EverflowingRiver
EverflowingRiver
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@Orion said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1440419#Comment_1440419
If they stop now, it's the same as giving preferential treatment to non-LGBT. They can't take back the non-LGBT lore.
Also, they're still expanding the mythology behind the Entity, etc.. You'd know that if you'd read the lore.
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1440452#Comment_1440452
A trans woman was shot just a few days ago for being trans in the USA, what are you talking about? There are still torture camps where LGBT people are sent by their "loving" parents to torture "the gay" out of them.
By that token I could say Jewish people are treated unequally in the US because a major football star tweeted anti-Semitic messages with no significant opposition. Or I could make the huge leap of bringing up the white woman killed in Indiana for saying all lives matter. Or the white motorcyclist who was intentionally killed by a man for being white(the offender stated that was his sole motivation). Bad people exists, it does not mean the system is bad. I'm not going to say they system is against whites because some white people got killed.
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@Netherstorm said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1439165#Comment_1439165
Yes, that oh-so lucrative LGBT market! So much money!! Man let me tell you, if the next Indiana Jones movie features Indy doing a dude, it will be the highest-grossing movie of all time! And I bet Harrison Ford doesn't even care about the LGBT cause, he's just in it for the money!
The mental gymnastics here are very amusing. You guys have to go to such great lengths to disguise the fact that you just don't want LGBT stuff in the game.
I know it's pointless to try to get through to you, but here's an example. Say a company donates a million dollars to a cancer research foundation. Then you find out.. the company doesn't really care about cancer! They still donated the money. They still contributed to a good cause. Are you really going to try to act all outraged about it? Even if BHVR doesn't truly, in their heart of hearts, care about LGBT, they still included them.
That's not even close to the same type of issue being discussed here...
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@Dr_doom_j2 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1438060#Comment_1438060
And if you looked at anything other than that post, you will see why I made that post, the conclusion to that conversation, and my view as to why it was unfair to specifically go out of your way to express sympathy and support for one marginalized group vs. another. It was short sighted in one way, but in another I think it's short sided that no post was ever made in regards to BLM when basically every insincere corporation is posting a black square. I took issue with that and only that, and to call that out as being a race carder or playing victim instead of simply aknowledgeding that, you chose to be negative and imply me as a race baiting victim card leveraging
You brought that conversation back up to play moral police, that is what you did, don't deny it. This conversation between us didn't display any of what you remarked on, and further more you continue to place the onus on me to respond to the topic of the thread from a previous conversation that didn't involve you, just so you could take away from my message the context and point I was making.
So again, really think about what you're doing here, think if it makes any sense to continue this conversation that only makes you come off as more shallow, and throw in a few more vaguely racist ad-hominm for good measure. Or stop and go be a better person than you are in this second. Your choice.
No one stopped you from making a thread about BLM. Feel free to do so. If you wanted a personal conversation with @Orion then you should have said so. Don't post something and expect no one to respond.
Its clear I'm talking to a wall. Anytime anyone questioned one of your posts you accused them of racism or at the very least of not caring about black issues. By definition you are using the race card to try and further your views.
You also keep saying I'm trying to bethe morality police. If you came to a forum for morality you came to the wrong place. I don't care about your morals. This all started because I told you why BLM wasn't being talked about in a thread about LGBTQ.
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@Dr_doom_j2 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1437975#Comment_1437975
Lol Jesus dude, you just couldn't help yourself. None of that is a quote from me.
The true irony here is the fact you "Hijacked" this whole thread to show me, Mr. Anti-gay, in order to again, and allow me to quote myself for you, show how "morally shallow" I am. At no point was that the premise of this thread, and you merely misappropriated my argument to fit yours, again a point which I made about a month ago amidst this unstable political climate at a time when these struggles were getting their 15 minutes of shine.
I wonder if you go onto reddit feminist posts just to say things like "Get over it ladies, men have it bad too, stop playing the victim card".
N
No you don't? Oh, that treatment is reserved only for minorities you have an obvious inborn bias against? Again dude, you keep bringing up things like victim card and now race card into this thread (btw, cool it with that race card #########, we'll see who gets banned when you make accusations like that. Frankly I don't care but someone who does will likely point that out to site staff)
I see only some issues are deemed worthy of speaking about obviously from your very quotable post up there. Why don't you take a breather before you post again and think about what you're saying and how you look before you accuse anyone of anything. Can't change anyone but yourself, after all.
