Xernoton
Xernoton
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To be honest, I still feel the euphoria when I think back to DH getting nerfed. 3 times. It's a bit mind boggling that they nerfed it 3 times and it remains a very decent perk, while they managed to make CoB useless with only one nerf.
MFT is ridiculous but it's less bs than DH was. It's not quite the same as "press E for distance and counter every killer's best mind games". It amazes me how some people tried to defend that. MFT is more of a constant drag.
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God forbid a killer is actually fun to play. Let's give him the Billy treatment, so people think thrice before playing him again.
Actually, let's give all killers but Legion the Billy treatment.
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Not bad so far. MMR obviously didn't quite hit the 50-60% kill rate sweet spot, but you getting 12 hooks on Sanctum of Wrath with Myers is impressive.
I would like to know which side had the incentive at the time. Would be interesting to see how the incentive on both sides impacts matchmaking but that would require us to repeat the whole experiment. I'm also not sure the event is the ideal time for an experiment like this as it can be quite time consuming and is obviously a huge advantage when you can completely ignore it.
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I'm with @Aven_Fallen on this one.
Everyone can decide what builds they wanna run for themselves. And if I feel like running an off-meta build, then I should have the right to do that. With more than 100 perks per side, seeing the same ones again and again gets old.
However, I will agree, that depipping is an outdated concept. It made sense back when grades decided over matchmaking but now not so much. It just feels bad when you have a rough match and the game gives you another punch in the face just in case you didn't realise that you lost.
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@FriendlyKiller said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3574464#Comment_3574464
The addon appeared in Wraiths inventory after I bought it on the bloodweb. When that didn't bring the other addons back I was like "nope later" and kept grinding the Halloween event. Today I selected Wraith again and the yellow addon was gone. I submitted a ticket expressing my confusion. More concerning is the fact some cosmetics are randomly missing. I'll wait for a response, I'm done with Haunted by Daylight, hopefully it's all still there when I log in again.😮💨
Best of luck, then. I hope this all clears out soon.
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@CountOfTheFog said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3574405#Comment_3574405
But wouldn't he have lost all his perks too in the old prestige days? And he would be P6 as they gave all P3 players an extra 3 levels of prestige.
Not necessarily. If he was P1 before the prestige rework, then it would set him to P3. You are right about the perks, but since the way these are unlocked changed too, it might be unnoticeable. Thank you for pointing it out though. This is another piece of information that I did not consider fully.
@FriendlyKiller said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3574405#Comment_3574405
That would make sense for my Oni, but my Wraith is prestige 9. Also when I noticed Wraiths addons missing I bought one yellow one thinking that might unglitch it. I took this picture just now and the yellow addon is gone.😳
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/LLMFMN89U72W/20231101-175751.jpg
This is indeed weird. Was the addon actually bought, or did the transaction not work (check the bloodweb again to make sure, please)? You could try and do one entire bloodweb just to see, if that might work. Also, as @CountOfTheFog pointed out, it would also be helpful, if we knew about the perks on your Wraith. Are there any perks unlocked on him? He should have all the teachables of any killer you prestiged at least once (or had the teachables unlocked before the prestige rework).
If these don't show up either, then we already know, that this is a bug and you might want to start a ticket to BHVR explaining the situation and asking for help. They should be able to solve this in some way.
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Could you give us a bit more information? Before the prestige rework (patch 6.1.0, 19 July 2022), you used to lose everything upon prestiging, so it might be you prestiged Oni before that. This would also make sense, seeing as your Oni is currently P3 level 1, so I assume you haven't put any more BP into him, since.
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Yes. No questions. PC players can use them, so why shouldn't console players be allowed to do the same?
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Do I get the 2016 survivors and killers too? That would be fun for a while. Imagine, if we could experience Billy in his best days again.
But honestly, what is your point? The game was unbalanded and it still is. Yeah, it has gotten better but playing killer is still pretty stressful.
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@HerInfernalMajesty said:
I’m not sure if I am remembering things correctly but when Ghost Face came out you were able to see where a Survivor was looking when they were on the generators. I think Survivor head movements were also more pronounced when crouched? Anyways I thought it was a neat feature. I do miss it.
PS: I remember the DH and DS days… lol
Did you really need to remind me of that? The horrors of DH hit validation are still fresh in my memories.
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@HugTechLover said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3573545#Comment_3573545
I agree. I get a plethora of survivors who DC / go next on hook.
This seems to have increased considerably. In 5 out of the 8 Billy games I had yesterday, someone disconnected. And I played with Shadowborn only.
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Xenomorph is a perfectly fine killer right now, although I would like to see what the actual 2.0 m/s speed for missed attacks would be like, since we never even got to test it (seriously BHVR, this wasn't one of your best moments). I played her earlier for a bit and it was a blast. Great mobility, great chase power, lots of room for mindgames on both sides and she feels amazing, now that her bugs are also fixed.
