KornySon10
KornySon10
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You are comparing a perkless M1 killer to fully decked out survivors?
All M1 killers should be running chase perks, unless you are a god at mindgames or have a really good map offering.
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You can stick on lightborn if there's 2-3 flashlights in the lobby, but they usually don't bother me that much.
I prefer enduring + brutal strength sometimes though, then it honestly doesn't matter how many pallets get dropped on your head.
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@djsponge10 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1086989#Comment_1086989
That build you stayed with bamboozle pop and corrupt and brutal is weak as hell. Literally does nothing from someone running to every pallet while every other survivor does different gens all it does is reduce pallets. There’s no map pressure. Sure you’ll probably get a kill maybe even two every once in a while but that build is weak just like clown.
I think it plays to his strengths, and that is his chase. Clown is only there for the chase, same with someone like huntress. I would always stack a few chase perks on him, be it brutal + bamboozle, or spirit fury + enduring. But I prefer bamboozle because I don't like having to deal with jungle gyms for any length of time.
Why use slowdown perks when you might not even be getting the hooks without the chase perks? Pop goes and corrupt are the only slowdown perks you really need. I have enough map knowledge I don't feel the need for tracking perks.
What build do you recommend that stops someone just running "pallet to pallet"? Spirit fury + enduring? I usually find that too mindless for my liking. There's no other options.
And I 3-4k with clown regularly at red ranks, so I really disagree. You just need to play with a strategy in mind, and pop goes lets you pick and choose which gens to doctor; while also just being the best slowdown perk there is currently.
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@Bill_I_Am__Overbeck said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1087095#Comment_1087095
But pallet drops don't equal a hit on a survivor. Even if you bust through pallets like nobody else with Brutal Strength and even Fire Up added onto that, there's 50 more pallets that the survivor has time to run to and force you to break. Sure, you'll create dead areas quickly with clown by breaking windowless open loops, but by the time you do that it'll be the late middle to end game.
On top of that, doctor can at least stop close survivors from completing a god loop window vault, while Clown just forces a medium vault, which has been relatively recently sped up by the devs.
You don't have to chase the same person around the entire map all game with him. Unless it's a SWF, it's always better to swap targets and chase people through the areas you have already broken the pallets in. That goes for any killer, not just clown.
My general strategy with any low mobility killer is to 3 gen. Knock out the pallets nearby, and you are almost set. Get a hook nearby? You are golden on almost any map.
It's only the overpowered killers like Freddy / Nurse / Billy / etc that I feel like I can safely just go chase-to-chase mindlessly across the map and not care about which gens to hang onto.
@Yung_Slug said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1086989#Comment_1086989
A lot of killers can do the things clown does but better, or they do it just as good and also have a way of pressuring the map.
He's add-on dependent and map dependent. If you get a map like red forest, survivors can complete a gen before you can even walk over there. Fixing maps would help him out a lot.
That's why I always use corrupt on my low mobility killers. You get 2 minutes of a map half the size to patrol. It's impossible to have gens pop before you can get to them with corrupt on.
And I think bamboozle clown forces jungle gym pallet drops faster than any other loopable killer in the game, bar someone using nemesis + PWYF who has built up 3 stacks (but they are not really loopable anymore at that point).
He gets entirely free hits at many tiles, with no need to mindgame if you have bamboozle on. L + T walls? Vault one, gas the other, collect free hit in like 10-15 seconds tops.
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@underlord99 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1086989#Comment_1086989
I think the reason people find clown weak is because he has like zero map pressure , plus if the survivor is smart and throws down the pallet early to make distance there is not much the clown can do.
Also it isnt nice to criticize people for following people they like. I dont mean to be rude but if every streamer/youtuber and every player is saying he's weak (including survivors) then maybe it's true.
As I said, all you can do is feed him pallets.
With brutal and some mindgames they won't make it far. You can pretend like you are going to bloodlust to force them onto one side of the pallet, and then kick it with brutal and they will make very little distance in alot of cases.
Any jungle gym is instantly shut down by bottles and bamboozle. They can only throw the pallet, and then you brutal strength it. Infinites almost cease to exist.