My bad, page 3
Screenshot_20200712-125500.png -
@Dr_doom_j2 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1437975#Comment_1437975
Lol Jesus dude, you just couldn't help yourself. None of that is a quote from me.
The true irony here is the fact you "Hijacked" this whole thread to show me, Mr. Anti-gay, in order to again, and allow me to quote myself for you, show how "morally shallow" I am. At no point was that the premise of this thread, and you merely misappropriated my argument to fit yours, again a point which I made about a month ago amidst this unstable political climate at a time when these struggles were getting their 15 minutes of shine.
I wonder if you go onto reddit feminist posts just to say things like "Get over it ladies, men have it bad too, stop playing the victim card".
N
No you don't? Oh, that treatment is reserved only for minorities you have an obvious inborn bias against? Again dude, you keep bringing up things like victim card and now race card into this thread (btw, cool it with that race card #########, we'll see who gets banned when you make accusations like that. Frankly I don't care but someone who does will likely point that out to site staff)
I see only some issues are deemed worthy of speaking about obviously from your very quotable post up there. Why don't you take a breather before you post again and think about what you're saying and how you look before you accuse anyone of anything. Can't change anyone but yourself, after all.
Look up your own posts on page 2 of this thread. You accused people of putting blacks on the back burner. I also never accused you of being anti-gay so quit with the straw man tactics.
You brought up black people first and was the first to accuse people of ignoring black issues and then criticized those who showed you that your comments belonged in a different thread. That is playing the race card.
You also have yet to show me where I have displayed any bias. You get out of here with this inborn bias crap.
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@Dr_doom_j2 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1437891#Comment_1437891
Lol you just love forcing that victim Narrative on black folks don't you? But continue with your unchecked biases, I find it quite funny that the person who I initially engaged with in this forum is correcting you for trying to make me look morally shallow.
Again I never said anything about being a victim. I didn't paint myself in anyway at all, I was staying a case for equity, and I don't know from my last post how you could even get that unless you already see all black folks as "pulling the race card" or "playing victim" Well mr. Scholarship, congrats for trying to upset me, but I'd hate to be accused of being an angry black man so I'll just leave this conversation before I allow myself to say something you can compartmentalize in your little black box.
Lol you don't make sense. You keep talking about this victim card. I accused you of playing the race card. I didn't realize that when you accused people of putting blacks on the back burner (your words, not mine) or that there is historical oppression that you were not insinuating black issues get the short end of the stick. 🙄
Now I am officially saying you are trying to play the victim.
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@Orion said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1437926#Comment_1437926
And I refer you to my reply to that post. Believe me, if someone wants to call you a bigot, they'll just call you a bigot.
And risk getting flagged. I don't think they would
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@Orion said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1437913#Comment_1437913
The way I read it, they didn't accuse you of anything, they simply said you were coming across in a certain way.
🤦 I refer you to my previous post with the autism example. It's such a cop out of a statement. "I'm not calling you a racist but you are acting racist." It's like when he said there was a conspicuous lack of BLM support from bhvr. He wasn't calling bhrv openly racist, but he was implying they don't care about the black community. I actually prefer if he just came out and said what he thought instead of playing word games.
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@Orion said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1437891#Comment_1437891
That's how I read their statement and that's how it is the majority of the time. Just because you say something with a certain intention doesn't mean everyone will pick up on your intention. It's a very common phenomenon; you wouldn't believe the number of times I've come across as homophobic to my boyfriend.
If that's true wouldn't the onus be on them to confirm what someone is saying before launching accusations.
In this case I can look at every post he's put on this thread to see he's a race baiter who criticized me and other for trying to stay on topic.
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@Orion said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1437850#Comment_1437850
A short jump, sure, but a jump nonetheless. When I'm coming off as rude, I expect my friends and family to point out that I'm coming off as rude because I'm not always the best judge of that. The same goes for coming off as racist, sexist, homophobic (yes, LGBT people can come off as homophobic too!), and so on.
It's not a word game, it's someone informing you that your point didn't come across correctly.
Well then that's your opinion. Nowhere did I say anything that could be twisted as bigoted. It's another case of if I can't win an argument, I'll attack the person saying it. People looking for ######### that isn't there to fill a narrative.
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@Orion said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1437808#Comment_1437808
Saying you come across as X isn't the same as saying you are X. Misunderstandings are a thing, like how you just misunderstood what someone else was saying and assumed they were calling you a racist.
