Reinami
Reinami
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@CrypticGirl said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/4008051#Comment_4008051
You do realize that in head form, she doesn't need to break pallets as she can fly right over them. Then she can go into flight mode and catch up with the Survivor easily. She can also spit on you and then immediately M1 you with zero cooldown, so yeah, she's busted right now.
You must not have read the post. The person in question said they pallet stunned her, and that she BROKE THE PALLET. So lets do some math shall we?
- A pallet break takes 2.34 seconds.
- A pallet stun lasts for 2 seconds.
- Switching from body form to head from makes the killer move at 3.68 m/s for 2.2 seconds before she regains normal head mode speed.
- Headlong flight goes 7 m/s, but builds up to that over the course of 2 seconds, assuming an even distribution of speed increase (we don't really know for sure as the data isn't there, but its likely true), the math on that amounts to the killer moving 11.8 meters before hitting max speed.
So we can easily calculate some nice math here.
So if they were pallet stunned and then the killer immediately broke it, that gave the survivor 4.34 seconds of distance. During which time the survivor can move 4 m/s which is, 17.72 meters. Now. The killer for 2.2 seconds, will move 0.32 m/s SLOWER than the survivor, meaning that during the switching animation, the survivor will actually gain .704 meters of distance. So now we are at ~18.42 meters of distance before the killer has started making any gains in distance on the survivor.
That alone right there proves my point. If you can't gain 18 meters of distance head start on a killer (no matter how fast) and still can't get a pallet on time, you are doing something massively wrong. But lets keep it going and find out, how much distance is fully traveled by said they "couldn't reach a pallet" to find out how badly they misplayed.
So at 18.42 meters of distance, for 2 seconds, the killer will charge headlong flight and move 11.8 meters while the survivor will move 8 meters.
- Survivor distance moved: 26.42 meters
- Current distance: 14.62
Now, while headlong flight is going at 7 m/s the survivor is still running at 4 m/s. Assuming a distance of ~6 meters for a lunge in head form the killer needs to get 6 meters away before they can hit. In order to reach 6 meters of disatnce at a rate of gaining 3 meters of distance per second, it will take the killer 2.87 seconds. During which the survivor was able to move 11.48 meters total, while the killer would have moved 20.09 meters.
If we go back to ur original stuff we have:
- Survivor distance moved: 38.2 meters
- Current Distance: ~6 meters
That means that from the moment the interaction occured that i was replying to. This survivor was able to move 38.2 meters away from the killer before they were hit. They claimed that they:
- Stunned the killer with the pallet
- The killer broke the pallet
- The killer swapped to head form
- The killer used the flight mode
- The survivor moved 38.2 meters total distance during this interaction
- The survivor was unable to reach a pallet in time.
For context, most maps are around 10k square meters, roughly a 100x100 meter square (with some slight variations but thats the average size). This means that if they were in 1 corner of the map, they could have traversed nearly 40% of the way to the other side of the map, and they claim they couldn't reach a pallet in time? This is why i called BS.
And even if we say the killer her didn't break the pallet but was already in head form and vaulted. The vault takes 1.6 seconds, which is 0.74 seconds less than the break. Which amounts to 2.96 meters of distance less traveled. So in that case they would have been able to travel 35.24 meters total instead of 38.2 Which isn't really that much of a difference in this case.
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@Volcz said:
Her flight is crazy overpowered, which just complements the rest of her kit.
I had a match where I outplayed Krasue on a loop, pallet stunned her, immediately ran to another tile b/c I know staying there was a death sentence. Well, she broke the pallet and caught up to me via flight mode before I could even make it to the next tile.
I love how they gave Myers a huge CD on his Slaughtering Strike despite being a mid/lower tier killer & left Krasue's flight mode unchecked. BHVR greed & incompetence on full display.
I'm sorry, but i'm gonna call BS. They upped the amount of pallets in a bunch of maps, there are pallets everywhere. They are all within 15-20 meters of each other. And breaking a pallet alone should give you a solid 12 meters of distance. There's no way she closed a gap of 12 meters, in half a second.
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@UnluckyMan said:
Slinger is type of the killer that always has been weak. He got few big nerfs and some small buffs. Only few slinger mains are able to unleash his real potential with amazing trickshots. Unfortunatelly seems like places where singer can make some good pikselshots are slowly dissapering. Maybe one day he will get small rework or significant buff.
Because he has to work so hard for his shots. At release when you could quick scope he was pretty good, because quick scoping had a high skill ceiling where you could practice getting good. Once that was removed he's been bad ever since.
Factor in the fact that you are 4.4, have to slow down to raise your gun, the survivor gets a heavy chance to dodge it with that little "wiggle" they do, and assuming you even land the hit, you have to reel them in, then hit them, then reload, then do it again. You spend so much time fiddling with the gun that it doesn't actually earn you any extra time from landing hits compared to say a huntress.
He really needs some buffs.
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@BlightAbuser said:
Hens just put out a video that showcases her strength pretty well.
The one from her on the PTB where she moved faster and could body block by going through survivors? Cuz she can't do most of that anymore. Also that was PTB, where matchmaking is basically non-existant and hens has like 10k hours.
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@ChaosWam said:
I'm not really seeing it, to be honest.
Even with scamper, you can't get too much value when a survivor can just keep going around the loop, it's specific loops she can cut down with the M2, and even then they need to be infected.
She's strong, but not NURSE strong like people claim. Maybe it's a skill issue on my part, but I'm just not seeing it yet. Maybe my opinion will change with time.Yeah i honestly dont' see it either. She seems ok, but not great. I'm sure with some practice you can get pretty good with her, but she gets destroyed if survivors body block for each other since you can't go through them anymore with the head. On top of that, i have played 5 games so far as survivor and not a single person was playing her. And thats on release day. Usually a good indicator that the killer isn't very good when nobody is playing her before the first day is even over.
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@Rlabotath said:
Her biggest issues are low TTK, and high mobility. I think Hens said it best in his video intro.
The added glide to ignore obstacles was the dumbest buff. It's fine if she's strong on straight loops and such, being a Dashlop, but being able to Curve along tight walls was way too strong. Not to mention that vault speed makes old Scamper look weak. Honestly she was fine on PTB, probably could've used maybe 1-2 nerfs, definitely not buffs.
Body blocking destroys her.
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@Abbzy said:
She is weak against bodyblocks and weak chainded loops where she cant get her attack fast.
And conveniently they just added a bunch of weaker pallets on tons of maps.
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mcIYuRFVo_A&t=443s@Cassiopeiae said:
This isn’t a rant about the new killer being OP or unfair.
Just want to know what I, as a survivor, can actually do to avoid getting downed before I even reach a minute of chase time.
Watching the stream and being told to just eat the mushrooms hasn’t been very helpful. Eating them mid-chase doesn’t work, the leeches take too long to drop off, and the slowdown while eating makes you an easy target. You can’t reliably force her to transform back during a chase, which means you’re stuck dealing with her long lunge, vaulting ability, and rocket-like speed.
I’ve read about her power in her bio, but that isn’t very helpful for countering her as a survivor, it’s just useful when playing as her. Any advice from someone who knows how to deal with her would be greatly appreciated.
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@ThatRyanB said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3958287#Comment_3958287
Thanks a ton for sharing all of these screenshots and video, folks! This is immensely helpful and goes a long way in illustrating what you're experiencing. Let me bring all of this back to the folks who were working on this so that they can take a look at what might be occurring.
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3957450#Comment_3957450
This is typically done to cut down on conversation about a given issue being fragmented across multiple posts, centralizing that discussion in - ideally - one place. In doing this, we try to merge and close bug report threads, but still actively check these closed threads for relevant proof points we can bring back to the team to aid in their investigations.
Hey @ThatRyanB
As of the latest patch 9.2.0 this is still happening. Just got out of another game, no offering in play, and survivors spawned in 2 groups on opposite ends of the map. This is still bugged for months now, is there any news on this?
