Pulsar
Pulsar
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For the game's sake, I hope it doesn't go as poorly as I think it will.
My opinion remains that this clearly demonstrates that BHVR is completely chasing the money. I do not think any license, no matter how obscure or how problematic, is off the table as long as they think it'll make them money.
It is disappointing, to me alone perhaps, because I did genuinely think they were better than that.
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@Steakdabait said:
forum community not active enough to be split like that tbh
Shouldn't need to be split, just an additional resource.
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@Blueberry said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3916831#Comment_3916831
I wonder if we could get the devs to pin that discord for forum people to see.
That would certainly help get people interested.
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@THE_Crazy_Hyena said:
A community Discord server would have been sweet.
Considering how many channels and categories you can fit, I am sure we could create an entire encyclopedia around DBD, down to every little detail.
I am actually down to set up a server dedicated to this, even knowing how much work it will be 😅Joined, thank you for setting it up!
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@Shroompy said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3916589#Comment_3916589
That would be pretty interesting... al though the only way I really see it happening is a DbD Forums Discord which has the event thingy built in, so theres only a few people able to discuss at a time and others can still listen and chat normally
@Blueberry said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3916589#Comment_3916589
I would 100% be down for that voice channel
Yeah, other than someone streaming and having different people on in a separate Discord call, that'd be the way to do it.
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I would like that.
As a related note, I would love a Forum podcast where we could debate topics via voice communication. I feel things can be lost so easily in text and I'd love to do it.
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@Waynesl said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3915922#Comment_3915922
If you all want to win then go play a PVE game your in a competitive asym game that's a 1v4. 55% is to low of a standard to have for killers since it's a 1v4 statically it should be 75% yet y'all are complaining about 60%
"It's a competitive game"
"I want to be guaranteed a win when I queue up"
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@Langweilig said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3915975#Comment_3915975
Funny enough a lot of maps don’t have anything on them while being insanely small. Despite your points small maps look terrible and feel awful to play on. You never have a moment without the killer and they can reach you very fast where-ever you are.
Agree with everything you said.
They do not have anything on them because they are so small.
If they did have strong tiles on them, they would be easily chainable and wildly OP. Instead, we have small maps with mostly bad tiles.
Bigger maps with the same number of tiles but higher individual tile strength is the way forward, I think. No more of these awful Coldwind tiles.
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@RpTheHotrod said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3915975#Comment_3915975
I'm all for larger maps, but the weak m1 killers with no mobility would suffer greatly. They need to have some way to traverse the maps better. Otherwise, they are effectively forced to stay in the center of the map where closer gens are and are more likely to be negatively affected by the 8 regression limit since they can't afford the road trip to very far gens. Survivors know this which is why survivors leave the far gens alone and just focus on central gens. This forces m1 killers to stay at the center since survivors aren't even bothering to do far gens anyway - not only can they not patrol them without massive pressure loss, but there would be no reason to anyway with survivors leaving those last and just focusing on center gens, anyway. Larger maps absolutely help vs the broken killers like blight and such, but absolutely wreck killers with no mobility. Instead, we should focus on bringing down the power of mobility killers themselves instead of a blanket nerf against all killers.
I disagree. Making maps larger solves more problems than it creates.
Realistically, lower tier no mobility Killers already need help. This will make them worse, no doubt about it. They will still need help. I would not be opposed to a Haste bonus outside of chase to help them traverse the map, but a lot of them need modernizations.
Making maps bigger makes it more difficult to tunnel. Players have a bigger area to run in. It also makes it harder to camp, since it is less likely that gens are within spitting distance from the hook.
It also means that loops won't chain as well. That was a big issue right after we shrunk maps. Loops that used to be fine suddenly started chaining from one end of the map to the other.
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@WolfyWood said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3915974#Comment_3915974
Let's not forget they actively balance around survivors being a team of four, punish players for dc'ing/going next, and make powers/perks that require teammates.
Still makes no sense how they can do all of this but then leave perks like Left Behind and Sole Survivor in the game.
