I_CAME
I_CAME
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@Prometheus1092 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3755772#Comment_3755772
I don't think it should be balanced, I'm a game like this it should be harder for survivors to escape than it is for a killer to get kills. That's what adds the fear element to survivors.i feel it takes something away from the game when survivors are on par with the killer due to being balanced, literally no fear in circling them and toying with them. Unfortunately survivors don't seem to want that sort of game where its a risk to goad the killer into chasing them, the ones that do end up playing TCM
I hate this logic. I've never seen another PVP game where people go through such mental gymnastics to justify it not being balanced. If you want to know how unbalanced game modes are received then look at lights out. It was massively killer sided and the devs admitted no one played it after the first few days. This game mode will end up exactly the same way after the novelty factor wears off if they don't take steps to make it fair for both sides.
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It will get nerfed… In 3-6 months.
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Less than 1000. The event is probably the least fun I have ever had playing survivor so I didn't really play much beyond the first week. It's not really necessary to get an absurd amount anyway. I got 2000 last year and still had 1500 2x bp offerings left over at the start of this event despite bringing an offering in every single game i've played outside of the event. It's almost impossible to run out of double bp offerings.
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Them saying they are working on something for excessive slugging is the most exciting.
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Are they not aware that their Haddonfield rework is terrible? That should not be what they're aiming for.
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@Phantom_ said:
If remote pallet break is gone so should be window blocking. Do you have any idea how unfair it is to chase someone who have set up pallets after pallats on maps with a lot of double pallets and godwindows, to finally catch only to lose chase because survivors can block a god-window, don't get me started on the infinite windows.
BHVR: we don't have enough palletshttps://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/KFLK6QDQH0W2/image.png
How many times are you supposed to respect a pallet??? Or mind game it or eat it?
Ok deal. I'll gladly give up all survivor abilities if pallet breaking and remote hooking are gone. I just want more bloodpoints and literally could not care less about all of this extra junk they put into the event.
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If you want to make people give up less then make it so survivors actually have a chance to come back after a bad start. Killers can play the worst game of their life and end up with a 4K due to a single perk like NOED or due to one terrible mistake by a survivor.
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Bad matchmaking is by far the worst thing about the game. I love getting matched with two 500 hour teammates and a 7000 hour Blight in solo queue.
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Just copy and paste what most tournaments do. Limit what survivors can bring while also banning things like grim embrace, deadlock, dms, etc on the killer side. Both of which are typical in tournaments. Obviously things like the anti facecamp system would need to be removed entirely. In addition you would need strict MMR to make it have any sort of meaning. Then you can turn the other queue into a casual mode that has heavy protections against tunneling, camping, etc. Maybe with a system to prevent "gen rushing" as well to satisfy killers. I think this would fix most issues the game has if done properly. The wannabe comp tryhards would hopefully be obsessed with climbing in rank so they would avoid the casual queue.
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The event powers are what ruin it. Uncounterable zoning with the remote pallet breaking and being able to remotely hook people are absurd. It enables sweaty players to play even more sweaty. I am not exaggerating when I say the event queue is the least fun I have ever had playing this game as survivor. This is in 4300+ hours. The event should just be about gaining more bloodpoints. We don't need all of this extra crap on top of it. Especially when it's as poorly balanced as it is now. I can't speak for anyone else but I am playing significantly less in this event than I have in past events.
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People keep whining about the remote hooking but the pallet breaking is definitely way worse. Once the event started I was immediately reminded of how obnoxious it is. Things that have zero counterplay should never be in the game. I've died so many times because there was literally no play for me to make due to being zoned with this ability. If anything shouldn't return it's this. It makes the main resource of survivors completely worthless. I have no idea why they think bringing it back is a good idea.
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@ImWinston said:
this event is simply killer's side, both in mechanics and in points earned... and if anyone thinks that this is not the case, perhaps they haven't understood the game as a whole. luckily the event is almost over
I mean the BP issue extends to the base game as well. It has been obvious for a long time and Behavior won't even so much as acknowledge it.
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@CrypticGirl said:
I'm inclined to agree with the sentiment that the only reason solo queue is in such a hellish state is because of the Survivors themselves. You can give them all the tips, buffs, and info in the world, but it won't necessarily stop them from being stupid. Like, what are you supposed to do about this kind of behavior here? I honestly don't know what this Renato did to deserve this kind of treatment, if anything.