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@Shaddoll_Serpent said:
Wait this still went through? I don't know if doing it without anti tunneling changes and incentives for unique hooks was a good idea to be honest with you, but at the same time, realistically not much should change since I believe hard tunnelers would tunnel regardless, although it will probably cause killers to seek out people they know are dead on hook mid game, which is kinda tunneling, but not actually "technically".
Killers who are going to tunnel already know who to tunnel. There was never any good reason to hide in anyway.
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@OrangeBear said:
That really sucks but i guess it's a nintendo problem
edit : i just realised, this means switch can't cross play for 2 weeks after each major update? That's devastating.2 days, not 2 weeks.
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@LotusDragonX said:
So normally I don’t think that DBD is survivor sided or killer sided, but I’ve noticed a running pattern that anytime killer mains complain about a survivor perk or mechanic it gets nerfed and when survivors and killers alike complain about something it gets delayed everytime… and I don’t mean the delay on the anti tunneling update cause I watched those lives and that would just be HORRID! But more so how anyone that’s not a Ghoul main complains about him being able to hit through stuff that is otherwise completely solid to all other killers that even have similar skills. I don’t expect any perk buffs because perks aren’t a problem nor his his skill itself- just the fact the skill is clearly buggy and they deny to fix it along with similar traits that are seen in other killers. Also the camping update is NOT what it should be. The camp meter doesn’t even extend past the huntresses BASE throwing range- meaning they can have the huntress base build with no add ons and when partnered with a perk like Insidious it makes it IMPOSSIBLE for a survivor to know that your teammate is being camped until you are actively being hit with her hatchet from NOWHERE. At that point it’s not a skill issue when the survivor has no way to counter the killers invisible aura or their incredible range.
I just want 1 overall mechanic change with anti camping counting when the killer has clear line of sight- not just when they are within your camp meter range, and for mutual requests to be taken into consideration even when a main whines about their favorite killer being buffed. And no, I’m not gonna deny that this has happened with survivors before because it has taken a while for some BROKEN survivor perks to be nerfed- but some of those perks have been nerfed now and there are some killer mechanics that even killers complained about around the same time that have STILL been delayed.
I'll say what i always say in these types of posts.
It depends.
When you are newer to the game at what we call "low MMR" the game is massively killer sided. When you are the "average player" the game is slightly killer sided. When you climb up to "above average mmr" the game becomes slightly survivor sided and at the "highest mmr levels" the game is massively survivor sided.
This seemed pretty clear to me as i started playing the game as well. My friends got me into the game to play with them, and for the first 50-100 or so hours playing games with them, we rarely ever escape, most of our games we were lucky if we ever even completed a single generator.
Then after a few hundred hours, you start to get better, and games start getting more even. In those types of games it starts to depend on the killer you are playing against, or the killers strategy. If they tunnel or camp (which is a hard strategy for inexperienced surviors to deal with) then you probably were gonna have a bad time. Same if it was say a nurse or a blight or w/e. But sometimes you'd get those games against a wraith, or a trapper and win pretty easily.
Once you start getting into the thousand hour mark you start to really understand the game, now it usually doesn't matter what killer they are playing, it ends up being less about what the killer is doing, and more about what your team is doing. If you have good teammates, you probably win, but most of the time, you won't because matchmaking is a joke. But, when the killer chases YOU, you can often take them on 1-2+ minute long chases, sometimes with them even abandoning it.
Then of course you hit the multiple thousands of hours mark, and thats when you aren't even playing solo queue hardly anymore, and all your teammates are really good at the game, also with thousands of hours. And unless you are playing against the best killers in the world (I.E. comp players) you probably win almost every game.
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@LordGlint said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3999752#Comment_3999752
I noticed you completely sidestepped the question and topic. How does that have anything to do with giving the different killers hook benifits befitting their unique needs and strengths? Weve already determined some effects are disproportionately better on some killers than others. Thats not being debated. Why would you be AGAINST this being reflected in the fresh hook benifits? Its weird youll point this out in awakened awareness, but then double down that every killer should get the same status effects and such.
Because its complicating an already complicated game. I don't understand how you don't understand that. The point is that we shouldn't be balancing certain things in the game like perks and basekit mechanics differently for different killers because it makes the game impossible for newer players to deal with.
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@LordGlint said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3999718#Comment_3999718
Just so I understand your concern. You dont like how perks are stronger on killers like Nurse than killers like Trapper. Because of that... you're AGAINST the idea of having differing fresh hook benifits that would better fit killers like Trapper? I really fail to see the logic here. Even if BHVR took out their magic wand and made every killer perfectly balanced (which is literally impossible because balance is subjective), why would having Trapper gain a benefit that fits HIM be a bad thing?
No, you are missing the point.
Yes some perks will be better on other killers. But a perk like Awaked Awareness, which was not OP on every other killer in the game (and still probably undertuned) launched worse than it was, because it was OP on nurse.
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@LordGlint said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3999697#Comment_3999697
Just so were clear... your talking about a "nerf" that was from the PTB to live that only really affected the killers like Nurse and not Trapper. I feel like maybe that was a bad example of a perk that got nerfed and now Trapper can't enjoy nice things. I promise you no one playing Trapper saw that change and removed it from their build.
Its an example because it was clearly stated that the perk was changed due to nurse. They have a history of doing this, and it could be (again we don't know because we don't know what we don't know) that there are MANY perks on killer side of things that are just bad because they are afraid of how good they would be on nurse.
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@LordGlint said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3999684#Comment_3999684
Even when leaving top tier killers out of the conversation, its pretty normal for different perks to be stronger or weaker for different killers. Exposed perks might be good on Clown but weak on Huntress. The opposite is true of aura perks. I dont think its practical to assume we'll ever have a patch where ever perk is equally useful on every killer.
Awakened awareness was stated by the devs to be nerfed simply because it was too strong on nurse. Thus we have a perk that nobody uses. Yes, some perks will be better for other killers, that is the point, but if a single killer makes a perk completely OP to the point that the devs nerf that perk, it makes it even worse on say, trapper. That is a problem.
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@ba_tetsuo said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3999666#Comment_3999666
I don’t find slippery slope arguments very productive. If you’re not interested in discussing the proposed changes, that’s completely fine, but framing it as “Change A will inevitably lead to Change B, and Change B is bad” doesn’t really move the conversation forward.
So you don't find the argument that these killers have actively had perks release in a state that they are unusable because the perks is good? You want perks to be released and just be bad because 1 or 2 killers make them too strong? My point is that this is a 2 birds with 1 stone thing. Why not fix these killers individually instead of keeping them in this horrible state rather than try and complicate an already complicated game?
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@ba_tetsuo said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3999633#Comment_3999633
Adjust them how? Change their power? Sure. For example, Trapper could get a new line in his power description, such as:
- “Each time you hook a survivor other than the last survivor hooked, reset X traps on the map at random.”
- “Each time you hook a survivor other than the last survivor hooked, your next kick deals X damage.”
- “Each time you hook a survivor other than the last survivor hooked, fly into the sky and become a tactical nuke.”
If the goal is to incentivize killers to go for unique hooks, they need to be given meaningful benefits for doing so.
Changing their power vs simply giving each killer a “unique hook benefit” attribute has the same effect. The advantage of putting it in a tooltip (whether in the killer’s bio or power description) is that it’s documented in-game, rather than hidden.
On complexity:
In a single match, a new player may need to track over 30 different elements that the tutorial never explains:- 12 survivor perks
- 4 killer perks
- 3 survivor items
- 6 survivor add-ons
- 2 killer add-ons
- 4 offerings
- The killer’s power
Some of these can be ignored (items, survivor add-ons, offerings), but that still leaves 19 things for a new survivor to track. The game’s complexity is already extremely high. Adding a unique hook mechanic only adds 1 more element which brings it to 20. That’s about a 5% increase in complexity, but with significant benefits:
- Quality of life improvement for low-tier killers.
- Allows changes to be tailored per killer, avoiding blanket buffs to top-tier killers.
