jesterkind
jesterkind
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I think it's a pretty decent idea! Other games have the commendation feature to encourage players to praise the other players, I think something like this would work just as well.
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I like these ideas both! I think I trend far closer to number one myself, I think that would give the Trickster some real options for how he wants to approach any given scenario without making him OP for any of them. Very solid, I could see it working, though I think he'd need an addon pass to go with it.
Though, quick nitpick, pet peeve of mine- lacerations are cuts, there'd be no knives to "pull out" for idea 2.
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Laurie stabs him twice; the first time is in the neck with a knitting needle, the second time is through the eyehole of the mask with a wire coat hanger.
I've not seen the newer movies but I have seen the original lmao
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I'd sooner see it fixed, honestly. I want to like it very badly but my god, those houses... those fences...
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@Dino7281 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2597586#Comment_2597586
So it would have same system as any other totem requirement perk. Imagine Inner healing that could just use from same totem over and over again... and that would still be weaker than CoH
but still would be for your whole team and killer would still have to leave gen to actually remove it.
So bad...
You act like killer can just instantly destroy it, everytime. He sees it across the map and know exactly where to go. It's still safe haven, place where your whole team get to heal and benefit from 2 free perks.
If you can get only 1 heal from it, well. Maybe you didn't really used it smart way...
I mean, yeah, but that's because Inner Healing is kind of a mediocre perk, a lot of healing perks are stronger than Inner Healing.
If the killer can see it and knows that snuffing it permanently disables the totem it's on, then it is a good idea to ignore chase and go stomp on that totem regardless of chase or gen patrolling. The counterplay wouldn't be the same- you'd get it out of the way as quickly as possible every time you see it, and then the game just doesn't have the totems in.
Now, I can practically sense the Hex comparison coming, and once again: Not the same mechanic, shouldn't function the same way.
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@Dino7281 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2597534#Comment_2597534
"The totems being relit is the core concept behind the perk."
Is said where? Core concept is safe haven based on totem location that can your whole team benefit from.
Who ever said you can do it infinetly?
"don't do it then?"
You don't see nothing wrong with that?
This is basically 8 perks in 1 and killer can't get rid of it unless he kills that player, which is way harder, because of that perk...
There is no reason for a killer to keep that totem. Don't you think it's weird that survivor can destroy totem, but killer can't? Survivors are moving hands around it and destroy it, killer stomps on it and it's fine... Someone skipped leg day
It's not a safe haven if you can't relight the same totem. If you can't relight the same totem, Shadow Step is markedly less useful and CoH is just a single-use heal that you can place down a few times. If it's a safe haven, it has to be more permanent than that, that's kind of what a safe haven is.
And no, I don't see the problem in telling you to time when you snuff a boon totem more effectively than just abandoning a chase to do it. You do it when that's the best option, not because you feel like you're actively being harmed by the totem simply being up. Either nobody's using it and you're free to finish the chase, or someone is using it and you can chase them instead. It's just a resource that survivors have, it's not losing you the game passively when nobody's using it.
Snuffing totems could be more impactful via cooldown or slowing down how long it takes to bless a totem that's been kicked a few times, but if the totems are broken or the perk only has a few tokens, it completely neuters the whole idea behind the perk.
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I agree- multi-level maps and elevated catwalks are definitely the biggest sticking point with boons right now. I'm hesitant to say their elevation should be changed, though, but mostly because I'm still on my "totem spawns need to be changed" bullshit lmao
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@Dino7281 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2597470#Comment_2597470
I am not saying it's same. I am saying your argument is weird.
"It can't be nerfed, because that's how it is supposed to work."
That's not really good approach to balancing the game...
It's super broken compare to Inner Healing and killer just can't do much about it now, unless you find out who has it and tunnel the ######### out of him.
Snuff it, so they can just do it again? Yeah, that's just not worth leaving gens, or losing chase for it. There just have to be some motivation to get rid of it. Don't forget it's time spent by 1 out of 1 vs 1 out of 4.
If you don't like removing totem, then fine.
