wisdom
wisdom
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@LapisInfernalis said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/407729#Comment_407729
Try this with Clown, Trapper (you have no guarantee they'll walk in a trap), Freddy and Plague. They can't get around MoM with their power.
Plague can.
break the survivor with the vomit before you hit them, they will be in death hook before the perk activates.
red vomit does not (should not?) count either.
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On a tangent: anyone else not getting he notifications but the perk is constantly being put in cooldown?
i am currently under the assumption the cooldown triggers off the killer, which makes the perk literally worthless at the moment. Before the implemented the cooldown it wasn’t even that strong, since there aren’t really to many crows in the map and the killer usually triggers them anyway.
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@Hoodied said:
What?
He is complaining that ds doesn’t counter Moris anymore
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@Venzhas said:
You can change the sensitivity in options. Its quite fast when 100%
At 100% survivors still run around you faster than you can turn.
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@NuclearBurrito said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/407764#Comment_407764
Things like spirit and nurse not counting was confirmed to be a bug.
Do you have the link to that? Was it on a dev stream or post somewhere? I am only going off of what I see people saying and not what the devs have confirmed.
not saying you are lying or wrong. I just want the evidence for my arguments later on xD
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How is playing tactically unsportsmanlike?
you put them in the ground and lose a boom stage to save yourself 10-15 seconds to allow yourself to go chase someone else (counting pick up and hook times)
its a trade off. That survivor doesn’t get a hook stage, but the killer gets a massive momentum boost.
There are now... *calcs in head* 5 perks that deal with slugging.
unbreakable, tenacity, buckle up, flip flop, and No Mither if you really want to count that.
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Removing the speed buff would make the perk useless.
right now I am on the fence. If surprise attacks (grudge/blinks/etc) are supposed to not count as basic attacks, then mettle of man punishes hit and run. The hag and Freddy are not included in this list of “surprise attacks” and I am not sure why.
if it is actually a glitch as it very commonly suggested, and realistically might be, then the perk is a free extra health state with no downsides. It’s an instant heal at its very worst and the only coubterplay is to not play the wrong killers.
the idea that the aura reading part of the perk will ever come up is a joke. No one will ever heal with the perk active... unless adrenaline forces them too... but you know... adrenaline means the game is over
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@PigNRun said:
Speaking of Trapper, I realised something. If the Survivor has MoM active, runs into a trap and gets hit by the Trapper, does that get rid of the endurance effect? Extremely situational, but it would be hilarious.
oh that’s a thought.
likenif they have 3 stacks, you hit them while they are in the trap? I wonder if that hit is actually ignored. I don’t think a survivor in a trapper trap counts as downed
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Hopefully it is intended for these surprise attacks to not stack tokens and people are just talking out of their bums.
the perk isn’t game breaking if it is intended to have every killer be able to play around it by simply using their power
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Currently it also doesn’t affect legion. Legion hard counters the perk, because frenzy doesn’t stack mom
with the pig, the dash attack counts but it’s not like pigs usually go out of their way to use their ambush.
From what I am told on the forums, and I haven’t actually gone against a wraith or spirit to confirm this with mom, their surprise attacks don’t stack mom which is (according to them) a glitch.
if surprise attacks power m1s are intended to not stack the perk, then Hag is glitched and really the only killer who cannot deal with it is trapper. But I am operating under the assumption surprise attacks are supposed to stack mom, since they are still basic attacks... so the perk is pretty busted as a free health state.
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@DingDongs said:
Just give either: exhaust after MoM trigger or remove speed burst when hit
That's all i ask for dev
I think that removing the speed boost after hit would make the perk literally useless.
exhaustion might be interesting if they remove the “can’t heal without revealing your aura” part
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@HighQualityDonut said:
I think MoM is fine, survivors only have perks to change up their playstyle, and the past couple of chapters have made fun meme builds, but nothing crazy viable. MoM is good. It also has requirements to meet, and a pretty nasty after effect once you eat the free hit and heal up.
