lazerlight
lazerlight
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Girl................................. that's a mechanic.... not a bug.... it's programed that way. It's meant to happen.
Plague gains her red puke if all pools are corrupted.... that's something that you want to happen. And it helps you if you're in the middle of a chase and a survivor cleanses at the last available pool. You get red puke and the survivor you're chasing gets HIT. Periodt.
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Make canceling his ADS take a second before he can do a basic attack, keeping his movement speed reduced until he is completely out of ADS. This will prevent ADS spams.
Slow his movement down more when reloading.
Make his spear shoot farther and faster the longer he aims.
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yup! its ridiculous how long it takes for a gen to regress to zero. Ive had hundreds of matches where i kick a gen at 70%, get 5 survivors hooked, go back around and the gen is till at 30%.
Regression should be faster and gen tapping should not be a thing. Survivors should get the same bar killers get when kicking a gen, and a mandatory skillcheck after they fill it.
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@SCP_FOR_DBD said:
Bloodlusts goal is to make chases not last too long, complicating it with pallets when the bloodlust we have is simple yet effective doesn't make much sense imo.
This change doesn't redefine the purpose of Bloodlust, its purpose will still be for ending chases faster. But I can now see why it wouldn't be too good for t walls or tiles with multiple windows, maybe a better change would be to make breaking pallets not remove BL.
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How to counter DS and Pyramid Head: "just play immersed forehead! Just don't be in the map forehead!"
That's all I hear when I read people defending them. They love to pretend like the killer's lose/lose situations are counterable, and then when they get nerfed they scream "but the lose/lose situations is all they had!!!" It's like... they KNOW the killers have busted mechanics lmao. They KNOW they aren't counterable. People on here just love being contradictory, because when people say DS and PH need cooldowns and slow downs when charging their powers, everyone jumps saying that they dont need it! But when I suggest that the Plague should have her cooldowns and slowdowns reduced when charging her green puke, everyone's like "she's fine the way she is". So which is it??? You want the cooldowns or not?? Everyone should get fair treatment lol, older killers have cooldowns and charging slowdowns for a reason. DS and PH need them too.
On top of the changes they are giving PH in the next patch, he needs to be 100% speed or less when placing his trails, not 110% as he currently is and will still be after the next patch. Deathslinger needs the same speed reduction as Huntress as soon as he raises his gun, and raising and lowering his gun should be slower as well.
Also, to those saying survivors can "move around when speared" they can't move around enough, in most corners no matter if you manage to move behind an obstacle you'll just slide across the side of the obstacle and get smacked by DS.
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i mean...... i think the forums don't have the power to store that type of information? Plus, there are more players than there are forum users. And seeing as how the forums get a considerable number of maintenance periods or a lot of times bugs out, it could cause serious problems with game progress (I think, lol. I don't know how data transferring works)
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@arcnkd said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1659761#Comment_1659761
I don't think so - I think if there was a second ramp, Survivors would take it constantly because they are the only side that takes stun-time for falling from heights. Killers wouldn't care either way because they can walk off the Empire State Building and keep going in this game lol
yes, but they cannot put the killer in a position of having to go around the hill to get to them, giving them free unhooks / heals, or allowing them to be cocky. Plus, your example still happens in the Red Forest Hills, since the sides of the hills that dont have ramps, have rocks or trees that usually force the players to use the ramps. Eliminating that fall stun for survivors anyway.
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@arcnkd said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/195846/could-hills-have-two-ramps
Hmm.. while I like the idea, I think I've got to disagree with it - if only because as a Killer, I have gotten several hits from cocky Survivors trying to lunge off the hill top and misjudging my ability to fall and lunge at the same time. XD
Those situations will still happen, adding a ramp will just give survivors more options to take. Whether to keep running around the hill, or meet the killer on top of it, or a second chance for a balanced landing play, etc.
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@Milo said:
The double ramp hills are kinda useless tho. See Red Forest.
I was thinking ramps that are on opposite sides of the hill, in contrast with the Redforest hills that have the ramps adjacent to eachother and have rocks and other obstacles on them.
If we look at Hills as Cubes, applying a ramp that goes through it will give Killer's an opening no matter what direction the Hill spawned with. Never creating a "Killer has to go all the way around to get to the survivor/hook" scenario.
The Redforest Hills still allow for these scenarios to happen. Since the ramps are next to eachother on the (cube) Hill, there are various scenarios that happen where for example, a player is facing the front of one of the "cubes" sides. They are unsure of where the ramps are. There's a 50/50 chance that if they decide to go to one side, they will be met with another wall of the Hill, insteand of reaching the ramp.
Having a ramp on opposite sides of the Hill/Cube, will guarantee a hill on either side that the player facing the wall of the cube decides to take.
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@SunderMun said:
I don't think it would make him broken, but it would make his portals a bit less situational, which is great imo, however it shouldn't be permanent as long as they're on it; just as they walk over it for the first second or two.
exactly what I was thinking. That'll give the demo info but not definitive info, but won't hinder survivors if they decide to stay. Gives the Demo the ability to choose whether to teleport or get there by foot.
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@SCP_FOR_DBD said:
While it wouldn't hurt, I don't think its what demo needs right now.
I wasn't thinking about it as a "fix" I was just thinking it would be a nice casual buff. It was something I randomly thought up while playing against a PH. I have no opinions on how to make him better or what his present status is strength-wise. I leave that to the Demo pros.
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@TheButcher6641 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1650217#Comment_1650217
Match history is more like whether or not you have won/lost and stats is more detailed such as hooks, skills checks, escapes, rescues and so on .
??? What? A match history is literally what you are describing as a detailed list of the actions performed during the match being displayed in the post match screen. Why would HISTORY refer to a "you won/lost" screen??? That's not a match history. And if what you are referring to is a "match replay", in which you are shown the entire match from beginning to end, that is a "Match Replay", not a match History.
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@TheButcher6641 said:
I'm not against the idea but I think it would more useful to have a stats feature instead such as how many hooks, kills, escapes and so on ...
...that's literally what a match history is... it's the same thing.. and if not, with a history, a ((total X action done)) is included at the end for each action...