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@jesterkind said:
I've been enjoying it, personally.
There are parts I'd change for next year, but I certainly hope the general shape of this event comes back. If a few things were tweaked to be less abusable and the time investment on the killer side became less of an active detriment, it'd be a perfectly good event.
Agreed. I actually quite like it. The void looks amazing and the idea for this event is really nice. A few tweaks and it could be real great. Although I can't help but think, you need to do a bit much to get noticeably more BP out of a match. That could be dialed up a bit.
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There is no "one size fits all" approach to this, so you need develop the understanding and knowledge when to use what strategy. Every killer has a unique strength and (almost) every perk can help you in different ways.
With that being said, this is a list of steps that can help you out in finding the right strategy:
First: Identify the problem. Why is it, that you don't have any pressure on the survivors? Do your chases take too long? Is it your perks, that don't help? Is it, that you struggle with your killer? Did you make a blunder and lost your momentum? Is it a survivor perk that is giving you trouble? Do the suvivors play coordinated? Doing that allows you to not only pin point what is going wrong but also helps in creating a plan to deal with it.
Second: Analyse what causes the issue. Sometimes it's not enough to know what is giving you trouble. You also need to know how it is caused. For example you could struggle to end chases quickly because the survivors use certain exhaustion perks or run to strong set ups. Or your gens are getting done too fast because the survivors don't bother healing.
Third: Develop a plan. This is where it gets complicated. The first question I ask myself is: "Do I need to play into my strengths or compensate for my weaknesses?" You could very well find yourself in a situation where you have 1 person on a hook and 3 survivors on a gen with no way to stop them from finishing it because you lack the mobility. In this case it can help to (proxy) camp the hook. Let the survivors come to you and slow them down by doing so. In case the survivors last too long in chase because they always take you to a strong setup it can help to ignore that part of the map and focus on everything else. If it is caused by exhaustion perks, then zoning (forcing the survivor to run into more secluded or weaker areas of the map) or baiting out the exhaustion perk, dropping chase and reengage the moment they get back on their gen can help greatly. Survivors and killers are mostly creatures of habit. If they do something once, then chances are they'll do it again.
Fourth: Execute the plan. You know what you want to do to fix the issue. Now all that's left is to do that. This is easier said than done however because you need to adjust your course of action on the spot. This is something that only comes with experience. A general approach on how to find strategies that work in different situations is trial and error. Don't be affraid to go for an ambitious play. It might work out. And if it doesn't, then you'll know what to look out for the next time you try it.
Fifth: Reevaluate and assess. Did your plan work? Did it help at least a little? Why did or didn't it work? How has your situation changed? Did you learn something? These are some general pointers that will make it easier for you to progress.
The most important thing when you play killer is to stay calm. I cannot count the times I've had a rough match and was still able to make a comeback. Remember, the game isn't over until it's over. When you feel yourself getting frustrated, then close your eyes, count to 10, take a deep breath and continue playing. It might sound stupid but it can make the difference. You'd be surprised how many times survivors basically beg you to take advantage of their mistakes when you don't let yourself get taunted.
I posted this a while back on Steam as a response to a very similar question. Hope some of this helps.
Good luck and see you in the fog.
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I was recently pointed towards it and was even provided with a video of someone still doing it. I didn't believe it at first but she still is a 3genning monstrosity. Guess I can keep calling her Caitlyn 3Genner after all.
It would already help tremendously, if they reworked the Shotgun Speakers, since they are mostly what ties this whole thing together. If that wasn't a thing, then she had no way to apply that kind of slow down to survivors, who can actually hit the skill checks (which is a bit challenging at first but quite manageable overall) without getting downs. Something that would easily require her to leave her 3gen.
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1 addon < 2 addons? Shocking.
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Mayhaps.
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@Mandy said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3573533#Comment_3573533
To give an example, every map with every killer - bugs can occur that then need fixing. It's not as simple as with shadowborn which is a set fov - it's adjustable so all those adjustments need to be checked. Some killers also have a fov increase, Legion in Frenzy for example so it has to be worked into that as well.
Thank you. This definitely helps understanding of why a FOV slider is more complex than Shadowborn as a base kit mechanic.
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@Pulsar said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3573185#Comment_3573185
So, what it's been a little over a month?
Honestly, not sure what you're expecting. This is BHVR, they do not move fast.
I'd say, realistically, you might be able to get it before 2024
Careful. You don't wanna hear everyone calling you a liar because you said it might come before 2024. You know how this community can get.
It would be nice though, if they told us a bit more about how it is coming along and when we might expect it the very earliest. Just so that we know not to go too crazy before that.
@Mandy said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3573402#Comment_3573402
Sorry that you think that way.
But that's not how it works, it's not decided on whether something affects survivors or killers, but the feature itself. There's more work that has to go into this than you possibly realise. Which is why we confirmed in the original AMA where we discussed this first that it's not something that we're able to put into the game immediately, these things take time, they take a lot of testing and as you might be aware, there's other content that's going into the game as well which also takes a large amount of testing and bandwidth from various other departments.
