CautionaryMary
CautionaryMary
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@Skoegul said:
Love that they justify their nerf for Distortion by pointing out the actual problem:
***
Dev note: Distortion counters a lot of Perks & Add-Ons. The token system and recharge mechanic makes Distortion far too effective and allows Survivors to go unseen for the entire match.***
This perk wouldn't be this popular if there wasn't aura reading for literally everything in this game by now.
Load into the game? Aura revealed.
Walk past a totem? Aura revealed.
Heal? Aura revealed.
Are you anywhere near a locker? Aura revealed.
Item on the floor? Aura revealed.
Someone gets hooked/unhooked/killer kicks a gen/you vault/you exist a little too obviously? Aura revealed.
There's more, yes, and I don't have to list everything for anyone to understand I hope. I just feel that maybe aura reading as a whole needs to be looked at before we completely slaughter the one perk survivors have at their exposal. Obviously if 'one perk counter too much', then there is 'too much to counter'.
And before anyone cries, I play both. I don't use Distortion and I don't use aura perks on my killer. As killer I shouldn't be relying on these to track down a survivor. Not with the amount of tools I already have at my disposal. From my own eyes and ears to the little things like scratch marks, crows and Killer Instinct - which as we all know has zero coutnerplay. And all this I get without using any perk slots, hurray!
Maybe we see the return of Shadow Step and boons now tho. We will see…
Yeah, that's the problem with the game essentially is your aura being read for the smallest of things and then adding aura to two perks, while gutting Distortion in the same patch.
I say this as a person who doesn't use Distortion as I know Behavior's way of reworking perks is by gutting them once people complain too much about a certain perk's usage.
I can see people bring CoH and Shadow Step now with these changes, so at least the meta might shift a little.
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@doobiedo said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3797916#Comment_3797916
I have never run distortion and I agree with the OP. It is absolutely disgusting that they are nerfing distortion now but we have to wait until november for them to do something about weave attunement. Let's stop pretending Survivors have any option to hide at all. Then when we see what kill rates are with survivor auras visible at all times we can buff survivors to compensate. And for whoever said use OOO you do realize ooo is a completely useless perk right?
Should've nerfed Distortion and Weave in the same patch as I told my friend the other day.
At least add it to where survivors can see the aura of dropped items if you're in the radius. It's hard to counter in solo-queue unless you just don't bring items.
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@GrimReaperJr1232 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3796295#Comment_3796295
I used the perk during that time. I don't need footage. I know you lost the perk if you tried to hit it but missed it—you only saved it if you didn't press the button.
Yeah, I probably was thinking back to the old days where I would save the DS for my third hook and hit it then.
I'm surprised that you're harshly penalized for missing the skill check, especially with how badly optimized last gen consoles are along with lag and latency when you can just use Off The Record that works on both hook stages.
My bad for misremembering on the perk and this talk informed me on the perk a little.
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@GrimReaperJr1232 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3795485#Comment_3795485
That... is not true.
If you missed old (pre-6.1.0) DS, you lost it. Period. If you gave an input, you lost it.
The only way to save is/was not pressing the button. I know this because I tested the perk when I was still new.
I encourage you to look at old gameplay because back then you could have definitely used OLD DS the second time if you missed the first skill check. 😊
I should know given that I've been playing the game since 2019/2020.
If that's indeed how it always worked because I'm not a DS user, DS is a fundamentally weak perk by consuming it you missed the first skill check. 💀
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@SpitefulHateful said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3795697#Comment_3795697
I love those moments when the end game chat is ggwp you were very good at that killer, it was a lot of fun
That happens?
And I know I should ignore the bad vibes but it's hard.
The biggest lie you have ever been told is "just ignore the bad vibes and everything will be okay". Because as a result when you feel bad after other players BMing and showing toxicity, you're made to believe it's your fault for having emotions. Meanwhile, the truth is that yes, DbD's community sucks, it's full of disgusting people and it's normal to feel bad around disgusting people. You don't look for pearls in piles of manure.
It's hard to suggest anything, but what helped me personally was to change my objectives as a Survivor, prioritizing escape over altruism and gen rushing. I use perks that help me, first and foremost (Clairvoyance is super helpful, especially if you're the last one standing). If I see that other survivors start going down fast and Killer extremely capitalizing on altruism, I don't play along, setting my sights on either hatch escape or fast gate opening. If you want more bloodpoints, you'll be able to get over 11K this way — minus the frustration of doing chases and throwing yourself at the Killer, only to realize other survivors have done absolutely nothing while you've been running around.
I gave a GGWP to a Trickster on Playstation yesterday. I usually do it when the game was close or something like that. It does happen, just not as frequently as you'd think. 🤣
I think the game has incredible amounts of burnout and Behavior needs to address some valid concerns about the game. I don't know if they're wanting a more chase oriented or stealth based game but I feel the enjoyment of the game went down once they started reworking the maps, which caused gens, hooks, and loops (abysmal pallets) to spawn closer together. It's either have the game be stealth based (harder with the amount of aura perks and add-ons) or chase oriented (harder with map downsizes, less speed boost than before, worse loops, and some killers simply depending on bloodlust to void a pallet in general).
I get so many randoms who get caught at the beginning of the game and insta starts killing themselves on hooks and I haven't experienced it as much in the past as before. Yesterday in particular was dreadful for playing solo-queue.
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@SoGo said:
I don't think it was Mangled that needed a change, but Haemorhage.
My suggestion: Make Mangled last until healed and put Haemorhage on a timer instead.
Yeah, my only issue with Sloppy Butcher was the hemorrhage. I assume that they nerfed the perk given that healing was nerfed via Medkits and the Circle of Healing nerf.
At least people can use Resurgence and Reactive Healing as Sloppy isn't as prevalent though.
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@HexHuntressThighs said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3794534#Comment_3794534
It's definitely overpowered without a shadow of a doubt. I just gave 4 reasons on why it's overpowered and those points still stand. Killers are told to stop relying on aura reading perks and use "game sense" to locate survivors. I say stop relying on WoO and use "game sense" to recognize tiles before you get to them, predict where pallets will be in said tiles and pay attention to where your teammates are looping and what pallets have been used.
It is factually an overpowered perk. It literally makes me at the very least 2x better at looping. And when I hit a survivor who uses WoO with the Amanita Toxin add on for Huntress, its blatantly obvious that some of them rely on this perk way to heavily.
The problem with Pain Rez is that it's not overpowered at all on weak killers but dramatically overpowered on Nurse and Blight. Certain killers being significantly better than others heavily skews the view on killer perks. But all survivors are the same so there perks don't have to take into account for that.
Not only would I say it's overpowered but I say without a doubt in my mind; it is hands, down bar none the strongest perk in the entire game for survivors. The only thing that was ever stronger was original Object Of Obsession.
You can give a survivor the tools of Windows of Opportunity, but that doesn't mean all survivors will loop optimally either.
It's more of a "I can go here because it's not a complete deadzone" perk because going down in an area because RNG decided to not spawn a pallet in the corner of a map is frustrating to say the least.
Usually if I notice someone is going from pallet to pallet as killer, I'll just ignore them and find someone else to chase. You can kinda tell and sometimes it's best to go after people out of position rather than someone chaining loops together. -
@Nun_So_Vile said:
Yes, very sad about the maps. Wish they didn't decide to remove a lot of those atmospheric horror aspects like fog and DoF.
To paraphrase a great line I heard the other day from @Atsuka_Anarchy
"Welcome to the Fog." …What fog?
Honestly, I would love a darker and foggier game.
Would even buff some killers like Trapper and Hag as their traps won't be as visible to the naked eye. Coldwind is an eye sore to load in on and I'm surprised Behavior hasn't said anything about it, especially when they had the Lights Out modifier.
