an effectively similar function in chases."
It only lets people chain more efficiently slightly by allowing for some pre-planning and small reactions mid-chase. Problem is, again, the same pallets spawn in similar places, and the best players, or even experienced players, know the basics on how map formation works. WoO or no WoO, they will know where the pallet is, you are not going to see a huge difference. Again, your problem is maps, not WoO. I don't want a perk that helps solo queues with their dumb teammates dropping every pallet and getting the team killed nerfed just because you can't deal with a slight advantage.
And Bamb is amazing for shutting down places with god vaults efficiently like Killer shack with a good Survivor, it's an underrated perk for M1s and Killer in general that people sleep on. The low perk rate is because people are sheep, that really is it.
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@Caiman said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3371882#Comment_3371882
Are you saying experienced players using this perk is a problem in itself?
The problem is the perk. Period.
And calling you inflexible because you evidently don't want to switch targets is insulting you? Do you think I should not call out people when they try to defend not wanting to outplay the issue?
You've dismissed everything I've said by just calling me bad at the game. Yeah, that's insulting me. "Call out", yeah right.
If all 4 Survivors are pre-dropping pallets and refusing to play them, they will lose on the majority of maps. They will run out of pallets to use and die as a result.
They won't run out, not before they get all the generators done, especially not on these new maps that have pallets on strong loops everywhere that are nearly impossible to play around with most killers. Any time they touch up a map at all they add more pallets to it. And they have plenty of other resources on top of the pallets too, Boons, items, Dead Hard, etc. etc. which just compounds the problem. And even when you do exhaust pallets, WoO tell survivors where the pallets aren't anymore, too, which makes it a lot easier for them to avoid the deadzones they created and stick to strong tiles. Which is the whole reason I want its range reduced, so that they can't make make the most optimal decision at all times because of the huge amount of information it gives them.
"Just chase survivors." I can't when they're chaining every single pallet and loop together in a perfect run. "Just pressure them off gens." How, if I can't chase them? There is no pressure. You cut off one chase to check gens and the guy you ditched goes and hops on a gen themselves. Then you're back to square one with nothing accomplished. The only way this could work is to camp a 3-gen and break all the pallets around it, and even that won't work most of the time, and it sure won't be enjoyable even if it does.
Nah, the problem is you and the others. Period. You going period doesn't mean you're right, I know that you're upset but still.
"You've dismissed everything I've said by just calling me bad at the game. Yeah, that's insulting me. "Call out", yeah right."
That's absolutely not what I said and you're just ignoring advice that I gave you instead of... idk, even saying to me that you already switch targets, but go off. You're pretty much demonstrating why the devs don't listen to this community.
And which new maps will they not run out of pallets on before the gens are done? Borgo? The new Shelter Woods has even less pallets and lots of deadzones from what I saw on the PTB. There's like... one god loop on Skully's hideout to make up for it. And Wesker came with the RPD reworks. Which have god pallets... but you have to drop those pallets frequently and then the Killer can quickly kick and move on. Those maps are considered Killer sided anyways, last I checked.
"And even when you do exhaust pallets, WoO tell survivors where the pallets aren't anymore, too, which makes it a lot easier for them to avoid the deadzones they created and stick to strong tiles. Which is the whole reason I want its range reduced, so that they can't make make the most optimal decision at all times because of the huge amount of information it gives them."
This is pretty much just complaining about the perk itself and, in the bigger picture, complaining about a perk that can compete with DH and COH for perk slots. A range reduction isn't going to do anything if a Survivor just runs around a bit before sitting on a gen, you're clearly focused around Survivors sitting on a gen and looking around them. Not to mention that this is a bit funny, since WoO kinda helps with looping when in solo queue and you need to know what pallets your dumb teammates threw down. Which is probably a reason why WoO is so used: Solo queue.
Plus it's complaining about Survivors not running to dead zones and then getting hit because they thought a pallet was still there when someone used it earlier. You're upset because some inefficiency is gone and you can't get M1 hits as easily anymore... which is kinda necessary for a perk to see similar use as DH. Just get rid of the pallets that they run to. Even as M1, you can do it.
""Just chase survivors." I can't when they're chaining every single pallet and loop together in a perfect run. "Just pressure them off gens." How, if I can't chase them? There is no pressure. You cut off one chase to check gens and the guy you ditched goes and hops on a gen themselves. Then you're back to square one with nothing accomplished. The only way this could work is to camp a 3-gen and break all the pallets around it, and even that won't work most of the time, and it sure won't be enjoyable even if it does."
Firstly, you switched your argument. You said just pre-dropping earlier, and I shut that down. Admit you were wrong about that first.
Second... it sounds like your problem is optimal Survivor play, and not perks. Chaining tiles together is easy without WoO against anyone who knows the maps. And especially the bit about other people getting on gens when you're switching targets. Your root issue is not being able to deal with that kind of play. And it is difficult, but there are things that you can do.
It's based purely off of circumstances and the positions of everyone, but what the Survivors are doing affects what your next move is. Should you just chase someone to a pallet and make them drop it ASAP, then go back and chase another? Should you keep switching targets until you find the weakest link (Keyword: Weakest, not weak, there are weak links in teams but sometimes everyone is strong. In that case, you find the weakest out of the 4, and just chase them around until you can down them, or squeeze more pallets out of them.)?
Again, your problem is good Survivors, not WoO. Nerfing WoO isn't going to deal with Survivors who know how to chain tiles, it just makes it only slightly easier. Which isn't worth nerfing the perk for everyone else, sorry.
