Why LGBTQ characters are important
I know my example is not DBD related, but ill give it anyways because its the easiest for me to explain.
Some time ago Overwatch "revealed" that soldier 76 is gay. And I really dont care what a characters sexuality is, but i didnt like it at first because it just felt like a buisnes move for me. "oh look how progressive we are, we are such a good company"
So as i said i didnt really like how hey did it, but then I saw how people got crazy about it.
There were so many people that were like "I dont want to play that character anymore because he is gay"
It just showed how many people are homophobic and it blew my mind.
I personally am heterosexual and identify as a staight male therefore I never got in trouble for my sexuality or gender.
But for LGBTQ people this is another story and when the Soldier reveal happened I realised that it really is problematic because of all those homphobes.
People say they dont care what sexuality a character has, yet they say that it doesnt belong in a video game.
I think they care, and they are offended by it, which is good.
Get those people who dont want gay/trans etc characters in the game out of here. And by adding more diverse characters they will be upset.
"But now youre excluding people for having a different opinion"
No im not, these people are not forced to go if a character turns out gay. Its their own problem and maybe people will reflect a bit more when the number of diverse characters increases.
Just my two cents here. If you have enough time for making a discussion about how the sexuallity of video game characters doesnt matter and "you dont care" it shows that you are lying and you actually care and dont want it.
Comments
First, it's a slasher game and like it or not sexuality has been a big part of the slasher genre since forever.
Second, there are heterosexual relationships.
Third, if we're being perfectly honest being LGBT+ is a much bigger part of someone's identity than being a cis striaght person. It's more about repping the people than it is specific preferences.
*bangs walking stick* Back in MY day, we didn't have any politics in our Star Wars or our Bioshocks or our Tom Clancies or our Fallouts or our Mass Effects or...
wanna laugh? I actually have a hard time thinking of characters in dbd that would not one way or the other have a 'political' element to their backstory
Wait, did you just call out Mass Effect, the franchise that's so progressive it let you have a homosexual relationship in 2007 and made zero deal about it?
Oh, come off it. Mass Effect is ridiculously political for reasons that have nothing to do with anyone's sexual orientation.
"I don't care about it, but here's a long rant on why I care about it not being in dbd."
Summarised your post for you.
To be fair, when people say "politics" when talking about games, they tend to mean "things I don't agree with".
Hence the point of my joke where people seem to think that acknowledging that gay people exist is 'politics' but games about nuclear war and ultra-libertarian underwater cities are just dumb shooty shooty bang bang toys.
it's a little sad how hateful people are going through life....
Yeah, but also LGBT+ thread and I wanted to call it out because no-one seems to remember the franchise even exists, let alone had LGBT+ characters in a time it was very uncommon...
No, but I think you just proved their point.
See, "politics" is just a code word for "minorities" (most often LGBT). Mass Effect has a ######### ton of politics in it, from your own character's promotion being a political maneuver to the literal political council you answer to and work for. You make political choices all the time. The game is filled to the brim with politics and people love it.
I just wanted to overtly point out that it had LGBT+ characters befoee it was cool.
There's a Mass Effect remaster that the internet is blowing up over and you think nobody remembers the series?
Fair point about LGBT relationships being damn rare at the time, but still.
No-one I ever talk to rembers it aside from vaguely recognising the name, it seems almost purely in the realm of games journalism these days and it makes me sad...
I think the way Apex Legends has done LGBT+ characters is really well done. Bloodhound simply uses they/them pronouns in their bio and in Gibraltar's bio it mentions him stealing a bike with his boyfriend. As a member of the LGBT+ community that's all I personally want, just a little nod and nothing to overt. I just want normal LGBT+ people in my games. If that's to 'political' for you, to read one line of text about a male character's boyfriend, you have much bigger issues that may need addressing.
if it helps that's what a lot of the people here want too- something subtle like David and Felix have in their lore (please don't do a Frank and Julie BHVR i beg). that's the type of ######### we want but unfortunately, and i got really bad news here, lgbtq+ people breathing is a political statement and honestly we just gotta wake up one day and choose straight to be less political.
(for clarification yes the last part is a joke)
That's how the devs will do it, since that's how they did it for heterosexual characters as well. It's also what people are asking for.
They've proven that they can show representation really well, for example, Claudette was the first POC woman to be added to Dead by Daylight, but they didn't make it about her race specifically, they made it about who she is as a person (a studious botanist).
I think they've also put in her lore that she's autistic but they never made a big song or dance about it, so it's a very subtle detail in her lore, which is just *chefs kiss* yes bhvr.
Oh I never knew that, it's nice to read though as I'm also autistic (slightly).
And so with there being heterosexual relationships already in the lore surely it's okay to want some rep for LGBTQ+ relationships, correct?
