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ad19970
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Killers do not have to be op in order to fulfill that role. Balanced and viable killers can pose a great threat and be scary. But of course they have to be played well as well. Both sides should do equally good at equal skill levels.
A killer being op as in you win almost all matches with them no matter how good the survivors are is not desirable at all.
When people camp and tunnel it's generally because of a lack of skill that they don't want to admit to. Obviously there can be matches where, unless you play Spirit or Nurse maybe, you'll lose no matter what, and those matches suck. But the game is certainly in a decent spot balance wise at the moment. Perhaps not actually good, but fairly decent.
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Oh dude please don't give him a nerf. He definitely doesn't need one.
I personally find him fun to go against. There are certain situations where you do not have counterplay against him, while you would have counterplay against other killers. Which is when running at a pallet or window from an straight angle and he can just whip you. His counterplay is more limited than against other killers. But he definitely has counterplay, thanks to his limited range, decreased speed while holding his ability and his 1.5 seconds cooldown when canceling his ability. And making it take longer to activate his ability would cripple him I feel.
If he'd get more map pressure with zombies focusing on gens and not getting stuck so much, and maybe a few other small buffs, I feel like a nerf like this would be fine. But at the moment, Nemesis arguably needs some small buffs, no nerfs.
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I'm not quite sure what the first change would do? Because the aura of the exit gates only show once the gens are all completed.
The second idea would be very bad in my opinion. NOED is already a unpopular perk, making it basekit and not bound to a totem would be completely broken. This way, even if survivors do good and repair all 5 gens, there is still a good chance that the team will go down. And it would completely discourage hook rescues during endgame. It would be really bad.
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@Aven_Fallen said:
"I for one believe one person should not have the right to ruin 4 other peoples enjoyment of the game."
I mean, this is exactly what a Spirit-player is doing...
But yeah, people should not DC. But they will do that, so I dont bother that much anymore.
But there are in fact people that even enjoy going against Spirit. Which killer one finds fun or not is extremely subjective. If everyone would dc on the killers they didn't enjoy going against so much, there'd probably be a dc in almost every match. And it ruins the fun for everyone that enjoys going against that killer. So I would argue just picking Spirit is not even close to the same as dcing.
For every killer, there are at least a few people that don't enjoy going against them.
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I guess Nemesis and Trickster are the most likely, since the devs said that they plan on balance challenges for killers after there release within the next patches.
I do hope Nemesis still gets some small buffs, his zombies in particular need their AI fixed and improved so they can apply more map pressure.
However, in general I think Trapper really needs a buff. I don't enjoy going against him and don't play him often, but he is the first killer of the game and he is in quite the rough state.
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Fun is very subjective. I for one enjoy going against Nemesis a lot for example.
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@woundcowboy said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2293325#Comment_2293325
I don’t get how this is a talking point. Friday the 13th used voice chat and it was fine. Just mute people who annoy you.
Because you want the game to be balanced around comms, so by not wanting to play with some weirdos I'd put me and my team at a disadvantage again. We'd end up with a similar balance gap in the end. And killers could stomp survivors teams that don't want to use voice comms.
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Adding comms would be just bad, because at that point you'll pretty much be pushed to constantly play over comms with strangers, or you will be one of the first reasons to blame that your team lost when it loses. And I sure won't play this game via comms with complete strangers. I don't need some mentally ill person screaming into my ear every second match. I'd rather get anal bleaching.
I do think people overvalue the power gap between swf and solo survivors, because matchmaking screws over solo survivors a lot.
But the best way to close the gap is to try and buff solo survivors with aura reading abilties and other information, such as base kit kindred or base kit totem counter, so they at least get close to the level of information that swf have. But even that has it's downsides.
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Haste status effect doesn't sound good. Loops are balanced around the base movement speed of survivors and killers, a constant haste effect would be too much, even if a survivor had to cleanse one totem before.
