Prometheus1092
Prometheus1092
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Um a lot of survivor's claim the chase is the fun part, looping. It's interesting that they like the chase when they can loop the whole match but if they get caught it's "tunneling" and no longer want to be chased. Out of all the controversial tactics killers use (slugging, camping, tunneling) tunneling is the 1 tactic that gives survivors exactly what they want....the chase. So enjoy the chase and dont get caught.
And Freddy?? Arguably the worst killer in the game? That one playing Freddy must have been a pro because Freddy is awful as an killer, he's useless lol. Survivors have all they need to counter the killers tactics with items and perks. You might not find the game enjoyable anymore but do you think it's fun for killer when survivors are literally doing a scooby doo sketch around a pallet for ages then move to a new one and repeat? It's part of the game, that's why I deliberately go anti loop killers and go into a match prepared to deal with the most common tactic I see.
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I would say survivors are a team to start with but in many cases the survivors are more brutal to eachother than the killer is and this is the view of many, survivors and killers. They have no issues stabbing eachother in the back if there is a gain. Yes some people do selfless acts to help their teammates but a huge majority of the time survivors are more like mercenaries and will use eachother to do gens, distract the killer or whatever needs a team effort, when the team is no longer required it's every man/woman for themselves. Perfect example, Many many many matches, survivors work as a team, help eachother out, when 2 die and it's down to the last 2, it's very common for both survivors to hide and hope the other gets killed first so hatch opens.
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@kosaba11 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3778420#Comment_3778420
There should always be an equal chance for both sides to win. Wanting the game to be fair is not some outlandish want.
There is an equal chance for both the win at the start, you can't expect that equal chance to maintain throughout the whole game even at the end
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Was hoping to get back to normal killings. but at least I can get a few survivor tomes done I suppose... After they are done then I just have to wait until 2 v 8 is over
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@ReverseVelocity said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3774034#Comment_3774034
You're really telling on yourself if you're saying you go down in every chase.
People don't really commit to chases indefinitely anymore. They drop you if you're too much trouble.
Have to disagree with that, I can't be the only one that will chase to the end. Usually I go against teams of loopers so doesn't make sense to drop a chase to then chase another looper doing the same thing. One way or another that looper I'm chasing is being taken out even if it means tunneling lol
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@bluesidesoul said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3776430#Comment_3776430
Took this a little personal I see. Sorry I wanna get a few more points to stay in match longer because the killer didn't want to go ahead and kill me so I could already be in another match.
Not personal at all lol, if you want to deliberately crawl away with the intention to delay the end of the game out of spite then I'm just saying go ahead because while your doing that the killer gets a chance to get extra points for smashing pallets and looking to close the hatch. so if you want to do that to feel like you got payback in someway then have at it, whatever works for you 😁
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Slug em....slug em both if it takes a long time to find them then they wouldn't mind spending a long time slugged.
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@bluesidesoul said:
When the killer slugs for the 4k, I roll my eyes. I then proceed to crawl into a corner or as far away from the slug point so they waste more time trying to find me. You need it so bad? Work harder for it. Plus it gives me a little side quest so I'm not bored out of my mind. We both would have been on to next match if you killed me already. I'm petty
I encourage you to do that, if I slug you then I'm using that time to smash left over pallets/doors or finding the hatch to close. Looking for your slugged a$$ isn't a priority. So while you think your essentialy giving the slugger the finger your really not lol.
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Im a Myers main, I use double iri very often for fun, sometimes people think I'm going for the achievement and deliberately try to prevent me from getting it but then the match ends and they see im P100 so it's pretty clear i already had it long ago and their efforts to deny me the achievement was pointless lol
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@Susurrus said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3775203#Comment_3775203
Yep.
Absolutely grotesque hypocrisy for the sake of profit.Guess they think the 'B' stands for 'Betrayal' too.
It's not hypocrisy at all, just because they made a business deal with someone doesn't mean they support the persons view or opinions. If I buy the dlc that doesn't mean I support anti LGBT views, same goes for BHVR. they clearly haven't done or said anything negative to the LGBT community. If you don't want to play the dlc or have moral standings against it fine but to say hypocrisy is just flat out incorrect.
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@Hunkulese said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3774689#Comment_3774689
Myers is weak against everyone except survivors who don't understand the game. It's extremely difficult to even get two kills against competent survivors using tombstone.
I'm confused, doesn't the game have a hidden MRR? If so how long does someone have to regularly get 3/4k to get to a point where they go against "competent survivors"? Because I been playing Myers for years and I regularly get 3/4k with him against survivor mains that have been playing the game from day 1. Usually double iri, play with your food (to counter the speed drop from tombstone) trail of torment, tinkerer and nowhere to hide. I'm regularly sneaking up behind people and mori them. (Yes I have perks from other killers but Myers as a killer when used correctly is extremely good.)
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@crogers271 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3774276#Comment_3774276
You can achieve the same result by having a count down timer instead of a hatch. As others have said, if by that point the gens are not done then the survivors have already lost so why give them a hatch to escape from?If I understand your suggestion correctly, the problem is that it wouldn't be fun.
DbD pushes tension, the heavy heart beating in the chest, trying to match the excitement, if not the horror, of the horror trope. Running for a hatch is exciting, it creates drama for both sides. The tension of the search which turns to relief when you hear the hatch sound is a very good mini-game.
A count down timer is the game just kind of ends.
You don't see the same system for killers, all gens done, gates open 4 survivors remaining where is the free kill for the killer?Killers have there own version. It's much easier to secure that last hook then it was the others. Is it guaranteed? No, but neither is hatch.
Also, once the gens are done and gates open, the survivors should be leaving. There should be a mechanism to force them out in such situations, but the game is over.
