ReikoMori
ReikoMori
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@HamsterEnjoyer said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3607949#Comment_3607949
I don't think game companies endorse someone never buying a game or dlc but using the game or dlc for free. I don't have a problem with it but to complain to BHVR about it is weird to me because its obvious they wouldn't fix it even if they could
They literally agreed to it when they entered into a distribution agreement with Steam. Family sharing has been around for years and is a well understood and codified system
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@Iron_Cutlass said:
NOTE: If had this sitting in my Drafts for a really long time since I just couldnt find the best way to articulate my thoughts into words, and I still couldnt even today, I thought I might as well post it how it is.
Anytime I see a discussion about For The People being paired with other perks, I always hear/see "For The People is only useable with (insert perk)" or "For The People on it's own isnt good enough to warrant a perk slot" but Im going to massively disagree.
For The People can easily turn a situation in which a Survivor is being tunneled out of the match into something more manageable since you can instantly transfer a health state right after unhooking the Survivor. In most of my SoloQ matches, my teammates recognize that I have For The People and let me use it on them to get them out of tricky situations.
In a SWF, the perk becomes infinitely stronger since you can coordinate healing much easier and can transfer health states to anyone who needs it much easier, this perk having a team support focus shines bright in situations where your team communicates.
One of the easiest to create scenario is the Killer coming back to the hook to tunnel out the Survivor on who is going to die on hook, using FTP on them gives them two guaranteed health states that the Killer has to go through, three health states and potentially more if other anti-tunnel perks like Decisive Strike, Off The Record, or Dead Hard are in play. You buy significantly more time for that Survivor (and by proxy, your entire team).
And, probably the least talked about part of the perk, becoming the Obsession. This perk is really good at trading the Obsession around which can be a deterrent for any Killer who may be using Obsession focused perks like Save The Best For Last. Also the extra Bloodpoints you get from escaping/dying as the Obsession is a really nice bonus that helps make this perk more incentivized to be picked.
And while I know a lot of people do not care for Competitive DBD, For The People has been a really consistent pick for Competitive DBD solely from what the perk enables players to do from a support standpoint.
So yea... consider using For The People... honestly you dont even need Buckle Up since Killers act like it's there anyways and just wont hit you... Idk why you are still reading this...
Transferring the obsession is a weakness for survivors and a strength for killers. The reality of that weakness is that if someone is getting tunneled out and they happen to be the obsession with STBFL in play it means the killer is about to lose perk value the moment that person dies. By switching the obsession from them to yourself you've just extended the amount of time they can get value from that perk. Most players already hate facing a killer with STBFL and would much rather the obsession get tunneled out so they can stop needing to play around it.
For the people is a fine perk on its own, but it also requires you to be a fairly skilled player who can navigate starting a chase injured. Most players simply aren't at that level of skill so it makes sense that the majority of people don't view the perk as purely good on its own. It being a consistent pick in comp dbd cuts both ways as well it showcases its strength, but also highlights its weaknesses as comp dbd has structured rule sets that often ban out better value perks.
Every perk is infinitely stronger in a SWF. That's like saying "every fight is winnable if I have my homies backing me up."
The strength of the health state play varies wildly depending on the killers in play. The high tier killers don't really lose time dealing with the extra health states and several mid tier killers straight up bypass health states. So a lot of this "strength" is actually dependent on the difference in skill between the killer and survivor. Trusting random teammates to be good is crapshoot in the best of conditions.
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@GentlemanFridge said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3606041#Comment_3606041
Does it have to Hello Zepp specifically, though? I dunno why an original composition with similar instrumentation wouldn't do it. AFAIK we don't have a single track that's straight-up lifted from the source. ST's menu thing comes very close, but still is an original.
Myers has the music from the actual films, but altered to better fit the composition structure of a DBD chase track it seems. An original composition can work, but Hello Zepp is what everyone knows and wants as it is the iconic track of the Saw Franchise. Wesker and Nemesis got completely original tracks that are unique to DBD as the themes related to them don't necessarily fit well with this game which is a good call. Honestly, it's that way for every licensed killer save for Freddy, Leatherface, Pig, and Myers.
Freddy's probably just forever boned due to being based on the remake which has very little to no memorable music. TCM as a franchise isn't super known for it's music especially with the first film being actually purposely light on scoring. Myers has his music and even had a bit more of it, but I think some parts got swapped out over time. While it never has to be Hello Zepp it is preferred and I'm going to be very blunt and say that for me personally I do not trust the current direction of music department anymore.
The last few themes, from the killer side perspective, have been varying degrees of awful. I haven't had a chance to listen to Chucky's yet to see if things have improved. Xeno, Merchant, and Singularity were by far some of biggest misses with music imo. Xeno's did get better, but it still isn't as good as it could be while Merchant's kinda got worse. All this is to say if the license is obtainable and it makes sense cost wise I would much rather that they get it. If it isn't then using the default themes are fine cause they are actually pretty good.
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@Mooks said:
Because when they were added to the game unique chase music wasn’t part of the deal and everyone (except Myers I guess) had the default music and they haven’t come around to create/add music for these killers.
As for the licensed ones, it might additionally be due to the licensing in general as it would need new negotiations and stuff. (It is very weird that Saw got their own rift but still didn’t get chase music for pig).
Also they wanted to only add music when they made changes to the specific killer. And just general stuff they simultaneously work on, new killers etc and they can’t just create this in bulk for everyone at once.
In Pig's case it really just comes down to Charlie Clouser being willing to license out Hello Zepp seemingly. It seems like while the rights holders of the films love working with BHVR they don't have the say on whether or not the music can be used. That's my guess anyway.
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@Toaster427 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3604078#Comment_3604078
not a single killer is opening a locker using this perk to find a survivor inside a locker. they just spam it the whole match to have constant wallhacks
They are opening the locker to find a survivor though which is point though even if they aren't looking for anyone inside the locker.
You said folks are using Ultimate Weapon are getting a benefit for doing nothing to advance their objective. Ultimate Weapon's only function is to help the killer advance their objective and to activate it they have to take an action that falls squarely into doing something that advances their objective.
There is a case to be made that the perk is slightly overtuned, but it isn't a free win. Survivors have things on par with it's level of power and ease of use as well. Solo survivor has never been a great experience and it isn't ever going to be a great experience, but that isn't because killers have busted perks which by and large they really don't. It's because this game is almost ten years old with very little mechanical changes to the way game can be played. Power creep's a factor dragging down the game for all parties, but the fact that this game is for the most part "solved" is a much bigger culprit. Communication between players is such a huge boon that no change other than making it a feature of the game can measure up to it.
They've tried to bridge the gap by updating the hud with more info, QoL features, and even making targeted perk changes to basically circumvent specific degenerate playstyles until more substantial adjustments can be made. Killers aren't really getting buffed to deal with SWF either they are just getting buffs because they need changes to feel better to play and push more variety into trials. In a lot of cases killers have been taking a lot of L's in terms of getting reworked, buffed, or bugfixed.
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@Toaster427 said:
Ultimate Weapon is free information for doing nothing but opening a locker, you don't even have to do anything in your objective, on small maps it's GGs since it hits everyone.
Now we have friend's till the end and again, spoon-feeds killers a free down, has so many negative effects that it's stronger than most 2 perks combined.
when is BHVR going to start looking at Solo queue survivors and ask themselves...wow are really making their experience just downright awful. your 60% kill rate means nothing when 50% of your solo queue are the ones actually dying every match.
these last two years have been absolutely awful for solo queue, you've given massive buffs to deal with SWFs, and what did we get? status icons? while simultaneously buffing killers to the point that playing solo queue now is one of the hardest experiences in gaming now?
I don't even know why I play this game anymore, I've been playing for so long holding out in hopes that BHVR will actually pay attention to the players that makes up the majority of their entire playerbase....but nope...just continued punches in the face....it's like BHVR is actively trying to send the message to these players that they don't want them playing their game.
Killer's only objective is to find and hook survivors.
So by checking the locker they are literally working on their objective.
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@Gastongard said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3604026#Comment_3604026
Opposite extreme? Its the most common thing nowadays to play in this way, tunnel out a survivor at 5 gens, sooner if possible, If I could tunnel them out of the lobby I sure would do it. And running 4 regressions perks as well, so every killer plays the same way, why is it a problem when a survivor tries to play differently? Not gen rushing, not being toxic, etc, just playing stealthy. Just think it for a moment and tell me its not hypocrite to say that.
Running 4 regression perks is a consequence of the inherent flaws in gameplay.