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@Bonquiqui414 said:
They screwed up the pipping system again. Disappointed but not surprised, year 6 already off to a great start
@Pilot said:
I got 3 Ruthless in the row at rank 2 with 1 pip away from rank 1, still rank 2
Yeah, actually, I found out it's just a visual bug. I restarted the game and suddenly I went from rank 9 with 1 pip to rank 8 with 2 pips.
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@Bonquiqui414 said:
They screwed up the pipping system again. Disappointed but not surprised, year 6 already off to a great start
So no. That really is kind of sad. Is the new mmr on or am I just stuck with green ranks at the moment?
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He's strong, but certainly not op. He has counterplay in chases and his map pressure is only decent.
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What baffles me is how people are going crazy over the nerfs to Franklins Demise and Demo addons, yet completely ignore the buffs to Nemesis and his perks.
I think this just again goes to show the killer bias on this forum.
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@Northener1907 said:
They are seriously not listening community again.
We all said Trickster is weak killer in PTB time. And they released him weak.
People keep said T3 is useless and powerless. It is not worth to get it. And again BHVR is not listening fans. Good Job!
We also said that the perks were too weak, and they buffed all the killer perks. We also pointed out that Nemesis couldn't tear up if all survivors just stayed infected, so they fixed that and Nemesis can get some charge when hitting contaminated survivors as well.
Don't just cherry pick examples to try and push your "devs don't care" agenda.
They also buffed Trickster in a following hotfix.
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Keys are still getting changes, they just aren‘t ready yet. Admittedily i dont really undeerstand the nerf to franklin‘s demise, but i would hardly consider that a buff to keys.
Also, if this is about devs only catering to survivors, then i would like to push your attention to the new nemesis perks, that all got buffed. And two of them got some serious buffs. Sadly none of the survivors perks got buffed, but i am still happy that at least the killer perks were all buffed.
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Eruption is so frustrating to me. Looked like a really well designed regression perk but in the end it has so many downsides and restrictions, as if the devs were so incredibly afraid of making it strong, I really hope it will receive some buffs when going live tomorrow.
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In chase I would argue Nemesis is better. His whip goes over pallets, windows and small objects, it's extremely strong, but it does have a limited range which certainly balances it out. I know some people want the range to be increased, but I'm not so sure about that, and if they do, then hopefully not more than one additional meter.
His ability to break pallets is also great, though you have to get to tier 2, and demo's pallet breaking animation is actually faster, but Nemesis of course has the great advantage of being able to move. This also allows him to counter flashlights at pallets. Both are quite strong in chases but Nemesis is arguably a bit better. He does slow down immediately when you start using his power, so he gets less free zoning, which is a good thing. Releasing his power without using it also results in a long enough cooldown to allow fair counterplay, which is great in my opinion, I am happy they didn't make the same mistake as they did with og Pyramid Head.
When it comes to map pressure, Demo is better, but not by too much in my opinion. Nemesis has his zombies, and while you can't control them, and they are rng dependent, they definitely help with map pressure. I wouldn't mind if BHVR changed the zombies so they'd focus a bit more on gens and be less at pallet loops, but generally I think they already serve their puprose quite nicely.
So in general Nemesis seems a tad stronger that Demogorgon to me, but he seems like in a fine spot balance wise already. Definitely not even close to being op but potentially viable. Although particularly big maps do seem to hurt him more than many other killers.
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@Nightmarecp said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2223890#Comment_2223890
I've not had the same thing, whether it is survivors going through vaults to pallets being dropped to them just running in a SLIGHTLY curved line i can't hit them AT ALL unless i have somehow gotten level three already through zombie add-ons, way i see it there are two simple fixes too, either widen the hitbox and lengthen it at level one or allow for wall penetration like old pyramid head. It made him an actual THREAT since the strong survivor loops got shat on by him but now they are back to being just as strong, i never agreed with that change and i also agree that the nemesis at least at mutation two should go through walls outright
I have to disagree. Nemesis ability being hard to hit is a good thing, he should require some skill in my opinion. However, if you are missing constantly, than I do fear that you might just still need to practice a bit with his whip. I mean I am definitely not perfect with it, but I get hits often enough. The hitbox can sometimes feel off, and I want the devs to fix that, but it should definitely not get a wider hitbox in my opinion, if it does, then only very slightly.