You say it wouldn't be fun... Is the 2 man stand off where they hide for 20min because they both want hatch but refuse to do gens fun? That's my issue with it. The count down timer would end the stalemate, finish the match and allow people to move on to the next one. Maybe 5min timer when there are 2 left? Should be enough time to get the remaining gens done if they are able to but not enough time to take the piss and hide for an undetermined amount of time. Doesn't cause stalemate doesn't give the survivors the win for holding out the match.
I see what your trying to say about the killer having something similar but in order to get that secure kill the killers has to get them on the hook first. A survivor can find the hatch with keys/maps well in advance. The closest thing a killer has to getting a free kill is noed but if there are no totems then it becomes pointless.
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@SunaIIanu said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3774313#Comment_3774313
I don't get what you mean, you think killrates wouldn't change without hatch?
And with adjusting the killrates, do you mean balance changes or do you mean using the new killrate as new target rate?
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3774318#Comment_3774318
I don't see people playing for hatch often, but I do play a lot of SWF, so I might underestimate it.
You seem to care a lot about earning things. I don't understand that, luck is always influencing dbd and I don't see the issue with it, a 3k is a win just like a 4k. Not saying that hatch is the perfect solution, but as someone who has experienced hatch standoffs and 3man escapes at one gen left, I think the current version is fine. And the Killer seems to find it first more often in my experience. But since you wouldn't mind trading Killer nerfs for deleting hatch it's a fair opinion, even though I don't agree with it.
You could also argue from a horror trope standpoint having a last survivor escape makes sense, but that is imo a weaker argument.
luck is fine I get that, luck of gen placement, starting places ect. It's not that I care about earning things but I do think it's a bit unfair on the other 3 survivors that have put the effort in for that one useless survivor to get what's considered a win (escape) then brag about it post game. Each to their own I suppose I mean noed can basically do the same thing for the killer, do nothing all match then mop up at the end with noed. It's crazy how many survivors have an issue with noed but not the hatch.
Like I said previously it's not that much of an issue because I can just slug them most of the time to get around the hatch issue. But my main gripe with the hatch is that it causes a stand off with the last 2 survivors. Both want to escape but won't do gens because they admit defeat and acknowledge they can't all be done with 2 player so hide. If there was no hatch then there would less incentive for the stand off (other than just pure toxic reasoning). That's why I would happily have killers nerfed if it meant the stand off for the hatch wouldn't happen.
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@SunaIIanu said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3774025#Comment_3774025
The hatch spawns at the start of the match (there used to be a bug that it had collision while being invisible right from the start) so when it opens at somebody's feet it's just a coincidence.
Also, the hatch keeps the killrates a bit lower, if you add a mechanic like a timer, that will turn the majority of 3ks into 4ks the killrates will probably rise and that will probably lead to Killers nerfs.
That's my point, the game hands the survivor the escape. They should nerf the killers and get rid of the hatch so people can't abuse it. Whilst 3k games would become 4k on the flip side there are many games that more survivors would survive if there wasn't 1 person going into the match with the intention to get easy hatch escape. Maybe if that survivor helped then all 4 could survive in some cases. It has it's pros and cons for kill rates. But without the hatch the survivors would at least earn their escape and not deliberately try to hold the game up even with nerfed killers.
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@Dreamnomad said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3774025#Comment_3774025
That is a really poor understanding of what the hatch is about. There are killer players on these forums (and you are clearly one of them) that fail to understand that the hatch is a mechanic is in the game for the killer as much as the survivor. Its purpose is to end the game in a reasonable amount of time. You brush the subject when you mention "In many of my games it's lead to a stand off where the last 2 survivors know they can't do the gens so don't even try and they both hide hoping the other player gets killed so the hatch opens".
Now imagine a game where there is no hatch. When it becomes apparent to the survivors that winning by conventional means is impossible and working gens is pointless then what do you expect the players to do? When there are only 2 survivors left and there is more then one gen left to be completed then it is literally impossible for the survivors to escape by completing gens unless the killer goes AFK. Without the hatch, then the only thing the survivors have left to do is waste the killers time. And that is exactly what they do. If you think it sucks searching the map for 2 survivors that refuse to work gens then trust me when I say it is so much worse looking for one survivor that refuses to work a gen and there is no hatch to end the game.
I understand perfectly what the hatch is about lol like you said it's to end the game in a reasonable time but your failing to see my point. You can achieve the same result by having a count down timer instead of a hatch. As others have said, if by that point the gens are not done then the survivors have already lost so why give them a hatch to escape from? It's a free pass. You don't see the same system for killers, all gens done, gates open 4 survivors remaining where is the free kill for the killer? As it stands the hatch system can and does get abused by survivors that effectively hold the game hostage by not doing gens, hiding out of sight. In this situation the killer can't do anything to end the game they have clearly won and that is holding the game hostage, it only ends when the survivors say it ends.
By removing the hatch and replacing it with a timer of some sort it eliminates the need to slug for a start. It also would help stop survivors abusing the system by deliberately hiding for 20min hoping the other would die as there would be no free pass so no incentive to hide. It also gives the killer the win they clearly had.
Like I said I don't mind too much because if I find 2 people trying to hold the game hostage I slug them to prove a point effectively eliminating the hatch option and creating my own timer via bleed out. What's best standard count down where survivors can move and do things or a count down where they are slugged?
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@Dreamnomad said:
This wasn't what I expected when I saw the thread title. Figured it would be another thread complaining about survivors ruining the match for everyone when they quit the game at the start of the match. Which is a fair complaint and one that should be addressed. Just make it so if you make more than one self unhook and/or miss more than one skill check while on the hook during the first 5 minutes of the match then it counts as a disconnect for penalty purposes.
