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@Zexbunny said:
Are people really arguing against basekit bp bonuses? I think it also promotes a healthy gameplay style while not completely wrecking the bloodpoint economy.
Yes they do more bloodhunts now and we have flan but those things are still reduced by removing the bp bonuses. Let's not pretend they aren't. Are people really that defensive of BHVR that they will defend everything they do? Even when they've reduced bp gains overall? Seriously?
I'm not even saying they are bad for this. Just that they could do so much better
To be fair, they did say they were adding BP incentives for when the queues need equalizing.
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@Tsulan said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3020227#Comment_3020227
Which isn´t exactly a reduction. Is it? You unlock the perks in the bloodweb on lvl 30, 35 and 40 for all chars. Soon you unlock all perks on lvl 1 after prestiging. Which is 20, 15, 10 levels just to get those 3 perks on level 1. Sure, you get them on all chars and depending on how many chars you have, it reduces the grind. IF you want said perk on every char.
For those that don´t want this or have only a few chars, the grind wasn´t reduced. Even more, it will take longer to complete a bloodweb, without the BBQ and WGLF bonus.
The shrine just sounds like a p2w mechanic after the update. You shorten the grind, IF you spend something on the shrine.
Currently, you release the teachables into the Bloodweb; you don't necessarily have those perks unlocked in the characters' inventories. So I would say you are still reducing the grind since the level 1 perk will automatically be unlocked for you.
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@Tsulan said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3020215#Comment_3020215
On level 1. If you want a higher level, you need to prestige the origin char or the char you want to have the perk on.
I mean, the perks will show up on the Bloodweb as usual once you prestige a character, so at that point you're just leveling up the character as normal.
Alternatively, Shrine of Secrets can also shortcut progress if the right perk rolls in, though that is admittedly a complete gamble.
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Not saying that's necessarily wrong, but I definitely don't think that's obviously true.
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I think the DBD mobile game already provided the solution to that in the form of visual notifications to certain audio cues.
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@KateDunson said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3019722#Comment_3019722
Well i was expecting a fix to don't feel the need to run an anti tunnel perk at all, not the creation of a stronger perk cuz if it makes it to live the way it is will become a must having perk.
After all they did this change to create variety not to create another stale meta in the near future
Fair enough.
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@KateDunson said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3019680#Comment_3019680
So we have to rely on a perk because of bad game design, the fact that everyone is running anti tunnel builds isn't the reason why they made this meta change?
If i have to use off the record every single game just to deny tunneling, let me say it, bhvr fixed nothing.
"We know why those perks are used and we will make adjustments accordingly"
After seeing the results I don't think you know why
You talked about a perk that was nerfed, so I talk about one notable perk buff that you missed that is extremely relevant to the gripes you are putting forth.
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@Walex90 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3019373#Comment_3019373
> The grind is better because you can now have all the perks on every character without having 3k hours in the game.
I have 3k hours and the amount of characters I have all perks on is 5 - first four and my EX main (all survs are P3 50 tho, and I didn't prestige any single killer), so there would be way more to go... but I get your point, and while I agree, this is completely not my point. It's purely about getting every single character to prestige 100 because that will be the new max now... and in order to achieve that you have to GRIND tons of points. I'm not even sure if it's doable...
That sounds like a personal accomplishment problem, not an actual problem with acquiring the tools needed to play.
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Off the Record?
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@TurboTOne said:
im more annoyed by the Fact you get a Penalty when you dc the first time. What if i just had a Problem with my Internet ? Now im getting punished for it ?
I honestly Dc maybe once or maximum twice a Month. If even at all. And i only do it for a REALLY good Reason. Being punished for it seems unfair.
(As Killer btw. Or when the Game is already Lost as Survivor. For example: Killer Slugs everyone on the Ground)
They've said before that they intentionally have the DC penalty start out really low to factor in the possibility of the occasional internet problem or IRL emergency.
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"I've been stuck at a 30 minute ban for the past week even though I only DC no more than once a day (100% of DC's have been from solo survivor q, if that says something)"
That might have something to do with it.
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I don't really count the cosmetics as part of the grind, tbh.
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@OnryosTapeRentals said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3015135#Comment_3015135
There's zero way the new OTR will actually make it to live though...
We'll cross that bridge when we get there. Right now, this is the effect that we have.
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@CaulDrohn said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3014961#Comment_3014961
Ok so we still disagree. Can we move on now?
If you want to move on, just stop responding. I still think your points don't really hold up at all.
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How does it interact with Rancor? ;P
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Have you thought about prestiging everyone once, then prestiging the characters whose perks you really want up to three, and then just grabbing the rest of the perks as you go about it?
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Part of me wants to try BBQ with Lethal Pursuer. Or maybe just try an all-around aura-reading build with Lethal Pursuer.