It would make the game much more horror based... Imagine walking into a Myers by accident because of a darker and foggier map, lol.
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@totallynotamegmain said:
Damn that looks like a scary idea, being banned for no reason with no way to recover.
Yeah, there's one YouTuber in particular who actively cheats to get someone banned as a form of "revenge" for Behavior banning someone that they got falsely banned. 😆
It's crazy how prevalent cheaters are in the game and how they can just create new accounts to avoid a ban.
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@Rulebreaker said:
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/EEIDQQ7I9ZH8/17258503772554744666679904856332.jpg
As of pretty much right now, NA East
For me, as a NA East it's usually survivor 100% during the day and 100% for killer at night.
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@Arbmos1998 said:
Personal Experience
I'm someone who for the most part likes to use a variety of killers, perks, addons to try and be as unique, different and interesting as possible to play and go against but if there is one thing I am noticing it's that survivors I go against immediately assume I am a "baby killer" right off the bat trying gimmick "Tik Tok" stuff which does work against the less experienced players. For example I'll down someone and "Fake" picking them up with say Pig I'll crouch as If I am doing the pick up animation and what a surprise a survivor comes rushing in to flashlight save but because I haven't fell for it I get a hit off. But then for some reason they try to do it a 2nd time thus creates a start up slug through their own misplay. If a killer isn't falling for your strategy back off. I don't want to slug but you force it.
Where Does this Lead? DC
I can't tell you how common this is becoming, it's almost as if these people are trying to farm clips against really bad killers but then when it doesn't work against an experienced one they give up and go next. What does this then usually lead to? I stream DBD so usually these people will come into my stream and instead of them admitting they played badly they take it out on me and project harddd or they leave a salty comment on my steam profile making me out to be the bad person.
"Slugging, Tunneling at 4 gens boringgggg Killlerrrr"
The amount of gens shown doesn't tell us the whole picture, it could be 4 gens remain yet 3 of them are between 75-85% complete.
Next issue - Current Gen Speed:
As we know killer gen regression is becoming less and less to the point of where players are looking into the likes of Dying Light as their gen defense and gen regression kicks at base are laughable, 1/4th of a solo survivor regression. In my matches I'm seeing the likes of Brand New Part, Green Tool Boxes, Deva Vu, Prove Thyself, Resilence, Hyperfocus etc becoming insanely common. It's strange how BHVR are not keen on killers stacking their perks to combo yet for some reason survivor can just stack multiple gen perks?
What does this now create? Usually players who are really bad in chase yet can slam M1 on gens because their perks and addons allow it. This is potentially why a lot of peoples solo queue games are miserable I swear the skill level of survivor is just getting lower and lower because they don't need to try as much to get winning results.
I don't know about you but when I see gens fly stupid quick to the point of you genuinely think it's cheating I immediately feel I need to change up my playstyle to combat against them as I know full well If I switch my brain off and just do random chases I'll lose. Quick gens are forcing "Tunneling, Camping, Proxy Camping, Slugging" which I know full well the majority of the survivor playerbase despise going against. When gens are chill and more normal It allows me to go for more chases and make the gameplay loop more interesting, 4-5 min games do not.
Map Offerings:
I see Eyrie, disregard any intention I had on playing nice that match. In my experience people picking the likes of this map know It is strong and try to use it to their advantage. I am not saying they can't or shouldn't use it I'm just saying don't expect me to play nice against you after picking a map what heavily favours you. Any other scenario I will attempt to go for fun chases but again I am conditioned to change up my playstyle to have a chance at winning.
Forced MMR: Which We Can't Even See
This to me is boring, I'm not a fan at all with every match feeling like I am trying out for some Comp Team, sure I could just lose 50 matches in a row but the issue here is I am eventually going to end up back where I am now (wherever that is) because at the lower end the game is simply too easy and I wouldn't find it interesting straight up stomping new - mid players but at the same time I don't really want to go against potential Comp Teams every game. I have a feeling It's high because of the type of plays, strategies, cockiness I see, weak players wouldn't act this way and It is quite common player profiles I see has things like "Winner of X Tournament, 2nd in X Tournament" etc I am pretty sure these players wouldn't be on the lower end of MMR. I miss 2018 DBD where matchmaking had a bit more randomness to it.
So players, something to take from this. Not every killer you are against is out to get you on a personal level If they just happen to tunnel, camp, slug etc. Sure you are going to come across the 1/30 killer who is just determined to slug all 4 because "lolololol" but survivors has a lot of tools given to combat this, no killer should be able to slug you all without the survivors making multiple misplays. Read the match, think about why the killer had to play a certain way, are gens flying? Are they struggling in chase and barely get one person in less than a minute? Are your teammates bm'ing? Are your teammates trying blind plays and not backing off which leads to slugs? Are they wanting to win the match just as much as you do?I think both sides feed off of each other and push themselves into playing in a way that the other hates.
If you play against a tunneling/camping/proxy camping killer, survivors will adapt and push gens.
If you struggle as killer, people will rush gens.
We're at this point in the game where people try to play as optimally as possible because you never know when a game turns around for the other side because a killer decided to tunnel or survivors "gen rush" their objectives.
So, you have both parties playing in a competitive level. As Firellius stated, tunneling and camping has always been a prevalent strategy that killers employ, so survivors have adapted to stay on generators to ease the pressure the killer is doing -- it's nothing new.
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@Firellius said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3794254#Comment_3794254
Oh, I'm not talking about the conspic action nerf. That was absolutely required. But the fact the stun duration then got tampered with, initially getting gutted for no reason, then reverted two years later only to get kneecapped -again- shortly after… That was the bit that was completely unnecessary.
It should've stayed at 5 seconds, or even increased.
Let's not forget the nerf where if you miss the skill check, you no longer have the perk anymore.
Old DS would allow you to pocket it for your next to last hook stage if you missed the first difficult skill check. Most people swapped DS out for more viable perks that give more value.
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@SoGo said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3795219#Comment_3795219
Overexposure, I would guess.
Many people gravitate towards her especially with the goth mommy stereotype. 💀 A lot of people main Sable, Mikaela, and Feng because they get so many outfits in the game.
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@SpitefulHateful said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3793822#Comment_3793822
I would put it on the same level because the only reason tbaggers don't say slurs in the game is because the game doesn't let them. And I believe these things totally should be put together because the goal is the same — to humiliate and offend another player, to make sure they will end this match not only as a losing party, but as a miserable party.
I play on PC, so I see what kind of verbal abuse tbaggers throw in the endgame chat. Reporting doesn't do much — Behavior doesn't care.
So, when I teabag at the exit gates — it's either because I was focused on via tunneling or because I had the killer dry humping me from giving them a long chase during the match. I do this action in jest back at the killer for them bming me in the first place.
I have never and will never type or use a slur against another player for how they play. For you to group me into people who teabag at the exit gates because they outmaneuvered a tunnel, a slugging match, or whatever the reason for the teabag and then say slurs in the game isn't an argument.
I've seen people get banned for these activities, especially when you gather screenshots or video gameplay when reporting them to Behavior, Sony, or Microsoft.
I don't understand why you're equating two things that have nothing to do with one another when you can report and move onto the next game. You're letting the person who teabagged you have waaaay too much power for what the action actually does.
I don't get upset when I get dry humped on the ground or being smacked on the hook, I simply chuckle about it and move on with my day — same thing when I see teabags as killer.