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@bjorksnas said:
After being unhooked ds becomes active for 40/50/60 seconds
Healing, Repairing, Cleansing, sabotage, or searching chests for a cumulative 3 or more seconds deactivates the perk
Upon another survivor being hooked ds deactivates
If picked up by the killer succeed in a difficult skillcheck to escape the killers grasp and stun them for 4 seconds
@bubbabrotha said:
My idea is:
Timer Active for 30 seconds
Timer Stops when in a chase
Timer Stops when sluggedw
Deactivates when ; being healed, healing, touching a gen, touching a totem, opening a chest etc.
Edit; I'm too tired to fix any grammar issues
I think it should stay active indefinitely after being unhooked UNLESS any of these points are met:
Once another survivor gets hooked, or the survivor with DS begins getting healed, then the perk will start a 30 second countdown of availability. (This will give the DS user a chance to recover, and/or use it if the killer were to go after them again after hooking someone else shortly after the DS user getting unhooked, but also prevents them from abusing the perk by i.e. self-caring mid-chase, staying at 99% health, etc.)
The perk will fully deactivate if the survivor touches a gen, a totem, a chest, a locker, starts healing someone else, attempts to rescue another survivor off a hook, gets fully healed, gets healed from the dying state, or enters the exit gates.
This will prevent using DS when getting grabbed anywhere other than at windows or pallets, and will prevent cheap end-game escapes.
Also, once all generators are repaired, DS will automatically start with the 30 second cooldown.
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I think the first box should be a mandatory objective in order to activate the RNG on the other boxes. As in, the first box will never allow survivors to remove the trap. Instead, they NEED to do a first box in order for the other boxes to give them a chance at removing the trap.
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@Pior_Morte said:
Why not? Demo needs some love and this won't make him unbalanced
Right? I was thinking that the KI should only continue if the Demo is within 12 meters, that way he can get a use out of the Oblivious status effect if survivors are sealing the portal.
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@Leachy_Jr said:
Why would you even think to do this? Like stop the "oh it's not final and it's just a sneak peek towards the mid chapter", no.
Why would you even think of nerfing pop without thinking of nerfing DS or UB.
It's pretty stupid to call the devs survivor biased, but when they do stuff like this it's hard to call them not.
This needs to be balanced out from both sides, pyramid is getting nerfed, his lose lose scenarios is what made him good, we'll have to see how he turns out though. Other survivor perks are getting buffed (thankfully none of them look busted) and now pop is getting nerfed with nothing to the survivor meta being nerfed along side it.
Pop is still going to be pretty good and usable, but just why did they need to nerf it in the first place? AND why not nerf DS UB in the mean time if we're touching meta perks?
"his lose lose scenarios is what made him good" AH!!! So you admit it! Those scenarios were never counterable.
PH stans just wanted to pretend like Survivor's could do something about it. "Oh just fake the window, just fake the pallet, just use a cheat engine to turn off collision!"
I see through Killer stans' act. People who claim Spirit/DeathSlinger (+ others) are fine just like to get cheap downs with the Killer's ability to put survivors in a lose/lose situation.
Anywho, Decisive Strike needs a change, that's a fact.
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"Don't gen rush."
People pretend to forget that Killers have the ability to literally restrict Survivors from playing. They can literally deny survivors of points by camping, tunneling, and slugging and have the ability to get a survivor out of the game... They forget that in a chase, the Killer can score points in THREE categories, while the survivors only score points in one. In most cases, even if the Killer gets genrushed, and all survivors escape, the Killer leaves the match with more points than the Survivors.
This thread proves exactly what most Killer mains want. They want survivors to consciously waste time.
They hate when survivors finish gens in less than 5 minutes but at the same time are okay with a Killer ending the game in 2 minutes by slugging and hooking everyone at the same time. The same people that defend NOED. Because Killers are allowed to end matches quickly if they so desire but survivors HAVE to waste time by doing totems and "not rushing gens."
I agree that tunneling, camping, slugging, should be punishable, because in most cases, it can be considered griefing, ESPECIALLY or specifically early game. Did you read that? I said EARLY game. It doesn't matter if it's "done for strategic play" and it doesn't matter that the devs don't see it that way. You are essentially denying a player from PLAYING the game, making the experience boring / unfair. And what word is used for that scenario? Griefing.
This community is so filled with the "The other side's fun is not MY responsibility", mentality. Which yes, you are correct. It ISN'T your responsibility, it should be the game's. But as Killer, you have the power to eliminate players. Even when genrushed, killers are not eliminated, they can keep playing, and can still make more points than survivors (and experience for Devotion might I add) at the end of the match. When Killers tunnel/camp/slug, they are denying survivors from playing, and preventing them from getting points in other categories. This is a game, winning or losing we all play to have fun and make points.
Tunneling/Camping/Slugging should be addressed and a mechanic to reduce gen rushing NEEDS to be implemented. I don't want all matches to last more than ten minutes, but I also don't want it to end in 4 minutes cuz all survivors split up on gens. I want everyone to be given an equal chance of playing, recovering from a bad position, and winning, WITHOUT denying other players from playing / getting points.
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@CookieBaws said:
My main gripe with her is she relies on survivors actions to ANYTHING.
I mean, corrupt puke does work, but once it out you are a pathetic M1 killer and anyone decent enough to chain tiles will make your life miserable.
The same i hate Oni for, he have to play "nice m1 guy" in order to get a down, but that can happen too late and you lost a game.
On top of the cake, her sickness damage doesn't contibute to Emblems, but healing from fountain does. A lose-lose scenario.
Yeah exactly... it would be cool if instead of her puke increasing the sickness bar on survivors, it would somewhat hinder them for like, 1 second. Maybe helping her force slow window vaults. That way her vile purge will have a secondary effect on the survivors other than just increasing their sickness. Cuz yes, she is easily loop-able.