There isn't really much incentive to not run regression when it is what has the most tangible effects on game out come regardless of playstyle, skill level, or killer. Survivors need an overhaul to their objective to make it more dynamic which would naturally increase the amount of time it takes to get done. That would decrease the value of running a ton of regression when done along side target reductions to the actual amount of regression perks.
There really isn't a reason to stealth as hard as some survivors do to the point of non interaction or even worse actively harming their own teammates, but it isn't like this is a new issue. It's been happening in cycles for the lifespan of the game where survivors devolve into hyper immersion for a number of reasons and the games are generally just less enjoyable for it. The game's also less enjoyable if you're tunneling from second 1, at least to me anyway though at the very least you're engaged with the game in a somewhat interesting way.
Stealth is a great way to play survivor and personally I prefer it whenever I did play survivor, but I do not understand what folks gain from hyper stealthing. Even back in the old days of early DBD never saw the point in trying to totally vanish all game.
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@adaw0ng said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3600336#Comment_3600336
The power is literally called "Jigsaw baptism" and she is supposed to be following his legacy and it's Jigsaw's traps still. Let's not be obtuse on purpose, please. The timer should for sure stop whenever she is crouching in a certain radious from a trapped survivor, or even regress it if it's for an extended amount of time. Remember that you can guarantee a kill if you use the Iri addon to start the trial with all helmets on, use Lethal Pursuer and you just pair passive slowdowns to make sure the helmet will pop before all gens can be done.
It's sad that such an interesting and actual slowdown for survivors in a power gets dragged down because of lame and boring playstyles. Changes for her have been announced for 2024 so I really hope they try to push her power to be useful in chase and weaken the lethality of the traps for afking pressing W behind a survivor while being crouched.
Amanda's main arc in the films is that she's an addict who traded drugs for obsessing over John. She does not actually care about his legacy and fundamentally did not understand the purpose of his tests which is displayed by the fact that every single test she personally setup was impossible to survive. This is even something John figured out about her and on his deathbed essentially placed her in another test without her knowing to see if she could actually stop cheating. She fails and gets shot as a result of not changing her ways and robbing others of their chance to learn from the tests.
She gets the beartrap as her power because it's the most significant test to her as it was originally the test she had pass which led her to become one of the apprentices.
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@[Deleted User] said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3601813#Comment_3601813
I think the simplest solution would be to shift Whispers from a perk to a basekit mechanic when it's a 2v1 and gens remain. They could even introduce a showdown scenario where the remaining gens automatically go to 1 once a chase starts. The other survivor has to crank out the gen, and the one in chase has to survive for 90 seconds.
Or they could just make so emoting and constantly dropping and picking items stop preventing the AFK crows from spawning which is the actual simplest solution and just make so when there is only one or two survivors left if they aren't attempting to either work on a gen or actively in a chase they start to gain crows. That way the game is telling them 'Hey you need to keep making attempts rather than hiding'.
That solves several issues across all assumed skill levels. New players fall back to constantly hiding because they don't understand and this will teach them rather quickly that they shouldn't hide like that. Experience players fall back to hiding typically out of spite due to being at a disadvantage and this makes it clear that isn't okay and that they either need to make attempts or die trying.
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@[Deleted User] said:
It's a fair complaint, but the survivors need to be given a reason to continue trying. There currently isn't one. What's the upside for them to continue working on generators in a 2v1? Zero. They cannot win that game. There are only downsides, like exposing themselves to the killer.
While i agree that there isn't a lot of reasons to keep trying at that point as a survivor it isn't right to just grind the game to a standstill through constant immersion. It's on the same level as a killer trying to stall the game till server closeout rather than just progressing things normally so everyone can move on to the next game in a timely fashion.
Something needs to be done to prevent survivors from circumventing the measures that are already in place to prevent permanent AFK hiding. As a collective group we shouldn't be able to waste each others' time to such a degree.
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@Cecaelia said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3591397#Comment_3591397
As I mentioned before if you paid any attention, I do not mind waiting longer. If the killer doesn't want to wait a long time they can just switch killers. There are 30 of them, it's not that hard. I know people will veto blight, huntress, nurse from the jump so it is what it is for that. Also like I said, you can only ban one, if you're swf then your lobby can only ban one. Ideally it would match survivors with the huntress banned together and then shoot them into a lobby, not one survivor has huntress, one has xeno, one has pinhead, one has blight so that lobby cannot get those four killers. One killer per lobby.
I will happily wait a match time for a killer to get out of a match and queue another one if that means I'm not facing a huntress for the 12th time in a row. (:
I paid attention, but your suggestion isn't sound. Just because you don't mind waiting longer doesn't mean that everyone else wants to wait with you and that goes for both sides not just killers.
It takes 4 survivors to make a match and you're saying to give each one of them a ban option. So that is 4 killers banned every game, for the individual that seems inconsequential(setting aside the issues of player bias and using mechanics to dictate 'approved' play), yet when you consider that this process repeats for every single concurrent match being played you end up with a massive queue of players who aren't playing matches of any sort. While killers can just switch that doesn't solve the problem you'd create as any semblance of matchmaking around skill level would become impossible. You're probably willing to wait the length of a singular match for a game, but probably wouldn't stand for waiting potentially 40+mins or more.
There are 30 killers and your suggested system would shave that pool down to 26 at any given moment and switching killers isn't an easy process. It requires dropping from matchmaking every time you need to change your killer and while most players have most or all killers they don't play them all with a high degree of comfort or skill. It's more common to see people who play 1-4 killers well at most since to truly get the hang of killer is a bit of commitment and a lot of stuff doesn't transfer skill wise between killers due to different powers and playstyles. This isn't the sort of game that has been designed with bans in mind and instituting them would just make people play less which would just add to inflated queue times.
Bans would be fundamentally destructive to the overall experience no matter which side you favor once you get to scale because this game isn't remotely designed to handle something like that.
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@Cecaelia said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3591155#Comment_3591155
They can enjoy the game how they want too, I just shouldn't be privy to it.
As for veto I'm okay with waiting longer queue times if that means I get more variety in what killers I am facing. Like I said, I'm sick of huntress every single round.
You're just going to end up getting matched against the Huntresses in the end as for that to even be functional it has to have a default time limit imposed or else matchmaking will grind to a halt because when you have 4 people each with a ban multiplied by the average size of a region you're eventually going to run out of suitable matchups to be made in a timely fashion.
I guess the frustration of low diversity in opponents, but at the very least consider the consequences of what you're suggesting.
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@Xyvielia said:
Always wondered what DBD would be like (Micro-transactions and such, aside!) if BHVR joined a major company to fully fund everything to get the game in a better place, where it needs to be, or could be.
Just to be able to play this game in the most optimized state…
BHVR is a major company unto itself and quite old as well. It isn't like they're a small indie operation.
@FilthyLegionRevival said:
I know people are going to come in saying that it would take way too much time to build it from the ground up but you're forgetting one crucial element. Dead By Daylight mobile's engine. That's more stable and optimised than what we have over in the core branch. Since the dev studio is partnered with the folks behind mobile, why not use the already established engine they have and improve on it for the core game?
Having this framework would reduce overall instability ranging from game performance and the likelihood of bugs. Due to this and other factors, the efficiency at which the programmers can work on the game would be increased by a noticeable amount and would be less hassle for them than it already is with the structure the current one has. I'm willing to accept criticism as I'd like to hear genuine discussion had on this topic since I've never seen anyone talk about the possibility of rebuilding the engine using an already established one like mobile's.
The mobile game is extremely different from the console/pc game. The dev tools, teams, and functional foundations are very different as well. You can't just port things between them with ease as even the assets made by the dbd mobile team are built to meet wholly different specifications. Even if they were to somehow magically change their entire backend engine over to the mobile's engine you would not see an increase in efficiency or stability. You're now going to have a considerable experience deficit which means efficiency is going to be worse until they get used to the new tools, the things you've made for the original version of the game now have to be rebuilt in the new framework.
They'd also just end up inheriting the limitations of the mobile framework which will be to the game's detriment. Though again, the two games are extremely different under the hood in key ways making this pretty much impossible to do without a massive time and cash expense if it were to be possible to begin with.
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@JustDevin said:
i think if they did a dead space chapter with a necromorph as a killer and then Isaac and ellie as survivors plus the usg ishimura as a map would be so awsome
No.
We have Necromorph at home.
Necromorph at home: Singularity.
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@Jay_K said:
A map for FNAF wouldn't work. Thinking back to other licensed maps the design is already done for the most part. RPD was Basicly a carbon copy of the original game (likely had the original files for the level to tweak) and the other maps like lampkin and badham were very easy to create as they are generic houses. FNAF would ideally be the pizzaria however this map would be far to small for dbd gameplay and the only thing you have to go off is the security footage and the blueprint.