I think having some perks with variety is absolutely a good thing.
But yes, the rest is odd. They need to commit one way or another.
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@Rokku_Rorru said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3915801#Comment_3915801
Agreed, not to mention killer queue times are awful half the time and I'd like to be able to actually play the role. Just nerf the high achievers already it's not rocket science and encourage more killer variety by bringing those who underperform up to standard.
Not to mention we have killers like Skully who are probably making the survive rate higher too with how underpowered she is right now.I think that the game needs larger maps brought back, desperately.
We did not foresee that shrinking maps would in-turn cause greater tile density, greater gen density and greater ability to camp/tunnel.
Maps being larger, with more spread-out loops/gens/hooks/objectives, would alleviate a lot of issues, imo.
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@RpTheHotrod said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3915954#Comment_3915954
You're making a common mistake that MMR is equal to win rate. MMRs job isn't related to wins or losses, MMRs job is to try to balance future matches. Thats why in many games that use MMR, sometimes even winning is neutral or losing is neutral. For example, in chess, a grandmaster winning vs a newbie wouldn't drop the newbies rating or increase the grandmaster rating despite there being a clear winner and loser. DBD has a far simpler MMR system, however. If a survivor escapes by any means, they won their match (even shows in the post lobby that you survived). However, for purposes of trying to balance future matches, the MMR system will treat a hatch as MMR neutral. So to clarify, escaping via a hatch is absolutely a win for the survivor, but MMR doesn't change. This has been clarified before.
Also what has been clarified before, survivors are not truly a team. They do not win or lose together. Each survivor had their own win condition - escape or die. It never says survivors win or survivors lose at the end, it just states if you personally survivored or not despite the results of the other survivors. Again, BHVR has clarified this before.
Its essentially 4 1 v 1 situations happening simultaneously. Since it's an asymetric game, the win conditions are different for each side. For survivors, you escape, you win. BHVR will refuse to ever define a killer win, but the majority of the community accepts that a 3k+ is a killer win. Way back when, one BHVR representative said that the killer getting a single kill counts as a win for them which means a killer can win up for 4 times a match which is just bizarre to think about. The survivor "side" can win up to 4 times a match, and the killer side can win up to 4 times a match. Thats probably why they don't clearly show killer wins in stats and just leave it to kills.
If Hatch Escapes do not count as a win for MMR, but do count as a win for Escape Rate, then the system is flawed. Either stop counting Hatch Escapes as an escape (win) or count them towards MMR. Not like it'll make the system worse.
Survivors ARE a team. I really don't care what anyone says. If you take three good players and one bad player, not an uncommon scenario, the Killer will focus out the bad player and it is up to the good players to stop them. That is a team game. You cannot win the game with three Survivors (and you are not meant to). BHVR cannot eat their cake and have it too. Survivors are forced to play as a team, despite differing goals and skill levels, if they want a chance to win but they are simultaneously NOT a team either.
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@RpTheHotrod said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3915936#Comment_3915936
Still showd as 50% to me, so I commented.
Survivors don't win or lose together. They have an individual win condition. If 1 survivor escaped, they won. If 2 escaped, 2 won. If 3 escaped, survivors had 3 winners. If all 4 escaped, then the survivors side had 4 winners.
If every single survivor had a 50% chance to escape, then on average the killer would win (3k+) 32.25% of the time. I dint think you understanding what you're asking for survivors to have a 50% win rate (ie escape rate).
Strange.
If a Survivor escapes through the Hatch, they did not win.
If two Survivors escape, it is a tie via MMR. They win, but the Killers win a similar amount.
If three or four escape, by any metric, that is a win.
All I know for sure is that the game sucks right now. Nobody is happy. Killers seem miserable despite having the game be sided towards them, Survivors seem miserable.
It cannot stay the same.
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@CrossTheSholf said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3915934#Comment_3915934
Survivors win individualy
Don't think that's what these stats show.
If the game is actually a 1v1v1v1v1, make the rest of the game reflect that.