Cool-down is really not good enough, unless you make it overkill like 2 minutes, noone cares. You would just use 2 of them, so 1 is always active and before killer can get rid of second one, you will have first back.
Possible way would be to punish survivors for each time their totem gets removed. Like that healing, or blessing will take longer for each time killer snuffed it.
I'm not saying it can't be nerfed, I'm saying you need to be aware of what the mechanic is supposed to do before figuring out how to tweak it. The totems being relit is the core concept behind the perk and the thing that makes it work for both sides, not a problem aspect of some other focal point.
Yeah, I agree, snuffing a totem isn't worth losing a chase or leaving a patrol, so... don't do it then? No matter what other changes they make to the mechanic, even if they totally neutered it by making totems broken on snuffing, you'd still only want to snuff the totem during downtime after a down/hook, not in the middle of a chase or instead of completing a chase, I feel like a lot of people are not managing their time efficiently when it comes to snuffing a boon.
I don't mind the idea of blessing taking longer for each time a killer snuffs a totem, though. That's not a super bad idea to encourage keeping a boon up for as long as possible on the survivor side and to make snuffing more impactful, I could just see it spiralling out of control if the values are too high, so it'd have to be done very carefully.
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@Dino7281 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2597425#Comment_2597425
It will still work like that. Killer doesn't have to get rid of it, if he wants them to stay there.
And it doesn't really work like that now, because they can just change location even when boon is active.
This would force them to think where and when they will use boon totem. Right now, it's just brainless.
It will still be their safe haven till killer finds it. I am pretty sure it's not supposed to be safe haven with killer inside...
If your argument is valid, then why you can remove hex? It's supposed to be strong perk killer can use, but survivors can get rid of it, but it would be bad if that could happen to them? hmm, weird...
I would definitely support a cooldown before you can change where you put the boon down, because you're right- it does undercut the idea of committing to a safe haven if you can just rebless it whenever. I don't think it's the most needed balance change ever, but it'd make it more consistent and I'd be fine with it. Similarly, I think that a boon totem having a cooldown after it's snuffed (but only a moderate one- thirty seconds, maybe) would help them think about where to put it since the killer snuffing it would have a little more impact. Again, I don't think this is a dramatic need but it is a little more warranted than the first idea.
CoH isn't a safe haven when the killer is inside. Shadow Step is supposed to benefit you when the killer is inside, but to be fair, that's the weaker half of it.
Hexes and Boons are not the same mechanic. They're not designed to affect the same things, they don't work the same, and they're not intended to have the same effect on the match. Trying to make one-to-one comparisons between the two simply, straight up, just does not work, period.
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It's not a good idea- the whole point of the boon mechanic is to make sure survivors are returning to the same spot over and over so that they can get utility buffs and so the killer at least knows they're going to be in one spot. From the survivor side, it's also supposed to be a safe haven you can return to if you need to, and that's not achieved if you have to seek out another spot- it's definitely not achieved if you run out of places it can go.
If the effects of boon perks are too strong to be up semi-permanently, then the effects should be tuned down; there's no point in just completely abandoning the boon totem mechanic by making it that temporary.
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Yeah, the chat filter is a bizarre mess. I really don't know why they implemented that way, though I respect what they were trying, at least...
It should just censor slurs and common curse words, there's no reason to branch it out.
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@BrokenSouI said:
I feel like people dont have a sense of humor anymore lol
I know, right? I was about to comment that myself lmao
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I don't know that it actually shows the "cursed" prompt, but it's fair to assume survivors could figure out that you have Devour if you mori someone and didn't bring in a Mori offering.
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@notlonely said:
i feel like you may want to know a story about a game called overwatch...
they nerfed EVERYTHING that was meta and made no buffs. The results? the game being a hot mess and now having lost 1/3 of its playerbase in around 1 year
You know, not to get too deep into it, but I think there may be another reason Overwatch lost that many players over the last year...
Regardless, yeah, I don't think just nerfing everything into the ground is a good idea for this game.
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It's not; it's just an annoying perk for survivors to play around if they didn't do bones in anticipation of it, so they get annoyed by it.