However much you would love things to be killer or survivor sided, sorry that's not the way it is.
Could you tells us a bit more about what exactly it is that needs all that careful testing, or potential issues? Because, respectfully, from my (admittedly very uneducated) perspective, it seems rather simple. Add a FOV slider, that allows players to scale their own FOV in either fixed numbers or freely.
But of course I am not a programmer, so I cannot possibly see all the potential problems. I reckon many of us would be more understanding, if we had a better idea of what it is that actually needs to be tested so thoroughly.
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@Rudjohns said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3572411#Comment_3572411
in some maps its really hard
you probably don't play survivor
I do. So I know, that it's really not that difficult for me. But I know that I can't take myself as the standard, so I asked a simple question.
I could be blind the entire game on Lery's (which is the only map that sometimes confuses me) and I'd still make it to the unhook. 60 seconds is more than enough time to get that survivor and with the updated HUD, which is also not affected by Blindness (not a bad thing, just saying), you'll always know, if someone else is coming or not. So you'll also know, if you need to go or not.
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For me it's the all the different characters in one game. Where else will you see Laurie Strode, Ada Wong, Ash Williams and Nicholas Cage teaming up against Freddy Krueger, Nemesis, Leatherface, Pyramid Head or Xenomorph? Where else will you see some random guy in a white shirt come out of a locker to teabag Amanda Young? Where else will you see Ghostface chasing a random girl in a pink bunny sweater through Haddonfield and teabag her after slashing his knife across her back before taking a selfy with her, where some random dude shows up to pop his butt into the picture? That is all real. These are all things that happen in this "horror" game. 😂
Also, I like all the little things you can do in this game to throw off your opponent. Pretend to go left, then go right, turn 360°, teabag and DH before dropping a pallet. I'm pretty sure there is no other game where this is considered crazy good gameplay. 😄 Killers have their own equivalents.
Some of DBD's older realms have a distinct feeling to them. As much as I dislike some of the McMillans gameplaywise, I cannot deny that they do have a special kind of feeling to them. Same for the Azarov's maps. Even after their reworks they kept some of their original flair. Sadly, this is getting more and more rare as BHVR rework maps. The new maps all look kind of generic to me. Like they could be in any other game and I wouldn't notice, that they should be in DBD.
The community despite all its downs is also pretty cool. So many passionate people about a game that we all love and hate at the same time. But there are also many good things that come out of this community. Like Burger King Myers, Shirtless Myers, Locker Dwight (god, they are cute), Bunny Feng and the other many, many, many memes. Even the discussions on this forum, which for the most part are very reasonable.
I also love these games, when both sides are about even in terms of skill and loadout and can all agree on a good match. Sometimes I'll have the most wholesome post game interactions with a bit of genuine advice here and there as well as some nice words after a tough game. I try to spread that same kind of positivity but of course it won't always work or be understood in the way I meant it. All the better when it does.
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Of course, but it is not like controller players will ever have the freedom of those that M&K. More optimising is always good but no amount of polishing will make Trickster and Huntress great to play on console. Not without some kind of aim lock / auto aim, which would be unfair.
I do hope they'll put some more work into optimising the game on platforms but we need to set realistic expactions of what is actually achievable.
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@Akumakaji said:
Spooky Loops did a fun killer challenge, recently.
Go from Ash 4 to Iri 1 with the same general build and no add-ons. If any survivors escape (your choice if hatch counts), that killer dies and can't be used again that challenge.
Once you reach Gold grades, no more slugging for tactical reasons is allowed, all downed survivors must be picked up and hooked immediately (hitting one when they bunch up or try to go for flashlight safes is allowed, though).
Once you reach Iri grades, no perks are allowed at all.
Good luck.
Spicy. I like it.
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@NODD3RS said:
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=v4r0Bn0VVmE
this build, or stbfl, noed, unrelenting, rapid brutality huntress. Or insidious wraith with Coulrophobia, sloppy butcher , and plaything with the terror radius while cloaked addon. Have fun :D
The Wraith build proved suprisingly effective against a group that started teabagging me the second I first went after them. 4k at 4 gens left. Next up is Doctor!
@JPLongstreet said:
Trickster or Singularity on my Xbox with the mighty controller 🎮🎮
Whatever perks & add-ons you desire.
I don't have a Xbox but I do own a controller. So I'll give it a go.
@Rulebreaker said:
Because we haven't seen one in a few months try this:
Trickster
Perks: Any but must not have more than 2 gen regression perks (we're sick of seeing 4 regression perks on everything)
Add ons: trick blades and your choice (recommend Edge of Revival for the party feel)
Offering: Any (recommend indoor map because funny to us)
Conditions:
You can only hook someone downed by your blades
You can only hit survivors by ricochet with your blades (or explosions with Edge of Revival)
No unreasonable tunneling or camping (survivors being stupid is fair game)
Have fun
That's a good one. I'll do that once I have the Trick Blades addon again. I didn't level this killer once since the prestige rework.