Lets change up the meta. A perk that helps in a ton of scenarios and isnt limited by exhaustion? thank you BHVR!
The requirements to meet are being hit by the killer. That isn’t much of a requirement 🤔
at the end of the day MoM is an instant heal. It isn’t quite to the level old ds was, because it doesn’t stifle early momentum, but is it still very strong, and when used in combination with other perks and in multiples is quite ridiculous.
Think about it. If you Are unhooked with 2 stacks, going to full health means you get 3 health stages.
if you get hooked with 3 stacks, when you get unhooked you are at full health.
It is an instant heal as a perk, minus the stealth benefits of being at full health.
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I think the fact that people think that the aura reading part of MoM will ever come up is a complete joke.
It only comes up if you heal while the perk has 3 stacks... so you just don’t heal.
And if the perk has 2 or less stacks, you can heal for free.
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Survivor is too demanding I agree.
killee, Im mostly just fed up with getting silvers because if hatch escapes/ dcs/ people dying on first ir second hook and needing double iri + gold to make up for it.
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@[Deleted User] said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/404795#Comment_404795
Yep. you've proven the fact that you're a low rank killer main. and that's ends everything. since arguing with kids is always a waste of time.
first is that you're saying nurse and billy are not common in rank 1
second. " basically the only time mettle of man won’t be in the game... is if there is no obsession while you are running no obsession perks. "
i challenge you to find a game vs. rank 1 survivors and no one have any obsession perk.
you can't? expected. cya later kid
Please, show me where I said that nurse and billy are not common at rank 1. I’d like to see that
second, you are taking what I said out of context. YOU claim that you can play around mettle of man because of the obsession. Which is ridiculous, especially when you follow it up with there will be an obsession every game.
of course there will. THAT’S MY POINT
you cannot play around mettle of man because you do not know who has it, how many people have it, or if it is even in the game.
Please, go to school and learn about logical reasoning and I guess how to read too?
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@[Deleted User] said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/404675#Comment_404675
all of that is just BS btw.
you're probably a low rank killer
you must know that at red ranks. 90% of the games will be billy or nurse.
back to the counter play.
MoM increases your chance of becoming the killer's obsession.
So there's a high chance that the obsession is running MoM. and rancor can easily help you out with this one.
some killers have no counter against MoM? there's a reason why exposed perks existed. why ultra-rare one-shot add-ons existed.
as a nurse. it's very easy for me to get grabs. off windows. off lockers. off gens. if you cannot get them. i won't blame you for sucking.
also for low ranks killers like you. you're probably a camper. try running an eboni mori and tunneling the obsession. this will eliminate DS and MoM. don't tell me you cannot chase a survivor?
also MoM has a downside. which keeps your aura visible to the killer. did you forget about this one? if all 4 survivors were running MoM. and all of their MoM's got activated. it's basically a heaven for the killer. he'll be able to slug all 4 EASILY. unless you suck
my advice for you is
try to rank up and be better at the game instead of begging and whining to make it fit your play style. if you suck. that doesn't mean the game is hard. maybe it's because you simply " Suck " ? think about it in this way for once.
thats cute.
anyway, I didn’t actually see a single counter to any of my points. We call what you just did an “Ad Hominem”. Google is your friend if you don’t know what that is.
so let me address your points, so that I am not a hypocrite:
”mettle of man increases your chances of becoming the obsession. Rancor helps here”
DS also increases the chances of every survivor to become the obsession.
Also rancor increases the chances of every survivor becoming the obsession.
basically the only time mettle of man won’t be in the game... is if there is no obsession while you are running no obsession perks.
It could be one guy. It could be 4 guys. You really don’t know, so you either don’t play around it or play around it with every survivor. There is no middle ground.
Simply saying you know who has it because it is Ash isn’t the same as actually knowing who has it and being able to play around it.