It's only a short jump between the two. And look at the context of his last paragraph. It's clear what he was saying about me. I simply pointed out his error in logic. By your logic, if I said someone was coming off as autistic I wouldn't be in any hot water because I didn't call them autistic.
This is the problem when people start playing words games.
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@cheetocultleader said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1437643#Comment_1437643
I was like "Da fuq could Goya do?" Googled it, and now questioning this ice cold agua de coco by my side. Sigh.
I honestly can't tell if you are being sarcastic or not so idk how to respond
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@Dr_doom_j2 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1437653#Comment_1437653
You say that like I had some greater goal in regards to this game.
I found it incredibly short sighted at the time with the riots and everything surrounding George Floyyds death that that moment was being hijacked by libtards, lgbtq+, women's rights, etc. When this was a simple case of something that's been going along and happening for a very long time within the black community with regards to how we are and historically have been treated by the police. We finally have a concerted, concentrated effort at looking at this - and not even a two weeks after the man was in the ground, the discussion went from Elijah Mcclain and Kalief Browder to a celebrity who wants to tell you about asian american attacks and a gay guy mad that some non gay guy played a gay guy in that movie that one time.
But yes, as far as this game goes, that's not really their problem. I mean a BLM shirt would be weird, but maybe you could put in some cultural pieces or something relating to other cultures, of that's your reasoning for deciding to put specifically gay clothing/characters in game. Again, it doesn't matter and black people are in the game already anyway. So I dropped it.
And you decided to respond to a dropped conversation to make yourself look morally superior.. but you just came off as a bigot. Assuming that because I'm black and stand for black issues, I in any way view myself as a victim... Wow.
You just proved how wrong you are about everything. You tried to take a topic completely out of the bounds of the thread and turn it into a discussion on BLM. Don't deny it, it's in writing.
You say that you didn't like the protests being turned into something else by liberals(I won't use a ride term like you did) and then you try to do exactly that.
You paint yourself as a victim by saying your movement (based on mostly lies and misconceptions) was taken over by others.
Also, you resorted to name calling which is just immature. No where did I say anything that could be construed as bigotry. But play the "he disagreed with me so he's a RacIsT" card all you want.
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@Volfawott said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1437687#Comment_1437687
If it's not important and you feel like it doesn't need to be in a horror game why don't you just ignore it.
Why do you feel the need to vocalise how it doesn't belong if it's unimportant to you.
Maybe he wants to point it out to those who get so tied up in it that they respond to every single post about someone else's opinion. Maybe they just want to show how beat to death the subject is.
I'm not speaking for him, just trying to show you that other people have different thoughts
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@Dr_doom_j2 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1356182#Comment_1356182
Oh so we're pulling the "My struggle is more important than yours " card? Is that what you actually meant to illustrate with your words, or should I give you a second chance?
It's funny how LGBT always want to have that level of inclusion in discussing inequality, but want everything to take a backseat to their struggles and comment on their oppression as if it exists to any significant degree in most civilized countries.
But since YOU want to go there, you're ######### right I can't hide who I am or how I look, and because of that, I've been subject to the type of injustice that steps right to your front door, as well as the kind that seeps in the background, because I never had the benefit of being able to cloak myself.
Not saying that's right or a fair way to live, but if your going to sit here and make a mockery of the struggle of black folks by comparing the issue to ######### like the rainforest and intangible political issues like that, like really? Do you care that little about black folks you're going to allow your narrative to be "oh, put those blacks on the back burner, we don't have to address them right now, not even when there is a major race event affecting the Americas right now, let's ignore that, give cursory support to BLM or something"
I can't believe you are upset that in a thread about lgbtq characters revolving around a tweet made during Pride month that you want to hijack it all for BLM and paint yourself a victim. I'm glad it didn't work.
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@Kate_cx said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1355533#Comment_1355533
Oh I didn't know that, thanks for clarifying!
But my point still stands, any company would look respectful and professional if they support any kind of movement regardless of how big or small they are.
Wrong. Look at Goya foods CEO. He stood up for something and they are trying to boycott his company. Also look at Chick file A awhile back. The CEO, not even the company, but the CEO made a personal statement and there was backlash. Companies only look respectful to the woke mob if it supports a woke cause.
And SpongeBob is not gay. He's a children's cartoon for crying out loud. He never had any sexuality before; it's only being brought up because of the political climate.
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@Orion said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1424954#Comment_1424954
So you think BHVR, a capitalist company, is actively trying to push consumers away and drive themselves into bankruptcy?