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@YOURFRIEND said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2595651#Comment_2595651
They do get the benefit when healing themselves. It's literally standard medkit speed, infinitely. I know my games go much smoother when I bring even a brown medkit. The self sufficiency of being able to heal yourself at standard speed for forever cannot be overstated. Even in a SWF it's far more efficient to heal yourself than to pull a teammate off a gen for it. It kneecaps a big part of the killer's pressure. Can the killer interrupt you? Sure. Maybe. If you have iron will and heal inside a jungle gym it's highly unlikely. They've got no reason to be there.
Right, but that just means that CoH is the same as the survivor bringing a medkit, which they're freely able to do at any given time. This is where CoH is basically just any other healing perk; it's no stronger than other methods of self-heal in the game, save for when you misuse Self Care on its own lmao
CoH is only worrisomely strong when it's used by teammates with coordination who are utilising the speed buff properly, not when some rando decides to use the free medkit.
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@YOURFRIEND said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2595628#Comment_2595628
You think coordination is required to see the boon aura, go to it and heal? Why do you think that? It's an action that benefits a solo survivor, so of course they'll acclimate to it quickly. Humans get used to things that benefit them very readily.
Perks are not a solution to other perks. They're a band aid. Rock paper scissors is a poor way to balance an asymmetrical title, cuz three of the other people are playing rock when you're countering the paper.
I think coordination is required to make CoH actually formidable and not just decent. A solo survivor can go to the boon and heal, yes, but unless they brought a strong self-heal build with them they don't get the full benefit of how quick the healing speed increase is unless someone else is healing them, and if the teammates aren't coordinating then there's no way to stop the killer from interrupting other than being reasonably certain they're chasing someone across the map. For solo queue, CoH will be nice, but it's nowhere near the game-defining benefit it would be with coordination.
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@YOURFRIEND said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2595393#Comment_2595393
You understand most killers don't have instadowns or a reliable way to inflict Broken, yes?
They can with perks. I'm not saying that's a good outcome, hence it being the worst case scenario, but it'd definitely reshape the meta lol
Again, I don't think that is definitely going to happen. You need a lot of coordination to make CoH work to that degree, and solo-q players simply don't have it.
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@Dino7281 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2595523#Comment_2595523
Killer Meta Perks: Have to earn those effects (Pop, Surge, BBQ etc.)
Survivor Meta Perks: Fix their mistakes (DS, BT, Unbreakable etc.)
Good survivor perks should probably help them recover from mistakes, since they're the side of the game that can actually be completely removed from the match by making mistakes. Not saying these aren't strong perks or that there's no reason to consider nerfing/tweaking them, but there's a weird obsession with "earning" effects and "fixing mistakes" in this community.
DS is perfectly fair after its changes, BT is a very balanced and reasonable addition to the game, and Unbreakable only works once so it's more like a resource than anything else. "Second chance" is a perfectly reasonable perk type so long as the game is balanced around them, which is where I think most of the issues come from.
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I know that if you edit a comment it goes into needing to be approved, so maybe that's what happened to the whole thread? Not sure if it applies in this case, but it might be what happened.
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@RaSavage42 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2595385#Comment_2595385
This is true...
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2595383#Comment_2595383
Here's my take on what's "meta"
But I forgot that Tinkerer is considered "meta" and for good reason... Also that it works really well with Ruin so they synergize
I think it's fair to say that there's a difference between a super-entrenched meta, and just perks people like running because they're strong and useful; Corrupt and Tinkerer are probably going to be seen quite often no matter what, because they're just convenient perks.
The attitude to take, in my opinion, is to make sure killers don't feel they need to run those perks, and have the leeway to run other builds if they want to.
The same obviously goes for survivor, too! Just focusing on killer for an example.
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@TheDuhJ said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2593743#Comment_2593743
Generating pressure via injures is one of the few ways killers can slow down the game, because no one wants to deal with the dead hard that follow in chase. Dead hard is the whole reason I picked up and learned trickster boi
That is definitely why it's strong, but since you don't technically need to do that to stand a chance- see again, instadown and Broken- I don't think it's going to break the game.