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@BlueHorkew said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3371961#Comment_3371961
Would you prefer a 28m TR, i just don't want him to shoot survivors outside of his TR with Monitor.
The ADS for entering is 0.4 with a 0.5 of firing delay. Comparing this numbers with other killers with similar range powers i think they are on par with them in order to give enough of reaction time to survivors. I just think that it feels bad because he didn't use to have this.
I would only give him maybe additional changes to his reload, maybe reduce the time to 2.5s (from 2.75), or increase his movement speed while reloading. One of the two.
Uh, why not let him do that? Slinger needs to get a direct hit to down, you need to be within a certain meter range to even get shot, and as soon as you see it's a Slinger and you hear his TR radius, you know what's happening.
Stop being scared of decent perk combos.
And as for the "similar range powers", as I said before, Slinger isn't true ranged. It's not just bad because "HE DIDNT USE TO HAVE THIS', it feels bad because it shows on loops and how you have to ADS behind a corner and slow down in the process to get shots at places like shack or jungle gyms, which leads to not being able to get angles because Survivors turn the corner quickly easily and consistently. He has to do the same thing as Huntress and Trickster now, including account for shot travel time, except he has limited range so he can't shoot people when they're shift+w-ing easily.
He's literally a worse Huntress at this point. No lullaby but so what? His TR is so massive that Survivors can run so far before Slinger can get a down, or a shot, with his power. Huntress deserves the lullaby, Slinger does not.
His reload isn't the issue with him, at all, it's him being a paid Killer while having the same or less chase potential as Huntress+Trickster but with less strengths than those two. But if you want to do BHVR-style changes that don't address his issues and just make people upset, sure go ahead.
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@BlueHorkew said:
Some improvements to Deathslinger, mainly focused on some of his bad add-ons to make them more interesting.
Base-kit:
Terror radius: From 32 to 24m, added a lullaby of 40m
After hooking a survivor the redeemer automatically reloads
Add-on Pass:
Marshall Badge: Survivor within 24m of a speared survivor suffer from the oblivious status effect for 60 seconds
Jaw Smasher: Reduce the basic attack hit cooldown by 20% when hitting a survivor speared by the redeemer. This effect will not stack with other attack cooldown reduction.
Wanted Poster: Every time you hit a non obsession survivor you see the aura of the obsession for 5 seconds and they also see yours. In the end game when the obsession is speared by the redeemer they suffer from the exposed
Honey Locus Thorn: Survivors hit by the redeemer suffer from the Mangled and Haemorrage status effect
Gold Creek Whiskey: You see the aura of survivors speared by the redeemer, this effects extends for 6 seconds after they are no longer speared
Hellshire Iron: You start the match undetectable for 30 seconds, when a survivor looses a health state by the redeemer you gain the undetectable status effect for 15 seconds.
Slinger isn't true ranged like Huntress and Trickster, he doesn't need a lullaby. He's more reliant on stealth than other ranged killers, actually, which is why he deserved the smaller terror radius.
Can we also add maybe revert the ADS readying speed nerf upon entering ADS only? And just leave the current penalty if he decides to cancel ADS. This way he can do cool reaction shots again on Survivors, but now he needs to commit to his shots.
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@Nos37 said:
It used to be that you could get a couple pallets out of a survivor and drop chase, creating a dead zone. Chasing near that zone meant you didnt have to deal with all the pallets. But the Hit & Run playstyles brought about Circle of Healing. Dropping chase is more punishing, and committing means seeing more pallets. 🤷♂️
Which is why you force more pallets out of Survivors while defending gens, no?
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@Caiman said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3371857#Comment_3371857
Windows just makes it easier for noobs to know where pallets are as well.
And yet so many experienced players are still running the perk. Strange.
And are you and OP actually complaining about someone basically gamethrowing by pre-dropping every pallet in the match?
Last i heard this was actually optimal play because there's like 40 pallets on every map these days which is plenty to slow down a killer so they don't need to take risks and can pre-drop everything, then zoom off to the next pallet as soon as the killer even starts to catch up. It is far from throwing the game.
Like, it's so obvious to just drop chase or get 2 pallets out of them if the Survivor is playing this way. You're evidently inflexible and unable to switch targets, a very basic Killer tactic, or exploit Survivor playstyles if this in particular is your reasoning.
Now you're just insulting me, thanks for that. If every single survivor is playing this way, which is not uncommon in my experiences, then dropping chase to move on to the next survivor doesn't make a difference. By the time they all run out of pallets, the game is pretty much over.
So what if they are using it? Are you saying experienced players using this perk is a problem in itself? Taking off WoO might prevent less experienced players from knowing where lesser used pallets are, but that's it. You're still going to lose to them without WoO.
And it's only optimal to pre-drop in tournament squads, which I mentioned, but now I see how you do things. Plus that "40 pallets" thing, if people actually say that about every map nowadays, is a small amount of maps... I don't think you shouldn't be kicking every pallet on those specific maps anyways, I know that's not how one deals with The Game off the top of my head...
And calling you inflexible because you evidently don't want to switch targets is insulting you? Do you think I should not call out people when they try to defend not wanting to outplay the issue?
If all 4 Survivors are pre-dropping pallets and refusing to play them, they will lose on the majority of maps. They will run out of pallets to use and die as a result. Keep shoving people off of gens and switching targets if you've figured out this is the type of team and you will burn through their resources, that's how DBD works to begin with.