But your complaint is at the end of the game when there are only 2 survivors left and you hook one of them that the player shouldn't be allowed to leave to give the last survivor a chance at the hatch? What is wrong with you? Does your ego need 4 kills so badly? If so then why wouldn't you just slug the second to last survivor? You already have the tools available. There is absolutely no valid reason to make a change based on your complaint.
Personally I think the hatch should be removed all together. I don't mind too much because im happy with the 3k and don't mind slugging. But my issues with the hatch are
1. It encourages slugging which most people hate. Even if I down last survivor before they find the hatch, I tend to just slug them, look for the hatch to close for the extra BP then hook them.
2. In many of my games it's lead to a stand off where the last 2 survivors know they can't do the gens so don't even try and they both hide hoping the other player gets killed so the hatch opens.
3. It can lead to 1 survivor essentially sabotaging the team by avoiding gens, doing nothing the whole match or even deliberately trying to get teammates killed so hatch spawns. (I have seen this a few times, they usually go into the match with a key for this purpose)
4. Spawn locations are insane, they are no where near random enough. There has been times the hatch spawned at the killers feet and other times it spawns at the survivors feet.
From what I can see, the only advantage to the hatch is it gives a potential free pass to the last survivor which gives them incentive to come out of hiding at the end of the match.
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@GreatJokeBalance said:
Just had a game I lost because they had 3 flashlights and I didn't have lightborn.
I should have full control and agency of where my first person view is while picking up a survivor.
I should not be penalized for playing the objective.
Instead I am forced to slug, or lose the game.
Because I didn't slug they all escaped.
I should have full control over my camera during pickup animation.
Facing a wall does not work when your overly generous blind mechanic is allowed to work from the side, while the killer is facing an object.
Fix this bs or I am knockout slugging from now on.
Joke game design.
Flashlight battery needs to be fully depleted on a successful save.
2-3 flashlight saves can lose a game, this is trash game design.
Battery should fully drain and deplete on a successful blind save.
Flashlight being charged at end game when first aid kits and toolboxes are depleted on first use is a joke of game design.
But as killer you can see what survivors equip before match starts, if they have flashlight then probably best to have lightborn on. Can't really complain about something like that tbh
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@Paternalpark said:
How is no one talking about this?
It's a massive buff that makes the stealth part of the game even less viable for survivors.
New tile designs plus this? You just supposed to rush gens then?
All scrach marks needed were color blind filters.
Will be meta like stretch rez was for survivor.
Well tbf I think it's a case of use it or lose it. Most survivors don't even try to hide, they loop and deliberately get killer to chase them around as many loops as they can so others can do gens.
Clearly they are not using stealth in games so it doesn't make that much difference. I think they should encourage stealth and stop the scooby doo loops around a single pallet theme but it is what it is, just have to follow the scratch marks and tunnel them out.
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@Rulebreaker said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3773574#Comment_3773574
believe what ya will, we're getting bored pointing out the same obvious flaws with this again and again.
Time will tell but the years of playing, the years of updates, tweaks, anti camping, anti tunneling hasn't changed anything really so I don't see how it will suddenly change over 10 more seconds each phase. If anything the changes made previously has taught me how to camp and tunnel more efficiently. Getting a player out of the game asap has always been the best tactic for a killer, camping and tunneling is an effective way to do this. That's not belief that's fact based on my games over the years and how I get 3/4k very regularly. But like I say time will tell if it does change.
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@Rulebreaker said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3773129#Comment_3773129
And when you eventually get to the point where the whole team is both smart and good loopers…then what?
Your free to do whatever, but the point stands that sitting at a hook for over a minute while 3 other survivors work on gens without any worry is usually gonna bite campers in the butt if the survivors are smart.
Nah the trick is to camp smart, camp but don't make it obvious. Make it look like it's safe for unhook but when they go for it, tunnel em. If it's a whole team of smart pro loopers then not camping wouldn't help much because it would leave the hooked guy open to be freed and I would still have to spend ages trying to catch a pro looper which could end up with 0k at the end. It's a judgment call I suppose, 70 seconds of camping v 70 seconds of trying to catch another looper while the other goes free. If it takes longer than 70 seconds to catch someone then I might as well sit on the hook and secure a kill. It might bite me on the butt on occasions but i still think it's worth securing a kill where I can get them, won't reduce camping. I'm thinking Myers double iri, proxi camp by hook, when they jump of mori em.
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@Rulebreaker said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3771555#Comment_3771555
Killers actually do have an incentive to leave the hook. To slowdown the other 3 survivors who are working on the gens rapidly and unimpeded.
I can't speak for everyone but I can say is in my opinion, camping and tunneling to get 3 v 1 asap will still be worth the sacrifice of a couple of gens.
I could go after a guy on gen but if it's a team of really good loopers then I'm setting myself up for a lose. Nah if the others want to get a few gens done while I camp and tunnel it's fine, I would rather deal with 3 survivors and have 1 gen left than deal with 4 and have 2 or 3 gens left. Protecting that last gen and the endgame is usually where I get the most hooks ending in 3/4k sometimes 3k only because hatch is unavoidable in some cases regardless of how many gens are done. Especially when it spawns at the survivors feet after not doing any gens the whole match lol
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@MechWarrior3 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3771126#Comment_3771126
Killers have been having a blast. 💥 Survivors are having a lot of fun too because they get to play with big groups of close friends. Both sides are taking part just fine.
400% was just an incentive by the devs to help reduce queue times because the game mode has been so popular. Killers finally having the chance to KWF it up.I agree it's a success with killers, there is no shortage of killers waiting to take part. But survivors...I'm not so sure. If it was that much of a success then surly there would be enough playing to lower the waiting times. Sure there are lots of survivors having a blast but overall I would say not enough survivors are playing it, and it's only been a week. Barely enough time for novelty to wear off. I think the longer it's out, the less survivors will want to play. I could be wrong, in an ideal world it would be great to have both modes and no long waits but I just don't see it happening.