- Makes going for unique hooks a meaningful decision instead of just “being nice.”
The point is that we have identified some kilers that are apparently too strong and so they want to adjust basekit mechnaics.
Where does it go though? Perks had to be nerfed because they were too strong on nurse. Do we now make perks behave differently on different killers? Its a slippery slope that leads to massive complication of an already massively complicated game with hundreds of different perks, dozens of maps, and 30+ killers to already learn. I'd rather instead they nerf those killers so we don't have to also make perks bad just because it might be too strong on 1 of these killers.
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@ba_tetsuo said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3999601#Comment_3999601
Honestly, what they should do is add a section to the area of the bio where they display the killer's Height, Speed, and TR that explains their unique hooks benefits.This would give them space to make something more complex that you can read about from the character select screen so new players can just click into the character and read about it, even if like 70-80% of killers just said:
UNIQUE HOOK BENEFIT: 10% haste and 20% bonus regression to the next generator kickBut again, that is alreay super confusing to new players. The point is that they should adjust those killers individually not make basekit things work differently. At least with things like terror radius, height and movement speed are understandable things to a newer player.
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@LordGlint said:
While I know they already said they're holding off on alot of the PTB stuff, there was 1 part of it I think warrants discussion and could possibly be room for really nice changes going forward.
BHVR for seemingly the first time ever have noticed that some killers are stronger than others and shouldn't get the same blanket benefits for the fresh hooks. While all they did was take the same ideas and give them a lesser version to afew killers, it means there's room to give different incentives to different killers. They COULD very well custom fit every incentive to better fit the strength and needs of every killer.
Pixel Bush brought up the point that something like aura reading across the map and a temp 10% speed boost does nothing for example if your playing Hag and can't really USE that. He suggested maybe a temp basekit mint rag effect to aid and incentivize getting away from the hook.
What do you all think? SHOULD we aim for a bunch of different benefits tailored to the strength and design of each killer, and if so... what are your ideas for some killer specific fresh hook rewards?
I don't like it. The game is already complicated enough without adding things like "basekit mechanics for these killers work differently just because" if these killers are actually too strong with getting an extra bonus to kicking gens that is the basekit, then those killers should be individually adjusted not rebalancing basekit mechanics around them. I already don't trust BHVR to balance correctly, why introduce even more variables?
New players already have a hard time figuring out what is going on. What about the new killer players? They won't even understand what is going on with all the new anti-tunnel and anti-camp mechanics because the UI literally does not tell you what is going on, and now they want to add additional complexity by making these base things work different depeneding on the killer because "they are perceived to be stronger" when that really isn't necessarily the case.
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When the blight is tunneling that 1 person, what is the rest of the team doing? Why is the person going down so quickly when they are hard focusing that single person? They should have the entire map of pallets available to them? I'll give you the first down, but by the time tunneling is clearly established you should have plenty of time on the unhook to run somewhere strong like main building or shack. Which at that point if the blight is chasing you they are going to lose the game, unless you go down super quick at shack. But at that point its a you problem for going down quickly at what is arguably the strongest structure in the game for survivors.
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@brewingtea said:
Maybe they could have included even a SINGLE WEEKEND in the test before coming to a conclusion?
They listened to people who A) have time to play DBD on a random Tuesday/Wednesday, and B) have time to write 20-page manifestos about it (instead of having, like, a job).
Listening to those people scream instead of giving the changes a fair chance isn't going to change next time, regardless of what the numbers turn out to be.
Don't you think that the people who have time to write 20-page manifestos because they have thousands of hours in the game are precisely the ones you'd want to me listening to the most? These are the people that understand the game more than anyone else.
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Us vs them doesn't make the game better. Play both sides, and learn what other players are experiencing.
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@dark_hunter92 said:
This is crazy. Do they realize how killer-sided this community is. Like of course killers are going to complain about learning to adjust and actually play the killer.
Like I've said before, the loudest voice in the community will control the flow of the game. Even if it's causes unfair gameplay for the opposing side.
Can you stop with the "us vs them" mentality? People actually care if the game is good. Its not always some conspiracy.
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@Pulsar said:
There's no way that's him.
This reads like someone posing as him supporting the idea that Killers are somehow not allowed to tunnel or kill anymore
Its him, he has posted about this topic many times already.
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@TicTac said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3996096#Comment_3996096
Well, everyone can play comp with their own rules. So every rule can exist.
But im talking about DBDleague, the biggest one with the best teams.
I'm LITERALLY in the DBDLeague discord right now, STARING at the rules and NOED is not on the banlist.
EDIT: Fair enough, i found a post from a mod talking about it, looks like they haven't updated the rules on the bot yet but it was just banned for this season just a week or so ago.
My point still stands though, and to say "nobody uses NOED because its banned" when pretty much EVERYONE used NOED 2 weeks ago prior to the ban, still stands.
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@TicTac said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3995829#Comment_3995829
Nobody uses Noed, bc its banned. A lot of perks on both sides are banned, so its kinda hard to say that comp killer play the most efficient for public lobbies.
But thats not the point. Yh tunneling/camping is the best strategy, but my point is: even that doesnt help you with a non S-/A-tier-killer if the survivor have anti-tunnel.
If you take comp (5 near optimal players) as an example its absolutely pointless to play most of the killer when survivor have no restrictions (public lobby).
I'm literally in a comp discord right now with 7000 members and i'm literally staring at the list of banned perks for killers right now. And NOED is not on any of them.
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@TicTac said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3995626#Comment_3995626
You cant really compare it with comp. They know that tunneling is pointless against a good team of survivors with most killers. Thats why they mostly ban anti-tunnel-perks (and against some killer even exhaustion- and healing-perks), give the killer the best map and dont use the anti-camp-meter.
So if you take the comp-knowledge into account, you should never pick most of the killers.
Comp almost always tunnels and usually runs noed as well.
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@AbsolutGrndZer0 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3995273#Comment_3995273
Because no game should be balanced around what the best players of the game are able to pull off. If you don't understand this, then… I don't know what to say that won't get me banned.
That is quite literally the opposite of normal game design. You always balance games around what the best players are capable of, but while keeping in mind that lower skill players. Look at any competitive game ever:
- DotA
- LoL
- CS:GO
- Rainbow Six
- Hell even Fortnite
So, imagine a world where we say, nerf the killer shack. If you nerf killer shack, what happens at high level play? Well, one of the strongest structures in the game is weaker for the survivors in a way that might make it a place you can actually mindgame on say, an m1 killer.
But what does it do against low skill survivors? Well nothing really ,because low skill survivors aren't using check spots, and watching for holes in the walls of shack to see where the killer is. Low skill survivors don't even realize what a "tile" is and probably don't even realize that the structures they are seeing from game to game are actually the same on different maps. All they see is, pallet, and drop it.
So this would be an example where, you can nerf something for high skill survivors while not hurting low skill survivors.
A great example that was actually done in DBD history was the old old ruin. The one with the skillchecks? That was an example of a perk that, at low skill play, was DEVASTATING to survivors because the low skill ones could barely hit skill checks as it is, and now they have to hit a great skill check? Or find a hex totem? When they barely even know what that is? But at high level play, where the survivors are hitting great skill checks in their sleep, it doesn't really hurt them. So this would be an example of a perk that needed a good rework to make it so it wasn't so devastating to low skill survivors, but actually buffing it at high skill play.
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@AmpersandUnderscore said:
They already addressed this and stated it's 20% of current gen progress, so it's exactly like pop base kit:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/455289/25-gen-repair-speed-bonus-if-someone-dies-before-6th-hook-state
i believe otz tested it on stream already. It could be bugged, or something that's maybe not working as intended.
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@Aven_Fallen said:
Easy solution is to not tunnel. You even get a Bonus to Regression when kicking after hooking unique Survivors.
Gonna be hard to do when the survivor who was last hooked is dancing around my face and body blocking preventing me from going after someone else because they are in a SWF on discord and get 87 perks for free because they have a mic.
