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Friendly reminder that the patch notes say that only the Demogorgon has Undetectable currently.
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I'll still try Surge with my Agitation/Iron Grasp/Mad Grit build, but I'm less convinced now that it will be worth it over Pop Goes the Weasel.
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@Khroalthemadbomber said:
She moves at Nurse walking speed when Crouched. YES she is now Undetectable when Crouched, but if you're crouching EVERYWHERE, you're screwed. That and it's REALLY easy to dodge the Ambush as a survivor. The last 3-4 major content patches have had Pig nerfs buried deep within notes. While it's paranoia to believe that someone at BHVR doesn't like her, this regularly and consistent nerfing really kinda feels like it.
Will Undetectable work to compensate for NO On-Hit effects working with Ambush anymore (see my previous posts on the subject)? Potentially. But I doubt it.
She is not Undetectable currently because she can still be revealed by aura reading perks. Currently only the Demogorgon has Undetectable according to the patch notes.
Also, DEEEEEEEEEEEEVS *shakes fist*
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What does the break pallet add-on do now if it pallet break is becoming base kit?
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@Aztreonam78 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/691724#Comment_691724
Grind in son gonna be increased bcs with Ultra Rare there will be Common perks which cheaper.
Consider that it's more likely that those common perks will already be obtained by a decent number of people, whereas a decent number of ultra rare perks would still need to be obtained. So the perks that are likely to get cheaper won't make much a difference while the perks that will become more expensive will actually have a noticeable impact on the grind.
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I'm down for nerfing Moris. Not just Ebony, but Ivory too. One is usually all it takes to flip a game on its head.
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@Hailoh said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/690520#Comment_690520
A 60 second chase is a REALLY long time to get one hit. Think of Decisive Strike and how long that takes to expire. Now think of that, but in the killer's favor. And if it does prove to not be enough, it could be adjusted to something like 70 or 80 seconds. 60 is just a benchmark.
I mean, you have to consider scenarios where they are able to keep the chase going just long enough that it becomes more efficient to give up on the chase and defend gens (which can end up being less than 60 seconds). Against some of the less powerful Killers, this can reasonably happen. At that point, the Survivor has gained their hit protection without having to commit to a minute long chase.
And even if you raise the timer, you just risk making the perk not worth the effort to use. I could be mistaken, but I think this is the sort of idea where there isn't really a comfortable middle ground between "problematic" and "useless."
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I really like the idea of giving Survivors unique abilities, but the problem is that we're way too far into the game's development to do something like that. Doing so will suddenly make the Survivor characters much less equal to each other, and if the Survivor you've already put all your resources into gets an ability you don't like, you are SOL.
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@PeenutsButt3r said:
Too bad rank doesn't represent the players skills, I mean it does for those who take seasonal rank seriously and get sweat in the game but even that some of them can't get a decent chase for more than 1 minute and become the burden to the team. (yes solo queue).
I can't even count how many matches I played on purple and red rank as survivors that had people did nothing to help the team and crouch-walking everywhere, or farming hook saves without BT, even some can't do gen when ruin is up and have to run around like an idiot to find the totem.
That's why the current ranking system is flawed.
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@PeenutsButt3r said:
@TAG why not?
Because that is not a demonstration of skill, which is the whole point of a ranking system. The current system tries to balance demonstration of skill and "fairness," which already isn't ideal. Emphasizing the fairness would only make that worse because it would come at the expense of the demonstration of skill.
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If anyone should be the Killer/Entity based on ugliness, it should be Quentin.
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I'm not sure how I feel about this. Like, this wouldn't be useful for bad Survivors, but for good Survivors, it seems like it'd be suuuper strong. Like, against most loopable Killers, this seems like not a terribly difficult task to earn an extra Health state. I worry this would further widen the gap between the top Killers like Nurse/Spirit and the rest of the pack, which is not what we need IMO.
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@PeenutsButt3r said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/690496#Comment_690496
That's why I said NEW, not to improve the current ranking.
And I'm saying I do not want this sort of new system that measures people based on "fairness" or "good manners."
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Sprint Burst lets you make a run for it after booping the snoot so maybe you can live to boop another snoot. Maybe Fixated so you walk faster and can quickly approach for the snoot boop before you Sprint Burst away?
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No thank you. The current ranking system already has issues with rewarding/punishing people who do/do not play a certain play pattern. This would magnify that problem in my eyes.
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It will obviously be based on Shawshank Redemption.
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What changes?
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@thedevalex said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/688718#Comment_688718
No.. totems are not the reason to run it. It was originally designed PURELY to counter trappers traps. Then totems were added later.