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@MechWarrior3 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3771043#Comment_3771043
This is false. The devs said if the game mode proved to be successful it will be permanent. It was very successful.
Not sure how it's been a success tbh, success to me would be players of both sides taking part. With the long wait times for killers and the 400% incentive for survivors I wouldn't say it's been an overall success. Success for killers maybe but I would argue a bit of a flop with survivors as a whole
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Im all for choice so having it as an additional option for people permanently would be great but not at the detriment of the 1 v 4. As it stands, and as many have pointed out, currently 2 v 8 has made q times in both modes unbearable for many killers so both modes are taking a big hit. There just isn't enough players to support both modes.
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People will always complain about something. 2 v 8 is a different mode but the same game. In 1 v 4 I'm always being accused of being toxic for something. If survivors are constantly blinding me to stop me doing the pick up, or if people body block or something then ye I slug them.
killer complains about being looped or body blocked, survivor says "what are we supposed to do let you kill us?" Ok, fair enough.... When a survivor complains about slugging killer can say "what am I supposed to do, let you escape?" Same applies in 2 v 8. With 3 hatches it can be beneficial to slug last few to get the extra points for closing hatches and ensuring the last ones don't escape. What are killers supposed to do? Let people escape through the hatch?
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They finally killswitched the whole game? If they haven't they really should because since the update there has been constant major issues. Not little things like the odd map glitch... Several maps with big bugs like Invisible walls and allowing people to go beyond boundaries, Wesker bug, the gen bug that will go down in dbd history for a long time lol among other big bugs. The whole thing needs to be shut down, fixed, tested, restarted. Not these spaced out hot fixes that usually give more problems than they fix.
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I don't want op killers at all lol I simply don't think killers are op in 2 v 8 based on what I seen and experienced on both sides. I don't loop as a survivor and I win huge proportions of my matches as a survivor. This is because I can adapt to more than 1 play style. I wouldn't say I'm particularly good at the game so if I can win against 2 killers then I don't see why others can't other than the fact they spend most 1 v 4 matches looping whereas I don't.
I have basis for my argument of not thinking killers are op
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@NetoJON said:
you can clearly see the killers are overpowered because no one wants to play as the survivors. Its a fact. Or they change it or the mode will die. I am a bad killer. Really bad and I got multiple times the hole team killed. I never did that solo. Also. 15 min to play as the killer in this mode. You guys that play as killers, if you dont start saying the mode is unfair because you want killers to be overpowered you will get no mode to play.
It's really not op for killers, it's because for years lots of survivors have spent a long time looping so it's all they know. Don't need perks or items to loop so other temp game modes like random perks means people can still loop. But 2 v 8 has has pretty much removed looping and now survivors are like "what do we do now??" So they don't have fun, they don't play the mode hence long waiting times for killers. But the survivors that know more than 1 way to play seem to be doing fine against 2 killers.
And once again as I have seen in other threads, blaming the killers for not saying it's killer sided and suggesting it's the killers fault if the mode fails. Imo it's the survivors that refuse to drop the whole "loop for life" mindset and wont adapt to a new way to play is what will be the downfall of the mode.
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@sinkra said:
I'm really worried that killer mains are going to sabotage the new 2v8 mode and prevent it from becoming a permanent game mode because of their constant complaining about queue length. I say just give them full survivor bot games so they don't have to wait in queue anymore.
Have to admit, pretty strange to put the blame on the killers for not being happy with waiting times instead of blaming the survivors that flat out refuse to play the mode. There should be bots yes but you cant say killers might sabotage the game mode. Not saying killers or survivors might sabotage the game mode because it has many reasons why it just won't be permanent. but if it is an us v them thing as you make it sound, then I would put my blame on the ones that are not filling the slots....survivors lol.
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@plattenpanzer said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3768133#Comment_3768133
Then it's the type of games that I never play for a very good reason. I don't support this evil practice.
Lmao I don't think you should step outside then, there is advertisements everywhere. It's like going to the store to get some bread and saying the store is evil for advertising some cola at the entrance. The image I have in my head is when you go outside....head looking at the floor, hands over your eyes muttering crazily "must not see evil adverts" Don't open your eyes and expose yourself to this evil! This post truly made me laugh 😂
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From what I see (posts and in-game chat) the complaints about killers teaming up are due to the prevention of looping. I think we all saw that one coming because there is such a prevalence to looping for survivors. In many cases it's all they know, without it they can't have fun. Not true for everyone I know but a huge proportion of survivors have said they will never play 2 v 8 for this reason, hence the lack of survivors and the 400% BP incentive. Not surprising if survivors that loop every match try playing 2 v 8 then complain the killers are teaming up stopping them loop.
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@BabyShrimp said:
my only question is, is playing outside bounds bannable exploiting? If anything theres less of a competitive advantage for that expect for hiding…
It's a tough one lol it should be bannable but at the same time the game is so broken that it's understandable to use such an exploit to even the odds in some cases. It's become a case of who can exploit better.
They would be extremely cheeky to ban people considering how broken the game is at the moment. The Devs should concentrate on fixing thier own mess before looking at banning the players imo
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@tippy2k2 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3768501#Comment_3768501
Maybe others would be game for that but I would much rather have a good game than a really crappy game but get a ton of BP because BHVR made it 20000% bonus :D
I suppose noob players who need BP might jump at that but not me
Hate to say it but I kinda saw this coming... The 2 v 8 mode takes away the 1 thing survivors seem to want to do, loop. I said countless times based on my experience of matches survivors go into a match to loop, not do gens, not for BP, not for any other reason due to looping being "fun" and "the only skillful aspect" for survivors. There are exceptions but a huge proportion of survivor mains are 1 trick ponys, all they got is looping and when they can't loop they can't have fun. That's why it's hard to fill survivor q, thats why they complain about tunneling, camping and slugging on regular mode.