One of my favorite streamers, pro vengeance, has a 98% 3-4k rate and he uses clown regularly at rank 1. And he also makes fun of people who say he is weak.
The only time I feel like he really struggles is against SWF, but what killer doesn't struggle against SWF?
Personally, I just think people are bad with him, and can't strategize enough with where to place the bottle tosses in order to land fast hits or force instant pallet drops.
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I like the super thick mist offering. I always appreciate how it can turn any map into a close quarters map.
Of course, I also run spine chill or whispers so extra fog is usually in my favor.
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@TAG said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1086971#Comment_1086971
I think it's really niche and not very good. I don't see much difference with or without it unless I'm playing very specific Killers. From my experience, Survivors will just move to another area of the map where they know it's super unlikely there will be a locked gen. It just slightly increases the time it takes to start working on gens. That's it.
If you don't have the map knowledge to get an idea where the survivors will be at the start of the game (usually right on top of the blocked generators), you can run whispers to guarantee you will get value out of it.
Plenty of survivors will attempt to wait it out, or do totems and chests, and if that is the case, it has already done it's job (assuming you are chasing someone by that point).
It opens up alot of 3 gen strategies, which I think is the best option on alot of the low mobility killers these days. If you can hook someone next to your 3 gen? You don't need to move to any other place on the map for the rest of the game.
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Why do people think clown is bad? He is add-on relient sure, but with a proper build and some decent add-ons he is an absolute monster in the chase.
It's probably because people follow the stupid builds streamers like otz put out for him, with devour hope and haunted grounds and all that other RNG nonsense; instead of using their brain and creating one for themselves.
I usually do corrupt + bamboozle + brutal + pop goes. Bamboozle and brutal makes him terrifying to be chased by, corrupt for an early game slowdown, and pop goes for a mid-game slowdown.
There is literally nothing you can do against a bleach clown with bamboozle except feed him pallets non-stop, and with brutal you will cut through them like nothing.
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@TAG said:
Disagree. From my experience, it usually doesn't change much, as you are still trying to chase someone while multiple Survivors are doing gens. Then you down the Survivor, hook them, and you've used up most of Corrupt. It doesn't even slow down the game by much; it mostly just changes which gens have progression on them at the start.
I think the Killers that can actually make work of it are the ones who need some time to set up. Mainly Trapper, Hag, Demogorgon, and maybe Freddy a tad.
I think it's the best killer perk in the game. Nothing else stops the survivors from spawning directly on top of your generators and starting to work on them ASAP. On many maps it can take them a minute to even find a gen, and that's already more value than old ruin used to provide half the time.
Depending on where you spawn, it can lock down a 3 gen for the lategame as well.
I feel naked when I play killer without it, unless im on someone super high mobility like freddy or billy; where I think ruin + surveillance is better option.
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@Blueberry said:
Just like Thanata the numbers are too low.
Thanata is great on people who just injure everyone for free, like legion and plague.
@Yung_Slug said:
It doesn't do enough to be that good. Its best use imo is to mess up the timing for people going for flashlight saves.
You may as well just use lightborn then. I sometimes slap it on if there's 2-3+ flashlights in the lobby. not because I particularly care about flashlights, but just being able to pick up a survivor right in the flashlight users face, and then run at them while they are trying to blind you, is pretty funny.
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@Waffleyumboy said:
High rank killers don't face camp, but the green and yellow ranks I get matched up with do. The sad thing is, when we rush gens and get out fast that is their justification for doing it again next game. Some people just don't want to try.
Sure they do, usually when you run them too long. I had a rank 1 legacy streamer I was running around say "I can't wait to facecamp this guy" after I ran him for like 3 gens, and eventually he downed me and did just that with the hillbilly.
About a week later, I facecamped him to death with bubba. And on the stream he was just like "THIS GAMEPLAY IS SO EXCITING"
Payback's a #########, mutha.
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Nah, its terrible.
Needs to be stacked with another chase perk, and by then? Instead of fire up brutal you could just be rocking spirit fury enduring; getting rid of pallets just as fast and also getting free hits to boot.