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@Destaice said:
Killer mains who tunnel every game try to discuss tunneling in good faith challenge: IMPOSSIBLE
First problem is that Pyramid Head's mori only activates on death hook. So if that happens early into the game you were absolutely tunneling.
Second problem. Sadako can lock in condemned stacks by hooking survivors. So if you got a super early condemned kill one of 3 scenarios played out. You tunneled, you went a cheesy fast condemn build with a map offering, or you're playing against noobs. In the later 2 you probably win anyways given the circumstances. So what are you complaining about?
Pig being similar in that its either noobs or tunneling for a head trap.
Damn, we have reach peak levels of survivor main mentality here. You can now tunnel without actually hooking someone.
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@TheGoone said:
Purple bottles will have use again and Yellow bottles will take 1 extra seconds to activate again but that ain't enough he's still always gonna be 15% faster.
You should nerf the haste as well or at least nerf his haste Add-ons like Garish makeup kit and Cheap gin bottle
You realize before the changes he moved at 10% movement speed, and after the chnages it was 12% right? He ALWAYS was able to be that fast.
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@TheGoone said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3989754#Comment_3989754
Then you are out for 90 seconds and killer can go for somebody else. Your overreacting
That's not how it works with SWFs, which is my point. This system is missing something to prevent abuse. Its "anti-tunnel" not "anti-prevent the killer from playing the game"
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@TheGoone said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3989740#Comment_3989740
Again unhooked survivors lose Collision you can just walk threw them. They can't bodyblock anymore
Again you are missing the scenario in place.
- Get hooked
- Get unhooked
- Heal up
- Work a gen to regain collision
- Throw myself at the killer to body block
- If killer hooks me, they are punished for "tunneling"
- If killer slugs me, they are punished for "slugging"
- If the killer ignores me, they can't because i'm body blocking.
If the collision thing is permanent (as in i can always walk through the survivor i just hooked) then sure maybe that's fine.
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@ThatRyanB said:
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/V0XPFJHE7F30/ptb-developerupdate-august2025.png
The 9.2.0 Update arrives next week, so let’s check out the notable gameplay changes you can expect from this Public Test Build. Plus, stay tuned for next week's PTB Patch Notes where we’ll share the precise values that are changing for each of the topics below!
Read on for all the details:
NEW FEATURES
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/ELZVJGD36DMM/devupdate-sluggingreductionupdate.png
- If a Survivor is left in the Dying State for a total of 90 seconds during a match, they gain the ability to pick themselves up after fully recovering.
- Added the option to enable or disable this mechanic in Custom Games.
- Note: Perks that enable you to recover from the Dying State - like Boon: Exponential - will continue to function as before, without needing to meet this requirement.
- Gradually increases crawling speed for Survivors who are left in the Dying State.
- Added the ability for Survivors to recover while crawling. Recovery now occurs passively with no need to hold a button.
- Updated several Survivor and Killer perks to account for these changes.
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/RRP2OJO8RCYG/sluggingreductionupdate-1.gif
Passive recovery while crawling
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/MB9O4NLKEIUS/sluggingreductionupdate-2.gif
Pick yourself up if you’ve been in the Dying State for 90 seconds
DEV NOTE: When it comes to slugging, we know it can be frustrating if you're on the receiving end of it too often or for too long, but we also know that sometimes it's the smart move. This updated system acknowledges this, allowing the Killer to slug occasionally when they feel like it's the right call, but will eventually kick in and swing in the Survivor's favour if slugging is used excessively.
A big part of this is also about making the experience of being slugged more pleasant (as much as being slugged can be, at least). The recovery changes and crawling speed will give you a bit more agency when downed so you aren't just holding a button and waiting for someone to come save you.
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/OKVTXX7D56DO/devupdate-frame.png
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/6F3UA65MOB0J/devupdate-tunnelingreductionupdate.png
- When a Survivor is hooked, their hook status is hidden from the Killer. When they’re unhooked, there is no notification and their hook status isn’t revealed immediately.
- This is disabled once all generators are completed.
- Unhooked Survivors gain the following effects for a limited time:
- Haste, Endurance, and Elusive (see below) status effects.
- No collision with other players (both Killer and Survivor).
- Immunity to Killer Instinct and sees the Killer’s aura nearby.
- These effects are lost when the affected Survivor perform a Conspicuous Action.
- All these effects (except Haste and Endurance) are disabled once all generators are completed.
- Added a unique effect to the Killer hook state UI that indicates the last Survivor they hooked.
- After completing a “unique hook” (the same Survivor is not hooked consecutively), Killers get the following benefits:
- Bonus damage for the next generator kick.
- Temporary Haste status effect.
- Temporarily reveals Survivors (think basekit BBQ & Chili) that have less or equal hook states to the hooked Survivor.
- These effects are slightly lessened for The Blight, The Dark Lord, The Ghoul, The Hillbilly, and The Nurse.
- These effects are disabled once all generators are completed.
- Added new effects that disincentivize tunneling:
- If a Survivor dies before 6 total hook states, all remaining Survivors gain a repair speed bonus for the rest of the Trial.
- If the Survivor that was last hooked is Sacrificed or Killed, generators cannot be regressed or blocked.
- Added the option to enable or disable these new mechanics in Custom Games.
- Updated several Survivor and Killer perks to account for these changes.
DEV NOTE: It’s no secret that tunneling can be seen as an efficient way to play for Killers. While this can be true, it’s also true that the results of this can be frustrating for Survivors, leading to Trials ending too quickly for some, while leaving others to fend for themselves in a match that is now much more difficult.
The intention here is for both roles to feel the benefits and incentives that come from spreading hook states. On the one end, Survivors have better opportunities to evade and reset after unhooks, while also limiting those tough situations where losing a Survivor too quickly causes things to go south quickly and snowball. On the other end, Killers are able to apply more map pressure to push back against efficient teams, covering ground post-hook and strengthening gen regression.
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/2IOB3V56TMEZ/devupdate-frame.png
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/AFXVD5SDE8KN/devupdate-elusivestatuseffect.png
- Added a new status effect that silences grunts of pain and suppresses Survivor aura, pools of blood, and scratch marks.
DEV NOTE: To start, we’ll be using this new status effect as part of the tunnelling reduction update, but plan to integrate this into relevant existing perks down the road to make their descriptions more streamlined. Arguably the easiest way to look at this is a Survivor version of Undetectable, in that when it’s active, you know you’re in stealth mode.
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/FR61CMRVPLNT/devupdate-frame.png
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/5FYHIP30TAHZ/devupdate-thetomesloreupdate.png
- Updated “The Tomes” menu to feature new Tomes and accompanying lore alongside each Chapter release.
- New lore is unlocked each week within the active Tome.
DEV NOTE: Ever since we reworked the Tome, we’ve seen how much you’ve yearned for more lore. We’re happy to share that beginning with 9.2.0, lore is back! While previously, lore was tied to challenges, we want all players to have a chance to immerse themselves in these stories, so we’ve shifted to a weekly unlock, not linked to any quest completion.
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/N2STWWLLAG7F/devupdate-frame.png
KILLER UPDATES
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/S41GGXGEAAOB/devupdate-theshape.png
- Replaced “Evil Within” with two modes that can be toggled with a button press:
- Stalker Mode: 4.2m/s movement speed, Undetectable, and can stalk Survivors.
- Pursuer Mode: 4.6m/s movement speed, 24m Terror Radius, increased vault speed, bonuses to lunge range, break speed, and stun recovery, and cannot stalk Survivors.
- Once the stalk meter is full, Evil Incarnate mode can be triggered at will, granting the following effects for a limited time (note: Survivors no longer become Exposed):
- 4.6m/s movement speed, 40m Terror Radius and an increased vault speed.
- Unlocks Slaughtering Strike ability:
- Hold the power button to charge this ability, reducing movement speed.
- Press the attack button while charging to quickly lunge forward, adjusting your angle as you move. The length of the lunge depends on charge time.
- If a Survivor enters the Killer’s attack range while lunging, they are knocked into the Dying State.