Unlike Pyramid Head's ability, his whip comes out instantly, so it needs to have a small hitbox for survivors to have a chance at dodging it. Otherwise it would be too strong. And it definitely shouldn't go through walls either, I think his ability is strong enough as it is.
Also, Pyramid Head's ability does go through walls still, so I don't get what change to him you mean.
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@Tsulan said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2226610#Comment_2226610
This video just dropped.
Yes, I saw the video. And again, in my time playing with Nemesis, I believe this only happened once. All the other matches multiple survivors spawned together.
Survivors all spawning seperate is a problem though, that's true.
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@Harold_Shipman said:
The fact that the shroud offering for killer separates the survivors, and the survivor ones bunch them up at spawn, shows a clear lack of understanding in the true weaknesses of killers (or rather, it does when they were first added, and they just havent been updated since)
It shows that their understanding was lacking back when these offerings were created. But that was multiple years ago.
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@Tsulan said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2226065#Comment_2226065
Zombies can be disabled by flashlight stunning them. Or wasting a pallet on them. Since they are RNG they are not really pressuring the area you would like to have pressure on.
The clip collection above showed survivors getting unhooked in front of the killer without BT. Do i need to say more?
Killers losing 2 or 3 gens before the first hook isn´t the fault of the killer. Its just survivors hugging gens. Killer can only chase 1 survivor and unless the other 3 survivor are idle, they will complete gens. Killer takes 20 or 30 seconds until he finds the first survivor. Lets say 20 seconds for the first hit (i´m being very generous btw.) and another 20 seconds for the second hit. Picking the survivor up and hooking takes 5 seconds. Walking to the hook another 10-15 seconds. Totals 75 to 90 seconds. A single survivor needs 80 seconds at most to repair a gen and since survivors usually spawn next to a gen, they instantly start repairing them.
While sure, the killer has to control less gens, survivors are also more likely to repair the other gens in coop. Meaning that they reduce the repair time by half.
The mori changes sound like the killer needs to jump through several tires. They probably require the killer to get 10 hooks and only allow him to mori the last survivor.
Could you please tell me where in the clip do survivors get unhooked without BT? Because the only clip I see is where both of them go down immediately after that.
Wasting a pallet on them means you've just wasted a pallet on the zombies. Not to mention that does waste a bit of your time as well, because you first have to lead them to pallets. flashlighting takes less time, but they are only stunned. It's true that rng plays a role here, but it's not a rarity that they pressure survivors off of gens.
I've been playing Nemesis a lot in the ptb, with his perk that reveals the auras of all survivors at the beginning. Only once did they all spawn seperate from each other, and still not all next to a gen. If you want to consider the time it takes for a killer to find a survivor, you also have to take into consideration the time it takes survivors to find a seperate gen. And while they'll do that, they'll probably have to hide from the killer as well when he gets close to where the survivor is. 20 seconds for each hit seems kind of realistic, though normally you'll be able to get a first hit on a survivor before that, but that does depend on when the survivors starts running away, what kind of gen the survivor is at, and what loops there are in the survivors vicinity. But 20 seconds seems fair, when talking about killers that have abilities that help in chases, but of course that can vary depending on the map and it's layout. I'm not going to argue that a map like Fractured Cowshed is balanced.
5 seconds to pick up a survivors is right as well, the time it takes to carry a survivor varies a lot. Sometimes it's only a few seconds, sometimes it can be longer.
If the survivor team is optimal, you can normally expect two gens to pop, but if you outplay the survivor in the first chase, you should be able to prevent the third gen to being repaired. That's not considering the fact that the chased survivors might have to run somewhere where a survivors is repairing one of the gens though.
The last two gens get repaired in coop, true, but that also means you can chase off multiple survivors off of one gen. The less gens, the better for the killer. However, that's not the only aspect. Hooking survivors itself slows the game down because now survivors have another objective to complete. One survivor is on the hook, while another one has to go for the rescue.
