Theninjajesus
Theninjajesus
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@Johnny_XMan said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1920402#Comment_1920402
What exactly do you mean?
I actually don't agree with that at all. I can agree on it from a killer to killer perspective, because someone like Spirit or Billy doesn't need Ruin as much as someone like Trapper or Pig, for example.
The point is that they are not doing anything to address core mechanics that force survivors to have to bring the same perks in the first place. Instead they are nerfing the perks without addressing what's also broken on the other side. Also, they have already announced a trial warm up coming "soon" so that should alleviate some of that concern.
By that same logic they don't do anything to address why Survivors do the same things over and over again.
Edit: look I'm not saying that there's not a conversation about bad design loops. But this was not meant to be a reasonable or fair discussion about a perk balance. I don't think this thread will be around for much longer.
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@Johnny_XMan said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1920405#Comment_1920405
If you are looking for a thread to trash on this is not the right one for you.
Well just look at the bright side, at least you can still use it as the anti-tunneling perk it was supposed to be. 🤣
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@AChaoticKiller said:
I was actually fine with any interaction other than gens being done with DS but i understand why it disables for saboing and cleansing
however i feel like it shouldn't be for healing or unhooking as you sometimes are forced to do the save yourself. example another survivor saves you goes down like 10 seconds later and is hooked and you have to do the next save at that point there is nothing stopping the killer from winning/tunneling.
healing is another thing since you do it at the hook more often than not and if i understand correctly that doesn't mean when you are healed but when you heal someone else. Why punish yourself? you can just not heal and i feel like other players will also have that mindset and not heal their teammates when they want to hold onto DS. there really isn't that good of a reason for it to deactivate when you heal another survivor. edit: also it means when you use a medkit/selfcare yeah why punish the survivor for trying to recover i get it's for anti tunnel but this is interaction seems a bit much.
I think the logic is, how could you be getting tunneled if someone was chased, downed, and hooked in the interim?
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@Dabihwow said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1919880#Comment_1919880
Problem was that people abused the hell out of it, the same thing with old Ruin, and ruin undying.
Yeah, it feels long overdue in this case. Having never been around for old Ruin and not having Ruin/Undying unlocked, I never helped cause the problem, but I had no reason to doubt it was oppressive. I definitely saw DS being used to fix gens right after I unhook, especially with BT. Glad we can see progress for balance on the survivor side of the fence.
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Thank you. Appreciate the understanding of a survivor primary that DS was utilized as an aggressive objective tool rather than a chase/escape anti-tunneling perk.
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If I hop in a lobby and all 4 survivors change who they're playing, I'm going to hop back out.
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@ILoveDemo said:
Seriously what is going on right now, does anybody know what the reason for the heavy Ds and OoO Nerfs (Not "Change") are?
And no a "Killer don't like it" dosen't count. If there is not only ONE good reason for that, then they should go back right now.
I hope they know that the majority of players against the Ds change. Do anyone know what the Devs said about that (the reasons)
@Sluzzy should we leave the game?
Bye.
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The survivor sees the killer. That's the point.
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One that can phase through tile walls. I'm thinking here of that iconic rubber wall imagery in Stranger Things and the X-Files. It's so striking and terrifying.
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I mean, giving the Survivor a 50/50 chance to escape after they didn't do teamwork well or the Killer was exceptional in catching everyone else (or the Survivors were bad in 1-on-1s with the Killer, or any of a dozen other plausible scenarios) dependent on GUESSING which gate the Survivor goes to strikes me as overly generous to the Survivors anyway. If the Killer closes hatch, I say start the EGC, take away powering the exit gates, lock out all generators except for one at 0%, and take away the visibility for Killer AND Survivor. If the Survivor finds and repairs it first, pop the Gates open. If they don't, the Killer gets their due. But that would be a 1-ON-1 game of skill at that point.
Edit: and honestly I'd be down for setting the gen at 50%, or leaving all gens available provided they fix 1. And they could always eschew that and try to find a key instead. The bones of this solution are about making the "final girl" moment a time of tension and skill, NOT a chance and a shrug.