@HugTechLover said:
Burger King blight, no m1 allowed.
I assume Burger King Blight is simply the meme addon, correct? I'll give it a go.
@caipt said:
Get a 4k as nurse without blinking, no matchbox/spasmodic breath
The best I managed in the past was a 3k. But I'm happy to try again. Let's prove how overpowered Nurse is, when you can get a 4k without using her power!
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@TeleportingTurkey said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3572592#Comment_3572592
it wouldnt be.
I already said that EMPs dont have any vertical limit. Height limit is literally only a thing singularity himself has to deal with
Whoops. Sorry.
Then I really don't know. Maybe they thought biopods might be somewhat hard to see (but even that is a reach). That's kind of stupid, honestly.
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@Archol123 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3572575#Comment_3572575
If you compare dbd to other online games you can easily see that people always get better at the the more time passes, look at Dota or Starcraft for example if you look at how bad even the top teams for example at TI played 5-6 years ago compared to now then you can easily imagine that across all players the same thing happened, and that is exactly my point here, people just were not that good to realise it (same with item choices in Dota for example)... Also I don't see how it is not the same game anymore? Because there were patches? Because new content got added? That would be the same for every game...
It is fairly easy to tell if people have improved... There more than enough gameplay videos from two years ago you can look and compare them to how the same people play these days, or look at old tournament videos... You can easily see whether or not the overall level has increased.
I would let that fly, if DBD was still in its early days. But after 5 years people definitely know how the game works. This doesn't mean that players individually don't improve but overall nothing much changes in that regard. That's how I see it. Because not everyone keeps playing the game. Some players leave and some players come back / are lured into the fog.
To say that 2 years ago, we didn't understand the game enough to see, if perks were good or bad is outrageous. Just look for how long the second chance meta lasted. And when Mikaela was released with good ol' Circle of Balance everyone used that too. On the PTB we immediately saw that CoH was way too strong (healing was faster than the killer's hit cooldown). There are also perk and killer rankings from back then. And they changed gradually as the game changed not because they understood the game better.
Even competitive players go with the time and change their strategies. The one thing that might be comparable (the chase) was also impacted by many changes like 6.1.0's killer base kit buffs, map reworks, perk changes, killer buffs / nerfs and to a degree even survivor animations, if we look back far enough.
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I guess it could be kind of hard to disable them with EMPs, if they removed it but I'm not really sure.
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@Archol123 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3572470#Comment_3572470
Exactly not, because they didn't realise it was good... That's the point... You are still missing the point... It is not a good perk because it shows you what you already can see, where certain map tiles are, it is a good perk because it shows you what pallets are still available, which you just cannot know from a distance.
I disagree on the second part as well, people were way worse 2 years ago xD
Unpopular opinion: People can think for themselves and while content creators do have an impact, they don't create the meta. The recent Otzdarva video where he talks about "problematic" perks is a pretty good example for that. Many of us disagree with most of what said in this video and Otz is pretty much as influential as it gets when it comes to DBD because he has the biggest platform.
Pre 6.1.0 DH was not used so much because content creators constantly told everyone to use it but because it was ridiculously overpowered. It had literally no counterplay when used for distance. By now there are also some content creators, that suggest survivors run anti tunnel perks again because they aren't quite so bad as some would like you to think. Yet, no DSs or OTRs in most games. Almost as if people would run whatever the hell they want.
The complaints about MFT started the moment we saw the what it did. By that time there weren't even any videos about it yet. But people already knew how strong it was. Demi is another popular content creator, who plays with a lot of different niche builds, that are pretty powerful, when everything works perfectly and pretty bad when they fail. You will often find him claim that these builds are "broken" or "overpowered" but everyone understands that they are very situational and overall more fun than powerful.
It's pretty much impossible to tell, if players have really improved over the last 2 years. Personally, I think it's about the same as it has been before. Survivors make less stupid mistakes, not because they play overall better but because the game gives them way more information to tell when something might be the wrong choice. The game has changed quite a bit in that time and any comparison would require us to define 2 entirely different norms to even get an idea of how good players actually were at the time, which already affects the integrity of any results we could get. Basically, it is impossible to tell because this is not the exact same game it was 2 years ago, which means a 1 to 1 comparison would not work and any attempt to fix that would further falsify the results.
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@Archol123 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3572411#Comment_3572411
In the end it is still mostly player skill, you can communicate as much as you want, if the individual players cannot last a bit in chase it is worthless...
You should just look back to the history of this game to see how bad people played like 2-3 years ago and how even worse they played even with literal infinites and what not... I totally think it could be just that.
