TheSubstitute
TheSubstitute
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@Starrseed said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2693456#Comment_2693456
I totally understand but by giving very unfair matchups like a team all 3k+ hours against me with 150h will also drive players out
That is 100% true. BHVR has opened up to new platforms so the number of new users have gone up but I don't know if they pay attention to player retention rates which would better indicate the long term trajectory of the game.
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(1) Twins
(2) Hillbilly
(3) Hag/Deathslinger (Tie)
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I find the crawling at 10 meters a second or whatever it is hack funny when they stop when they notice the killer is watching. Yes, if you can crawl away at the same top speed of a Lamborghini I, for sure, won't notice that you're cheating. Definitely.
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@ohheyitsbobcat said:
Something I haven't seen brought up yet is the genre and age rating as a defense for BM and I think I'll play devils advocate here.
DBD is a horror game that is rated 17+ meaning that only adults or people close to adults should be playing it. While kids will still play it, I think that's more on the parents to ensure their kid(s) are mature enough for the content and to understand what comes with it and if they should speak to them about what is happening.
Secondly, the horror genre is supposed to invoke negative feelings. It wants to scare, repulse, shock, anger, etc their audience. To make them feel tense, to bring up a sense of anxiety and panic. Considering how much BM effects some people I would consider it to fit into the horror aspect of DBD. Just as some people can handle watching a body get mutilated and others would faint at the mere thought, I think BM fits into the same sort of category. Some people can handle it with no reaction while others can't and it's up to each person to understand their limits and take proper action. To either understand it's not inherently real or to separate ones self from it when they've been pushed too far.
While a different argument could and maybe should be made for kids games or other genre's, DBD is again, a 17+ horror game. I think standard BM is par the course.
I think the horror genre is a great argument for getting rid of BM. Until you can show me a scene where, when confronted with an invulnerable , knife wielding maniac, the cops started tbagging Micheal Myers in Halloween, BM breaks the fourth wall and ruins the horror atmosphere.
It just turns out, as opposed to a hail of bullets, what was really needed to stop Micheal was someone one-quarter Michael's size armed with a piece of wood.
BMing brings nothing to the game and detracts from it. It should go.
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@StarLost said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2691014#Comment_2691014
Would you happen to have that study on hand?
I really enjoy reading stuff like that.
Sure, here it is. I hope you find it interesting.
http://gamestudies.org/2004/articles/deslauriers_iseutlafrancestmartin_bonenfant
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Killer
1. BBQ and Chili. I like BP.
2. Surveillance. I find it extremely useful.
3. I don't really have a third favorite overall. I try a lot of different builds.
Survivor
1. We're Gonna Live Forever. Same reason as BBQ and Chili
2. Mettle of Man. It's a total meme perk and 9/10 times totally ineffective but, on the very rare occasions it does work it's a lot of fun.
3. I don't really have a third either.
Both number one picks are pretty much guaranteed to be on anybody I run regardless of the secondary effect is any use to that character or not. Number two shows up occasionally but is less often than not and three depends on what I'm trying to do.
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Casual. It's a video game I pay to play. If my revenue depended on it I would be a lot more competitive but hobbies are there to reduce stress, not add stress.
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@BadLooperQ said:
Idk why some killers have a problem with toxic survivors. Just let then be. When I play against toxic one's I usually don't even chase them, they want attention and they won't get from me.
About tbagging or clicking flashlight at the gate, well, I think it became a meme at this point, If it gets you, I consider changing roles for a bit. If the team was a swf full of flashlight coordination,DS's, BT's and so on and I lose 4 people, I Just move away from the gates and look for things to gain more BP for me rather than giving Chase points for them.
And idk if it's because I play solo q on low mmr right now but killers tend to be way more toxic than survs imo. Facecamping on First hook, tunneling 3 times in a row and so on... But to each their own I guess.
It might be the starting at solo queue. After I became decent at survivor I noticed the levels of toxicity of the killers I faced dropped off more rapidly than the level of toxicity I got from the survivors I faced.
There actually was a study done on it that concluded that, as opposed to other games, the highest level of toxicity was found in the highest ranks of DbD, interestingly enough. I'm sure I'm not there so I can't comment but I thought that was interesting.
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Does BMing add anything positive to the game? No. Does BMing add something negative to the game? Yes. So, discouraging it or getting rid of it is the better choice.
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I think one of the most incomprehensible was when I was doing my Adept Cannibal achievement awhile back and I ended up in Lery's. I picked my three gen and defended it to the end. One person, who I think was in a 2 man SWF, kept on going after the center gen in the three and I couldn't do anything but focus on the gen so I end up at center gen 90% done and only two hooks when the third gen pops because with the generator layout my only chance to win was going to be by keeping those gens.