“It’s very easy for the nurse to get grabs”
spirit too. What’s exactly your point? It’s not like the nurse plays for grabs. The nurse is undisputedly the strongest killer in the game. You could revert the game back to version patch 1.0 and keep her the same as she is now and she would still dominate (she would be the only killer that even has a chance but still)
Saying the nurse can do something isn’t really an argument. It is just stating a fact about how powerful the nurse is
“90% if high tank games are nurse and billy”
thats not how balance works. When the perk hard counters most killers and will be used in high frequency, you shut down the option for other killers to even enter the metagame. Do you really enjoy the meta of nurse + billy + spirit/micheal thrown in once and a while? Do you think that it is healthy for the game? Shutting killers out farther and farther?
“Mom has a downside, it keeps your aura visible to the killer”
actually I address this in my post you very clearly didn’t read.
MOM keeps your aura visible to the killer when it is active and when you heal. to full health. Not at all times like you are suggesting it does. Which means if you get hooked at 2 stacks (likely) and heal to full health your aura is not revealed.
Which is why tunneling counters it... because you can turn it on before they can heal forcing them to not heal and not gain 3 health states.
Tldr; saying there is something wrong with the perk doesn’t mean I am bad at the game. Nor does it mean I currently have a problem with the perk. But seriously you need to look at the perk objectively and consider all the situations in which it can and will be used, as opposed to assuming you will be playing nurse every game and getting gen grabs every game. Or playing billy every game. It’s just dumb.
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this post was made after they buffed the stun time to 5 seconds right?
why would it make you go invisible ._.
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@[Deleted User] said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/403718#Comment_403718
grabs?
rancor And/Or S.T.B.F.L.? (MoM increases the chance of becoming the obsession)
exposed?
basically m2?
billy?
Leatherface?
nurse?
" your aura is revealed to the killer " part?
" don't tunnel the obsession " ?
yeah. no counterplay at all.
Playing specific killers is not coubterplay. If you are not playing those specific killers.
Also that is a joke right? Grabs? That was for comedic effect or were you being serious?
now “dont tunnel the obsession” is also a joke for 2 reasons
1) MoM actually counters not tunneling.
2) mettle of man does not require you being the obsession to activate
ti elaborate on 1:
if you are hit 2 times, you are probably hooked. That’s what happens in a general game is dbd. So that means that when you are unhooked, you can heal yourself for free without penalty, and you have 3 health states. Or, you get tunneled and the perk doesn’t do anything until you are on your last hook, at which point injured is the same as being at full health for the purposes of any subsequent chase.
Now it’s only a ridiculously powerful when the killer chooses not to tunnel.
The fact that ash’s aren’t currently running ds is because most Ash do not have the bloodpoints reservations to get all the perks they want. And the fact that you KNOW Ash has it is the only way you are mentally preparing yourself for the punishment
i have not had any issues with the perk,. I am also not stupid enough to believe that means that the perk is fine, because I know how it can be used.
and to elaborate on 2:
very soon survivors that are not Ash will be using mettle of man. And when they do, the perk will be a problem. When we start seeing 4 man teams of mettle, ds, adrenaline, X.... there is no counter to it. You either get punished for tunneling, or you get punished for not tunneling.
COUNTER-PLAY OPTION:
play a killer who can circumvent MoM every time
Play a killer who can instant down while he is uninjured (which is just normal gameplay) or hope that Ash heals while they are injured and the perk is active (which there is literally no point in doing)
hit them 3 times, down them on the 3rd hit... and then just accept that when they get off the hook the next time they have an instant heal, because it is better than 3 health states
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@sailormars said:
Agreed. Killers are just crying because the game is now slightly harder for them. Killers have been consistently getting great perks and survivors have only received crap. Now that we finally get a good perk all they can do is cry and complain because it won't be an ez win for them anymore.