Solo queue teammates being solo queue teammates
And Exhibit B, where we have two P100 Davids playing like pros. 😋
The quality of players is a problem but I will die on the hill that it's largely a matchmaking issue. I literally just got matched with a member of Team Cynic. Now most people probably wouldn't know who that is but i've seen them play in all of the major competitive tournaments. The match was not fair at all and we got absolutely destroyed. I think when a 10k hour killer who plays the game competitively is being matched with casual solo survivors then there IS in fact a matchmaking problem despite what some other posts have insisted. My game before this was a P100 Hag and the game after was a P100 Oni. I should not be in games with any of these people considering what my escape rate is in solo queue. Matchmaking isn't perfect in any game but it is especially terrible in DBD and utterly fails to separate different types of players.
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Every Hillbilly solo queue game is the same. Lethal pursuer where someone gets downed in the first 10 seconds of the match. 50/50 on whether they give up on the hook. Then the game is pretty much over. It's understandable that no one wants to play against him anymore. You just know it's not going to be a fun experience.
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@Batusalen said:
The reason why SoloQ is in that state is because of survivors themselves. Not matchmaking, not balancing, not how killers play, just themselves.
Average survivors with low game sense (specially not making the right decision at the right time) and not playing as a team (including bringing perks that only benefit them and not even help progressing the true objective, that is doing gens) is what make most SoloQ games a true hell to play. Then, instead of trying to get and do better, they complain about the "40% average escape rate" and how the game is killer sided without understanding what an average means or that they are most likely in the lower half of it.
Coincidentally, Hens just uploaded a video today about the topic:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Je3AQGuG2C8&ab_channel=Hens
Who would have thought that if you are good at the game, have good game sense, and try to play as a team (which is the main strength of survivors, being 4 vs 1) would make you and your team mates win more games?
So you think we should balance the game around 13K hour comp survivors like Hens who play DBD as a job? Hens also had a stream where he and a group of comp killers did an M1 only trapper challenge. They achieved a 90% win rate at the highest MMR. Does this mean that killers who can't achieve this are just bad at the game? Or does this kind of logic only apply to survivors. Using extreme examples to prove a point like this is just silly and doesn't mean anything for 99% of the playerbase.
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@MrT1412 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3742939#Comment_3742939
With the amount of quitters in this game, 60% overall is pretty even.
It's way higher than 60% though. They intentionally cherry pick statistics and don't include games where people disconnect.
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@Mortecaii said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/417780/survivors-are-so-bad-now-what-happened
I''ve been saying the same thing, It's gotten so bad, I switched to playing killer most of my games, and absolutely DESTROYING everyone smh
Killer is laughably easy at the moment. I always get a good laugh out of the resident killer mains on this forum trying to gaslight people into thinking killer is difficult in pub matches. I played killer back in the days of old old haddonfield and old old dead hard. The game was actually sort of challenging then. This current state of game balance is an absolute joke.
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because there is no matchmaking in this game. Sweaty Blights aren't just isolated to some super secret top 1% matchmaking queue. They get matched with random solos too. I know because I got a 7000 hour comp Blight a few nights ago. It was about as fun as it sounds. Sweaty four man teams struggle against a sweaty blight and typically lose even in comp level gameplay. If this game had any real matchmaking that kept these players out of regular matches then it wouldn't be an issue. As it is now a sweaty Blight is basically a guaranteed loss for the overwhelming majority of teams. If you need a comp team to have a chance against something then it is overtuned. A streamsniping comp team with the most busted builds imaginable was literally the only thing that was able to stop the almost 2000 game blight winstreak. Even then they barely won.
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Yes. Playing late at night you get nothing but killers who play every match like their life is on the line. The sweat is on a different level compared to playing during normal hours. I think the lack of players is a major factor. The matchmaking is already bad but it's basically turned off late at night. You can lose over and over again and still get matched with a 7000 hour player who describes themselves as a comp player in their Steam bio.
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@bornagain234 said:
WoO extends chases by a huge amount. It wouldnt be picked so much if it wasnt so good.
You can be sitting on gens and plan where to go when the killer shows up, and know so much info for free.