They try to hammer the gens, I chase until a pallet drops so I can break it and grow my dead zone and at six hooks one of the solo queue survivors finally gets three hooked and died. I'm now down to one gen and I keep on wounding and breaking pallets and eventually I kill them all at 11 hook stages with the one SWF player on the hook and trying to suicide so their friend, who was standing on the hatch, can get out (but I went straight to the hatch as soon as the hook stages started going rapidly).
End of game, I put in a ggwp and the first SWF person I ran across goes off at me swearing, calling me all sorts of things, and telling me how bad I am.
It's like, really? I played with no gen regression perks, the only perk I benefitted from that game other than BP was Franklin's Demise, and I took a 2 gens left, only 2 hooks on survivors situation to a 11 hook, 4K situation without camping or tunneling and I'm the bad one?
I always find it funny when people who lost to me are telling me how bad I am. They kind of forget the whole if I'm terrible but they still lost to me what does that say about how they played aspect.
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If everyone escapes, between 1 to 6. If I'm killing someone then between 5 to 12. 12 is very rare as I nearly always let at least one survivor go. The only exceptions are adept achievements (I'm only missing two now though), tome challenges that require killing a group, and toxic behaviour.
5 is usually the lowest number before someone dies as I normally alternate hooks so that is I find survivor A first, I hook a different survivor, survivor A is the next survivor to run into me and the process repeats.
In the meantime, I do slug the survivor if I see them before I've hooked a different survivor but I normally just run away. If the gens are popping like popcorn in a blast furnace, I'll stick around so I can chase a would-be rescuer who's trying to 'lead me away' just so I can get some more BP without tunneling. Toxic behaviour can throw that out the window if they're coordinated enough they don't appear to be solo Q as sometimes the best way to get the toxic player is to hook or slug all of their teammates first.
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There's nothing wrong with it. It's boring for the killer if they can't find anyone or get into a chase and that prevents BP gain but that can just mean the killer's map awareness is, for that game, below the stealthy group's skill in stealthing or the killer doesn't have a useful tracking perk in their build. I find a stealthy group to be a lot of fun to play against as a killer unless they're just making a hatch play; then, I make an effort to try to find them, kill them and give the hatch to the other survivor.
It's a smart move as well to play stealthily at first. I do it as well as a survivor and normally start getting chased after someone else gets hooked as making sure everyone only drops one hook stage per hook increases the survival rate a lot in most circumstances.
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If the other side doesn't have fun consistently they stop playing. That's unhealthy for the game and kills the game if it becomes too widespread.
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I did it because a Wraith let us suit up and opened the exit door for us after another survivor dc'ed
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@ManOMaker said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2688066#Comment_2688066
I realize now that yes, my original statement does have a certain level of victim blaming and I did not disclose my opinion that I still do not like the act of bming, so I have changed my post to show that now.
And I do totally agree that there's nothing wrong with people joining a game and hoping to have a fun experience, there never should be something wrong with that and I do wish that BHVR would step in somehow but when I think of solutions there's nothing I can think of that would really solve the problem.
Anyway, thank you for pointing out what I missaid and mostly agree with you too!
Thank you for clarifying that; I do appreciate it and I hope you have a great day.
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@cantelope said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2688480#Comment_2688480
No, you replied to a post that someone typed in direct response to another post and commented on it without understanding what was being commented on in the first place and laid out a heavy handed accusation.
You then proceeded to accuse the person of defending toxicity despite never having done that, going so far as to stick words in their mouth.
"it's...pretty odd to see someone saying 'if you are annoyed by teabagging in a game it's a you problem'"
He never said this or endorsed this. Only that escalating a comparison to such extremes isn't okay. Yet here you putting words in his mouth.
Once again. You either never read anything they typed, or you're a troll. Which one is it.
You're behaviour really seems like a troll who didn't expect me to be so blunt about it. If you want to turn tail that's your choice, but the fact you seem to do everything in your power to ignore the whole. Part where you accused him of something he didn't do really seems like your a troll who probably should have quit while they are ahead.
I'm sorry but you are coming across as a troll. I don't believe that's your intention but you're not understanding what other people are saying and you're jumping to conclusions (eg. when you told me I was saying you were defending rudeness and, yet, in the post you quoted I specifically said that you were not condoning rudeness).