I would never rule out FNAF as being a possibility maybe not for this killer but it would be fairly silly of bhvr to not bring it eventually given there is a big following for that game.
They likely had access to the design documents, but everything needed to be made bespoke considering RE2 remake is made in capcom's proprietary RE engine. I would assume that assets used in that engine would be extremely difficult to downport to UE4 let alone the version that DBD is using.
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@ResidentHobo said:
TL;DR: DbD used to be scary but has consistently been updated to "improve meta," the indirect result of which has been a diminishment of the game's horror themes. As a result, every new update has been a direct downgrade in terms of both aesthetic and general game-play. No one seems to know how to fix this and honestly at this point, I don't believe a fix is actually possible.
When DbD was released, it was a very dark game; not just thematically, but visually as well. The darkness of the game along with the originally very narrow field of view of its three killers contributed heavily to a stealth-based meta. This style of game-play, along with the dark atmosphere, was much more intense and thematically in line with the game's horror aesthetic. Today, however, we can see that the game has devolved into a brightly-lit , goofy, "run in circles" simulator where perks as well as a substantially larger quantity of pallets have been added in order to enforce competitiveness at the cost of theme and atmosphere. Hiding is still possible, of course, but with the enormous FoV that killers currently have, along with the fact that most maps take place in brightly lit environments, stealth has taken a back-seat to looping in terms of usefulness; the game's horror aesthetic suffers immensely for this.
Endurance and the perks which enable it have additionally created and enforced the idea that getting hit by a killer is often not a big deal, further removing the game from its horror roots.
The addition of 'survive with friends' wasn't inherently bad. Many people had requested the feature and it was honestly cool that the developers listened to the players. However, as the game was not initially built for SWF, many of the perks had to be re-balanced in order compensate for the occasional usage of voice communications; this re-balance has still not reached a point resembling satisfactory. Combined with skill-based-matchmaking, SWF makes it inevitable that you will reach a point, especially as killer, where the game simply is not fun. The primary game-play loop, similarly to the game's perks, was not designed to be engaged with VC and to this day, four players with voice communications have an immense leg up on every killer solely by utilizing these two functions in conjunction. This issue unfortunately combines with the former two and compounds the issue of Dead by Daylight's loss of identity.
As the game has continued and new characters have been added, a number have found it harder to fit in to the cast when compared to others. Trickster, Skull Merchant, and the Singularity, for example, are far from the typical person would describe as "horror."
Finally, the addition of charms is cute. Cute is not scary. A fair quantity of character skins fall into this category as well and I'm wondering at this point if the developers have simply given up on the idea of this being a horror game.
Dead by Daylight has been on this downward slope for a long time and, unfortunately, the largest amount of damage was done so early-on that a reversion to the original "meta" for lack of a better term would essentially require the creation of an entirely new game in addition to the deletion of the current one; obviously this will not happen.
...I guess "press [F] to pay respects." The game is still fun sometimes but even with (and sometimes due to) these mountains of added content, DbD is a frustrating and hollowed-out shadow of its former self.
The default killer FoV is 87 and has been 87 basically the entire time so that hasn't really changed and doesn't really change unless you use specific perks.
DBD isn't running on the exact same engine as when it released anymore and the game being as dark as it was in general wasn't good. Same with the fog and moonlight offerings, they were by and large more disruptive than thematic on top of coming with a rather severe resource penalty on lower end hardware. The brighter maps and cleaner graphics make engaging with the game less terrible and removed certain "competitive" elements such as everyone just playing Claudette wearing the bloodstained plaid and hiding endlessly because the graphics made it impossible to see her on most maps available at the time.
The abandonment of stealth as being the main focus for survivor gameplay is wholly due to how we as players started to approach the game and what could be done to optimize gameplay. This is also something that isn't entirely consistent across the board as different regions approach the game differently, but the bulk of players tend to prefer chase oriented gameplay over much slower immersive gameplay. The game is ultimately a pvp game and thus needed to be designed in ways to encourage player interaction and currently chases are the only real type of interactivity between both sides. If you want more immersive gameplay trends then you need to lobby for wholly different ways to play DBD.
Cosmetic items don't diminish the horror of the game or horror as a concept. Cute things can be scary, colorful can be scary, but most importantly a game doesn't last as long as this one has without having a steady way path to monetization when it comes to live service games. For as much as people complain about it the cosmetic items work. They would not make them if players didn't want them and didn't buy them. There are plenty of on brand horror themed items as there are just cute things.
Trickster, Skull Merchant, and Singularity are what a typical person would describe as horror because the horror genre is multifaceted. Horror is also expressed differently based on which cultural lens you are viewing it through. Trickster and Skull Merchant are serial killers which translates across culture, but they differ in their additional elements. Skull Merchant is wrapped in the aesthetic of Brazilian horror manga, now you can argue whether it misses the mark or not, but that seems to be what they were shooting for. Trickster is very much a play on the horror themed K-drama which approaches slasher type killers differently than western horror does. Singularity is Sci-Fi body horror where technology runs rampant and flesh gets used in all the wrong ways by being seeking perfection of form.
As much as I dislike what SWF has done to the game over time we can't keep saying that this wasn't what they intended because they've said on this forum in other threads that it was always something they intended to be in the game, but just couldn't get it in right at the time they shipped the game. So whether we like or not it seems to be stated intent.
I agree with you on the expansive growth of perks featuring endurance.
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@dbdthegame said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3577984#Comment_3577984
So you're telling me solo q are actually competent in Asia?
Where can I buy a cheap flight to Japan? Asking for a friend.
You're actually probably looking to go to South Korea or China servers, but you're going to most likely be extremely disappointed as they are regions that huge on self-reliance and consider perks like self-care worth running even with its current day drawbacks. You'll also be playing against a entirely different set of meta killers who've specialized in punishing high end solo player tactics so you if you're struggling in your current region you'll still be struggling in the Asia regions as well.
Keep in mind that you're basically going to go from being what could be considered decent player in your region to potentially what is considered a bad player in another region until you adjust to how that region approaches the game.
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@BBTschak said:
When using Head On you can enter a Locker without noise. This has a cooldown of ~15 sec. No additional changes.
I noticed that Head On is the only exhaustion Perk that you have to use in combination with annother Perk (Quick&Quiet) to effectivly use in a chase.
This limits the use of Head On.
I think with this change you will see alot more Head On and it frees a Perkslot for something else.
There are alot of Maps with very few Locker and alot of them are in bad places.
When you get one of those bad Maps atleast you have 3 Perks and half of your Build is not completely useless.
TLDR: Add a mini Quick and Quiet to Head On (only for Lockers) with a cooldown so you are not forced to use Quick&Quiet everytime you want to use Head On.
What do you think?
Head On isn't meant to be a perk used in chase to start with. It's actually a perk meant to be used to stop a chase involving one your teammate and to counter locker grabs.
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@Marc_123 said:
Yeah would be nice but i doubt it.
But you are right - less and less people think about everything being digital today.
My DVDs and BRs still work with no internet but all Apple, Disney, Amazon bought movies and series won´t. And if they go broke one day everything you bought is just lost forever.
With games it is an issue since PS3. PS1 and PS2 couldn´t have any patches - these games had to work and be complete out of the box.
Recent games you sometimes can´t play without a day one patch... which is sad.
PS3 and Xbox 360 games could and did have patches. On a quite regular basis on top of having multiple firmware updates for the console itself. It's literally the generation that started the trend of DLC and microtransaction economies.
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@PreorderBonus said:
So I bought Naughty Bear today, and the only time I hear voice lines in-game is when I spawn. I expected him to have at least a few more, especially because he has a few in the menu. Even killers like Wesker and Trickster make comments when you down someone or get stunned. But Naughty Bear doesn't.
I guess I was expecting the same level of dialogue as the other speaking killers. Even legendary skins like Birkin's Blight get a lot of new voice lines.
So that isn't Naughty Bear, but the narrator from Naughty Bear.
In the original game he only really talked at the start of a level and when you killed all the other bears in the level and during certain event kills. When you killed everyone in a level the narrator would say "Total De-fluffication! You De-fluffed them all!"
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@kin said:
those who do not play to win will continue to play not to win, those who play to win will continue to play to win. Nothing will change and it will not get worse, I doubt that most of the players will somehow change their style of play when they get the opportunity to see how good or bad they are in the game. After they do, nothing will change, at least globally...you're being too dramatic
That's not entirely true. It's a known fact that people's behavior changes depending on whether or not they're able to observed and graded.
The entire reason to have leaderboards and stat tracking is to assess the level of perceived skill between yourself and others. So people will change their approach to the game and if the reward is based on achieving a certain level rather than just completing challenges then people that get motivated by that sort of thing will act on that motivation.