That may have been the case back when it was originally designed, but I would imagine most people who use it nowadays primarily use it for the Totems. Utility of a perk can change over time as it gets buffed/nerfed to the point where its main use can be different from its original intent. For example, no one today would even begin to argue that the reason to run Sloppy Butcher is to inflict super Hemorrhaging on Survivors.
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I do this as Pig myself.
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Not one individual perk, but the Agitation + Iron Grasp + Mad Grit build.
As for how I'd change one of these perks, I'd probably make Agitation increase Survivor pick-up speed. Possibly also drop the Terror Radius increase from it, as there's not much of a point to having it IMO.
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@ProfessorDunwich said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/688852#Comment_688852
I recently saw a post saying they were not actively working on the Doctor. Regardless, I highly doubt each killer was in development for 2 years from design to implementation. Simply changing Freddy's mechanics took 2 years.
They said that they had to design Freddy as though he were a whole new Killer, which is different from Legion who mostly got a bunch of number tweaks and a few other things. If Doctor ends up being like Legion, it wouldn't take as long as Freddy to do the changes.
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@ProfessorDunwich said:
Devs said he is being looked at but not actively worked on. Keep in mind it took them 2 years to revamp Freddy. So look for a Doc improvements at the end of 2020.
To be fair, with Freddy, that was a total re-working from the ground up. It's possible that a Doctor re-work could end up being more along the lines of Legion, which only ended up taking a few months.
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Monstrous Shrine IMO
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@Leonardo1ita said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/686691#Comment_686691
What about giving them just a faster vault speed to fix the problem? Like Myers, 1,3 seconds
That just seems like an excuse to not try and fix bad map design.
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Or it could be because their goal is to do gens.
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@UltraBanana said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/687027#Comment_687027
You can try to avoid the insane loops but sometimes it is not really feasible. Take the suffocation pit god window for example. Typically your best bet on that map against really good survivors is doing a 3 gen on one side of the map.
Boom, you spawn in on the side with the god window. Ruin is on the other side, instantly dies cause it spawned in view of a survivor. Discordance pops off on that side as well, and before you can even walk to that side of the map the gen is basically done because of toolboxes and prove thyself. Chase one survivor off, the other one finishes it. Get your first hook and the first gen is done.
Now your 3 gen is stuck on the god window side, and every survivor in the lobby knows to abuse it. What is your strategy? Just don't chase them on that side of the map ever?
This is why I say they are badly designed. A bad Killer is someone who just follows someone into those loops (assuming they are not a Killer like Nurse who can beat those loops) when they are better off avoiding it and going for other gens. Obviously if you don't really have a choice but to play their game, that's not really your fault.
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@Blackowt_9120 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/687014#Comment_687014
I would call the killers who put themselves in that situation bad killers.
Both statements can be true in my eyes. Players who have no way of overcoming these badly designed spaces with the Killer they are playing as but choose to waste time they cannot afford in those spaces anyways are bad, but those spaces are still badly designed.
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@Blackowt_9120 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/686961#Comment_686961
I don’t think so. Plenty of killers have ways to work around it, this is only a strategy for the ones that can’t. And realistically this becomes way less of a problem the more time you spend playing because you just know which loops to abandon, which to chase, and which to punish. And you make that call based on game state too. If 2 people are already dead and there are 4 gens left, you can probably get away with chasing for a minute or two, but if there are 4 people alive and 3 gens left, don’t chase the long loops, because that will just end up being a lost game. Look at it this way: they’re stuck with you until they get themselves out, so why waste time chasing 1 person when you could be stopping 4 people from leaving. It’s not bad game design, it’s a game design that’s punishes bad choices, and you could say the same thing about the survivor side of it, probably moreso.
If there are Killers that cannot work around it, I would call that bad design.
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@Demian said:
Excuse me. I don't dislike roar while charging.
If roar is remove, it should be made by very~ultra rare addon. For example, the effect is added to Amanda's Secret or Amanda's Letter.
It can be added to Letter as downside if there is upside to compensate for it.
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@Blackowt_9120 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/686758#Comment_686758
That’s exactly what I’m saying. Or rather it’s what I’m saying you should treat it as, otherwise you aren’t playing, you’re getting played
That's bad game design, no?
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@SquidFacedMan said:
Making survivors run to specific stations(up to 4 times) to then complete a timer with 3 skill checks, all under the pressure of a timer is already powerful enough. Buff Pig but don't make this gimmick any more lame to play against than it is.
Nooooot really? It can be good, but it can also be pretty weak. The problem with the RBTs as they currently are (in my opinion) is that they are inconsistent. Improving the consistency of the Traps would certainly be nice for the Pig (though I would personally just opt for making the first box auto-fail and go from there).
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@Blackowt_9120 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/686716#Comment_686716
Patrol generators and ignore them when they o to one of the god loops. It’s better not to waste time and be in control than play how they want to
So what you are saying is that those Survivors can just go about their business knowing that they have a safe zone where the Killer dare not chase them?
