CaulDrohn
CaulDrohn
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Nurse, hands down. Only play her if i got a daily i cannot switch, and even then very reluctantly. Won't bring any perks or addons with me, bc I just refuse to waste BP on her after i P3'ed her ^^.
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@Deadeye said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1812837#Comment_1812837
As I said, if you buff it, you will fix it for Undying only. And for the VERY RARE games where the killer runs multiple aura reading perks. Games with 0 aura readinds are more common than 3+. Buff Distortion and you get aura immunity against the more common games where the killer only runs BBQ or only runs Nurses.
Just roughly calculate. The most games have like 9 hooks and the first kill is about hook number 6 or 7. Subtract the up-to-2 hooks when you get hooked and obviously are within 40m of the hook. So 5-6 Distortion stacks would already be enough to completely counter BBQ aura reading. And how many times do you heal within 28m of the killer? 3 stacks is already enough to completely counter Bitter Murmur, because you don't sit on every gen that gets completed.
I would say three tokens max is fine, but there needs to be a way of replenishing them. There are multiple ways to do so. It could be working like Stake Out and Diversion, slowly filling up when in TR but not chased. It could work like WGLF, for each unhook or protection hit, but that might be to much. Maybe only one token for each unique unhook, that would result in maximum of three recharge token. Or you gotta finish a gen to get one back. Or, totally scrap the tokens, and give it a one minute cooldown.
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Having a single person escape though the hatch is fine for me, I can shrug it off easily. But having three survivors with comms on one gen remaining, all crouching through the map so they can all escape through the hatch, thats the epitome of unfairness for me when playing killer.
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@sulaiman said:
Well, take a team without any means of communication in this game, on whatever skill level they play.
Then, give them communication. IF you dont believe that their performance, on whatever skill level they play, is improving, i think you are very underrating the impact of swf.
also with your same argument, moris didn´t need a change, because not every killer used them. Sure, there were the one that hooktunnel of the first hook, but they were rare, and maybe could have won without the mori.
Something unbalanced is not balanced through being rare.
First af all, you are mixing SWF with comms now. Sure swf nearly always will have comms, but the issue lies in using the comms, not in playing as swf. Even randoms can have comms if they coordinate it in pre-game lobby. And regarding comms, you have no way to prevent this, bc it is out of scope of the game.
Of course their perfomance will increase with comms, why should I deny that? But I question the implication that this "comm upgrade" makes them op (again, in a general sense). It doesn't, bc comms cannot compensate skill or game sense and bc miscommunication happens. And really good survivor teams do not even need comms to destroy you as a killer, even with 4 randoms.
Moris needed this change bc the promoted very unhealthy gameplay (aka tunnel-for-mori). If all killers would always have played it "fair", this change would not have been necessary. With SWF alone, there is no "unfair" usage, that "unfair" usage gets introduced with comms, again. And even then, it's just not as unhealthy as "unfair" mori usage was. And, to repeat myself, there's just no way to prevent comms.
So we have to live with it, swf with comms is a thing, sometimes op in the right survivor hands, but on average manageable (imo). It won't go away, it cannot be fixed (the comms), it won't be removed (the swf part) (bc that would really kill the game).
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@sulaiman said:
I admit, the mori change was needed because they were op. But what about the other side of the equation? There is a very broken and op part on the survivor side, that is not being adresses. And thats swf. And i doubt that it ever will be adressed, but its the most broken and unbalanced part of the game.
And this disparity in adressing issues is what some players have a problem with (i for one, and i am a survivor main who used to play killer every now and then)
I think you are overrating the impact of SWF a bit, to be honest. Sure there are swat teams out there which can destroy nearly every killer, but they are rare, and they could do so even without comms. They are just insanely good players. Still SWF is harder to beat, thats for sure, but a well coordinated teams of randoms can also be difficult to handle. SWF tend to be way more altruistic, esp. casual ones, not wanting to leave someone behind. You can exploit that as a killer. SWF can be very strong, and will have the edge over weaker killers, but on average it's not op. It really comes down to the individual skill of the swf members. If anything, having to face four coordinated skillful survivors (not meaning comms here, but general game sense!) with a weak killer is OP, but that has nothing to do with SWF. Comms are by no means a sure path to victory. If you miscommunicate via your comms, you will do more harm then good (have proven that multiple times in my games with my wife xD).
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@SaintDorks said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1810884#Comment_1810884
Getting jerked off does not make one reasonable mate.