Might still need tuning down, though. It's only been active for like, a combined three days, so we'll have to be a little more patient to keep an eye on it.
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Not on its own. Minor nerfs to some of the meta perks may not be the worst thing in the world, but there's a reason all of the meta perks are entrenched as deeply as they are- it's not just that they're strong, it's because of the way the game overall is balanced.
Take regression perks, for example. If kicking a generator without any perks at all did literally anything for the killer to justify taking the time to do it, you could nerf regression perks a little and the meta would change inherently as people have the freedom to experiment with other kinds of builds, free of the fear that they're just setting themselves up to lose because gens are gonna fly.
I'd want to see the core game changed a little, and then all the non-meta perks buffed substantially to make them more appealing. That, in my opinion, is the best course of action.
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Boon perks, currently, but with an overhaul to totem spawns and maybe a few QoL buffs to Hexes they'd be pretty evenly balanced.
In general, anyway. Obviously some Hexes just suck, but the mechanic overall isn't substantially weaker than the mechanic of Boon perks.
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@ryseterion said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2594905#Comment_2594905
Thats not what im complaining about, im complaining about how now after the fix you dont have to actually care or worry about timing it correctly, just use it for distance or when the killer swings at you.
Using it for distance hasn't changed at all, and how on earth is waiting for the killer to swing not timing it correctly? The whole problem before was that timing it correctly from their screen wasn't good enough because the hit validation only cared about what was on the killer's screen.
DH can be baited if it's used to dodge a hit, which is what this fixed so more people are gonna try to use it that way. DH for distance hasn't changed at all.
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@ryseterion said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2594663#Comment_2594663
Which is why its really annoying and unhealthy. Anyone who uses it basically has 3 health states for free
But that's not changed. It's how Dead Hard worked before, it's just sometimes the survivor would be screwed out of using it because of desync. You were never supposed to be able to hit them through it, that's such a weird complaint to make.
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@UnknownKiller said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2592026#Comment_2592026
U cant bait a DH for distance
Okay? I never said you could. Baiting out DH isn't even discussed in that post...?
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@ryseterion said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2594026#Comment_2594026
What i mean is that survivors will wait until you are in the swinging action, then they use it and can not be hit.
Yes, that is how Dead Hard is supposed to work. When they do that, they are supposed to dodge the hit. The only reason that didn't happen before was because of desync, which is why they fixed it.
You aren't meant to hit them in that scenario, it's literally what the perk is designed for.
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You're not meant to be hit through Dead Hard (outside of using something ranged to hit them at the end of the dash, which I heartily recommend, it's very satisfying), and you absolutely can bait it out still because nothing about baiting Dead Hard has changed, I'm not sure where you're getting that from.
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@Zacharry100 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2593990#Comment_2593990
Keyword: Safe area where they can heal as much as they want and killer has no reason to go over there. A survivor being healthy is better than injured. A killer going to a part of the map with no gens is much worse than one survivor going to a side of the map with no gens with unlimited healing there with no drawbacks. This is a worse case for killer.
All that really buys them is a chase reset, though? They can't contribute to the objective in this scenario, meaning they either need to be working on gens while injured at some point, or they're just not working on gens. If you as the killer realise they're doing this, all you need to do is patrol the generators and do your best to down them as quickly as possible and this'll just be a waste of their time.
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@Zacharry100 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2593743#Comment_2593743
Worst case scenario: Survivors do a gen in one area with a totem bless it. Killer has no reason to go the side of the map where there are no gens. Survivors have a safe area to heal as much as they want without a care in the world.
If there are no gens there, aren't they wasting their time? They have to come to where the killer is in order to do generators, and they're running the risk of being downed before they can escape back to the totem radius.
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@Exxodus21 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2593900#Comment_2593900
Shadow Step is completely busted. The game is built for killers to be able to track survivors by scratch marks and sound. Shadow Step and IW completely counter anyway for the killer to track them unless they stay within the killer's line of sight.
While you're not wrong, I want to highlight that Iron Will is already busted on its own and Shadow Step only makes it very slightly worse. You'd get more mileage out of Iron Will and Lucky Break instead, those two perks together are insane.