The OP's concern is valid if a bit hyperbolic. Player cards are nice if they are designed well, but it would be great if they were flair only and that were obtainable by everyone through actions that didn't necessarily drive folks to be hyper competitive. Stuff that unlocks after playing X amount of games, doing gens, healing, or using your power. If there is a particularly fancy looking player card just make it something you can get for a few shards. People who want to like really get into collecting the cards will while not necessarily being incentivized to play every game competitively.
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@UndeddJester said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3573226#Comment_3573226
Should definitely not watch Jigsaw... please never promote that film and forget it exists...
I was right in the middle of my new player DBD hype, full Pig fan boy grin on my face. Watched the first 6 Saw films, enjoyed them all, skipped Saw 3D cause that also doesn't exist, and decided to check this film out.
I have never been in the middle of a franchise high during a film as hard as I was watching Jigsaw... honestly you could have almost done anything and I'd have lapped it up... but man...
Every scene that went by kept knocking a chip off my enthusiasm, I was still fanboying hard, watching and enjoying but it kept taking knocks... stupid ######### that made no sense with the core concept of Saw blatantly absent. I kept shrugging it off and letting myself go with the film, but the repeated logical and narrative screw ups were eating at my forgiveness...
Then we got to the silo scene... and the rake... and to quote Popeye "that's all I can stands, and I can't stands no more...". My rose-tinted fanboy glasses didn't just crack, they snapped clean in two, and I went from happy wide-eyed fan, to full angry nerd rant mode in a single instant. I couldn't even finish the film I was that angry... my mate did watch it to completion to see if I was overreacting or missing something, and in so doing he became just as irate as me.
This anecdote is obviously not evidence the film is bad... but honestly outside of my personal opinion, there is so much objectively wrong/contradictory to the point of Saw in it, it's a miracle someone managed to screw it up so badly.... and I doubt anyone wants a 10 page essay explaining why...
But please... never recommend that film again... it brings nothing but pain to Saw fans... 😥
I've been watching Saw since the very first film and seen them all save for Spiral and X. I'm a fan and I think Jigsaw is fine.
It's not a great film, but it's fine. Though I also don't ever expect that the disciples will ever be as good as John was because they do not have the same reasoning for doing what they are doing that John had. I go into each film with the explicit understanding that it needs to not be measured against the first 4 films or else it is going to be impossible to actually find anything to enjoy. I think Jigsaw has plenty of things to enjoy on it's own which is why I suggest it.
If you don't like it, you don't like it. But don't speak as if you speak for all fans of Saw.
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@Vanishlord said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3572852#Comment_3572852
Yeah most of the disiples in Saw who were popular are literally Hoffman and Amanda and in DBD they would be practically the same. Reverse bear traps are the only traps that could really work in dbd off the top of my head. I would be happy to see legendary skins like they do for silent hill.
https://sawfilms.fandom.com/wiki/Laser_Collars?so=search
You should watch Jigsaw.
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@tippy2k2 said:
John Kramer would absolutely work. He has always been a serial killer who likes to pretend like he's a good person by killing people he has decided don't appreciate their life (my personal favorite being the Janitor who smokes and therefore deserves to have his chest caved in).
Hoffman took the janitor Hank not John. That's important to remember along with the fact that not everyone he targeted he actually had a hand in their kidnapping or the ultimate construction of the game they were placed in. He also unlike his disciples did adhere to his promise to make test that were able to passed.
His reasoning isn't necessarily rock solid in a lot of his earlier games as a lot of them are for revenge rather than a bid to push people to appreciate their lives. The reasoning gets further abstracted once he's no longer around to personally oversee the games and the other pick up where he left off. Hoffman's goals aren't the same as John's, Amanda is an obsessive addict who traded drugs for John's approval.
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Lightborn is extremely helpful if you have photosensitivity issues and even if you just like having information. You get aura reading on whoever tries to blind you and if you're running lethal pursuer you get for longer so it's like a little mid match lethal pursuer which comes in handy.
Rarely will Lightborn ever contribute to a killer losing which is why I always find it weird when survivors will say people running lightborn just mans more time will be spent on gens. They're gonna be on gens regardless because most players don't completely throw their objective to just follow someone around with a lightstick. That take always sounds like copium, but it is true that most who use lightborn also tend to not be as good at wall facing or moving with camera tilts.
Personally, I think needing to use camera tilt movement is kind of trash because it highlights how binary the entire interaction is. It either works or it doesn't and it doesn't feel all that skillful. It's more skill to attempt a blind rather than defeat a blind, since most players aren't trying to blind you through geometry cracks and just blinding you at animation locks that level of skill isn't that much higher than walking with you camera panned up or down.
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@CountOfTheFog said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3569034#Comment_3569034
I play on Switch. There's thunder, lightning and rain in Friday the 13th: The Game which is peer to peer and 8 players in a Match. You'll be fine.
F13 despite its other issues somehow is better built to handle the limitations of last gen hardware.
Weather effects would be alright for maybe three games before losing all aesthetic effect and 20 games until folks start finding the weird ways it can be used as a gameplay advantage because of some weird way it'll be implemented in this game compared to any other game with weather effects.
That's sort of the fate of almost everything added to the game it seems sadly.
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@CountOfTheFog said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3572319#Comment_3572319
What's PH chop chop?
If you are facing a pyramid head and reach full torment status he gets the option to use FInal Judgement which he basically chops a survivor in half on bias. Like the way you'd cut a grilled cheese sandwich in half. It's different from his mori where you get wrapped in metal and he stabs you.
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@mizark3 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3570830#Comment_3570830
They are neither unnecessary, nor without cause. I explicitly laid out how it is 'Exploiting bugs ... to obtain a competitive advantage', which is laid out as a bannable reason on BHVR's rules list.
Support tickets are dealt with quickly, and that is how outside program cheaters are best dealt with. It doesn't slow down the review of videos to submit a plaintext report.
A plaintext report is still a report that has to be reviewed which is a waste of time. Per singular instance it is negligible, but it adds up over time in conjunction with all the other instances of junk reports.
Hug tech isn't regarded as bannable else the devs would have made a statement letting us know expressly that it was. They've done it in the past for other actually serious exploits so people can't say they weren't warned. Hug tech has been in the game since they've had Blight and rather than killswitch, issue ban warnings, revert to ptb state or launch a fix they've left him as is. For years. At this point it either isn't considered high priority which means it isn't going to result in anyone getting banned or it can't be fixed without a huge amount of work and doesn't have a outsized negative effect on the game so they're not going to fix it unless absolutely necessary.
So yeah, it's kinda unnecessary to make reports for this particular thing. Almost the entire game is players "Exploiting bugs to obtain a competitive advantage" because that sort of statement is very vague and could be used to describe most actions a player can take that isn't an expressly stated mechanic. You gonna report survivors for running through fat shame spots, killers being able to moonwalk survivors down, Wesker sliding, killers avoiding blinds by looking up, down, or into walls? If we're strictly talking about bugs used for competitive advantage these things technically classify.
You're not reporting these though because that would be a silly waste of time and that same logic applies here.
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@mizark3 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3570638#Comment_3570638
"I want to get away with cheating by doing things expressly against the rules and don't want to risk my cool 'drop tech'/'hug tech' being temp banned" is what I heard. Problems should be addressed, and this is one of our only means of raising awareness to these problems. Posting on the forums is yet another realm available to us. How would you like it if someone said "I disagree with you, so I want you silenced on the forum"? It is just silly.
The important stuff in the queue is stuff you plug in a support ticket for, typically with video evidence. They respond quickly when you provide video evidence of hatchet throwing Ghostfaces, or a Deathslinger reloading and moving at 5m/s, but the ticket-less reports are likely in a backlog. Essentially this won't hinder the critically important reports, so I still advocate reporting cheaters regardless of the degree.
I'm not concerned with your stance on hug tech and I don't care if it stays or goes frankly.
You shouldn't be encouraging people to file unnecessary reports against other players without an actual cause. You may not like hug tech, but it isn't a reportable offense. Just like using the current portal/void infinites aren't reportable because while they may not be the fairest thing ever it isn't cheating or exploiting in a way that warrants reporting.
All you do by reporting hug tech users is slowdown the process of dealing with actual cheaters and exploiters who are going out of their way to ruin games.
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@mizark3 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3570388#Comment_3570388
To add on to this, don't forget that exploiting bugs is a temp ban offense. Make sure to report 'hug tech' Blights and 'drop tech' Survivors.
