Jago
Jago
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- Jago
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Comments
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Escaping through hatch feel like a win so... Got to be proud about it.
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Cheat engine rework is the real rework we all need.
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Yeah I agree it feels boring. Same for being stunned cloaked for 8 hours :(
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Bold of you to think there is an MMR system.
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Dont worry, base UB will be the good nerf she deserves /s
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I'm all ears = 1 sec freeze
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Anything Junji Ito.
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@Terion said:
yeah if you manage to slugg 4 people within 45 seconds its an insta win.. I can think of 1 killer who can do that. You know who it is? lets see if you find out.
Thats why i dislike anything about this, from the insta mori to the ub basekit. One screws over soloQ hardcore, the other screws almost all of the killers, even completely destroying some. (twins for example)
Yes. Leatherface.
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Sorry but I'm NECROMORPH gang.
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It's called the "Just leave" feature
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@CaulDrohn said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3207702#Comment_3207702
Yes, the new mori offerings are a gamble (and a bad one, I'd say). I would like them to do something different myself. But thats not set in stone, the PTB is coming for the community to test this out as well.
Yep... We ll see how it goes ! A little bit of chaos is good sometimes
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@Rovend said:
61% kill rate
Bro there's probably 95% killrate on extremely low MMR. What is even that argument of a blurry stats XDDDD
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@CaulDrohn said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3207532#Comment_3207532
Where does it tell that?
You have to make 1k, 2k or 4k, and the last survivor needs to be killed by the mori animation. You don't have to kill all four through the finishing mori.
If you want to do a 4 K you'll probably have to slug. Risking a Hatch escape would mean the offering you've made as a killer is pointless.
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@fulltonon said:
The fact is they just wanted to remove slugging and used moris as excuse.
But the Moris offering basically tells you to slug for a 4K.
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@dugman said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3203082#Comment_3203082
Personally I don’t bother slugging for the 4k, but note that the new version of the red Mori offering requires a 4k with a mori on the last survivor to get its bonus. So it’s pretty likely that someone bringing that offering will be slugging the third survivor to try and down the fourth for the mori rather than risk the hatch.
That's a pretty good point, those Moris offering are just incentives to 4K. That's crazy as is.
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@foxsansbox said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3203107#Comment_3203107
Neither did they, because it's simply not a prevention. Many killers will have no issue slugging the last two over and over.
It's free real estate.
I guess ! Let's create the illusion of a survivor buff to sell Mori cosmetcis :'D
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@Audiophile said:
I swear to god… it’s just non-stop. Like 70% of my games are Wesker and they ALL either clearly proxy camp the hook or they loose proxy camp by leaving but as soon as the unhook happens they shoot back directly to the hook to either tunnel or get a cheap hit on the rescuer. I take my 4% chances on all of these games. It’s just no fun.
If you want absolutely to win, and put all chances on your side, you do that. Thats the game design currently.
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@SmarulKusia said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/348081/are-we-going-to-30min-match-meta
No. We are not, it’s a prevention for killers to be greeding
I don't understand.
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@MrMori said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3203084#Comment_3203084
Hardly anyone does 4k streaks anymore precisely because 3k + hatch is identical to a 4k in terms of whether you won the game or not. So they do 3k streaks.
Slugging for the 4k is unnecessary. I'd make hatch auto close after 60 seconds, that's good right? Then there would be absolutely zero point in slugging since the game is guaranteed to end in max 3 minutes.
That's your vision of the game, but trust me, there are plenty of people having 4K as a primary objective. 3K streaks has been democratized by streamers that dont want to "waste time" (AKA viewer retention optimization) or risk to loose it because of hatch.
I think it's pretty natural to want to do 100% of your objectives in a video game, in this case : 4K. We don't have stats about that, but I think thats way more common that we think.
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Instead of all this, just :
- Add a surrender option after 5min in the game.
Done. No more slug complaint. No more hacker problem.
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@Seraphor said:
- Tunnel out two survivors.
- Slug the last two in a relay until you manage to get them both on the ground at the same time.
Pretty much the only way to guarantee your 20k from the Ebony Mori offering and likely the new meta for those "slug for the 4K" type killers.
So much fun for everyone involved.
It's gonna make Mori offerings so much more toxic than they currently are.
Yeah, I'm afraid that's exactly what will happen, but nobody even talk about that ?
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@MrMori said:
Yeah, you're missing that you can hook survivors.
Thank you mister obvious. But if you're in a 4K streak, you don't want to risk a hook ; the other survivor has a probability to escape.
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@RoastedGarlic said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3200909#Comment_3200909
Look, twins is an outlier plain and simple, twins is also in need of a rework. Maybe if killers weren't constantly slugging for 4k's this wouldn't of needed to happen. But killers brought this change on themselves.