Pretty sure killers are crying because they literally just got rid of a perk with no counterplay, and then added another perk that doesn’t have counterplay
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The killer ranking is harder, than it was before, but not by much for people who normally took the time and effort to apply pressure to win the game. There is the issue of survivors DCing costing you progress but eh.
the survivor ranking is a nightmare, however. It isn’t *harder* in the sense that it is more difficult and therefore requires more skill, but rather it is a competition of working for limited resources. I am personally so sick of losing a pip or black pipping because I get iridescent in chaser but don’t get lightbringer. Possibly don’t get benevolence.
Being required to do every aspect of the game an an above average level when not every aspect of the game is always presented to you is getting real old real fast. It feels way to much like luck, where the killer just happens to find someone else first so you get your gens done... preferably 2 full gens by yourself so that you don’t have to get multiple iridescent in other categories.
Right now I’m gen rushing killers, and then going back to farm chaser and hope I don’t die nor the killer DCs. That’s the only way I can guarantee my pips hovering between purple and red... and that is very hard.
the Survivor emblem system isn’t hard in the sense that people don’t know what to do or have difficulty accomplishing specific tasks... it’s they have difficulty understanding why they should have to go back to farm for points when the game is over.
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@Blueberry said:
Still bad. They need to make it a few seconds of aura, not a location ping. A location ping is just trash.
am
i misremembering what infectious fright does? Because 6 seconds of aura reading was in the perks ability.
was that changed and I missed the patch? (Now the description says location but it used to say aura and I remember during the ptb it revealing auras)
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@Peanits said:
The numbers would probably have to be tweaked there, 50 meters is the better part of an entire map. It could definitely work that way, although you would lose any potential to combine it with perks like distressing or add-ons like the doctor's which increase your terror radius.
The doctor’s terror radius add ons lower your terror radius in punishment mode, though ._.
honestly a static distance would definitely be preferable since it can be used on more killers than it currently can, unless the point of the perk is to only be useable on killers with larger terror radii to keep it off small tr killers.
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Guys I’m pretty sure the reason they buffed the base stun was because 3 seconds wasn’t entirely enough for most people to get away from a killer when including the animation locked time.
3 seconds on old ds didn’t have any time locked animation, so a t1 ds was farther than the new ds was, which is why people felt like it was so useless by comparison. (Since it was counting the time the killer was still picking up the survivor)
by buffing it, the stun is comprable to old t2 ds.
Its completely fair. The devs still want the perk to be used, they just don’t want it to singlehandedly win games
(which makes me wonder why they made MoM directly after fixing ds xD)
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i think the game is in a pretty good spot right now when it comes to gen times.
generally your first hook will happen about 2 gens in. But since you have a survivor on a hook, the moment you start chasing someone there are 3 people off of gens (the person you hooked, the person you are chasing, and the person going for the unhook)
on top of that there is some time associated with healing, which takes time off the gens (or they risk being exposed which makes for faster chases)
of course that is a lot easier said than done. In order to gain the advantage you have to be perfect with your tracking and ability to close loops. The killers job is much harder, but it is manageable imo.
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If anything, breakdown should show both survibors the killers aura, not just the unhookie.
I echo the idea that it should reward you points for healing too
and in the point if bbq, perks do not have to be symmetrical.
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@mooseKing said:
I think the perk was intended for lucky or skilled killers. If you run a survivor near a gen that is being worked on, then you can hook them right beside gen then kick it. Don't think it was meant to be a bonus for hooking a survivor.
^^^
thus. Plus it is on theme for the perk to have a timer. The perk is literally called “pop goes the weezle”
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I think it has a lot more to do with coding it into the perk than anything else.
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Actually I think the reason is to prevent it from being used in tandem with instant heals, btw 🤔
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The plague plays very similarly to the clown but has the ability to gain an ew3 state later in the game
i think in terms of strength she is pretty in par with Mikey, which is mid tier.
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You know what Solidarity actually needs?!
an aura like Prove Thyself, We’ll make it, streetwise, leader, and a plethora of other perks letting you know that the person healing you has it.
so people don’t fight over the heals.