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Like I said in another thread, DH for distance let you both get closer to the pallet and get further from the Killer simultaneously. Now it does neither (unless you get the Endurance hit). I imagine you can still use it to cover yourself at the pallet, but the window will be tighter.
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@MikaelaWantsYourBoon said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3016304#Comment_3016304
That's what i said on mine last comment. Strong campers should lose their camping potential. Other killers should be okey.
The solution to that is not to make BT basekit. It's to actually NERF Bubba's camping.
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@MikaelaWantsYourBoon said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3016282#Comment_3016282
Gen time buffs is direct buff to camping. Survivors needs to sit more on gens while you are camping. It is okey against Trapper, Wraith, Freddy etc. But camper Bubba should not be buffed. Now i can not wait more camper Bubbas with longer gens + Deadlock
Then nerf Bubba's camping.
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@MikaelaWantsYourBoon said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3016124#Comment_3016124
I would be okey too but they buffed camping. So base BT needs to be stronger. Or at least strong campers need to nerf (not their chase potential, their camp potential). Bubba, Trickster and Huntress are on top that.
BT doesn't make camping better or worse, so I'm not sure what the point is in that regard.
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@anarchy753 said:
BT is 100% dead, because if you use it instead of Off the Record you're just getting 1/5th of the exact same perk, and OTR works for you instead of hoping the other players are running it for you.
Why not both? BT now extends the haste duration.
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@MikaelaWantsYourBoon said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3016060#Comment_3016060
I had this solution: BT will be basekit for 10 second but survivor will lose collision. So both sides can not bodyblock each other and killer can not hit you for 10 seconds. So at this case, it will be smarter to go after unhooker.
I'm not on board with a full-on basekit BT. I think what they currently have is a fine place to start.
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@MikaelaWantsYourBoon said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3016020#Comment_3016020
I am seeing issue with that because they buffed camping. So if camping is stronger than before, then survivors should have stronger anti-camp/anti-tunnel mechanics. 5 seconds BT is so weak. You can block them to go any strong loop. Counting 5 is not hard.
I'm not convinced that you can consistently do that with the speed boost, but I'm open to being shown otherwise.
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@MikaelaWantsYourBoon said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3015983#Comment_3015983
If killer bodyblock you, it does not matter you have speed boost or not. I can do this with current BT, it should not be hard with base BT.
I don't see the issue with that? That's not a consistent counter strategy on the Killer's part. If it was, BT wouldn't have been the meta perk that it was.
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@MikaelaWantsYourBoon said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3015957#Comment_3015957
You still don't get me my friend. They promised us good base-game changes. Killers have some good stuffs. But as survivor, i still need to use some perks for fight against tunnelling. Base BT shoul give me chance at least run to loop but it is kinda imposible with 5 seconds. So i still need to use perks. Survivor basekit change did not give anything. 5 seconds is joke.
I don't see how it doesn't with a five second grace period AND a speed boost.
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@MikaelaWantsYourBoon said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3015925#Comment_3015925
Well we need to see on PTB. I only worried about bodyblock part. It is not like BT, count and hit. It is damn 80 seconds. You need to hit them.
But this is not only part worried me. Killers got some fair buffs but they made camping and tunnelling stronger and 5 seconds BT is just joke.
So i need to see in PTB and test stuffs. Hope they did not break anything (I know they did)
With the new OTR (that can still be used alongside the nerfed DS, mind you) and Base Kit mini-BT, I am not willing to say that tunneling got buffed.
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They could aways add the visual signals for audio cues from the mobile game.
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@MikaelaWantsYourBoon said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3015890#Comment_3015890
You worried about this perk for end game. And i said with this changes, probably most of survivors will not even see end game.
OTR is not problem because they nerfed survivor's speed boost too. So they will not make good distance and you will catch them again. And new generator times will forgive you for tunnelling, plus you can still get anti-gen perks. They did not nerf so much except Ruin.
So it should not be hard to finish game before last gen pop's. I can not see this perk will be problem except bodyblocks.
I am not talking about anything BEFORE the end game. I am talking specifically about the end game. That is why I am saying it is irrelevant to what I am saying.
Good news: When 80 seconds of enduring somehow isn't enough to evade the Killer for some reason, DS will still be active to give you yet another chance at escape prior to the end game. ;)
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@MikaelaWantsYourBoon said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3015865#Comment_3015865
Base BT is nothing, so you still need to bring BT or OTR for anti-tunnel. They nerfed DS too. Plus you will smaller distance for hit boosts. So yeah, they buffed camping and tunnelling. Generators will take longer.
It should not be hard to take 3K/4K most of games. (If you are not Trapper, Myers, Pig ofcourse)
Base BT is not nothing, plus how could you say DS was nerfed and simultaneously bring up OTR in the same sentence when arguing tunneling was buffed?
Irrelevant to the point I'm making.