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@DBDVulture said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3371710#Comment_3371710
-"so what? It tells you where the pallets are. So your problem is the maps, not the pallets themselves."
Being able to see where all the pallets are increases your ability to loop efficiently. If this were not the case then no one would use Windows.
Overall I would say the mechanics of pallet stuns were a lot more fair in 2016 as they required a skill shot to time the stun correctly. If you mistimed the event then you got hit and stunned (this happened a lot back in 2016 because there was a delay before the stun AND the hitbox was massively smaller).
Pallets as a whole are fine when a map has ~8 pallets. But some maps have 11-14 and there is one with 25 pallets.
It might be interesting if we had steel and wooden pallets. Steel pallets take the current pallet duration to break and stun for longer but take longer to pull down. Wooden pallets are faster to drop but get smashed in one kick (and give stun like the killer has endurance).
Overall I would say no the pallet situation is not "ok".
You're aware that the second part is actually playing those pallets correctly, right? Not just knowing where they are? A good looper is going to have a general idea where pallets are except for special, rarely used pallets. You're still going to get outplayed by a good looper regardless of WoO, sorry about that.
And then, in that case, the source of your complaints are certain maps specifically. Which means the focus of this topic should be on maps... and not blaming perks. But to stay on topic, nerfing WoO absolutely will not fix your problem, since those 25 pallets are very visible if we both have the same map in mind and you're still going to lose to good loopers on this map.
Generally, the two actual reasons for why you would want to run WoO is:
- You're new and don't know where the pallets are yet. Which is fine, WoO doesn't help you play pallets themselves and throwing down pallets instantly will throw the game unless you're in a squad or the Killer is newer than you.
- You're experienced but don't want to miss pallets. Which is also fine, since you're typically going to know where all the pallets are to begin with and you're most likely going to know where basically all of the pallets are without WoO. You can play pallets somewhat decently already and you knowing where lesser used pallets are isn't going to matter if the Killer can't outplay you at pallets.
Interesting pallet idea though.
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@Caiman said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3371710#Comment_3371710
Knowing where pallets are is powerful. I think this would be fine if you didn't see all the pallets on half the dang map all at once which lets survivors chain them together endlessly without hesitation or doubt. Which is why I want the range decreased, so it only shows what's in the immediate vicinity. If you want WoO to have a big range, run it with Open Hand.
Yeah, knowing where pallets are is somewhat powerful. Thing is? Everyone knows where the majority of pallets are, knowing how maps generate generally lets you know where pallets will be just by looking, Windows just makes it easier for noobs to know where pallets are as well. The big part is actually playing those pallets and not dropping them.
And are you and OP actually complaining about someone basically gamethrowing by pre-dropping every pallet in the match? That leads to Killer victories 90% of the time except in tournament squads (which are the minority and should not be balanced around), why do people think the "Meghead" meme exists?
Like, it's so obvious to just drop chase or get 2 pallets out of them if the Survivor is playing this way. You're evidently inflexible and unable to switch targets, a very basic Killer tactic, or exploit Survivor playstyles if this in particular is your reasoning.
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@Spectralfx said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3371318#Comment_3371318
Except for the math part, I fail to see how any of what you mentionned proves anything.
Oni winning through dead hard is irrelevant, it just mean that outside of DH survivors played very poorly ( it's a thing).
Also, BNP stacks with the effects of other people having toolbox, it brings down the lowest achievable 1st gen time to roughly 17 seconds... whoever mathematcian you watch probably don't play at high level and probably don't understand what a proper "gen rush" entails.
You only need 1 survivor with it in their toolbox, usually whoever brings the weakest box.
Sorry, let me give a bit more info: People have posted clips of Onis eating several DHs in tournament matches and still winning. On these forums... fairly recently. Which indicates something.
And by admitting that the Survivors, outside of DH, played poorly and still lost the game, you actually do kinda lose the argument in the process, because that team still lost the game (because they played poorly) despite running "crazy strong perks". Which indicates that DH doesn't carry Survivors as much as people think, and skill is required in other areas. I failed to mention that it was a tournament, yes, but I DID say that the Survivors successfully landed several DHs, and still lost the game. AKA they got value, but still took the L. Which would mean that DH does not need to be nerfed if you can refuse to wait for DH several times and still win because it doesn't carry games, and you and the others are just blaming the perk instead of the Survivors knowing what to do and... well, being good.
And proper gen rush is 3 Survivors on 3 different gens, 17 seconds means 3 Survivors on a single gen iirc and 10 second clips in customs with perfect conditions aren't high level play, so you yourself don't know what proper genrush is, and balancing around high level is stupid because that's not the majority of the playerbase and the majority will never reach high level.
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@Spectralfx said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3371305#Comment_3371305
Okay then, makes sense.
I wasn't sure as you wrote a whole paragraph instead of... you know... agreeing.
I wouldn't be against buffing boons in a world were DH, Brand new parts and other crazy strong survivor options were finally nerfed for good.
I think that fighting for map control for something other than gens or pallet would be a cool dimension to the game if killer actually had "time" for it.
I was confirming how it would work in practice.
BNP also isn't a problem. People have done the math in videos iirc, BNP is less efficient than either normal toolboxes or just bringing toolboxes with basic add-ons. DH isn't either, people have posted clips of Onis eating several DHs and still winning.
What other "crazy strong survivor options" exist btw, that might confirm for me whether you want OP things nerfed or just don't want to deal with new things that make you think differently or adjust your build slightly, like 90% of the DBD community.