If you want an endgame perk just do NOED and call it a day.
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@Mert_MK said:
Nothing will be fixed.
Survivors will kill themselves on hook instead or go afk, same with Killers.
Both sides are gonna try their hardest to make the match unfun for the other side. While penalties were active, my friend got slugged and teabagged by a Pig until he bleed out, killer even admit he did that because he's aware he can't dc without a penalty now.
And when i played Killer i had a SWF last second switch to toolboxes and bring a Strode Key.
Should have looked into why people DC in the first place and fix the ######### game. This is going to kill the game.
Better they kill themselves on hook so I get my pop goes / emblem instead of DCing so I get nothing.
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@[Deleted User] said:
It doesn't exactly help matchmaker puts you in matches you have lost already before they've even begun because the people have like 5000+ hours of practice on you.
So you stop learning anything because you can't even really figure out what is going on, you don't get enough practice in those matches to get any better.
Some experienced streamers have suggested you find some friends and go to private custom games and have them run loops against you so you can talk to them, and really figure out what works and what doesn't.
Half of the streamers are not really even that good. Alot of the youtubers only post videos of themselves winning.
I only follow people who have made an impression on me. In the case of the guy I mentioned above, I had probably 2000-3000 hours when I ran into him, and he absolutely demolished my team when I was playing survivor, to the point I checked his profile.
Watching him let me significantly up my game.
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@Torchlight said:
Honestly come off a ton of really bad games with sweaty SFW grouped red rank survivors (im rank 10), so needless to say I was pissed off and made a dumb post about "oh survivors op ######### life" blah blah blah. I need to get better at Killer and I know I should be moon walking, mind gaming, and all the other things that good killers say you should do, but I dont know how.
at this rank trying to mind game as someone of my skill level is nearly impossible against the people I keep getting put up against because:
1 - Im horrible at it so I either swing to early, go the wrong way, or miss read the situation.
2- the survivor predicts it and just makes a ton of distance meaning by the time the next chase is instigated another gens done.
I want to get better at this game but constantly being talked down to by hot headed survivors and feeling like no progress is being made is really ######### me up tbh... any tips on ways I can practice or videos that might be able to show me how to do better?
https://mixer.com/ProVengeance_
Watch this man play. He almost always wins, and usually explains what he is doing. The statistics prove it.
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@NullEXE said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1082224#Comment_1082224
It's pretty obvious which way a Killer is coming from, any half good player can figure that out. Why even mention promotion - that's a useless weaker version of Spine Chill.
Spine Chill literally turns stealth killers into just m1 killers with no abilities.
Yes? Myer's is a KILLER he should be the power role. If the player wants to play a jumpscare HORROR character they should be able to. You are the SURVIVOR. This isn't supposed to be a competitive game, it's supposed to be casual. YOU ARE SUPPOSED TO GET SCARED AND EXCITED. Important to also mention giving a player a perk that guarantee's you know when the killer is near you ignoring things like terror radius, and stealth as a "counter" is not balance. That's just broken. Balance would be giving a survivor an equivalent advantage. Which also wouldn't make sense for a HORROR game.
I also never take Spine Chill off, because I also like getting free win's by taking a perk. Just like Decisive Strike, Borrowed Time, and Dead Hard. 2 Immunity perks, and a confirmed safe hook for the Benevolent emblem. YES PLEASE! Though i'm not going to sit here and lie - to say that these are not broken to hell perks, and they shouldn't belong in a Horror game.
Honestly I get scared more often by Survivors stunning me as Killer than I ever do playing survivor.
You can know which way the killer is coming from by just knowing map layout. The easiest solution is knowing where the corner of the map is. He is most likely not coming from the barrier, the closer you are to the corner then the easier it is to predict where the killer is coming from. As the game goes on, you get a mental idea where the killer is all the time via Hooks, Chases, and Sounds - it gets extremely easy to predict.
Yeah, when you are doing a gen that has like 3-4x corners or LOS blockers near it, and the killer has literal wallhacks on you, it will be super obvious which one they are going to pop out of.