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@Rokku_Rorru said:
I'd like it to at least keep the vault speed would be nice, that's all I could ask for. Though we have Finesse now so
Yeah, Finesse is functionally old Spine Chill without the flickering to know when a killer is looking in your direction. 😂
I do miss old Spine Chill, I remember Pain Reliever using it back in the day and I started using it because of him as it was fun to play with it…but it did disregard stealth killers' ability to stalk a person so. 😅 Used to love running it with old Iron Will, Resilience, and Sprint Burst.
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@PuddleOfBludd said:
Or … hear me out.
You bypass all of that reworking which would only buff SWF (none of whom would need to run any of the aforementioned perks that you want to have base kit ) and just add communications to the game for SoloQ. Boom, on par with SWF without buffing SWF.
I used to think comms for solo-queue would be good, especially in cases where you can simply go on mic and say killer has x aura perk.
But in that case, I feel like it defeats the purpose of the game and I say this as a person who duo SWFs (rarely). I doubt Behavior would implement voice comms because then you would have people who main killer complain about the unfairness of the games as this a huge buff to survivor. Adding voice comms is a double-edged sword as it significantly nerfs killers like Trapper and Hag, who are already weak by allowing people to announce in the game where the killer traps when the random comes for an unhook.
I really don't think comms is necessary for a game like Dead By Daylight, perhaps a small radius of Bond but eh.
I say this as a person who has more hours on survivor than I do killer, BTW.
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@GroßusSchmiedus said:
Im going to say it: Still SIght, Dramaturgy, Plot Twist, Chemical Trap and Light Footed are underrated.
I would add Strength in Shadows to the list, even if you have to trek your way to basement. As long as you're not overly using the perk, it's good value to have a fast heal in basement. I like to pair it with Botany Knowledge to get a faster heal.
Even Background Player is a great perk, even with its recent speed boost nerf.
Yes, going to basement is a risk that I would not advise survivors to do. Wicked is an extremely niche perk, even if I like to run it with Babysitter and We'll Make It for more aura reading. Regardless, being hooked in basement and unhooking yourself isn't that powerful and is just flat out a weaker Deliverance. Even if you unhook yourself, which many people often do right when they get hooked, the killer is going to come back and hook you (rightfully so) back into basement.
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@SoGo said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3793405#Comment_3793405
And also starts them.
The only problem that I have with Scene Partner is that if you scream when reaching a vault, it disables the vault animation.
I think they added that somewhere after the perk was released, but if they removed that mechanic I'd definitely use it more.
I meant to tag,
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@BrightWolf said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3793623#Comment_3793623
It kind of is, its a form of rescue denial.
It's better known as a fishing strategy most often employed by stealth killers, in where they set a "lure," (a slugged or hooked survivor), then will hide nearby but within LoS and easy walking distance and go for an "easy" trade (if mistimed) or a second down. While technically, not official camping, it is still a PITA to deal with, because unless you're in a SWF or have coordinated SoloQ teammates, it results in a super cheap 4K for the killer.
If anything, you could argue that it's proxy camping and depends on the circumstances in the game.
If it's slugging for a 4k, at that point it's best to just let the survivor on the ground die and play for hatch (even if it's boring to go against).
If it's at the beginning of the game, the slugged survivor should move away from where they're downed and recover — the killer won't know where you are unless you stay where you are and at that point, the rest of the survivors should be doing gens with one potentially trying to help you up.
If it's at the middle of the game and the killer is struggling with no hooks, it's understandable for them to deploy slugging as it's a tactic to put pressure onto the survivors for them to get off of the gens.
Now if it's at the end of the game and the killer has everyone slugged and refuses to pick up, causing them to be bled out — it's a toxic move, but again in none of these situations is it considered "camping" or "rescue denial". All of these situations have counterplay via bringing Unbreakable or simply moving. Yes, everyone being slugged at the end of the game is an issue but we're talking about slugging in general here.
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@kaister901 said:
There are probably a ton of posts on this. However, it needs to be said again. MMR is just not fun on either role. Once you get into high MMR, it honestly becomes impossible to enjoy the game. I play both roles pretty evenly. Once I reached high MMR or at least I assume I am, when I see I am paired regularly with people a 1000 hours and above, the game seems impossible.
If I play survivor, it is always a killer that is running the usual gen regression meta build and cannot be mind games. If you don't have a safe loop or god pallet, you are done for. Then as killer, it is even worse because you are up against 4 people that cannot be mind gamed doesn't matter solo or SWF. I am forced to play using killers that can ignore loops, which is not really fun for the survivors or myself. It becomes stale quick playing only the same few killers so you stand a chance of at least a 2k.
I am a working adult now. I used to be a student when I started playing years back and could keep practicing to be as good as possible. That is kinda impossible to do when working. So, I am perpetually stuck at the lower cap of high MMR ever since I got there. I am unable to drop further for more relaxed games on either role because of the cap. The only option I have is literally to get good. Which is easier said than done while working.
Which is why I find myself only playing DBD now when there are game modes. The base game mode is just not fun. I think the lower MMR cap should be removed or at the least allow players who lose constantly at high MMR for a few days straight to drop to mid or low MMR to match their skill level currently.Honestly, even though I think before MMR my games were better (I've had in the past people realize to do gens before unhooking a basement Bubba or camping/proxy camping Trapper/Hag in basement) - I think even if you rip MMR out of the game, people have developed certain techniques and perk builds to go back to casual DBD.
Even though I prefer a more chill and casual Dead By Daylight experience as both killer and survivor, I don't think it would change anything.
People would still run gen defense (even against lower ranked people with less knowledge and experience) or meta perks such as Resilience and just staying on a gen to progress the game. I do believe even if some of my randoms are confusing in what they do, they play in a more competitive way and taking it out of the game would just cause all the knowledge the players have gained from MMR being introduced and making both survivor and killer gameplay being a steamroll without it in place.
I personally dislike MMR to a certain extent, but taking it away would just make games more of a toss-up than what they already are.
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Even though, I agree that the game has objectively been harder for survivor and easier (not completely handholding as others think) for killer. I wouldn't say that Behavior hates either side, I mean they need both for the game to function.
Without survivors and killers, they wouldn't have a functional game. Even though Behavior has made some changes that make me scratch my noggin, I wouldn't consider them to hate or be biased to either side. Their reasoning to make it a 60% KR, while buffing survivor in more QOL updates highlights Behavior wanting to make the game more competitive (even if some people believe the game should be more casual, which I agree with).
Yes, Behavior has been buffing killers whether specific to the killer or with QOL improvements like kicking a gen or pallet faster, they also introduced a HUD mechanic and anti-camp meter. They also develop perks that have undoubtably became meta for survivor —such as Finesse and the old Made For This.
This might be a hot take, but I believe Behavior cares about both roles but they're a developer at the end of the day and will make questionable decisions. However, they do take in feedback and change things accordingly from me playing the game for many years.
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@ReverseVelocity said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3793488#Comment_3793488
I'm not sure personally. Having it start you off injured, and stay injured, is kind of the core identity of the perk, it's iconic and removing that would be kind of a shame, in a way. I think a good start would be making it reduce Grunts of Pain by 100%, bringing it in line with Iron Will. It wouldn't be much but it's a start.
They'd probably have to give it another ability on top of everything else to make it good. It could be anything, really, could be a big permanent healing speed bonus (like +100%), which would fit in with the theme of the perk (i.e: I'm fine, go on ahead).
Maybe it could give you 10 seconds of Endurance once you unhook someone else. You're already very vulnerable going in for a save, and you can't hook trade, since you're one shot, but you'd be heavily rewarded for being able to get in there. You'd also have the self-pickup as a threat or a fallback if you went down. I know old BT was busted as all hell, but maybe it'd be alright with the caveat that you're injured for the whole trial? I don't know.
