HectorBrando
HectorBrando
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Like someone said, EGC exists only to stop Survivors from taking the game hostage by hiding in a corner and to get rid of Hatch showdowns. Its not there to give you free kills.
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Someone could stay in the exit zone deliberately so the killer can close it and force the other survivors to reopen it, making their escape harder.
"Ill stay here so the killer can close the door and screw the others by forcing them to open it again".
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I think gens go a bit too fast in Red Forest maps where all gens are spread and in the outer rings of the map except the landmark generator, is really hard to patrol those, but in maps like Backwater, The Game and a lot more slower gens could be way too hard to do, especially with certain builds and with several killers. I believe the main problem are certain maps, both survivor and killer favored maps.
@Seanzu said:
The issue I have, and I play both sides is that killers want EVERYTHING and it's going to put the game out of whack.
They want gens increased, maps smaller, killers buffed & survivors meta perks nerfed.
I don't think you can change all these and still keep the game reasonably fun for survivors, they're clearly working on maps and bringing weaker killers up a level or two every couple of patches and that's what they're focusing on
My issue is killers always complain about genrushing, which they may have a point, but when survivors complain about tunneling and camping they all flock with the same mantra "you cant complain because its a valid strategy", like gen rushing isnt a valid strategy too. I believe most killer mains are Spikes.
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2 kills with plenty of hooks is what I call balance and what most games should look like.
4k and 4 escaped should be fringe cases and they should happen when one side makes a LOT of mistakes and the other plays almost perfectly. And by mistakes I mean all ranges of mistakes: skillwise, mindwise, decission making and adapting, IE missing an attack or a vault, failing mindgames, taking bad strategic decissions (3 genning yourself as survivor or wasting too much time on a lone gen while survivors fix the center ones) and failing to adapt to a changing enviroment like survivors finding lightflashes in chests or a killer changing his chase scheme.
I believe a lot of people screaming for massive nerfs or buffs on both sides fail at self criticism, sometimes you really have to ask yourself "it was the game that is poorly balanced or did I make too many mistakes?" because sometimes the problem is not the game but oneself.
P.D. Obviusly the game has several imbalances that need fixing for example Red Forest and The Game maps, stacking toolboxes and Ebonies.
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It could give some people infinite griefing potential against their own teammates.
If you dont want survivors going for a save camp the hook and if you dont wanna see them tbagging go hit them and force them out.
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@ZoneDymo said:
Honestly, I know its technically a nerf, but it combined with not losing items just means its a much more inviting thing to just bring.
AND you will be able to just use it for all its worth.
So yeah idk, I think it will be a much worse situation.
Not really, any yellow or higher rank survivor used the item until it had almost no charges so they could escape with it, most people didnt lose their toolboxes unless they were killed or got Franklin'd with almost no charges.
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Knockout is like Insidious or Head On, one of those perks that add very little to the players running them except trolling potential.
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I think Lithe is indeed the better chase breaker out there, as you say it can be used mid chase and it also uses a window, if there isnt an opening nearby the killer will be forced to vault it losing some extra seconds and losing control on his camera creating an opening for a juke.
BL is good too but there are fewer elevations than windows except on very specific maps (Haddonfield and Hawkins for example) but it has 2 problems first if you have the killer very very close he can hack you before you land and second he can see your direction easily from higher ground so isnt as easy to juke him.
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I dont really rage, more like thinking to myself "you gotta be kidding me..."
As survivor major incompetence/extremely selfish behaviour, for example being chased to the killer and running towards a hooked teammate, you are either very bad and you are going to get the poor guy tunneled or extremely selfish and you are using an unhooked person to get the killer out of your back. I also dislike when people go over altruistic to save me and gift the killer extra sacrifices, especially if the killer doesnt deserve it and/or is using stuff like NOED, facecamping Leatherfaces etc, just get out of the trial and forget about me (or at least cleanse the NOED first).
As killer I dont think anything has ever make me annoyed.
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Nurse and Pig.
Nurse is almost as good as ever, the main difference is how insanely harsh you are punished for missing blinks, no more chain blinking wildly knowing the survivor cant break the chase.