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The only reason you are seeing it every game now is because people can use it every game now, because they are finally able to use the perk they wanted to.
its no different than if you were at higher ranks and going against it at t3 ruin
the only reason it increased in popularity with the change is because before people wouldn’t bother using t1-2 because it was worthless.
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@fluffybunny said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/384289#Comment_384289
Yes, slug all the survivors regardless of if they have recently been on the hook or not. 1000 IQ plays.
Yea because that’s clearly what I said
there is no way when I said “slug every survivor every time on the chance they have ds” the implication was that ds could actually activate.
its not possible that I was referring to slugging every survivor that was fresh off the hook even though there is a good chance they don’t have ds. No way i meant that.
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@TheMadDoctor said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/384263#Comment_384263
Actually enduring at tier 3 makes the stun 1.7 seconds...that’s not very long. Also can’t you slug someone incase if you tunelled them in order to counter the new ds now? Why am I poking holes in a joke? What is life?
You want to slug every survivor every time on the off chance they might have ds?
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The underline problem with stealth isn’t that you can’t hide, it’s that there isn’t any reward for doing so. You lose points in evader and bloodpoint for staying stealthy, so why would you ever do so unless you are new to the game or playing against the nurse?
and no I am not saying there should be a reward for playing stealthy. I don’t need my allies having more of a reason to crouch next to the walls at the edge of the map.
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Honestly I am not sure why people say the game is such a strong killer map.
is it just because of the heartbeats making it hard to tell where the killer is coming from?
Every pallet on that map is extremely safe so I don’t see why people put that map as the primary example when maps like Sheltered Woods and Coal Tower exist 🤷♂️
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We could also just make all non-party streamer/ event offerings hidden.
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On the devout changes, you also have to consider that somehow they thought it was a good idea to make 3 kills silver.
which might be alright and justified if every single game you must slug at the end now because the hatch is the difference between an iri and a silver.
for killer, getting a silver on anything results in you needing to get 2 iri and a gold. Anything less is a black pip. And silver is super easy to acquire on 2 of the emblem scores (gatekeeper and devout)
for survivors, as you mentioned, it feels like it takes luck because there just aren’t enough resources to go around unless you farm the killer.
my current strategy is to gen rush the ######### out of the killer, then when the exit gates are open farm them for points and hope they don’t Dc. That’s the only way I feel like I can rank up now, because any time I have a long chase with the killer and get iri in evader, I get silver in lightbringer because all the gens are already done.
i also find myself in these situations 99ing gens when there are 3 left just to milk whatever points I can.
i am actively seeking POINTS and not GAMEPLAY.
on matchmaking: the ranks difference will eventually be fixed but honestly I would rather play a game with different ranks than wait in a lobby for 25+ minutes.
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@NeaJovovich said:
Honestly, 16 meters is too small.
If they Killer is not in an active chase with another survivor, the hooked Survivor should continue to get Bloodpoints.
The reason why I say 16 meters is too small is because there are try-hard Nurses, Spirits, and Wraiths that hang out by the hooked Survivor, just far enough so their Terror Radius is not playing, waiting to use their corny supernatural power and down the unhooked Survivor.
They did have a poll asking everyone what they would consider a camping range.
i think most people agree that it is camping when it is 16 meters. Any farther and you start punishing killers who simply cannot get out if hook range fast enough.
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Huge issue with the old way ds worked was that the game starts in the survivors favor, and begins to migrate towards the killers favor.
the way ds used to work, the game would swing back into the survivors favor just as it should have started going into the killers.
i could write a dissertation on how ds affected gameplay the way it was, but the short story is that most people think of how survivor perks affect them, and now how their perks affect and benefit their entire team, and DS broke the symmetry of the games balance by giving the extra time you as the user are awarded to the rest of your team to do generators.
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@ThirdSealOPplzNerf said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/53148/should-trapper-get-buffs
Yes he seriously needs buffs. He should be able to carry unlimited traps and start with all of his traps and have a trap reset animation. Breaking traps will have skillchecks and take longer and escaping traps should take 10 seconds instead of rng or 5 seconds if a friend helps.