Something that revolves around really risky altruism would fit really well. No Mither is meant to make you the center of attention and place a massive target on your back, to draw attention away from your team. If you go down, they HAVE to deal with you, otherwise you just get back up and keep on going.
I like some of the changes you've mentioned, especially the unhooking process but it doesn't really help in situations if a killer is proxy camping for example. In that situation, a person with No Mither is useless in terms of getting the unhook done.
The healing buff is more situational as then a person would need to find a person to heal, as they couldn't heal themselves which many survivors don't usually run perks that actively benefits others, rather than themselves so this is just a niche change that wouldn't be fully utilized, in my honest opinion.
The grunts of pain being fully silent to come in line with Iron Will, I agree with.
The line of reasoning that it's an integral identity of the game because it was made like that since it's creation shouldn't be used as an argument though. It gives permanent information to the killer (you being broken) and you're helpless as you start the game injured and broken. Many perks, such as Spine Chill has been completely reworked (albeit in my opinion a straight nerf), No Mither should be no exception.
As others have stated, people either use the perk to troll their teammates (IE sandbagging or making themselves die) OR the person who doesn't have No Mither feeling like the game is a lost cause.
The change I would make to make it start you off healthy, permanently injured, and hiding the broken status effect would be a great change for people and still work with the synergy of Resilience (you can't heal, you're broken) and actually help with Tome challenges that require you to use No Mither — I could probably actually finish them without feeling bad about my team. 😂
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@ppmd said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3793507#Comment_3793507
To me it's like when they made shadowborne basekit on killer. The perk may take on a more niche use(like shadowborne did), or it can buff the existing stuff. So bond as a perk could be map-wide instead of 36 meters, and kindred could show killer aura by the hook and maybe do another small thing like slightly buff base bond or something. That way you only really need to run one of them to get more information if you really need it. You would also need to rework empathy if that is the case but I think it's pretty manageable. Maybe you could make it the reverse where everyone has map wide aura on teammates or something lol.
I do agree that changing chase mechanics to be longer would be healthier for survivor, but my current thinking is that buffing chase through making killers have more possible counterplay and making maps have more usable resources would be fairer overall and wouldn't really be any more abusable by SWF as compared to solo. Of course, I wouldn't MIND a bloodlust nerf either with how many killer powers have gotten buffed lol but I think bloodlust is more of a bandaid fix and lessening it is more likely to be pushed against since there are still some weaker killers that benefit more from the mechanic.
And absolutely I 100% agree that buffing survivor at all benefits SWF as well as solo, but I also think the largest gaps between SWF and solo are information and skill. So if you give more information to everyone and improve matchmaking then many solo problems will reduce. I don't pretend to think the information gap will close, but it would be reduced a lot which I'd love!
Thank you for taking the time to read, let me know what you think of this when you can.I agree that more information definitely helps solo-queue and I don't necessarily disagree with the points you've made.
Hence why one of my favorite builds before gens were pushed closer together (they reworked maps to make them smaller) was Bond, Open-Handed, Kindred, and Sprint Burst.
Now that they've made maps smaller, I've made Deja Vu a permanent place from my builds but I digress. The only issue that I could see that you brought up is how the perks would be changed, IE reworking Empathy as in your suggestion making Bond map wide — even putting Open-Handed in a list of perks that would need to be reworked. I don't disagree with a small radius around you to show a Bond. I don't even think Kindred is needed as it would just be a weakened version of Kindred and we all know about the dreaded black bubble that doesn't show the killer due to a bug or whatever reasoning Behavior gave for needing it.
The only reason I brought up basic changes like I've mentioned would be simply that they're easier to implement rather than making a whole list of perks that need to be reworked/tweaked to make it playable for people who do run Bond/Kindred. Again, I don't disagree with what you're saying and I think you bring up good points but just know that if Bond/Kindred basekit was brought into the game, it would make SWF stronger as well as they have pinpointed information which would help in the comms they use. My suggestion was an overall buff to both to help people survive in chase longer, which would help alleviate survivor gameplay as a whole.
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@SpitefulHateful said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3793495#Comment_3793495
Because it's the sign of disrespect and mockery — players going out of their way to express that they see you as lesser. The fact that people would often say slurs and insults when they t-bag (many streamers have willingly documented themselves doing that) shows that is pretty much the same. And unless you play your most intense, you end up either wasting your time waiting until they're done mocking you and rubbing their victory in — it's really like you have to wait until a guy who beat you at your tabletop game finally gets tired of flipping you off because you don't really have an option to leave the room and everybody else is telling you "relax, it's just a game, take an L, will you?"
I suppose you can say it's a sign of disrespect and mockery, but I would not place it on the same level as using a slur against another person.
Suuuure, there are some people who use teabags along with slurs but let's not group ALL people who teabag into people who actively use slurs to belittle people. You are putting things together that shouldn't really be put together and that depends almost exclusively on the person doing the action and they will get banned accordingly, as that's against the rules in the first place!
I play on console, so I don't see the endgame chat that PC people get - but if someone is teabagging you at the exit gates, screaming profanity in the endgame chat or even in direct messages, promptly report them, and move along to the next game. I haven't personally experienced teabagging and having slurs said to me - the only slurs I have gotten was from a fellow survivor in a match, which I reported.
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@ppmd said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3793485#Comment_3793485
When making perks basekit, of course we need to be very careful. But the reason for example old spine chill was turned into the heartbeat mechanic is because it helped for accessibility reasons. In a similar fashion, making these perks we mentioned at least partly basekit would not buff survivor overall, mainly solo queue because they have less information than in a SWF. This is why killers sometimes say SWF have several perks basekit, so really what we are doing is just giving it to everyone, not only those who are playing with others. If we do this we can make survivor more even overall and then balance for that if it's an issue.
Your suggestion to buff distance gained on hit would help with chase, but it also buffs survivor overall. This would not close the gap between SWF and solo, as in a SWF you could likely make even greater use of this distance gained to know exactly where to run and also die outside of 3 gens and such. It might make solo queue better as it may buff individual players somewhat, but if one player isn't informed then they won't be able to use this information.
To put it another way, injured solo queue teammates often run to open chests to hopefully find a medkit to heal instead of going to a teammate because they don't know where their teammates are. What if we allowed them that chance to coordinate with their teammates which you would have in a SWF? Now solo queue is better, and SWF is the exact same since they could just tell you where to go.
To address your other point differently: I think survivors could use help in chase(sometimes anyway), but I think that comes more in the form of killer power design and map design, not in those basekit things.
I hope this seems reasonable.I get your point and it's a reasonable take on the idea of bringing solo-queue closer to SWF.
I'm not inherently against the idea of it, but I don't know how they would implement a Bond/Kindred being basekit while either reworking Bond/Kindred or buffing them — it's a very thin line to address when you add perks into basekit survivor. My addition with making survivors get the retained version of the speed boost prior to 6.1.0 would address a chase issue that solo-queue got affected by. Chases are much more short due to the reduced speed boost and the buff that bloodlust got when it was reduced per tier. These issues highlight a problem that solo-queue would benefit from, yes - a SWF will benefit from this as well but you could argue that any buff a survivor (aka solo-queue) gets would buff SWF.
If you add basekit Bond/Kindred into the game, that's less information that a SWF team needs to communicate amongst themselves anyways.
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@SpitefulHateful said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3785103#Comment_3785103
I guess, you don't get offended if the person who beats you in a game of cards or chess flips you off and calls you a slur (after all, they won, so they get to behave how they want). Good for you.
Comparing teabagging in a video game (since the early days of Halo) to slurs is quite a leap in rationale that I didn't think I'd see on the forums. 💀
I don't understand why people get offended at teabagging and I say that as someone who doesn't even teabag unless I'm actively bm'd to in the first place.