Shadow Step on its own is not a busted perk. Shadow Step in combination with one or both of the ridiculous stealth perks in the game is absolutely busted- but the difference between Lucky Break/Iron Will/Shadow Step and just Lucky Break/Iron Will is, in my opinion, minute.
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@GillyBeannn said:
I do agree with you but I guess from the killer's perspective, it's frustrating when on your end, it tells you you hit them but then the server says you didn't. The problem is that bhvr hasn't fixed that problem where if your hit doesn't validate, why are the survivors still screaming from the supposed hit. It basically a big F you to the killer, and that's something that has to go so the killer doesn't get to illusion that they were supposed to hit them.
Overall, I am glad for this change so that the perk works as intended, same with the pallet stuns, but I also play killer so it's very disheartening when my game tells me I hit someone but it actually didn't.
I suppose I can see that, but it hardly justifies the general response I've been seeing across the forums, it's just a minor annoyance to get the audio cue and not get the hit.
Oh well, I imagine it'll die down over time.
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Shadow Step is definitely fine, but Circle of Healing may need looking at.
The time investment survivors have to put into maintaining Shadow Step combined with the fact that scratch marks being hidden during chase isn't that devastating means it's strong, but pretty easily played around if you know what you're doing. Maybe don't run aura-reading perks for a bit and you'll probably be fine on that front.
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@Avilgus said:
HEX: UNDYING
We’ve been watching this one closely, and there’s a few things we’d like to address:
-Transferring the same Hex multiple times can get out of hand: Hexes are meant to be strong perks that can be destroyed, and having to destroy the same Hex four times can be a bit much.
-Since tokens aren’t transferred when a Hex changes totems, Undying was unpopular with perks other than Ruin (which does not have any tokens and is immediately at full power).
-Having aura reading on all totems also made it a very powerful tracking perk on top of its other effects, and is a little redundant with Hex: Thrill of the Hunt.
From the January dev update : https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/217721/developer-update-january-2021#latest Explaining Why Undying got nerfed.
Sorry, this is a genuine question and not a rhetorical one- what is the relevance of this here? I'm curious, I can't quite see it myself.
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To be fair, the chapter before last did give us Lethal Pursuer, which is more than strong enough to warrant being a meta perk. It's insanely good and weirdly slept on.
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@drpynz said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2593743#Comment_2593743
You are free to your opinion. I still stand by mine. Call me a noob killer but I absolutely look to scratch marks at least 50% of the game to see the direction a survivor takes. If they going for an unhook or you get sidestepped at a jungle gym. Scratch marks are huge and so are basically disabling aura reading perks and add-ons. I feel its "game-breaking"
I respect that- I just think that if someone's clearly getting irritated and worked up over their perceived powerlessness, maybe I can help by talking about the ways to deal with it. Sound, blood (+ Bloodhound), non-aura tracking like Whispers, Spies, Discordance, all of that still works against Shadow Step, to say nothing of the fact that it's easily the most obvious one to snuff since survivors immediately run you towards it.
Circle of Healing, again, is a different beast- but Shadow Step is definitely something you can deal with.
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Shadow Step isn't really that strong, though? Removing scratch marks is only a moderately good effect for the survivor side unless you're in an indoor map, and removing auras is good but pretty easily played around in the long run by just not leaning on aura reading perks as your sole source of tracking.
Circle of Healing is strong, but worst case scenario there is just that instadown and Broken are going to be more popular, or killers will just commit to a down instead of hit-and-run. It's definitely strong and might need tuning down, but it's hardly apocalyptic.
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It's going to be a very annoying perk to play around against strong, coordinated teams, and there'll be some totem spots that just won't be worth snuffing, but it's hardly game-breaking.
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Depends on what they do. I could see some pretty fun mechanics being added with boon totems, and some more refining of just how the mechanic functions.
Seems like it could be fun!
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@botrax said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2593472#Comment_2593472
They did the right thing for the survivor but not for the killer and its almsot always like that its really hard to try and believe the dev are not survivor side
They did the right thing for survivor, which happened after they didn't do the right thing for killer. What would you want them to do, ######### over survivors because killers got the same treatment? I'd rather see them learn and not repeat the same mistake.