If it's as strong as you think then it would cause killrates to skyrocket when they nerf it. You do realize this would lead to killers being nerfed in other ways don't you? Do you understand how balancing works? Killers are already at their targeted kill rate.
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Yes. Even comp killers think so. Blight is still OP but he isn't as OP as billy. Billy has absurd mobility and an absurd insta down chase power that has barely any cooldown for missing. The only real counterplay against a strong Billy is the crouch tech which isn't even intended. If that didn't exist he'd have an 80% kill rate.
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Why should they balance around the weakest killers? The average killer is significantly stronger than a few years ago. It makes playing against the high tier ones impossible. Hillbilly, Blight, Nurse, Spirit etc can stack four slowdowns and create games are essentially unwinnable for anyone except a competitive four man SWF.
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All of them up until the Vecna chapter which I haven't bothered with yet.
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@VantablackPharaoh91 said:
Pop's not amazing right now. They should rebuff it to 25% and leave it alone, it was fine at 30% before the genkick buff and will be fine at 25% with it. It's not a good all-rounder pick anymore and the change sadly only really hits the Killers that needed it the hardest of all, all because it could be stacked.
This is why meta, all meta, needs toning down. It was done for Killers. Now it's time to do it for Survivor meta as well, we got Adren but that isn't enough. Nothing should be so strong it's "the obvious choice or you're throwing" and nothing should be so strong it turns the tide of a lost game in your favor SHARPLY just by existing.
You guys already killed the entire survivor meta a long time ago. There's not much left to nerf. Pop is much stronger than it was the last time it was at 20 because of the changes to gen kicking and the nerf to gen tapping. You get more basekit regression with each kick and you will get even more regression after the kick since survivors can't tap gens anymore.
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@EmpireCity830 said:
I just feel like most games 4-5 gens are getting done. On killer it is really annoying by the time I have found, chased, downed and hooked 1 person 2 gens are done and a 3rd is 50%+. Or 3 gens are really close to being done. On solo-q is just as annoying. I hate getting found first, chased, downed and hooked in less than 2 min and spend most of my time on hook rather than doing gens and helping teammates. If this happened every now and then ok it's not a big deal but this is nearly every game for both cases. Makes this game really frustrating at times.
I also feel that the kill rate for killers across the board is deceptive and doesn't take into account the pace of play. I've had many games where I get 3 or 4 kills but there is 1 to 0 gens remaining and I didn't start getting pressure until 2 gens were done and a 3rd about to be completed. Point here being that just cause I got a 4k it doesn't mean that pace of play isn't a problem.
The sad part is that idk what to do to fix it and make it so that every player has a chance to play the game and not feel super stressed out. Buffing either side too much would make play miserable for the other side.
Anyone have any ideas on what could be done to make the pace of play "balanced"?
Also, if there was some data on avg number of gens done and avg match time that would help. Cause I seriously feel like its 4.0 + for gens and time is less than 10 min per match.
The games being close is ideal. The gens should get finished on a regular basis. It means both sides have a chance. If most of your games are you winning with two gens done then there is a problem. Longer games just means making the game even more killer sided than it already is. That just doesn't work on these tiny maps that have enormous deadzones and weak pallets.
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@Nazzzak said:
Probably 7 or 8 games out of 10, all the gens don't even get done in my games. Increase them further and I may as well not even play tbh.
I don't understand why people think killer needs to be buffed anyway. Killers already dominate pub matches. We're also in the middle of an epidemic where people are giving up in every other match. Is buffing killers REALLY the way to go considering the current state of the game?
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@[Deleted User] said:
I think stacked regression and slowdown is really obnoxious to play against. I'd really like to see diminishing returns across all equipped slowdown perks that increases with the number of slowdowns equipped. It's just beyond obnoxious to have a gen 80%+ only to have it get hit by Pain Res+Grim+Pop. You can argue the balance aspect all day, but it's objectively bad gameplay to sit and watch a bar fill for 70 seconds and then have to do it all over again without actually progressing the game.
This is by far the most deflating feeling in the game when you play survivor.
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The problem with the pallets they add now is they are literally useless. Even if you do manage to stun the killer you still don't have time to get anywhere. Pallets should be somewhere in the middle in terms of how strong they are. Not ones that are completely useless to the point where they might as well not even exist. The map design on the latest Haddonfield rework is by far the worst I have ever seen in the entire history of this game. It's balanced around an M1 trapper with 300 hours and no perks being able to win. A terrible decision considering how strong the average killer is these days.