Pig is quite good but requires better planning and more brains than other killers, for example one complain I see a lot about her is "I hooked someone near a box and 15 seconds after unhook the RTB was out, make it so the first box is never the right one", well maybe you shouldnt use the RTB in that case and wait to down someone in a place a bit further away from boxes also patrolling boxes crouched yields very good results, usually people are concentrated on them and dont see you coming.
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@gohookyourselfstupid said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1121410#Comment_1121410
You don't have any upvotes for a reason
While the manners arent very nice he does have a point, what does it matter if they stand at the Exit Gates waiting for you to press crouch?, just go there, force them out and be done with it.
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What he is trying to say is that BBQ is not very good in low mobility killers (the ones who suffer the most from gen rushing) and by running it you are gimping your build instead of using something who fits better for those killers.
I agree.
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Yes, not only it helps in chases but it also helps A LOT in stealth builds.
Also we know how hard can be to deal with stainless killers like Ghostface or Tier1 Myers who dont have any other power, imagine a stainless Huntress with her hatchets or Hillbilly with chainsaw etc.
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@I_Face_Camp said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1114923#Comment_1114923
Pretty sure they are just American, not African
Actually Wraith is african, he migrated to America before turning into the Wraith.
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@cipherbay_ said:
easy counter, either get in a locker or stay away from the hooks
Not that easy, the sheer amount of hooks makes it hard to get away from them and unlike BBQ where the killer has to pick the guy and hook him this works the very moment you lift someone, you dont have time to get in a locker unless he slugs and the killer just needs to do a quick 360º spin to check the entire map to know the general position of everyone else.
Like someone said above, I doubt this perk will remain like this after PTB, they did the same with Surveillance, in the PTB it worked on gens from the start then it got changed to work only after kicking a generator when released.
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As always, awful or very situational perks for survivors, you have to go back to David King chapter for the last very good perk for survivors (Inner Strength is good but not THAT good).
For the people looks awful, Red Herring looks too much of a hassle to be something useful outside of memes and it might trigger the diversion while someone else is working on the gen, effectively leading the killer there.
Off the record looks somewhat decent, is a timed mix of Iron Will and Distortion but the hook requisite makes it rather meh, I use Iron Will to juke the killer to try avoiding getting hooked in the first place.
@Rex_Huin said:
Perk activation and effects have become more surreal and nonsensical.
Healing a survivor but you get injured?
Leaving a locker to trigger an explosion on a gen?
Makes no sense but whatever...
I think it creates a diversion not an explosion per se, like Adam's pebble.
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What high risk is having Moris as basekit?. Displeasing the Entity? what is the Entity gonna do about it?. No points is no high risk at all and even if you didnt get sacrifice points the act of ending matches so fast would benefit the killer, less points but way more matches would compensate the penalty.
@ClickyClicky said:
I like how when someone calls for a survivor buff the replies are
”OMGWTF LOLOL LMAO cant believe u wud ask for this dats completely broken stupid entitled surviv0r mainz”
and when killer asks for moris to become standard somehow the replies are more civil and nobody really seems bothered by the crazy imbalance.
Totally not a heavily killer sided forum at all...
I remember reading a killer idea in reddit (I believe it was reddit), it was so freakishly op and unfun to play against that it looked like designed by an edgy 13 year old. He had all the good stuff and no drawbacks, one hit kill, leatherface tantrum, fast pallet break, old freddy stealth, no terror radius and on top of that the ability to mindcontrol survivors and move them around. What really baffled me was the responses were very welcoming and even saying it wasnt strong enough.
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Keys will be consumed if used to open the hatch like the Brand New Part is consumed when installing it on a gen
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I believe they are going with this because is easier to indentify the worst loops in problematic maps and put a breakable wall than redo the map entirely like they did with Springwood or Lery's.
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@[Deleted User] said:
They sound like really survivor sided changes to me. Especially the sabo ones. Those sabo ones really have me worried, sabo crazy survivors are why I quit DBD the first time.
That seemed to have stopped so I started playing again.
They slightly buffed sabo solo survivors and nerfed harshly SWF sabo squads, which were the biggest offenders.