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@philward1953 said:
I assume this is a DBD x Meet Your Maker crossover thingy, but did they ever announce this? I only started to find these today. I've only escaped with one and I got an "HRV Figurine". It's kinda cute!
The weird red glowing thing was called a "Gemat"
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/Q5TRM8YLPK9L/screenshot-2888-29.png
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/96EGOOWYIPYG/screenshot-2889-29.png
Some have speculated that this might have been an intended thing, another shadow-drop event like the Silent Hill gnomes a while back.
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@[Deleted User] said:
Play With Your Food, is a perk that HAS really needed to be cleaned up in the special attack interaction and interpretation department for a long time now, as it's rather loose as to what count's as an "attack" and making change's to killer's because an add-on make's a good synergy just creates confusion (Along with some other killer's).
Generally an "attack" is a direct action by the killer that carry's damage, usually the token is consumed when this action is dealt, For instance pressing the Basic Attack button is an action that carry's damage, for a Special Attack we would need a few example's:
*Trapper setting a beartrap is not a direct action that causes damage (no token loss), a survivor stepping in a bear trap is not a direct action from the killer that carry's damage (no token loss).
*Hillbilly rev's his chainsaw, a direct action but has no damage (no token loss), Hillbilly chainsaw sprint's which is a direct action that carry's damage (token loss).
*Plague use's vile purge, a direct action that carry's no damage (no token loss), vile purge reach's max on a survivor, not a direct action from the killer that carry's damage (no token loss), Plague use's corrupt purge, a direct action that carry's damage (token loss).
*Knight summon's a guard, not a Direct Action that deal's damage (no token loss), Guard hit's survivor dealing damage, not a direct action that carry's damage from the killer (no token loss). Knight perform's a Basic Attack, a direct action that carry's damage (token loss).
They should look into Play with your food and clean up and make ceratin interaction's act properly. The best way to do this is make sure that token's are consumed/lost when a "Direct Action" that cause's damage comes from the killer (see Knight explanation above). Instead of cenobite just not being able to use the perk because there power doesn't remove health states unless a ceratain add-on is brought it should be:
Cenobite creating a chain portal, not a direct action that causes damage (no token loss), Firing a chain to tag a survivor, not a direct action that carry's damage (no token loss). Firing a chain with Engineer's fang, a direct action that carry's damage (token loss).
There's a couple of other killer's beside Cenobite that have weird PWYF interatcion's which just prevent them from using it.
Deathslinger, he lose's a token whenever he fires the redeemer, an action which does not carry damage at all, he does lose a token when hitting a speared survivor or breaking the chain manually which is intended, since those are both direct action's which carry damage. Breaking the chain to wound a survivor with the enviroment does not remove a token of PWYF which technically isn't a direct action that carry's damage.
Twin's also have a weird interaction. Twin's have weird interaction's with perk's as Victor sometime's activates them. Victor consume's PWYF token's, which make's sense it is a direct action that carry's damage, however Victor doesn't gain the speed bonus from the token's and technically isn't meant to activate/apply perk's, so should you lose token's by attacking with him? You are in control of Victor but as stated, he's not intended to activate/apply perk's, so would it count as a Direct Action from the killer when Charlotte's the killer and Victor's the power?
Trickster, his throwing knive's don't deal damage until the meter's full but count as a direct action that deal's damage for each knife thrown. Which is weird when you consider Plague's Vile Purge.
Nemesis (last one i think), hitting a non-infected survivor with the Tentecle whip is not a direct action that deal's damage yet it result's in token loss.
(edit: typo on "Charlotte")
This could be fixed so that PWYF removes stacks per health state loss. Would let most killers + killers like Trickster and Huntress use the perk nicely without really losing anything.
Although, Bubba might be a problem in that case... but then you could just make it so that insta-downs or certain insta-downs (like through a direct Killer power like Billy/Bubba and not through Exposed via perks or Myers/Ghosty) remove two stacks instead of one.
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@solarjin1 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3368583#Comment_3368583
Ts Myers is about as fun as getting gen rush. You just roll your eyes and go to the next match.
Given that it's a unique challenge that I never see, it's plenty fun to me.
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@ReikoMori said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3371280#Comment_3371280
For pc play that would require the same level of control and access to root functionality akin to what you have to give to Respondus Lockdown Browser which is used to do exactly this. It's a pain to deal with as a college student who is required to use it for taking exams. It's invasive and has a non zero chance of compromising the security of your system in a way that isn't immediately apparent or easy to fix without resetting your OS.
Now put that sort of system in a far less regulated application like DBD and watch how much worse everything gets for everyone. Keep in mind this is a game that already has repeated issues with getting ddos'd and botted.
Yeah, there's no way people would give a game that level of control, especially if DBD would be blocking major communication tools like Discord from running at the same time. That would raise a huge stink and people would not tolerate that.
Not to mention getting Sony and Microsoft to actually go along with giving DBD special permissions in this regard... it's basically impossible, you'd have an easier time buffing Killers to handle more consistent SWF play from solos.
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@Spectralfx said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3371303#Comment_3371303
You really don't read eh?
What I am saying is just, survivor get's to bless a totem with CoH (this one only) once per trial.
This doesn't affect others boons in any shape or form, period.
Um... I did read.
"And... okay, so it would be programmed where if a Survivor brings multiple boons, and places them, and then the Killer snuffs the totem... COH is deactivated and rebooning a totem won't apply COH?"
I wrote this in response to you. We are saying the same thing now.