To use another example that I used many years ago and I saw you used something similar in another post if people are to argue about if the sky is blue, first, they need to agree on what is the definition of blue. Without agreeing on that basic definition, any discussion is futile. I think that's why you're coming across as ad hominem'ing and using semantics. I don't think that's your intent either; I'm just pointing out why it could be looked at that way in case there's any chance that could help.
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@ManOMaker said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2687922#Comment_2687922
Yes, I know the real reason as to why people get mad at bming. My point is that you shouldn’t let it affect you.
The problem with your statement is that you're victim blaming. Whether it is intentional or not, you're coming across as defending toxicity.
You may mean, paraphrasing one professional game writer , bming means you are either/or (a) a child or have the mentality of a child and/or (b) you're a terrible person. Then it could be argued that you try not to care about it since in the case of (a), they'll eventually grow up and realize being a dingus on the Internet isn't a good thing but nobody's perfect and kids make mistakes or (b) the person bming is a terrible person and nobody should care about their opinion on anything until they become better people.
People could agree or disagree with that but at least then the onus is shown to be on the person bming. There's nothing wrong with people joining a game and hoping to have a fun experience. It, unfortunately, won't change without BHVR stepping in and, so far, they don't seem concerned about toxic behaviour as a company but the onus for the bad behaviour should be on the bullies; not the victims
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@drakolyr said:
Tbh, the grind plays a fair part.
And maybe bad MMR.
But new killers shouldnt have it that hard, cause killers are dominating low ranks. And when you are new, you start from scratch.
Starting as a new killer in September was really, really bad for the first few days. After, it became a lot easier once I had the game mechanics down. If it has gotten worse than September I totally understand what the other poster is saying; I might have quit as well.
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@PigMainBigBrain said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/299038/do-you-think-newer-killers-are-dropping-out
Less killers available to fill lower level responsibilities = survivors going up against sweaty killers more often. I like to compare it to the economy. Less workers to fill the demands of a society=a society with less filled demands. Hurts survivors in your instance because it makes your games overall worse as in your scenario putting you up against full gen slow down sweat in an MMR range that doesn't really call for it or need it.
I warned about this kinda thing before, but nobody really listens to killers outside of ignoring our feedback as "an excuse" or "git gud" or "just whining". End of the day all it does is upset the balance and you end up with situations like yours. Low level killers simply stop giving a damn at some point and either give up entirely or go play survivor.
- The sweat of killer role right now isn't appealing to new killers.
- The grind required to "git gud" involves a massive grind that gets exponentially longer every new patch to strive toward perks which pushes new killers away since every killer you play you need to get every single perk you used to use over again. Unlike survivor where you can just pick a main, and get everything in the game. All survivors play exactly the same so you don't need to grind over and over again.
- MMR handling for new killers puts them up against people with 1000+ hours for no reason and SWF's. Which, if you've never been bullied as a killer, depending on the severity, you can make a person quit the role entirely. And I wish I was joking.
Put all of that together and new killer retention rates drop, and survivors have to face the try hards who will not budge as killer and play RIDICULOUSLY SWEATY every single game, AKA killers who have thousands of hours, know every loop and counter etc, AKA you get to play against Marth or Angrypug and "pros" every game.
But yeah without a doubt newer killers are dropping out, I've watched them make quitting posts....
That's what I think is happening too and the first signs of it are just beginning to show. I started about three weeks before the switch over to grades and SBMM and I made it to where my color as killer just turned purple if I remember (8?) but the matches were fun, not sweaty. I don't want sweaty which is why I started dividing my time.
Now, if I'm going to get sweaty as both survivor and killer, that sucks even more. I don't run DH or most of the meta perks on either survivors or killers (possibly one on a character) because I just want to have fun.
And I totally understand what you're saying about new killers. I started my PvP gaming with Shadowbane where play to crush was the motto and griefing was a legitimate tactic, which I didn't like or do but it was very present (and, also, killed the game) so I have a pretty high tolerance before something makes me want to quit but my first few days as killer were hellish.
If SBMM has made that even worse, that does not speak well at all for customer retention.
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@MikeyBoi said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/299038/do-you-think-newer-killers-are-dropping-out
What do you mean drop out?. Like are you referring to nobody playing weaker killers like pig, trapper legion etc? Survivor queue times have always been longer compared to the AM and it’s always been like that.. Meet windshield?