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@Free_Hugs said:
Generally if I'm tunneling a player like that, and I will from time to time, it well be because my goal for that match shifted from "Kill the survivors and try to 4k" to "[Bad Word] that guy."
After [Bad Word]ing that guy, I will normally let the other survivors escape.
If any comment about "this game is crap" comes from that, it is likely the sentiment that 100% of the killers attention and focus can't kill a single survivor playing to win, which is 25% of the survivor's team, and thus killers are worthless to play as.
Thats bad strategy tho, usually most groups have 1 or 2 weak links who are rather easy to hook to gain momentum, is better to get rid of the gen jockeys first and leave the loopers for the end since they will way less pallets and gens cant go as fast once 1 or 2 people are sacrificed.
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He does have some reason, with the last patch BHR changed Doctor's chase music, if you pick the new tune and run it backwards you will hear a subliminal frequency that encourages people to call the SWATs against other players and start using "I cant believe its not butter" instead of regular butter with their breakfast toasts, this all in conjunction with The Milkman and several renegade Illuminatti members to opose Lalilulelo and the reptilians from Omicron Persei 8.
The Housing Committee is NOT gonna like this...
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I would love to see a characterless update with bug fixes, optimization and general balancing, hell I wouldnt mind having 9 months or more without any new characters at all if they used the time to fix stuff.
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I believe toxicity-wise DBD isnt as bad as some people believe, especially compared to stuff like Dota2, LoL, fighting games and some other genres.
Whine-wise is another story... (and im not directing this at the OP, just look at the forums most posts are "nerf this, nerf that" "buff this, buff that" "im done with this game" "devs you are awful and deserve nothing but misery and pain").
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I usually dont tunnel those guys since they tend to follow me around with the flashlight trying to save whoever Im chasing, someone following me around is someone not fixing gens, I just have to remember they are nearby when Im picking someone from the ground and play accordingly.
In any case if they get angry at postchat I usually respond "You wanted my undivided attention and you got it", it also works for t-baggers, fast action spamers and other pest-like survivor playstyles.
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@Chicagopimp2019 said:
@Nickeleye I think the real advantage to using Franklin's is that the survivors (myself included) really love their items and tend to return to pick them up. I can't tell you how many times I've knocked an item out of a survivor's hands and started to chase someone else, only to loop back around and find them looking for their dropped item. Thats why you will see good hag players trap the dropped item. It's pretty much guaranteed someone will set that trap off. The loss of 10% of the item's original charge is just a plus and will take that item out of service much faster. After all, any use of that item is reducing the number of charges as well....
It also works as a soft way to stall one survivor, if you make him drop the item far away from where you hook him he will lose a lot of time going after it, someone crossing half the map to retrieve his item is someone not fixing gens for 30 or 40 seconds, if he decides is not worth it you have effectively get rid of it.
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Add to that the fact that as an urban/indoor map the blood trail is almost impossible to hide, making it very very hard to juke any decent killer.
For me once you get hit in The Game, Lery's, Springwood and Hawkins is almost impossible to lose a decent killer, the only hope is loop him enough so he decides to go check on other people (Springwood isnt as bad as the other 3 tho).
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@healthygameplay said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1095017#Comment_1095017
why would anyone in SWF needs OoO, they are all gonna be on comms and know exactly where you are anyway
Because the OoO uses it to tell the rest of the team exactly where the killer is and where is heading making it very easy to avoid being spotted.
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In solo queue they are very risky indeed, I usually dont go for them unless I know the rest of the team is coming alone and there is a high chance of success (no NOED, no Leatherface, no Myer tier 3 etc).
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Because I play solo and solo you need to stay away from the killer or use what makes you harder to catch, not perks that make it easier to save you or save others, Solo queue is every survivor for himself.
Sounds greedy but those multi saves where everyone uses BT and DS with the door at 99% or that Adrenaline that pops right when the killer hits you are very hard to pull in a completely disorganised team like solo teams are.
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@TAG said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1075214#Comment_1075214
DH the perk is technically always there. DH the Totem? Absolutely not. Furthermore, whether DH the Totem is/can be dealt with is far more in the hands of the opponent than whether the chest Key is/can be dealt with. The road being different matters a ton in this particular comparison IMO.