- This ability can also be used to destroy pallets.
- Unlocks the ability to grab and kill or perform a regular Mori on Survivors who would die the next time they are hooked.
- Adjusted some of the mechanics of stalking:
- Removed the limited pool of stalk points per Survivor.
- Reduced stalk range to 32m and removed distance modifier.
- Moving while stalking has increased movement speed but incurs a reduced stalk rate.
- Reworked his add-ons.
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/KYEB6NKI2G7O/theshape-slaughteringstrike.gif
Slaughtering Strike in action
DEV NOTE: By moving away from linear “Evil Within” tiers, we wanted to give players more tools they can use to adapt to each Trial’s unique situations, while keeping the core of what makes him “The Shape”.
Slaughtering Strike makes for a high-threat offensive attack, offering up an insta-down opportunity with an extended lunge that's particularly effective in loops and for ripping through pallets quickly.
Understanding his kit has changed quite a lot, we’ve done a pass on nearly all his add-ons, reworking many of them to offer more unique effects. In particular for those who prefer his old playstyle, Fragrant Tuft of Hair will change Evil Incarnate to function like old Myers, offering an Exposed effect and no Slaughtering Strike. Stay tuned for patch notes for the full details on these changes!
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/13DLVM9GJD8R/devupdate-frame.png
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/DJ7BRR08E58E/devupdate-theclown.png
- Increased activation time of the Afterpiece Antidote.
- Increased how long the Afterpiece Tonic’s Hindered effect lingers after leaving smoke.
DEV NOTE: We’ve heard your feedback that The Clown’s easier-to-activate Haste can make instigating and maintaining chases less interactive for Survivors. That, coupled with nerfs to his purple bottles has pushed players towards this frustrating tactic. To make both bottles feel like viable options without being too oppressive, we’ve adjusted the values of their most impactful qualities to strike a balance between pre-9.1.0 values and Live values.
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/08BAR9PMARLT/devupdate-frame.png
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/BJJBQ7PGA3IM/devupdate-theunknown.png
- Increased the additional time added to Weakened when injured by a UVX projectile.
- Increased movement speed recovery after teleporting.
- Increased camera vertical range.
- Adjusted several add-ons.
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/WZNAYQQGPMJH/theunknown-uvx-verticalshot.gif
Increased vertical camera range in action
DEV NOTE: The Unknown is largely considered to be fun to play as and against, and we want to preserve that while adapting to the current state of gameplay. We’ve buffed the UVX slightly, while also taking what we learned from The Animatronic to allow for orbitals, improving UVX aiming and making for even more fun gameplay.
It’s also likely no surprise that Blurry Photo is the most used add-on for the Unknown, given the importance of speed recovery. To help create an opportunity for more add-on experimentation, we’ve converted a portion of this add-on into a basekit buff, while also doing a pass on other add-ons that are due for some adjustments.
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/ELLG8CQEDJFB/devupdate-frame.png
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/64DWI89LSQRF/devupdate-thedarklord.png
- Vampire Form:
- Slightly reduced Hellfire cooldown.
- Increased total Hellfire pillars by 1.
- Reduced Hellfire charge movement speed.
- Slightly increased slowdown time after casting Hellfire.
- Wolf Form:
- Increased Pounce Attack charge time.
- Increased Scent Orb spawn time.
- Bat Form:
- Increased movement friction to make flying easier to control.
- Adjusted his add-ons.
DEV NOTE: Vampire Form is slightly less oppressive in short loops where movement slowdown had less of an impact, and toning down Wolf Form’s mobility, which has been outclassing some dash Killers. On the flip side, you’ll find Bat Form easier to control in tighter spaces and can use Hellfire slightly more frequently and reach further with it.
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/ROR59NWGSYC1/devupdate-frame.png
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/V4USCCTSEWGC/devupdate-theghoul.png
- When grabbing a Survivor on the other side of a vault with Kagune Leap, the Survivor is released at the start of The Ghoul’s vault instead of at the end.
DEV NOTE: It’s no secret that it’s been a common pain point for Survivors to be locked in place when hit with a Kagune Leap Grab-Attack across a vault. Survivors shouldn’t have to wait for The Ghoul to finish their vault before being able to move again, so we’ve removed this tech.
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/BSXKYDTEWZ2H/devupdate-frame.png
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/J8NJLH9UUUG9/devupdate-theoni.png
- Hooking a Survivor now spawns more blood orbs.
DEV NOTE: We understand that with the changes we’re making to address slugging, this will impact The Oni slightly, so we want to mitigate this. By turning hooked Survivors into a greater source of power gauge build-up, The Oni is rewarded with more quickly snowballing power by hooking.
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/O6C117J2G4OD/devupdate-frame.png
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/S0UA6IHVKJRL/devupdate-perkupdates.png
- Updated various perks.
DEV NOTE: In addition to the general perk balance updates you can expect each release, we've also made a number of adjustments to account for the new systems coming to DbD this update, specifically relating to slugging and tunneling.
Stay tuned next Tuesday for the PTB Live Balance preview on Discord, where we'll dig into the details of these perk changes, and then follow that up with patch notes, where you can find the nitty-gritty numbers.
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/AQV7FZEJFLGD/devupdate-frame.png
Until next time...
The Dead by Daylight Team
Do things like distortion hide the reveal effect from the "fresh hook" thing?
- If a Survivor is left in the Dying State for a total of 90 seconds during a match, they gain the ability to pick themselves up after fully recovering.
-
@TheGoone said:
Unhooked survivors won't have collision you can just walk right through them
@OnryosTapeRentals said:
I believe they said that recently unhooked survivors will have no collision, so they shouldn’t be able to bodyblock.
I guess they could still drop pallets or find another method to get in your way. It’s something I think we’ll have to test on the PTB first.
@jesterkind said:
The dev update also says they lose collision, so you'd just walk through them in that scenario.
Re-read the edit.
-
@4thdslip said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3989657#Comment_3989657
I think everyone is overreacting about the Elusive status. No one does this with OTR, and Elusive is part of OTR. There's almost certainly going to be a timer (likely 10 seconds just like everything else in unhooks) that you can wait out or smack them so they get out of your face.
Elusive is not part of OTR, you can body block with it.
The problem i have with the system is it seems to be abusable. If a survivor is unhook, they can just throw themselves at me now to body block for their team after they get healed up and i can't do anything. If i hook them, i get punished, if i don't hook them, i get punished.
-
@AmpersandUnderscore said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3989617#Comment_3989617
I think getting base kit pop and BBQ is pretty substantial, tbh.
Every single other downside effect is completely avoided by not tunneling until hook 6 and is completely within the killers control.
The numbers matter. Making it so my regression is 6% instead of 5% isn't going to make a difference. And BHVR has a history of having tiny tiny numbers like this for things.
-
@Abbzy said:
- If the Survivor that was last hooked is Sacrificed or Killed, generators cannot be regressed or blocked.
This is super strong sometime you will find the uhooked and you cant spend more time looking for others or down him in bad place so now what you will slug him?
Overall the changes look not that bad but only problem I have is how long it will take so all kilkers can play against experienced survivors with these changes meaning weaker killers like from low b-tier to trapper, skull merchant if I remember corretly it will take one year (if their rework or buff wont be badly done) to get skullmerchant rework,trapper rework, mayers rework and tricster rework which isnt even half of the killers which will struggle a lot and this will only have one effect which is happening right now and will get even worse after this on higher mmr there will be same killers on and on no killer variety which some survivors are complaining about now. This will only force people to change mains from ghostface, legion and simular weak killers to more powerfull ones to have more fluid and chill games with option to go after another survivor without tunneling. What do you think?
You will slug them, and then guess what, you get punished again because of anti-slugging. Its a lose/lose.
-
@Tipsy said:
The anti tunnels changes looking mighty scary. I think its too much and way to easy for survivors to abuse it, specially with anti tunnel and slug perks since they can just harass the killer. I say this as someone who plays mostly survivor as of late. This will bring back imo one of the worst survivor metas, the unbreakable ds meta where unhooked survivor is always in the killers face.