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I blame esports...
...for all kinds of things, but this problem too.
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@Freddy96 said:
It was his free time, at his home streaming just because he wanted to, he wasn't streaming on dbd official channel but his own private channel.
Replying to the same question a million times outside your work time would annoy any single human being
The hate towards 1 single dev that was born after a video made by some braindead youtuber is disgusting.
Almo is not responsible for every issue the game has and the fact that now he's been judged just because he asked to stop repeating always the same question is something that would've been possible just with this whiny community.
I would love to see half of the community being asked the same question about their job when they're at home trying to relax yet replying in the same way he did
He chose to bolster his Twitch profile by identifying himself as a Dev at Behavior. If he took efforts to maintain a private account where he didn't identify himself as an employee, THEN you'd be correct.
And, as I said in my own post on the subject, there's basic iceberg theory at play here. These are folks who just want basic access. Not even representation which is its own can of worms- basic access. How would he react if a member of the deaf community said they wanted an on-screen heartbeat indicator?
The way the toxic elements of the DBD community would dump on Almo for all his blisteringly awful ideas and thoughts on DBD gameplay up to this point, all of a sudden rallying around him because he was dismissive of a conversation about disability access... woof those certainly are some hot takes.
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@GodDamn_Angela said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1892314#Comment_1892314
There have been multiple threads about this and I don't think any have been deleted.
Mine was locked, and I got nuked in Behavior's Twitch for asking if there would be an official statement from the company about his conduct.
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The thing that concerns me is, there's no such thing as an "isolated incident". If he felt comfortable and confident enough to say this in a Twitch stream, basic iceberg theory would mean he's like this about other physical disabilities, or lgbtq folk, or BIPOC. His dismissive and callous perspective is probably not contained to colorblind mode, but probably also someone who has hearing impairment asking for an on-screen heartbeat indicator. Or people asking for representation in game so they can enthusiastically recommend it to their friends and family who accept them and are excited to see themselves in a game. The fact that this community's more toxic elements have gone from saying he's bad at his job and should be let go to defending him against the people saying his self-identification on his personal Twitch as a Behavior employee means he's acting as a representative and should comport himself accordingly is... predictable and disappointing, would be the two emotions that come to mind.
He looked to boost his personal Twitch by using the clout of his employer. That comes with accountability from the public, because you're always, at least partially, acting as an employee. I would NEVER identify who my employer is on any social media for that very reason.
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"Fixing" SWF is easy. They just don't want to. You just need to code in so that the game has an in-app audio system that preempts Discord and Steam voice chat (a feature that games currently have), and then add in a condition to audio chat in game where, if you're outside of 32M, you can't hear anyone. This would be powerful but not oppressive, like going against SWF is right now. You'd have to balance risk of two or more getting caught quickly by the killer with the power of being able to talk to someone and relay intel or perk benefits. Plus there'd be fun in the games of telephone that arise when three players are in non-overlapping spheres of range.
But again, I've always been of the philosophy that they're trying to appease a player base that's larger in a cynical display of utilitarianism, ignoring how both player bases are essential to the enjoyment of the experience.
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@HellDescent said:
What did he say?
He told someone asking about accessibility for colorblind people to "stop whining" and "we'll get to it if we can". This a feature they've been promising for two years, if I recall correctly
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@ImInSpainWithoutTheA said:
Im gonna get legion. Any builds you guys suggest?
If you could, please include perks, add-ons, reasons for perks and/or add ons, and strategy.
Thank you.
Were you looking to maximize Chase, control Gens, a good generic build? Legion can be outfitted for several different techniques.
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You know, I'm already a hard sell on why Survivors should see any benefit from the Antidote in the first place given how much help Clown needed to achieve parity. Nothing about your suggestion has moved me away from my initial position.