I can copy paste over my answer of why I personally care from a different thread if you want?
Glad that you don't see why not though. First person who genuinely doesn't care when they say they don't care lmao.
I don't care what you identify as, who you're attracted to or what your colour of skin is.
You're all food to the entity
Prepare to die
This scenario is exactly what I referenced in another thread and got called out for it.
Soldier: 76’s sexuality announcement was a business tactic.
I’m not of the community but why the hell is LGBTQIA+ only acknowledged and celebrated one month during the entire year? Why the hell do these game companies think that we can’t differentiate on whether or not their moves are disingenuous and only for business? Its harmful to the LGBTQIA+, not progressive. This is why I say its not okay to pressure these companies to make moves like this. Its never genuine and its screwed up on their behalf. BHVR going out on a limb to announce their inclusion of characters apart of the community was their own will though, so I guess their idea is pretty genuine even though it was only mentioned in Pride month and never any other time before that.
its not always easy to tell, but i like to look over to how comic books have handled it since its a medium that can explore relationships over a long period of time.
if its done out of tokenism there are normally two main red flags,
1. the male gaze. having queer characters be made for the male gaze, not actually intended to bring to tell stories from people who might come in this community.
this normally means they go for the safest most least offensive lgbtqia+ persons, and that defaults to a 20 something, preferably white, with the most hetero normal assimilated type of woman they can muster.
this obviously is problematic, because queer people just like people of color, don't exists for the sake of validating or entertainment of people who aren't like them.
2. you can normally see that these character's sexuality or sexual identity become their defining trait. where they don't have any strong character motivations or they don't really add to arcs that they're involved in.
Eventually once the buzz surrounding these characters get thrown on the way side, or are used to further the hetero character's plot. Or discarded all together because people don't find them very interesting as characters standing on their own two feet, in favor of more proven and established characters in the universe.
Marvel did this a lot in the 2010s in an effort to bolster the young adult demographics, but even one of the more high profile characters eventually got put on the backburner in favor older characters who already have an established fanbase and maybe one or two get to stick around.
The physical aspects of a characters sexuality is often a bigger deal than their actual emotional aspects of it it when the other straight characters in their world get to explore both healthy and unhealthy aspects of the physical and emotional sides of being in a relationship.
This aspect of representation isn't always black and white like the male gaze part and it can take a long time to surface if they intended to go down this route, sometimes writers and creators do mean mean well and want to do best for the characters. But they're often outright rejected from telling stories with representation or hampered by management where they have to tell the most white bread most blandest more non offensive lgbtqia representation, _they can be progressive but just don't rock the boat._ It can lead to queer people of color, disabled queers or people who don't fit into the hetero normative mold like fem men or masc women get erased from the narrative.
So its a case by case more often than not. but i believe like people, narratives and lore can always change and shift with time. characters like Harley and Ivy started off iffy but through character development, engaging stories and great portrayals they managed to make something good of the characters. and to think they managed to start it off from a kids show. like who woulda thought.
I think the nature of dbd's being lore heavy only outside the game, leaves them a lot of wiggle room for them to _not mess up._ Because we already see them doing it with their canonically straight characters.
It's such a perfect story. For the entity, it's all the same food. Will the entity be picky and eat people?
I'll never understand why people get so riled up. So what if they add LBGTQ characters? Not everyone is LBGTQ so stop worrying about it. Not everyone is straight either and so on. We all make up the real world so why shouldn't we all make up the game world too? Is it really that bad? If it is then the problem lies in your hate filled heart. I'm a straight male and i know bi people, gay people and other straight people. At the end of the day our only enemy is time because his brother death is a sonuva b**** that none of us will ever beat. None of us make it to any exit gates in this life.
Enjoy the ride my friends. We're better together.
Entity be like
Who someone is from birth is not political. It is not up for debate.
Lmao i wasnt saying it was for debate, just stating my opinion. As a whole tho i dont really care if LGBTQ+ characters get added i just know it will divide the community and homophobic slurs and stuff will start being thrown about. The devs already said they are going to and people are saying it will most likely be the next chapter.
Oh look another daily thread demanding for LGBTQ representation in a game that has no place for it.
Please stop; you're doing more harm than good.
And again I ask, this is a place for straight relationship representation but not for LGBTQ+ relationship representation?
Seems like people asking for representation in a game with cis heterosexual representation isn't the harmful aspect of this "debate."
It's not demanding, it's explaining why it matters. As for DbD supposedly having "no place for it", the devs disagree with you.
This is Dead By Daylight. The sexuality of the characters in this game have nothing to do with this game. You want a bisexual character? Cool! How about a homosexual Killer? Neat! But representation should not be the focus (not saying it is here), fixing the broken mess of this game that we enjoy is.