What you seem to not understand is that killers doing the 4K casually, or Killers doing 4k Streaks will still do it.
And guess what ? Yes. It will last even longer. If the survivors don't give up and the killer can't find the last 2 in 45 seconds, just repeat the process.
Welcome to 30 minutes match meta.
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@Jplanas98 said:
Point is the same, reasoning is different. You didn't make the post and state that it's the ultimate BT counter, or the ultimate OTR counter. You came to the conclusion of Snap Out taking priority being uncounterable because it's the ultimate counter to Dead Hard. Reasoning is just as important as your argument.
So you're telling me that if you use Dead Hard the Killer will decide "this isn't worth my time anymore". In that case wouldn't that mean you are in a safe position and would then be able to both Snap Out and mend right after?
I'm not talking as if you enjoy Dead Hard as a precious ring, I'm pointing out that you only came to this conclusion once you realized Doctor passively counters it after the recent change. "You're crying", I mean, you are crying about it. Multiple people have told you multiple ways to work around it, and have told you that it's an intended feature from the devs, and you refuse to accept any of those answers and continue to make the same argument. Also, if you think saying "you'd go down anyways" is a Killer vs. Survivor mentality, that say more about you. If you were slugged with a Killer standing over you and your team mate says "I would revive you, but you'd just get downed again anyways", does that make it a Killer vs. Survivor mentality?
Again, you're still trying to nit pick minor things in attempt to dismiss anything I've said rather than face the possibility that you might actually be wrong. So much so that you even misquoted me, because I never said "You'd go down anyway". I said " You were more than likely still going to be chased after using DH and going to get downed anyways." One implies more that I'm saying you're bad, while the other implies that you would most likely go down eventually because you would continue to be chased.
"Point is the same, reasoning is different" -> the reasoning is implied. As you said, whatever its OTR, BT or DH, or Medkit, or SoulGuard or... Whatever. No need to say everything to create a discussion.
"that mean you are in a safe position" -> Again, no, because the 2 status effects counter each other. I've walked to outplay the killer, BOOM I go down for it. Get it ?
"Multiple people have told you multiple ways to work around it" -> doesnt mean they're right.
"intended feature from the devs" & "passively counters it after the recent change"
--> choose a side. Anyway, the recent patch has made this more obvious because mend is more common.
Whatever mate, if you think that's fine & balanced because it's in the game, good. We have nothing to say to each other. Enjoy basekit UB, seems totally balanced and intended by the devs.
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I really hope they work on it.
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I don't like it. I wonder how Comp players will react to this.
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@Jplanas98 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3200307#Comment_3200307
The reason you're getting the "go to a team mate" answer is because you're complaining about how Snap Out takes priority and don't like the other answers you're getting no matter how valid they are, but being told to go to a team mate gives you a reason to continue to complain because it fits your argument while the other solutions don't.
If you're taking slow actions, then that should mean you're in a position where it should be safe to snap out and mend. If not, that's entirely your fault. If you know have a time limit why would you intentionally do something that would decrease that time limit if you know you then won't be able to mend yourself?
"The 2 status effect HAVE NOT BE THOUGHT to work together with the recent patch" those were your exact words, and in your original post you even say "literally the ultimate counter to dead hard". It's very clear that you're upset about this because you now realize Doc can counter your Dead Hard. So, either you're now trying to back pedal, or you're losing track of your own comments.
What did I say in that comment that was wrong? If you use Dead Hard on a Killer they're not suddenly going to stop chasing you, they're going to continue to chase you until you get downed. Nothing I've said has been a Killer vs. Survivor mentality, you just know you don't have a legitimate counter argument so it's easier to dismiss anything I say by saying I have a "Killer vs. Survivor mentality" than it is to admit that you're wrong.
'"either you're now trying to back pedal, or you're losing track of your own comments."
The point is literally the same. It's just a shortcut to formulate it that way : Mend & Snap Out counter each other.
"If you use Dead Hard on a Killer they're not suddenly going to stop chasing you, they're going to continue to chase you until you get downed."
No. That's false.
"Nothing I've said has been a Killer vs. Survivor "
You keep talking to me like I enjoy Dead Hard like a precious ring + "you're crying" / "You'd go down anyway". Hypocritical.
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Umb / FlipFlop / Power Struggle
You're safe in 5 seconds.
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@Jplanas98 said:
No killers require 2 survivors to avoid an uncounterable down because that doesn't exist. As other people have said, you can still snap out of it and mend right if you don't screw up and decrease your timer by walking or slow vaulting. It's also still perfectly balanced, you're crying because it counters DH, when DH is a perk that prevents you from getting downed by a hit. You were more than likely still going to be chased after using DH and going to get downed anyways, so if your argument is that they didn't take into consideration the recent patch, your argument is a joke.