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/Y7SY39YHLKD3/bugexploitsarebannable.png
Found here - https://support.deadbydaylight.com/hc/en-us/articles/4408581146516-What-actions-will-result-in-a-temporary-ban-
Cheating is cheating, don't justify your cheating just because you aren't using external software. Play with bugs with friends in private lobbies, but keep that out of normal matchmaking or risk a justified ban.
Do not listen to this person.
The devs aren't going to hand out bans for use of hug tech and you're just going to be putting in reports that clog up the support system.
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@Firellius said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3568898#Comment_3568898
The game doesn't only consist of defensive play in that regard there is not problem.
It does if the killer wants it to. That's the problem.
The killer is still engaging with the game when in proxy, but they are doing so from a dominant position. Yes, you will be expected to work under less than optimal conditions to circumvent the dominance of a proxy camp. Yes, it requires players to act in a coordinated manner and the game gives you limited tools to coordinate. It's on you to figure out how to make that work because as I keep saying just giving you more things will not improve your experience solo play.
We don't need to be given anything. Camping should just not be a thing. The game should not allow a player to stop engaging with the game, and in turn, force everyone else to stop engaging as well.
Each survivor has 4 perk slots and every game requires 4 survivors to start and 1 killer. 4 x 4 equals 16 as opposed to 4 x 1 which equals 4. If even one person brings Bond at the very least that person can move in a more coordinated fashion with their teammates when I was playing survivor having it made a huge difference. I've only been out of the game for 2 weeks at this point so I know that hasn't changed.
But you said the killer only has one opportunity and the survivors have sixteen. Neither of which are correct.
If you want to have exact info on what the killer is doing at all times then you're gonna be outta luck. You get a decent amount of the time if you want to run perks like OoO, Alert, or Wiretap. That's the thing though you need to prioritize what you want in your build and if you don't want to run info perks then you're not getting the benefit of info and the game shouldn't change to just give it to you for free.
So survivors have to pick up these perks on every single game on the off chance that the killer can't be arsed to play the game, in order to pull off a difficult gambit that hands the killer the win if it goes wrong.
You talk about the removal of strategies being a problem but you don't seem to pick up on the fact that these kinds of band-aid perk solutions do the exact same thing to survivors. Pre-6.1, there was almost NO variety in perk builds for survivors precisely because of this issue.
BHVR is far from flawless and I never claimed they were flawless so I'm not sure what you're trying to say here.
That's what an appeal to authority is. Your argument is that the game is purposely keeping camping in, therefor it is unreasonable to argue that it should change. This argument ONLY holds merit if you believe that BHVR is beyond reproach. Otherwise, it's worthless.
If 11 meters is not functionally different than 2 meters then what is? What's the exact range in which the killer should be allowed to contest a save then? We know 1-2 is nearly impossible and you seem to think 11 is still nearly impossible so what's the measurement in which contesting a hook is fair for both sides? What's the number that makes sense for 1 killer to be able to engage in defensive play against 1-3 players when trying to progress their objective?
Because the functional difference is in what the killer is doing. If they actually go after a survivor, that's fine. But if they sit on the hooked survivor with the express intent to deny any attempt to unhook, that's not. And I don't care at what distance they do this.
Tell me what you consider good defensive play in this game since proxy camping is such a scummy thing in your eyes. What can a singular killer do that serves as a reasonable and proper defense against up to 3 opponents.
When I hook a survivor, I go looking for the next. Along the way, I will keep an eye out for anyone trying to get a rescue. I just want to get downs and hooks, not prevent unhooks. And I don't think it's unreasonable to ask the same of other players.
Getting hooks, over preventing unhooks.
It's because what you want is just literally bad for the game.
You've made like 4 or 5 claims about what I want without even asking.
You prefer getting hooks over preventing unhooks and that's cool. Some people prefer to be defensive and prevent unhooks over going for more hooks. Both have merits and are valid ways to play under the current system.
You've actually been very clear that you do not believe killers should play in a defensive style and that you don't want to use your perk slots on perks that would actively help you with the situation you don't like. So it seems pretty clear that you don't want camping of any sort, not have to use perk slots or learn how to deal with a proxy scenario, and more direct innate info on what the killer is or is not doing.
I clearly don't think BHVR is beyond reproach, but I also don't believe removing proxy camping is good for the game and that currently it seems like the devs don't feel like it should go either. If they change tac and completely remove it I'm going to call them out for making another bad decision in the same vain as the way they handled the Skull Merchant rework. While I'm not a hyper defensive player I believe that people who are should have that ability to do so especially in a game as limited as this. Not everyone wants to chase constantly and hate that the community often seems to only value chasing and trash people who don't play in a chase centric manner.
Survivor meta being extremely stale hasn't really changed, the current meta has almost cycled around to just being the 2017 meta all over again. So, as far as I can tell survivors haven't lost any strategies simply due to swapping out a few perks since by and large they've been using the same ones forever. There was low variety pre 6.1 and there is still low variety post 6.1 because build variety is far and away the least valued thing on either side of this game even when it could literally improve folks odds. Do you have to pick up the perks every game? No. Should you at the very least put one of them sometimes? Yes.
I want people to actually just play the game they have and really learn how to make it work for them rather than constantly throwing a hissy fit and begging for changes. With exception of accessibility features it would be nice if folks stopped asking for major one sided changes to the game for a while. Like the AFC change hasn't even had time to breathe and folks to just play the game yet y'all are already wanting to mess with killers again. AFC was necessary, but damn it sucks constantly seeing folks trying to push for more heavy handed restrictions on the way people play the game.
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@Firellius said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3568758#Comment_3568758
Proxy camping is still playing the game. Defensive play is still play whether you like it or not. Facecamping wasn't playing the game and it has been addressed and now it's on you to learn how to circumvent the non-deviant defensive play. Period.
No, it hasn't been addressed. Because someone standing 11 meters away versus 2 meters away is not a functional difference.
Killers have to make that same decision when it comes to builds and they can only make it once per trial. Across all survivors that decision can be made up to 16 times and realistically only 1 of you needs to make it once to get the effect. If you want the information put on the perk.
I don't know when you quit but I'm pretty sure both killers and survivors have only four perk slots, not 1 and 16. And no, you still need 4 perks to get the information you're banking on.
You are trying to dictate what is and is not acceptable play based on your own preferences even if the face of that fact the game has been purposely allowed to maintain the option of proxying while removing the ability to face camp. You are the unreasonable one.
I'm the unreasonable one because BHVR is literally flawless and never makes mistakes, ever. I'm sure that's a very reasonable position to take.
Survivors don't have to gain telepathy, but they should learn game awareness via shock horror, using the tools they have access to.
The tools being: The HUD and literally nothing else.
So many survivors still don't know how to read the HUD and don't even try to pay attention to it when it does a ton a heavy lifting for you on both the condition of your teammates as well as the general things the killer could be engaged in. It tells you when someone is being chased and when they aren't being chased with relatively good accuracy.
Congrats, none of that helps if the killer is camping, because that's indistinct from the killer seeking.
If someone isn't being chased and someone is on the hook and you've not encountered the killer's TR for a while you can guess the killer is probably near the hooked survivor.
The problem is:
for a while
That's too late. You're on a strict time limit to get this stuff done, on top of everything else.
Camping has issues, but the worst offending issue is now mechanically far less viable than before.
Is it? Because it still requires tremendous investment from survivors to counter it, while requiring zilch from the killer. And if the survivors mess it up even the slightest bit, it's likely to snowball into a 4K on the spot.
Killers will just find another way to facilitate defensive play because to remove every single defensive strategy from a pvp game is exactly how the game dies as no one wants to play a game where they aren't allowed to defend against their opponent or only allowed to approach the game in a singular way no matter the circumstance.
And a game consisting of only defensive plays is no fun for anyone either. That's the problem.
The game doesn't only consist of defensive play in that regard there is not problem.
The killer is still engaging with the game when in proxy, but they are doing so from a dominant position. Yes, you will be expected to work under less than optimal conditions to circumvent the dominance of a proxy camp. Yes, it requires players to act in a coordinated manner and the game gives you limited tools to coordinate. It's on you to figure out how to make that work because as I keep saying just giving you more things will not improve your experience solo play.
Each survivor has 4 perk slots and every game requires 4 survivors to start and 1 killer. 4 x 4 equals 16 as opposed to 4 x 1 which equals 4. If even one person brings Bond at the very least that person can move in a more coordinated fashion with their teammates when I was playing survivor having it made a huge difference. I've only been out of the game for 2 weeks at this point so I know that hasn't changed.
If you want to have exact info on what the killer is doing at all times then you're gonna be outta luck. You get a decent amount of the time if you want to run perks like OoO, Alert, or Wiretap. That's the thing though you need to prioritize what you want in your build and if you don't want to run info perks then you're not getting the benefit of info and the game shouldn't change to just give it to you for free.