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Better get used to it. There is a limited amount of big horror franchises they can bring to the game. They will definitely start expanding into other areas once they run out of horror franchises. At the end of the day this is all about money and I feel like they would absolutely add something like Darth Vader if they could pull it off. I personally am not bothered by "silly" collabs. I don't take the game seriously enough to actually get upset over something so ridiculous.
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Make staying in games rewarding. The simple reason why people give up is because going next is more rewarding in most cases. The reality is if a game looks like it's going badly then there is zero incentive for anyone to play it out. Why stick a bad match out if you can just go next and get one that you have a higher chance of having fun in? If you stay in a bad match you are going to lose and you will get no points for your time on top of it. I don't actually run into many people who give up for no reason. It's usually because a game looks unwinnable which in most cases is true. There are too many situations that you can't come back from on survivor when compared to killer.
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That windows is the single most overrated survivor perk in the game. My chases are just as long without it.
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I don't understand why it needs to go away at all. There are obviously enough players for multiple game modes. I would literally never play normal mode again if it became permanent. Not having to go against high tier killers with four slowdowns every match is the most fun i've had in a long time. Nearly every game I have is actually competitive and it feels great. It really shows how hard perks carry a lot of people.
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I like it because it's more fair for solo survivors. I don't have to ever worry about getting matched with a high tier killer who is running 3-4 slowdowns. People already tunnel, camp, etc in normal matches. At least now I can play games without them stacking a ridiculous amount of slowdown on top of it. This is easily the most fun I have had in DBD in a long time. I don't even want to keep playing after the modifier is removed because I know I will immediately get matched with a Hillbilly using a full slowdown build.
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@CarlAlc7 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3721899#Comment_3721899
The League you're talking about literally puts Ghostface in the lowest tier of balancing where almost all of the good survivor perks are banned to use against him and they only have him be played on Lery's and nowhere else, like that right there should tell you everything about how "good" Ghostface actually is if they need to favor him so much and put so many restrictions on the survivors in order to make him viable.
You forgot to mention the part where you will never play against survivors who are remotely close to that level in a real game.
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I've seen him do well in comp DBD. If people can have success in comp then you can beat regular survivors you will run into in pub matches. A lot of people love to exaggerate how bad killers actually are in a real match.
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@PreorderBonus said:
I don't understand people who say Freddy is the worst when Myers is in the game. At least Freddy has some sort of anti-loop and map mobility, which on its own can be enough to win games as long as the player is good enough. Myers has no mobility, no map control, and no anti-loop. On top of that, he starts the game weakened.
There is no universe where Freddy is even close to Myers level while purple tombstone exists.
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I am honestly shocked that emotes aren't in the game yet. The amount of money they could make by selling basic animations would be insane. I personally don't take the game seriously enough that it would bother me. I'd probably laugh out loud if I saw my teammate break dancing around the map. I for one would buy a lot of emotes if they sold them in the shop.
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Myers is definitely ranked too low in tier lists. Like who even plays Myers without the tombstone piece? People who are absolute beginners? It's practically basekit on any Myers I go against. The existence of purple tombstone makes him a low B tier killer at least.
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@danielmaster87 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3719799#Comment_3719799
You've got to be trolling.
It would be better than the current system where everyone has their time wasted because one person's ego just can not handle one person POTENTIALLY escaping.
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You wait until they come to their senses and finally rework her. If she's good enough then you just die and the game ends. Even comp level survivors are expected to lose against a good nurse.
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@BlackRose89 said:
I just wish they could do a middle ground. If 30% is too high and we already know 20% was to low then why not try pop at 25%? Even better just make it 20% total progress like how it used to be instead of being current.
The thing is it's stronger by default because of the gen kick change. You get more regression from the kick itself and it's much harder for survivors to stop the regression so you get even more regression from that.
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@Rudjohns said:
I just had a game against Plague where she immediately got her power and downed 2 survivors within seconds, and then she found me after hooking both of them, and the first survivor hooked killed themselves on hook
Now, did they give up at 5 gens? Yes.