I look forward to playing as this new Killer. Looks fun.
We're in agreement, then. Bring on the LGBT characters.
Since three of you replied and I'm on mobile, take this as a shared reply.
The representation for even the straight characters in this game isn't good or at the level where it should be. Heterosexuality is mentioned, but there's no representation of the positive virtues that come along with it.
Now if heterosexuality doesn't have that, what makes you think other sexualities and niche genders will get it?
And you keep forgetting the fact that this is a game about perpetual pain, murder and death. I'm sure it'll look good to outsiders hearing that an ancient evil deity, chose an oppressed LGBTQ individual and then makes them even more oppressed.
Plus the developers have already confirmed at least one character in this game is LGBTQ, yet you still want more.
Please focus on the problems with the game instead of wanting representation when it's not even needed.
"Characters"
That right there is also a problem. A lot of people, not saying you in particular, are wanting a character for every sexuality or niche gender in existence.
That's not realism at all. When do you see the entire LGBTQ spectrum in any area of life outside pride events?
Now if heterosexuality doesn't have that, what makes you think other sexualities and niche genders will get it?
Did anyone ask for that? Because I don't see it. What I see is people asking for the same treatment that heterosexuality already got.
Plus the developers have already confirmed at least one character in this game is LGBTQ, yet you still want more.
People want equal treatment between heterosexual relationships and non-heterosexual relationships, yes. Saying "oh, someone's LGBT" is not what happened with heterosexuals.
Please focus on the problems with the game instead of wanting representation when it's not even needed.
The people in charge of lore are not the ones who work on the balance of the game. Furthermore, just because you don't think representation is important doesn't mean it's irrelevant to everyone.
That's not realism at all. When do you see the entire LGBTQ spectrum in any area of life outside pride events?
You do realize the game is about an evil spider goddess that takes people from various realities (not just our own) to feast on their souls, yes? "Realism" is not a factor here. Even if it were, the fact that She can take people from any reality automatically throws that out the window, unless you have data on demographics from alternate realities.
1) And the treatment the heterosexual characters get isn't even decent, it's terrible. Why do you want awful representation? You scream representation, but there's nothing shared between you and characters in a supernatural death getting murdered over and over, with exception to maybe one part of them, which you're making such a big fuss about when really, sexuality shouldn't be fussed about in 2021.
2) "Equal treatment" still doesn't mean good treatment. The heterosexuals weren't done good, neither will the gays or niche genders the developers have no clue about.
3) it doesn't matter, its still the company as a whole that makes decisions, and this exemplifies the issue of them not fixing core issues and adding stuff that barely no one asked for.
"Realism isn't a factor here"
I don't know how to say it ANYMORE clearer but proper representation is all about REALISTIC portrayals of someone's experience.
You're asking for representation, when you have not the faintest clue what it actually entails.
You were talking about realism in demographics, but now you're trying to change the subject to realism in personal experience. Which is it? Please make up your mind, are you complaining about the realism in demographics by having multiple LGBT people in the game, or the realistic portrayal of their experiences?
I have never seen a person that requested a character for every sexuality/gender in existence?
all that is asked for is not to exclude anymore.
there are some people asking for a specific character with a specific sexuality, sure, but that’s not different to someone asking for a character that is Indian, or a character that has a specific job or hobby.. no harm there
I was mainly talking about survivors here. I forgot about the new killer when I put down my rant (only just looked into it today), and frankly you'll see no real counter-argument from me: I'm aware that Hollywood had a nasty reputation for making sure certain crowds are only presented in a negative light if they are presented at all.
I must say though, I don't really see anything in his lore that really suggests to his sexuality. The story seems far more focused on his narcissism and need for attention than anything else.
Is it just because he looks like a pretty boy? *shrugs*
Pretty easy really, take apex legends..Gibraltar is a huge tough but nice guy and he's gay..but you wouldn't know he was gay if you didn't read his lore you wouldn't really know it, because it's a small part of his character like sexuality is in general, that's how you do it right..making some extreme grandstanding fake looking character with no personality
My Friends group. Didnt start out looking for LGBT members we all just picked up and added each other cause of halo 4 multi-player. I'm Bi, my friends are, straight, pan, gay, and even asexual. We didn't search for each other cause of this it just happened.
So the idea of having multiple LGBTQ characters is not shocking because they exist 🤔
Yeah, but why do we need a survivor/killer for every sexuality and gender? If you say ''representation'' then there's a lot missing for the straights.
I'd really like to know how BHVR would deal with countries that have anti-homosexuality laws like Russia, the Arab Emirates, China and so on. Would they rewrite/censor the character on release for these regions? Or would they flatout not release them?
There isn't though. This game has several confirmed het relationships and in general het relationships dominate our culture through media