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@MikaelaWantsYourBoon said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3015839#Comment_3015839
They buffed tunnelling and camping, so you can kill them before end game starts.
Camping? Perhaps. Tunneling? No. Is that relevant to the point I'm making? Also no.
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For me, it's the end game. I see no way a Survivor with this perk does not escape once they are unhooked during the end game.
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@Pepsidot said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3015069#Comment_3015069
They will still be able to do this though, right? Won't running with 1 second of BT cover the distance of old DH anyway? So it's really not that different, if not better? And it would mean you have the choice of pulling the pallet or just taking a hit and saving the pallet whilst you run to a safer loop (if hit)?
WORST thing is (for killers at least), I'm guessing they will NOT have any indication on whether a survivor has used their DH or not. So right now you can bait out a DH right? Well with the new DH you will never know if they really used it or not. That's a scary thought.
The thing is that when you are DHing for distance, you are both getting closer to the pallet AND further from the Killer, who now has to close the gap caused by the DH. Now, you are not gaining any distance from the Killer, who can now potentially reach you AND hit you before you make it to the pallet.
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@legacycolt said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3014698#Comment_3014698
Are you sure? From my understanding the gen regresses at 400% until 30 seconds are over
When you kick it, it starts regressing at 100%, but that 100% will tick up gradually until it caps at 400% after 30 seconds.
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Because he happens to have my favorite Survivor cosmetic?
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Use the new Off the Record if that bothers you.
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@GannTM said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3014711#Comment_3014711
I’m at school, cut me some slack 🧍
Do what I do and internet browse while also ahdering to responsibilities and avoiding getting caught. ;)
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It means the Survivor can't just DH at will to reach the pallet. They now have to time the DH for when the Killer swings to make it to that pallet.
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@C3Tooth said:
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/YR16J2B8XB5Q/image.png
Open Gate is consider Conspicuous Action
"Open Gate" is conspicuous, but "Go to gate as it is being opened" is not. The person who was using DS or BT to escape before was not the same person who would 99 or open the gate.
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@CaulDrohn said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3014022#Comment_3014022
And there's also no reason to assume that it would be easy and NOT break anything!
About the cheaters, when you change the EGC to be stoppable by an active trap, how do you think the server will recognize that? Bc a clients sends the info. And that info can be forged / spoofed. How do you think all the other things that cheaters can manipulate are done? Exactly the same, they are sending forged / spoofed content to the server, which the server than accepts as true. Of course the server should not allow something like that, but we know it does, considering all the stupid cheats that occur. So I'm not talking about some vague risk here, but a very specific one! One we won't have when EGC cannot be stopped.
Technical hurdles is one thing, code design the other. If it's technically challenging we don't know, but adding an unneeded (imo) interaction between EGC and traps is also a flawed design (atleast for me), and that alone is enough reason to not do that.
If there's no reason to assume it will be difficult or easy to implement without breaking things, then this is not a point that can be argued in either direction. It's a non-argument.
You are inventing a worry that entirely theoretical. It is pointless to argue about it because there is no way to demonstrate it to be a legitimate concern.
Code design and technical hurdles are two sides of the same coin. I believe it is a needed and beneficial interaction that both solves the problem better than the current solution and does so with less collateral damage to balance.
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What about Off the Record? The perk that now grants you Endurance effect upon being unhooked?
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"no one brings it at the top level because it wastes way too much time to heal off of it."
They are alleging that this is false, so take that as you will.
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Of all the perk changes they made, Off the Record is the one that concerns me because it makes escaping during the endgame SUPER easy with just the tiniest bit of coordination. Far easier than DS + BT ever made it. We'll have to see how the base kit changes to Killer stack up to that during the endgame.
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@dugman said:
Actually a killer that can look like a survivor is already a decent ability simply because it implies they are Undetectable the entire time they are in that form. Even against swfs Undetectability is still a good effect. Looking like a survivor while you’re Undetectable is really just a bonus.
While that's true, there'd also need to be a way to make the Killer play different from other stealth Killers because just Undetectable and a Survivor imposter model is not enough to make that distinction.
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@luvcraft said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2987904#Comment_2987904
what was the legacy reward?
An exclusive cosmetic for each of those prestiged characters.
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@Slaughterhouse3 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/329625/suggested-buffs-for-weaker-killers
Personally? I think Trapper is very underrated, if you dont focus on gen defense. Doctor can use some touch ups, Pig is a lot better now, and Myers needs addon changes because the power is pretty decent. Can even add some decent effects to some of his addons because most of them are horrible.
The improvement to Video Tape and Pig's Trap RNG are nice, but I personally would not call Pig "a lot better now" with how lackluster her ambush still is.
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@rooCraah said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3012726#Comment_3012726
Seconding this.
If you hook a survivor after the gates are powered, but before they're opened, Blood Warden triggers as soon as they open.