Was it for no reason? No, that game started absurdly bad and the chances of us escaping were minimal
Do I care? No, I also gave up, because I rather move on with the next match as soon as possibleThese are most of my games where someone gives up. I very rarely see people give up for "no reason". It's almost always because we were put into some sort of unwinnable situation.
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They don't need to balance the game around the weakest killers. This is the problem with the new Haddonfield rework. It feels like it was made with an M1 only trapper in mind. It makes playing against the higher tier killers feel awful. It makes way more sense to just buff the weaker ones.
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They're probably afraid to buff weak perks in large numbers considering how disastrous it has been in the past. Buffing weaker perks is what led to the eruption meta and things like FTP+Buckle Up.
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@Chordyceps said:
It does kinda seem to me like they're not just balancing slowdown perks based on only their own merit, but how strong they are when combined with other slowdown perks. Which is fair I think, since running multiple slowdown perks is a fairly common thing.
It's the norm now. People realized how insanely strong running 3-4 slowdowns is and are doing it almost every match now. It's the most demoralizing thing ever when you load into a game against a higher tier killer and see this. There is some limited data to show how strong these combos are on nightlight. People who run 3-4 slowdowns have close to a 70% kill rate according to their data which is already notorious for being lower than official kill rates. I strongly doubt they are nerfing solely because of high pick rates. They probably have their own data to show how strong slowdown stacking is.
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My guy the kill rate has risen by more than 10% since 6.1. Weak killers are being buffed left and right. Maps are being turned into massive deadzones with few good pallets. Do I need to go into how nearly every good survivor perk has been nerfed in the last few years? How can you objectively look at the state of the game and pretend like the devs favor survivors?
If you really want to balance around high level play then give all survivors voice comms and make the MMR strict like it is in actual competitive games. If they did that you guys would change your mind about balancing around high level gameplay because you would be playing against a SWF every match at high MMR. People say they want to balance around high level players but don't actually want to play against high level players.
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Something has to be done about slowdown stacking regardless. The real issue here is people bringing four strong slowdown perks on upper tier killers who typically fall into the S or A tier. A Billy, Nurse, Blight, etc stacking four slowdowns is just unfair. I have a lot of experience in this game relative to the average player and I can tell you that most killers I see stacking slowdown are higher tier killers. Seeing a blight or hillbilly with 3-4 slowdowns is more common than seeing a Freddy or a Legion doing it.
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@Reinami said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3714974#Comment_3714974
You are being intentionally obtuse.
I pointed out a problem, and the response EVERY TIME, as you can see in this thread is "but average players" etc.
And i'm pointing out that a streamer here, who is clearly biased towards survivor players as you can see if you are even somewhat familiar with them, even says that you MUST take slowdown perks if you aren't playing a top tier killer and when you play the other 30+ killers, you MUST take slowdown perks.
If i posted tru3ta1ent you'd get a different bias.
I'm just pointing out that someone who often sees things from the survivor point of view is also able to see this which shows that there is probably a problem here.
What is your solution to this if you don't mind me asking? I watched the video and he points out that someone is going to lose regardless of how they balance this. If they do nothing then survivors have to deal with high tier killers stacking four strong slowdown perks which he CLEARLY acknowledges as being completely unfair and borderline unwinnable for survivors. On the other hand nerfing regression will make the weakest killers even weaker as everyone has pointed out. How would you personally make this fair for everyone?
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Pop was way too strong simply due to how much easier it is to get downs now. People keep saying "You have to earn it by getting a down!" and completely ignoring a number of things
- Maps are significantly weaker
- Killers are significantly stronger
- Gen tapping change and increased regression from gen kicking was a buff for pop. You get 5% basekit regression just from kicking a gen. Isn't this in addition to what you get from pop? Someone can correct me if i'm wrong on this since I don't typically run pop on killer. I'll gladly admit if I am wrong.
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There are some conflicting ideas about the direction you're going in with killers. You nerfed scamper and buffed his rush because you wanted to encourage more skilled gameplay with chucky. Then in the same patch you make the collision for bubba more forgiving. Like how easy are we trying to make some of these killers? Being able to use the saw in tight loops was really the only skill based aspect of playing Bubba. I understand the other buffs but is this one really necessary? I would rather you have made his sweep even stronger instead of rewarding players who can't use the chainsaw well.