Yeah, highly doubt it. Like, why would they do that? Moris aren't very strong right now, I doubt they'll make them weaker like that. They talked about survivors being able to engage with the system as well, which sounds like they'll have another objective to complete, which would prevent moris, probably by delaying them. Not sure how killers can affect the moris, but my hope is by hooking every survivor once or something like that, to discourage tunneling and camping.
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@Tsulan said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2223594#Comment_2223594
I played mainly survivor during the PTB. Nemesis was no threat at all. His whip has a wonky hitbox and is very easy to avoid.
The examples of 3 gens going by the first hook is from my solo survivor matches.
People see the zombies as a strong side power. But on most maps they will just be something to mainly ignore or disable by using a flashlight.
He's not a strong killer. I'm getting release Freddy vibes from him. Where everyone thought he's OP, while he was one of the weakest killers.
But we'll see.
The Zombies can't be ignored near gens though. Which is how they can apply some map pressure. Not to mention the fact that they can help Nemesis locate survivors.
Many people probably aren't that good with Nemesis yet, though fair enough, that can also be said about survivors going against Nemesis. Nevertheless, I still think he is pretty strong, his whip ignores pallets and windows and that's pretty damn powereful, even with the limited range. His hitbox does need a bit of looking into, it certainly has it's problems, but in general it worked fairly well for me while playing him.
I still believe however that if a killer loses 3 gens during the first chase, it's because he probably messed up a few times, or simply got outplayed. I am not the biggest fan of this, but the simple fact is that the first chase is aguably the most important one. That desn't mean the game is unbalanced, it's just arguably a design flaw. Even if 3 gens do get repaired, after the first hook the killer starts getting more pressure, and that's how the killer starts slowing the game down.
On the other hand, the Mori changes sound like they will add a second objective for survivors, which I could imagine will slow things down a bit, so if Nemesis isn't A tier, perhaps they are already thinking about those changes as well when balancing their killers. I don't know, we'll have to see, but so far Nemesis seems pretty promising to me.
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I kind of agree with this. Wasting a pallet just to kill a zombie that respawns shortly after is a bit much in my opinion. Although to be fair you can still use it until the killer breaks it.
But I do not think it should go back up automatically. Instead, if a pallet is used succesfully to kill a zombie, survivors should be able to put the pallet back up again, just like with Any Means Necessary, but it should take like something between 10 and 15 seconds in my opinion, since the main purpose of zombies is to pressure survivors where the Nemesis isn't.
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I have been able to hit survivors going up already. I think the hitbox is just generally a bit janky. There have been a few hits over windows or simply with nothing between that haven't registered as well, but luckily those instances are rather rare.
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They definitely need to do something about tunneling and camping. Give killers some other forms of buffs to compensate, I don't really care, but going against a camping and tunneling killer is one of the most miserable gaming experiences to be had in my opinion. Luckily it doesn't happen that often to me, but often enough to be annoying.
They've talked about some interesting changes in the future, especially moris which made it sound like they might be adding a second objective to survivors, so I hope that's when they also find ways to dscourage killers from camping and tunneling.
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I mean, are you talking about the one survivor being killed so early so it ends up being a 3v1? I do agree that there has to be something done against tunneling. And giving remaining survivors some form of help when a survivor dies would be a good way to go, but other things would need to be adressed as well.
It seems like they have some interesting things planned for moris, which might be the early game collapse, but it sounds like survivors will be getting another objective to prevent moris or whatever. Hopefully together with those changes the devs will also figure a way to nerf camping and tunneling and not make losing a survivor so devestating.
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@Tsulan said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2222420#Comment_2222420
Current game meta is to rush gens. Its not rare to lose 2 or 3 gens during the first chase. Which is a 2 hit chase. Now make it a 3 hit chase and the killer faces losing 4 gens until he gets his first hook. At that time, the power is still not in T2. So he can´t use it to hit over pallets. The unhook will be pretty safe, because again 3 hits to down the rescuing survivor. By the time the killer gets his second hook, the last gen will be repaired.