I think they gladly would tank their long term future for short term survivor money. Hell, they might not even realize they are doing it.
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@Terra92 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1406395#Comment_1406395
Yeah you'd think that, but in games like League of Legends where the stakes are(apparently) a lot higher, where it's an actual cooperative competitive team vs team and the balance between over a hundred different champions truly matters, it's still just a mess to handle any sort of playtesting.
I mean some of the original characters introduced into the game never had updates or fixes to their kits until six or seven years later. It's not such a simple task to take someone's idea off a forum, which could inevitably become a huge lawsuit if you or anyone ends up suing them for your idea. After all, you were the one to come up with the idea and they didn't even consult you or pay you for your time. Even if the lawsuit wasn't in the way, it's one thing to talk about and develop a system in which a character could work, it's another to test it among a small number of yourselves and get a feeling for it, and it's a completely different dimension to release it to the public.
The minds of your players will always outsmart you, and it's honestly in your best interest to fix problems as you see them, rather than predict everything your players might do to break something you've made. Maybe the team should be upfront about that, but I think that would just lead to more misleading reports, people assuming they have a say in how a killer will end up. I mean that's sort of how this forum(and reddit, oh my god reddit is the worst at this but that's a whole other bag I don't wish to stick my hands into) behaves when it comes to problems with the game. People don't come here to have a discussion, they often come here to complain about a perk that needs to change right now oh my god. And if you don't think exactly like they do then sucks for you because they have a million rank 1 hours into this game which gives them authority to tell the devs how the game should be run(they don't have the authority).
Anyways, I've rambled enough. This quarantine has me coming back to this forum far more than I care to admit, and each time I'm both amazed and disappointed how easily people think that spamming new threads about something they don't like will actually get something done. It won't, and if they really think their complaints had anything to do with any changes made to killers or survivors, they should seriously consider a lawsuit for the time and effort they put into fixing the game, if they believe in fair compensation. Maybe wasting a couple thousand on a lawyer to find out they have no case will shed some reality on the situation.
That's just it though, this isn't some huge competitive game like league of legends where tournaments are held with money on the line. The devs top priorities should be on bugs and then character development. They are the ones who decide to release a chapter every couple of months instead of sitting and thinking through it all. Part of being a developer is solving problems that might come up, not patchwork fixing them as you go. I understand this community is fickle but that's no excuse.
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@Terra92 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1404947#Comment_1404947
Developers create games, characters, mechanics, concepts with certain things in mind. Anyone with even a passing knowledge of programming knows just how easy it is to come up with something, even with a think tank of a team, and end up coming up with ideas that they didn't think would be abused, implemented, or even be a problem in the first place.
I'm not defending BHVR on their mistakes, lord knows they have a ton to work on, but at the same time, changing something like this isn't new to any developer, ever. I don't necessarily disagree with you, but this jump to conclusions, this extreme reaction to their choices, is something I will never understand, even if they destroyed Inner Strength(my favorite perk) to the ground.
You are right if in cases where developers are coming up with something new. The basic game mechanics and strategies are all known at this point. Predicting how a killer will be used should be easy for them
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@OBX said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1404947#Comment_1404947
This isn’t the first time bhvr sold a new dlc one way then waited a few weeks so folks could buy it and then change the core mechanic entirely. This has happened to survivor and killer. I could care less about PH as I purposefully waited to buy this expansion until bhvr made whatever change they always make (be that good or bad.) folks should really not buy dlc until seeing how it will be changed
That's what I'm saying, it's no surprise at this point
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@Terra92 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1404779#Comment_1404779
You'd be surprised at how easy it is to miss a feature or mechanic you weren't thinking about, and then about a thousand people play that character for a week and figure out at least a dozen things you didn't expect to happen. It happens all the time in video games, the Speedrunning community is practically built on unintended features and bugs.
This isn't a missed feature or a bug. They sat down at a drawing table and said, let's make a killer that did x, y, and z. They then either don't have enough experience to realize how players will use x,y, and z, or they knew going into it z was going to be nerfed after they made money on it
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@Carpemortum said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1404536#Comment_1404536
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1404541#Comment_1404541
They didnt remove his power. Lol. They altered it because people used it to just camp and tunnel even though it promotes the opposite.
If balance changes is keeping you from buying a character, boy have I got some news for you..
Or if it's because PH cant use his power AND camp/tunnel now, well learn to actually play killer.
So why didn't the devs know this before they released him? They couldn't anticipate that people would use his power to tunnel or camp?