And insulting someone does?
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@noctis129 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1811827#Comment_1811827
But the list I gave u was not from 2017, it's since 2017 til 2019. They also butchered trapper, the doctor, and lullaby on top of the ones I mentioned earlier. Sure they might of buffed bubba, and made some changes to other killers that I would categorize as neutral changes. But saying that it's the same level of buff compare to nerfing them is far fetched.
I am a survivor main. I don't care for it that much to go do back research and give u recent list. I know there's more becuz everyone here was complaining about the amount of killer nerfs. I mean my life is easier due to all the killer butchering but I am not bias. This game is just too easy for survivors. Killers need to be OP.
The list you posted is just deprecated, and does not really work in proving your pointI had a quick glance at it, it stated STBFL was nerf. It was indeed, but got a buff to it's current state again to make it useful again. Just as an example.
Where the hell was trapper butchered, what do you mean, same with doctor? They were both buffed (trapper got an addon pass and faster trap placements some years ago, doctor rework was a massive improvement). I honsetly don't know what you are talking about. If you would say Pig, she got passively nerfed with introduction of EGC (another thing more favorable for killers, btw!).
On a site note: You do know that "butchering" means something like "nerfing severly to a (nearly) unplayable state", right? Doctor is nowhere near unplayable, he's very solid. Trapper is weaker, but still playable without any issues.
Saying Lullaby was butchered is also a far fetch. Yes it does not affect healing anymore, but it no longer shows in hud even with zero stacks. So you could say it's a neutral change. On top of that, Lullaby was never a great perk to begin with, so there's no great impact.
"made some changes to other killers that I would categorize as neutral changes"
Yes they also did this, but I did not even give an example for it! Prime example would be recent Pyramid Head changes. But the other things I mentioned were actual bufffs. Oni got his flick added (granted it was removed after PTB, if I remember right). GF got some minor buffing number changes and a big one, adding Undetectable state, which also buffed other stealth killers. Blights addons were totally reworked between PTB and live. Yes his aura-read addon was then nerfed afterwards, but that was to be expected, since it legitly was to strong. Recently he got his Adrenaline Vial changed totally, which makes it better than before.
"But saying that it's the same level of buff compare to nerfing them is far fetched."
But you fail totally in proving this claim! I listed so many major buffs, besides all the smaller ones I added later, you posted an outdated list and wrote something like 6 nerfs, half of them questionable (butchering Trapper/Doc) or minor things.
I'll post again a list of major killer buffs / survivor nerfs and ask you to do the same (about killer nerfs, survivor buffs). I'll even add some of the nerfs myself! And then we can discuss if it got easier or more difficult for killers:
+ Freddy Rework - Nurse Rework (questionable, since her range addons were actually broken, but whatever)
+ Doctor Rework - Spirif "Nerfs" (they were so tiny, but whatever)
+ Cannibal Rework - Hillbilly Rework
+ Plague & Clown adjustmens - Pig nerfs due to introduction of EGC
+ EGC + Closable Hatch ?
+ Toolbox Nerfs - Ruin nerf (althoug thats more like a neutral change or even buff)
+ Inst-Heal removal ?
+ Exhaustion Changes ?
+ Undetectable status effect - Myers detectable with Spine Chill / Premonition (but overall it's a net positive for stealth killers)
+ Map reworks ?
+ Undying + Tinkerer Buff - Pop Timer reduction (although that reduction barely makes any difference)
There, eleven impactful changes that made the life for killers significantly easier. Now it's your turn to fill the right column. I'll be waiting.
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Yep, noticed this as well. At least both survivor and kilelr can get up there, so its not critical.
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@Ecstasy said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1811839#Comment_1811839
You heard him devs! Players don't need anymore variety. With 22 killers already, its time to stop cranking out DLC and cosmetics for fat cash injections that only pile up more problems.
You can officially focus on the major bugs and balance issues for a better game now. Variety is totally covered.
Damn good thing these devs aren't greedy at all!
🙄
We certainly do not need a bunch of high-impact offerings on top of our perks, it's already difficult enough to balance levels, powers and perks.
About your sly comment, actually YES: We have enough killers. But BHVR has to earn money to continue developing the game and keep the servers running. That has nothing to do with greed. Major bugs are routinely addressed in hotfixes and mid chapter patches. Balance issues are addressed as well, the mori change is EXACTLY THAT!