Terrible tradeoff to get the power to hit over pallets (something the Huntress or the Plague can do)
Plagues power exposes survivors. Current meta against her is to not cleanse and just rush gens. So survivor that require just 1 hit to get downed, can beat Plague by just hugging gens. Plague can hit over pallets and her puke can down survivors in a greater distance than Nemesis. So in all terms Plague is better than Nemesis.
Plague isn´t exactly a S tier killer. So Nemesis also won´t be.
I'm guessing you haven't played the ptb yet, so I can understand your confusion here. But you CAN hit survivors over pallets and vaults at tier 1 already. You gain the ability to break pallets at tier 2.
I am going to argue that if you lose three gens during the first chase though, then you've probably messed up quite a bit during that chase, unless you are playing a killer that doesn't have a power that helps in chases. This is also why spreading damage is pretty helpful in most situations.
And since Nemesis can hit over pallets, windows, or other low objects, hitting a survivor 3 times isn't all too hard either. Though I would suggest not chasing the first survivor you get a hit on immediately, unless there is reason to believe no other survivor is nearby.
If a survivor is unhooking in front of you, you don't need to use his ability, just hit him normally and chances are the rescuing survivor won't get to another pallet or window in time.
Plague can hit survivors over pallets and windows, but if they don't cleanse she can't down survivors with her puke except for one time when she uses her default pool. So if they are one shot, you won't have the ability to down them with your puke. If survivors are constantly one shot, she is nothing but an M1 killer. Her puke does go further distances, but on the other hand, you have to hit them repeatedly with your puke in order to injure them, unless of course you have your special power. Nemesis just whips out his tentacle and gets a hit. He also doesn't have to waste time going to a fountain in order to down survivors with his power, not to mention the fact that his power being able to down isn't dependent on survivors. The time it takes to release his attack is also much less then the time it takes to charge up Plagues puke attack.
Last but not least, Nemesis has two zombies that help him apply map pressure. So in general I disagree, I believe Nemesis is definitely stronger than Plague. Plague not being A tier we agree on. But I feel like Nemesis will be A tier, or at the very least B+.
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@BananaBlooD95 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2223373#Comment_2223373
His power's hitbox could be twice the size and T3 max range could be 8m (so+3m) and he'd be a solid A tier.
I wouldn't mind if they increased the range a bit, although I do personally believe it is fine the way it is now. But I disagree with doubling the hitbox size, seeing as how fast he can whip out his tentacle, it should have a small hitbox. Otherwise, they'll just end up decreasing the speed at which you can attack with Nemesis tentacle.
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@BananaBlooD95 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2222420#Comment_2222420
"Even with the limited range it's still very strong." It's not just the range, it's the size. Demo's Shred or PH Punishment of the Damned are stronger. Demo also have mobility and PH can cage people. He is not as strong as people say he is, he's around PH & Demo.
I mean, I would argue PH and Demo aren't weak to be fair. Demo may not be quite viable for the top level of play but still.
I do think the hitbox can be a bit wonky at times, but in general the fact that it's not very wide just means you'll have to aim better. It's definitely a good thing seeing as how fast you can shoot it, so survivors do need some chance to avoid the attack. If it was as wide as demos shred or Pyramid Head's attack, it would be almost undodgeable, and that wouldn't be good.
His chase potential is definitely similar in strength to Pyramid Head and a bit better than Demo in my opinion, but he still has a bit more proper counterplay than Pyramid Head because his ability has such a narrow hitbox.
And yes, it's true that Demo has mobility and PH can cage people, but on the other hand, survivors might want to vaccinate against Nemesis, which wastes a bit of their time, and he has two zombies roaming the map that can apply some extra map pressure for Nemesis.
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@Tsulan said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2222390#Comment_2222390
Thats like calling Plague OP, because her ability exposes survivors that touch infected gens.
His power is everything but strong.
I don't even get this comparison. Could you please explain that comparison, cause it makes absolutely 0 sense to me.
His ability is very strong in chases since it can hit survivors over pallets and vaults. Even with the limited range it's still very strong.
Further more, there are two zombies in each match that can apply some nice, additional map pressure.