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@botrax said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2593130#Comment_2593130
For multiple reason when they nerf killer most of the time its because survivor find them boring to play against example deathslinger. A killer nerf is rarely because they are strong spirit nerf is a good nerf for now but if they add the dust shes going to be destroy.
The mori nerf killer had no idea before the nerf happen but for key survivor had a 3 week notice before it happen.
The dev always think about the survivor fun but never about the killer fun you can see this in the wording of every patch note
The mori nerf having no announcement is definitely bad, they shouldn't have done that. Sounds like they learned that fact, though, since people did get warned about the key nerf.
Seems like they did the right thing there.
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@YOURFRIEND said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2592101#Comment_2592101
Yeah, one survivor off gens for 14 seconds in order to give their team 2-4 additional perks in perpetuity if they pressure the killer hard enough that he never has time to find and snuff the boon. The horror. What a waste.
And out of position where? In a place the killer has no interest in being? That's hardly out of position; it's perfectly positioned. Circle of healing obliterates an entire play style. Hit and run is not a thing anymore because survivors have an infinite healing resource. It's broken. Power creep at it's finest.
More than fourteen seconds the first time, and an additional fourteen seconds every single time they want to relight it. If the killer never finds the boon it's because survivors are looping and being downed away from it, so the boon's clearly not doing very much for them if they're never in its radius.
Out of position as in not on a generator and returning to the same spot over and over. If survivors are there making use of the boon, that's where the killer wants to be. Pretty basic, that one.
I will agree with you that hit and run is probably not going to work against CoH, you're gonna have to commit to downing people instead of spreading injuries.
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Rest in piece...
It would be The Game if they fixed the pallet density, though. It's a pretty fun map in terms of pure layout.
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@Junylar said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2593186#Comment_2593186
If you hit someone - the hit should be accepted, not rolled back. When your fair hits get cancelled for obscure reasons - it's not a fix, it's a clear additional health state that allows survivors blatantly tank hits with no excuse.
That's the problem- they're not fair hits, they're hits that only look fair because of slight desync issues. If a hit gets refunded at a pallet, you were not supposed to get that hit and would've only gotten it due to server desync.
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I'd definitely want to see a training mode where you can play against survivor bots as killer, or against a killer bot as survivor, so you can test out new powers/perks/addons/etc.
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@DorkianBae said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2593107#Comment_2593107
Mori's were busted.
Keys were busted.
Yet keys were allowed to stay in the game a whole year afte Mori nerfs.
Yeah, balance team def not survivor biased.
Yeah, BHVR are slow, we know this. Not sure where you're getting the idea that they're survivor biased from this- just because they did Mori's first, I guess?
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@botrax said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2593066#Comment_2593066
Mori used to be strong now its a shity offering its only usable on last hook you lose the ability to use your hook perk and most of the time it take more time to mori someone over hooking them
Now, bear with me because I will admit to joining the game around the time moris were nerfed so I don't have any firsthand experience with them, but... my understanding is that they just let you kill someone when you downed them after they've been hooked only once, and that's not strong, that's busted. There's no way to justify something like that being in the game, that's not a case of being "survivor sided" to change that.
The point of bringing a Mori is style points. It's a fun animation and it's fun to kill them outright instead of hooking them, it's satisfying. Moris weren't ruined, they were repurposed, same as keys- though killers got the better end of the deal there since Moris are a way more fun mechanic than keys lmao
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@botrax said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2592855#Comment_2592855
And in the same patch they destroy deathslinger and last year they destroy mori
How on earth are Moris destroyed?
Bringing a mori has limited tactical value but it's all about the style, I'm struggling to see what else you could want them to be without going back to them just killing someone way too early.
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I've played against it, and it's definitely harder- they had the poor fortune to be sent to a map where it didn't matter quite as much, though, so it's definitely not unbeatable in all situations.
Just be aware of who has Iron Will and try to not let them slip away, or ignore them and focus on their teammates.