I personally think your belief that DH is easier to counterplay contradicts your belief that DH Moris is more likely to happen, which I think presents a big issue with your comparison. If it is easier to stop it, then what makes it more likely to happen than the other thing?
Its more likely to happen because the odds are higher, you always have a shot at 5 stacks of DH but for keys without plunderer (a ~3% chance, 7% to find a key but it mustnt be a green one) you would need to play 30 games to find one and on top of that in that specific game you still need to fix 5 gens to get a 4 men escape, you have a 3% chance of attempting to use the hatch. 4 or 3 people escaping after finding a key in a chest outside of a SWF is very very rare, as a Killer ive seen it only 2 times, as a survivor only once.
You always have a 100% chance of attempting 5 stacks of DH, Im sure you can get those stacks more than once in 30 games.
@Marcavecunc said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1075214#Comment_1075214
And to get a mori you need to get 5 hooks first. (and for them not to rush to unhook in your face)
Keys can be found 10 seconds into the game.
Honestly they're different mechanics, why would changing one absolutely require changing the other?
And to use that key you need to fix a number of gen firsts, the hatch doesnt spawn if you dont fix one gen more than number of survivors alive, to get a 4 men escape you need 5 gens first, its not finding it and escaping right off the bat and then again, you have a very low chance of finding a key in the first instance.
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@whammigobambam said:
The killers have more tools but it's the survivors who act out more in order to unnerve the killer. Fast action notification survivors literally make me want to vomit with disgust. The only thing I want to do is kill them and nothing else I will actually even let the others go then stop playing after.
Then what they are doing is working rather well, that kind of actions are usually done to divert your attention from something else, like the parent birds trying to get the snakes attention and divert it from reaching the nest with the very vulnerable offspring.
When I get one of those fast action spamers I usually leave them for last when their weaker teammates have already dropped al pallets to make his chase way easier and remember someone spaming is someone not fixing gens.
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@TAG said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1075154#Comment_1075154
You do need to tunnel someone out of the game, though, which means you are:
1) Playing into DS if they have it
2) Potentially playing into Borrowed Time if someone else has it
3) Not really pressuring Gens
It also hinges on you actually REALIZING that someone found a Key in the chest, which is not an easy thing to do at all because Keys are tiny, hard to see, and not really something you are actively looking at if you didn't see a Key in the pre-game lobby.
And EVEN with all that, there is still the possibility that another Survivor took note of the Key (this is assuming no SWF; in SWF, they will almost definitely know about the Key the moment it is found) and will keep it in mind in the event the Survivor with it is tunneled. There is still also the scenario where the Survivor chooses NOT to take the Key from the chest OR takes the Key and hides it to better ensure that the Killer doesn't know they have it.
With all that in mind, a Survivor who finds a Key in a chest does not have to play the game any different than normal compared to a Devour Hope user who now has to both actively stay away from Hooked Survivors and play Totem defense once Survivors are aware of its existence to maintain it. For a Key, the game length is just shorter for them (either slightly shorter if no one dies and they only need to skip opening the Gates, almost 20% shorter if someone dies, or almost 40% shorter if two people die). For a Killer with DH, they are now juggling the extra aforementioned tasks to try and gain the benefit of DH that you are referring to (the Moris).
A trade off for DH being always there while finding a key being a 14% chance with Plunderers, the effects (an easier win) are the same even if the roads are different.
What caused this argument was the estatement "Unless killers can do with moris what survivors can do with keys in chests they should be removed", which they can, if its harder or easier or has more or less counterplay is up for each one to decide, I believe DH has a bigger chance of granting free moris than survivors have a chance of getting a key in a chest and use it to full potential (3 or 4 escapes) but I also admit is easier to counterplay DH than a key found in a chest.
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@TAG said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1075119#Comment_1075119
1)That doesn't get rid of the Key.
2)Furthermore, the Key holder can just hide the Key somewhere for later.