If they couple this reworking the "anti-tunnel" perks like DS and OTR, i think its fine, but the big hitch in the plan will be what the actual numbers are.
Like, are we gonna get 1% haste for 5 seconds? Or are we getting 5% haste for 30 seconds? Are we getting like, your regression is now 125% when kicking a gen, or "Now you knock off 15% off the gen when kicking it (like a basekit pop almost)"
The entire thing is very numbers dependent.
The other potential problem is how abusable it is. So the survivor gets unhooked now i have to go after someone else. What if thast survivor starts bugging me, they start body blocking me. Ok so i hit them. Ok then they keep doing it. Ok so i hit them again. Now i can't pick them up. But also i cant slug them.
-
@ThatRyanB said:
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/V0XPFJHE7F30/ptb-developerupdate-august2025.png
The 9.2.0 Update arrives next week, so let’s check out the notable gameplay changes you can expect from this Public Test Build. Plus, stay tuned for next week's PTB Patch Notes where we’ll share the precise values that are changing for each of the topics below!
Read on for all the details:
NEW FEATURES
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/ELZVJGD36DMM/devupdate-sluggingreductionupdate.png
- If a Survivor is left in the Dying State for a total of 90 seconds during a match, they gain the ability to pick themselves up after fully recovering.
- Added the option to enable or disable this mechanic in Custom Games.
- Note: Perks that enable you to recover from the Dying State - like Boon: Exponential - will continue to function as before, without needing to meet this requirement.
- Gradually increases crawling speed for Survivors who are left in the Dying State.
- Added the ability for Survivors to recover while crawling. Recovery now occurs passively with no need to hold a button.
- Updated several Survivor and Killer perks to account for these changes.
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/RRP2OJO8RCYG/sluggingreductionupdate-1.gif
Passive recovery while crawling
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/MB9O4NLKEIUS/sluggingreductionupdate-2.gif
Pick yourself up if you’ve been in the Dying State for 90 seconds
DEV NOTE: When it comes to slugging, we know it can be frustrating if you're on the receiving end of it too often or for too long, but we also know that sometimes it's the smart move. This updated system acknowledges this, allowing the Killer to slug occasionally when they feel like it's the right call, but will eventually kick in and swing in the Survivor's favour if slugging is used excessively.
A big part of this is also about making the experience of being slugged more pleasant (as much as being slugged can be, at least). The recovery changes and crawling speed will give you a bit more agency when downed so you aren't just holding a button and waiting for someone to come save you.
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/OKVTXX7D56DO/devupdate-frame.png
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/6F3UA65MOB0J/devupdate-tunnelingreductionupdate.png
- When a Survivor is hooked, their hook status is hidden from the Killer. When they’re unhooked, there is no notification and their hook status isn’t revealed immediately.
- This is disabled once all generators are completed.
- Unhooked Survivors gain the following effects for a limited time:
- Haste, Endurance, and Elusive (see below) status effects.
- No collision with other players (both Killer and Survivor).
- Immunity to Killer Instinct and sees the Killer’s aura nearby.
- These effects are lost when the affected Survivor perform a Conspicuous Action.
- All these effects (except Haste and Endurance) are disabled once all generators are completed.
- Added a unique effect to the Killer hook state UI that indicates the last Survivor they hooked.
- After completing a “unique hook” (the same Survivor is not hooked consecutively), Killers get the following benefits:
- Bonus damage for the next generator kick.
- Temporary Haste status effect.
- Temporarily reveals Survivors (think basekit BBQ & Chili) that have less or equal hook states to the hooked Survivor.
- These effects are slightly lessened for The Blight, The Dark Lord, The Ghoul, The Hillbilly, and The Nurse.
- These effects are disabled once all generators are completed.
- Added new effects that disincentivize tunneling:
- If a Survivor dies before 6 total hook states, all remaining Survivors gain a repair speed bonus for the rest of the Trial.
- If the Survivor that was last hooked is Sacrificed or Killed, generators cannot be regressed or blocked.
- Added the option to enable or disable these new mechanics in Custom Games.
- Updated several Survivor and Killer perks to account for these changes.
DEV NOTE: It’s no secret that tunneling can be seen as an efficient way to play for Killers. While this can be true, it’s also true that the results of this can be frustrating for Survivors, leading to Trials ending too quickly for some, while leaving others to fend for themselves in a match that is now much more difficult.
The intention here is for both roles to feel the benefits and incentives that come from spreading hook states. On the one end, Survivors have better opportunities to evade and reset after unhooks, while also limiting those tough situations where losing a Survivor too quickly causes things to go south quickly and snowball. On the other end, Killers are able to apply more map pressure to push back against efficient teams, covering ground post-hook and strengthening gen regression.
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/2IOB3V56TMEZ/devupdate-frame.png
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/AFXVD5SDE8KN/devupdate-elusivestatuseffect.png
- Added a new status effect that silences grunts of pain and suppresses Survivor aura, pools of blood, and scratch marks.
DEV NOTE: To start, we’ll be using this new status effect as part of the tunnelling reduction update, but plan to integrate this into relevant existing perks down the road to make their descriptions more streamlined. Arguably the easiest way to look at this is a Survivor version of Undetectable, in that when it’s active, you know you’re in stealth mode.
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/FR61CMRVPLNT/devupdate-frame.png
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/5FYHIP30TAHZ/devupdate-thetomesloreupdate.png
- Updated “The Tomes” menu to feature new Tomes and accompanying lore alongside each Chapter release.
- New lore is unlocked each week within the active Tome.
DEV NOTE: Ever since we reworked the Tome, we’ve seen how much you’ve yearned for more lore. We’re happy to share that beginning with 9.2.0, lore is back! While previously, lore was tied to challenges, we want all players to have a chance to immerse themselves in these stories, so we’ve shifted to a weekly unlock, not linked to any quest completion.
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/N2STWWLLAG7F/devupdate-frame.png
KILLER UPDATES
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/S41GGXGEAAOB/devupdate-theshape.png
- Replaced “Evil Within” with two modes that can be toggled with a button press:
- Stalker Mode: 4.2m/s movement speed, Undetectable, and can stalk Survivors.
- Pursuer Mode: 4.6m/s movement speed, 24m Terror Radius, increased vault speed, bonuses to lunge range, break speed, and stun recovery, and cannot stalk Survivors.
- Once the stalk meter is full, Evil Incarnate mode can be triggered at will, granting the following effects for a limited time (note: Survivors no longer become Exposed):
- 4.6m/s movement speed, 40m Terror Radius and an increased vault speed.
- Unlocks Slaughtering Strike ability:
- Hold the power button to charge this ability, reducing movement speed.
- Press the attack button while charging to quickly lunge forward, adjusting your angle as you move. The length of the lunge depends on charge time.
- If a Survivor enters the Killer’s attack range while lunging, they are knocked into the Dying State.
- This ability can also be used to destroy pallets.
- Unlocks the ability to grab and kill or perform a regular Mori on Survivors who would die the next time they are hooked.
- Adjusted some of the mechanics of stalking:
- Removed the limited pool of stalk points per Survivor.
- Reduced stalk range to 32m and removed distance modifier.
- Moving while stalking has increased movement speed but incurs a reduced stalk rate.
- Reworked his add-ons.
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/KYEB6NKI2G7O/theshape-slaughteringstrike.gif
Slaughtering Strike in action
DEV NOTE: By moving away from linear “Evil Within” tiers, we wanted to give players more tools they can use to adapt to each Trial’s unique situations, while keeping the core of what makes him “The Shape”.
Slaughtering Strike makes for a high-threat offensive attack, offering up an insta-down opportunity with an extended lunge that's particularly effective in loops and for ripping through pallets quickly.