I mean they're stopping playing killer. My queue time have gotten longer, both AM and PM, and especially with killer, after a long wait, I'm getting really advanced players. It could be because they expand the MMR ranges the longer you wait so the only killers left to match with are more experienced killers who have more progress to lose
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@Marigoria said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2685568#Comment_2685568
So if someone teabags in a video game it means their parents failed educating them? L M A O
Possibly. I have a elementary aged son and, when he was playing online ( supervised and a children's game) he laughed at someone. I asked him not to do that and reminded him of when that happened to him and how bad he felt. He has never done it since so he has a better standard of conduct online than some older gamers even though he's still in elementary school.
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@Marc_123 said:
Can´t believe this thread got so long... i guess a lot of people don´t have real problems in real life.
A game is only a game. Whatever any players does has absolutely no effect in real life...
But it does affect real life because there is a real person behind the other screen and the more real problems they have the more it would affect their mental health. So why be a jerk?
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@Nathan13 said:
can't believe how many people seriously get offended with people teabagging/ flashlight clicking like those survivors are horrible people. Some of you probably should be staying away from online games like Ironknight said.
It's probably because they could be (I said could, not definitely are) terrible people. Teabagging, in real life, has been a part of sexual assaults and hazing rituals. As one example, a while ago I read a thread from someone who was complaining that real life teabagging now met real life charges because that interfered with their hazing. Now, before people say I'm saying something I'm not, of course real world tbagging is far worse but the arguments defending virtual teabagging are also the exact same that were used to defend gamers saying they were going to ######### someone or they raped that team. Real world ######### was far worse of course but how do you think real world ######### victims felt after being told they were going to be virtually raped? It's a comparable situation.
Whether someone is being a terrible person for doing it depends a lot on the circumstances. Is it with friends who have no negative connotations with it and they all are fine with it? Or is it being done to a stranger where you have no idea what they have been through and the only purpose is to make the other person miserable?
If the second, then there are three possibilities (a) you're a younger teenager or have the maturity level of one and one day you'll realize being a jerk on the internet isn't a good thing to aspire to and will stop (b) you don't understand or (c) you are, in fact, being a terrible person.
I don't think it's going to change anytime soon but just how gaming moved away from saying they were going to ######### the other person it will move away from tbagging. However, if everyone is apathetic about something nothing ever changes.
As for the other taunts (flashlight clicking, come here, points, etc) it's better to be a good sport but, if you're going to taunt, at least don't do it referring an activity that has been used in real world sexual assaults.
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The correct answer is I play him. I've single handedly brought down the kill rate.
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When the clock counted down the last 100 seconds, Injustice 2 Pro Series player Dominique “Sonic Fox” McLean knew he’d already won the match. His opponent’s health bar had been reduced to a sliver. All Sonic Fox had to do was kill time. So he started teabagging.
Here's an article discussing its history, current usage, etc and the different implications between using it with strangers and using it between a group of friends who thinks it's okay. It also covers its similarity to another term that was previously used heavily in competitive gaming which, fortunately, has been mostly outgrown and is no longer used.
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I would love to have a Deep Wounds effect on the Doctor. He's the only killer that could effectively use it to get downs.
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@cantelope said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2683907#Comment_2683907
Paragraph one. I personally know what it's like to be sexually victimized as a child over several years. So you can shuffle that card back in the deck. If you draw connections to anything and everything that could possibly in anyway set off a victim then dbd needs to be deleted. What if a doctor or a clown sexually assaulted someone? Ffs clown is a reference to John Wayne Gayce. Freddy is a pedophile. Trapper and leather face were abused. Huntress kidnapped, abused and murdered children. Need I go on? So much in this game would do the trick long, long, long before what you are insisting.
Paragraph two. Intent is meaningless without context and severity. By your logic someone willing to work hard in school to get a good job is no better the someone willing to lie cheat and steal to get a good job as both of their intents are to get a good job. I've seen this pathetic excuse time and time again, mostly with people comparing stream sniping to blaming people for being a victim of sexual violence.
And finally, because you can't seem to get this through your head. Paragraph 3.
I AM CRITICIZING YOU FOR YOUR CHOICE TO IN ANYWAY CONNECT RACISIM AND SEXUAL VIOLENCE TO BEING RUDE. THIS IS NOT THE SAME AS DEFENDING BEING RUDE. JUST BECAUSE I WONT CONSIDER AN IMPOLITE CHILD TO BE ANYTHING CLOSE TO A NAZI DORSNT MEAN I THINK THEIR BEHAVIOUR IS OKAY.
Shockingly it's almost as if I have some kinda of personal experiences that make it clear to see how much ######### different one is from the other. Not that it matters right?