They do this Everytime a killer is released, they make him good and then nerf him after they cash the check.
The only other explanation is they don't even bother playing as their own characters so they didn't see the issue with the cages at all.
Overall, I can only conclude they intentionally deceive buyers or just don't care.
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@DBD78 said:
No surprise they removed his power. Survivors always complain about new killers instead of learning how to counter them. And devs can't stand their ground as usual.
Exactly, this news should not come as a shock to anyone. I almost feel sorry for those who bought pyramid head, but I don't because fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice, shame on me.
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@Voyager said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1403339#Comment_1403339
Well, that's a valid point. New players probably do stick around, on survivor. Not killer.
True, with survivor a new player can get to purple ranks in a week.
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@SweetTerror said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1403299#Comment_1403299
Honestly at this rate new players are probably thinking that it's pointless jumping into DBD. With the way the matchmaking is right now, it's giving new players the impression that it's too late to hop into this game.
No, they nerfed ruin to help new players so they should have no problem there.
(Sarcasm btw)
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@GodDamn_Angela said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1389433#Comment_1389433
About your #3
You are either being willfully ignorant or just deciding to ignore basically everything anyone else is saying. The only time anyone mentioned heterosexual relations are being forced down anyone's throat is after people complained that BHVR will shove LGBT+ relationships down their throat. If they write an LGBT+ character as they have written most of the other characters would it be being shoved down your throat? We have no reason to think that they would write it any differently. Except for the writing of Jane's story, but that's a whole other bag of worms, but that isn't about any intimate/sexual relationship anyway.
If you say yes, that you think them writing any LGBT+ relationship would be shoving it down your throat, then @Orion , and any one else who mentioned it, would be correct in stating that Heterosexual relationships are being shoved down our throat. And from what we've seen of how BHVR writes relationships it hard to come to any other conclusion since so many are saying they are going to do a poor job of it.
Also, their tweet was an apology for straight up lying to the community about the sexuality of the characters. You say its pandering, because its a tweet, but I'm not really sure where else they could have posted an apology that would both be immediately visible and easily shareable.
You clearly have not read any of my prior posts in the subject. I clearly state my issue is then tweeting about it, which is seen by many as pandering.
And how about just adding in the lore instead of tweeting. You said it's an apology but there was nothing to apologize for. It sounds like you wanted an apology for them not filling some quota that parts of society think should be filled. It seems obvious that the tweet, during pride month mind you, is an effort to pander to the gay community.
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@OnryosTapeRentals said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1388039#Comment_1388039
Let me break it down very simply:
- People are claiming they do not care if LGBTQ representation is added to the game.
- People are then saying they feel as though it would be better if character's sexualities were left undetermined. However, there was no such outrage when The Nurse had a husband, Frank and Julie had a relationship etc. In which case the only conclusion to be made is that people have a problem with the fact that introduced relationships won't be straight. You can voice faux concern for "how" LGBTQ characters are implemented if you want but the fact remains none of the heterosexual relationships in the game have been treated the same.
- I've seen a lot of responses in this thread that are just blatantly homophobic and utilize the same tired statements of 'it's too political', 'I support it BUT...' and 'don't shove it down by throat' etc. If heterosexual relationships aren't deemed as political, then why are LGBTQ ones? Once again, there is only one reasonable conclusion: people don't like the fact they're LGBTQ.
- LGBTQ people aren't a "world view". It's not a matter of debate over whether they exist, deserve rights, representation etc. They're people and should be treated as such. If you don't agree with this then I'm sorry but you are by definition homophobic.
EDIT: fixed a few spelling errors.
All three points you made are full of nonsense.
1. People saying they don't care if sexuality is added to the game and then saying they wish it wasn't doesn't make some one a homophobe. They are just stating they prefer a game one way or the other but are fine if it changes.
2. Bhvr didn't put out a tweet announcing the nurse was married or Frank was in love with Julie, it was written into the lore with no fanfare, hence the no reaction to it.
3. You and others like @Orion are the ones who continually go on and on about hetero relationships being shoved down your throat when according to you all it shouldn't impact the game play so why should it matter.
Finally, by world view I didn't mean homosexuality. I meant the world view of someone who constantly plays the oppressed victim card and calls anyone. Who disagrees with them a bigot. Being fine with gay people existing and preferring to not have any sexuality shoved down any throat doesn't make people homophobes. You just seem to have an axe to grind.