If survivors don't get vaccinated, they go down after two hits from Nemesis ability, but Nemesis will have a harder time tiering up his ability. If survivors do vaccinate, they waste a bit of time and getting hit by the ability of Nemesis gives him some more charge, but now they can take 3 hits instead of 2. So survivors are pretty much given the option what to do, with one not being necessarily better than the other in my opinion.
I wouldn't mind more encouragement for vaccinating, in fact the one change I would hope for, is to have Nemesis simply build up his tiers over time based on how many survivors are infected, and then increasing the amount of vaccinations on the map to 8 or something similar. But if they don't change that, I still think he'll be in a good spot.
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@Tsulan said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2222340#Comment_2222340
IF he gets his ability. So he has to choose between 3 hitting a survivor (does nobody see the issue here?) and not using his power.
But he has his power? Or am I misunderstanding something? He can use his ability even at tier 1, it just has slightly less range and can't break pallets. And you can still charge up your ability by killing zombies, even if that is a bit time consuming.
Also, 3 hitting is not a problem when considering how strong his ability is.
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@Tsulan said:
He´s a mid tier killer at best. His power can easily negated by decent survivors (getting bitten by zombies).
Since being infected has no negative effect for survivors, they will just stay infected during the whole game. Since he will stay on T1, he basically is a powerless m1 killer with 2 rng zombies that can or can not block small areas.
That's not quite true. His power is pretty strong even at tier 1, and survivors that are infected only need two hits of nemesis ability to go down, if they aren't infected, they will need 3 hits to go down. That can definitely have an impact seeing as his ability hits survivors over pallets and vaults.
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I really, really doubt it. Spirit and Nurse at the very least will be stronger, and arguably Blight as well. Maybe even a few other killers.
Just looking at the first few clips I would argue the survivors going against Nemesis weren't that great either. In Otz's clip, the survivor would have gone down no matter what, and in the clip of tru3 after that the survivor should have gone in the house, but that clip does show the potential of the zombies off. They definitely need to lose collision though after hitting a survivor for sure.
I believe he might already be in a pretty perfect spot balance wise, except for maybe a few design problems they could improve. He seems strong enough to be viable even at red ranks but not too powerful to be op or anything.
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Doubt it. Perhaps it is a way to test an idea for early game collapse though.
To be fair, the game is at a fairly decent spot balance wise at the moment, at least in my opinion. An impactful early game collapse that might even slow down the game will require many other balance changes to killers that might end up overpowered, to certain slow down perks, and the big ones of course, a nerf to tunneling and camping.
So I am still puzzled on how they would want to implement an actual early game collapse at all.
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@DetailedDetriment said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2218390#Comment_2218390
The autoban is the biggest issue. People will report others for anything. Flashlight? Reported. Mori? Reported. Key? Reported. SWF? Reported. It's going to be especially bad for streamers. If the feature goes live, then I can see the game dying in a couple of days.
Back to the zombies, it's going to be the same issue as Spirit. No counterplay. People hate going against Spirits because there is nothing they can do against her. Unless you're a quiet character or have Iron Will, then you're probably screwed. I'd honestly prefer for Nemesis to have control over the zombies. At least then you can plan accordingly to his actions, but for the AI just to walk out and block you feels cheap. It could even anger the killer to a certain point as they now have to hut the zombie. And if it's the same AI as the tutorial, then oh boy, get ready for a treat.
I didn't find anything beneficial from the stream, other than, again, boon totems.
Moris and keys are going to become base-line features. The new map is God awful. It's one of the worst in the game right now with the tight hallways of Hawkins combined with the God pallets of The Game.
The focus on Game Health is good, but I'm not expecting very much from it.
They only don't have counterplay when you are in a chase and they block off a loop. Which is very rare. Generally speaking they are pretty damn weak.
Perhaps if they hit you while you are injured, they shouldn't down you, but instead just incapacitate you for like 6 to 10 seconds or so. Otherwise I feel they are fine. I don't mind a bit of rng that is created by them, they definitely shake up the gameplay.