3) Equipping Franklin's to pre-emptively have something (something not even good) to deal with the RNG-esque scenario of someone finding a Key in a chest doesn't make sense. What if the team didn't bring anything that makes you want to use Franklin's?
4) You don't need to equip anything to deal with Devour. Small Game or Detective's Hunch is helpful, but not necessary.
Franklin's is not a good counterplay to Keys, and this is not a good comparison.
Ok, I accept your arguments against Franklins but even without it, you can tunnel the key holder and get rid of him, if they found in a chest and they are not in a SWF the rest of the survivors will be clueless about it and you dont need to equip anything to tunnel someone out of the game.
The comparison still stands, both situations are extremely strong, can be dealt by the oposing side if detected in time and both have time consuming requirements to reach full potential.
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@TAG said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1074992#Comment_1074992
You can counterplay Devour Hope very simply by just breaking the Totem. There is nothing you can do to stop Keys outside of just winning the game. Definitely not a good comparison.
You can equip Franklins, tunnel the key holder or killing them before the hatch spawns and they locate them.
You need 5 gens to get the hatch with 4 survivors and 4 gens with 3, you have ample time to get rid of them and sticking to the theme of the post (we are not discussing keys overall, just the act of finding them in chests), you need to find a key in a chest to get all of that which is a very low chance even with Plunderers.
Is a good comparison, both Devour and keys in chests have some counterplay, both can be devastating to the other side if left unatended, both have time consuming requirements and both are rare ocasions.
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@SnakeSound222 said:
Keys shouldn’t be available in chests unless the Killer can do something similar with a Mori. Key rarity should also be increased until they get nerfed.
The kiler can get free moris without offering one, you can bring Devour Hope to get them after 5 unhooks, yes I know the totem can be cleansed and requires 5 hooks but keys are a 7% chance without Plunderers or 14% with it and require a number of generators to be used.
P.D. those percentages also include the green key which cant be used to open the hatch so the chances for an usable key are a bit lower.
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Well you are indeed camping the hook waiting for someone to save the guy.
If you like that playstyle go for it but you wont get much done once you start facing survivors who ignore campers and go straight for gens or brackets where most people use BT and DS, expect very fast games with 1 kill per match and a LOT of teabagging at the doors.
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I find it very similar to old Ruin.
Match starts, 30 seconds later is gone because everyone knows totem spawns and just by looking the killers direction you can deduce the general area where it spawmed.
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I think getting rid of keys in chests would work against the killer in the long term, keys are very rare without Plunderers and 3 or more survivors escaping like that after finding one is even rarer, I think it happened to me twice and one of those they were going to escape through the gates anyway.
In the other hand, making chests worse would discourage survivors from opening them and go fix gens instead.
I know not everyone who searches chests do it for keys but you dont keep people away from generators by getting rid of incentives to do other stuff.
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If they buff Leatherface (which theyll probably do) take for granted his basekit is going to change, there is no way they make him stronger and leave his camping potential as it is.
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Nothing, I dont want to give them that satisfaction.
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I dont really want anything that isnt human and if its human I dont want weird proportions for gameplay reasons, so no Xenomorphs, no Predator, no Chucky, no Terminator, no Carpenter's thing etc.
Yes, I know the game has the Demogorgon and I dont like that killer one bit, Id rather have flayed Billy Hargrove than Demogorgon as killer.
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I dont think the developers gave any insight of the sexual orientation of any of the characters except 2 of the Legion, in my opinion since they didnt give anything they can be wathever you want in your eyes. The canon is "you dont know" so they can be what you want.
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@Archimedes5000 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1062109#Comment_1062109
Again, Billy is supposed to be high pressure killer, slowdown is not something "his kit lacks"
Also he did not forgive a hook, he was trying to increase the pressure by slugging, there was not time to hook because the gens were getting finished.
And again, surviviors were not playing well, they just did gens in front of his face, the game shouldnt require a slowdown perk, tunneling and perfect chases to win against bad surviviors.
Having map pressure is not the same as slowdown, is similar but since you cant put pressure in 4 people at once is not exactly the same, slowdown is making gens go slower or make the survivors waste time in other stuff, RBTs, Feral Frenzy, stacks in Dying Light or Tanato are slowdown perks (some stuff is better than other, Pop right now is the best slowing tool of all).
