Anyone else feel like the devs are scared of making strong survivor perks?
I’ve been thinking about this especially since the new patch and it feels like the devs are afraid of making strong survivor perk options.
If we look at killer over the past year we have got Pain resonance, Pentimento, Lethal pursuer, Call of brine and Deadlock as new great options. Out of the three scourge hooks so far only one launched weak being gift of pain but it has now been buffed into a solid position
Now if we look at survivor over the past year we have gotten COH which was completely busted on release and is now a solid option and that’s about it really. Overcome is decent but worse than other exhaustion options and Shadowstep isn’t strong enough to run on its own. Hell they even nerfed parental guidance before release despite it not being incredibly strong in the first place. Perks like overzealous and inner focus are being buffed literally a month and a half after their launch because they released which such trivial numbers. For example how strong would overzealous actually be if the 16% boost happened regardless of a hex totem or not? Encourage side objectives with bonus gen speed that goes away when the killers pressure gens well sounds pretty balanced in my opinion. Boons overall are weak especially in the case of dark theory like when was the last time you saw someone run a boon perk without COH as well?
Looking at the new patch the same problem shows itself. Calm spirit apparently needing a 30% reduction in speed to compensate for its mediocre effect, Pharmacy needing the prerequisite of being injured, Botany having a medkit efficiency debuff and Dark sense having its endgame activation removed. It just feels like the devs want to make a new meta but absolutely refused to make new strong options for survivor players to use meaning we’ll just use the old meta regardless. To me it just feels like the devs are afraid of similar outcry to COH or dead hard when they release a strong perk for survivors. It’s not all negative though with perks like distortion and ITR record but it still feels like they are p,saying it very safe at the moment which feels weird for a meta shake up
Comments
For your counterplay of PR the survivors actually can’t tell what’s a scourge hook or not (unless they have saboteur). By the time you figured out all 4 spawn you’re either dead or the perks already gotten insane value.
Lethal only needs to work once since it helps immensely when killers are at their weakest that being the early game. Also many killers already run aura perks/add ons so don’t make that bonus sound like a bad thing. What if the killer is camping with deadlock? You can’t really be patient in that case
My problem isn’t that these perks are strong. My issue is that survivors consistently get perks like dark theory and corrective action which just plain suck
DH wasnt even a game breaking perk. Sacrifices have always outnumbered escapes in this game by well over 50% so its never been balanced.
I would be more than happy with the killer buff patches if camping and tunneling was addressed. To me thats the real issue thats always ruined most games and with this patch its even worse on top of all the buffs.
If the buffs were in place and the camping and tunneling were mechanically addressed out the game then hell, it might even be ok to buff killer further- i dont know.
Ultimately the band aid of perks like off the record etc. Dont really help with anything but delaying the innetivable tunnel which is particularly bad with gen speed now.
Address camping and tunneling so it cant happen then balance around that and it would be fair and more importantly - FUN.
Thing is ruin undying was still very strong after its nerf. Mettle of man was completely destroyed (not that I’m complaining just an observation)
Built to last is far from meta. It makes medkits better but all other items aren’t strong enough to warrant using when you take into account time spent in lockers.
My point here isn’t that the old perks should stay the same. All but 2 of those perks mention are really old. My point is that new survivor perk releases have been terrible hence why nobody even now of all times is using them
Disagree with dead hard but the rest is spot on. Tunnelling and camping is something they’ll have to address soon because it is way to easier to do without punishment now
Rarely have I seen pentimento without plaything. Same thing with lethal pursuer and bbq/darkness revealed/ one of my many other aura perks. If killers are willingly taking builds which don't communicate well with each other that is not indicative of survivor perks strength. Same thing with survivor builds. Botany has been nerfed on its own, yet pairs well with CoH. Its the same thing with how killer builds work. Botany isnt that great on its own, same with pentimento.
Regardless its not a post about strength of current perks but wanting a new way to play survivor.
Bird Lady? A-tier killer who's getting destroyed by survivors Shift+W buttons? Hmm... K.