He countered your counter, but somehow his counter to your counter is uncounterable even though you have a few different options on how you can counter it. This is essentially what your complaint is.
"No killers require 2 survivors to avoid an uncounterable down"'
That's the main answer I have here : "go to a team mate."
"if you don't screw up and decrease your timer by walking or slow vaulting"
Yes, slow actions decrease the mend bar. It shouldn't be a reason for Snap Out to be a priority over it.
"you're crying because it counters DH"
I really don't, I was surprised because the 2 status effect conflict each other.
"You were more than likely still going to be chased after using DH and going to get downed anyways"
I won't go further because you're acting condescending with a Survivor VS Killer mentality : no thanks, have a nice evening.
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@Crowman said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3200229#Comment_3200229
Go to a teammate. You not wanting to adapt is not a balance problem.
We are on an argument loop my friend. Thats fine if you disagree and think it's balanced.
I don't.
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@Crowman said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3200210#Comment_3200210
Deep wounds does not force a down. If you let the timer wear out which you can pause by running, but that's solely on you.
The problem is solely you. You refuse to adapt your playstyle and want to nerf a niche situation because you don't want to play around it.
I'm talking about the 2 status effect. Snap out of it FORCES a down if you have <60% of a mend bar.
Niche situation maybe, still : it doesn't have counter and is an unintentional design.
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@Crowman said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3200173#Comment_3200173
Twins.
Victor downs someone, other survivor kicks and pick up their buddy before twins can get to them.
Deep Wounds is far from an uncountable down. Just keep running.
No you're talking about a survivor already downed. Try again.
I'm talking about the 2 status effects that don't work together and FORCE a down.
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@Jplanas98 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3200107#Comment_3200107
If you're on a mending timer you shouldn't be walking anyways, that's how you cause the timer to decrease. Same with slow vaulting. You're just damaging yourself, has nothing to do with Doc. You also can definitely play around builds using those perks, being in tier 3 doesn't prevent those perks from working at all. Also, going in lockers literally counters his shock, so don't know what you're talking about there.
What this really comes down to is that you're upset that that this specific Killer makes your build less viable, and occasionally makes mending difficult. He's pretty well balanced, you just don't like that he counters you once he bring you into tier 3, or you just don't know how to play when you hit tier 3.
Won't react to first paragraph, I disagree and thats not the point. Straight and simple : I was surprised this was a thing.
You should be able to mend before Snap out. That's it. The 2 status effect HAVE NOT BE THOUGHT to work together with the recent patch. It doesnt make sense that the only option is to find someone else to get out of this situation, or like you say not being able to do a single Slow action. That's not balanced.
Name me one killer that requires 2 survivors to avoid a uncounterable down. I'll wait.
It's not about Doc really. It's about the 2 status effect that counter each other.
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@Crowman said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3200107#Comment_3200107
You can't using heal perks or items against Plague.
Some killers have powers that are effective against certain things survivors can do. Doctor just happens to be good against endurance if you are in T3.
There's no balance issue occurring here
You can go on a fountain. That's the direct counterplay that activates Plague"s power. It negates medkit, boons and altruism : great. But there is a counterplay in the kit.
I agree with you about the fact Killers are designed to counter parts of the game. But in this case, with Doc you're Down or Down : no options, no counterplay = no balance.
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@besjo33 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3200101#Comment_3200101
So not having one for 4 weeks would be bad….
That would put less pressure on people to trigger the effect of emergency. Which could result in drastic less playtime.
Their 4 week of void is filled by new content and PTBs ... It's smart from them, even if I'd tend to be on your side.
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@Crowman said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3200096#Comment_3200096
You have enough time to snap out of it and mend. If you let the mend timer drain enough that you can't do both then you need to find another survivor.
It's really not a big deal even with the more sources of endurance. You simply need to be more careful playing with endurance against Doctor.
I'm repeating myself on this one, but by your logic, once you're on mending timer :
You can't walk against a Doc
You can't slow vault against a Doc
You can't play around Builds like Fixated / Vigil / Sprint Burst or try to hide scratch marks / go in a locker
Etc...
This ... is not balanced ;)
I really wonder why you keep going with that statement when all is needed is just a priority swap between both status effect.
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They want people to play the game, rift is a good pressure point.
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@Crowman said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3200083#Comment_3200083
It's not a flaw. It was an intentional choice made by the developers.
It's really not a big deal needing to seek out a teammate.
It's a flaw considering the recent huge patch. Mend was not a problem before because the only trigger was BT.
Now that there is Base BT, and DH trigger mend, this is more common than ever.