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I been saying this for a while in 1v4 mode, people in my games don't like or want to do gens because apparently it's boring and shows no skill. That's why so many people loop and deliberately try to get chased. Which is why I go anti looping killers. When they lose and I suggest not looping they usually say "what else are we supposed to do?" Or "looping is the only fun skillful part of the game for survivors" 🤷♂️ your funeral, not doing gens won't help you win tho.
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@Dreamnomad said:
This is a pretty good argument for 2v8 not being a permanent mode.
I was looking forward to the 2v8, it is pretty fun tbh. More so playing killer. But if it's going to drain the 1v4 player pool then I agree 2v8 should not be permanent. The player count simply isn't there for both modes. It's possible the players dropped during the gen bug and haven't come back yet but I'm just speculating on that.
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@Monarch said:
It is ridiculously sad to watch some of the people in this community who constantly adopt this tit for tat mindset, or who say "Killers OP" "No Survs OP" or who think the other side are all skilless and scumbags.
It is so tiring to try have a discussion in any part of this community without having someone from either side saying, well actually this is worse.
Worse yet, someone complains about an unfun part of the game be it facing a nurse, doctor, a bully squad, etc, and the other side immediately takes their own frustrations and says, well actually this unfun part of the game is completely fine because I find it fun/you need strong strategies to counter the other sides BS.
It's infuriating to go against a BS addon killer as a solo chill player, just as infuriating as it is to be a trapper against a SWF using full meta, playing like it's the grand finale of the tournament of their life.
So then killers say, well nurse/spirit/blight isn't busted, she's needed to counter these 4 man squads, and survs say well I need to use these perks and items bc nurse.
Anyway, rant over, I seriously hope this community actually can be chill and not an "us vs them" roundabout.
I seriously think the game would be so soooo much better if people actually just took it easy and could overcome tilt a little better, admittedly myself included at times, and if people could understand eachother and realise that fun should be had for both sides, so even if you liked 5 blink nurse or hug tech or 4 man hatches, they're gone for a good reason.
And for god's sake stop trying to say the other sides problems don't need addressing just because you think your sides problems are worse, both sides have valid problems, and "Well this is worse actually" only ends up in arguments and making this community a horrible place to be unless you love keyboard warrioring.
Rant over ig.
You seem to not like the us Vs them view some people have.... Your entire rant is essentially an us Vs them view but involving a different us and them lol. Instead of killers v survivors your rant is a casual v competitive. Both sides see things differently regardless of if it's killer v survivors or casual v competitive.
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@AmpersandUnderscore said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3766947#Comment_3766947
So if it should be a base feature due to how easy it is to tunnel then same should apply to gens
There's already a base kit anti gen rush feature. There's a base kit, stacking penalty that punishes survivors for stacking up on gens.
In fact, this penalty specifically punishes survivors for focusing on one gen and completing it as soon as possible. The penalty doesn't apply if survivors spread pressure.
So this already exists for survivors. Sounds like tunneling one survivor out needs some kind of similar penalty, and has needed one for a long time.
This can be offset with perks the survivors can equip. I got no problem having similar features in place for killer tunneling as long there are perks that offset it that a killer can equip.
I would say the time it takes being looped is the penalty for tunneling 1 survivor.
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@Sarrif said:
Nah, it should be turned into a base feature of the game. We should have always been balancing for hooks instead of kills, the bug helps make the game more fun by punishing killers who tunnel one survivor out because of how easy it is.
More fun for survivors maybe but doesn't make it more fun for killers that's my point, not fun for everyone. From a killer myself, I don't have fun spending whole match doing scooby do chases around a pallet like it's a joke. Yes you can argue it's part of the game and that's all survivors have to do (it's not but that's another topic) but tunneling is also part of the game like or not. So if it should be a base feature due to how easy it is to tunnel then same should apply to gens because let's be honest doing gens is pretty easy.... Just do the occasional skill check and that's it. Same should be applied to both sides or not at all.
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@Toystory3Monkey said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3766254#Comment_3766254
i guess it's bad to want the game to be designed in such a way that all 5 people get to play the most of the match instead of most killers being actively encouraged to stop one person from playing asap or lose.
and devs just patch it with the perks that get in the way of good faith playing.
though why do I care that much, im playing mostly killer anyway, the current system benefits me as long as i play killers with good map control.
I think they should have more objectives personally. Like I said, if killers get punished for tunneling out a player asap then survivors should be punished for knocking out gens asap. Works both ways. I would say preventing gen rushing would have more of an impact on the whole play the most out of each match.
Tunneling gets 1 person out asap. The rest have a longer game. When all gens get completed super fast however, then all players get a short game. So really based on your reasoning of prolonging the game so everyone can enjoy it, preventing gen rushing would be more effective in achieving this. Just pointing out the flaw in your design for punishing people for accomplishing the goals of the game that's all.
It would be the first of its kind to do that I think lol. Can you imagine cod or halo that said "you can't kill your opponents too quickly" or "you can't run away from a tougher player and intentionally go after the easy kill of the weaker player" would change PvP games for sure 😂
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@Toystory3Monkey said:
ngl, this bug is awful, but I like the unintentional idea behind it.
BHVR should consider making it a mechanic.