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@sharkster13 said:
The biggest issues I personally have with Plague is that survivors who are broken and decide to cleanse are fully healed. Let's say you hit a survivor and he's not broken, but gets infected and transitions to the broken status. Once he cleanses he regains full health (without a medkit or healing). Yes, you get vile purge, but the survivor usually cleanses on the other side of the map (it's a pain when it's a really big map) so it's kinda useless and all that infecting at that point gets pointless and it hurts your emblem system. And when you injest coruption, survivors are usually far away and if hit by it they get sprint burst and get even further away and she is not that fast to catch up to them easily. And she is soooooo easy to loop and so difficult to go against SWF + her chanting when you injest coruption is too loud, so you don't hear survivors and can easily escape. And it's a pain that once all pools of devotion are used, ALL pools reset and you are suddenly forced to use vile purge even if you didn't want to (Let's say when you are three gened or in the end game and you want to find out where the survivor is by infecting objects but you can't).
So some of the buffs I'd suggest:
- if a survivor is broken and cleanses he stays injured (sort of like legion with frenzy)
- quiet down the chanting while using corrupted purge
- corrupted purge can infect objects/survivors
- not all pools of devotion are reset when the last one is used for cleansing, but rather one is used at random, or half of them are reset
- change one of her IRI addons to consume corrupted purge state tremeandously faster but get instadowns as a balance
I thought of the same thing, but that would just force survivors into a healing simulator. Maybe, this could be added if they removed the sickness increase when she continously pukes on survivors and just let it at the timer. That way, they can cleanse, then heal, and if they get puked on, they have to wait for the timer to fuel up. But Im not sure of that change either. So I would just leave it at healing after cleansing.
I like the Corrupt Purge infecting objects idea.
Hmm. If they add the "one pool gets used" that would just be more annoying since the Plague will just get infinite Corrupt every time a survivor cleanses at the previously triggered pool. I think it should stay the same. Or maybe add a secondary power button that allows the Plague to "call upon the gods" to give her corrupt purge once all pools are red. (Ofcourse, it should still activate after a certain amount of time, so Plagues don't force survivors to never cleanse. The secondary button would allow her to activate it earlier)
I think you left out a word in your last point about the IRI add-ons. With that description it sounds like you want to activate corrupt at a pool way faster AND get insta downs... that doesn't sound balanced. Insta downs with jer red puke honestly aren't necessary even with an add-on. Every plague running it would just slug and get everyone out of the game the moment the match starts lol.
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@LuffyBlack said:
Killers get more bloodpoints because the cost of their add ons and the fact they can't even keep them at the end of the match. Other than that, I don't agree with anything you typed.
Survivor's add-ons get used up too even if you dont use your item. And I don't think that is the reason why Killers make more points. Unless the devs themselves said that in a livestream.
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@JimPickens666 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1632494#Comment_1632494
I didnt read your post but you're right, NOED and destroy an entire team. It reminds me of one time i was AFK as Bubba I had got 4 chainsaws for a daily with no hooks and then decided to not bother playing and just let them get the free escape. One came up and kept pointing at me so i thought they wanted to farm but they actually just wanted to loop. So I wiped the whole team with Bubba's chainsaw and slugging. Idk how i did they seemed to just not want to open the door. If it was me i would have opened the door, just like when there's NOED in a game.
I've literally died to NOED once that i can think of. Surely it must be more than that but it can't be by much, and i know for a fact i've died to more moris. Maybe people just don't take the killer seriously a threat because they're really not lol
you should read it then
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@zoozoom6 said:
theres a ton of bus, lies and misconceptions in this lets start with:
"As I stated before, when Killer's tell survivors to "do bones", they are telling survivors to waste time."
yes and there's nothing wrong with this it makes the match more interesting to decide what to prioritze and get punished if you pick wrong plus you get points for cleansing totems.
"ALL totems have been broken. Because of course, it's not enough to break 2,3 or even 4 totems by yourself, because if there is a single dull totem, NOED will activate."
you know you can break noed after it spawns right? if you worry about not being able to find the fifth totem maybe you should keep one obvious totem around so when you break 3 you have a 50% chance of knowing exactly where noed spawns. Or you know just take a map for a few games and memorize spawns.
"But when KILLERS end the game quickly, they don't get punished."
yes they do this is a lie they get minimal points and might even derank and have no chance of double pipping. you say not pipping is meaningless but i disagree i like close games and while rank is a weak indicator of how well the players are it does account for the extremes well at least ie: if you need to play against players that installed 10 min ago you likely wont find them outside rank 20 and if you want to play against the best that put 100 hours in every week you wont find them outside red ranks.
do you just hate hex perks as an idea? would you prefer an m1 simulator with nothing else to do?
Another case of countering my disagreement of the "do bones" argument, with the "do bones" argument.
You are giving survivors the responsibility of making the game last longer. You want survivors to spend time away from generators so that it's easier for the Killer to apply pressure. But in the same breath are okay with games where Killers purposefully slug to hook everyone at once early game. Again, you are fine with Killers ending games quickly but not with survivors doing the same. You are okay with Killers denying survivors points, but are not okay with survivors ending the game early.
"You know you can break the totem when it's active right?" Yes. I do. What is your point? That does not help you in any way. The whole point of what I said is that it doesn't matter if you went through the trouble of breaking four totems, the killer can still wipe out the team because of that one totem. You are countering me with "do bones." You are not providing any good counter arguments with that. It's like me saying "something is wrong" and you asking me why it's wrong and I reply with "because it's wrong".
No matter how strongly you feel about ranking. It. Does. Not. Matter. Deranking, ranking up. It does not matter. Rank doesn't prove your skill. Rank doesn't give you usable in-game/in-store rewards. Ranking does not matter, therefore, deranking is not a good punishment because at the end of the match you still camped someone, you still denied them from getting points, you still denied them from playing, you still ruined their game. That's the point I'm trying to make but ya'll choose to ignore it and look at it from a superficial perspective or hold the "Players from that side deserve it" mentality where you only care about YOUR fun because as long as it's fun for YOU you're okay with it and it doesn't need changing.
And as I have stated before, Killers that end the game quickly don't make many points, but they still leave the match with more points than the survivors. In other words, they ruin the match for the survivors, because they were denied of points and/or were incapacitated most of the game and the Killer STILL makes it out with more points than all of them.