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@RpTheHotrod said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3915919#Comment_3915919
You edited that from 50%. Regardless, 55% is still rather low. A 60% kill rate means getting slightly less than winning half of their matches, but that slight is so small, let's just say it's half their matches. At 55%, that means still that on average you're wanting killers to win under half of their matches.
I edited it two hours ago, yes. Over an hour before your comment.
And once again, are you willing to tell Survivors to accept losing more than half their matches? Hatch should not be counted in Escape Rates if it isn't counted as a win.
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@CrossTheSholf said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3915922#Comment_3915922
60% isn't all their matches. It means the average matches ends in between a a 2k or 3k. And that's even with the unhealthy state the game is in where you have to optimize efficiently or get stomped on both sides. I play killer and survivor and I rarely have fun as either. The base core of the game is broken
On that we agree.
Survivors escaping 40% of the time means that a SIGNFICANT portion of the time, only one person is escaping, likely through the Hatch, which does not even count as a win.
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@CrossTheSholf said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3915919#Comment_3915919
Killers are the power role. That's what asym is.
I'm afraid that being the power role does not mean Killers should be winning all of their matches.
It is, after all, a game. Games are supposed to be fun for all players, not just you.
Being pre-designed to lose is certainly not fun, or would you say that the current state of the game is healthy?
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@RpTheHotrod said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3915801#Comment_3915801
Then on average you're wanting killers to never win? A 50% kill rate is only a 2K.
Which is why I said 55%. Slightly over two Kills per match on average.
I believe this gives Survivors more wiggle room.
I do think it's funny how you are concerned that Killers would never "win" with a 50% KR, but not how Survivors never win when they get less than two people out per match.
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Any chance we can see some Stats with DC's included and/or some Stats without Hatch Escapes?
Probably not, but it has a HUGE impact on average matches and could certainly help explain why the average match feels so poor.
Hatch Escapes do not count towards MMR and are treated as a tie. It feels like a loss to the Killer but does not feel like a win as a Survivor. It is my opinion that if MMR does not view Hatch as a win, then it should not be automatically reflected as an Escape in these stats.
Likewise, DCs are still present in-game. I would like to see how they influence the Escape Rate, and I believe this is important information that could serve to elucidate issues that would otherwise fly under the community's radar.
I still think the 60% KR is a mistake and we should aim for 55%.
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Prior to EGC and being able to close the Hatch, iirc, I had a game go on for over 6 hours via Hatch Standoff.
It's been 6 or 7 years, so my memory is fuzzy, but I also seem to recall a bugged-out Claudette stuck on top of Shack for over 6 hours as well.
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I'd like to see stats with DC's included and, separately, Hatch Escapes excluded.
I think both will help paint a more accurate picture of the current state of DBD.
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I do not play much anymore. I haven't touched Survivor in over a year.
It does not look fun. All of my friends that I used to run with have quit because of how miserable the average game got.
I won't even speculate on the why, but the average game of Survivor is just tedious at best and worth uninstalling for at worst.
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@brewingtea said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3914725#Comment_3914725
In Otz & friends' latest "Hardcore Survivor" series, they escaped 166 times in the 52 games they played, for an escape rate around 80% (not counting DCs), and that's using minimal perks and items.
I don't know why BHVR's stats don't reflect this, but one possible explanation is: When you're at the exit gate with 3 people, it feels bad to leave 1 behind (even though that would give you a 75% escape rate) especially when it's a friend, so they frequently lose 1 more trying to go for the risky save.
"Doesn't that mean it's balanced, though?"
Not really. There's a huge difference between having THE OPTION to go for the save vs. barely getting 2 out. As others have said, it's about player agency. SWFs have more options regarding which perks they can run, which items they can bring, and what strategies they can use. That makes the losses WAY more tolerable, knowing you aren't just powerless.
Or perhaps it is because they have pre-selected their team of some of the most experienced players out there.
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@Bodark said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3914650#Comment_3914650
No. I said already healing is very clearly not. Unless it’s self care. Because self care allows you to heal for “free” with no teammate and no medkit. Albeit a harder second chance perk to use. If you did not have self care you would be caught because of your grunts of pain. Or you would be downed instantly because you were injured.