Like, reward and encourage killers to keep all survivors alive for as long as possible (or straight up make mechanics that stall the game within reasonable merit until somebody gets finally killed so that both sides will play around the idea of setting up the best ground for the next stage of the game which is killing the remaining survivors) bc one of the reasons not to kill people too soon (unless it's a really free kill) is that survivors in 3v1 will become more capable of finishing the overall objective faster.
it's really bad that the game is not balanced around 3v1 or 2v1 in any way and is designed in such a way that losing 4th person almost always means losing the game.
killers still need their comeback tools so survivors never feel truly safe, but it should work both ways.
Nah I disagree with that, the goal of the killer is to kill. Punishing killers for accomplishing their objective is absurd. Can't blame the killers for survivor lack of skill or general stupidity in some cases which get them killed quickly.
By your method of having a mechanic to strengthen the survivors if the killer kills someone then the same logic has to be applied to the other side. Every time a gen gets completed the killer gets an increase in speed. If killer gets punished for accomplishing their objective then the survivors should be punished for doing theirs (gens)
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@joel84 said:
Sorry,
but some players should slowly but surely accept that DBD is not all about chases. I recently had a game in which I was very agile and tactically clever.
I was able to repair at least 3 generators myself and take 3 players off the hook at the same time, including full healing.
It's hard to believe, but that's my style of play. Do Gens, help your buddies and SURVIVE
SURVIVE SURVIVE ...... Does anybody know what that is? SURVIVE ??.....
I think some people don't know.
It's not my job to go into a 1v1 with a killer. Others can do that, but not me, and that kind of playstyle should be accepted. Whether you like it or not.
The endgame chat was a bit surprising for me
me: GG
My Teammates complained about me. I would play with distortion( No, I don't want a debate about this perk ) and hide. I had no right to speak …. crazy or ?
than comes the Killer: My God, you have thousands of hours and not even the balls to go hunting with me ? Running Distortion and hiding all game bla bla.
After that, he got upset again about the number of hours I had spent in the game and then left.
Excuse me? But I survived because I played smart. Few people like that style of play, and that's probably why those people got upset. But that's not my problem
There were no such discussions in 2016. You can take my word for it. What do I want to say with my contribution? Times have changed. Nevertheless, don't let anyone tell you how to play.
Have you also had such experiences? And do you think there is a difference to the past?
Please let me know
Exactly what I been saying for a very very long time. As a killer the vast majority of my matches I go against loopers that want a chase and when things go tits up and they all die, they rant about how bad I am at the game for tunneling, slugging, camping, using boring builds such as double iri Myers or using noed. They do also complain at their own team mates for not doing gens quick enough or for hiding. It's crazy how many people try to dictate to others how to play the game, what tactics are acceptable and what's not.
I offer friendly advice to people that I beat by suggesting they don't loop because I play anti loop killers and tombstone Myers. Looping builds my power up on Myers so not a good idea to try it. But that's just my advice, they are free to loop if they wish just as I'm free to tunnel and camp or whatever works and your free to do gens, unhook or use whatever perks you want. I say do what works. That's what I do
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@PreorderBonus said:
I swear, if I have one more random player who repairs the only generator in the corner of nowhere, I'm going to lose it and become a slugger skull merchant.
We get the Hawkins map? Randoms repair the portal room gen and the upstairs gen. The map is Greenville? Randoms flock to repair the theater gen. The map is Suffocation Pit? Randoms suddenly have a daily mission to "repair every single generator on the same side."
Of course we lose every match if this keeps happening. I thought it was common knowledge by now that some generators are better left for the end of the game. At this point, I'm happy to face Corrupt Intervention because it funnels randoms into the middle generators.
To be fair they are doing gens and getting points, it's better than looping getting very few points, usually end up dead and not making any progress towards the main objective which is escape.
Not only that but it's possible they are doing an achievement/mission of repair total amount of gens.... Doesn't matter what ones. Not great team playing but if they are solo then can't really blame them for wanting to do their own thing due to no ability to effectively communicate.
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@Kaitsja said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3764970#Comment_3764970
So, now we've established that looping does work on you. We've now also established that these are players who only play the game for the chase. There's a difference between a survivor who's looping you to get you to drop chase, and a survivor who wants to be chased.
I can loop most killers for 30 - 45 seconds, sometimes longer depending on tile spawns. I don't do it because I want to be chased. I do it to get the killer to drop the chase in favor of an easier target. If it works, then I don't lose a hook state. If it doesn't work, then I lose a hook state but they've just lost two gens. Looping is the only area in which a survivor can showcase their skills. That's not to say they're doing it to flex, however.
If you're playing against people who are coordinating flashlight saves for when they go down, that's two people not on gens. More efficient survivors won't bother with that, unless they're already in position for the save. They aren't going to make sure they follow their buddy around for when they inevitably get downed. The less people that are on gens, the easier it is for the killer.
Now, tunneling doesn't require skill. You're chasing one person who's just been unhooked with the intent of rehooking them. You're applying all your pressure to that one survivor while the other three work on gens. Tunneling is, more often than not, done to the detriment of defending your generators. Target the wrong person, and you could be walking away with a 1k/3E at best. Worst case, you're looking at a 4E.
As for losing LoS being skillful, it's easy to lose LoS against less experienced killers. Even without perks that hide scratch marks. More experienced killers make it so that losing LoS is a much more difficult task. Whether or not you can lose LoS on a killer depends entirely on how skilled the killer is, what perks they're running, and how well they're able to control the chase. It's more luck than skill.
All the things you think tunneling requires to be successful are completely invalidated by bloodlust. You can be a bloodlust andy, and still successfully tunnel someone out of the game. Looping isn't a flex, but it does require skill. Skill doesn't necessarily beat skill in a game where skill isn't the most important factor.