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@Spectralfx said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3371290#Comment_3371290
Well, no.
Some hexes can be re-light while others can't.
Making CoH a one time deal would still make it very strong (people would probably hold it until they actually need it instead of spamming it all over non-stop)
Such a change would have 0 impact on other boons, it would be a perk specific change.
Read on how hexes works, killers have it way harder lol
Pentimento is a very special kind of re-lighting where it more so takes up a slot where a totem was. It's not really a re-lighting perk, more of a hex perk that activates through broken totems. Not quite the same as boons.
And... okay, so it would be programmed where if a Survivor brings multiple boons, and places them, and then the Killer snuffs the totem... COH is deactivated and rebooning a totem won't apply COH?
Honestly, if we're going to do that, I would rather just buff and nerf boons. Not just make them basically removed from the game, because then that would make it too risky to run. We'd lose another perk that can compete with meta perks, meaning more DHs.
And I know all about hexes, I'm not a new player. That's why I think that boons should be adjusted so that they're high risk, high reward, like hexes. As it is now, they're low/mediocre reward for low risk. Which makes them forgettable.
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@waffleminion said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3371281#Comment_3371281
Man lol this community is kinda #########
Just in case: You are aware that Survivors received some basekit SWF information, right? Again, that would explain why it felt like you "kept running into SWF bully squads".
And you didn't answer my question... but I think the conversation is done, sadly.
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@waffleminion said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3371282#Comment_3371282
Refer to my first paragraph, youre a waste of time
The paragraph where you said you're a new player and that you played for a few months in 2016... and that you hope the devs see this post, regardless if the playerbase agrees?
Are you trying to say that because the community might not agree, you're allowed to be hostile with people who respond and try to refute what you are saying? I don't understand.
And I'm completely serious, just in case.
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@Spectralfx said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3371279#Comment_3371279
I would say that only CoH needs to be counterable the way hexes are.
Remember that some OP perks got turned into hexes in the first place to allow a counterplay due to how impactful they were (NOED)
COH is in the same position.
I mean, that would indirectly hurt other Boon perks, because then stacking COH with other boon perks (due to how BHVR set things up) would be a bad idea. If your COH is destroyed, you lose all of your perks.
Honestly, it's better to go with the "optional permanent destroy" basekit ability, since then every boon can be buffed and they're no longer forgettable + failed new mechanic.
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@waffleminion said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3371276#Comment_3371276
I'm sure there's some way to block outgoing audio outside the application when the app is running. Enough reports a team member would review that survivor group. Stop asking stupid questions and use you're brain a bit
You do realize that getting aggressive is just going to get people to stop responding to you in good faith, right?
EDIT: Also, to respond, this is going to be nearly impossible on Playstation off of the top of my head, DBD would need to have an absolutely insane amount of power over Sony to get them to actually restrict platform features while DBD is booted up. And as for PC, DBD would need to be checking for programs running, like Discord, or something... and that's kinda invasive, which people are not going to be in favor of.
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@waffleminion said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3371277#Comment_3371277
You completely missed my main point and trying to strawman
Uh, since your main point is based off of these "bully squads" you ran against, it's fully possible you ran into solos who knew what they were doing, especially since you've missed several major updates that both buffed and nerfed Survivors, if you last played in 2016.
Also, what is an MP title? Mario Party? Multiplayer?
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@Spectralfx said:
That perk also create another issue;
As killer you can no longer hurt survivors to deplete their pool of ressources (medkits) or coerce them off gens for a moment to heal a partner (gen pressure)
Because you know, somewhere on the map there is a blue source of unlimited free healz.
If killer finds and snuff out the boon it should be dead forever, the same way Hexes get shut down.
This will then involve gigantic buffs to every single boon then, correct?
Because as it is, COH is the only boon that exists, basically, all of the other boons are forgettable, Dark Theory basically never happened and the devs clearly abandoned Boons after only a few chapters.
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@waffleminion said:
Im writing this in hopes that the devs ultimately see this post, regardless of whether or not the community agrees, I'm not entirely sure what the general opinions of the long term DBD players are as I am a new player, I played for a few months all the way back in 2016, came back last month. So I'd consider myself new.
So I've worked myself up quite a bit and I'm sure there's SBMM. On the survivor side it's kinda mixed, most randoms I'm paired up with are horrible. The killer side was very fun, up until tonight. I swear every game I'm playing is SWF, I dont understand why I, as the killer can't turn off match-making for SWF. Imo it ruins the entire experience and I genuinely can't believe that this issue hasn't been properly addressed yet. All it would take imo is proximity chat where the killer can hear the player based on range and volume. Could even implement a new elf/goblin-like killer with big ears meant to enhance eavesdropping with the proximity chat. Using a 3rd party application would be grounds for a ban.
SWF currently makes the game extremely unbalanced, and its just bully squad after bully squad tonight.
So I'm deleting the game again, hope the devs figure something out. It's genuinely a fun MP title, dunno why there hasn't been proper competition yet, but it just blows my mind that this long-standing issue that completely tips the game's balancing hasn't been addressed and fixed yet.
Another recommendation that I have is that I think that there should be a ranked mode. This mode would tie specific perks to specific survivors, it would operate kind of like Battle Field classes and players wouldn't be able to choose the same survivors so no player runs the same perks. Then within these classes you can select specific perks that are tied to that class.
The game needs some major rebalacing work imo.