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@xXTrajikXx said:
So I got caught and hooked just to be camped. Once saved was tunneled non stop until death on hook. Then they just let everyone else finish gens and leave. #########? This is why I rather run the meta perks and play toxic because when I try to be different I get screwed. So back to the usual easy escape builds and toxic play. Killers whine and complain but continue to be toxic aswell. Screw it. Cant beat'em join'em.
Teabagging. I will go to town hard on a teabagger. In fact I had a game recently where I opened the exit gates for the Survivors I was so satisfied I caught the teabagger. 3 escape 1 kill too. And I broke with my tradition of not camping this teabagger drew my ire so. It may have been me you were playing against. Was it on Coldwind Farms? Were you a Bill?
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@Grandpa_Crack_Pipe said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1862597#Comment_1862597
Calm down, junior.
We're still talking about video games here.
I'm probably older than you are, real talk, but I get what you're saying. I'm just exhausted by their intractability to acknowledge they responded without reading what I said to harangue me. I don't know why I keep falling for thinking people act in good faith, ever. But yeah it's why I switched to "whatever"
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@Seanzu said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1862613#Comment_1862613
Can't admit I'm wrong? You said to me "way to read". Yet I asked if you had ever directly told me you wanted exhaustion to be the punishment and you gleefully pointed out a comment that had literally nothing to do with me except that I'd quoted it for comparing irl to dbd which is still insane.
You're the one that's quoting literal proof that you didn't directly tell me it was exhaustion related, and i stand by my point, you want exhaustion users punished, not t-baggers.
Whatever.
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@Seanzu said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1862605#Comment_1862605
Again, this was NOT a comment to me, I read it, saw you comparing real life and being too exhausted to t-bag, you NEVER once mentioned exhaustion as the penalty in a comment TO ME.
Whatever, you directly quoted me saying exhaustion as a consequence for teabagging in an unedited post, and you can't admit you're wrong, ever. I feel sorry for anyone who knows you personally if this is how toxic you are online.
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@Seanzu said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1862597#Comment_1862597
This wasn't a comment to me at all, you replied to someone else, I just happened to quote it, lmao.
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/SXJ4BMK50TL7/chrome-09-01-1610222021.png
Can you please direct me to where you directly told me that you want the penalty to be 30 seconds of exhaustion? Thanks, I'll wait.
Yes, you DIRECTLY QUOTED an UNEDITED post where I explicitly said EXHAUSTED right here:
SenzuDuck Posts: 5,228
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1862159#Comment_1862159
Why can't they institute a penalty? If it's toxic and they can't appeal to their sense of respect for their fellow human (ha), then why can't they get the exhausted condition for doing twenty squat thrusts right in front of me? If I were a person and just started popping off calisthenics in front of an angry man with a machete chasing me, odds are I'd be tired if I just spent the past two minutes sprinting away from him.
Probably because it's a video game, not real life? Maybe this is where the anger comes from t-bagging for most people, they muddle dbd up with real life, especially when you start comparing IRL men with machetes chasing you with video game characters as some sort of an apt comparison.
That's insane and probably warrants a more serious discussion with a licensed professional in my honest opinion.
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@Seanzu said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1862585#Comment_1862585
I probably ignored it because of how ridiculous it would be to only give someone exhaustion as a punishment when that just means your issue isn't t-bagging, it's exhaustion users, lmao.
I just checked and in every comment you ever sent to me not once did you mention Exhaustion besides the time you edited it to the end of a comment.
Theninjajesus Posts: 62
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1862149#Comment_1862149
But what are they supposed to do?
They can't put sometthing like a cooldown on it because it would mess with gameplay (e.g trying to stealth around,trying to dodge huntress hatchets at low wall loops etc.)
Why can't they institute a penalty? If it's toxic and they can't appeal to their sense of respect for their fellow human (ha), then why can't they get the exhausted condition for doing twenty squat thrusts right in front of me? If I were a person and just started popping off calisthenics in front of an angry man with a machete chasing me, odds are I'd be tired if I just spent the past two minutes sprinting away from him.
THAT? THAT unedited post? God you're just a horrible bad-faith negotiator.