Yes cosmetics are pretty expensive, but guess what? You do not have to buy them! I really wonder if the communities of other games ######### the same as DbD or if thats an exclusiv thing. Skins in LoL are also super expensive, Loot-Chests in various other games are pure scam. But BHVR is greedy, yeah right.
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@Warcrafter4 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1811502#Comment_1811502
I don't think this person is worth talking too given them complimenting the survivor main echo chamber in this very thread.
My whole thread is about the communities reaction to an favorable change (bc moris were totally problematic, as recognizes from both sides of the table, the way they ######### the devs for anything they do, just for the sake of complaining (it seems). And after responding to multiple ppl repeating the same skewed view of "killers always only get nerfs", I stated my gratitude to the few ppl that bothered to answer that they share my view. It has NOTHING to do with "survivor mains", you are the one trying to twist it in this direction!
About the one you were talking to, he made a rather stupid remark that "useless addons are boring and limiting our options". Where it is totally justified to point out, that there are already myriads of options available, so having a bunch ob impactful offerings on top is just not necessary! They can remain gimmicky / "useless", esp. when that applies to nearly all oof the orfferings. They are simply not MEANT to be impactful, I would argue, that what perks are for!
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@Poggy said:
Hello all. In an attempt to use as much hard data as possible to distill down the most neutral map for our DBD league finals coming up, we created this spreadsheet.
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1zlFTsZFd8TIerYmkq6ummTDoqPUUluAmF3TeQ42An10/edit#gid=0
The first page distills based on square meters per hook. More hooks per sqm. = Killer bias, less = Survivor bias. Purple-ish is neutral.
Of those that were neutral, we then go to the next metric (sheet 2 at the bottom) which is consideration of infinite looping potential. Those are then excluded and the final metric we used was the old kill rate data within range of 40-45% Kill Rate for the maps.
We determined that the 3 maps we would like to use are
Gas Heaven, Blood Lodge, and Coal Tower.
Other considerations had us rule out The Thompson House, Dead Dawg Saloon, and Rancid Abattoir.
This is all from data we have available from the Wiki as well as that released by BHVR that we could find. What other data should we have factored in? What other information has BHVR released that we may have missed? What do you think of our method for determining neutrality potential?
Thanks for reading and I hope you find this useful or helpful!
Poggy
Is it new ormond or old one? Bc with the new iteration, I encountered actual hook dead zones multiple times. On one long border of the map were a total of three hooks. If you used just one of these hooks for a sacrifice, and another survs goes down right at the already destroyed hook (so not at the edeg at all), there was literally no way to hook them, bc the nearest hook was just to far away.
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@SavouryRain said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1810638#Comment_1810638
Yeah, Killers get "suckerpunched way to [sic] many times now" with all the survivor nerfs and map changes going through to make the game more fair for killers.
The game has literally never been more fair for Killer mains. I'm not arguing whether about the exact state of fairness and balance in DBD, but this argument of killers being unfairly targeted by devs is flat out wrong.
Exactly. How one can proclaim that killer game play is so bad when it is in the best state it has ever been is beyond me.
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@Emeal said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1811499#Comment_1811499
making more useless offerings is not a good thing, its boring and limiting of our options.
You have 75 perks and 22 different killers. What more variety do you need?
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@noctis129 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1811422#Comment_1811422
What buffs did killers get? U asked for a list... And I don't want to research all that so, I guess that's on me.
I already wrote that in another response, let me quote myself:
"Taking the survivor side, are you for real? Freddy Buff, Doctor Buff, InstaHeal nerf, Toolbox changes, map reworks (most recent Ormond, oh all the whining), Hex:Undying. I would even say Ruin change was for the better. How on earth can you claim the devs are survivor sided? The last two years shifted the game from heavily survivor sided to more or less even now (with SWF being favor for survivors, and soloQ in favor for the killer). Sure killer got some nerfs as well, and survivors some buffs, but claiming victimhood only for poor killers is so far off the bat that it's not even funny anymore."
And thats only the major things. Let me add some more:
Cannibal Buff (yes i know billy was butchered instead), together with a heavy Tinkerer buff. Plague having a fountain by default. Clown slowdown on through removed. Oni, GF, and Blight all were buffed from their PTB versions and even received some minor buffs / tweaks in following patches. Buffs to various non-meta/niche/meme perks like Franklins,Mindbreaker, Cruel limits. Going more back in the past we also have Trapper, Wraith and Hag adjustements, which made them all stronger (although the first two are still pretty weak).