BHVR is far from flawless and I never claimed they were flawless so I'm not sure what you're trying to say here. The way you're approaching this makes you seem unreasonable and it's not because you disagree with me. It's because what you want is just literally bad for the game.
If 11 meters is not functionally different than 2 meters then what is? What's the exact range in which the killer should be allowed to contest a save then? We know 1-2 is nearly impossible and you seem to think 11 is still nearly impossible so what's the measurement in which contesting a hook is fair for both sides? What's the number that makes sense for 1 killer to be able to engage in defensive play against 1-3 players when trying to progress their objective?
Tell me what you consider good defensive play in this game since proxy camping is such a scummy thing in your eyes. What can a singular killer do that serves as a reasonable and proper defense against up to 3 opponents.
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@Firellius said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3568414#Comment_3568414
Teamwork isn't a one-way street, but again it bears pointing out that's not a mechanical issue and thus can not be solved by frontloading survivors with basekit versions of perks and stacks of new game mechanics or features. If you don't want to accept that then that's a you problem.
But we aren't talking about teamwork.
We're talking about a killer staring at a hook.
YOU are the one making this into a chat about teamwork. I am of the opinion that camping should be addressed directly, you think it needs to be done with teamwork, even though the game is explicitly built -against- teamwork.
I have a lot of issues with the game and have for years, but I've never been so far up my own butt as to think that having bad teammates could be solved by just removing any and all difficulty by defanging my opponent or giving myself every mechanical advantage possible without needing to give something in exchange. That's not how you make an interesting pvp game.
This is incredibly rich when it's brought up in defence of CAMPING.
You know, the thing that removes any and all difficulty and defangs your opponents and gives yourself every mechanical advantage possible without needing to give anything in exchange?
It's good that you say that that's not how you make an interesting PvP game, because then you might understand why camping has been considered a problem for all these years.
Say what you want about killers, but in this particular case you're the only one being unreasonable
So you're claiming that survivors should dump a quarter of their build variety, check if the killer's camping, and then telepathically communicate with total strangers on the internet to set up a strategy for a rescue without any room for miscommunication and no tools to facilitate said communication, all within 60 seconds of the target being hooked...
To offset the killer standing still and staring at a hook.
And -I- am the unreasonable one?
You're trying to dictate to people how they should play
No, I'm dictating that they should play, period. Instead of investing their time in ensuring that no one gets to engage with the game.
Proxy camping is still playing the game. Defensive play is still play whether you like it or not. Facecamping wasn't playing the game and it has been addressed and now it's on you to learn how to circumvent the non-deviant defensive play. Period.
Facecamping took away survivor options entirely, but proxy camping does not it just limits them which is last I checked the entire point of defensive play. You're not defanged whatsoever just limited and may need to yes, expend precious resources such as a perk slot to mitigate the potential. Killers have to make that same decision when it comes to builds and they can only make it once per trial. Across all survivors that decision can be made up to 16 times and realistically only 1 of you needs to make it once to get the effect. If you want the information put on the perk.
You are trying to dictate what is and is not acceptable play based on your own preferences even if the face of that fact the game has been purposely allowed to maintain the option of proxying while removing the ability to face camp. You are the unreasonable one.
Survivors don't have to gain telepathy, but they should learn game awareness via shock horror, using the tools they have access to. So many survivors still don't know how to read the HUD and don't even try to pay attention to it when it does a ton a heavy lifting for you on both the condition of your teammates as well as the general things the killer could be engaged in. It tells you when someone is being chased and when they aren't being chased with relatively good accuracy. If someone isn't being chased and someone is on the hook and you've not encountered the killer's TR for a while you can guess the killer is probably near the hooked survivor.
Camping has issues, but the worst offending issue is now mechanically far less viable than before. To completely remove camping in its entirety would require a complete change to the killer objective which also necessitate a complete overhaul a lot of killer perks, some powers, and potentially map design. While I want the game to see drastic overhauls in some areas doing that would be better left to just making a new game due to the scale of work involved.
That still won't truly solve your problem even if it happened though because again, your teammates will be what they are no matter what mechanical changes or advantages are added to the game. Killers will just find another way to facilitate defensive play because to remove every single defensive strategy from a pvp game is exactly how the game dies as no one wants to play a game where they aren't allowed to defend against their opponent or only allowed to approach the game in a singular way no matter the circumstance.
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@Firellius said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3568258#Comment_3568258
Baseline aura reading? Bond's right there, it's a free perk
Oh, did they remove the perk slot cost, then?
And did they make it possible to equip it to someone else's perk loadout too?
Internal communication? There's an entire hand signal emote system that was meant to be used in place of verbal communication.
Oh yes, because 'beckon' and 'point' are an excellent way to set up a strategy of 'I'll distract the killer and you go for the hook'. Great comms, I don't know why no one has ever thought of that one.
Stack that on top of the player created signal language
Quick question: Does hands-up on the hook mean 'killer is camping' or 'come rescue me'?
It's not as direct and potent as VC, but the game was designed with non-verbal communication being the main way we interacted.
The game is built for teamwork
These are literally mutually exclusive. And if you somehow believe that the game isn't built specifically to isolate individual survivors, I don't know what to tell you.
There is a huge gulf between 'the game has the opportunity for teamwork' and 'the game is built for teamwork'.
You want all this info, but the game is already given you most of what you want if you'd learn to read the HUD
Mindreading is not a standard skill set. When another survivor lets go of a gen, you still have no information other than that that survivor let go of a gen. Until they do something else, you have no relevant info.
And guess what? If they move to make a rescue and the killer is proxy camping, that doesn't show on the HUD.
The HUD is something everyone has access to by default and Bond only requires one perk slot out 16 total slots spread across 4 players.
No, it requires four perk slots. Teamwork is not a one-way street.
And keep in mind that all of this is to facilitate killers being able to win by doing the absolute bare minimum. For all this talk of 'Just use telepathy, 4head, skill issue', killers are deathly allergic to actually having to play the game.
Maybe, instead of camping, if you dislike actually playing the game that much, I don't know...
Quit?
I don't camp and I have quit the game recent, but that has nothing to do with camping. I quit playing because I think the devs are making horrible design decisions around Skull Merchant and just in general the game as a whole right now. AFC was not one of those bad decisions though.
Teamwork isn't a one-way street, but again it bears pointing out that's not a mechanical issue and thus can not be solved by frontloading survivors with basekit versions of perks and stacks of new game mechanics or features. If you don't want to accept that then that's a you problem.
I have a lot of issues with the game and have for years, but I've never been so far up my own butt as to think that having bad teammates could be solved by just removing any and all difficulty by defanging my opponent or giving myself every mechanical advantage possible without needing to give something in exchange. That's not how you make an interesting pvp game.
Say what you want about killers, but in this particular case you're the only one being unreasonable. Proxy camping and generally defensive play is so hated in this game, but it's been a part of the game since day one and the devs have went out of their way to make sure it remains possible. While I currently don't like the current direction things are going, I know they aren't stupid when it comes to actually understanding what the actual problematic things are in regards to general game balance.
You're trying to dictate to people how they should play and since you know that will never work you're wanting to bend the game to your whims via taking this position. You seem like the one who dislikes playing the game rather than me.
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@Firellius said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3567661#Comment_3567661
That requires people to learn to approach the game as a team rather than a series of 1v1v1v1v1 with some occasional teamwork if they feel like it.
Ah, yes, because that is what the game is built for, with its robust internal communication system and baseline aura reading on all other team members.
It helps facilitate well-coordinated teamwork efforts.
Because DBD is meant to be a team game. Obviously.
You want to act like the game doesn't have some of those things, but it does. Folks just refuse to use them.
Baseline aura reading? Bond's right there, it's a free perk that only requires anyone to play dwight or at the very least dump some bloodpoints into him. The amount of people who have the perk and yet refuse to even entertain using it is massive.
Internal communication? There's an entire hand signal emote system that was meant to be used in place of verbal communication. People never actually use it for that, but that is what it's for. Stack that on top of the player created signal language and you have a set of serviceable tools. It's not as direct and potent as VC, but the game was designed with non-verbal communication being the main way we interacted.
The game is built for teamwork, but like with any game with solo queue the players trend towards not working together. Giving you built in features will not change that because it's not a mechanical issue, it's a player issue. You solve player issues by learning to play in better ways rather than expecting everything to just be given to you. You want all this info, but the game is already given you most of what you want if you'd learn to read the HUD which has a very robust suite of indicators telling you in real time most of what you need. Combine that with Bond and you have the maximum amount of real time information necessary to make effective decisions. The HUD is something everyone has access to by default and Bond only requires one perk slot out 16 total slots spread across 4 players.