Even as killer, when I see a survivor teabag me... Guess what? They're losing distance to teabag me. If they're at the exit gates teabagging, I go around and kick pallets or just go stand around to be on my phone - it's literally 2 minutes of my time out of the entire duration the match was.
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@ReverseVelocity said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3793474#Comment_3793474
The point is that you can use those perks from the start of the trial, remove being injured from the start and that goes away.
Adding one single health state to the entire game doesn't really achieve much, while also defeating a large point of the perk.
Again, I understand your perspective on being able to use Resilience with a niche perk like No Mither.
How would you change the perk, or would you just leave it the way it is? My aim was to make the perk more versatile while keeping the aim of hard mode enabled, hence the thread that was created to discuss it. I don't know of any other change you can make to the perk to make it more viable and the amount of times I audibly groan when I load into a lobby and see a random with No Mither consistently being tunneled due to no protection other than a built in borrowed time is quite frustrating to deal with.
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Honestly, I would be down for more HUD icons - even extending it to showing the anti-camp meter.
I don't think I would necessarily agree with making perks basekit. I say this as a person who loves to run Bond and Kindred in some of my builds, but I don't think adding this into basekit survivor would be suitable - especially with having to rework or tone down the basekit as those forms of perks already exist.
I do agree that solo-queue needs some love, especially in the form of buffs but I don't believe we need anything basekit that I'm aware of.
If anything, I would potentially buff some of the changes that were introduced in 6.1.0 — stuff like the distance a survivor makes when being hit, which could help a survivor in chase as we get less distance now, which I think was a terrible change for solo-queue and makes chases shorter.
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I want to add that you can still use the perk combo, it's very hard to go the entire game without being hit at least once. At least then the perk has more versatility and lets the game flow for the No Mither user. I've seen my fair share of games where a random is using No Mither and you have people who literally don't care for the No Mither player (some thinks the perk is throwing the game) or people who give up in their games due to how, like I've mentioned a detriment the perk is in its current iteration.
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@ReverseVelocity said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3793465#Comment_3793465
I think being injured from the start is one of the points of the perk. So you can get value from things like Resilience, etc from when the trial starts.
I get that, but like I mentioned you can get value from it by simply being hit and put into that one health state.
Even if someone is running resilience on No Mither, it shouldn't make you that much of a detriment to your team — especially if the person in question isn't that good of a looper and gets focused on to have an easier match for the other side. As it stands now, No Mither is a drawback considering it lets the killer know that you are permanently broken, causing you to be an easier target. There's a reason why No Mither has such a low pickrate. -
@BugReporterOnly said:
I just had someone with it get caught and then went next on hook. Even if it was the perk roulette challenge she didn't bother trying and almost all of the time I see this perk that happens. Give David a new perk to replace it.
I think a good change for No Mither would simply be to start healthy and then stay permanently injured, maybe even hide the icon from killers to prevent them being a tunneled target as most killers will target a No Mither player if they're caught during the game.
I doubt Behavior would honestly touch the perk given that it's considered a "challenging" perk to make the game harder, but I agree that it needs to have some security to it for yourself to be perma one health state. Even with the suggested change I've mentioned, it still would hold the "challenging" aspect as you can't heal yourself or have others heal you. A No Mither player can be quite detrimental unless they're running Boil Over, Power Struggle, or anything that can troll the killer in some way.
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@indieeden7 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3785740#Comment_3785740
Even if you have the time to heal, the killer can still come back to tunnel you even after that. And it would still be tunnelling.
Especially if they have the mobility to return to the hook right before the heal is completed/when completed. I've had many times where I get healed under the hook and the protection doesn't stay on me anymore because it doesn't really last that long.
It's why I've personally opted to just run away and find someone else to heal me as most killers simply return to the first hooked survivor. Stripping away a player's agency even if they're fully healed doesn't stop the person being tunneled, it just simply makes it easier when they're inevitably on the hook again.
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@BigBlart said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3785712#Comment_3785712
right, but I specifically mentioned being fully healed, not just being tapped by any survivor at all. If you have time to stop and get healed fully directly off of hook, you’re not being tunneled, no?
Ah, but usually when I do get healed under the hook I believe the protection is already off of me.
I personally don't even care to be healed under the hook anymore as the killer typically returns especially if I'm the first person hooked.
As both of the previous people say, another person healing you shouldn't affect your protection whether it's from the built-in protection of the game or simply your perks being deactivated. Even if you're fully healed, the killer can still hyperfocus on you to continue tunneling you out as it's easier to win when there's one less survivor.
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The idea is that if you're healing another survivor or healing yourself, it's a conspicuous action as you're not actively being tunneled or having an engagement with the killer.
People heal right underneath hooks in regular gameplay, so it wouldn't make sense to just have you being healed remove your protection.
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@LadyOwO said:
Basically this. She was given absolutely no downsides at all. Increases hatchet wind-up, increased speed while holding a readied up hatchet, AND is now able to hold 7 hatchets?! Plus with her beach ball sized hatchet hit boxes she almost never misses any shot...
To be fair, I believe they reverted the change where she could have faster movement when moving with a readied up hatchet.
That was due to no counterplay as she's supposed to lose speed when drawing her hatchet, but I do think she need a speed boost for hatchet wind-up speed as I played her prior to her nerf.
The hatchets amount was added due to Infantry Belt being a popular add-on, which Behavior believed she needed as an add-on built in.
I think the only thing I could think of changing about her is her hatchet hitbox - I would argue that Deathslinger and Trickster are harder to master due to how precision based their hits need to be, whereas Huntress has more leeway to hit her shots in otherwise due to the bad hitbox size or latency related.
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@HexHuntressThighs said:
and when you leave them in the ground because you know they have DS, they complain about slugging.
Yeah, it's a cycle... Hit them and stay on them, it's tunneling.
Slug them in case of DS, you're being a douche for leaving them on the ground. It's like a double edge sword and regardless, you'll be called a tunneler or camper which is why I said earlier... unless you're great at looping and don't mind to get hooked AGAIN, I wouldn't bother for the average survivor.
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@NarkoTri1er said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3785146#Comment_3785146
if they are very well aware of what they are doing, you are going to lose against them most of the time, since anti-tunneling builds are the most powerful builds in existence when used aggressively.
I think that's a bit arguable as it depends on when a person actually does it.
If it's at the beginning of the game and someone throws themselves at the killer and they're not generally good at looping, I'd argue that it's practically throwing the game in a way.
If it's further into the match and gens have popped, I would argue that it is indeed a play as my duo sometimes does that when gens need to be pressured, but overall I would not recommend throwing yourself at the killer unless you feel you can loop for an extra gen to pop during your chase.
I use OTR sometimes and I like to kinda troll the killer by pretending to do a gen and taking chase that way, notice how I'm not throwing myself at the killer though. It's a very risky play that sometimes works, but it can make the game harder as the key to winning as killer in some cases is simply to tunnel a survivor out and cause a 1v3 to happen.
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@Dustin said:
Age old conversation but personally as someone who quit maining Nurse early on because I felt guilty this is one of the few changes I'd like to see for her. Realistically you won't really get stunned in most cases anyway it's just salt on a survivor when you stun the Nurse and she just shrugs it off and blink strikes you anyway. You basically need a teammate to come assist you in this case.
I'd like to see pallets put her power on CD until she has fully recovered and then it charges like normal. Yes that would just be like an extra second or so at most for a survivor to run but it's better than what it is now. I would be in favor of DS and Headon also doing this as well.
If Plague can get a nerf like this for their power I don't see why it shouldn't apply to Nurse who is just more consistent throughout the entire game. Yes apples and oranges but tell me how many times as Nurse do you get stunned outside of headon and DS? Realistically probably little to none. Get stunned with DS or Headon? Legitimately as soon as both stuns end you can usually close the distance with the survivor immediately after the stun is over anyways.