Understanding his kit has changed quite a lot, we’ve done a pass on nearly all his add-ons, reworking many of them to offer more unique effects. In particular for those who prefer his old playstyle, Fragrant Tuft of Hair will change Evil Incarnate to function like old Myers, offering an Exposed effect and no Slaughtering Strike. Stay tuned for patch notes for the full details on these changes!
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/13DLVM9GJD8R/devupdate-frame.png
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/DJ7BRR08E58E/devupdate-theclown.png
- Increased activation time of the Afterpiece Antidote.
- Increased how long the Afterpiece Tonic’s Hindered effect lingers after leaving smoke.
DEV NOTE: We’ve heard your feedback that The Clown’s easier-to-activate Haste can make instigating and maintaining chases less interactive for Survivors. That, coupled with nerfs to his purple bottles has pushed players towards this frustrating tactic. To make both bottles feel like viable options without being too oppressive, we’ve adjusted the values of their most impactful qualities to strike a balance between pre-9.1.0 values and Live values.
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/08BAR9PMARLT/devupdate-frame.png
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/BJJBQ7PGA3IM/devupdate-theunknown.png
- Increased the additional time added to Weakened when injured by a UVX projectile.
- Increased movement speed recovery after teleporting.
- Increased camera vertical range.
- Adjusted several add-ons.
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/WZNAYQQGPMJH/theunknown-uvx-verticalshot.gif
Increased vertical camera range in action
DEV NOTE: The Unknown is largely considered to be fun to play as and against, and we want to preserve that while adapting to the current state of gameplay. We’ve buffed the UVX slightly, while also taking what we learned from The Animatronic to allow for orbitals, improving UVX aiming and making for even more fun gameplay.
It’s also likely no surprise that Blurry Photo is the most used add-on for the Unknown, given the importance of speed recovery. To help create an opportunity for more add-on experimentation, we’ve converted a portion of this add-on into a basekit buff, while also doing a pass on other add-ons that are due for some adjustments.
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/ELLG8CQEDJFB/devupdate-frame.png
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/64DWI89LSQRF/devupdate-thedarklord.png
- Vampire Form:
- Slightly reduced Hellfire cooldown.
- Increased total Hellfire pillars by 1.
- Reduced Hellfire charge movement speed.
- Slightly increased slowdown time after casting Hellfire.
- Wolf Form:
- Increased Pounce Attack charge time.
- Increased Scent Orb spawn time.
- Bat Form:
- Increased movement friction to make flying easier to control.
- Adjusted his add-ons.
DEV NOTE: Vampire Form is slightly less oppressive in short loops where movement slowdown had less of an impact, and toning down Wolf Form’s mobility, which has been outclassing some dash Killers. On the flip side, you’ll find Bat Form easier to control in tighter spaces and can use Hellfire slightly more frequently and reach further with it.
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/ROR59NWGSYC1/devupdate-frame.png
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/V4USCCTSEWGC/devupdate-theghoul.png
- When grabbing a Survivor on the other side of a vault with Kagune Leap, the Survivor is released at the start of The Ghoul’s vault instead of at the end.
DEV NOTE: It’s no secret that it’s been a common pain point for Survivors to be locked in place when hit with a Kagune Leap Grab-Attack across a vault. Survivors shouldn’t have to wait for The Ghoul to finish their vault before being able to move again, so we’ve removed this tech.
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/BSXKYDTEWZ2H/devupdate-frame.png
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/J8NJLH9UUUG9/devupdate-theoni.png
- Hooking a Survivor now spawns more blood orbs.
DEV NOTE: We understand that with the changes we’re making to address slugging, this will impact The Oni slightly, so we want to mitigate this. By turning hooked Survivors into a greater source of power gauge build-up, The Oni is rewarded with more quickly snowballing power by hooking.
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https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/S0UA6IHVKJRL/devupdate-perkupdates.png
- Updated various perks.
DEV NOTE: In addition to the general perk balance updates you can expect each release, we've also made a number of adjustments to account for the new systems coming to DbD this update, specifically relating to slugging and tunneling.
Stay tuned next Tuesday for the PTB Live Balance preview on Discord, where we'll dig into the details of these perk changes, and then follow that up with patch notes, where you can find the nitty-gritty numbers.
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Until next time...
The Dead by Daylight Team
Having the effects randomly be "less effective on certain killers" is massively confusing and leads to more knowledge issues.
I don't think it should work differently for these killers. it should be the same for everything, and if it becomes a problem you adjust those specific killers as needed.
- If a Survivor is left in the Dying State for a total of 90 seconds during a match, they gain the ability to pick themselves up after fully recovering.
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@Skillfulstone said:
Did...did you literally make a thread for the sole purpose of opposing the one from @Daniel_Silva04 ?
In some ways yes. But my point is that there are plenty of people who also like 2v8 and want it to stay.
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@jamally093 said:
What I mean is per generator complete there's supposed to be a repair speed penalty but playing killer and survivor I noticed...it kinda doesn't exist. Playing killer 50% of the time by the time we're half way done on hooks there's maybe 1 generator left now I could be a skill issue but I also noticed on every map most if not all generators are 3 or 4 person. Now I get you can't make the generator penalty permanent then survivor would be a nightmare to play but I noticed if a generator is repaired a hook or two just removes the penalty so it kinda just enters the whole what's the point of the penalty if two hooks removes it. Then again why post this 2v8 stops being fun after 3 days but I would rather play this then deal with ghoul.
Its only 1% per gen done. So great, that 90 second gen now is taking 0.9 seconds less time.
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@sinkra said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3988993#Comment_3988993
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/kb/articles/478-stats-october-2024
Actually the kill rate last year was 57%, but remember killer mains complained so much that it was too survivor sided so these devs kep nerfing survivor and aim for 70% kill rate now, but are too ashamed to show us the new 2v8 stats.
I'm not talking about the stats last time, i'm talking about your claim that its 70%.
Secondly, what changes did they make to nerf survivor in 2v8? Because they did nothing.
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@sinkra said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3988974#Comment_3988974
Yes, the official kill rate was 55%. Now it's closer to 70%.
And you have a source for that data? Or are you just making stuff up?
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@cogsturning said:
I totally don't get the appeal. It's all chaos and pretty much no strategy or teamwork. The perk list is bloated, sure, but at least that gives you different flavors to matches. This is just constant aura reading and selfish survivors.
Except it doesn't the perk list is bloated, until you realize that there's maybe only a dozen good ones for both sides, and of those there's like 5-6 that really stand out, resulting in basically the same match every game anyway.
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@Rulebreaker said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3988497#Comment_3988497
Jumping through alotta hoops to try and justify them.
Welp, if you so desperately wanna use your definition:Toxicity in gaming refers to malicious or hostile player behavior that disrupts the online environment and harms other players, ranging from verbal abuse like hate speech and harassment to behavioral misconduct such as griefing (disrupting gameplay for others) and doxing (sharing private information). This behavior creates an unpleasant and unsafe atmosphere, often escalating due to factors like player anonymity, competitive pressure, and the contagious nature of negative actions within a community.
Kinda hostile to purposefully try and rile up a fellow human wanting to enjoy a game and who did nothing to you as a person within the match (Leon). Kinda malicious and possibly hostile to simply watch a person bleed out for 4ish minutes with them knowing you "could" hook them at any given point but aren't and for reasons at best petty (Nancy was keeping him decently busy durring her 2 chases) at worse just mean (just to watch them bleed. Remember he was explicitly watching her for like 90% of the time). Kinda seemed like he wanted me more than the win as he was ignoring the bot till it forced his hand to slug it.
Could swear this kind of behavior is disruptive (causing disruption: [disturbance or problems which interrupt an event, activity, or process]) to peoples experience of having a "normal" trial because people keep on complaining about things like this. Personally we think its a good reason too. Pretty sure **** like this harms at least some other players either mentally or emotionally. Its defiantly creating an unpleasant atmosphere. The clown seems to be fitting toxic more and more, and thats even if we be nice and exclude malicious since we're not 100% sure what he was thinking.