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@Firellius said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3567243#Comment_3567243
just play the game as it sits
They'd love to, but they can't, because camping still hasn't been nerfed.
They most certainly can because what they want is free escapes and a complete inability of killers to play defensively which they aren't getting. They need to play the game as it sits and learn how to actually make proper saves against a defensive opponent. Don't misunderstand me here, being completely denied the chance to make a save was extremely problematic. That problem has now been addressed and that means the issue is no longer "Killer makes it impossible to save" but "I need to learn how to make saves under suboptimal conditions."
That requires people to learn to approach the game as a team rather than a series of 1v1v1v1v1 with some occasional teamwork if they feel like it. They are never going to learn that if the devs just keeps giving them game changing mechanics and basekit versions of perks. At some point you have to just learn how to the play the game that you have, this is the exact same concept survivors push at killers and it's true. Proxy camping is never going away as that was never the goal and the devs have been clear about this from the first moment they ever mentioned working on a solution to the strength of camping. Proxy camping pressures the survivors into making suboptimal saves, but they still can make saves while facecamping deletes most options to even try to save. Not being able to deal with facecamping is a game design issue that has now been corrected. Not being able to deal with proxy camping is a player skill issue that survivors need to overcome.
This isn't to be mean, but even in a casual game such as this players should be expected to develop skill based solutions rather than rely on the game to change at the expense of their opponent.
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@KFChris18 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3567117#Comment_3567117
Since the feature doesn't force you to jump off hook, comp just banned it. You're already not allowed to try to kobe unless you have deliverance anyway.
That's hilariously dumb.
Comp DBD continues to be the strangest thing.
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@Ayodam said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3566353#Comment_3566353
Yeah, when people complain about camping it’s proxy camping that they’re unhappy with. Face camping is pretty rare. It does suck for the person stuck on hook but it’s an uncommon situation and removing grabs was probably enough to solve it.
That's straight up revisionist interpretation right there.
You don't have to go far to find the countless posts, videos, reddit threads, twitter threads to find complaints about face camping. Literal years of complaints about Bubba never leaving the hook, Myers standing inside the survivor to prevent unhook prompts, huntress with instadown hatchet just standing at the hook arm raised.
They begged the devs for an anti-face camping mechanic and now that they have it suddenly the goalpost gets shifted from "We need a way to deal with face camping" to "We need a way to deal with all camping". You got grabs nuked, you got basekit BT, you got a Bubba nerf, and you got AFC. It's time for survivors to stop trying to shift the goalpost and just play the game as it sits. The devs have been telling y'all the entire time FOR YEARS that their goals were never to make camping impossible just less powerful and annoying. AFC accomplishes exactly that by removing the inherent strength of being able to completely deny a save without giving survivors the slightest chance. It allows someone to get back into the game rather than spending all their time on hook.
Please stop trying y'all collective absolute best to ruin the ability of killers to remotely engage with the game in a strategic/defensive manner. Literally, have gotten most of what you've been asking for in both gameplay, balance, and accessibility while killers can't even get granular audio controls or FoV slider let alone system wide mechanical changes that tangibly affect the game for all parties involved.
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@Aidan_fowl said:
🙄
Not saying I don't belive you but its strange how many killers always have problems like this when they want something to be changed:
Epilepsy attacks because of flashlights
Feeling dizzy or sick seeing the post hit animation
Now is autism if they hear too many notifications.
Maybe you are telling the truth. But the community here lies so mucho to get what they want that I am more than skeptical.
Have you ever considered that a large portion of people who play the role that requires as little social interaction as possible might be on the spectrum? Or that the world is filled with people who suffer from extremely common illnesses who also like to play horror games.
Flashlights being able to rapid fired clicked was annoying, gamebreaking as it literally could crash a lobby, and ran the risk of triggering seizures.
DBD has some of the most aggressive motion sickness triggers in a mainstream game which is compounded due to killer having a forced FoV that's too small for some and too big for others which causes motion sickness. It's a long standing accessibility issue that most games on the market have had the sense to account for early by giving players FoV sliders and trying to keep sudden forced dragging of the camera to a minimal.
Constant notification spam is a long standing and well known annoyance tactic survivors use to bother the killer. It offers no real value to their team and for players that have issues with over stimulation a round of DBD can become problematic. Again, it's an accessibility issue that most games resolve by either attaching cooldowns to noise notifications or letting players have the option of controlling which things give notifications or the frequency of notifications.
Killers in this game have gotten the sum total of about 1-2 accessibility features while survivors have gotten some sort of accessibility or annoyance limiting feature pretty much every time they've asked. Not saying that's a bad a thing, but literally the killer role NEEDS basic baseline accessibility features. People have been asking for notification cooldowns, FoV slider, granular audio controls for years. Not because they want to just win a game, but because the game needs these things and should have had these things. Part of the reason people often drop the killer role or DBD entirely is due to lack of baseline features that are present day one of most modern game releases.
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@Marc_go_solo said:
Even when not taking into account sensitivity to hearing, those notifications can be rather distracting. Depending on the platform and settings there are options to stop notifications. On Xbox there is an option to silence them - I only get the notification when pressing the big X on the controller and see a notification has been sent. Hopefully there are options for other platforms.
However, it can be annoying, especially if someone is trying to team with the killer to say where a survivor is.
Different type of notifications being talked about.
They're talking about the audio ques in the game that the killer gets for survivors doing rushed actions like fast vaults and rushing in and out of lockers repeatedly.
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@Devil_hit11 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3563188#Comment_3563188
any chance you think BVHR will improve skull merchant a tiny bit more? one aspect that I find baffling is that I am given opportunity to min-max her drone rays by switching direction to get faster lock-on traps but than there is 3 second immunity to not be able to do that. It is like. here's mechanic to showcase greater mechanic expertise in using the drones rays more effectively but here's another mechanic to prevent you from doing that.
I'm sure they'll make adjustments to her, but I don't think it will be to something like scan immunity numbers. You can already adjust that with a addon and increase spin speed with another addon.
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@Mooks said:
To some degree it feels like BHVR might want to limit the licensed cosmetics options to not overshadow their original content. It’s not really something we can prove one way or the other and we won’t get any confirmation on this. But they have kinda used this argument for anniversary chapters to be original again - and it does make sense: for licensed cosmetics they only charge auric cells sure, but they have to give the license holder parts of the income of every sell while original cosmetics will go directly to BHVR alone.
also creating licensed cosmetics might be to resource intensive compared to the actual profits from it when it’s not for recently released characters.
(I also kinda have the feeling this might be at least one of the reasons for Netflix to withdraw Stranger Things from DbD - they seemed very open and willing to add further cosmetics for their characters in DbD after all..)
With Netflix, that particular company wants to monopolize their original licenses on their own gaming service which is kinda floundering atm. They also just have weird priorities that make no sense other than finding ways to generate profits with minimal investment. Hence, pushing a Roblox crossover that's one of many dbd clones built in Roblox and then kinda just going radio silent.
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@Akumakaji said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3563178#Comment_3563178
I played like a dozen games with her back to back, to get a feeling of her new power and I still don't fully understand how she works ^^"
No, I read her power description and all and understand that scanning a survivor three times either damages them or sends them into deep wound and gives them a claw trap, but it nearly never happens because I did something skill full, but rather randomly, often at the other end of the map. You can set up a drone during a chase, forcing survivors to the abandon the loop or risk taking a hit, and the hinder and haste can come in handy, but I still havn't gotten into any "Skull Merchant mindset". A lot of survivors though accused me of playing a killer requiring no skill at all, I guess thats those that haven't read the patch notes?
One thing that bothers me is how rare and random you give survivors claw traps. 3/4 times when I look at my radar I see nothing, then at other times suddenly two survivors have claw traps on them. But the claw traps themselves got a rather short timer, you either need to have a survivor nearby right at that moment, to capitalize on the haste effect during the looping or run after the trapped survivors who might be just holding W. I really think that survivors should appear on the scanner more frequently, thats the main schtick of the SM, isn't it? Tagging survivors and tracking them around the map?
BUT the way survivors randomly get injured surely shakes things up a bit. I also never seem to be able to predict when I will get hasted or undetectable and I find the "reverse direction" quite tedious, even though I get the feeling that this is one of the nooks and cranies that make a good Skull Merchant player.
I actually would wish that we had two direction add-ons:
1) Every x seconds the drones change the direction that their scaning beams face.
2) changing the scaning beams direction changes it for all drones on the map, so you could just do this at random and maybe catch a survivor off-guard.