Edit: And you're even worse than I thought because you literally responded to this with EXHAUSTED in the original quote, trying to claim I edited it in. What trash you are.
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@Seanzu said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1862575#Comment_1862575
Oh wait, I see your edit "punish survivors with exhaustion for 30 seconds" ok go ahead, I don't run exhaustion anyway, I think the real issue here is players that are better at chases than you are at looping, if your punishment doesn't affect everyone then your issue with t-bagging isn't the t--bagging itself the issue you have is with exhaustion players and that they often t-bag you because you can't catch them, got it.
and no, it's really not, some random who has no idea who you are spamming ctrl is not offensive or at least to me, unpleasant. And also, how does a 30 seconds exhaust punish people doing it in the exit gates? lol.
I'm thankful I'll be able to t-bag and be t-bagged for the life span of this game bc like I said, it's fun. :)
I said "exhausted" this whole time. Way to not read.
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@NoOneKnowsNova said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1862572#Comment_1862572
Still a huge problem, if you can get a survivor killed only two hooks in, which more likely than not you've only lost a gen by then (or maybe even none) then you're the favourite to win the game.
That's how the Mori works now...
Plus my revised system requires the same amount of hooks to kill all 4 survivors. It just gives more flexibility in how it's used.
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@Seanzu said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1862562#Comment_1862562
Not really a "mind game" then like you said. If it doesn't at least have the potential to affect the match in anyway.
How is it "unpleasant" it's literally some pixels, from some randomer who doesnt know you spamming ctrl, lol.
Because people can't be unpleasant unless it's to your face? That's such a load of crap.
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@NoOneKnowsNova said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1862564#Comment_1862564
Which highly encourages tunneling the survivor you hooked second.
It cuts off your ability to generate more tokens if you tunnel in that way.
Edit: that's also no different than the incentive to tunnel right now via hooking anyway- to catch an already weakened target.
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@NoOneKnowsNova said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1862488#Comment_1862488
And this solution is?
Every two hooks, the killer gets a token and can kill a player who's been hooked at least once.
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@Seanzu said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1862550#Comment_1862550
Amount of games I've lost due to t-bagging "mind games" - 0
Amount of games killers have lost to t-bag "mind games" - 0
Seems to be a lot of other people in here calling out on the ridiculousness of wanting a 0 effect action to be punishable, and rightly so.
Who says it causes losses? I said it's meant to mindgame the killer, or be really unpleasant in the endgame and say "hey killer, we don't respect you, even a little bit!" right at the exit gate.
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@Aztreonam78 said:
You don't take the joke words seriously, don't you?
Serious or not is up to the Dev to address. Given how it's been roses for survivors and fertilizer for killers lately, it feels like a stick in the eye to an essential part of the DBD playerbase.
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@Seanzu said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1862538#Comment_1862538
What?
I said it's fun, I never said it adversely affects the enjoyment of a killer, its cool that you're comfortable putting words in my mouth though.
It doesn't both me when I play killer, so why should I advocate for something that doesn't bother me as killer, but I enjoy doing as a survivor?
Your sample size of 1 is irrelevant, and noted.
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@Seanzu said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1862523#Comment_1862523
Because it's fun? Because everytime I see my team mates I like to do a little t-bag to say hello, because it's funny to t-bag a killer who's spent the entire game being terrible and tunneling off hook, BECAUSE ITS FUN & It Doesn't Do Anything To The Game.
In the same vein, I don't think it does anything, so why put effort into removing something that has 0 effect on the game?
Circular logic.
"It doesn't do anything!"
"Okay, it's adversely affecting the enjoyment of killer players, so let's get rid of it."
"No, don't do that! We need it!"
"Why, what does it do?"
"It doesn't do anything!"
Endlessly and forever. It must do something, otherwise you wouldn't fight so hard to keep it. You don't get to say it doesn't matter but then that it should never be gotten rid of when people say it affects their enjoyment in a negative manner. Because then you just prove affecting people's enjoyment in a negative manner is the whole point.