Hmm…player anonymity, meaning no one can really judge you for your actions. Players being ****s cause theres no consequences? Sounds bout right with many online games. Competitive pressure, meaning wanting to win (or not lose) more than anything else. And the spreading (contagious nature) of negative actions in a community, looking at some of the conversations above for that one. Strange isnt it, that slugging and some of the reasons people seem to slug fit snugly here? All these combined sound like every reason we hear on why people slug.
And before you go on and say something like "its not defined by DBD as griefing" greifing is not the whole definition as this definition says:
ranging from verbal abuse like hate speech and harassment to behavioral misconduct such as griefing (disrupting gameplay for others) and doxing (sharing private information).
Ranging. Theres more to consider than just whatever is considered greifing to be toxic, and that clowns behavior fit pretty well by all the other metrics. Hell slugging in general fits "toxic" pretty well as said above and its not greifing, occasionally its even necessary such as 4 dolts with flashlights. What could that mean? It could mean that you can have valid strategies be used as "toxic". Surprising.
Well…seems like this all fits that definition of "toxicity"…so what hoop is next?
My entire point is that you should be mad at the devs, not at the players for using these strategies. The game does not understand that "tunneling is toxic" because it lets you do it.
Let me put it this way for you.
Lets say i'm a new player, never played the game before. I bought the game because it looks cool, and i queue up as killer. I start playing the game a bit, learning how it works having a good time, but i'm losing a lot of games. So i start focusing on trying to get better. Trying to understand how i should be playing to win more games.
Then, i think to myself, wait, if survivors only have 3 hook states, and when someone gets unhooked they are injured, that means that they are weaker and they should be an easier target. Plus, if i get them out of the game sooner then maybe i'll be able to win games more because i can quickly turn the game into a 1v3 instead of a 1v4. Let me try that.
So, i play another game. This time i try "tunneling" although, i don't even know the name of this thing, its just a stategy that i thought of that naturally emerges from the obvious things the game is presenting. But then i come across a problem, i hit the survivor who gets unhooked, but they get this weird status effect i have never seen before. So i think to myself "hmm this isn't going to work, it looks like they are protected when they are off the hook".
So maybe next game i try playing survivor, to try and understand what it is that is going on, and maybe learn some strategies that i can employ by playing the other side of it. Then it happens, i get hooked, and i see that endurance icon. That's when i see that the protection doesn't last very long, just 10 seconds. So now i think to myself, maybe i can wait out that protection, not hit the survivor, and then hit them when the 10 seconds are up. That should work.
So i queue up another game as killer, and i give it a try. I hook a survivor, wait for them to get unhooked, then count to 10 while chasing them. After 10 seconds, i swing at them, and lo and behold, they are downed! Its working! So i pick them up, put them back on the hook, and then do it again. And it works! They are out of the game, and that was super quick, it only took about a minute or 2. And now the game is a 1v3. From here, i have a much easier time at it and start winning my games more often.
What has just happened here? Did i know i was playing "toxic"? Did i do anything the game didn't let me do? No, i didn't do any of that, i just learned what the game was giving me in terms of information, and employed a strategy that, quite frankly, makes a lot of sense in the context of the game. And, what was the result of that? I won MORE games. The game itself actually encouraged and reinforced this behavior and strategy, because it resulted in me winning more games. So i got the positive reinforcement that this was working and it was the right play to make.
And, whose to say this player is wrong? Again, the game didn't do anything to tell me this was "wrong" if anything it did the opposite, it actively encouraged me that this was the correct way to play the game, by getting me more wins than before.
This player in this scenario is not being toxic, they are simply learning the game with what little tools the game has given you to learn the game.
Thus, my ultimate point again, is that your ire should not be directed at players who employ a strategy that game lets them, and actively rewards them and encourages them to do. You should be directing that anger at the devs who allow such a strategy to flourish.
This is not to say that i think these things are good for the game, i actually don't. I think that tunneling and camping should be completely removed from the game as an impossibility, the game should not encourage me for doing those things. But, i don't direct my anger at players who use it, i direct it to the devs for making horrible decisions and leaving these problems in the game for a literal decade.
At this point, given how long its been in the game, you need to start asking yourself who is to blame here. If it is a strategy that has existed since the inception of the game for nearly a decade, whose fault is it that this strategy exists?
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@Rulebreaker said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3988497#Comment_3988497
Jumping through alotta hoops to try and justify them.
Welp, if you so desperately wanna use your definition:Toxicity in gaming refers to malicious or hostile player behavior that disrupts the online environment and harms other players, ranging from verbal abuse like hate speech and harassment to behavioral misconduct such as griefing (disrupting gameplay for others) and doxing (sharing private information). This behavior creates an unpleasant and unsafe atmosphere, often escalating due to factors like player anonymity, competitive pressure, and the contagious nature of negative actions within a community.
Kinda hostile to purposefully try and rile up a fellow human wanting to enjoy a game and who did nothing to you as a person within the match (Leon). Kinda malicious and possibly hostile to simply watch a person bleed out for 4ish minutes with them knowing you "could" hook them at any given point but aren't and for reasons at best petty (Nancy was keeping him decently busy durring her 2 chases) at worse just mean (just to watch them bleed. Remember he was explicitly watching her for like 90% of the time). Kinda seemed like he wanted me more than the win as he was ignoring the bot till it forced his hand to slug it.
Could swear this kind of behavior is disruptive (causing disruption: [disturbance or problems which interrupt an event, activity, or process]) to peoples experience of having a "normal" trial because people keep on complaining about things like this. Personally we think its a good reason too. Pretty sure **** like this harms at least some other players either mentally or emotionally. Its defiantly creating an unpleasant atmosphere. The clown seems to be fitting toxic more and more, and thats even if we be nice and exclude malicious since we're not 100% sure what he was thinking.
Hmm…player anonymity, meaning no one can really judge you for your actions. Players being ****s cause theres no consequences? Sounds bout right with many online games. Competitive pressure, meaning wanting to win (or not lose) more than anything else. And the spreading (contagious nature) of negative actions in a community, looking at some of the conversations above for that one. Strange isnt it, that slugging and some of the reasons people seem to slug fit snugly here? All these combined sound like every reason we hear on why people slug.
And before you go on and say something like "its not defined by DBD as griefing" greifing is not the whole definition as this definition says:
ranging from verbal abuse like hate speech and harassment to behavioral misconduct such as griefing (disrupting gameplay for others) and doxing (sharing private information).
Ranging. Theres more to consider than just whatever is considered greifing to be toxic, and that clowns behavior fit pretty well by all the other metrics. Hell slugging in general fits "toxic" pretty well as said above and its not greifing, occasionally its even necessary such as 4 dolts with flashlights. What could that mean? It could mean that you can have valid strategies be used as "toxic". Surprising.
Well…seems like this all fits that definition of "toxicity"…so what hoop is next?
No its not hostile to rile someone up. Is a survivor teabagging toxic? The point is that its a strategy. Have you never been to a tournament before for nearly any game, or sport, or boxing, or football, or anything? Its a strategy to get in the head of your opponents and get them to make a mistake.
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@Coffeecrashing said:
In 2v8, BHVR should be super buffing survivors, and super nerfing Legion and Oni, to balance the 2v8 queue times.
We really should be making 2v8 massively survivor sided, to get the queue times more balanced.
Edit: Alternatively, give survivors a bunch of ridiculous items or abilities, that are too powerful for 1v4, like unavoidable flashbang grenades that only affect killers. Or fog crystals that completely block killer vision, but survivors can easily see through them. The killer queue times are so horribly bad, that 2v8 could easily support these ridiculous items.
2v8 is already survivor sided. In normal DBD there are 5 gens and roughly 12-15ish pallets per map (depending on map. In 2v8, you have twice the survivors and killers, but only 8 gens to do, and there's like 50+ pallets on the map.
The queue times are a problem because of the novelty of being able to play killer with a friend. If they just left 2v8 on for like 6 months, it would wear off and eventually start to even out. But the problem is the game probably couldn't survivor 6 months of horrible queues, so its a bad idea to do it.