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@profrog said:
If bhvr ever adds something about a character being gay, I'd doubt it be anything more than a sentence or two, much like David's ex in his lore. Not in your face at all, and who cares if a small addition makes a small amount of people happy?
This shouldn't be something you stress over and gay representation shouldn't be politics.
That's my point, it shouldn't be a big deal but they tweeted about it like they cured cancer.
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@Snowstruck said:
Posts like this are gross, not to be rude.
The Huntress is, i'm pretty sure, canonly autistic and has the mind of a 8-9 year old.
Sexuality, preference, and all those other topics, when talking about Huntress, is just gross to me.
I wouldn't say she's autistic. I would say that she is just socially inept. Think about it, would you be well mannered and have good social skills if you grew up in the woods alone after watching your mother get killed by an animal?
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@OnryosTapeRentals said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1346763#Comment_1346763
I'm sorry but I don't see this thread as respectful at all.
It's rooted in the same anti-LGBTQ rhetoric that gets brought up every time an LGBTQ character is represented in media.
People are claiming they preferred leaving the character's sexuality and past relationships unconfirmed so players could make up their own story. However, if this were true, then where was the outrage when The Nurse was confirmed to have a husband in 2016?
People are also stating that representation is an agenda, a political statement, shoving it down their throat, pandering, toxic etc. But why is it that Frank and Julie's relationship, The Nurse's marriage, Dwight's crush etc aren't held to the same criticisms?
BHVR claims to be an ally to the LGBTQ community but the fact that homophobia like this is allowed to exist on the forums suggests otherwise.
As someone who has supported Dead by Daylight for 4 years, I'm disappointed to see such a response from the community.
I apologize if I have came across as rude or blunt, I'm just tired of having to disassemble the same hateful arguments time and time again.
I was waiting for someone to flat out call people homophobes for disagreeing with their world view, even though 99% of the disagreement in this thread is about how bhvr if implementing lgbtq characters, not if they should.
If you try to feel insulted chances are you will.
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@Orion said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1387054#Comment_1387054
I was referring to the line about "sacrificing quality".
Then what is your point? You keep getting stuck on the thought that you can't have a good female killer and a good killer at the same time. If the devs had a list of possible next killers, all of who would turn out great for the game but all happen to be male, I'm saying they shouldn't forget that list just to put a female killer in. That is the risk of asking for specific identity traits. Does that mean that will happen? No it does not. Just let the devs come up with whatever they want without suggesting they need a female character just for ratios.
I'm done posting on this topic after this cause it can't be broken down any further.
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@Orion said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1386892#Comment_1386892
It really doesn't, since the lore and art departments don't have anything to do with the game design/balance department.
By balance I meant number of killers, not the typical definition of game balance used in the forums.
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@gunslingers_potatoe said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1386370#Comment_1386370
And if that was the only reason I wanted a female killer, how is this even you're problem? I get that you disagree with my opinion but at this point you are just throwing dirt at me.
No one threw dirt at you. Since the ratio was in your original post it stands to reason that the ratio was your main goal in wanting another female killer. I am simply saying that adding anything for the sake of a ratio risks sacrificing quality for the sake of balance.
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@kakmieke said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1384229#Comment_1384229
I think with requests like this it's not really anything to do with representation. I agree with OP, I'd like to see a female killer again. It's not do with ratio of male/ to female or anything it's just because I want to see something new and different from the art team. The female killers we have have some of the most unique and best designs in the game.
OP says they point of another female killer is to even things up. Maybe you don't want another female killer just for a ratio but some people do.
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@NeaMainNON_TOXIC3 said:
I have two to three versions of a build
1.) Devour Hope, Corrupt Intervention, Infectious Fright, PGTW
Devour Hope can be hidden with your corrupt purge, I find it very useful when working.
2.) Monitor & Abuse, Ruin, Surveillance, BBQ
3.) Save The Best For Last, Corrupt Intervention, M&A, PGTW
Can I ask why save the best for last?
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@Huff said:
The way I see it, make your characters how you want. Make every single character LGBTQ or whatever for all I care. Maybe I just don't understand what it's like as a straight person, but I would think the easiest way to be inclusive and help LGBTQ people to feel more normal and less like a marginalized group is to treat them like any other normal person. That means not tokenizing them and making a big deal out of having somebody like that in your stuff.
As I said, maybe I just don't get it or something, but if people just started making celebratory posts and stuff about something like that related to me (like having a straight pride month or something) it would feel odd to me rather than inviting that people are making a big deal out of my traits. I think it's absolutely great to be inclusive, but when it's purely for the purpose of inclusivity, to the point where it takes away from the quality of the character, that's when it starts to feel (to me at least) like it's "pandering" and being used more for good PR than just having a character that's like that from the beginning.