You are choosing to ignore the depth of the points I have made just because you are on the side of the "Do Bones" clan lol.
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@Syntai said:
I allready said this.
"Survivors aren't getting punished for doing their job."
It's just a lategame oriented perk.
With your logic a lot of perks would need a rework.
Take Bitter Murmur for example. With your logic I could also say: "Why does the killer see me whenever I finish a gen? Why do I get punished for doing my objective? I am just doing gens, like I am supposed to, and the game/perk is punishing me for it!"
Also Bitter Murmur doesn't require the killer to do something, aswell.
This is just how some perks are designed.
There are lots of perks like these.
Same with survivor perks.
"Why does DS hit me, when I just downed a survivor? Why is this game punishing me for doing my job?"
This is not how it works, dude.
Also NOED has the requirement of having atleast 1 dull totem alive, within the endgame, while relying that you still have to work for it (managing to find/hunt/hit the last survivors before they escape), and it can also get cleansed at this point.
It has every counterplay opportunity any other hex has, and even more.
People just complain against NOED because it's lame to go against.
The only point I agree with is a BP issue. But survivors tend to get less BP overall, which could need some adjustments.
Bitter murmur gives the Killer information, it does not grant them an insta down.
Having a dull totem is a requirement for the perk itself to work. The Killer does not need to perform an action prior to its activation or after its activation to gain the effects. Resulting in a very strong "reward" for the killer, in exchange for nothing *from* the killer.
As I said, DS is not balanced properly. imo it should deactivate once you perform any action unrelated to a chase. Hopping in a locker should deactivate it. Because right now it allows survivors to be cocky. But at the same time, I believe it should stay active all game after being unhooked. So long as the survivor does not perform any game progessing action.
Killers have a job to do, yes, but in the end, it's a game. Everyone came in to get points. If a killer wants to deny a survivor points by tunneling them, they are playing like a jerk. They are not simply "doing their job" by tunneling, they are purposefully denying that player points in other categories. That's what I mean when I say tunneling and slugging should be discouraged with more noticeable drawbacks or changes in the in-game mechanics. Just the same way I believe some mechanics/design choices/perks should be readjusted to prevent cocky playstyles by survivors, to take away their feelings of "superiority" because they abuse game mechanics and map designs knowing that the Killer cant do anything about it.
When I say "NOED punishes survivors for doing their objective." It's because they gain a very powerful hindrance once they complete their objective. Imagine survivors getting a perk where they gain the blindness, hindered and exposed status effects when opening a chest. Would you run it? Imagine killers getting a perk that stuns them when they kick a gen or break a pallet. Would you run it?
They'd do nothing for you. They'd only benefit your opponent, even tho it's YOUR perk.
That's how I see NOED. The Killer does not require to perform an action to gain a speed boost and give survivors the exposed status for finishing all gens.
So yes, it IS punishing survivors for doing their objective and gives the killer easy downs.
And also, the point I tried to make with my post, is that, people who use the "do bones" argument, are BLAMING the survivors for not wasting time. They are blaming the survivors for not lengthening the match. They are blaming the survivors for finishing "too quickly". And because of that, they are saying that survivors deserved to get hit with NOED. In other words, you can say that they also see NOED as a punishment for survivors who do their objective.
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@azame said:
I Actually agree with every point you made here. My biggest gripe is like you said they want us to do bones which wastes time ot give them time on the off chance noed is active. In solo queue a simple totem counter could resolve this problem.
Yup. NOED stans will ignore my points and stay holding on to the "Do Bones" argument.
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Me: "Saying "Do Bones" is wrong and here's why."
NOED stans: Do bones and stop complaining.
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@KrazyAce13 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1632187#Comment_1632187
You are forgetting countering perks by doing the hex totems are part of the objective list, until you can realize and remember that this debate is going nowhere.
Hex perks do not deny survivors access to gen progress, nor do they deny access to opening exit gates. They hinder survivors, and make survivors vulnerable, but do not impede on their primary objective. Until you can realize and remember that, your argument is going nowhere.
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@Syntai said:
I am not sure why people complain about NOED.
Unpopular opinion, but:
The perk is average at best.
Atleast on higher ranks. I can imagine that it reks butts on yellow/green/purple ranks.
But why do so many survivors complain about it?
NOED is so damn situational, that it almost never works out in the first place, since:
1) The perk only activates as soon as the endgame is reached.
I must say, the majority of my wins end with a 3K + Hatch Escape, followed by a 4K.
NOED doesn't activate if you win beforehand. So why take a perk that relies on you almost losing?
There are so many better perks to choose from which will boost you in almost every scenario.
Corrupt Intervention, Ruin, Enduring, Spirit Fury, Whispers, Discordance, Brutal Strenght, and many, many more.
2) Doing Bones.
Here we go. I've read multiple arguments regarding this one.
'Doing bones isn't a counter, because it takes time to do so.'
'Doing bones isn't a counter, because it's not my objective and I don't have to do it.'
I mean, atleast there are ways to counter it.
If I - as a killer main - could go to every corner of the map to light up some graves to disable adrenaline/exhaustion perks/whatever I might do it. (+ it would give me hella BP).
Doing bones isn't difficult. And as you get more experienced with the game you start remembering all the totem spawns, IF they don't spawn clearly visiable next to gens, like it happens with my games.
People expect me to 'Just leave survivors for 60 seconds' whenever they could have DS. There is literally no counter play whenever they just jump into a locked. I can't just sit there and wait a minute.
There is no real counter play to adrenaline. Sometimes you just have to watch them get healed, while being unable to reach them.
But meanwhile I hear stuff like: 'Sometimes the killer pressures all 4 of us so we cant cleanse the totems all arround the map'.
Seriously? If the killer somehow tp's all arround the map at once NOED is going to be your smallest issue.
I don't use NOED. But I've tested it. And most of the time it didn't even activate, because all the totems where allready gone.
This was before they started rewarding survivors with double the BP for cleansing.
3) Even if it activates, it tends to get cleansed before you get value out of it.