So in a scenario where you should be injured and easy to catch. You get to heal yourself for “free” although it takes like 40 seconds. Definitely a second chance perk.
So We'll Make It, Second Wind, etc etc are all second chance perks, as are med-kits.
They all allow Survivors to do something they wouldn't normally be able to do/do it far faster than normal.
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@Marzipan210 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3914751#Comment_3914751
Since when is the burden of proof on the person who rejects a claim? BHVR claims they can filter out games where survivors give up. I am not gonna believe them until they prove it. And hook suicides are only a small percentage of the way people give up.
You are contradicting the facts of the matter.
Either give us some proof or admit that it's conjecture and doesn't really mean anything.
You could say that for literally anything in this game and the awesome part of it is, you don't ever need to provide any proof to back up your statements!
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There was an error displaying this embed.
so then prove it.
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@Bodark said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3914596#Comment_3914596
Most killers hate most second chance perks. But I don’t think any killer hates self care even though it’s very clearly a second chance perk.
They complain about the blatant ones. DH is personally very annoying to me to this day. I call it Crutch Hard because it literally can not be countered by me as a Huntress main. You can’t fake throw a hatchet. Robbing me of a down and a hook and huge pressure. It feels very cheap and unearned. It’s abysmally easy to press E when a hatchet is heading your way.
DS is absurd as well sometimes. I’ll down a completely separate survivor very quickly and rotate back to the unhooked survivor because I stumbled into them and I get punished for being good at chases and get punished for their mistake of running into me. (It should deactivate if I hook someone else imo)
But Mettle of Man is very clearly a second chance perk that I would never complain about because it is hard to get. And comes with a huge Aura reading downside.
It’s just a general thing to complain about. Not all second chance perks are annoying. Some are very much so.
Is healing a second-chance action then? Because it would seem to be, by your definition.
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DMS, Pain Res, Corrupt and Grim.
NWO is not a gen slowdown perk
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Certainly one of the lists of all time.
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@buggybug said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3914517#Comment_3914517
Just thought your last comment was funny that's all appointment/apartment name.
it's the right word :(
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Insurance perks is probably a more apt name.
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@Bodark said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3913066#Comment_3913066
Sounds like a personal issue lol. Professional players in everything whether sports or gaming practice in low stake scenarios as well as high. And Practicing against people who won’t try to stop them or interfere while they drill the fundamentals.
You should have the skill and ability to determine the level of effort needed for each match. There shouldn’t be a “getting used to easy matches” might be something that older people have to deal with idk.
No matter what level the opponent youre against you can learn and practice in each match unless you purposely decide not to. Some things can only be practiced against lower skill teams and some things only against higher skilled teams.
Besides I have gone against people who were very clueless but gave me a hard time because they did the most wild things that made zero sense at all because they didn’t know what to do. You can always learn from any match.
Not when you've been playing for as long as I have. When you've been there when techniques were developed, seen metas changed and ideas/strats fade in and out; regular matches become boring.
Having a good team once a week is awful. I feel terrible for the other players, because if I want to try even a little, I'm gonna roll over them, but also not trying at all isn't fun for me nor do I get anything from it. It became weeks of not trying at all waiting for a decent match, then I'd find it; feel like I was learning for a match and then I'd go back to waiting.
It is why I went into the comp scene a bit. To find a consistent challenge and like-minded people. I found one of those things.
Regardless, there was basically nothing left for me on Killer, nothing that interested me enough to learn. So many hours spent improving and learning and developing. I'd pushed myself as high as I could go, which was far beyond what most people (much less someone on a Console) could do, and I am relatively satisfied with that.
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@Reinami said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3913118#Comment_3913118
Lets start with this.
Do you agree that its a problem? Lets not focus on the solution atm. Do you agree at least, that it is a problem?
What exactly am I agreeing is a problem?
Let's nail it down first.