I believe the developers have said that they don't want any perks or items to disrupt a killer's power due to the implementation of how it would affect other killer's and their powers.
I wouldn't be opposed to Nurse having a cooldown if hit with any stun, but I feel pallet stuns are a more practical compromise to at least introduce some counterplay to Nurses who freely blink through pallets without any repercussions.
Hell, Blight loses his rushes if he gets pallet stunned through a pallet - I don't understand why Nurse can always just outright ignore a fundamental part of the game due to her teleportation.
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@LadyOwO said:
I play survivor alot and I can tell you that this would just ruin the nurse. I really don't mind going against them seeing how hard it is to play her effectively
Yeah, I feel like if you don't run in a straight line and dodge and weave behind objects, it's actually quite fun to play against Nurse as it creates a sort of mind game as they're trying to anticipate where you're at behind whatever obstacle you're behind.
I do think the whole pallet stuns would introduce a nice gameplay mechanic for skill expression, especially as they removed lightburning to prevent her from blinking. I think that change would actually have Nurses somewhat mindful of pallet stuns instead of just blinking and not being slowed down in any capacity, even if they're pallet stunned... They just recover and hit you anyways.
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@SweetbutaPsycho said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3784968#Comment_3784968
Yeah I totally understand that and dont per se have a problem with survivors trying to make DS work even though the killer doesnt even tunnel them. Waste of a perk slot as you said.
What Im suprised about is how many people that run this combo and play like this, and waste your time by baiting their DS and hitting you with it, get super outraged when they get tunneled after that. Like you more or less try to bait a tunnel, waste your anti tunnel defence on something that was nt originally tunneling and then get mad that you get tunneled.
Had literary every 3-4 games today someone complain about this. Like yeah Im trying really hard to hit you with DS to waste your time but after I pull it off you then have to go chase someone else.That line of thinking just makes no sense to me.
Yeah, it reminds me of a game I played as Trapper and a Nancy would always try to bodyblock with OTR everytime I would try to hit another survivor.
It's mainly because as other people have mentioned that survivors want the most value out of a perk, even if it's generally wasting the killer's time as you have to hit through the OTR and then eat a DS stun if you pick the survivor up.
In that situation, I don't think survivors have the privilege to complain about tunneling if they're actively throwing themselves at you as it's fair game when the killer inevitably downs them again and puts them on the hook as that's the end result of their game plan is anyways.
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@Toystory3Monkey said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3784857#Comment_3784857
again, if you dont like it - go push them out.
if you get bled to death there's nothing you can do except waiting 4 minutes till killer is done feeding their ego.
idk why is that so hard to understand. that's the core issue and that's why bleeding people to death is problematic.
Yeah, I don't understand this argument about survivors teabagging at the exit gate.
When I play killer, typically I just either go mess around on the map to break pallets or force them out or chill around as the endgame collapse timer ends the game.
It's not about the control a survivor feels when they're at the exit gates and the endgame collapse timer isn't the same as being bled out for four minutes as the other survivor waits for the other to die to get a chance at surviving through hatch.
People typically wait at the exit gates to make sure that each survivor makes it to the gate accordingly. Yeah, some survivors will wait at the gate to deliberately teabag at the exit gate but I never understood getting upset at it and from my experience from seeing the teabags at the gate, it's usually a tunneled survivor teabagging in jest as a "you couldn't catch me" type of jab if anything.
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@Ohyakno said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3784797#Comment_3784797
Usage rate do not tell the whole story. BBQ and lethal are good on huntress, by far the most popular killer. That skews the rate of usage by itself. Knockout has a pick rate around unrelenting. Is it problematic? Yes. Should it be reworked? Also yes. Trying to defend unhealthy stuff by pick rates is a one dimensional argument. Means very little. You've got this fixation on usage rates because it's easy. Point at number. Make argument. Ignore context.
Like I just told you, gearhead by itself, will not deplete distortion tokens vs standard terror radius killer. I've tested this. Assuming the survivors in my lobbies were being honest they rarely ran out of tokens.
Of course I care about survivor gameplay. What I don't care about is constantly equating one sides stuff with another sides stuff. It's like people screeching for respawning pallets because hooks respawn. It's like comparing Zanshin with Windows when they obviously do very different things because each side interacts with the same information differently.
I don't want distortion to not exist. I've gotta be one of the only people who used distortion when it didn't regenerate tokens. What I want is for it to not be infinite perk denial vs standard terror radius killers. Make tokens regenerate slower. Make them only regenerate in/out of chase. Give one per gen/unhook/successful heal action. Whatever doesn't punish killers for existing on the map.
It's not infinite perk denial, however? I've given you alternatives, but it's not the perk that YOU want to run, which is the issue that we're having.
If you did care about survivor gameplay, you wouldn't minimize what I'm saying with the "b-b-but survivors" schtick you did earlier.
I bring up the statistics because obviously Distortion has decreased in popularity, since Finesse has came out and people started to use the vault speed build again.
I like how you don't respond to when I asked how to counter a popular aura reading perk, that's not even including Nowhere To Hide which is also number 6.
I wonder why Distortion had/has a high usage rate when the top most used perks are always a combination of two aura reading and two regression perks? 🤔
You acting like Huntress is the main culprit of how BBQ & Lethal are highly regarded when we have full aura reading Nurses, BBQ/Lethal Hillbillies, Spirits, and Blights who utilizes the aura reading combo to create a snowball effect on solo-queue is baffling.
I don't know why you want to add some type of "reward" to earn a Distortion token. We already have enough survivor perks where you have to do x action to earn whatever benefit the perk wants to give you. Additionally, making it so that you regain tokens from being chased by the killer will just put you in a situation where if you're not chased by the killer, you won't even earn the Distortion tokens back.
Like I said, if Distortion gets nerfed - there has to be a way to counterplay the ginormous amounts of aura reading perks and aura add-ons that killers run. Either reduce the effects of these popular perks/add-ons or introduce a universal signal in the bottom right hand screen that your aura was read, but your aura still is shown to the killer. You can't have it both ways where you always get value out of your perks when I run a healing build and get a Plague. 🤷🏾♀️
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@Ohyakno said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3784778#Comment_3784778
I run aura perks on doctor..... because it's fun. I run alien instinct because it's fun, not because it's good. It's still nice to get a modicum of value from my dumb gimmick builds. Until it feels frustrating because a single perk disables them.
Gearhead by itself will not disable distortion vs a standard terror radius killer. You'd need at least two other aura perks to do that.
It's not in the top ten but it's up there with kindred and we'll make it, notably good perks. You're gonna see at least one in the majority of your games. If you had a game with 2-3 it's absolutely crippling to aura perks.
Finally yeah, you're right. I can keep running stall perks. But I'd really like to get reliable value on more interesting perks. That's not possible with distortion in it's current iteration. Again harming perk diversity. Distortion is bad for the game. Frankly I don't care about "b-b-but survivors!!!" That's a different topic entirely.
Finally finally I never said it ruins build variety. I said it harms it. You can still run aura perks on stealth killers or ones with substandard terror radii and get good results. It'd be nice if more killers could get value out of the perks though. Increasing build variety.
I don't understand why you're being confrontational when I used the same argument you said for killer builds.
That's nice and dandy that you like to run aura reading perks on Doctor, but if you really like to use aura reading perks that directly affects Distortion users, go ahead and use Gearhead.
When you mentioned BBQ and Chili and Lethal Pursuer, which ARE in the top ten killer perks for KILLER and say that you want to use "interesting perks" that are undoubtedly META perks, I don't know why you're getting upset about a NON-META perk such as Distortion with it having less than 10% usage rate.