Then by that logic, WoO should have been the most used perk for years. Because it allowed (and still does) players to bridge quite a lot of the skill gap between good and bad players. But that wasn't the case. It would also mean, that as time goes on and players supposedly get better overall, WoO becomes more and more obsolete and its pick rate would drop. But that's not the case either.
Most people 2 years ago knew just as well how to play the game as they do know. Maybe even better because back then there weren't as many demands for base kit perks (people understood that not running a perk would mean they couldn't capitalise on it), but that is material for a different discussion.
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@Archol123 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3572372#Comment_3572372
Or did people just find out that knowing exactly how far away a certain tile is can be quite usefull? Also I think a few content creators changed their mind about WoO not being useless and therefore they might have impacted the pickrate as well.
But the devs are working on closing the gap between solo and swf so we will see if it stays the way.
Windows basically does nothing for swf, they can call out everything over voice, same for perks like bond or kindred, so I don't agree on that part at all.
And you want me to believe that this happened out of the blue? 5 years into this game's life cycle and 3 years into the perk's? Seems unlikely. Or like a convenient guess.
No matter how much work they put into it, the hierarchy will stay. The only thing they can do is bringing solo queue and SWF a bit closer together. But then they'd also have to deal with a new issue. The fact that SWFs have such a big advantage, that balancing killers around that, is a catastrophy waiting to happen.
@Rudjohns said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3572353#Comment_3572353
you cant see hooked survivors with blindness
You can. You still see that giant bubble in the distance. If that is not an indication, that something is going on over there, we are not talking about an issue with Blindness anymore but about an issue with the player, that can't identify very obvious clues.
The fact that you don't see the survivor themself makes little difference. How hard is it to remember the hooked survivor's location for a while?
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@Archol123 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3572353#Comment_3572353
But windows also serves as a solo queue perk becaue even players that know the map already don't know which tiles have been used already by a teammate so it help them keep track of where they can bring the killer... Which brings us back to my initial claim that blindness hurts solos more than swf, because if you have coms you don't need to see the aura your teammates can tell you which pallet they already used...
However did people play without WoO, I wonder. Solo queue is not a new thing and neither are the issues that come with it. The old Windows of Opportunity did that too. You do not need permanent aura vision on your surroundings to know, which pallets have been dropped / destroyed. Even with a cooldown you can still look around and see where to go. But it wasn't used back then. Almost as if this was just a strawman to defend a crutch perk.
The game has never been balanced around SWFs. It will always be the hierarchy of SWF, then killer, then solo queue. And solo queue can perform perfectly fine still. Just as a full blown SWF on coms can easily lose to a Trapper with no perks, if they screw up big enough. Almost every single perk in the game either works better in a SWF (even WoO because SWFs use longer chase times more effectively and can communicate set ups) or is a bigger disadvantage for solo players. The same goes for every killer. Are we going to remove all perks, addons and offerings as well as all killers, so that solo queue and SWF can be equally strong?
The point is, you'd need to break / change the metric to achieve that. But this is not an option as it would also completely break the game's balance or mean we'd arbitrarily enforce a certain result.
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@rvzrvzrvz said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3572000#Comment_3572000
it's not enjoyable either as killer when you're forced to hard tunnel or lose, it takes away from my enjoyment of the game it's not only a survivor problem
example i'm in a good mood I decide to play nice> lose> get tbagged at exit gate, then next game I play stronger killer with meta build/hard tunnel to take revenge, but that team was playing more chill they all die at 4 gens, I play a lot of solo q so I can't help but feel bad for them, it's endless cycle of toxicity
even killers playing nice against me usually lose badly with 3-4 escapes, I don't like that spreading hooks should be more viable
Agreed. We have come from a meta, that made tunneling a high risk, high reward strategy to one, that makes tunneling the go-to for (almost) every killer. When it should be the other way around. The only way to work against this, is a carrot and stick approach. There need to be more tools against tunneling and incentives to spread hooks.
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@Archol123 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3572292#Comment_3572292
Blindless also removes the ability to see hooked or slugged survivors my man, which is why knock out and third seal are so annyoing to go against.
You do see bond or kindred from time to time, Windows of Opportunity came in the meta not that long ago...
It doesn't for hooked survivors. I'll let you in on a little secret. When there is a huge bubble on your screen and someone is hooked at the same time, then you can deduce that this is the hooked survivor's location. Blindness will not remove this bubble. You still know exactly where to go. Well, as long as you can be bothered to pay the least bit of attention and don't actually fall asleep. Oh and you'll need to remember that for the next few seconds while you play a thrilling game of "holding M1 and pressing Space every once in a while".
For slugging, you can make the argument that Blindness helps. That's true. But you know what's also true? You can keep track of the killer and you can see when someone goes down. So you still have a pretty good idea where the slugged survivor is. The only killers that can really capitalise on this are the same killers that dominate anyway. Because they need to traverse the map and down survivors quicker than they can get up. Again, this is a problem with the very strongest killers. A Myers will not suddenly teleport across the map, Blight rush to get near you and activate tier 3 in the process just so he can slug you.