One of the other commenters (I think with a Freddy profile picture) commented with a picture of one of those Stranger Things characters (the Scoops Ahoy girl), and after being reminded of her, I totally agree that she's an LGBTQ character done right. It's made obvious what she's interested, but it's not done in a way that takes away from the episode, just a little thing you learn about her. I think when something like this is revealed in a good way (like how they did it really smoothly and naturally with the girl in the Stranger Things episode) then it's awesome, but it just feels out of place when it's made to be the defining characteristic of something. I also saw somebody make a comment about people hating on stuff only when LGBTQ things are introduced, but I think that's just stupid, because Ellie was already revealed to like girls before anything was revealed about The Last of Us 2. I remember hearing plenty of people saying they did her reveal well because they didn't throw it into the story as one of the main plot points, and it was just revealed in a natural way.
I don't care much either way because it doesn't matter to me what kind of genitals Dwight likes, and if you LGBTQ people are loving it that much then that's even better. I just personally would feel weird if people tried to tokenize me in such a way.
And please, don't even try to twist what I'm saying around to try to make it sound like I'm hating on LGBTQ representation. I hate having to add this in, but there's too many people who will try something like that.
^
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@Iceman said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1384370#Comment_1384370
hmm, I want to say something about who you probably are on the other side of this screen but by this context you can probably guest what it is. And that's probably why you and the person you quoted "FAILED" to understand.
Typical, you fail to refute my argument and then try to subtly insult me by saying "I'm not going to sack up and say something to you here, but at home I'm judging you". I want you to say what you think I am. I have said nothing on this thread against women, men, or anyone else. All I have said is you continue to not use the word organically right.
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@Iceman said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1383990#Comment_1383990
I wasn't talking about my post. I said OP post. And far as the word "organic" its for something to naturally occur. When it comes to situations like this you have to speak up/ask for it so in the future it become an organic thought.
You didn't say OP post, you said this post; the meaning of your message was not clear. And once again, you fail to realize what organically means.
The next killer should just come from the creative minds of the devs. They should not sit at a table and say, "well some people wanted a female so that's what we are starting with".
@NightmareReborn said:
I personally don't think representation is necessarily a top priority for games like Dead by Daylight. That being said, I'm not against any group of people being added into the game, as long as it fits naturally, and doesn't feel forced.
This guy gets it.
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@Iceman said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1383357#Comment_1383357
Things come organically if people speak up ask for it. Once again, there's no harm in asking. Did you get sick from reading this post? Not physically but maybe mentally. And that's something you will have to deal with on your own.
By definition something is not organic if it is asked for/expected by the community. And no, your post did not mentally hurt me because it's just words.
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@Seiko300 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1383688#Comment_1383688
Cool. Then by all means let the next original killer be female, whatever makes people happy as long as the character is unique and well developed from a story standpoint, as well as has a good power that is viable and fun to use.
Though I'll still be holding out hope the next chapter is a licensed one. I had myself so hyped up for a licensed property that was absolutely incredible (I definitely made the mistake of overhyping myself) and I was slightly disappointed when it turned out to be Pyramid Head. In retrospect, I'm having a lot of fun playing the character and a lot of people were super happy to see Silent Hill revived through Dead By Daylight... but nonetheless I was left feeling somewhat crestfallen.
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1383711#Comment_1383711
I included Legion in the female list @EverflowingRiver still there in case you missed the name written amongst the other female killers.
My mistake. Sorry
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Everyone seems to cleanse on Nintendo Switch against plague. Maybe that was just my experience though
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@Seiko300 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1383036#Comment_1383036
^ This is actual facts. And a seriously overlooked comment on this thread.
The only reason that there are more male killers than female killers is because of the licensed killers. If you count up only the original killers male to female it becomes an 8:6 ratio or simplified 4:3.
Trapper, Wraith, Hillbilly, Doc, Clown, Legion, Oni, Deathslinger
Nurse, Hag, Huntress, Spirit, Legion, Plague
Making the disparity in all reality, not that wide
And on a personal note, sorry that guys are naturally villains and females are the heroic "final girls" especially in horror slasher? Is... is that something we should be angry about?
Something like this better not stand in the way of future licensed characters like Pennywise, Pinhead, Candyman, Jason etc. or I'm gonna lose my sh*t.