If you don't care about survivor gameplay, then don't use Distortion as an argument that it *harms* killer builds when you're using (#3 BBQ and Chili ((16.03%)) and #4 Lethal Pursuer ((also 16.03%)) as YOUR example.
It sounds like you want NO counterplay to your aura reading builds other than just hide in a locker or go in a different direction but what's the counterplay to Lethal Pursuer??
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@Ohyakno said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3784717#Comment_3784717
The problem with distortion is that it negates aura reading perks entirely and pushes killers toward more reliable perks.
Let's say I'm playing doctor with lethal and BBQ. Vs a distortion player this is a permanent disabling of two or my perks. There's no way I can burn through the tokens fast enough to actually use my perks on a distortion user. It only takes a couple of games of having your perks not work against 1-4 members of a team for you to say screw it and switch to surge, pain res, overcharge, whatever. Stuff you know will at least do something.
It hurts build variety and perk diversity. The only time I've ever ran out of distortion tokens is vs a wraith with a few aura perks or a huntress with a full aura build. God help you if you want to run a weak aura perk by itself like alien instinct. There's a good chance you load into a game where it straight up doesn't work and will never work on half the team.
If you want to burn through Distortion tokens fast enough, run Gearhead.
Gearhead has no issues burning through Distortion tokens as even experienced players cannot consistently hit great skill checks to avoid Distortion stacks to replenish.
Your argument that it ruins killer build variety can be the same argument towards survivor build variety as well.
Like I've mentioned in my previous post, Distortion only rose in popularity due to the introduction of aura reading perks and it isn't in the top ten most used perks.
I'm saying this as a person who doesn't really use Distortion since they've mentioned that they were going to tweak the perk, the only time that I actively use Distortion is when I'm playing with my duo so I'm not necessarily biased in this area.
EDIT: I was in a game, so I couldn't complete my thoughts.... But if you want to run gen regression because it's more reliable than aura reading perks, you're well in your regard to do that. I highly doubt that you're running into 2 Distortion players in a single game that prevents the game from you finding survivors. In your example, as I have played Doctor, I don't know why you would necessarily equip aura reading perks on him as he has pretty much on demand information due to his static blast.
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@GetSacrificalWarded said:
Lately, I have been thinking about Distortion and how it works. To make it clear, it is not overpowered nor too weak, but I believe that it is not fun for both the survivors who don't have it and the killer.
Distortion does two things: it hides you from aura reading for every token, allowing you to play stealthily, and it lets you know when your aura is being read. These two aspects are fine and should be in the game, but the way they are implemented presents some issues:
The player hides from the killer if they have a few aura perks, but against specific aura reading perks, the tokens drain super fast. This means that killers are kind of forced to run specific perks if they want to use aura reading (like Gearhead, for example). It is not good to basically have to bring an extra perk just to avoid having your other perk countered, while simultaneously, Distortion runs out of tokens and becomes useless when facing a fully optimized aura build. This situation makes off-meta killer aura reading less attractive because now you have to build your setup around it.
The stealth it provides, when it works, is a bit too strong and passive. It basically hides you completely from the killer if he is using aura without requiring you to do anything on your part, which incentivizes the killer to tunnel the survivors they can find. It also hides your scratchmarks which i feel is fair but the survivor doesn't need to use that because the killer does not get any info on where he is.
If you are playing solo queue, you cannot communicate the most important part of the perk to your team—the information on when your aura is being read. This kind of forces everyone to run it if they want that information. It would be better if it benefited solo queue in the same manner.
My solution: Remove the token system; now it works for all aura reading (solving the issue of tokens draining too fast against specific perks and builds, thus incentivizing variety in killer builds). Instead of completely hiding your aura for no cost it makes you audibly scream (or better yet just triggers a loud noise notification for everyone, including survivors, so it doesn't interrupt your actions), giving a notification to all survivors and revealing your approximate location to the killer as a loud noise notification. This would allow the killer to know roughly where you are but still give you a chance to hide (especially if the killer is far away and with the fact you leave no scratch marks). This also stops the really annoying parts of aura reading, such as the counter to mind games in chases while not completely hiding you against specific perks(so the killer still gets some value), and it allows your teammates to know when your aura is being attempted to be read, even if you are not on comms with them. This would actually be stronger than the current iteration in regards to chases because it completely shuts down the ability for killers to see your aura mid chase and circumvent the mind game (now you can run out of tokens) while simultaneously it would just help a bit with long distance aura reading without shutting them down (since perks like bbq are basically used to get the rough location anyways) by letting your team know when it happens and letting you hide easier(no scratchmarks and instead of an aura they just get the loud noise notification so you can hide easier but have to actively hide and outsmart the killer). It would be more interactive (no more people just putting it on and hopping to not get found but they would have to actively hide), work better for solo queue and it would stop this rock paper scissors thing where it counters some perks completely but some aura reading builds(usually the strong ones) counter it completely.
I like the stealthy playstyle but i think it should require the survivor to outsmart the killer actively just like the loop based playstyle does. i will say what i said in the beginning again: I don't believe the current perk is too strong nor too weak but i believe it is just not interactive nor fun enough.
I usually play killer, so I might be completely wrong, but I feel like I’ve come up with a decent idea here. This would even soft-counter the weave meta because you have infinite tokens, and the clueless solo queue players will see the constant loud noise notifications and move the item away. what do you think?
@GetSacrificalWarded said:
Lately, I have been thinking about Distortion and how it works. To make it clear, it is not overpowered nor too weak, but I believe that it is not fun for both the survivors who don't have it and the killer.
Distortion does two things: it hides you from aura reading for every token, allowing you to play stealthily, and it lets you know when your aura is being read. These two aspects are fine and should be in the game, but the way they are implemented presents some issues:
The player hides from the killer if they have a few aura perks, but against specific aura reading perks, the tokens drain super fast. This means that killers are kind of forced to run specific perks if they want to use aura reading (like Gearhead, for example). It is not good to basically have to bring an extra perk just to avoid having your other perk countered, while simultaneously, Distortion runs out of tokens and becomes useless when facing a fully optimized aura build. This situation makes off-meta killer aura reading less attractive because now you have to build your setup around it.
The stealth it provides, when it works, is a bit too strong and passive. It basically hides you completely from the killer if he is using aura without requiring you to do anything on your part, which incentivizes the killer to tunnel the survivors they can find. It also hides your scratchmarks which i feel is fair but the survivor doesn't need to use that because the killer does not get any info on where he is.
If you are playing solo queue, you cannot communicate the most important part of the perk to your team—the information on when your aura is being read. This kind of forces everyone to run it if they want that information. It would be better if it benefited solo queue in the same manner.
My solution: Remove the token system; now it works for all aura reading (solving the issue of tokens draining too fast against specific perks and builds, thus incentivizing variety in killer builds). Instead of completely hiding your aura for no cost it makes you audibly scream (or better yet just triggers a loud noise notification for everyone, including survivors, so it doesn't interrupt your actions), giving a notification to all survivors and revealing your approximate location to the killer as a loud noise notification. This would allow the killer to know roughly where you are but still give you a chance to hide (especially if the killer is far away and with the fact you leave no scratch marks). This also stops the really annoying parts of aura reading, such as the counter to mind games in chases while not completely hiding you against specific perks(so the killer still gets some value), and it allows your teammates to know when your aura is being attempted to be read, even if you are not on comms with them. This would actually be stronger than the current iteration in regards to chases because it completely shuts down the ability for killers to see your aura mid chase and circumvent the mind game (now you can run out of tokens) while simultaneously it would just help a bit with long distance aura reading without shutting them down (since perks like bbq are basically used to get the rough location anyways) by letting your team know when it happens and letting you hide easier(no scratchmarks and instead of an aura they just get the loud noise notification so you can hide easier but have to actively hide and outsmart the killer). It would be more interactive (no more people just putting it on and hopping to not get found but they would have to actively hide), work better for solo queue and it would stop this rock paper scissors thing where it counters some perks completely but some aura reading builds(usually the strong ones) counter it completely.