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A little, but I don't obsess over it because I think the rank scoring system is fairly flawed.
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@Blackowt_9120 said:
For The killers who you said had trouble, just find someone else unless they’re the last person, then go for it and eventually one of you will make a mistake. Ghostface anyway can just stalk them to 99 and go after someone else. If you’re going to waste that much time on loops you deserve to lose. They all have to go for gens, doors, or the hatch eventually
What do you do when everyone on the team is aware of how to take advantage of the loops in question?
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If you are listing Killers that are weak to "infinites", then I would say that is argument enough that these "infinites" are not fine.
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@NuclearBurrito said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/686555#Comment_686555
Remember that the timer still goes down during Box searches. So if you've only searched 1 box and there is 30 seconds left on the timer and you haven't found a box yet then you are probably dead.
And being interrupted is now way more problematic making it less a question of "will this box have a key" and more a question of "can I search this box in time before the Killer can reach me?"
The 2nd question is part of the games mechanics and can be answered with varying degrees of certainty and promotes interactivity.
The 1st is just RNG and when you die from not finding the Key it's the game screwing you over rather than the Killer outplaying you.
IMO, unless you are using the Gear add-ons (which creates the opposite problem) or just hard-tunneling, I think the Trapped Survivor is virtually assured the escape if they are not playing dumb. This is not something I personally would want.
The way Traps are currently set up, unless the Pig is actively interacting with the Trapped Survivor in some way, the only times RNG really screws someone over is when they have to search every single box on the largest maps (which is more of an issue with the maps than the RNG IMO). If the Pig does interact with you, unless they are hardcore tunneling (crouch tunneling or otherwise), you still have a very reasonable chance to get the Trap off. And if the Pig does manage to get that Trap Kill by balancing keeping the Trapped Survivor busy just long enough to die and not forsaking their main goal of dealing with the other Survivors, I would say the Pig played well and earned that Kill.
I won't say this is an objectively bad change, but it is a change I personally would be very unhappy with.
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Everything is just my opinion.
RSN2 Base Kit - Sure
Putting on Traps before EGC collapse but after gates are powered - I don't think that fixes the problem with the Traps during the EGC because then you just tunnel tunnel tunnel until the EGC kills them. I think it should be reversed; the RBT timer counts down but the EGC timer is paused.
Putting on Traps during EGC - I think if you pause the EGC timer but leave the RBT timer running, you don't need to do this.
Reduce timer by 5 seconds when a gen finishes - Too insignificant IMO, especially when you can 99 gens.
Slow down RBT timer when near a teammate - Not sure why this is needed.
Pig can see RBT death timers - As I said in another thread, I think this idea is reasonable, but I know there are people who disagree.
Crouch movement soeed increased to 3.85 m/s - I think this is a small enough increase that I am comfortable with it?
Detection perks don't work while in stealth - I think just giving Pig immunity to aura perks through Undetectable is good enough.
Raise PoV while crouched - Yes
Add-ons:
Workshop Grease - I wouldn't use it. Personally, I don't think Skill Checks are a good parameter to alter for Pig add-ons.
John's Medical File - I don't think this needs a timer decrease as well.
Utility Blades - 40% is a weird number. I like the idea of an add-on that injures Healthy people for searching the boxes, but idk if I would do it like this and idk if I would do it at Uncommon.
Video Tape - I THINK this is fine?
Razor Wire - See Workshop Grease. As an added note, I think if you use this plus Grease together (along with Unnerving Presence), you run the risk of creating a very frustrating experience for weaker Survivors, which probably is not a good thing.
Slow-Release Toxin: I don't really think this solves the problem of the RBT penalty add-ons being counterproductive to the Traps' goal of stalling (as you would want to tunnel the Trapped Survivor anyways; otherwise this add-on may as well read only "Trapped Survivors become Exhausted for 30 seconds when they remove the Trap.")
Rusty Attachments - Same as Utility Blades, for the most part.
Interlocking Razor - This + Razor Wire + Unnerving Presence = Miserable experience for Survivors who aren't expert enough in Skill Checks to power through Ruin
Tampered Timer - Tampered Timer currently reduces the timer by 30 seconds already.
Amanda's Secret - I worry that giving a notification when a Survivor starts to do a box gives the Pig too much knowledge in knowing when to camp a box to guarantee a Kill (even if they don't see the Box auras, they will know their locations with the notification and also know how many boxes need to still be checked).
Rules Set No. 2 - I've seen this idea before, and I like it. The only thing I would change is that I would remove the ability to see the Linked Survivor's aura when a gen pops; I don't think the Killer should know who the linked Survivor is until the gates are powered.