Edit: And AGAIN I'm not saying you don't deserve to be able to do it, but if you teabag, you should suffer exhaustion for 30 seconds.
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@Seanzu said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1862509#Comment_1862509
Holy heck this conversation is ridiculous how do you not see the comparisons you're making are so far from each other?
Survivors t-baggin is not a "mind game" there is no "what if I t-bag him and he loses this chase because of it" t-bagging changes absolutely nothing in the game, it doesn't have any power at all, on the other hand, hitting a survivor on the hook gives you benefits already (unlike t-bagging) as you're actually face camping to do it, which is far stronger than t-bagging ever could be, ontop of it you actually think letting the killer hit someone until they pull off the hook is something healthy, killer camp and tunnel, do you not think if a survivor pulled off infront of them they'd just let them go?
T-bagging is not "mind games" lmao.
Then why do it? Why fight so hard to keep it?
If it doesn't have a benefit and you can get rid of it without consequence, then why are you arguing so hard that you should be allowed to do it without any concessions?
If it doesn't serve a purpose it literally does not matter. It does something, right? What it does is supposed to tilt the killer
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@Seanzu said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1862431#Comment_1862431
Because the game isn't goofy enough to have flying perks or medkits that fire fish, there is an obvious difference between "you can take multiple hits and heal yourself" and "you obviously want realism because nobody flies or shoots fish out of medkits" like c'mon seriously?
and again, those things sound ridiculous, you have a 20% chance to "jostle free" so the killer can just hit you and put you back on the hook and force kill you?????
You have a "tumble chance" the thing is you straight want survivors punished from the sounds of it, but you want killers to "maybe" be punished, sounds like bias in all honesty.
It's not a straight punishment. They can choose to do it and mindgame and RISK injury, or they can choose not to and get away safe. Likewise, the killer can choose to hit a hooked survivor and RISK them getting a free unhook, or they can keep that player hooked safe. Actions have consequences. As of right now, there's no consequence for teabagging a killer, nor is there a consequence for a killer hitting a survivor on the hook. If they want to engage in bad manners to mindgame someone, there needs to be a chance of it backfiring.
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@NoOneKnowsNova said:
Would you rather they rush it or take time to come up with what they find a balanced solution?
Certainly seems like they don't care about rushing some nerfs. Like, it took me two minutes to think up a better system than what they put in.
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I think hitting Survivors on the hook should give the Survivor a 20% chance to be jostled free, yes. It's scumbag stuff from the killers. I think a Survivor within 5M of the exit crawling for at least 30 seconds should have a "tumble chance" of 50% if a pickup is attempted. I absolutely believe killers with bad manners should experience consequences. Unlike you, I believe in PARITY.
Edit: I was using my examples to demonstrate how, for all your talk about how you don't want any realism, you clearly want some, otherwise why would you say those things are dumb?
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@Seanzu said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1862338#Comment_1862338
It wasn't a personal attack on my mental health, but if you're comparing IRL Death Situations With T-Bagging In DBD then it's probably more of a you problem than anything else.
And also, if you're being chased by machete man, would you run to a pallet, drop it, and run to another pallet? Would you magically heal yourself in a corner? This game is so far from realistic that using the "do you want realism" is a big fat no from me because if I were to be hit with a machete I would die, but it's a video game so that isn't the case.
No, I don't want any realism.
And killers want there to be a consequence for crouching 30 times in front of a pallet after they just sprint flat out for minutes of a chase and flinging a pallet down.
And there's always SOME kind of realism in the game. It's why medkits function like medkits instead of firing fish. The game conforms to some kind of realism. This is a minimal change that doesn't take away your ability to do anything, and in response you call me mentally ill.
That's some real unhealthy aggression, champ.
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@OniWantsYourMacaroni said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1862319#Comment_1862319
I mean impact on the balance of this game,which is much more important imo
Okay. I disagree with you but I get what you're saying.
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So if you don't want any realism, why not just ask for a perk that lets you fly?