I also have some experiences I will not get into that make this personal for me. I had a much longer response but I'm just going to say this. I'm very sorry over what happened to you but you are not making any attempt to understand why this could be triggering to someone else who had similar problems. That's fine; people respond differently. However, teabagging is not cool and the excuses being used to defend making someone else feel miserable are the exact same being used to defend slurs and ethnic jokes that made my family feel miserable. That is also not cool.
I do not feel the majority of people who teabag are condoning sexual violence or racism. They are, however, using the same excuses that were used to excuse racism to defend their behaviour which is victim blaming. It can also be triggering to people who have experienced sexual violence. They either don't know or don't understand (which happens) or they're too selfish to care. Whether you make that association or not because of your experiences is valid for you; it is not how someone else will react and their reaction is equally valid. Nobody controls how someone else reacts and everyone has to work through terrible experiences in their own way.
In the end, everyone is playing a video game and we want to have fun. I know you don't condone teabagging or being rude but it can have problematic associations for other people and it's better to speak out against toxic behaviour than imply that people should just get over it (a stance that I'm not sure since I don't know you but I think you might agree with).
This discussion is getting a bit heated so I'm going to step back. If you want to please consider my point (or not as you prefer) and I hope you have a good night (and I apologize for implying this post would be short; I obviously lost that somewhere).
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@cantelope said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2683612#Comment_2683612
So both your posts miss the point people are saying... which once again makes me think your a troll.
I'm not defending rudeness. I'm pointing out that reacting to someone being rude by comparing it to racism is a terrible thing to do. Just because I said there's a difference between a nazi and someone who didn't cover there mouth when they burped doesn't mean I'm defending burping in people's faces.
As for your second post... stop. Trying to compare someone tapping crouch to jokes about ######### victims and racism is disgusting. Outright disgusting. It has no place in this thread or this discussion. Stop.
There is an infinite chasm between someone being kinda rude in a game and someone being openly bigoted. Stop putting the two anywhere near each other. You aren't helping anyone in anyway. You're just degrading the struggle and frustrations of people you clearly know nothing about if you think they have any place in the same breath.
I think I lost my previous post so I apologize if this is a repeat. You are the one who is not making a connection. I have significant experience with both issues. I worked with victims of sexual assault for over a decade helping them recover from their trauma. I'm not even going to get into more personal items. If you do not think that taunting strangers using something that references sexual activity could not be triggering you are being clueless.
And I specifically referenced ethnic jokes as most weren't told to be offensive; they were 'funny'. While racism is a far worse problem I am not directly equating the severity of the issue; I'm equating their intent. Both racist jokes and teabagging are done to make fun of other people at their expense. That's the connection you're overlooking.
So, other than upsetting people, is there any reason to teabag? You don't know what the other person has gone through who's sitting on the other side of the screen. Why be a jerk and, depending on their background, offend people far worse than what you intended so you (if you do tbag) can have a laugh at people at their expense?
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@cantelope said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2683612#Comment_2683612
So both your posts miss the point people are saying... which once again makes me think your a troll.
I'm not defending rudeness. I'm pointing out that reacting to someone being rude by comparing it to racism is a terrible thing to do. Just because I said there's a difference between a nazi and someone who didn't cover there mouth when they burped doesn't mean I'm defending burping in people's faces.
As for your second post... stop. Trying to compare someone tapping crouch to jokes about ######### victims and racism is disgusting. Outright disgusting. It has no place in this thread or this discussion. Stop.
There is an infinite chasm between someone being kinda rude in a game and someone being openly bigoted. Stop putting the two anywhere near each other. You aren't helping anyone in anyway. You're just degrading the struggle and frustrations of people you clearly know nothing about if you think they have any place in the same breath.
I've worked with people who have gone through the exact same things I'm talking about. My job for over a decade was helping people recover from that. I'm not even going to get into even more personal stuff than that. If you do think that taunting someone who has survived sexual assault by using a taunt that specifically references sexual activity should be laughed off as a 'oh, they're just being rude' and couldn't be triggering then you are being clueless. There is no reason to do it to a stranger except to try to be rude and ruin their day and it could be even worse depending on what they've gone through. Start thinking of other people and have empathy.
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@cantelope said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2683532#Comment_2683532
No those are different things....
Slurs are bad because of the implied violence and social debasement behind them. This is doubly so in face to face conversation. In fact any comparison to real world harassment to some generalized action or swear in a video game is a bad joke at best and degradingly ignorant at worst.
Someone teabagging is someone being rude. Rudeness and racism are different things. Like.... very very different things.
I mean what next does burping at the dinner table make you a nazi? Not wearing socks at a guests house?