I've seen this strategy before where survivors leave 1 dull totem in the open and wait for the last Gen to pop to see if it lights up. If it does, they cleanse it - if it hasn't been cleansed by a random allready.
And even without any strategy it seems that some random allways stumbles over this totem whenever it lights up.
4) Sometimes it does activate, but even though you have it, you still have to find, hunt, down and hook the survivor. All within the endgame is going. If you're by chance too far away from one of the exit gates, they'll be allready gone before you can make use of it.
5) Sometimes you only get value out of the speed boost, because the target you are hitting with NOED was allready injured/you would have gotten him anyways.
6) Even if you end up getting value out of it, most of the time it's just 1 instadown, unless you are facing a dumb SWF team which even hook-dives a facecamping leatherface to try and safe their teammate. There are killers that also achieve this with their simple kit - or perks like Haunted Ground/Make Your Choice.
NOED isn't that good.
And lastly, I dislike the point where you said that survivors are getting punished for doing their objective.
They don't.
It's really simple to be honest.
There are a certain bunch of killer perks which focus on the late game.
NOED. Blood Warden. Remember Me.
They are bad at one state of the game, but useful under in certain situations. They aren't punishing the survivor for doing good, they are simply just created to work under different circumstances than your average 'Whispers' perk.
You could say the same with survivor perks. DS for example. Why do I get punished for doing good? I downed the survivor and he gets a 'Get out of jail free card'?
This is just how some perks work.
Also: Killers DO get punished for ending games quick - aswell as camping. It reduces their points, they have a harder way of ranking up/derank, and good survivors will take the opportunity (if they see the killer camping) and win the game.
( I saw that you said: "Don't say this!" but this is literally the state of the game. If you camp, you lose pips. You also most likely lose the game and you don't get much BP. So what is there else to add?)
When I tested NOED it was useless in 7 out 8 games, because I wouldn't have needed it, it got cleansed, it didnt activate or survivors escaped anyways.
~Sincerely, a killer main that doesn't use NOED because it's #########.
I never said nerf it. I said rework it so that it's a more interesting and fair perk to use and go against. Getting free downs because survivors did their job is not fair. It IS punishing survivors for doing their job. Again my post is about how killers use the "do bones" argument to defend NOED, which, as I said, is a synonym for blaming survivors for not *choosing* to take time away from their primary objective. Bloodwarden and Remember me don't give the killer free hooks and sacrifices. They have requirements to meet. They require the killer to do something in order for it to activate.
I'm not here pretending that meta survivor perks are perfectly balanced. They obviously aren't.
I will say again that you cannot say depipping is a punishment because it isn't a noticeable punishment in-game and post-game. Because of how meaningless ranking up is. You don't get rewarded for it. Even if a Killer ends the game quickly and gets less points, they still get more points than all the survivors, so, that also, isn't a fair punishment.
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@DBD78 said:
Only lazy low rank survivors complains about Noed!
oooh you got me! omg I never thought anyone would notice.. I'm so embarrased... 😥😔😔😔 now everyone will know I crouch around and play blendette in every match getting all of my teammates killed and farming them off hooks... my dignity....
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@IshinSolarc said:
I'll make it short, gen rush and endure having to search for NOED totem while the killer keeps hit killing your teammates. If you feel cleasing dull totems are a waste of time, you can go without doing them but you should at least remember their locations when NOED goes off. NOED is not a perk that benefits losing killers, is a perk that punishes bad survivors who are oblivious to totems and that is why it was created.
Also saying that killers are the ones who end the game quick is just ridiculous, good survivors can loop killers until 2-4 gens are done because most of the maps allows it, if you and your teammates are not making good use of the map, it doesn't mean killers are the ones ending the game fast, it's yours mistakes making the game go faster.
But I agree with you about a survivor who gets tunneled is bad, they should make it if a survivor gets 7000-8000 in boldness category they are sure to not lose any pip, because it's one of the hardest to get if the killer isn't a walking potato.
When I talk about Killers ending the game fast. I mean the Killers who purposefully slug survivors and aim to get them all down simultaneously in order to hook them all at the same time. I'm not talking about games where survivors keep memeing and coming for unsafe rescues and risky saves or choose to group up and loop the killer next to their downed teammates. Those survivors obviously were trolling and handed themselves to the Killer.
So it is totally fair to say that Killers have the ability to end the game quickly and are applauded when they do.
@KrazyAce13 said:
This will be a short read so you’re welcome...
dont do bones dont get points dont cry when downed 5 feet from exit gates with noed... this is a bad mentality that has come from a big streamer that wants noed nerfed but says wasting time on bones when doing gens is more important is bad. This is kind of like hexys counter argument for selfcare haters, it takes less time to selfcare than it does being dead. It takes less time todo bones than the time wasted being downed in front of the gate to noed.
Sorry, I apologize if I misunderstand what you are saying but I'll give my answer to what I believe is the message you are trying to send.
Your final sentence, before the one with your very specific and, unfortunately for you, wrong presumption about me, is comparing spending minutes searching for totems and cleansing all of them which take an additional 12+ seconds depending on the amount you find and cleanse, to getting one hit downed by a sped up killer and being instantly hooked and camped end game. Again, we are using the time factor. And again, you are blaming the survivors for not taking time away from the gens, in order to "save the time they could spend being downed by NOED." You are punishing and blaming the survivors for doing their objective and not giving the Killer their "rightfully deserved" downs and play time. You are punishing survivors for basically not cooperating with the Killer.
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@GoshJosh said:
Your post in a nutshell: Please at least give us a totem counter.
Every reply so far: don't complain about NOED!
Literally. They all choose to ignore the main points I bring up and a lot of them get angry and annoyed. They bring up "but what about when you're going against optimal groups!?" like they think I haven't gone against cocky survivors who pre-drop pallets to finish a gen right in front of me... and they counter my "dont say {do bones}" argument with "Do Bones". Lol, it's hilarious. They instantly assume I'm an immersed survivor main that crouches around the entire map not doing anything. When it's the complete opposite. I play both roles. I know the struggles of both roles. I know the frustrations of both roles. But as soon as you say you want a change for one side, you're a clown and a joke and entitled and a *crybaby*. ...When they're the ones getting personally offended and agitated....