Amanda's Letter - I worry you put too many downsides to compensate for the insta-down. I'd probably take away the RBT penalty and maybe the decreased ambush distance. Maybe I am wrong, though.
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Roar during attack - Yes
Crouch taking 1 second - Sure?
Crouch speed up to 4 m/s - Not sure about this one; seems like it would make crouch tunneling easier
Searching boxes takes 20 seconds - That seems like it would make Survivors too open to being attacked by the Pig, but idk
Search any two boxes to open the Trap - My main issue with this is not a mechanical one but a flavorful one. By making this change, you are basically reducing the odds of an RBT kill to zero. The goal of an RBT is to kill, yes, but there needs to be some hope of a Trap kill (the timer reduction change does not cut it due to 99ing gens). There is nothing wrong with it being hard to kill with a Trap, but when it reaches a point where it will never happen, what is the point of there being a SAW character to begin with?
Doing gens reduce the timer by 30 seconds - 99ing gens is a thing, so that doesn't really accomplish much. Worst-case scenario, they're still better off doing gens anyways.
Killer sees death timers - I am on board with it for the same reason you have stated, but I know there are people who allege that it would promote tunneling.
Add-ons:
Combat Straps - I feel if you are making the base time to crouch 1 second, Straps as a whole kinda becomes unnecessary.
Razor Wire - I don't think that would change much except for bad players. Good players still beat it with little effort. Personally, I think Skill Check add-ons should go.
Annotated Plan- I already explained my issue with the multiple key thing, but mechanically I have no issue with this.
Sketch - See above
Amanda's Secret - Not a good enough trade-off IMO.
Amanda's Letter - This is no better than the current Letter. In fact, this is probably identical to the current Letter in practice (assuming you keep the aura reading).
Bag/Crate of Gears - With the change to base searching time, these add-ons become too much IMO. Even with the reduced percentages, using both means the Survivor takes 26 seconds to search one Box. That doesn't seem like much since it only takes a little more time than the time it would take to open a Gate, but remember that if you stop searching a Box, you need to start over. And with your change to guarantee two box searches, that gives the Killer a sizeable amount of give to balance gen defending and Box search interrupting. Maybe at higher levels this wouldn't matter aaaas much, but I think more often than not, this would just make things supremely frustrating if the Pig had even the slightest intention to disrupt Box searching.
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Killer, just because I have more fun playing Killer.
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I don't like the idea of not allowing someone the option to die so their teammate can take the Hatch.
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The thing is that the Hatchets flat-out deal damage whereas the bottles only slow down a little bit. If you land hits with both the Hatchet and the Bottle, the Clown still needs to take advantage of the hit to deal damage whereas the Huntress is ready prepping another Hatchet for the maybe-down.
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@Mochan said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/685133#Comment_685133
Which is bad form, if they can't own up to it. Frankly it's better not to make such bold promises if you can't back them up. People are going to hold it against them later. Nobody here is going to forget that mathieu said those words.
You are taking the quote too literally.
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@Peanits said:
There are no plans to change the base kit for the Clown in the immediate future. It's definitely possible down the line, but I don't want to get your hopes up just yet.
The killer's we'll be taking a look at in the near (or at least near in terms of the roadmap) future can be found here: https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/77678/
Q: Could you talk about who you're planning on reworking/updating next?
A: We cannot give dates on when these changes will happen, but we can share some information on which killers we are looking to update. We will be taking a look at the Nurse and her add-ons (primarily her add-ons) and the Doctor. We would also like to review the chainsaw killers, the Shape, and the Pig, and more. Some may receive smaller changes or add-on passes while other may see more significant changes.
I am very okay with Doctor being looked at.
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Why does "nothing is off the table" somehow trump "F13 has a whole lotta legal stuff surrounding it?"
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Drop all the current Mori offerings and bake Moris into the Bloodpoint offerings that are not Pudding, Shell, or Streamers. Yellow Bloodpoint offerings let you Mori one person who has been two-hooked, and green Bloodpoint offerings let you Mori all Survivors who have been two-hooked.
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@avilmask said:
He's visible from unlimited distance when he's cloaked. Maps like junkyard make it impossible to surprise attack survivors. He could at least have a maximum radius where his cloak is visible, like Freddy.
Considering that he takes time and makes a ton of noise to decloak and considering that Spirit exists, I'd be okay with him just being completely invisible period while cloaked.
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Alright, Cote. Money where your mouth is. Make it happen. ;)
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@Hoodied said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/683316#Comment_683316
I'll check, why?
I just want a Pig guide from him since he is generally considered one of the best Pig players. I could be mistaken, but I don't believe he's ever put up a proper guide to playing Pig, and I think this would have been the best time for him to do it.
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Does anyone know if scorpionz submitted a Pig guide, by any chance? :o