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@Reinami said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3913085#Comment_3913085
Let me put it this way. Remember the games where a bubba would just facecamp a survivor to death? And how the game was really unfun for that survivor on the hook? Like, sure the other survivors would probably win the game right? Cuz they could just finish the gens, and get out probably before they could actually get a kill.
Remember how awful that was though to experience? And even though the survivors still would "win" it still was really unfun, and so the devs did what they did, and they added the AFC feature.
That is the kind of feeling i'm talking about when playing killer in games like this that should be fixed as well.
The other aspect your missing on the "fun" factor here is. Do you think this game that this clown player played and didn't have fun was also fun for the survivors? I really doubt it, i'd bet that most of the players in that game, did not have fun.
And what, precisely, do you propose to do about it that wouldn't massively screw up the balance of the game?
Because this is Clown we are talking about here. A weak Killer, and a weak Killer on a bad map with bad perks against good players with good perks on a good map.
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@Reinami said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3913085#Comment_3913085
You are missing the point though, he didn't really "win". It was completely thrown because the survivors were overly altruistic.
He got a 3K, he won.
If the Killer slugs all four people, and then they somehow manage to recover and escape, they won. The Killer misplayed, yes, but that doesn't change the end-result.
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@Ryuhi said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3913105#Comment_3913105
Because stacking the odds in your favor should not be required to have a chance at winning a balanced game. Something that applies to both sides for different reasons. His build wasn't bad, it just didn't have something that is essentially necessary in the current meta. My point with RPD was that it created extremely unfun games that all parties involved knew would result in the killer getting a 4k. The outcome doesn't mean anything regarding how it got there.
His build was full of objectively bad perks. He didn't need to stack the odds in his favor, he just needed to not literally handicap himself.
If he is advocating for weak Killers with bad perks to be able to compete with top tier .001% SWFs using full-meta sweat builds….idk what to tell you.
I understand it is frustrating. I'd be frustrated too.
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@Ryuhi said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3913085#Comment_3913085
Thats not what he meant by the BT comparison, at least not how I took it. He was talking about how you were throwing if you didn't take BT at the time, which was generally considered the case. That same type of necessity has been felt with gen perks more than once in DBD's history, especially specific combos with specific killers (corrupt being the big example for setup or poor map presence killers.) He had 3 hooks by the time the gens were powered, and his win was solely from getting aura reads on how greedy the survivors were being. It wasn't his game to win, it was their game to lose, and if he didn't play it the way he did it could have easily been a 3E. There's a specific type of frustration that causes with games, and experiencing it frequently takes a massive mental toll (see: all justifications ever given regarding going next) beyond what the game "should" be. He even touched on wanting to give up and get out of the game but then he kept with it because he was forced to. That type of frustration is felt by both sides, but for some reason there never seems to be any empathy across the isle for either side.
Did I miss something regarding that possibility statement though? The fact he won a game like this is proof that there's always possibility, the point was more about the helplessness and frustration than the number of kills. RPD library whack a mole wasn't ok even though it almost always ended in a 4k.
RPD sure wasn't okay, but it was a specific interaction on a specific map; not the entire game.
You'd be "throwing" if you didn't run Nurse + slowdowns by that logic. If you go into the game with a weak Killer, no gen perks, no real chase perks against good players WHY should you expect to win?
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@Ryuhi said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3913065#Comment_3913065
Putting aside the streamer's personality/complaints/etc, the main thing I took away was how fast the gens got done, and how his comeback was entirely caused by overzealous plays on the survivor side. He was even content with a 2k when the snowball started. Balance discussions aside, I absolutely get the frustration aspect of what he's saying, especially knowing that a more meta perk selection (or killer) would have given him a better chance at a more meaningful match (win or lose.) His game sense was not poor, he was doing things like recognizing when gens would pop and was making decisions like hooking the one survivor when he knew the others were down and healing across the map, so I don't think his macro play is especially poor (aside from the limitations of clown and his perks ofc.)