@arcnkd said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1631829#Comment_1631829
This.
Though, while I can see the merit in having a totem counter for the benefit of solo players or non-4-man SWF groups to know whether or not their 'randos' are breaking totems so they know whether they should be using repair time in search of totems or not; I think having an actual physical counter would weaken hex perks too much by giving the Survivors too much information in regards to how they can spend their match time - allowing them to "optimize" gen rushing and totem breaking instead of having to use some precious seconds not knowing.
I think a better system, personally, would be a game-wide notification/unique sound effect when the last totem is shattered that lets all players know there are now no more totems. This way, you still get the indication that you no longer have to search for totems -- but you never, at any given time prior, know just how many totems are left. You would only know 'if the sound hasn't gone off, there's at least one totem hiding somewhere'.
Even this, though, still weakens hex perks which are meant to force Survivors off their generators and to use match time focusing on a second objective instead of just rushing through the primary objective with no consequence.
Honestly???? That sounds like a sick Idea!!! I'd love that to be implemented!! That way both sides know when all totems are gone!
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@NuclearBurrito said:
Ok, so wanting to nerf Nurse isn't too crazy of an idea, however these specific idea's are all a problem.
Basically here is the thing about Nurse:
- She's really hard to get good with
- If you aren't really good at her, she feels horrible to play
- If you aren't good at her, then she's #########
- If you ARE good with her, then she just feels alright to play as
- If you are good with her then she's insanely strong
If we are going to start making changes to her we should be addressing all 5 problems at once.
So here's the thing, problems 1-4 are all problems that would be solved through buffs, however problem 5 means that buffing the Nurse would cause an unhealthy effect on the meta, for example: pre-nerf omega blink Nurse. And at the same time, Nerfing her to solve problem 5 like you are suggesting would just kill the Killer since problem 4 means the people that are good at her won't stick around without her insane powerspike on mastery.
Luckily, we are not limited to making changes 1 at a time. In one way or another, the solution here is sidegrading. Take away a power in a way that disproportionately effect good Nurses, and then re-add power in a way that disproportionately effects bad Nurses.
For example:
- Replace the fixed blink charges with a power bar
- While charging the power bar drains (but not while held at max charge), chain blinking takes 100% more charge per blink and still has all of the same limitations as the current chain blink (half max range, only 1 chain blink)
- Charging a blink takes 50% of the power bar by default (no addons)
- Recharging the power bar takes 10 seconds from 0% and starts immediately on fatigue like now
- Base MS increased to 4.0
- Plad Flannel is made basekit
If you are a bad or just alright Nurse this is a buff, since more MS means less power reliance (tho still not fast enough to chase) and the power bar system named here is more forgiving to split second mistakes. However for a Great Nurse this is a nerf, since blinking has a much longer cooldown even if you don't chain blink meaning they can't snowball as hard.
It doesn't have to be these specific changes, but the point is that no one change is going to cut it here, since the Nurse both needs buffs (for non-balance reasons) AND is overpowered.
Thank you! Thank you for actually taking the time to gather counter arguments. I see what you mean. Thanks to your explanation I can see how my changes would not solve the problem. Yeah, I agree that there needs to be a way to make her easier to play for newer players. Like the gauge working as a guide for the amount of blinks she can use. She needs a whole different approach to make her feel fair for all players, new, old, survivors and Nurses themselves.
Thank you again. I wish more people actually took their time to counter argue and not start name calling or dismissing or blaming it on your playstyle. You made me feel at ease with your reply.
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@Avarice10 said:
Have you ever tried playing Nurse, especially against a SWF who know what they're doing? She's a hard killer to master, you need a lot of patience and wits to play her effectively. Making her have Myers tier 1 lunge would make her even more frustrating to play when you're trying to learn how to play her, and you'd have even fewer nurses. What the Nurse needs is QOL changes so she's more user friendly to beginners, then you can talk about reworking her. Any Nurse player who is super good at her has honestly worked hard for it and they have my respect.
Yes. I have. I commented that before.
@bjorksnas said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1630651#Comment_1630651
hes the same kind of person who though billy changes were good you can't argue with someone like that
Why do you feel the need to talk like that? Getting people "on your side" while talking down about me. If you disagree you can move on. There's no need to attempt ganging up. I just shared my opinion, but many people in these forums just resort to saying "no. You're being [insert disrespectful adjective/noun]." If you're gonna come in with a dismissive attitude then I'd prefer if you didn't interact at all. I didn't make this post to attack anyone or insult anyone. I just want the game to be fun for everyone.
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@BuggyNurseMain said:
This is probably the most entitled survivor post I've seen on this forum. You get smacked by one nurse out of every 10 and you come on here to complain about how busted it is. Grow up.
????? If you dont agree you can share why you dont agree instead of calling me things. Or simply ignore the post. You are doing nothing by just stamping me as entitled and telling me to "grow up".
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@HarlowXRaven said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1630243#Comment_1630243
I'm not talking about telling them in the lobbies im talking about when the game starts and also what about the other suggestion of a survivor getting replaced with one.
How will you change your perks if you get the warning once the match is loading?
A scale rating for tunneling and slugging?? Wut?? At any rate, what you're suggesting is basically an indirect block feature. Why would you have a rating system for a Killer that you might not face again ever? Why have a rating system if it's not aimed at avoiding the low rated people? Not only would it be unreliable and inconsistent because maybe they happened to slug/camp/tunnel your team that one match, there's no way their playstyle can be cemented, every match is different, BUT it could basically ruin the queue times for the person being rated! Cuz people would constantly avoid them!
I wouldn't mind an in game block feature tho. I want to avoid as many entitled survivors that complain even after escaping and Killers that play scummy as possible.
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@bjorksnas said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1630409#Comment_1630409
well it takes more than muscle memory to play nurse, if a nurse can get consistent hits through walls and tiles they can't see through or even hear through if the survivor has iron will then they are just too good, they shouldn't be nerfed.