What exactly were these "SWFs" like? Because due to the Survivor status icons, it allows for some SWF-level communication without needing to be in a SWF. Maybe you just kept running into good players who knew what to do and how to read the status updates?
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@siro said:
The hitboxes in this game are literally garbage.
Starting from the fact that there are killers like bubba, hillbily, blight, mastermind, that when they try to hit a survi at the moment he is jumping a pallet with his ability/power, the game (I DON'T UNDERSTAND WHY) makes a preference and chooses that the power hit /destroy the pallet, instead of the survi jumping.
Another thing. The blows that are given to the survis, when you are jumping a pallet or a window and you are already at a considerable distance so that a hit no longer connects you, AND IT CONNECTS YOU THE SAME. ???????????
Fix this garbage that is becoming unplayable. BHVR you have been with a game for years, since 2016 and this last point was always happening. Is it intentional that the game rewards you in a negative way the way you act with the mechanics? Because if it's not intentional, I honestly don't get it.
And this sh** makes me so dizzy. Honestly, its so raging. 0 Sense.
Maybe the issue is your connection? Or maybe you're experiencing packet loss? I see Youtubers not really struggling with the 2nd issue (and the 1st, to a certain extent) they 360 and it works and hits clearly connect for them.
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@I_CAME said:
Actually you don't have to suck it up. This is a video game. It's not a job. People are under no obligation to put up with things they don't enjoy. If people are constantly DCing to specific things then it's probably a sign that those things are badly designed and need to be changed. That's more likely than everyone just being a crybaby which is what you seem to be implying.
People were dcing and hook suiciding when Killers got their basekit buffs a while back. Contrary to popular belief, this community can mass dc and suicide based off of popular opinions and knee-jerk reactions. The majority is fully capable of being wrong.
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@Aven_Fallen said:
Yeah and IMO the Survivors really cannot be blamed for that. It is just miserable to go against a Skull Merchant who decides to 3-Gen. I played one game today against a Skull Merchant who in fact did use the Drones on Gens, but was not super-hard on the 3-Gen and it was ok.
But I also played against 3 Skull Merchants who were just 3-genning and not really chasing anyone. One of them burned The Game as well. And nobody really wants to play a game of trying to break a 3-Gen for 40+ minutes while not even getting the chance to go into a decent chase. Sure, you get a good amount of BPs because the game is so long, but you would have gotten more BPs in the 3 games you can play instead of that one 40+ minute game...
Skull Merchant is the one Killer since original Legion where I feel constantly miserable to play against and dont want to play at all. She is also not really fun to play in my opinion since she is not really strong (outside of her 3-Gen) but more because she is really dull to play AND kind of distracting...
And well - aside from being the first Killer since Legion which really makes me want to not play against it, I also think that this is the first Killer where I have to say - just killswitch her. Killswitch her, rework her and bring her back in a few months. And when bringing her back, include a Refund-option (for money, ACs or Shards, whatever the people paid for it) in case they dont like the reworked version of Skull Merchant. Because the current design really should not be in the game and BHVR should really pull her back for now and start from scratch.
I pretty muched called this entire mindset happening the moment Skully came out. I knew people would start seeing her the same as old Legion once the 3 gen strat proved so effective with her. It's all Skully players do now because the Killer is so weak that they have no choice. It's literally old Legion and moonwalking all over again, yet another Killer that is so weak that they have to rely on unfun strategies to get something done.
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@Xernoton said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3368581#Comment_3368581
Friend, I did not mention the Tombstone. But now that you did, I'll say it's an outdated mechanic as well. At least the Tombstone Piece shouldn't exist in it's current form. Tombstone is more or less fine. It's pretty obvious when it's in the game so there is some counterplay to it.
You make it sound like the Tombstone addons have the same effect as Thanatophobia. "Get hit and slow your team down." But it's more like "Get hit and instantly die." At least the Tombstone Piece has to go eventually. You can instantly kill one person at 5 gens remaining.
By the way you're completely missing the point. I said Michael Myers in his current state doesn't fit into the game anymore. He is outdated. A great early game for him is still a bad early game for any other killer. His tier 3 isn't all that powerful, if you can't use it to snow ball and at some point his power will literally run out. His faster vault is becoming increasingly more worthless because most maps are so stacked with pallets that he can't really capitalize on it anyway. His tier 1 is the worst debuff to a killer immaginable. He's undetetable but moves at 105%. That might be useful on Lery's and Midwich but then you get sent to Ormont against a group that knows what they're doing. He needs a rework. His base kit and addons should be looked at.
You said "Myers is outdated" and how he was made for 2017 DBD. People who say that almost always have Tombstone in mind. Either that, or they mean his power. Sometimes both.
And no, it really doesn't have the same effect, Thana is a weak perk only good on certain killers while Myers add-ons can allow for a new way of eliminating Survivors, a new threat that isn't a complete joke without very specific add-ons and perks like Sadako's condemned, and you generally get insta killed at 5 gens if your team isn't doing gens. Stop blaming the killer for your team's incompetence. This is done in many topic on the forums, and I'm sick of it.
Or alternatively, we can just buff his basekit instead of touching some of the most unique add-ons in the game, with several entire builds that can be done with this Killer. His power running out doesn't matter since at that point, the game is typically done. Myers can just run Endu+Fury if that's an issue.
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@SweetTerror said:
How does anyone play skull merchant with that abysmal 2 second loop of chase music? People rightfully gave the reworked chase music for Ghostface crap because it was grating to the ears. How could they not? After all it sounded like a washing machine, and yet the skull merchant is somehow even worse.