I do wish that killing them with a pallet would let you reset the pallet though. Otherwise in lower ranks survivors might end up with deadzones very fast.
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@Laluzi said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2216888#Comment_2216888
They don't do a lot compared to Plague's sickness, though. You can't transmit the T-virus to other players and you can be healed while sick, so it's mainly intermittent anti-stealth and not getting a freebie hit if you run into a zombie or get tentacle whipped. So basically a loss of a bonus health state that applies to specific actions... so the anti-stealth is the only part that really changes how survivors have to play. Either way, they're going to try to avoid all hits.
It's harder for Nemesis to infect players than Plague does (he can't infect objects they need to interact with and he needs to be in a close chase with a person to hit them, opposed to Plague being able to spray all over the place when she approaches several survivors.) I'm comfortable with where he is with the finite vaccinations right now - we'll see how the PTB pans out and if there's an issue.
(Though I was hoping we'd see more incentives to vaccinate, and the T-Virus would be a little more dangerous in thematic ways - like if you're moried/sacrificed when you'd been sick for a while, you spawn a zombie upon dying. Or late-stage infections cause you to make zombie moaning noises and it's confusing to your teammates, causing them to scatter away from you at first and masking the approach of actual zombies.)
I mean, the fact that you pretty much can take an extra hit when he uses his power is quite the incentive to use the vaccination. I understand your argument, but at the moment I would disagree,
I think survivors should have an constant incentive to vaccinate against the Nemesis. It creates this additional counterplay. His power is very strong and dangerous, I personally don't agree that it's harder to get survivors sick with the Nemesis than with Plague, since just one hit gets them infected. With the added bonus that the Nemesis can actually down survivors with his ability.
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@Mandy said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2216795#Comment_2216795
There's 4 vaccines
I feel like that's way too few. There needs to be much more, or an unlimited amount in my opinion. These vaccinations are what create a very interesting counterplay to Nemesis.
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That sounds pretty op in my opinion.
I actually really like the way he turned out. He is so much fun to play as, and even go against. Although those are my first impressions.
The only thing I would change at the moment is to have an unlimited amount of vaccinations for survivors, or at the very least increase the amount of vaccinations by a lot.
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Wait you can collect them even if you are not infected?
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It's too early to say. There is the possibility to dodge his tentacle attack, but it can be quite situational. Still, at the moment, I do believe he has a fair amount of counterplay.
Breaking the pallet with his power for example is faster than breaking it normally, but survivors can still get a bit of distance to him. It's certainly doesn't nullify the pallet drop, that's for sure.
We'll just have to wait and see. One counterplay that is very important is to get the injections if you are sick. I'm just not a fan of the idea that these injections have limited use. But there definitely needs to be a proper incentive to go for these injections instead of just gen rushing.
I do feel like the examples you give are always the worst case scenarios though to be honest.
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@CheyeneKL said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2216038#Comment_2216038
They actually CAN down you, too. I'd be less disturbed over them (even with the body blocking they're very capable of) if that wasn't the case, but they infect, injure, body block, camp gens, camp hooks (that one is lowkey hilarious though) and down you.
They do all of that very, very rarely though. They are very easy to avoid and not very dangerous at all.
Although fair enough, I wouldn't mind removing their ability to down a survivor. Maybe instead they could hold an injured survivor for like 3 or 4 seconds, or if they hit an injured survivor, it incapacitates them for like 5 seconds or so.
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@Gay_Police_Dept said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2216038#Comment_2216038
"they really get effective is when they chase survivors off of gens"
Yeah, that's also killer's job.
It's so situational though, it doesn't happen often at all. They really aren't that strong. It's a nice new idea for a killer.
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@Gay_Police_Dept said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2215588#Comment_2215588
They can easily catch you in narrow places, especially while you are being chased. It's like Trapper's traps, difference is that Trapper has to place them first. This new power just requires the killer to exist.
They aren't even compareable to Trappers Traps in power though. He can set up his traps where he needs them to be, and they can immediately down a survivor if the trapper gets to the trapped survivor fast enough. The zombies only infect a survivor, or injure them when they are infected, and they are very slow and easily avoidable.