If they're truly too good, then a lunge reduction or charge recovery after fatigue shouldn't be a problem for them. And when they get downs, then that means they made a good play, and didn't get the down because the lunge or the other points I made gave it to them.
It's just like Billy's change. Good Billy's are still good Billy's. They just can't abuse their chainsaw usage.
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@bjorksnas said:
nurse was nerfed in a few ways, 4 meme / training addons, no extra blink addons without a large drawback because old 3 or more blink nurse was so easy to play and nearly impossible to play against even if the nurse is just mediocre, the cooldown drastically lowers the potential because while you might be able to catch up with one blink against good survivors they will either run the entire speedburst 12 meters and the cooldown 3 seconds for one blink 3.5 for two and gain 16-18 meters, the charge time cannot go faster than 2 seconds for 20 meters so the survivor can get about 4 meters out of range, making it nearly impossible even with the lower cooldown to catch up in a single blink unless the survivor messes up. Also a 3 second cooldown still ensures at least 6 seconds for two blinks for a default nurse to use their full power meaning on average you always get 2-3.5 seconds of unrestrained running in fatigue and an extra 4-2.5 where the nurse has one or zero blinks available
A small lunge on nurse is terrible for absolutely no reason nurse is already plenty hard to play and build muscle memory for and making a high risk high reward EVEN higher risk for the same reward is just wrong.
"mega blink" isnt a thing and nurse should be able to always use her first blink to its max potential even if the other one is on cooldown
if her charges start regenerating after fatigue that means with no addons a wiffed or hit double blink swing will take 9.5 seconds before you can use both blinks again which is ridiculous for a killer that can really only secure downs with their power
You guys are focusing too much on the word "mega" I just used it to refer to the blink that lets her blink the farthest. So, it IS a thing.
She is incredibly hard for new players. After using her for a couple times I was able to get some consistent 4k's, because of the points I made in the first post. Nurse is easy as pie to players who are used to her. No amount of mind-gaming survivor's do will secure their health state against a good Nurse. I still stand with my opinion.
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@NuclearBurrito said:
Mega blink?
The long blink. The blink that lets you travel farthest. I'm not talking about the infamous "omega blink".
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@[Deleted User] said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1616021#Comment_1616021
You could do a few different things, or a combination of them.
One possibility would be giving him a cooldown of maybe two seconds instead of .5 seconds after leaving torment mode before he can M1 again. That's enough time for the survivor to drop a pallet or vault a window, so it would hurt the M1 side of his zoning ability.
Another possibility would be reducing his speed while in torment mode to below 100% - say ~85%.
Another possibility would be making his attack dodgeable by massively increasing the propagation time of POTD. Right now it's .033 seconds, but it would be dodgeable towards the edge of the range on regular ping if that was more like .33 seconds (they could tweak the exact number). He would still be able to hit people locked in a pallet drop or vault animation, stuck in a tight corridor, etc. but aiming for someone out in the open would be a lot less likely to succeed.
You'd have to buff him to compensate for any nerfs here, but there are a bunch of possibilities there too. For example, you could increase his power's duration and the base range of POTD. You could also increase his movement speed while walking over an existing trail of torment. You could even make POTD capable of breaking dropped pallets.
I'd love for his power to break pallets. I mean, it launches a bunch of metal bars from the ground. And the cooldown he gets after using POTD is fairly close to the normal duration of a pallet break so I'd be fine with it. I think a 1.5 second cooldown would work just fine for when he cancels his power as long as he keeps that 85% slowdown while cancelling (2 seconds of cooldown is a bit much for a cancellation). I think a good compensation buff would be to make POTD travel way faster.
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@TheStabbiNAngeL said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1614555#Comment_1614555
That's actually not true when he cancels for some reason he has to drop his knife to the ground which is around 3 seconds *before you can attack or raise the knife again for another potd attack given survivor's enough time to create distance or make the vault.
That is incredibly incorrect. In DBD, time is very important, especially for Killers. It is wrong to say lose time durations or approximations when it comes to powers and cooldowns. 3 seconds is a VERY long time when it comes to cooldowns or stuns or animations. If he had to stop for 3 seconds when cancelling his power then no one would be complaining about him that much. He has less than 1 second of cooldown when he cancels his power, plus, he regains his normal 115% speed. Not even Killers wiping their weapons after a hit takes 3 seconds. Killers breaking pallets, generators, vaulting, wiping their weapon, missing an attack, all of those animations take less than 3 seconds... to approximate a cooldown to 3 seconds is very wrong.
After he stops drawing trails he can immediately do a basic attack after no more than 1 second.
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@TheStabbiNAngeL said:
Pyramid Head can't use his power constantly he either runs out or gives up, if he does he'll just get punished for his misses stop avoiding torment just because you don't are afraid to get moried that's why you're being zoned his power is very countable in fact I've gone against maybe four or five pyramid heads who never hit me with there power only one guy because he was running I'm all ears other than that the survivor's I face usually make me miss about four times then I'm out of POTD and is forced to basic attack's which is on a recharge rate seriously you guys are just making going against him hard on yourselves also its easy to bait the power just as it's easy to mind game with it you're clearly can see it coming since the red stain is so large, it's kind of like going against the plague in a sense the way survivor's avoid torment, I don't know what other killer's are doing but I don't abuse the cages nor do I camp unless I'm being gen rushed and I very well should because I'm going to lose the match if I don't.
I don't think they are talking about the Punishment of the Damned itself, its the fact that once he's close to you with his sword on the ground, in many cases, when you're at a window or pallet, you're gonna get hit. Drop the pallet, you get hit with POTD, dont drop it, he'll cancel and M1 you. He doesnt have drawbacks for cancelling his power. Same with Deathslinger. He can keep pretending to aim his gun until he catches up to you and M1's you.
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@Velarica said:
If 3 survivors do nothing but let their teammate run killer and rush gens during this time, it is entirely their own fault for not doing bones. As to the Candles in basement I will also remind you KILLERS do not have this information naturally (They need to run a perk to get this info). If something like this were to be implemented then then killers would need a straight counter on the UI somewhere while survivors would have to check basement for this information. This is due to the fact the killer needs to be out in the map pressuring gens while a single survivor can check basement really at any time without much worry.