Looping to drop chase? This is not what happens in my games. I'm repeatedly going against people that want the chase, spin around in circles flashing the flashlight in the air trying to get my attention. If they are expecting me to drop chase, it doesn't happen, they get killed. Still doesn't seem like a good tactic to use. Especially when knowingly going against an anti loop killer.
what your saying doesn't make sense because you say losing line of sight is easy against low MMR but higher MMR it's much harder to do and you say looping is effective and tunneling the wrong person could end in at best 1k.... How do you explain the complete opposite happening in 90% of my games and has been happening for years. My tunneling works 9/10 times, I'm consistently getting 3/4k on a nightly basis. The big picture clearly shows that looping generally doesn't work on me. If looping was effective and tunneling costs me gens then I would be losing far more than 10% of my games. Yes I do lose a few gens but I still walk away with 3/4k and the looper one of the first to go.
The only way it makes sense is that lower MMR lose line of sight is way to go, higher MMR looping is the way to go. But if that's the case then how many months/years of getting gold/iri medals and 3/4k does it take to get to the higher mmr where looping actually helps people win. I'm clearly not at that point yet because I'm still walking away with 3/4k with people trying deliberately to loop anti loop killers and even when I'm Myers. They hand me the T3 by looping then surprised when I mori them quickly.
Facts are pretty clear in my games so far, looping = death sentence. Many people loop, many people die and lose.
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@Kaitsja said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3764909#Comment_3764909
No skill is involved in tunneling. You are focusing solely on one survivor out of four. What do you think the other three survivors are doing while the fourth is busy in chase? Their objective. Your objective is not just to get kills, it is also to prevent the survivors from completing their objective. If it takes you more than 45 seconds to get your first hook, you've already lost two gens.
You equate looping to tunneling, despite them not even being remotely similar. A survivor cannot be in two places at once. A survivor who's in chase cannot simultaneously be doing a generator, or cleansing totems. How exactly are they supposed to be able to do these things while being chased? They can't, because it's not physically possible.
Losing LoS is not the real flex. It's much harder to lose LoS on more experienced killers because they don't blindly follow scratch marks. They control the chase, and where they want you to go. You keep saying survivors lose LoS on you, but how do they do that without looping? Do they just round a corner and suddenly disappear? Looping isn't about trying to delay the killer indefinitely. It's about making the chase take longer. The longer the chase, the more time the rest of the team has to focus on gens.
They lose line of on me by looping in order to lose line of sight. They use perks to hide scratch marks, use speed boost, blind me. They don't hang around and wait for me to chase them around another loop. That's the difference. Looping to lose line of sight works. Looping to flex how well they can loop or to buy time just doesn't work. Huge proportion of loopers will hang around and wait to get another chase to try waste time so gens get done. But the fact is it just doesn't work on me. It might work on others, but 9/10 the looping just doesn't waste enough time. tunnel them out asap and move on. And I definitely disagree with the the 45 seconds and lose because I have taken way longer and I still win. This is my point, against me anyway... Looping just doesn't work, they end up dead and with a low score. If I can beat looping then I'm sure many others can too. Not saying I win them all, some times I lose against loopers but that's really not often.
While someone is looping me there is usually 1 other survivor as back up for if they get caught. Pretty obvious when I down them and there is someone else there immediately with a flashlight to waiting for the pick up. Another reason I go pyramid head, send em to the cage then tunnel the flashlight guy and it disrupts the gen guys by freeing the looper. When he's free I go after him again. When the loopers are out then even if it's 1 gen left to complete, the rest just fall. But one way or another the loopers get taken out.
Im sorry but my opinion is something skillful, something hard to do should be a flex. It's impressive to do something hard. By your own words, that's lose line of sight. And there is just as much skill in successfully tunneling someone as there is in looping, requires the same skills, knowledge of the map, anticipate survivors movements, control of movements to hug corners effectively to catch them. Use of killer abilities such as pyramid head. All these skills are involved in successfully tunneling someone. If looping is such a flex and skillful thing then it must take a degree of skill to counter it head on.
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@Kaitsja said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3764706#Comment_3764706
The same cannot be said about tunneling. It's called tunneling because you tunnel vision. You ignore everything else around you for the sake of going after one person.
Good killers rarely lose LoS on survivors, and even when they do, it's only enough time for the survivor to gain distance. Looping is realistically the only thing survivors can do to shake the killer. Survivors move at 4.0m/s, while Killers are either 4.6m/s or 4.4m/s, with the exception of Nurse. If a survivor just mindlessly runs in a straight line, they'll get caught and downed. If they just mindlessly run pallet to pallet, they'll create deadzones.
It's easy to lose LoS on a low MMR killer, because they just follow the scratchmarks. Much harder to lose LoS on a killer who mindgames loops, and forces the survivor to either make a mistake or run to a deadzone.
It sounds to me like the loopers you're talking about are people who play the game purely for the chase. Not everyone who loops plays like that. Survivors loop because it buys their team the most time. Losing LoS rarely works in chase against more experienced, more knowledgeable killers.
There are perks that hide scratch marks. Like I said previously the ones that use these perks to lose me in a chase end up winning. Looping doesn't work on me so fail to see how it's worthwhile to loop based on the years I been playing. I would say same can be said for tunneling because the killer needs to be aware if his surroundings just like the survivors do, needs to read the survivors to anticipate the next move. But surly if survivors want to flex skills then it would better to flex at how they can lose line of sight. You said it yourself, much harder to lose line of sight than loop. That's the real flex, not looping.
Also isn't looping the equivalent of tunneling? Ignoring all other objectives, having tunnel vision only concentrating on the looping nothing else. Not doing gens, not healing team mates, not doing totems. Sounds like survivor version of tunneling to me.