(Oh boy, what have I done, I shouldn't say that...)
Common consensus of the community is that artist is an A tier killer. She 115% with insane zoning and anti loop potential. She also has great synergy with many perks like DMS, PR, I’m all ears and Lethal pursuer.
Holding W does counter her but keep in mind that got nerfed pretty hugely this patch. Alongside longer gens she dominates most matches now from my experience with and against her
The narrative that lucky break was weak before this update is funny now it's pretty nuts
No.
Okay
cough Circle of Healing, its not the Devs fault you dont use it. Its great.
No.
They released plenty of strong perks the problem was when you compared them to the metz perks they weren't on that level of broken or useful in ever situation.
That would be like killers saying that we haven't gotten any strong killers but using nurse as the comparison point. Like if they aren't as strong as her or better they are weak. Which isn't the case because blight and spirit are considered to be strong.
is that why killer queues are ABYSSMAL right now? Taking 15 min to find a single match and survivor queues are damn near instant ?
sounds a little sus.
right now after this patch and ever since the patch-- the game has been like this.
not enough survivors right now. so I think you should re-evaluate your comment.
Absolutely.
My general feel right now is that they seem disconnected from the survivor community.
Their whole “We’re gonna shake up the meta” and “Killer should feel like a threat” do not go hand-in-hand with “Lets make sure everyone has fun in our game”. Not only that but it failed to deliver on that front anyway because in the issue of Camping and Tunneling OTR just took the place of DS. It didn’t ADD anything fun or amazing. It kept the same meta which is survivors bring perks to soft counter Camping and Tunneling.
They seem to find what is most “annoying” on either side and either band aid fix it or slap a perk to it.
Sometimes people don’t just use strong perks because they are strong but also because they are fun. They took the fun out of DH and made unnecessary nerfs to perks like DS that have already been nerfed enough.
The meta is weaker now without question but most of these newer survivor perks won’t be used. I can see a case for overcome, COH and parental guidance but nothing else really
I literally mentioned that as the one exception to the rule. It’s an amazing healing tool and actually quite balanced now as the time it takes to set up can backfired if it’s placed badly
I meant it’s initial launch where it only blocked blood pools for 180 seconds without a way to regain time. Literally no one used that version
Any strong survivor perk can be easily multiplied by 4. They're not scared of making strong survivor perks, it's that they really can't without it being broken or unfun.
You guys had dead hard, ds for free endgame escapes, unbreakable is still not touched and so many other perks. Idk what you're talking about because you have GREAT perks. Inner healing is 5 heals which gets rid of noed. Blast mine and flashbang and so many others...
I used Lucky break all the time before the patch and found it super effective. People sleep on overzealous because gens are like 12% longer and overzealous removes 8% if not a hex. This one is probably just me but I've gotten so much value out of exponential because most killers assume it's CoH and they will ignore it if going for the slug straight into a chase. You also have to consider that any survivor perk can be brought into a match by 4 people where the killer is only 1.
Off topic can we finally cap regression perks so they can be balanced properly because you have to balance them as if all 4 perk slot could have regression perks.
Do what? You can tell which is a scourge hook and what's not. Seriously, just look at it. It has a bunch of white overgrowth on it. It doesn't glow like for Killer, but you can tell just by looking at it. "Already gotten insane value." That hardly happens unless you're all hook swarming and continuously getting plopped on the same hook. Not only do Scourge Hooks require you play well as a killer and down people, it also it totally RNG if one is even nearby. Then add the fact they can be Sabotaged. You are VASTLY overstating.
Killer camping with Deadlock? Maybe move to another Gen instead of sitting in some grass and moaning about it? Then the Killer has to worry about two gens instead of just the one.
Also, you want to talk about useless perks? Literally every single Killer has at least 1 if not more that's useless or so niche they only work "decent" for one killer.