In fact, I feel this change would specifically, and permanently, end the 99% gates meta. Because the current strat almost always involves 99%ing the gates, and finishing them when the killer is relatively close, 99%ing a killer with Blood Warden, especially an instadown killer, would be disastrous as the killer can see all of you and you can't get out.
The end result: survivors are forced to open gates instead of 99%ing them, in order to check for Blood Warden, so if the killer has the perk, they can hide or otherwise prepare for it and not be caught by surprise.
(Mind you, this version of the perk would be absolutely broken, as if you run both BW and NWO you can guarantee a BW trigger, and by extension, over 2 minutes seconds of killing time after the last generator is powered, virtually every single match if you manage to get 3-4 NWO tokens)
Perhaps we can do a thing where the amount of time Bloodwarden lasts can scale to the number of remaining Survivors?
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@CaulDrohn said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3012982#Comment_3012982
I already told you at least two times: Adding ANY conditional modification adds complexity, increases chances for bugs and unintended effects, potentielly makes the code a bigger mess and so decreases maintainability. Yes the timer slows down currently when a survivor is downed or hooked. But that works unconditionally for all killers, and is deemed neccessary to give the survivors enough time to rescue someone during end game.
Your proposal was to stop the timer when a trap is active. So you would have to change the timer to be stoppable, you would have to check whether a survivor has a trap on and whether it's active. And then stop the timer. It may not look like much code, but we don't know about the state of BHVRs codebase. So we have some additional implementations, which all can add bugs and glitches, and at least two additional conditions (trap on and active) we can be pretty sure about (there can be more hidden conditions we don't know). Furthermore we need to make the traps auto-active in endgame again, so thats some additional conditions for the traps (and likely some implementation). Since the EGC is relatively new, we can assume that it's still somewhat clean. The code for the pigs traps is older, and thus likely more messy. So getting it right might be more of a task, with higher odds of introducing bugs and other unintended effects.
All that effort for making the power of one killer work during end game / EGC (Freddy also loses part of his power in end game, btw). And also a change that might not even come into play (when all traps were already used), so it's conditiona whether the auto-active traps are even needed. That's no good code design for me, it adds complexity into the code base for just a minor benefit for one killer play. Code needs to be clean, easy to understand/maintain and modular. And your proposal is neither for me.
And one additional thought that crossed my mind while typing this: knowing about BHVRs difficulties with cheaters, I clearly can see such a stoppable timer as exploitable. All a cheater would have to do is sent the info to the server that the player has an active trap on, and the timer would likely stop. Even if there are no traps in play.
That are my thoughts about that. You can accept it or disregard it, do as you like.
That's just how coding works in general: The bigger and more complex the code is, the higher chance there is for bugs. That's game development in a nutshell, not a point against the idea. The fact that you understand that you don't know the game's code should be a crystal-clear cut that you (and I) are running purely off assumptions with this addition's impact to the game code. We're not actually arguing with anything but hypotheticals at this point, which accomplishes nothing. There's no reason to assume that this would be legitimately difficult to implement outside of "but maybe it'll break things".
The cheaters thing doesn't really say or mean anything. Why? Because "cheaters can maybe exploit it" can apply to just about anything about the game. A new Killer, a new map, a new anything. You're inventing a scenario in your head that we don't even know is possible to justify your position. By this logic, I could say that cheaters can just send info to the server that EGC never progresses period. Why should that matter?
Considering that you are accusing me of having gross misunderstandings of coding, everything regarding the "technical hurdles" of making this change that you put forth amounts to little more than guessing. It doesn't actually mean that the hurdles that you're hypothesizing actually exist in a meaningful way.
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@CaulDrohn said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3012081#Comment_3012081
Any further discussion is futile. You show some great misunderstandings about code quality design, so let's just agree-to-disagree and move on.
I'm willing to learn if you can explain it to me instead of just alleging that I just don't get it. Simply going "don't make the spaghetti code worse" doesn't say anything. The EGC is already coded to conditionally modify the speed of the timer ticking down, so what exactly is the difficulty in adding another condition?
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@Marcavecunc said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3011263#Comment_3011263
Then you'd get people asking for Aura reading Wraith to be basekit, and Myers aura read to be basekit, and Spirit killer instinct to be basekit.
Same as asking for survivors to have a basekit aura read on the killer's location. No thank you.
(but yes, playing with Amanda's letter is stupidly fun, going for unexpected ambush attacks and whatnot.. same with any aura read add-on on killer to be honest)
Then you tell them "No, we're not going to follow a slippery slope."
I think Pig needs SOMETHING for her ambush attack; it simply requires jumping through too many hoops just to hope the opponent makes a mistake. I think at least a tiny version of Amanda's Letter or something similar could help with that. Alternatively, a version of Amanda's Letter that only functions while you CHARGE the ambush attack.