I can't remember the last time I actually saw someone (other than myself) using Bond. Even Kindred isn't all that popular. WoO has slowly gained popularity since its buff all the way back in patch 5.3.0. One of the reasons it wasn't quite as popular is, that survivors only had 4 perk slots, one of which was used for BT, one for DH, one for DS and one for something else. Then, we headed into a healing meta, where looping didn't matter all that much either. Now we have a chase perk meta and WoO needly fits in there.
Third Seal has, as I said before, been in the game for way longer than most of us have played. It was never a good perk though. Because Blindness is not a big deal when survivors don't rely on aura vision, which they don't for the most part. You really see the difference when a player has WoO and when they don't due to Blindness. WoO does not serve its supposed purpose anymore. People that rely on it do not learn maps because there is simply no need to. But when this fails, they crumble. So Blindness is in a weird spot, where it is way too strong because it gives survivors a huge handicap in deactivating a crutch perk, that some can't play without, but it's also pretty weak because survivors can just as well play without it. A noob stomper if you will. Though, even some very experienced use it.
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@C3Tooth said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3572045#Comment_3572045
Finding a survivor to start a chase is also something that need to learn.
Lethal pursuit helps new killers to start first chase early. And thats an entire perk. UW does almost same thing, with a “weak” side ability that deny over 20 survivor perks.
Overall, the only killers using this perk are high speed one like Wesker/Blight. They start a chase right after the scream. Just no react time. Trapper using this perk does not really matter beside Blindness.
Lethal Pursuer is a fix to a problem as old as the game itself. Spawns. Tell me, how do you know which direction to go to when you spawn in the middle of the map? Or when you find yourself on Haddonfield, where spawns are about as random as it gets? The game does not give the killer any extra time to find their first survivor, when it clearly messed up. When a killer loses the first gen before they can get into a chase just because they got unlucky, that is not something, that they can learn to circumvent. But it does leave them with a severe disadvantage, that the game does neither consider, nor compensate for. That's why Lethal Pursuer fixes a problem, that no amount of skill and knowledge could ever fix.
Blindness was never an issue before. And it definitely wasn't for a lack of ways to apply this status effect. Third Seal for example has been in this game for longer than most of us have played. Yet, it sucks. Because Blindness has only one single use. To deactivate WoO. What other aura perks do survivors commonly use? That's right, none.
Are we really going to nerf a perk, that is fine because the very strongest killers in the game are too good with it? Again? This has happened and if I recall correctly most of us agreed, that nerfing Awakened Awareness because Nurse was / is too strong was not a smart move. I guess it's also time to nerf Lethal Pursuer, BBQ, Pop, Pentimento, Nowhere To Hide, Discordance, Floods Of Rage, Pain Res etc. then?! Because all of these perks are much better when you use them on a killer that is already strong. Nevermind, that even STBFL, a perk that is widely considered a helping hand for weaker killers, is stronger on Spirit than it is on Trapper. The stronger the killer, the more use they can get out of each perk. It's called scaling.
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They really messed up on Mother's Dwelling. The graphics are objectively better than before but I prefered the old version still. The new is this kind of green-greyish hue that looks nice at first but gets really old and kind of ugly later. The gameplay wasn't all that great to begin with but at least it didn't screw every killer in roster.
Now, even Blight and Billy look at this map and cry. Blight can work, if you know exactly how to hit every one of those trees and Billy is just straight up depressing. Mother's Dwelling used to be one of his better maps but now it's among the worst. The chainsaw isn't worth much, if you need to stop and rev again 3 times before you finally make it to the other side. A M1 killer can walk that distance in almost the same amount of time. The loops became stronger too, which really wasn't necessary.
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@Annso_x said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3571913#Comment_3571913
WoW is a crutch because it gives info you can have easily but UW isn't because it gives very important information the killer doesn't have ? what kind of logic is that lol ?
If UW is fine because "the killer will find you anyway" how is WoW not fine because survivors know the loops anyway ? Also because chases aren't about "if" the survivor will get caught but "how long" does it take we might as well start the game with them on the hook, you know, just to speed the process up a bit.
Tracking and finding survivors is literally half of the killer's job, and UW reduces it to opening a locker and basically denies any stealth, so yes it's a problem.
And a perk that does half your objective for free is definitely more of a crutch than one which lets you know where your teammates dropped pallets.
One perk is a manual on how to play the game, the other helps the killer to get into the next chase slightly quicker. Guess which one UW is.
The thing is, that survivors don't know the loops. That's exactly why WoO is a crutch. It bridges the skill gap of people that do know maps and people that don't. And when maps are such an issue because most of them are stacked to the point where pre dropping and the occasional visit to shack can easily delay most killers to get a hit for way longer than it should take to get the down, then that is a problem. One that will never be fixed, let's be honest. This discussion is about as old the game itself but nothing has changed in that regard.