Every single bad faith debater always engages in this bad faith BS when I suggest this solution. Of course I know the difference between real life and fantasy, but every game has an element of realism, otherwise there'd be no physics. All I want is to make teabagging a tactical decision. Is mind-gaming the killer an important enough benefit to risk injury?
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@OniWantsYourMacaroni said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1862174#Comment_1862174
I would rather see the devs spending their resources on things that will actually have impact on the game honestly
If you don't think that doesn't have an impact on the game, hoo boy, are you more than wrong
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@Raz_ said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1862199#Comment_1862199
i know tbagging can be frustrating sometimes when playing killer.. especially for newbies.
but honestly after 3k hours im just laughing when i get tbagged.. we just need to get all a thick skin.
and lets be fair here.. survivors tbag each other more then the killer (atleast survivors like me) as i said i love to tbag my GF just as a fun and the other way around.
I know. I'm saying let survivors keep teabagging, but respect the limits of human physical exertion. I understand teabagging has a psychological warfare component, but to do twenty squat thrusts after a three minute flatout sprint would leave anyone not an olympian-level or professional athlete fairly tired, and last time I checked Dwight wasn't an offensive tackle for Green Bay.
Post-edit: why are you so opposed to being allowed to keep it, but with a tiny bit more realism? Is it the fact that you may actually face a consequence as a survivor?
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@Raz_ said:
Tbaggins is a very important part of the game.
if you still get mad when you play killer about a simple button just dont play the game honestly.
tbagging is important for me, since i need to tbag my girflfriend to have some laugh moments.
I'm not saying take it away. I'm saying respect human physiology. If you started doing squat thrusts in front of a serial killer you just spent a minute charging away from, full-speed, then you'd be exhausted, right? Then give the exhaustion status to anyone who considers the psychological warfare component more important than the physical safety component.
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@OniWantsYourMacaroni said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1862149#Comment_1862149
But what are they supposed to do?
They can't put sometthing like a cooldown on it because it would mess with gameplay (e.g trying to stealth around,trying to dodge huntress hatchets at low wall loops etc.)
Why can't they institute a penalty? If it's toxic and they can't appeal to their sense of respect for their fellow human (ha), then why can't they get the exhausted condition for doing twenty squat thrusts right in front of me? If I were a person and just started popping off calisthenics in front of an angry man with a machete chasing me, odds are I'd be tired if I just spent the past two minutes sprinting away from him.
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@Seanzu said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1861498#Comment_1861498
T bagging is something I did mid match on halo 3 regardless of who was winning or losing.
There are thousands of games out there with t-bagging and dbd is the only which has a community so upset over t-bagging, it's kind of insane really.
It's scumbaggery in those games too. Is it so wrong to want a less toxic experience?
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I mean, it's validating to hear from the Devs that they don't consider killers to be players, I suppose?
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Welcome back! It's like you never left, am I right?
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@Peanits said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1858479#Comment_1858479
They share the same resource. Reloading gives you four bottles by default of any combination you'd like.
One way you might want to use them, for example, is by throwing an antidote as your approaching the loop, then switching the tonics. That way you get a speed boost from the gas that's too far away for the survivor to run back and get, and then have your usual bottles to slow them down some more.
If the LCtrl changes which tonic you use, how can you pick the combinations of reloads? If the button that formerly executed reloads has been repurposed, and it just happens automatically when you're at zero, then wouldn't it just reload whatever tonic you're currently using? Why not just give four of each that reload completely during the animation so you can EXPEND them in any order? This seems like a control scheme/UI/logistics nightmare, and that's not even getting into the fact that any speed boost perk a survivor brings gives a benefit 300% higher for the Survivor than the clown could ever muster (and believe me, I checked the numbers twice just to be sure)?
I've got significant questions about your utilization of the data you crunch and the kind of solutions you implement, for whom and when, and if you just engage in the raw utilitarianism of 4 survivors is more than 1 killer, therefore you always need to rush to nerf the killers, and drag your heels on nerfing survivors. If I combed through the data of four years and came to you with a 70/30 killer/survivor power reduction change ratio, would THAT convince you?