I really, really hope you're a troll.
The other point I thought I would make is that you don't get to control how people react to offensive behavior. The person making the ethnic slur is just 'joking'. A person who dealt with sexual assault may be offended by the person who's taunting using a behaviour that references a sexual activity. Just stop acting terrible and respect other people. It's just a video game doesn't mean there isn't a real person on the other side.
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@cantelope said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2683532#Comment_2683532
No those are different things....
Slurs are bad because of the implied violence and social debasement behind them. This is doubly so in face to face conversation. In fact any comparison to real world harassment to some generalized action or swear in a video game is a bad joke at best and degradingly ignorant at worst.
Someone teabagging is someone being rude. Rudeness and racism are different things. Like.... very very different things.
I mean what next does burping at the dinner table make you a nazi? Not wearing socks at a guests house?
I really, really hope you're a troll.
I'm not a troll. If it's just being rude, stop defending rudeness by using literally the same arguments that are used to defend racial slurs and ethnic jokes.
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Survivor does require skill; it just requires less than killer does to be good and experience with one survivor is directly transferable to another survivor. Killer experience is not 100% transferable.
I do play both; I'm not going to play half a game and killer is the harder role. Also, playing both sides does give a better understanding of where each side has a point and where they don't. Survivors do have some legitimate complaints; as an example, killers do have more power to wreck a person's gaming experience (eg just because you can end a game with five hooks or less in the early gamedoesn't mean you have to. Kill them mid-game and instead of getting 3 to 5K BP per survivor they get 10 to 15K each and instead of 10K BP you get 30K). An SWF bullying a killer, though, is worse because at least a killer ending the game quickly is ending the game quickly as opposed to dragging the experience out.
For survivors, why tbag? It's just annoying. If it's a new or severely outmatched killer, don't humiliate them just to wreck their day. Either end the game quickly or lead them on some chases so they can get some BP out of the game. And also the game mechanics favor survivor more and more as MMR increases; don't be toxic. I know this doesn't apply to the majority of survivor players but there is a sizeable minority that is toxic. Call out the toxicity and try to reduce it.
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@El_Gingero said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2680323#Comment_2680323
Comparing being teabagged in a computer game to being in a fight or getting into trouble at your job is a bit silly.
They are just random strangers playing a video game. It means nothing unless you make it.
Sort of like when people say racial slurs to my family or tell ethnic jokes. They're just joking or that's how they speak. It means nothing unless I make it.
Or, instead of acting like terrible people, they could just not do things whose only purpose is to annoy and upset other people.
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I go for the unhooker. If it's easy I'll hit the unhooked person so they can spend some time mending (small time waster for the survivor) as I assume Borrowed Time. If they're slugged I'll leave them on the ground so two survivors can now be occupied for more time. You could try that instead.
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@DesignDad said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2681192#Comment_2681192
Hey friend! Maybe I can help clear things up:
Grades are not used by the matchmaking system. They used to be called "Ranks" and were used for matchmaking, but that is no longer the case. Grades serve as a monthly tracker for how much time you spend playing, based on the Emblem system (Emblems turn into pips, and pips turn into Grades). You can't lose a grade through de-pipping anymore, either! At the Grade Reset on the 13th of each month, everyone goes back down to Ash IV and starts the climb again, and they get a Bloodpoint reward for their previous Grade. Get your Grade higher, and you get a bigger reward!
MMR is an entirely separate value used for Matchmaking. It's hidden, meaning you don't get to see it. It has absolutely no connection to Grades: Your MMR doesn't directly influence your Grade, and your Grade doesn't directly influence your MMR. MMR doesn't reset each month, but it is constantly adjusting based on match results to try to find you balanced games. This is why it's called SBMM (Skill Based Match Making), it's trying to measure your skill and put you in matches with similarly skilled teammates / opponents.
We've been considering removing the Grade icons from the post-game screen due to this confusion. I was hoping we could leave them there to allow everyone to have a little way to show off / have some bragging rights, but I've seen lots of people confusing Grades with MMR (understandably so!). What do you think? Should we hide the Grade icons on the match summary?
Thanks for taking the time to ask your question! I hope this explanation has helped clear up some of your confusion so you can get back to enjoying the game. <3
I really like that you are responding to posts especially since SBMM is a new system and will take time to calibrate properly.
With that said, I would also like to add that what would, in my opinion, help a lot would be a combination of lowering potential MMR ranges for matches so one side doesn't get stomped, buffing weaker killers and improving moderation of toxic actions.