A survivor can NEVER, under no circumstances, in no possible set up, in any timeline or different universe be equal to the killer when it comes to the chase! The moment that happens, is the exact moment the killer role becomes pointless. Survivors naturally have an advantage in their number. If the killer doesn't have the upper hand when these numbers are negated, then there is no possible way a killer should ever be able to perform even remotely ok. Especially not with SBMM. The killer will down you eventually, because that is how it has to be, when you want to achieve some kind of balance. The question is never, "if" the killer can get a down but "when" (which slowly seems to change and a problem on its own). And this is where WoO and UW come into the equation.
The killer will make their way across the map, open a locker and then have UW, which will activate when they get close enough to a survivor. But since survivors work on gens, the killer has a pretty good idea where they will find the survivors anyway. So they'll make their way to one out of the 7 gens and when they hear, that that gen has progress, they also know that someone was around that area before. Ultimate Weapon doesn't tell the killer which gen to go to but the direction the survivor is in. This can help when survivors try to hide around the gen or run early on. But the effect is only a decrease in time until the killer finds that survivor. The chase will happen, no matter, if the killer has UW or not. I don't know which game you have played up until now but in my games the bulk of the killer's work happens in their chases and the way they play around the map. Not finding a survivor. That is the bare minimum that a killer has to do. Why do you think info perks are a thing to begin with? So, that you can focus on what is actually your objective. I'm sure the pink Bunny Feng and Neon Nea as well as Gabriel and Ace with his golden tux care a loooot about stealth. That must be why survivors play so aggressive these days and don't try to avoid the killer. Hiding in plain sight.
WoO on the other hand will lead to things that otherwise wouldn't happen. When a survivor has no clue where to go and they run into a dead zone, then that is their mistake and they pay for it. When a survivor has WoO, that can't happen. It eliminates the potential for a survivor to make such a mistake and it also shows the survivor how to get to certain loops, which one is the shortest path and (this is the most scary) how much they actually have to work with. So they will be less likely to take any risks and instead play in the most boring and safe way possible. The same way comp players do. A whole lot of pre drops and a bit of good old fashioned Shift + W. A new player should always play distinctly different from a veteran player, just as a bad player should play different from a good player. WoO bridges that gap. That is why I refer to it as a crutch. The old version of WoO told you where your team mates had dropped pallets too. Yet, that one was too weak. Funny how that works, isn't it?
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It's kind of unnecessary though. Yeah, it would be nice to see them more engaged with their own community but it wouldn't make much of a difference. For the most part, they let us discuss things here and only intervene sparsely, which probably isn't a bad thing.
The more the devs control the discussions on this forum, the less natural each discussion becomes, which in turn has an impact on any useful information they take away from them.
It would be nice though, if there were an extra section "ask the devs" where they would basically have AMA's every so often. I'd prefer that to the ones on Reddit.
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There are consequences. If the killer tunnels, they have a much higher chance to win the game.
If these aren't the consequences you want, then too bad. Because that is where we are. I don't like it either, because hook spreading should be the go-to strategy but when that is heavily disincentivised and punished by the game itself, survivor perks and survivor play styles, how do you expect anything else? 4 chase perks per survivor means, that they are almost equal to a killer in the 1v1. That forces, the killer to focus on the 4v1. And eliminating 1 survivor early is about the biggest advantage a killer can get in the 4v1.
You get no advantage for playing nice, you get no extra BP (less because you are more likely going to lose) and you feel stupid because you do it to yourself. This is why tunneling is so common. But of course, we are only talking about punishing killers for playing in a way that survivors don't like.
All of what I said above can also be used for camping.
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@Annso_x said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3571574#Comment_3571574
Yes, UW does the same thing as the doctor's static blast (with half the cooldown and the effect lingers and moves with the killer).
It's as if a perk and an killer's kit aren't supposed to give you the same value.
That's news to me. I have never noticed, that other killers can now use UW to get survivors into madness tier 3 (which is what good Doctor players mostly use it for). That's crazy.
Seriously though, UW is nothing but a strawman and a counter to WoO. The killer will find you anyway. UW just speeds up the process by a bit. And Blindness is the weakest status effect in the game. It is mostly useless because survivors don't need to see any auras. As long as they aren't using everyone's favorite crutch perk, that is. Seriously, how hard can it be to remember the nearest pallet or window, that you saw with WoO?
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@XshyguyX said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3571009#Comment_3571009
You say this.. butni legit feel the change. Why is that that?
It is called the "Placebo Effect". You think something is different, therefore it feels different.
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Definitely not the weakest but he is quite inconsistent. There are maps where his active ability power will barely help him like Lery's but there are also maps Dead Dawg where a good chain can easily end the chase.