Seriously, gameplay discussions aside I can't stand the music. It's very annoying, and no matter how hard I try to look past it, I just can't. Out of all the killers, I can't think of a worse chase music.
Yeah, the composer (I forget his name) has been really good with new chase music ever since they started that with Oni, but it seems like he's been sort of... losing his touch? I suppose it's the result of having to make songs for years every... what, 4 months..? but... it's becoming a noticeable pattern. Hag, Nurse, Knight, and now Skull Merchant... there's others I'm forgetting, I'm sure.
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This Killer really is just Legion 1.0 in terms of unhealthiness. I still think that SMs are going to settle into this playstyle, and then people will DC the moment they either hear her chase music, or realize she's setting up a 3 gen.
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@Verconissp said:
They won't make Shattered Hopes basekit for some reason,
Fog offerings exist which needs to be removed tbh,
some killers struggle against survivors hardcore,
normal dbd things,
Literally just make the ability to break boons basekit AND optional (so NOED and stuff can still work) OR make Boons go on long cooldowns upon being snuffed and then buff every Boon to compensate.
And before someone goes "BUT BOOWNS" no, you mean COH. You not only basically never see any other Boon besides COH, but boons were dropped after Dark Theory came out.
Yeah, Dark Theory. THAT exists. I bet you didn't know it did, it's easy to pretend it doesn't exist, and it's exactly the problem with boons in a nutshell. Boons are too safe, so they have low to mediocre rewards outside of COH. There is no real punishment for getting your boon discovered. Give the Killer the ability to break a totem if they find a boon, or make getting your boon snuffed inflict large cooldowns on your boons. Problem solved.
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@NerfedFreddy said:
Make bloodlust exclusive trait of m1 killers, anti-loop killers don't need that, they are already strong and should rely on their powers instead of w-gaming
that's your buff
So, making this basekit for M1 Killers will prevent them from getting extra chase changes, and force them to boringly trail behind a Survivor, begging for hits.
Or do you think Killers can "mindgame" most tiles? Open tiles like the center of Blood Lodge say "hello", plus standing in optimal spots with 3rd person camera as Survivor to deny any and all mindgames.
Without any kind of anti-loop, M1 Killers ARE reliant on mistakes or altruism to get things done. If Survivors know what to do, they can consistently do long chases against these Killers... which result in losses. It's why Nurse and Blight are meta.
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@Xernoton said:
I think they can't do another 6.1.0. That would not help with the core issues some of these killers have. Myers for example is simply outdated. He was not designed for this game. He was designed for 2017 DBD, which was a very different game.
More addon passes and also base kit reworks / buffs are probably the way to go for most killers. Though, even then you won't make Trapper an A-tier killer.
Stop complaining about tombstone. Stop.
You're right, this isn't 2017 DBD, which was 1v1v1v1v1. 2023 DBD is a 4v1, which is why people shouldn't complain about getting their actions slowed down because their teammates messed up.
ISTG, with how these forums think getting multiple Eruption procs in a game is "abusing Eruption", and the persistent 1v1 mindset that people have regarding balance, it's no wonder the devs don't listen to the forums.
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@Gamall said:
"Vulnerable" is the right word in my opinion
Vulnerable might be a bit too long...
Does anyone here have a word that means "to make something fragile"? Because that would work perfectly.
Enfeebled works somewhat but it's as long as Vulnerable and people might not know what enfeebled means...
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@Mandy said:
What platform are you on please?
Not the OP, but I'm on Steam, and based off of everyone here, something extremely bad is happening with the servers, and you might need to alert the team to an emergency.
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Suddenly having the same issue as well. "Could not connect to RTM server".
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@Monlyth said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3363475#Comment_3363475
You haven't met a lot of female and/or trans gamers, I take it?
Just look at this thread; a genderfluid person getting talked down to by somewhere around 13 people for a simple QoL suggestion.
It's hilarious, but also sad, to see gamers claim they aren't bigoted while jumping down a trans person's throat for wanting to be out of the closet.
No, there are some strange things in OP's thread, people are picking up on it and how it almost sounds like some bigot pretending to be LGBT+.
Like, "getting misgendered while being slugged on the ground"? DBD doesn't have voice coms, this sounds like a non-DBD player trying to basically concern troll. Their OP contradicts the game itself.
The only other thing I can think of is that TC is referencing a specific event, and since they heard someone talking to them while being slugged, I'm assuming they went to a bigoted streamer's twitch stream or something.
Not to mention that it's been 2 days and OP has been eerily silent.
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@SMitchell8 said:
Some alternative game modes could include;
1. Hardcore (No terror radius, red stain, auras and limited HUD.
2. First person perspective
3. Perkless (perks can be found in game and equipped)
4. Switch repairing generators for crafting/finding parts to build a raft to escape an island (alternative to gens and exit gates) farfetched idea lol
5. 2 v 8 (Frequently suggested)
You know, looking at this gave me an insane idea for a "roguelike" DBD mode. Where Killers and Survivors have to gain perks and stuff mid-match and lose them all at the end of the game.
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@Aven_Fallen said:
Incapacitated should not exist outside of Killer Powers (like Victor or Pinheads Chains). So I am happy if they remove it from any Perks.
And this has nothing to do with "Survivors crying", it is just really bad gamedesign to be forced to do nothing for some amount of time.
I mean, how bad would it be if the Killer can be incapacitated? Maybe not for 25 seconds, but for like 7 seconds? This would really suck and should not be a thing.