I am currently Iri 1 on killer and Iri 3 on solo queue survivor (I'm just mentioning this as it shows I do spend a lot of time on both sides) and survivor is far less stressful and far less demanding than killer. While some killers do quite well it's not an enjoyable experience to be taunted and BM'ed while playing an unfamiliar and/or weaker killer. I suspect that if survivor toxicity was dialed back a lot of killer complaints would disappear.
That's not to say that many killers don't need either direct or indirect buffs, they do, or that the majority of survivors do this (the majority are just fun players) but the sizeable minority that does do this can sour an otherwise completely enjoyable gaming experience.
I think it's obvious that the devs do really care about their game and it, of course, takes time to implement things but please think about these recommendations. While I'm sure the devs don't share this attitude the answer to the frustrations killers currently face is not playing Civ VI. The matches I've been getting recently have been getting better for enjoyability so some tinkering with SBMM may have already occurred but there is still some ways to go.
As a side note, I think the devs did awesome with the new chapter. Keep up the good work with things like that; you did a great job.
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@Zlaraki said:
So everyone is dead, the killer picks you up and runs in circles, drops you then does the ballerina on you as well, clearly enjoying every bit of it. He goes away for a while, presumely closing the hatchet. Now he drags me to the exit, lets me revive and hits the control panel. I was relieved for a moment, halfway through the panel I stopped, I just had this feeling the killer was waiting for the ultimate satisfaction killing me right before the gate opens. I decided to die with pride and Tbagged right infront of him until he was pissed off enough to hang me.
Would you have risked your pride and take that chance to escape?
I quite often close the hatch and let the survivor leave through the exit gate. If the survivor is slugged, I let them wiggle free so they don't bleed out and, if they go in a different direction, they might find the hatch before me (it's also more fun than waiting for me). Closing the hatch gives me a little bit more BP and, if the survivor is not right behind me, starts the EGC so I don't have my time wasted (and exit gates are much easier to find).
If I were doing that and somebody tbagged me, well, it's not a pleasant experience to try to do something nice and get mocked for it. It has and does happen but, in your situation, I would have been suspicious but would have gone for the unlock anyway just in case.
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@SwampDaddy said:
I tried consulting the Discord, but people were extremely cruel and insulting. So I'm going to try asking here.
I still don't understand MMR. I am sitting at iri 2 and I've lost over 5 games with zero kills at all. I haven't lost any pips at all. So I'm wondering when my MMR will get low enough that I will start being paired with groups that are easier to go against. Low MMR equals being matched with others with low MMR, right?
So what's the deal? I'm busting my behind like a mofo and I still can't get any progress toward iri 1.
Please help me here with some guidance.
When they brought in SBMM, keeping in mind I only played a few weeks prior to that, I found it took about 10 to 20 games on the killers I'm really weak and/or new on for my SBMM to calibrate. As well, keep in mind, when your MMR is more at an enjoyable level that pipping up at Iri requires a lot of iri emblems and that requires a lot of hooks so don't focus on kills, focus on getting a lot of hooks.
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@Akumakaji said:
I honestly have a hard time (without accusing anyone specific) believing all those "I play killer and survivors equally and I have no problem getting 4ks while playing casually".
Apparently it's just "SBMM doing its job". I guess that a lot of this people haven't really experienced the killers side in a meaningful way, besides doing a daily ritual here or there. Playing survivors a few days opened my eyes to how aweful real tunneling feels. But really aweful SWF stomp groups won't show up just at the casual low ranks.
Sorry if this comes over as entitled or salty, for I am not salty at all.
I'm currently at Iri 1 for killer and Iri 3 for survivor (solo queue). I most certainly do not get 4Ks each match and when I got my MMR back down to a level where matches are enjoyable again I alternate hooks so no survivor dies before the fifth or sixth hook so my MMR stays at an enjoyable level.
Despite not tunneling or camping, I still get BMed a few times per day and still run into bully squads of SWF whose only goal is to try to ruin my day. When I'm playing killers that are weaker or I'm unfamiliar with the BMing Increases a lot. The majority of survivors are cool and fun but there is a very significantly sized portion that is just out to ruin people's experience; I encounter more toxic survivors than I encounter toxic killers.
Survivor, even though I solo queue, is easier, less stressful, and less demanding in my experience than playing killer.
BHVR needs to step up its moderation and/or start buffing the weaker killers.
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That does actually bring up a good point. How many Plagues do you actually see? I see more Plagues than Twins and that's about it
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Plague is very well designed.
I'll expand more on that. She's interesting and adds a brand new dynamic to the game while having quite a lot of counterplay. By providing secondary objectives, she changes up gameplay and that makes it more fun both as and against.