So, I have done my job and listed killer buffs of the recent years / last months. Now you can come and list me your nerfs. I'm waiting.
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@HarlowXRaven said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1810818#Comment_1810818
It wasn't fine but honestly, maybe they should just remove keys and mori then the useless arguments would end.
I wouldn't even mind them removing both. Only hatch has to stay to prvevent hostage situation.
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@Emeal said:
I hate Offerings with limited usefulness.
I want SOME usefulness or why should I use the Offering?
So now it's in line with the other useless offerings :P /i
You use the offering to get a daily done, bc you like the animation, or you are afraid of late game DS. Easy :)
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@MissRememberMe said:
For the 100th time, yes we are all on agreement that moris were op and needed a nerf. But at this point it coukd be better NOT to run them. Like, the Mori anination takes so much time. Usually it is faster just to hook them. We wanted moris nerfed, not turned into a meme.
There are plenty of ways they could jave been changed that would have kept some pressure but not kill off survivors too soon.
Yes, this IS a lazy nerf.
Yes, Moris ARE useless now.
Let me ask you a question, and I totally mean it, I genuinely want to know, no trolling:
Why do you feel / think a mori has to be powerful? Why may it not be "useless" apart from the killing animation?
I honestly do not understand whats so important about it or whats so bad about it if moris are "just a meme".
I have the feeling this is the main discord in this situation, ppl like me who do not care whether a mori is "useless" since it's mainly just about the killing animation, and ppl like you who still want their mori to be powerful enough to have an impact (assuming here). For one fraction, the loss of impact is a non-issue, so the change is perfectly fine. For the other fraction, nerfing mori (too much) is a sacrilege, making the change totally unbearable.
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@pseudechis said:
I broke out the Mori's in a big way last night to see how it was and I have to say it doesn't make that much of a difference.
The big key is that where once it was possible to quickly mori 4 people now you'll probably only end up mori'ing 1-2 later in the game for the hell of it.
The two big losses I see about the ebony mori now are...
I feel its kinda overpriced BP wise given its sizable reduction in game impact.
I can no longer use it to quickly punish that one really obnoxious survivor who is hell bent on just being an annoying prick all game (constant noise spamming, unnecessary body blocking, flashlight clickity click etc). That is how I used to use them, this one guy is killing my game experience, bury them and then play a relaxed casual fun game with who's left. Now I am forced to interact with that prick for longer which is a reduction in overall game enjoyment, bummer. (and before anyone says maybe they behave like that because I brought a mori, I'll say this people who behave like that will do it no matter what, they are wankers in general and even if I bring a mori it doesn't justify their crap, just as keys don't justify me being a jerk to the key user).
Also people seem just as angry about them when you bring one, even though they have half the impact they used to have, the endgame chat is just as salty and tantrum filled as it was if you had insta-tunneled everyone out in 2 mins with it. I guess whiners are going to whine no matter what happens.
Another "loss" if you will is making the achievement of killing all four exceptionally more difficult. But you could also use DH for that, so ...
A bit overpriced yeah. Maybe the red mori could be downgraded to purple. Otherwise you could argue, offerings overall do not have such a great impact, so it's more or less fair that moris impact was decreased as well.
Yes, not being able to punish annoying players anymore might hurt a bit, I can see that and likely will miss that from time to time. But as a compensation for this loss, I no longer have to dread a hidden offering, bc let's be honest, most of time that meant tunnel-mori time. The instances were the killer did NOT tunnel hooked survivors out of the game with his mori when they COULD have done it was in the single digits for me.
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@Sluzzy said:
Everything being nerfed into oblivion is not a good thing: makes for a boring predictable game. The devs are fault because they are unable to filter the noise and once the baby is given some candy, the cycle continues. That is what is wrong with the game.
Yes because mori games are so much more unpredictable than non mori ones /s.
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@Yords said:
You do make good points, but it still doesn't explain the whole Halloween "event" in October. Or things coup de grace nerf. The devs might not be fully at fault, but remember that they did release a broken chapter intentionally while knowing what could happen.
Yes the event and rushed release were also a bummer for me, and they got some well earned criticism for it. But then they suprised us with this mori nerf, a thing that really delighted me, but then saw that the forum is filled with people bitching that mori were not changed the way they liked and / or were not changed together with keys. No one of these ppl even acknowledging that this recent chance is a huge improvement for survivor game play, even if there may be even better options. Just complaining cause you can. And irrelevant what the devs do, the outcome is always a proof that devs are stupid and greddy. Thats really sickening, all this negativity, when it is actually a real nice change (and I'm saying this as a 70% killer player).