The only time they really get effective is when they chase survivors off of gens or when they are at pallets while a survivor is being chased.
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@IlliterateGenocide said:
its litterly op, totems done in seconds, 20% stackable, really bvhr???
How is it op when it still has a rather situational usecase? Small Game is underpowered if anything, so a slightly more powerful small game won't be op in my opinion.
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@DapperTrapper said:
Why are survivors so scummy and take pleasure on making the killer miserable?
In their pretty little head the killer is this mindless evil NPC to defeat and not another human being playing the game?
Then again lookin at how many times you used "XD" I assume you're underage so that kind of mentality makes sense.
Dude it's a game, don't need to take everything so serious. It's just a little trick to get a killer equip a perk that becomes useless. People don't immediately want to make the killer miserable.
It goes both ways by the way. The idea that only survivor players can be toxic and try to ruin other players fun is beyond ridiculous.
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@BrokenSouI said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2168415#Comment_2168415
They can deal with it better, yes. But the ultimate way to pressure a killer is to spread out to 4 gens at 4 corners of the map. Even with something like freddy teleport..You can only do so much. If I come to a gen and find 3 people..And regress it via ruin or pop..That means other generators were not being worked on and that makes it so much easier. And that's not even counting if I have a shot at multiple hits..Instead of finding one person..Getting a hit..Chasing one person. While 3 other gens are being worked on
That's true, spreading out is the best strategy for survivors at the beginning. But the more mobility a killer has, the better the killer can get from one survivor to another, spreading the pressure even at the beginning.
Also, if the killer is good enough, and starts chasing the first survivor found, it will still very likely only result in two gens being done after the first hook, and that's where the killer starts to get much more pressure. Because it shouldn't take a good killer 80 seconds to down a survivor, so after you've got your first down, you can easily go to a different gen and prevent it from getting repaired. Unless of course survivors all spawn on different gens already, which luckily only happens very rarely. This is also why the first chase as killer is arguably the most important one, and if a survivor manages to outplay you too often during that first chase, that alone could cost you the entire game.
There are other aspects as well to take into consideration. If survivors all spread out to work on the four gens furthest away from each other, that would mean the remainig 4 gens are all closer to each other, which makes it easier to defend them as killer. Unless you get a crappy map like Cowshed or Mother's Dwelling. Although not sure if Cowshed is better now after the rework.
Then there is also the aspect that if all survivors are spread out on different gens, the survivor that is being chased is more likely to run to one of the areas where another survivor is repairing a gen, which will also force that survivor off of the gen. But that can be quite random, depending on whether the survivor has the ability to run somewhere where no one is working on a gen or not.
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I can't say I agree. The balance of the game has become increasingly better over time. It's too slow, but the progress that has be done is very good in my opinion. Killer is generally fairly doable now, unless you maybe get those insanely rare depip squads.
I would argue killers like Blight, Spirit, Oni, HIllbilly and others are definitely viable even against good swf teams. It's hard to win such matches even with those viable killers, but that's how it should be when the opposing team is very good.
Bugs are annoying though, I do not think there are more than in the past, but sadly, there aren't less either.
As for camping and tunneling, I agree it's ridiculously frustrating to go against, and one of the aspects of the game that really needs to be looked at the most. But I played 5 or 6 games yesterday, and only in one of them did I get a camping killer. The other games were all against killers that played normally.
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I think he is now actually viable, but I wouldn't consider him too powerful. He's in a great spot now in my opinion.
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Good question. I thought it just removes the sound survivors hear when the Demogorgon emerges from a portal in close range. I think within a range of 8 or 12 meters survivors can hear the Demogorgon emerging from a portal.
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@BrokenSouI said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2168329#Comment_2168329
I mean...That's literally every killer though
Not necessarily. The killers with good map pressure are usually able to deal with survivors that are spread out much better because they can get from one point to another much faster. Obviously if survivors play it well they'll still be able to get at least 3 gens done fairly quickly, but that's where the killer can start to turn the game around.