And once again : you shouldn't be forced to rely on someone else. That is not a counter. Needless to say this argument becomes weaker the less survivors there is in the trial. I wont even talk about the state of SoloQ and Matchmaking in this equation. No. This is not a counter.
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@Crowman said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3200040#Comment_3200040
You don't lose progress on snapping out of it if you have to cancel snapping out of it. Having to find a teammate to mend you is not really a problem. It makes endurance effects against Doctor more deadly while not giving Doctor an innate ability to ignore them like Legion or Deathslinger.
This is not the point.
Being FORCED to find a team mate is not balance, it's a flaw.
Don't compare with Legion or Deathslinger, they're find. The only problem and MY POINT in this thread is that Snap out should block Mend, or Mend be priority over Snap. Simple.
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@Xernoton said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3198438#Comment_3198438
I know, but why would you be walking instead of running? If the Killer is on you, you mostly run anyway. The only thing you might have to change is what you do on the other side of a pallet or window. Just keep running in circles and it won't be a problem though. If the killer is elsewhere you can just run to the next safe structure and start snapping out of it and mending. There really is no need to walk unless you want to get your exhaustion to go down. But that shouldn't be a priority over mending.
Many situations ? Slow vault for example. Or let's say you want to not leave marks on a certain area ? Or play a Fixated / Sprint burst / Vigil type of build ? Etc...
All of this reduced to NO COUNTER, because Snap has priority over mend. That's my problem.
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I agree, I made that exact statement in the thread. But this mechanic should be adjusted to the recent patch and DH change. Thats all I'm saying.
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@AGM said:
For what it's worth, the devs are aware of this interaction, and made a conscious choice to make snapping out of it take priority over mending. They talked about it in a livestream a while back.
Before or after DH rework ?
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@Gandor said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3198436#Comment_3198436
Believe me. I am survivor main that playes killer less then I should. Doctor is already on the weaker side. Snap out functionality is designed as slowdown. You never NEED to walk so much. You can run in circles if you need to stay on 1 spot. Loosing scratchmarks without any perk (shadowstep or dance with me) should be required only if you flash blinded killer and try to loose him - which should not happen more then 1 or 2 times per chase (the need to loose scratchmarks) and you have enough time for that.
Overall. I think it's part of his power that is already quite weak (or rather slow at getting downs) compared to under killers. So I disagree with it being unfair or in need of change.
But sure. Maybe you play the game so differently, that I overlooked some aspect. If so, provide me the details. I can't think of anything where this would be so bad, that it needs a change (more so, that we should first focus on really unfair things first. I don't see this being one of them)
I play on both side and I understand your point ! My only issue is that you can't do nothing about it in some situations. That's all.
Putting Mend on top of Snap out would be a QoL improvement. Not a nerf like the (old) Nurses Calling aura reading of Snap out being deleted.
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@randonly said:
Well, I already had the same problem, and i agree, there’s no counterplay, but doctor doesn’t need nerfs, just put the prompt of “mend” to stay on top, and not the “snap out” one
Yes thats exactly what I meant with this thread. Not really a nerf, just an adjustment of something that hasnt been anticipated.
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@AnneBonny said:
i say just delete him entirely because he's ######### annoying and gives me a headache
That's a bit extreme haha. I agree some visuals and sounds together can be overwhelming on the long run, but I think doctor is cool and has balanced anti loop power !
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@Xernoton said:
What did I just read? You have so much time snap out of it and mend this really isn't an issue. You don't lose any progress mending and the timer doesn't go down as long you're running. The killer losing you has no effect on the deep wound status. So whatever you point you were trying to make earlier is completely invalid. Snapping out of madness also carries on progress so it doesn't regress.
You loose progress if you walk. That's enough to clash with the snap out timer.
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@Milo said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3198295#Comment_3198295
You weren't forced to find a teammate until you stopped running to get the mend to get so low. Imo that's balanced.
@Milo & @Gandor sometimes to break a chase you have to crouch / walk to create spaces of no scratch marks area; break line of sight or create confusion.
I don't call that "screwing up". Maybe if we had a 10 min chase and at one point I go down because I had 5% mend remaining, OK fine I guess.
But here I was 60% and had no option but keep running like a headless chicken, hoping to find my team mate to mend me ? No. I don't call that balanced. Snap out action should prioritize mend OR PAUSE the mending action.
I can upload the clip that made me realize this was a flaw, and you'll see no mistakes on my end.
These 2 status have not be thought to work together, and that's my position.
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@Sandt21 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3198301#Comment_3198301
Sadly, 3. But I was playing as wraith with two speed add-one, so I was able to maintain time semblance of pressure
thats cool honestly ! I now want to try the challenge myself
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agreed
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Done both !