I like the stealthy playstyle but i think it should require the survivor to outsmart the killer actively just like the loop based playstyle does. i will say what i said in the beginning again: I don't believe the current perk is too strong nor too weak but i believe it is just not interactive nor fun enough.
I usually play killer, so I might be completely wrong, but I feel like I’ve come up with a decent idea here. This would even soft-counter the weave meta because you have infinite tokens, and the clueless solo queue players will see the constant loud noise notifications and move the item away. what do you think?
I personally don't understand the fuss about Distortion given that it actually has went down in usage rate (it's 8.73% usage rate at the moment on Nightlight.gg) and no longer in the top ten most used perks.
I do believe that the perk had an uptick in usage rate when killers would bring aura reading perks, especially because the last few killers we've had (Xenomorph, Chucky, and Vecna) all three came with aura reading perks with the introduction of Ultimate Weapon, Friends 'Til The End, and Weave Attunement.
I think if Distortion does get some nerf, there needs to be more counterplay to your aura being read other than just get better at looping and I say that as a person who can loop at tiles.
Dead By Daylight needs to allow different playstyles and even though there's the idea floating around that Distortion players do nothing but hide all game, I don't find that to be the case in the games that I play. People will rat and do nothing even if Distortion didn't exist and just because you have an aura reading perk doesn't mean you need to ALWAYS get value from it. There's three other survivors in the game and it's already easy enough to find them in plain sight (the game isn't dark by any stretch of the imagination) or finding scratch marks.
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@Official_hilbert said:
I will commend BHVR on their recent works toward better quality of life changes for the game, such as removing the depiping system or changing the requirement to get adept killer. With this however, I still feel like there are some more things that need to be changed as I feel like they would greatly improve gameplay for both killer and survivors.
Firstly, the removing of lockers next to vault locations and pallets. There have been so many games where I’m being chased by a killer (or am chasing a survivor) and thinking I’m close enough to the pallet or window I press the input for action and get sucked into a nearby locker. This is beyond frustrating as this now gives the killer a free hook for a mistake. There is no changing the input either as on both console and pc, actions are set for both vaulting/pallets and entering lockers. The Game, yamaoka estate and groaning storehouse maps have these issues and need to be changed. There’s shouldn’t be two action inputs right next to each other.
Secondly, this leads into my other issue. Make grabs universal across the game. A while back, they removed the ability to grab survivors going for an unhook. At the time I thought it was a great idea but lately I’ve been wondering if that was the best decision. Looking at how killers grab you, the only way you get grabbed in most situations is to be injured. You can’t grab a survivor off a pallet or window unless they’re injured, with the only exception being pulled out of a locker. However this isn’t ideal either as if you fast vault out of a locker you can still be grabbed. This issue is mainly used for countering some killers with insta down abilities like leatherface. In some situations you’re only hope of avoiding a chainsaw is to hop in a locker but you have to time the hop out as to not be downed. If you’re even a millisecond too late he can just grab you. It’s a frustrating mechanic that doesn’t have any real consistency. So my change would be that you can only grab survivors if they’re injured. In any situation, from pallets and windows to even when they unhook or hop out of a locker. If survivors are healthy they can only be hit with a basic attack, this would make grabs universal and bring back unhook grabs, making it so teams have to work together to heal up before going for an unhook.
Finally my last QoL change would be to generators regressing. The biggest issue I have with regressing is how a regressing generator can be regressed again. For example if you’re using the perk surge, the first down regresses the gen, but if no one touches the gen and another survivor goes down, the gen regresses again despite already regressing. As both a killer and survivor main I don’t see why it does this. On the survivor side I don’t like having more progress taken off when it already is losing it. As for killer, ever since they intorduced the new entity blocker for gens, every regression counts. I don’t like to have my gen reach max regression and suddenly can’t anymore because of the perks I use. I havnt used surge for that reason. Along with, if I down a survivor and have both surge and pain resonance, there’s a chance that both perks can activate on the same gen and now I’ve lost 2 of the 8 kicks I have on that gen left. It would be nice if once a gen starts regressing it can’t be “kicked” again until it’s stopped. Allowing for your other regression perk to go to another gen that has more progress on it.
Those are just some of my ideas for quality of life changes. Let me know what you think, I’d like to hear your thoughts. Thanks for reading.
The first change I do agree with even if it's sorta rare for me to jump into a locker while in a chase.
The last two I don't agree with, even as a person who plays survivor a lot (I've also played killer).
If a person goes into a locker, let's say they're doing a gen, and they get grabbed out of a locker. I don't believe that a survivor should just be injured if they're in the healthy state. If you're caught in a locker, you ran the risk of being in the locker when you know the killer can check it and hook you if you're found.
Even though I think Surge has been buffed due to the smaller map size and generators being pushed together, I don't think limiting gen regression perks is the way to go.
Even as killer, generators do in fact go too fast in some instances and putting limitations on perks that incentivize downs to put pressure on generators just because a generator was affected by it doesn't mean that the generator should simply be blocked.
Again, I agree with your first point - in fact I believe there should a surplus of lockers in the game to help Trickster and Huntress players, while giving more counterplay to BBQ and Chili, and as you said away from vaults to reduce accidentally going into a locker.
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Yeah, I agree.
Map offerings need to be reworked to make it so that it's specifically banning the maps, rather than making it so that you specifically needed to go to the map realm a person burns an offering for. I think it would help with the RNG aspect and actually make map offerings more versatile in cases of multiple people running map offerings, rather than just a russian roulette of which map out of x number are we going to go to.
Map offerings offer too much value for both sides - killers for (Midwich, Haddonfield, RPD) while for survivors (MacMillan, Ormond, Red Forest).
On the contrary, I personally despise Eeyrie of Crows due to the nasty three gens that are set up and hard to break due to its small size (just my opinion). I honestly feel quite claustrophobic on the map as everything spawns so close together outside of main. I think the game would flow better, rather than people dcing during loading just because the killer brought Midwich.
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@Marc_go_solo said:
This was the perfect "casual" mode (if it can be called that), and it was a lot of fun. This could be brought back as the first permanentalternative mode, even if it's restricted to perks you already have. Make add-ons and offerings random, and I admit I'd probably not be looking back.
I agree, I played the game mode a lot as it was quite fun seeing what perks you ended up with.
It was nice not playing against meta and as a person who always switches up their builds - I found it a breath of fresh air compared to their previous game modes that they introduced.
Additionally, I believe the queues for both survivor and killer were not as bad as "Lights Out" and 2v8. -
First of all, there's more to survivor gameplay than just "holding down a button" for gen speed boost.
People coordinate saves, mind-game at loops, unhook survivors, and heal survivors whether under the hook or from basic traversal of the map and finding them.
There's a lot more involved than just holding down a button uninterrupted on a gen, especially in solo-queue where it's less coordinated than a SWF team.
I don't particularly disagree with slugging or tunneling, even if it involves me being the victim of it.
However, pushing the idea that people have to tab out of a game or simply put the controller down so you can have an easier 4k during a video game that people play is counterintuitive.
Do you want the last survivor to be aura read when you slug? I don't really understand your reasoning of tabbing out and just forfeiting a game as it goes into a new phase of the game called, "endgame collapse," as I'm sure you're aware of.