The hook was right there, no need to move an inch, he could literally hook the guy without even walking, he should have hooked Yui at the start and then rush the other gen, you gain time by slugging if the hooks are far away, if they are so close is better to hook and force a save, that also gives you time with the benefit of one less step in the sacrifice.
And you are right they didnt play super good either, they were doing gens in front of his face and that also factors into the insane genrushing, if they werent so bold the gens wouldnt have been completed so fast and believe it or not, such boldness and urge to rush actually worked in his favour by exposing them in ways they shouldnt have exposed themselves, they went all in and lost.
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@Archimedes5000 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1062051#Comment_1062051
He did the mistakes mostly after the 3 gens were done, so it does not change that genrush was too fast and nothing could be done.
You should not be forced to bring slowdown perks every game, especially on killers that are supposed to be "high mobility - high pressure" killers.
Same with chase perks, most of them are not that good on Billy anyway.
The surviviors were not playing that good either, he found them all the time, that game shoud've been a 4k. Also if he didnt tunnel that one guy out of the game, they would probably finish the last gen too, and who knows how it would play out later.
Before the first 2 gens pop he forgave one hook, he missed to regress the gens and went after the very obvious DS user who was leading him away from the almost done gen instead of trying to defending it, also not by not having Pop he lost 40 seconds of regression (maybe 60 if he were to hook Yui at the start).
You should be forced to bring perks that help you and cover what your basekit lacks, thats why they exist and you shouldnt bring 3 perks who cover the same area because you will lose strength in other areas.
Slowdown perks arent mandatory but you risk facing people with a genrush strat and without them is very hard to win, though he did win the game without them.
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@Archimedes5000 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1061908#Comment_1061908
But did you see how he played? He couldve done nothing about these early gens, and those were onlu 2 toolboxes. He had to tunnel someone out of the game, and tunneling is supposed to be toxic or something.
Also awful build? Discordance for gen pressure, BBQ for tracking (easier to find = easier to pressure) and Bitter Murmur to get extra pressure just after a gen is done. Are killers supposed to bring Corrupt, Thrilling, PGTW and Surge every game or what?
He played very well skillwise speaking but he also made several mistakes, he has 3 tracking perks and zanshin (which is decent for newcomers, for veterans not so much), not a single slowdown perk or chase perk like Pop or Bamboozle, should have hooked Yui at the begining when she got downed near a hook (with Pop that same gen would have been regressed more than 20 seconds), bumped into a lot of trees/rocks, sometimes he abused the chainsaw when there was no need and seeing how much they were genrushing he should have defended the gen in the house and the 2 adjacent gens from the start. The locker plays were masteful tho.
The genrush in the video is insane true, but he still got 3 kills with a not very good build in a very bad map for Hillbilly..
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He still got 3 kills with an awful build and numerous mistakes (he had some very good moves too).
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The points argument is a bit moot since opening gates gives them in objective category which are super easy to cap, unless the game has been an insane snowball from the start or the last survivor was afk in lockers most of the game anyone who reaches the opening switch either has them caped or dont deserve any extra BPs.
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In terms of absolute power without regards to skill needed to master, the Nurse is by far the best killer in the game.
In terms of a ratio power/skill needed I would go with Hillbilly, easier to use than Oni, Spirit or Freddy, has the best map pressure in the game, an easy to use instadown without requisites, the ability to catch up to survivors very fast after breaking a pallet and he can also proxy camp without CD.
@Shaai1 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1056115#Comment_1056115
Problems with nurses they usually get genrushed.
Making a bad blink with her is way too punishing.
Imo problem with nurses is most of them are not very good because the insane amount of skill and dedication you need to master her, also you either stomp or get stomped, there is no middle ground so it can be very frustrating to learn her.
Since the rework I faced only 2 insanely good nurses and they dominated the game almost as easily as they did before the rework, then again, only 2 insanely good nurses, the rest were quite bad.
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Today it blocked for me (if it wasnt blocking that would explain why the survivor who blocked was so eager to vault trying to waste my time).