But now that I might play the SM from time to time, the big elephant in the room is this: which weapon is the best looking with the most interesting FX effect and should I buy?
Tracking was her big thing before the rework, but now most of the time you're not going to have anyone tracked. Her entire power is now centered on whether or not you can get a clawtrap on someone, but they only get them by being locked on after being scanned 3 times. It's relatively easily to completely avoid being scanned when not in a chase and it takes fair amount of time to get someone locked on.
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@pizzaduffyhp90 said:
I can understand the hate behind the character as nobody really enjoyed her especially for how she started and what she was capable of. That being said however, she finally gets a rework and personally to me it could be better but, it's something better and I'd much rather take this then a 3 gen merchant.
If you don't like it fair enough but, I've seen some people say they'd much prefer the old Skull Merchant with holding 3 gens and it's like you all asked for a Skull Merchant rework, you got one where she doesn't make the match extended for long periods of time, and is more of a chase killer now but, I guess players want 3 gen Merchant back.
I never understand the majority of this community.
That's the exact problem though.
The most vocal of folks just wanted change without consideration of how to make good change.
A lot of us who were actually playing her in ways that weren't focused on extended the game forever didn't even get a look in. For all the things that changed they still made her a weak killer who's got nothing other than being able to bulldoze through chases. Her entire kit just makes it so no matter what you're getting hit. You don't need to be smart or crafty, literally just drop the drone and bloodlust them until they get hindered and you get the hit. Head empty, only chase.
Yet, that's what folks asked for though. A Skull Merchant who is forced to engage in chases no matter what and that is what they got, but it isn't good or fun for either side. Rather than give her options and maybe a new way to interact with the game, they gave her the bare minimum viable product version of her power and got rid of any of the interesting things she had or restructured it to be mostly worthless.
Skull Merchant rework is what you get when rush to make changes without even attempting to collect feedback from people who playing the killer to find out what they even liked about the killer.
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@Nazzzak said:
After getting Alien, I'm positive it's Predator now. Both owned by Disney now, both connected to each other through those god awful AvP movies (sorry, just my opinion!)
They are also connected by an older line of comics and a couple of games.
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@biggybiggybiggens said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3524420#Comment_3524420
The huge amount of things they can work with in FNAF is only there if you want it to be. Anyone who doubts FNAFs inclusion for one reason or another is fooling themselves at the end of the day. FNAF is a "when" not "if". Not being a huge FNAF fan myself, I'd love to run around a spooky Pizzeria. Animatronics always scared TF out of me when I was little so I resonate with that fear I suppose. The Singularity brings some of that fear, but it doesn't have that shady trait of false innocence that would come with something like FNAF.
It's got a better shot now that the film is actually a project that's near release instead of in development hell.
It will depend on how well it's received and what gets showcased, but I stand by what I said previously. The best bits of FNAF aren't in the actual games, but in the books which have infinitely less reach even in the larger FNAF fandom. The closest they've come to really integrating the interesting bits in a weaponized fashion has been Security Breach which the fandom doesn't seem to care for, but those outside the fandom appreciate more. I don't see a world where they make Glamrock animatronics the featured killer for the chapter.
So going strictly off the classic FNAF looks and lore it doesn't matter if that choose AftonTrap or a Nightmare animatronic there isn't anything there that serves as an interesting power. The game needs more killers with interesting powers and working with a license presents opportunities and limitations. Considering at this point it's foolish to trust that the devs really get what's actually interesting, skillful, and fun for killers or survivors it's much more likely that this chapter is a cringey nothing burger.
Not everything that is horror is necessarily a good fit for DBD. I want people to have what they want and enjoy, but you gotta look at the game you're dealing with here and recognize how limited it truly is.
If anything, FNAF would be better served by having it's own Asym horror pvp game. That way the ip could truly be allowed the best possible chance to shine, there would be more games in this genre, and the overall limitations of this game's design wouldn't weight down the creative opportunities that do exist in FNAF's cadre of characters. It can even serve as vehicle to push more of their lore in other places into the gaming space. It would also ensure that I could play Roxxanne Wolf my favorite FNAF character.
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@Livion said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/393706/i-hate-to-be-that-person-but
I have to admit that I did notice this but in general, everyone is three gening (trapper is surprisingly prominent) characters like hag are normal but pyramid head?, and I don't mean like a last resort is their whole game plan and I don't get why people are starting to do this (maybe it's just a bunch of bad luck but we'll see)
Almost like 3 genning is a systemic gameplay issue that every killer can to some degree abuse right from the start of the game.
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@Krazzik said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3560311#Comment_3560311
I mean a lot of the 'experts' with thousands of hours in DBD have been completely wrong in the past, and SM just got a massive redesign, so no, you can't really tell how good she is until people have had a chance to master her new kit.
She got a massive redesign, but functionally lost a great deal of the complexity found in her original power which is bad because she wasn't all that complex to begin with. What they gave her didn't actually change her intended play pattern instead it just made her worse at it by removing anything that didn't facilitate bulldozing through chases. SM is a killer who was meant to be extremely easy to solve from the killer perspective of playing her. So if she's gotten worse at just about every unique feature, lost playstyle variety in her addons due everything being clawtrap centric, and lost her highly deviant unintended playstyle there is very little good to see there.
It was good she lost 3 gen, but they took a killer who wasn't strong and just made them weaker. It's very easy to tell weakness in DBD and in Merchant's case what's propping her up is that she's an m1 killer so perk synergy isn't an issue for her. She on her own, relying solely on her own tools is quite stunted. She doesn't do anything that other killers don't do better or at least in a more unique way. This rework actually pushed me out of the game entirely cause this is like the 4 time I've dealt with BHVR ruining a killer I had invested time into and I don't have the patience to wait a year or two before they actually give her something more well rounded.
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@catslayer said:
should developers fix inaccurate face models or not, what do you think? i know that it doesn't really change anything, but sometimes it feels as if i'm not playing that character, but instead some rip-off...lol
this is about licensed survivors who don't look like themselves at all, which mainly would be ada, cheryl, claire. here's the examples:
claire's:
(left DBD, right original). they kind of ruined her eyes with makeup or something; just everything feels a bit off for some reason.
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/AHK442XT26DN/image.png
cheryl's:
(first DBD, second original)
should i even explain?
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/RMJD62TGLBSR/image.png
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/QKDACYAOBJEE/image.png
jill's:
i think it's...alright. they kind of reworked it and it is a bit better but...still waiting for her 69th face rework
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/L8U3684DM05V/image.png
ada's:
as much as i love her, sometimes it doesn't feel like i'm playing as her, because again, something's off...i think it's mainly the eye shadow/just eyes in general.
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/K6JPA2MFCIPC/image.png
do y'all see the same differences as i do? if so, do you think they should work on them? who else should get a face model rework in your opinion?
Keep in mind that DBD is made of a different engine and with a different set of artists than the original games guest characters come from. Things will rarely look picture perfect even in the best of circumstances. There is also other things to consider like whether or not a character likeness is based off an actually person, it isn't uncommon for a lot of characters to have their facial features modeled after actual models, actors, and actresses. Depending on the situation sometimes there are contractual limitations that force them to kinda "off brand" the face because while they've licensed the character they might be lacking the license for the IRL face model.
TLDR; This game is the Wal Mart brand version of horror.
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@crogers271 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/392936/the-real-problem-monetization
But please don't make this game a budget fortnite. Y'all are better than this.What would be your preference for how they make money?
Steady DLC releases, cosmetics, and additional mori animations.
Battlepasses suck in basically every regard when they are implemented in the way they currently are. The only way the battlepass system would be acceptable is if they were something I could purchase and complete at my own pace. A few other games have been trying this strategy out and it seems to be working a treat. Though I would argue that battlepasses as a concept should just be thrown away entirely.
Linked set cosmetics should be few and far between rather than the normal standard. I get linked sets for cosmetics that drastically change a character's appearance, but most sets shouldn't be linked and should be designed with that in mind. There isn't a lot to do in this game and messing with cosmetics to make interesting looks was like the only bright spot when the game otherwise isn't doing it for you. Linked sets are killing player expression much like the current approach to reworking killers is killing skill expression.
Making money isn't the problem, it's the way they go about their monetization. It's anti-consumer practice stacked on top of anti-consumer practice where the only people who would truly would be satisfied with this is addicted whale players. Though I don't even think whale level players would be happy with this as their isn't really any truly exclusive things which is good. So the monetization scheme just ends up being annoying most of the time. I personally don't mind the extra cosmetic in bundles, but I get people don't like it more often than not so they would probably sale more stuff if they would stop doing it.