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@noctis129 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1810908#Comment_1810908
https://steamcommunity.com/app/381210/discussions/0/1621724915795099897/
hereis a list I found on simple Google search.
But for me, it started w nerfing killers like Billy when nobody asked for it. To nerfing PGTW, which, nobody asked for. And nerfing mori. And there was a few others but I'm too lazy to track down all the comments and threads.
For real? You are posting a nerf list of 2017? And you want me to take you seriously?
You yourself claimed numerous nerfs in the last three month, but then come up with this? Yes, billy was more or less slaughtered, and I'm not fine with this as well. But cannibal got heavily buffed in the same freakin patch! Nerf to PGTW was not requested, but has no real impact. Morri nerf is just recent. You cheryy pick the few nerfs, and totally neglect the changes that make it easier for killers, so you can claim that killers only get nerfs. If you do not see a problem with that, I can't help you.
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@noctis129 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1810857#Comment_1810857
The other half isn't coming. And unless u been living under a rock, or bias enough to ignore the changes, killers been nerfed for a while. There were numerous threads w all the list.
"The other half is not coming" How do you know that, are you part of the dev team? You are just assuming. But you know what.? I'm willing to take a bet with you! I'm betting that keys get a change in Q1 or Q2 of 2021. So are you betting against that? What would be our wager?
Point me to such a list, then. But please don't confuse bugs with nerfs, that would be emberassing for you.
Also what a way to totally IGNORE the constant killer buffs / survivor nerfs we got the last 2 years, well done sir, well done.
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@noctis129 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1810871#Comment_1810871
Just don't use mori than. Why u gotta ruined it for other ppl.
I didn't, except for dailies.
I did not ruin anything, #########, if any the devs did. And when a thing is problematic / broken, it needs to be adressed. It does not got changed to ruin your fun, quite the opposite. It got changed bc it ruined the fun for others!
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@CLAUDETTEINABUSH @AChaoticKiller @MythMage @Ttwylerr @DoritoHead
It really means alot to me to see other ppl sharing my point of you, when sometimes you get the impression you are the only reasonable person in this forum. Thanks alot :).
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@noctis129 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1810830#Comment_1810830
This is exactly it. Ppl needs to play the role they hate to play, and understand the other side. Otherwise they are just entitled. Making emotional comments and tries to justify it w logic.
If you are directing it to me (the op), let me ensure you that a play more killer than survivor, and STILL really like this mori change! Bc using a mori felt always like a cheap way of winning for me. Now, with this change, i can finally don on a mori without feeling to bad about it, since I know it won't make much of a difference.
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@DoritoHead said:
The title looks like clickbait lol
But anyway I agree. The game's community is the problem in this case.
Yep, it is clickbait, got me there xD.
The title would not have worked as good had i wrote "community" instead of "game", bc the devs are not directly responsible for the community ^^.
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@noctis129 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1810808#Comment_1810808
It was universally agreed that both mori and keys needs a rework. No killer side agreed to only nerfing killers.
And I'm a survivor, not a killer.
There is a constant wave of nerfing killers in the past 3 months. Mori was fine as it was. Its a meme offering.
Yes both need a rework. And the first half was done now, the other will come as well.
Please lay out to me this constant wave of nerfing killers, I'm really interested.
Mori was certainly NOT fine, why should it need a rework then? You even wrote it yourself in the first sentence!
Pls check again your definition of "meme", I fear you do not understand the term. "Memeing" means more like fooling around, best with crude perk builds and playstyles. A killer tunnel-moriing each and every survivor is the exact opposite of a "meme" game, #########.
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@SaintDorks said:
"Another thing I want to point out: This change came totally unexpected, and I guess with good reason: many killer players would have spammed their moris if they knew their moris get nerfed soon. Since the key changes will likely be tested in a PTB, changing both moris and keys together would have exactly the proclaimed effect: As soon as the info gets out that key/mori changes will be tested on next PTB, some killer would begin to spam their moris in their trial, how much fun would that be ... just look at the insta-heal addon changes, lobbies were full of insta-medkits before the changes finally kicked in."