Don't lie, you never play survivor.
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@NullEXE said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1082162#Comment_1082162
Yeah which makes sense for a Killer. What doesn't make sense is a perk that directly tells you danger is nearby like Spidey Senses - in a HORROR game. Not to mention how much of a crutch that ability does for a role that shouldn't be the power role.
Not only does Spine Chill give more information to the survivor than whispers does a Killer, but it's easier to use, and more reliable.
It doesn't tell you which direction they are coming from, unless you pair it with premonition as well. And that uses half of your perk slots, which is a waste in my opinion.
Nothing is going to save you from the stealth killers on close quarters maps. Otherwise, you are probably taking hits entirely for free.
Should scratched mirror myers just murder everyone without counterplay? Let me tell you, there is basically none on a map like lery's.
That's why I will never take spine chill off, in case I run into builds like those.
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@Waffleyumboy said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1082189#Comment_1082189
Double heals for over a minute is good enough for me.
I'd rather never go down, than save ~10 seconds off 1 heal.
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@NotSimoun said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1082144#Comment_1082144
When you said you played nurse did you mention you play in red ranks? Because I have and one cooldown and fatigue is all you need to reset chase. R1 survivors know that you only need LoS to mix nurses up and never go to any open field. It is possible to juke a nurse with just one jungle gym.
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1082109#Comment_1082109
good survivors know not to use DH until you swing except if you're directly on top of them. She's probably the only killer where survivors aren't worried about dedicated because they know the nurse has to decide on a swing or not before fatigue strikes. It's mindgames on survivor's terms.
I'd say not using DH until the killer is directly on top of you is the worst time. With dedicated servers, half the time it will leave you exhausted on the ground because the killer hit registered before your dead hard.
You can really tell who actually uses the perks in this thread.
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@Waffleyumboy said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1082168#Comment_1082168
I also run that...
There's so many better perks than saving a few seconds on your heals.
You can be running stealth perks so you are not getting chased in the first place, chase perks so you are not being hooked in the first place, second chance perks, gen rush perks, etc etc. I think it's terrible overall in comparison to what could be in it's place.
It's nice to have, but overall greedy and will be punished by the best of killers.
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I usually just do him the tombstones these days. You will derank, but it's pretty damn funny.
Monitor + Play with your food + Nemesis + Corrupt intervention. Then offer hawkins/lerys and a tombstone piece + J memorial.
Eat a pallet, get to 3x stacks and tier 2. Then get to 99%. Leave whoever you have been stalking and patrol gens. Pop the 99% tier 3 on someone and it's GG instantly.
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@RayrafLPP said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1082130#Comment_1082130
Just dont heal then and magically it works. As if sprintburst did anything agaibst one shots. Oni is faster billy is faster. Once downed you dobt heal anyways so you can use dead hard next time. Sprintburst is good but still no compairson to deadhard.
Yes, don't heal against Oni. Give him his insanely overpowered ability for free. The red rank Oni's will usually be running scalped topknot and infectious fright.
Unless you are literally right next to a pallet, you are going to get murdered by 90 degree flicks.
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@Waffleyumboy said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1082156#Comment_1082156
That's why I run spine chill with it. Plus, I mostly play swf where it's super potent.
I think it's inferior to something that will actually give you a new capability as a survivor. Like borrowed time, letting you stop a camping killer. You can save 5 seconds off your heal....or actually save your teammate from someone camping them.
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@NullEXE said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1082056#Comment_1082056
There's a big difference between knowing a survivor is in your vicinity as Killer, and knowing the Killer is in your vicinity and looking your direction as Survivor.
At the start of the game, I can usually use whispers to pinpoint exactly where the first survivor I am going to chase is. I have played with it for hundreds of hours, and know about what 32m is.
If it's the last survivor left, they will have almost nowhere to hide.
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@Waffleyumboy said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1082060#Comment_1082060
Why you diss we'll make it?
Because it is mainly a greedy perk and encourages healing directly under the hook, which is never a good idea.