?????? what are they supposed to do? You suggesting that they should go and try to take the killer away from them? That'll only hinder the person who's getting chased and probably get the other survivor downed quicker. Again, you're suggesting Survivors should hand themselves to the Killer or sabotage their teammates. And again, 3 survivors running around the entire map totem hunting while one of the survivors gets chased all game is purely a waste of time. You want survivors to consciously waste time.
Why care about a totem counter for Killer if any Hex perks are already located for you? What are you gonna do with that information? Camp the last dull totem in order to get NOED? You'll still need to walk around the map and waste YOUR time to find it.
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@Iceyrawr said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1606304#Comment_1606304
left behind only works when you are the last survivor, and take away 1 perk slot.
now a common offering can get your whole party out and completely stronger than a perk?
your argument just further proves why this is wrong
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1606313#Comment_1606313
No?
doing gen is not the only way a hatch spawn.
Oh really? What are other ways of spawning hatch?
If even two gens are done, the hatch won't spawn unless there is only one survivor left. Survivors have to do 3 gens for 2 survivors to escape thru hatch. Doing gens is the only way to spawn hatch while there is more than 1 survivor left. Survivors have to do way more work in order to use keys and get more than one person out. Killers just tunnel and get a survivor out of the game early game.
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@APoipleTurtle said:
This is still one of those UI elements that I would be okay with as part of a perk, but NOT as a base-game feature.
SWF get the benefits of plenty of perks for free (such as Bond, Kindred, Detective's Hunch, etc) through the power of communication. Solo survivors must run the corresponding perk to get these abilities on their own. I see no reason why a totem counter would be any different.
SWF have info of how many totems have been cleansed, and location, A totem counter only shows the amount of totems left. It doesn't show players their location... Its the same as the Generator counter... you want the gen counter to be turned into a perk too? I don't think so.
@Velarica said:
There already is a totem counter, Small game, just because its not meta (and admittedly a weaker perk IMO) doesn't mean you cant use it. It does exactly what your asking for, it helps you find totems. Sadly its really not your fault if you were running the killer, its on your teammates to suck it up and look for totems instead of pushing through Ruin
Totem counter..... as in.... numbers... as in.... 1 2 3 4 5...
@Pipefish said:
A totem counter would nerf NOED since it'd incentivize cleansing which would make less games were NOED pops up. 😬
But... isn't that what killers want?? Don't NOED users want survivors to "do bones"???? I don't understand?? You want survivors to do bones but don't want them to be incentivized?? Make that make sense. This is exactly what I mean. NOED stans have the same mentality.
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I really don't understand Killer mains lmao.
They're always like "DO BONES LOL"
But at the same time don't want there to be a totem counter. It's like... do you WANT Survivors to do bones, or not??? This is why the whole "Do Bones" argument doesn't sit right with me.
---
This scenario is a perfect example of why NOED should be changed.
The ones that are most affected are the ones that do most of the work during a trial or succeed at distracting the killer most of the game. (Lets call them the MVP) The MVP has no chance of doing totems since the Killer won't leave them alone, and then when all gens are done, they get downed and camped and die on first hook.
But it's not the Killer's fault for running a cheap perk, it's the other survivor's fault for not using the time that the MVP is giving them, to consciously run around the map, taking time away from gens in order to make sure all 5 totems are gone.
What is the MVP supposed to do?? GIVE THEMSELVES to the Killer so that they have a chance of searching for totems before endgame?? I don't think so!
I saw an idea of having 5 lit candles in the basement and each fire represents a totem being untouched. This would be a cool addition for a counter.
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I knew it couldn't just be me!
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@Caz2018 said:
At the risk of sounding stupid, what does 'M1 killer' mean? I keep seeing this but applied to different killers and have no idea what they are going on about.
M1 refers to a pc mouse's left click. M2 = Right Click, M3 = Middle Mouse Button or Scroll Wheel.
On PC M1 is the default button for performing the Killer's Basic Attack. M2 is the default button for using the Killer's Power.
People refer to some killers as M1 Killers, since their power itself doesn't actually down survivors, but instead hinders them or affects them in some way. Examples of M1 Killers are Clown, Trapper, Legion, Doctor, Plague (without her red puke), etc.
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@Avarice10 said:
No thanks, I rather killer not hold the game hostage in a 3 gen set up, thanks.
??? Don't they already? Don't get 3 gen'd. Learn how to scout out all the gens before gluing yourself onto the closest gen to the one you just finished.
@TAG said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1597634#Comment_1597634
I don't think it's a problem that a Survivor can stop gen regression if the Killer chooses to break a pallet.
You make it sound like the killer chooses to leave chase to go break a pallet 30 meters away. I say it because there are many gen / tile set ups that require the killer to break the pallet in order to reach the gen. As in, they have no choice but to break the pallet.
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@TAG said:
I'd probably suggest 1 second, personally. That would still be enough to stop a mid-chase gen tap.
1 second is not enough when killer is breaking a pallet.
@Onyx_Blue said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1597338#Comment_1597338
That's my point really. Plaster fixes are so common to this game, but none of them are ever worthy solutions. The fact they made this perk just tells me that the gen tap issue is far from being worked on
Like.... Instead of fixing one thing that will only require them to change some values in the code, they go ahead and create a perk for it... it's ridiculous. They are profiting off of their core issues.
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sure three seconds might be too much. I'd be fine with the same length we have right now where we have to wait a couple of seconds after a skillcheck is missed to continue filling the bar.
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My problem with nurse is that if you have no walls, you're dead. Plus the fact that she can immediately blink right after landing the first hit. If you are in an open area, no amount of mindgames will save you. If you run backwards, she'll just look down and blink, and even if THAT gets her, she'll use her second blink to hit you, or lunge and knock you down. An expert nurse is guaranteed a 4k unless all survivors bring a BNP and genrush the living heck outta her.
IMO she needs one of these changes:
- Only allow her "farthest" blink to be available when she has full charges.
- Make her charges start to replenish AFTER she is finished her fatigue animation (this one will give survivors a slightly better chance to reach a tile).