Can’t make him strictly better than the Hag, friend.
Thoufh removing the limit on how many he can carry would be nice. It really shouldn’t be required to use an add on to not have to go on a scavenger hunt every time he uses his power.
I also agree that getting out of the traps shouldn’t be rng.
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@KillermainBTWm8 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/380295#Comment_380295
Would it not stand to reason that looping can cause the survivor to extend the chase for an unreasonable amount of time... Then you have nurses and it causes an effect of threads saying nerf nurse. I don't have a problem with looping myself because I do play characters like nurse and spirit but I also understand that looping is a big controversy in this game some think it's fine some don't the way I look at looping is that however it is not an exploit to any extent it is however fairly easy to tell that looping is not really intended bloodlust contributes to that. Plus tunneling would just be more popular anyways with your idea which is even worse because fast killers that can traverse distances quickly like spirit, hillbilly,nurse can easily tunnel and this will just quickly kill the survivor on hook making this idea useless tbh.
How exactly would this promote tunneling?
I also don’t have a problem with looping, and this isn’t really supposed to change looping, nor do i see how it would affect looping. :o
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@KillermainBTWm8 said:
Icecream. I feel as though this would be a good idea on paper until you take into account tbagging and flashlight clicking would be more prominent than ever for the killer and a survivor would never have to worry about being toxic bc if they get camped they don't depip ect.
I feel like that could be true. Would it not stand to reason that a survivor who is good at avoiding the killer doesn’t deserve to depip.
or on a killers behavior perspective, they would be encouraged not to camp simply to make sure the survivor doesn’t get a free Black pip.
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In terms of chase her vomit is clear as to how it is strong. You just break them during chase.
the only time infecting objects seems useful is on generators that are at high percents, since you can kick it, then infect it, and there is 35 seconds of regression that survivors are afraid to touch it. And if they do touch it you will know they are there (like a built in surveillance)
if you want to spread the sickness as a strategy, I suggest slugging. Broken survivors on the ground get their saviors sick. I mean you can do that on the hook to. Regardless, the sickness only spreads on broken survivors
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1) on legion: I would take away their infinite chances to hit someone during their frenzy and remove the power gauge penalty for using your basic attack.
this would open up counterplay options and also increases the skillcap of the legion.
2) This will be a long one:
Tydetyme is right in a vacuum. Without ANY travel time survivors can do 3 generators in 80 seconds the issue here is multiple.
-survivors often spawn together, which means it is less likely for them to be able to work on three different generators
-when a survivor is in the hook, the math changes. This is because now a different survivor can now be chased and the other 2 survivors are pressured to go to the unhook.
-when there are 3 or less survivors in the game, the game is completely killer sided through the same math.
in most games, only 2 generators will be done by the end of the first chase, assuming you have good tracking skills and chasing ability. Gen times go down by increasing killer pressure. They need to stop making these massive maps with gens 40 meters apart from each other if they want to fix gen times.
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Question to the camping OP
why, when the emblem system came out, should survivors be punished in rank for gen rushing, but you not be punished in rank for camping?
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I feel like having all platforms stay consistent in terms of mechanics is important, but definitely increasing the maximum sensitivity. Survivors should not run be able to run faster than I can turn my camera!! XD
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Why not keep it as exhaustion and take away the 3 second requirement but always exhaust when you leave a locker (regardless of if you get the stun or not)
would make it an exhaustion perk that can turn lockers into pallets and gives the killer options for counterplay. That seems reasonable to me.
would also give merit to Iron Maiden.
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That is the reasoning I think “the child” would be a good killer. Though I believe they can’t do that for legal reasons in many countries.
ALTHOUGH “The Orphan” as a liscence could get around that. But it was a terrible movie so... -
Actually an angel killer would be cool. Doesn’t have to be fallen, could be “an angel of death”
problem is, only way the killer ends up being cool is an emphasis on the wings, which is to much money to be plausible. -
What exactly is wrong with just using offerings?