Unless you are running spine chill.....and can know it is safe to actually heal under the hook. But still, it's usually not a good idea. 50% of killers won't directly come back to the hook, but 50% will. Want to gamble on which it will be?
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@RayrafLPP said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1082090#Comment_1082090
So what do you do in thid situation? Dead hard for distance to reach the pallet. Thats a major problem i have with it. If the killer lunges early the survivor has enough time to react. If you wait another second the survivor deadhards anyways because of the distance. In this situation you broughz up theres no counterplay given. It is a free health state.
As I said, dead hard for distance is suboptimal. Sprint burst or lithe gets you like 5x the distance that dead hard does. If they are dead harding to the next pallet, they probably could have sprint bursted or lithed off to the next loop and not even been in that chase to begin with.
I had a game where I was looping the shack against the plague on ironworks of misery. I got puked on and eventually injured, but she could not score a hit. I used lithe to vault the shack window and used the distance to make it all the way to the god loop in the main building. With dead hard? I was stuck at the shack and eventually would have had to drop the pallet.
Sprint burst requires significantly more game awareness to use effectively. You need to know when it is safe to have it on cooldown, or you will be stuck walking across the entire map. Dead hard you can always have in your pocket.
And then you hit a billy, myers, oni, etc etc and your dead hard is almost worthless.
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@RayrafLPP said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1082070#Comment_1082070
Oh and i didnt read your comment but im giving a statement on it anyways.
I've played this game enough to comment without needing to read the argument.
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@RayrafLPP said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1082070#Comment_1082070
Every good survivor looks behind them. You want to mind game the killer at every possible situation. This has nothing to do with deadhard but since most good survivors run this perk we can somehow agree on that i guess.
I see alot of the best players with sprint burst over dead hard. Dead hard is lazy and relatively easy to use, but as I said earlier, you will get exhausted on the ground in so many cases if you try to use it to actually juke a hit instead of just for distance.
I never bother to look behind me in a chase unless i'm actively looping. If I am just running to the next pallet it's not really worth doing anything except a glance to see how much distance I have on the killer.
I am talking when the survivor is just staring behind them nonstop when they are not going to make it to a pallet in time before you hit them, that's a huge telltale of dead hard.
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Nah, tons of my survivor games still involve trash teammates getting slaughtered / DCing on their first down. There's plenty of super OP killers builds you run into as well, that will take a full team of rank 1's making no mistakes to stand a chance against.
I think killer is easier, even against red ranked SWFs, because I don't have to rely on anyone to get the job done.
If I run something like object of obsession to try and carry the game, the killer can just ignore me and tunnel off my weaker teammates instead.
There's plenty of faceroll survivor games, but I get just as many faceroll killer games as well.
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I didn't read this thread, but you can tell someone has dead hard because they are staring behind them while you are chasing them. If you get juked by dead hard more than once, it's your own fault.
Dead hard for distance is suboptimal, sprint burst or lithe will get you much more.
It doesn't even work when it comes down the miliseconds, because you just get exhausted on the ground.
It doesn't work against 1 shot killers.
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@gatsby said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1081949#Comment_1081949
Yeah. That's something I sometimes forget. You don't want to be the survivor that doesn't get hooked or have a teammate that never gets hooked. If it's mid/late game and some teammates have been getting tunneled, its honestly in your best interest to purposely get chased for a while
I honestly think it is their own fault for getting caught. Should I just throw myself at the killer because my team decided to run dumb perks instead of things that will actually help them survive the diciest situations?
Every time I see someone with like "we'll make it" or "we are gonna live forever" getting absolutely butchered; I wished they would run DS so they can be terrible and get away with it, or spine chill so they would not get caught in the first 20 seconds of the game.
I would rather run spine chill and left behind.
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@NullEXE said:
3 - It counters all stealth killers.
4 - It counters all terror radius perks/abilities in the game.
Basically it's the perk that gives all the Killer information you need when your solo that you get for free when your SWF. The opposite than Bond, but doesn't have a requirement to be useful.
Though at the same time, that makes it too powerful for survivors to have.