A status-effect which simply blocks almost all ways of playing the game should really be quite rare and only related to some Killer-Powers.
People who say this seem to not know that this is a 4v1, which is why the 1 can get stuff like Incapitated but the 4 can't do the same to the Killer. Literally, these two roles aren't comparable just because of the number difference, to start.
Not to mention that one person on a one person team being unable to do anything isn't the same as two people being unable to do anything on a four person team.
And people who cry actually do go "bad game design", along with using "balance" and "counterplay" as their favorite buzzwords... so this does indeed to have to do with "Survivors crying".
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@Emeal said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3366546#Comment_3366546
bHVR should put SOMETHING in the Survivor HUD that helps with dealing with 3Gens.
Something that informs the other survivors of whats happening.
Skull merchant is really really good at 3gens, and SoloQ survivors are not. But many Killers can do 3Gens if they are bad chaser.
I think @Phasmamain is right, Skull merchant is just the latest offender, this is a problem SoloQ'ers need help to identify and have a strategy to do about.
Why not just add basic specific in-game messages like Identity V has? You can even let people pick out a perk they have and send a message like "I have Kinship!". Would fix the issue with perks like Kinship and counter camping + tunneling.
If you're worried about spam, add a cooldown. Simple.
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@Mooks said:
Or maybe.. the killer just doesn’t suit you at all but may be something others can play with? Don’t get me wrong, she does need adjustments, but it’s not as bad as some make it out to be. It’s more the general M1 hit problem and not specifically Skull merchant problem that most people complain about.
Her adept is impossible unless you get negative IQ survivors
its not that hard to get a 4 K with decent map, RNG in your favor and good addons, sorry but if you are being remotely serious here this is a skill-issue.
there are plenty of casual players on both sides. Not everyone is only focusing on highest skill levels.
I dunno, she's definitely a 3 gen killer and basically every Youtuber I've seen do funny videos on SM has directly or indirectly mentioned the 3 gen problem (Yerv) or her being weak (Spooks)
Like, the glaring problems in her design and power design are there and have all been brought up, she can't get value from her drones if she isn't there, so people lock down an area from the beginning, and just play in that area until Survivors throw themselves at the Killer to leave the match. People hated Eruption because of 3 gens, why make a weak Killer who needs that to do anything, and isn't fun for Survivors because they have to put up with something nearly uncounterable if the Killer dedicates to that 3 gen?
"She does need adjustments" is a massive understatement, she needs an entire rework, she's unhealthy for the game and weak like Legion.
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@BlueHorkew said:
Has anyone found dredge to be weird since the update?
I was going against a dredge on the new shelter woods and nightfall seemed darker than usual, i was having way harder time to see around me than what i remember.
Then the weirdest thing happened, dredge became invisible during the nightfall, not only i couldn't see him, i went down and was getting carried by nothing, in my screen Dredge just didn't exist.
Is something going on with Dredge or am i tripping?
Sounds like the new Dredge buff went live. /s
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@tippy2k2 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3365532#Comment_3365532
That and the DBD Discord isn't run by BHVR so this is doubly the wrong place to ask
I imagine you'd have to DM a Mod on the DBD Discord but since that's not something handled here and I am not part of the Discord, I have no idea who that would be
Didn't it use to be run by BHVR though? Do you know why that changed?
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Nah, they're right.
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@leviivel said:
her lore doesn’t explore her all that much, it’s not that great.
she was only but a young girl until she found the manga’s that her father created and became inspired, similarly to how deathslinger and trickster got their nicknames, “the skull merchant” came from those manga’s. Anywho she starts running an online site where she has other people make manga for her, later in her life her father left. Making her the only source of income since her mother didn’t work. When she turned 18 she had already become as self made millionaire. She bought companies and literally killed competition. But ultimately, was taken by the entity.
they really should’ve explored her more because there’s no explanation on how she got into robotics and the only big character trait we have of her is that she will become absolutely obsessed with anything if it means she is the best.
Haven't fully read her lore, but I'm guessing because "she gets high grades therefore she can do robotics" or something. Or they're going to leave the robotics for a tome and they threw the robotics in while planning that for a tome. Which is... really lazy.
Honestly, this chapter feels like a mess, the Killer's design being too many things at once + bad power being the highlight of this chapter.
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@Skill_issue said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3365005#Comment_3365005
with bubba you can catch up and with legion you just make sure to get a frenzy hit first...there is counter play available. ghostface and myers yeah i guess they are screwed but myers is supposed to get an addon update.
Source on that add-on update? Because if that's true, I'm gonna be pissed that they're listening to 1v1 babies and nerfing tombstone.
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@jamally093 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3347021#Comment_3347021
Thought they were set in America?
I think this is the case, Trapper's lore is set during the times of slavery in America iirc.
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@Witchubtet said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3347058#Comment_3347058
I also Said only effects two gens. Also entity blockers aren’t as harsh as incapacitated or as dumb as aura reading on downs. The cool down is so it can’t be abused constantly, but gives killers 45 seconds to focus on a chase or check on the third gen. It also gives survivors time to work on the gens without the fear of eruption.
Thing is, I don't like the thought of it affecting only two gens.
And it can't be "ABUSED" constantly if you have to WORK for it. You have to get downs AKA win chases.
Are you thinking this is a 1v1 game, and not a 4v1? Because people who use the word "abused" seem to think that they should have consistent, reliable, easy counterplay and subconsciously think things should be a 1v1, balance-wise.