Legion is female too
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@Orion said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1383169#Comment_1383169
To them, it might. Your opinion is not the only one that matters. I edited my previous comment after you quoted it. Here you go:
I do find it funny how you think creating a female killer and creating a killer with a good background are mutually exclusive concepts.
Like someone else posted, I never said story telling needed to be sacrificed for another female killer. This is so similar to the other threads though about gay characters. Don't just put something in the game because you need to feel like it's "fair". If that's the case I want several more black characters along with one native American from North America and one Aboriginal character. We also need to increase Chinese representation because there are 2 Japanese characters. See how that works?
A killer should be designed by the devs from their creativity, not what the public seems the flavor of the day.
Look at the spirit, great killer with a great story. No one cared that she was female.
So what I'm saying is, just stop with the gender/sexuality/race crap and let it come organically like it will.
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@Orion said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1383159#Comment_1383159
You don't have to participate if you think it's irrelevant.
No, because if I don't participate people go on thinking their point has merit.
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@GoodBoyKaru said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1373391#Comment_1373391
My experience with Clown is that he's weak, yeah, but I agree I don't play him right. People who do play him right say he's stronger than people give him credit for, so yeah I'll believe someone who plays him correctly. Like I'll believe a 3k hour nurse main saying she's strong over a 10 hour player saying she's the worst in the game.
Forgive me for not automatically taking the devs side about balance issues after the multiple legion nerfs and the ruin nerf.
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Another thread about a topic that is irrelevant. Why have good story telling when you can make a killer with a certain set of genitals 🙄. Or would it help the op sleep at night knowing there was a quota system?
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@GoodBoyKaru said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1371477#Comment_1371477
AFAIK @Almo said that clown was underrated and has hidden potential. Not that he doesn't need further changes.
@DudeDelicious (apologies that I keep tagging you on these topics btw man), the forums resident BigBrainClownMain(tm) says that on a scale of 1 (criminally underrated) to 10 (very overrated), clown scores a 1. Also from them comes the notion that they need to be very careful with clown, since he could very easily become OP. The change they made already went a long way and, to use a direct quote, "His only weakness is stealth".
So can we please all shut up about Almo saying that clown was underrated because he is. Everyone says he's one of the worst, and I disagree. I wouldn't say he's good but you can easily streamroll a team if you know what you're doing- again ask DudeDelicious. Man's working on a clown guide to upload to his youtube channel (it's been rumoured anyway). Give him a break, please.
So because one user says clown is good and is making his own guide on him we are just supposed to believe clown is good? No thanks, I'll stick to what I know about clown for know.
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@Peanits said:
Good to know, I'll mark it on my calendar. The many other "game will die" predictions that came up over the past four years haven't been right so far, but I'm sure you're onto something this time in spite of the game steadily growing since release.
The sound bugs don't help your case any
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@Nicholas said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1366139#Comment_1366139
By "alert" I mean exactly that. I was simplifying the conversation but that refers to the first step in accomplishing getting those equal rights. It's about bringing awareness and being accustomed to differences. People don't win rights overnight. Those media campaigns are important in a societal shift. Not to mention the fact that the alert also refers to the legal process of the courts putting the gov on "alert" about classes of people.
The second part, the reason why they support equality is immaterial if it accomplishes something good. When big corps were in favor of same-sex marriage, did I think it was out of charity or goodness? No, I knew it was because there was change and they didn't want to be left behind on the wrong side of history for the sole purpose of profit and money. Yet does that really matter? So if companies want to be inclusive to earn points or increase sales, makes no difference bc something greater is achieved when more people/corps support a cause.
I gotta disagree with your second paragraph. You are saying the ends justify the means which is just something I will never believe.
I believe people will be more alert and open to change when it comes naturally. Nobody likes to be told what is supposed to be right or wrong.
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@EverflowingRiver said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1366083#Comment_1366083
A good society makes sure the minority has equal rights, it does not mean I need to be "alerted" to anything. Otherwise everything is an alert and the individual is supposed to too toe around everything.
I'm not trying to be ride, but I think you missed my point. My last post was saying Boone cares if you put a gay couple in a commercial. Campbell soup did it a couple years ago and guess what, they still sold soup. They didn't go on Twitter and say " look at our new commercial featuring two dudes kissing, aren't we inclusive."
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1366088#Comment_1366088
This dude said it perfectly. Do something because it's right, not because you want attention.
Sorry for the spelling, I just got off work and my hands are cold