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@csandman1977 said:
So before going into the changes I want to talk about clowns strengths as of this post.
Anti-looping. That's it. In the hands of players that know how to use him, clown is one of the better killers for making loops near impossible. In the overall concensus clowns major weakness was map pressure and being able to get from point a to point b. Also his god awful reload time.
New clown. Will still be amazing at antiloop. His speed bottles will improve his map mobility making it easier and quicker for him to end a chase and get to another one. That alone raises his tier potential.
Reloading speed being quicker is a huge buff. Huntress players can tell the difference with and without iron maiden or reloading gloves.
Now the elephant in the room is that the speed gas (or sonic tonic which is an amazing name and all credit goes the person who created it that i cant remember and i stole it from) affects survivors. And there was no real way to do have this kind of speed boost on clown without the gas affecting the survivors. Think about his anti loop and then add in throwing the sonic tonic in front of a survivor and them not getting the speed boost.
Clown would have the strongest chase in the game besides nurse. It would be meaningless to try to run from him. It needs to be this way.
All in all i think clown will be b tier if not a tier.
I find your argument specious. If they can make one gas affect only survivors and not the Clown, they could make another affect only survivors and not the Clown. I think what they want to do is make it a lure but they're ignoring the potential issue that popping Sprint Burst as you head into the cloud would give the survivor a compounded effect compared to the clown.
For example, it's a flat boost of 15% to the Clown's 4.6 move speed, which cannot be boosted, resulting in 5.29 m/ps.
For the Survivor, though, the Antidote by default will make them go from 4 m/ps to 4.6 m/ps, assuming no speed perks. If there IS a speed perk, it puts their base speed at 6 and the Antidote fires it up to 6.9. That's a 300% bonus over Clown's bonus to speed using a perk that a LOT of people use.
I don't know why they nickel and dime killers on their power boosts and nerf stuff for killers so eagerly while not crunching data to actually see how challenging it is for killers already. I mean, I have my theory that they need 4 survivors for every 1 killer so they're trying to keep the max numbers of people happy but if they make it unplayable for killers there's no game left.
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@TheBigBingus said:
Hey man, I main Oni and have roughly 1500 hours on him give or take. I would SERIOUSLY recommend you get infectious fright on Oni, it turns him into a completely different killer. If you end up getting all the perks from the killers, I'd personally recommend 1 of 2 builds, and then if not, I'll recommend what I would run with what you've listed.
Build 1: BBQ, Infectious fright, Pop goes the weasel, and Monitor and Abuse
Build 2: BBQ, Infectious fright, Hex: Ruin, Hex: Undying
Build 3 with what you've listed you have: Pop goes the weasel, BBQ, Tinkerer, Corrupt intervention.
Build 1 is to maximize your slugging potential with Monitor makin your terror radius massive so infectious has a bigger range, and you can sneak up to survivors easier, because Oni's chase music is strangely quiet. Build 2 is to maximize gen slowdown, and is what I've been using since undying came out. BBQ is amazing on Oni, keep it for sure. sloppy butcher actually doesn't increase the amount of blood orbs you get, so its not as good as you may think. Build 3 lets you have more time at the start to get that first hit with corrupt, and it has stealth synergy with tinkerer, so you can instantly catch someone off guard with your power, down them, use the pop, and repeat the process when you see someone on BBQ. Hope I helped! -An Oni main who seriously loves this killer and loves trying to get more people to give him a shot.
Thank you much! It sounds like you mostly approve of what I'm currently using and just need a little Infectious Fright to maximize slugging capability. I'm going to try it with what I have available (Build 3) tomorrow. Oni definitely had a steep ramp up but I think I'm starting to get the hang of the Dash, the Tetsubo slam, and the best ways to utilize momentum. Even the games I get with zero kills are always fun since I've hooked everyone multiple times and it's a harrowing escape for the Survivors (at least, when I'm not up against SWF anyway). Appreciate the insight!