I’m talking strong here not overpowered. Admittedly it’s very hard but it has been done before with the likes of exhaustion perks, Prove thyself, BT and kindred all being strong perks that aren’t too strong when stacked
Coconut also said Sprintburst was insane and he was surprised it didn't get nerfed. So I'm not listening to anything he has to say on balance
Working decent for 1 killer is better than the garbage survivors get the majority of the time
Boon: Dark theory, self preservation, corrective action, Rookie spirit, Resurgance, Clairvoyance, red herring, power struggle, counterforce, guardian and visionary all just either suck or are outclassed majorly by other perks. Hell some of these have even been buffed since release and are still terrible.
Overzealous requires you to spend time cleansing a totem to get the boost and goes away immediately when getting hit. It’s not worth the slot especially compared to fast track or prove thyself.
Exponential is just to situational to bother with considering you have to set it up before and hope the killer doesn’t snuff it before you get up. Even in an anti slug build just bring souls guard, unbreakable or even no mither tbh
maybe ask what type of strong perk do you want?
i think its because a perk that is effective and universally useful in dbd is typically perceived as overpowered/too strong. if you make every perk strong than you will get a lot of complaints about every perk, so to reduce complaints, 80% of the perks are released as ineffective to prevent complains, 10% are decent-ok but could be stronger and 10% are legit powerful.
i would say kindred, BT and prove thyself are easily 10 perks for survivor. Kindred bridges gap between swf and solo and its strong even in swf because of wall-hack aura reading it has. Prove thyself increases gen speeds on average and this needs no introduction for why this is good. BT grants endurence and taking extra hits is always powerful.
I know I'm late but I just saw this topic and you're literally wrong that DH was the last strong survivor perk released. At the bare minimum, Apr 2, 2019 was the release of 1.0 Mettle of Man which literally nuked all m1 killers besides spirit and nurse out of existence until it got hard nerfed roughly a month later to what it is now. The reason survivor perks can't be to strong individually is because you can have 4x of them at once.
Sorry. Should have elaborated.
No. I don't
What do you mean strong survivor preks have been to the game forever???
Have I been playing a different game??
Dang, that are some impressive numbers, where are you getting them from?
Oh.OH! OhHhH! You pulled 'em outta where?... Oh yes, the smell sure gave it away. Ugh...
And still most survivors ran circles around the killers, greeded paletts to the absolute max and ate killer sandwiches for brakefast. Playing Killer was an absolute uphill battle and you could never slack for but a moment, always on edge
Not every survivor was carried by DH, but every game was. The first 2 days, were the survivors pretty much crumbled, displayed most effective how much ofca stranglehold on the game DH had. Its death released all that design space that was held hostage and will allow the devs to flex their creative muscles.
BUT you must always remember, that killer perks should always (or most of the time) trump corresponding survivor perks, as it's 4 perks vs 16 perks. Working together they are allowed to be strong, but in the 1v1 they have to be weaker.
Yea, the last 10 survivors (except mikaela) released all came with useless perks. Like who designs them
I don’t think so. DS & DH were the strongest out of both sides.
BUT BUT MAH 1v1!
and what strong perks in the category of what i listed on survivor side have been released on killer side? name one perk that has been released that has been on the power scale of MoM or CoH?
Why would you make a perk to be used by a supermajority of the population? That was half the problem with Dead Hard. It was in every single game, several times.
They want pre nerf DS / DH level perks only to be satisfied,,yet the killer mains are the entitled ones having to suffer the nonsense DH was all this time kekw
x4
Harder to balance it out
Yes - but there's a reason for that.
1 killer with a strong perk is a bit different to 4 survivors with strong perks.
That said, OTR is very solid, CoH is probably the most powerful perk added to the game since...PR?
Yes, and that is pretty obvious when you see that they made a boon perk that gives you 2% haste
Yes, but they shouldn't be.
Yes
Yoichi and haddie launched with extremely mediocre perks
Ever since COH especially they’re very scared of similar backlash to what that perk got
When i brought empathy and empathicc connection randoms tried to sell me to the killer at least every third match :)
Because survivor already have great perks, niche perks are the must fun to create. Is very easy to abuse survivor perks that are OP, no reason to complain