Regarding the basekit combacks/protections, regardless of which one each of us thinks applies, I think the bigger point he was making is that there are a lot of issues on the killer side that are on the same level as BT was before it became basekit: Gen perks feel that necessary because of the speed of matches like this, and it feels as necessary at higher level as BT felt before it got made basekit. Thats part of the issue with the pandora's box that got opened with basekit mechanics/buffs like that and the timer ones: It validates a lot of whataboutism, and makes issues feel particularly ignored when not addressed in a similarly impactful way.
I couldn't even finish the video, but I made sure to watch the entire match to get why he felt the need to make the video, and his frustration is valid. He could absolutely let it not get to him, but I can't imagine this kind of game being rare when you main clown for that many hours, especially if you're willing to divert from his meta.
I do not think it is a rare game.
However, I do not think there is anything wrong with that, aside from the stress factor, which is something built into the game.
Despite literally everything going wrong and all of it stacked against him, he still won the game as Clown. That isn't similar to Old BT at all. If you got farmed without old BT, that was it. You were done and you had no recourse, that's one reason DS was so popular because it was a defense against dumb teammates.
If you get dealt the worst hand possible as Killer, you can still win. It might not be easy, or "fun", but to say it isn't possible isn't accurate.
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@Reinami said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3913065#Comment_3913065
Posted 10 minutes after, so you didn't watch the video to see what my point is then?
No, I took a guess who it was because I was getting in my car.
Not safe to read Forums and drive!
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@Bodark said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3912486#Comment_3912486
As someone who has played against bots a lot for aiming practice it’s definitely not even close to the same lol.
But that’s the good thing about Huntress even if it’s a blowout you are still improving. Each hatchet you throw improves your aim and muscle memory.
AND when you go against a bad team that you are crushing you can relax and go for crazy and more wild shots. This actually improving your knowledge more than in a match where you have to lock in and not get fancy.
People play differently subconsciously in a blowout. There's no reason to try. People aren't showing me their best material when they've seen the match is already a loss. I want their A-grade material, I want the best of the best. Mindless slaughter dumbs my skill down by making me used to easy matches.
Sure, it lets me go for ambitious shots, but it doesn't make the Survivors really try their best, which is what will in turn, make me improve.
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Is this mf Arinad? Author of the billion-page Clown guide?
Also, what is your point? Not every Killer should be balanced to compete with the .01% of Survivors. Survivors have no base-kit comeback mechanics, they have base-kit protections. Call it what it is.
Some of us enjoy playing against difficult opponents and learning. Coming back better next time.
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@Bodark said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3912455#Comment_3912455
It’s a New Killer and you’re New to PC if I remember right. So it put you against those guys. I never got good teams consistently until I mained a single killer.
Still get very bad teams sometimes but it’s very rare now. I like one sided bloodbaths, it’s fun with Huntress. Nothing quite like landing all of you shots especially cross map but I like close games too. That’s why I play the blood moon event because it’s ridiculously survivor sided with gen speeds.
I’m gonna try using it tonight and see how I feel about it. It’s been awhile since I used it. It was so bad when I tired it the first time I wrote it off completely.
Same account though and it has been linked for a LONG time, since I was able to iirc.
I dislike them. I have no pressure to learn and improve. If I wanted a slaughter I'd play against bots.
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@Bodark said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3912408#Comment_3912408
Do it! I’d love to see somebody get good value from it. I watched your Kaneki stream. You seem pretty good but the survivors seemed a little clueless tbh.
Think I talked about how I wasn't impressed with my competition. Big reason why I lost interest in DBD. It isn't fun to just slaughter without any pushback, you know?
If I do it might not be on Huntress, might do a game but probably won't be the whole time.
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@Bodark said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3912381#Comment_3912381
I’m not talking about Wesker or Nemmy. Although Nemmy does seem like a wasted perk since his whip is beyond good enough.
115% killers can actually potentially play around a pallet without it being as big of a detriment to them. 110% killers cannot. Except Spirit and Hag potentially.
Either way I would wager that there are much better options than dissolution. Couoe De Grace would have done you better in every single scenario and gotten much more value than Dissolution. And Dissolution doesn’t stop a lithe from proc’ing either.