Yes, and whispers "counters" every stealth perk in the game. It is too powerful for killers to have.
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@NullEXE said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1081983#Comment_1081983
Oh! The survivors are bad at the game, OKAY - yeah then the mori is strong. You were gonna die anyways.
Any good survivor wants to be tunneled because the Killer can't kill a survivor they tunnel - tunnel vision loses the game for Killers. Killers need to be smart and take survivors by surprise and juggle them. Good survivors can look a killer for a whole match, and if you got a key - then till the other 3 leave and you open the hatch / take the door.
As I said - any survivor with a key is a free win. A killer has to meet a requirement to actually be able to mori someone.
Lmao. You sound like you literally never play survivor ever. I play both sides. Mori's are significantly more strong than keys.
Key's you have to get the objectives done, and find the hatch, which is significantly harder than using an instadown killer with a mori and tunneling someone off hook.
Nail someone with instasaw billy in the first 30 seconds of the match and then tunnel mori them so they are dead in the first ~60 seconds of the game? That's alot easier than getting 3 gens done as survivor.
Keys are only a "free win" if you are doing left behind key; and sitting in a locker while your entire team dies, which is honestly more of a win for the killer really.
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Hag main? That's toxic to begin with. I don't think there is a single killer I get more 1 hooks on, just because she is so good at defending them.
If you go into the basement against hag? Goodbye forever.
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@Techn0 said:
Ruin was never good against a team of good survivors. I agree on that if killers were saying "Ruin is mandatory" they were most likely not good killers.
Ruin however was NOT a crutch perk. The amount of pressure an m1 killer can put out is extremely low outside of a select few characters. Running a perk as a bandaid fix to try and remedy the combination of map sizes and generator speeds is not something that should be seen as using a crutch.
Which ones? All the M1 killers have ways to apply pressure. Trapper can instantly end chases with smartly placed traps.
Pig gets ruin built-in with the RBTs. Clown is a monster in the chases. Wraith can bounce targets and actually still get plenty of ruin value just pushing people off gens with sloppy butcher. Demo has his lunge and can also bounce between gens incredibly fast.
Legion/plague everyone is a 1 shot all game, effectively.
Ghostface/myers get free M1s all the time, or one shots if you know how to stalk.
And Oni is just straight up overpowered in his ability if he gets fed it early.
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@ScottJund said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1078881#Comment_1078881
"Barring a really unfavorable map" is the key modifier here considering the majority are unfavorablr for killer
A proper build and play-style on any killer can mitigate it greatly. Killers like demo, hag, trapper, etc are all incredibly good at hanging onto a 3 gen. Someone like hag/demo might even be too good at it, if you have cleared out all the pallets nearby.
Someone like huntress has no map pressure but you ignore half the loops in the game so that is the price you pay.
It's like people playing M1 killers complaining about god-windows when there is a perk that completely shuts down almost all god-windows, the shack, cow tree, and almost every single jungle gym if used correctly.
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@ScottJund said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1078858#Comment_1078858
I'm not a Huntress main and perhaps someday people will realize I'm not complaining for myself I'm complaining for the 99% of other people who don't have the luxury of playing this game for a living.
The top killers still absolutely demolish almost any solo Q team, barring a really unfavorable map.
Killers still have so many crutches they can put on. Be it add-ons, entire characters (freddy, nurse, spirit), perks, moris, hawkins/lery offerings, etc.
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Gen speeds are fine. You only get gen rushed if you are chasing 1 survivor for minutes at a time and refuse to break chase.
If it is taking them minutes to go down, they are better than you. If you can't find a single survivor in the whole game who you can down in a reasonable amount of time, the entire lobby is better than you, and you deserve to lose.
Simple, really.
Scott is a huntress main so it's no wonder he is complaining he can't slap on the braindead ruin and now actually gets punished for mis-positioning his 110 killer on the map.
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The chili is actually garbage. Use the beast's mark + carb tuning for about as powerful as he will get. Primer bulb + carb tuning guide is also amazing. I usually run it with spirit fury + enduring for free saws.