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Killer: NOED. I would consider it if I run a full end game build (ie No Way Out, Remember Me, Blood Warden) but otherwise I think it's harmful to developing long term chasing skills. If I get out chased by a group, I want to figure out how to counter it and doing otherwise would be detrimental, in the long term, to my enjoyment of playing killer.
Survivor: Dead Hard. Unless I'm doing a Tome challenge I won't run it for the same reason; it's too easy to get away with things that you wouldn't have without it even more than other exhaustion perks (and dh'ing through a trap is ridiculous). I quite often don't run exhaustion perks though as I started in September so I still have a lot to learn about looping and chasing. I will sometimes run the other exhaustion perks and I want to become better at 99'ing my Sprint Burst but I don't like Dead Hard's design so I won't run it.
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Ruin and surveillance can be helpful as when the survivors stand up or get off a gen for a moment the gen turns white and then yellow as they get back. It's a giant visual cue crying out for crows as long as Ruin isn't cleansed in the first thirty seconds. Tinkerer or Discordance works as well for getting you some time to get to the gen since crows can get there fast.
Infectious Fright could be interesting but I haven't tried it yet.
Plaything-Thrill-Retribution-Pentimento was interesting but my Retribution got cleansed super fast in my admittedly small number of games I used it.
Lethal Pursuer was lackluster in my opinion since the Artist can locate survivors so easily.
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The only way to get a variety of more killers is to run fun perks so you get sacrificed more and your MMR lessens. Or BHVR could buff the weaker killers so they could compete. The first sounds like it's more likely to me.
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The Doctor.
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@Colton147147 said:
Many killer players are also toxic
Whataboutism isn't saying that you have a problem with the behaviour; it's saying that you want only certain people to so it. There are both toxic survivors and toxic killers but, for whatever reason, there are more toxic survivors than there are killers and killers receiving toxicity is currently a larger problem than vice versa.
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@Laluzi said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2669264#Comment_2669264
BHVR really likes to pretend like SWFs aren't a problem or have no impact on the game's balancing. They'll fiercely defend the right for people to play with their friends (which is fair), but they refuse to acknowledge the massive performance gap that creates between solo players, or how much more difficult it is for killers to perform against skilled teams with perfect information versus skilled teams with no information. When they balance killers against solos, the intended gameplay bracket, killers get absolutely screwed versus comms.
True, the absurdity of it was laid plain to me last night. I saw two people had similar names and the same character, two possibly unrelated survivors and two flashlights so I brought an Ebony Mori just in case it was a bully squad. It wasn't, it was a 2 man SWF and two solos I think but they played normally so I played normally for me (I alternate hooks and just slug the survivor instead of hooking twice in a row unless they Tbag which is when I tunnel). I got 6 hooks, slugged two of the weaker members a couple of times and hooked everyone at least once for BBQ stacks.
One person said it was too bad I didn't see the Mori animation in post game chat (just friendly discussion, not trash talk) and I said I wouldn't have used it on their group anyway since they were fun and cool to play against.
That's when I thought of the absurdity of how the killer is bringing items to help them in case the killer is being bullied by the survivors. In the horror genre, doesn't that seem absurd?
Solo survivors generally can't bully since their MMR isn't high enough. SWFs can because voice coms makes a 1100 MMR survivor far more effective than they would be in solo queue. I think BHVR needs to bring in a multiplier to MMR for survivors in parties to take this into account and that could help eliminate some of the issues.
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Survivor: Haha, you suck 'bunch of swears'
Me: Didn't I carry you to the exit gate?
Survivor: LOL, I kicked your butt, 'more swears and slurs'
Me: I literally opened the exit gate for your group.
Survivor: You suck you 'more swears'. I got out by kicking your butt
Me: You didn't notice I walked past two hooks while carrying you on the way to the gates?
At that point I just left chat. I think that person was the saltiest escapee I met; I've had much saltier from survivors who didn't escape. For context, I was doing a complete in one trial thing and, if by the third gen popping, it didn't look like I was going to complete it I just let everybody go so I could try again faster with another group.
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I'd rather buff weaker killers since they need it and, if it's a party of survivors, inflate their MMR when picking a killer to go against. When solo queueing, use their actual MMR but, for a party, multiply their MMR by some number (eg. 1.1 to 1.9) depending on how many are grouped together.
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If I see a Dwelf I expect toxic play as well.
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BBQ and Chili. On a low mobility killer the information it gives is of limited use. I run it on every killer but that's for the BP.