Something that very good Pinhead players do is charge their power so that they can hit a survivor from the direction they are running in. This can make it much harder for the survivor to break the chains by using obstacles.
The box can also be pretty powerful, if you know how to play around it. Once you start chaining it, the survivors can barely progress the game and you always have an extra edge in chase.
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I saw someone say that female survivors vault slower again. Is that actually true? I didn't notice it yet.
Edit: Oh my lord, it's actually true. It's a good time to be an Ace main.
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@Emeal said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3570513#Comment_3570513
I doubt it is as simple as that, and even if it was a necessary evil I doubt bHVR would want to play with the Perk namely because of that.
The only thing DS needs now is perhaps to put the Killer's Power on a Cooldown to allow it to be useful against Blight/Nurses.
That's something I've also thought about and it would definitely get the job done. Regardless of what route they go, I think buffing DS would overall be a good choice.
Knowing that survivors have no protection against tunneling, be that because they don't use any anti-tunnel perks or because they are so weak that they barely slow the killer down, will always have negative implications. When DS was still a 5 seconds stun and it was in every game, I considered tunneling to be way more risky. And I would say back when I played really serious, DS prevented me from tunneling quite a bit.
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@jesterkind said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3570660#Comment_3570660
Well, sure, but it's also used for the unranked modes. It's just how normal matchmaking works, as far as I could figure out- I googled around a bit after DBD added MMR to better understand the topic.
Ok. Good to know. I wasn't sure how matchmaking is typically handled outside of ranked modes. Thanks for enlightening me.
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@lav3 said:
Female survivors vaults are broken again.
Really? How?! I am dying inside.
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It was never meant to end camping. It wasn't even meant to make to make it impossible to down the unhooker immediately as far as I know.
It does a good job of disincentivising the killer to stay right next to the hook to try and prevent unhooks. The hooked survivor will get off the hook as long as their team mates don't ignore them, which is exactly the point.
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I'm indifferent about it. I didn't care about prestige anyway and for me it didn't seem like too many killers were dodging lobbies.
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@jesterkind said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3570630#Comment_3570630
What makes you say that? I don't see anything in the game that I'd consider a hallmark of a ranked mode. I guess you could argue the grade system is kinda-sorta like a ranked ladder's placement ranks, but considering it isn't used for matchmaking and it isn't visible to other players, I don't think it really counts.
Curious what you mean, sincerely.
Isn't MMR typically used for ranked modes?
@TheSubstitute said:
I'd add a requirement that every player has to spend at least a few games on both sides so players could understand what the other side is like. My aim would be to decrease toxicity and increase empathy (or, at least, recognize there is another human being playing the other side in a match).
I think that's not a bad idea. But instead of forcing people to play both sides I'd suggest having them play 5 games on each side to earn good chunk of BP and maybe shards (maybe 500k BP and 6k iri shards, that they can use for the shrine).
If people don't want to play either side for whatever reasons, then that is fine. Maybe they want to play with their friends and not allowing them to do that sounds wrong to me. But adding an incentive to give it a go would probably have the desired effect.
@dbdthegame said:
Make Autohaven and Macmillan the only two realms in the game.
Now, that is a drastic change!
Not saying it's good or bad but definitely drastic!
@Shroompy said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3570223#Comment_3570223
Only allowing certain realms to be played by certain killers
This would avoid situations like Billy being sent to Lerys, or Dredge on Swamp.
But what if I want to go for the most painful experience known to man? 🥺 Billy on Lery's such a unique feeling.
You really feel like you just want to throw your chainsaw after that damn Nea, that just vaulted 1,000,000 windows in your first chase.
@fussy said:
Add "What if" mode, where we will test some funny or interesting and crazy idea/things for 1 or 2 weeks. Maybe even do some balance changes on stats after.
For example:
- No aura perks for week
- No exhaustion perks for week
- All 4.4 killers are 4.5
- Some new mechanics, like on events
- Killers and survivors see each other auras 5 seconds, when match begins
- Matches only with random perks
- No scratch marks and terror radius week (my favourite one)
I have million ideas, but it never will come live sadly, cause BHVR need months or even years to change one symbol in perk's code, i don't expect they do something like this.
Sounds fun, honestly.
What's wrong with the new UI?
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@Emeal said:
cause you could abuse it with Head on to stun the Killers for 7 to 8 seconds.
Buffing it wont stop tunneling.
Agreed. 5 seconds DS would not stop tunneling but it would disincentivise it a bit. When survivors use perks to be strong in every situation but tunneling that of course means killers will utilise this weakness.
DS was a necessary evil. Evil because its pick rate was pretty high and necessary because tunneling is objectively stronger than spreading hooks. Buffing it back 5 seconds might mean that more people use it, which in turn would make killers consider the threat of DS a bit more and lower the amount of tunneling overall.
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I would phrase it a bit different.
Break Down is badly designed perk. It either does nothing or it is extremely unhealthy.