Tbh,It is better people get the last bit of juice out of items they used once and never bother picking up a again then having a hand full of hot trash. Since,well you can't burn items for BPs so they are setting dead in their hands now. Atleast then the game would have a massive spike in killers trying to purge something and never picking It up again.
"Moris are useless now!"
"Yes, they are no longer overpowered and will only have a limited impact now. But why on earth is that a bad thing? Imo, there shouldn't be any short tracks for either side, bc thats bad game design. Moris are fixed in this regard now, keys will follow. Moris are now a fancy way of finishing of an already doomed survivor, the way it always should have been, imo. They can still be used as late game DS counters (the time when DS has the most impact, btw). And finally, quite importantly, a secret offering being used is now no longer a reason to quit on loading or suiciding on hook! Moris still have their use, they just cannot be used anymore to get easy wins."
I honestly only ran moris to purge the game of flashlight taggers..So, now I will just activity camp hooks til they are at teir 2. Because, letting them be unhooked at teir 1 is now a problem since they will just flashlight blast me.
As stated before,they are not gonna change keys they more then likely are gonna settle for a new killer with a hatch related perk (as they normally do) So you are gonna have to waste a slot..Even,then..I think the best way to deal with keys Is,just make frankland's demise work even if survivors put the keys down (or give the killer a stomp on item to break option). You do not have to nerf everything to the ground to solve a problem. Just, use a brain for about 2 seconds.
In terms of why this was kind of goofy relates to the fact of this whole killer lock-in ordeal as well as a bunch of other crap people have had to deal with..Including the new Killer being buggy as sin. And a Konga line of Cosmetics yet some bugs (Including people being unable to move, People hacking/cheating and so on) have not be fixed. In the long line I think figuring out why random people can not move during the game is more important then well adjusting the mori numbers. There are more then likely mutiple ways to make a mori rework without making It " a fancy way of finishing of an already doomed survivor" Which honestly for the price and the punishment (yeah you make less points for a mori) is not worth its red tier. If It is gonna be a hastle to run then make people get triple the points for moring a Survior. Because, It is now no longer a quick clean up at the cost of points..But, basically punishing yourself for a animation..(Which most are still slow as frozen dung). If that is how It is ment to be then every survivor tribute should force the survivors to have more time on each gen by 10 to 20 seconds pre tribute. Cause, that is fair right. Wasting time and all that.
Like that is the problem, there is no reason to run them. The cost is too great. the time wasted is too great. It is counter productive to even run them for a archive quest.
And having a spike in killers all spamming their moris is desirable in any way? No no, nerfing moris out of the blue is a way better solution imo.
Mori for flashlighters feels really overkill, tbh. But whatever, when you want to camp them to second stage, do it. At least the other survs have some time to do gens then.
How do you know they will not change keys, are you part of the team? I find it really arrogant claiming to know what will happen when you are not even involved in the development.
"Konga line of Cosmetics yet seome Bugs" There are different teams, ever heard of that? Or how you put it: "Just use a brain for about 2 seconds"
Less points for mori was esp. the case when tunneling right after hook (bc you loose opportunity to injured/down/hook that person again). If you play normally and use the mori just for the last state, as you have to do now, it does not change so much about the points. Btw., if you say that mori is to expensive now: if you used it for tunnel-mori, you also won't have gotten many points, so it won't have been worth it either. Where is the logic there?
The reason to run it is: 1) Daily, 2) Have some late game DS protection. It's not an ez win anymore, which is a good thing. The cost of 7k BP is negletable compared to all the sh*t you have to grind through. If you can, avoid the moris from now on. For you old, yes the BP are lost, but they are lost as well when mori did not change. Moris may waste time yes, but they did so before as well, so where is the point? Archive quests never required you to use a mori! There was just one where you had to kill one by hand, but that could be achieved with DH. Dailies do.
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@noctis129 said:
I can't wait for the next complaints by entitled survivors!
Mori's are done, I wonder what's next? Let's just keep nerfing killers!
I already stopped playing killer. My killer is now rank 20. Every time I play killer, I get a 4k now without mori. I only play for dailies. Nothing more.
It was universally agreed by both survivors and killers that moris are problematic. Don't make it into a fight between survivors and killers, thats not the point!
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@TheMoth said:
The reason is, people lost all trust in the Devs. Especially Killer mains got suckerpunched way to many times now, so they cant assume the Devs will work to fix the issues they have with the game.
No, all they rightfully see is the Devs once again taking the survivors side and dumping another tool to punish Survivors. I could go on and on about the intention of features and how they are used, but lets stay with the facts for now.