Skull merchant has or had dissolution basekit with traps and it was map wide. It was still essentially garbage. It was an add on but it was so unimpactful they made it basekit.
It’s definitely one of the worst chase perks in the game though for sure. Unbound is probably the only chase perks that is worse.
I am tempted to stream to prove you wrong.
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@Bodark said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3912361#Comment_3912361
That’s what happens when you have several hundred hours on a single killer. Trying to run around the pallet as an easy to read 110% killer is not possible against the survivors I go against on average. I just reached Top 250 Huntress players worldwide last week.
I beat competitive players who had triple to quadruple my hours and I promise you they will NEVER lose a pallet to dissolution against Huntress. It’s not gonna happen lmao.
Any Huntress worth their salt would know to either break the pallet if it’s an unplayable loop or double back and hit over. That’s what Ralph does. And he’s got 6k hours playing her.
Put them in the right situation and they will.
Beat Team Misery using Dissolution on Wesker. Pretty sure I downed Abby using it at some car pallet on Autohaven. Beat them again with Pinhead, but not with Dissolution.
Went into Tofu's Scrim Nights with Nemesis and Dissolution, iirc.
Played it in the Community Cups Tournament.
Must be like Lightborn. Some people swear by it and others can't get value from it.
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@Bodark said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3912327#Comment_3912327
Twenty seconds is definitely not more than enough time for a 110% killer lol. 20 seconds is about the time you get in range of the survivor to ready up. And then you have about a 1 second window to score the hit. Trying to run around the pallet and not hit over it or break it is a horrifically bad idea
If the pallet is down doubling back and catching them at the pallet works 90% of the time and far better. Dissolution is one of the worst perks to use on her since she is so slow. Super tall with audio queues when winding up.
It’s genuinely an F Tier perk that approaches mediocre on a handful of killers. 99% of the time a survivor knows it’s active they will hold W to the furthest away loop and when you catch up it’s gone. No survivors stays at a loop you injure them at.
I think we play the game very differently.
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@Reinami said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3912337#Comment_3912337
Probably also haddonfield but i haven't tested it. It definitely creates a true infinite in dead dawg main though. I tested that and its super broken.
I would imagine that some of the upstairs windows in Haddonfield would be busted.
2-Story House in Badham is something to look into as well.
What about the Boat on Swamp?
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@Bodark said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3912238#Comment_3912238
How do you use it right? Especially on Huntress. You injure a survivor and then what? They fast vault and nothing happens because it take 3 seconds to start and then you round around the loop 20 times so you can actually threaten the hatchet then they vault and it doesn’t break because the timer ran out lmao.
Running this perk on her is a terrible idea. It doesn’t help with god pallets or 50/50 pallets. And at any other pallet you’ll be better off mind gaming and doubling back to catch them over the pallet.
It should be reworked so that way if you hit a survivor the next time they fast vault a pallet it breaks without a timer or terror radius requirement.
That would be wildly overpowered, so no.
I am not an amazing Huntress player, forewarning.
I always force the pallet down first, if you get a hit when it goes down even better. It means Survivors cannot play around pallets at all. Twenty seconds is more than enough time to get a hit. Don't threaten them with a hatchet if the pallet is already down and if it isn't, walk through it.
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@Iron_Cutlass said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3912234#Comment_3912234
It’s not about the direct value of getting the pallet break.
Dissolution does something important against good players, it forces them to change the way that they play tiles. Pallets becomes significantly weaker, it forces Survivors to play more around windows which a lot of Killers can take advantage of. Even still, Survivors playing safer are more likely to exhaust their window vaults which can make structures that are safer less reliable for Survivors.
Hard disagree that it is awful, you are not using the perk right.
Precisely!
Experienced players often operate in sequences, whether or not they consciously realize it. Being able to interrupt and force computation massively disrupts their chases and forces them to act on incomplete or unfamiliar information.
That is part of what I played on when I was playing and how I found limited success against players, objectively, better than me.