All I can say is what works and doesn't work in the matches I have played. On a nightly bases I'm getting regular 3/4k against people that loop. When I lose its not due to looping it's due to losing line of sight. Maybe I'm playing a different game to everyone else lol but that's my genuine nightly experience on dbd
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@SweetbutaPsycho said:
As we all know things are (once again) broken since the last update in DBD. Especially that super cool gen bug that turns clear wins into clear losses is super fun.
Now to my point: I faced multiple SWF groups today that tried and sometimes managed to trigger that bug on purpose to turn their clear losses into an insta win with 3 gens remaining. After that I got the 2 remaining survs teabagging me at the exit gate, writing ez like 10 times in chat and admitting that they know this bug exists and therefor their 2 colleagues dced because it is a "survivor strategy". I find this entire interaction annoying to put it gently.
Also am I the only one that thinks at this point the entire game should just be killswitched for like a week so the devs can iron out the worst issues and maybe fix some code so it doesnt break more and more with each new update. I mean I really like that the devs are communicating about these issues and that they are working on fixing stuff but gamebreaking bugs like these should imo at most be in the game for like 1-2 days until they are fixed and not 1- multiple weeks until the next hotfix arrives.
It's funny, I said in a previous post that I heard things like this was happening and the response I got was "nonsense" and refusal to acknowledge it out of blind support for team survivors. If those people are reading...hate to say it...nah who am I kidding, I love to say it.... Told you so. I played a few games last night to test the waters and indeed a did have a match where they intentionally tried to trigger the bug. (I slugged the remaining survivors and watched them bleed out for their efforts) Obviously I got bashed to hell and back post game lobby but they bring it on themselves lol
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@Kaitsja said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3764552#Comment_3764552
Looping isn't just going in circles, though. Knowing what resources are in your area, how to utilise them, and chain them together while also being able to read what the killer is going to do is incredibly skillful.
There is nothing skillful about sitting on a generator and hitting the occasional skill check that only exists to ensure the survivor is actually paying attention. The same applies to altruistic actions. The chase is the only area in which a survivor can showcase their skill level as a player.
If looping is the only skillful area for survivors then same can be said for tunneling, about keeping on the survivor, reading what they will do, making sure they don't lose line of sight, knowing what resources are in the area where they could lose line of sight. During the chase, it's more skilful to be able to lose line of sight and lose the killer than to go in circles imo.
It still doesn't explain what the point is. Ok so they flex about how "skillful they can loop" but to what end? 9/10 loopers going against me end up dead with a low score because they haven't done ######### all else in the match. It's easy to predict because most loopers do the same thing. I have been a survivor for a long time prior to being a killer and I still just don't see the point. As a survivor I played dbd to accomplish the goal of the game, do the gens, survive, escape. Not flex about how good my pointless, meaningless looping is. As a killer I play dbd to get kills. If people want to dance around and flex and lose that's fine by me. They lose but hey at least they can loop for a little while lol
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@Kaitsja said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3764509#Comment_3764509
Losing LoS is an effective tool, but I'm not sure you could call that a stealth playstyle since the point of a stealth playstyle is to avoid ever being seen by the killer in the first place.
It's not really about fun. Looping is effective, and really the only way for survivors to showcase their skill level. Someone who can't loop is often going down in chase very quickly. Whereas someone who can loop is going to run the killer for a long time, maximising the value they get out of a single chase.
It's important to understand that while the scooby-doo-esque chases may not be to your liking, it's a result of how DBD has evolved over time. Stealth used to be a viable playstyle, but with perks like Nowhere to Hide, Floods of Rage, BBQ, Bitter Murmur, Darkness Revealed, Alien Instinct, Ultimate Weapon, Weave Attunement, etc. It's just not viable to go all-in on stealth anymore.
I very much disagree with the whole looping only way to showcase their skill level because like I said many times, in my experience spanning multiple years, looping just doesn't work. Ye they can go in circles for ages, hardly skillful. I was survivor for 2 years I have done it and know how easy it is. But the loopers end up dead with pretty low score end of match when the go against me anyway. The ones that don't loop, work on gens and lose line of sight when after a chasing for a bit... They are the ones that end up beating me.
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@Kweh said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3764509#Comment_3764509
Looping is…… boring? The only point of interaction in the game is….. boring? Survivor's only viable way to make time for 90 second generators is….. boring?
Why are you playing DBD? Get a hobby or something man.
From my point of view, finding, tracking, having genuine chases, avoiding flashlights, making jump scares is what I find fun.
The point for survivors is to complete gens and escape. If they spend whole match looping then I ask the same question, why play dbd because the objective is not to loop it's to do gens and escape. As previously pointed out, in my experience looping doesn't work. They still end up dead and don't escape so what's the point? If you want to go in circles for 10min then go on a merry go round not dbd.
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@Kaitsja said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3764228#Comment_3764228
Stealth just isn't viable anymore. Stealth was a viable playstyle before maps started getting their visual overhauls, and before the plethora of aura reading/location revealing perks we have now.
Dead by Daylight may be horror-themed, but it's still a videogame. Take away looping, and you may as well have killed the survivor role.
Not exactly true, there has been a few games where survivors have actually lost line of sight and won, all survived. They didn't loop and still had an effective role. Survivors have different ways to play, most want to loop. That's fine by me because very very often I'm prepared for it and effectively take away their looping tactic and they end up losing as a result of trying it.
By all means if survivors feel looping is the way to go and enjoy the comedic scooby doo scenes then go for it, I don't find it fun but each to their own. they really shouldn't complain when they have similar boring tactics used on them tho... Camping and slugging for instance. Survivors think it's boring but they obviously don't care about my enjoyment when they are looping circles around me so why should I care about their enjoyment when I slug them and take the 4k? Works both ways, each to their own tactic, whatever makes them win and have fun. But looping rarely gets a win in my experience.