Your explanations revolve around the Devs having any intention to make the game a fun and enjoyable experience. Thats the level of trust most Killer mains have long lost.
Taking the survivor side, are you for real? Freddy Buff, Doctor Buff, InstaHeal nerf, Toolbox changes, map reworks (most recent Ormond, oh all the whining), Hex:Undying. I would even say Ruin change was for the better. How on earth can you claim the devs are survivor sided? The last two years shifted the game from heavily survivor sided to more or less even now (with SWF being favor for survivors, and soloQ in favor for the killer). Sure killer got some nerfs as well, and survivors some buffs, but claiming victimhood only for poor killers is so far off the bat that it's not even funny anymore.
The "lose trust in devs" is another of this BS. If one constantly neglects all positive changes and only hooks themself to the things not working properly, of course they "lose trust" then. Some folks here seem to have a mission to talk down and shame the devs for each and everything, repeating lies like "devs don't care" over and over again (or why did the devs do changes to twins after reported issues form PTB).
I'm more or less a killer main, and I did not lose trust. If anything, the recent mori changes increased my trust in the devs! Bc mori abuse was a really unfun experience which needed to be addressed. Finally it was. And I'm super hyped for upcoming key changes. So please, don't talk on "most" killers behalf if you do not have any information to prove that it's indeed a majoritiy thinking like that. Thats just not true.
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@burt0r said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1810597#Comment_1810597
But now you get the same problem like toolbox and instaheal nerfs. Survivor saw that one side got shot down and can expect, even more so with a potential ptb, their change to come and simply spam all their stashed keys or run more scavenger builds to get the most out of keys or the absence of moris.
This inequal treatment will over long or short kill one sides fun/patience and this game will die.
Yes, some/many will. But like I wrote, killers can try to adjust for it, or just dodge the lobby. Survivors cannot adjust to (old) mori. If they run scavanger builds, they actually waste more time.
It has nothing to do with inequal treatment, thats just entitlement speaking there. All the last patches were changing things here and there, sometime the one side got buffs / nerfs, sometimes the other. And claiming the game will die over this petty business is extreme hyperbole, come on.
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@Greatamygdala said:
How hard is it to code that you just have to change hatch spawn requirements from instead of 3 survivors/1 generator it only spawn when there's one survivor left then go from there for future updates.
I'll take 1 potential survivor escaping over two or three.
I wouldn't mind that either.
But if that's not the route the devs want to take, but doing something more fancy, it will take more time, simple as that. It's still their game, sure we all can make suggestions, but it's still their decision to implement it the way they want.
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@burt0r said:
Here a word from an outside perspez of an already retired (killer)player.
The biggest problem is, like many complaint focus on, the timing.
If they prepped the key changes with orb or without and simply hit moris simultaneously without warning everything would've been fine (except for the whiner you get everytime, flaming about the now "useless" OFFERING).
It would not have hurt to not do anything for a few months longer until keys are done. Moris are a focus of complaints since the beginning and got changed twice, with the promise to look at keys when the FIRST change was done years ago.
If they truly did this for the health of the game, they could've done this easy parameter change in the code months or years ago.
I am going to put on a tinfoil hat and speculate that they did it now, directly in the hot fix to this chapters disaster, to please atleast the bigger side of the community to ease the rage.
Tldr: if keys are so complicated, they could've started working years ago in accordance to their promise with the first moris nerf. Or they could've left moris until keys get done. This nerf is so easily applicable that the argument "it should be done as soon as possible" is ridiculous given they could've done it also years ago.
Like I wrote, key changes likely will require a PTB. So there is no "without warning" for keys. You either have to take the mori changes into the PTB as well, or leave them deliberatly out of ptb and then surprise players with it with the actual patch. But in this scenario, you can bet that players would ######### around why keys got changed and not moris (atleast for the hypothetical PTB). The only true way for hitting both without warning would be both being patched simultanioulsy in a patch without prior PTB. But since the key rework might be a bigger change, that would be really bad practice.
If you want to patch both at the same time, you have to decide: either patch without warning [BAD, bc no PTB for testing], or run PTB [BAD, gives warning to players to spam moris / keys beforehand]. So BHVR decoupled it, mori being patched without warning, keys likely in PTB. The thing is, hitting Moris unexpectedly is far more important than keys. Why? A killer can try to adjust for keys, since he will see them in the lobby. Moris are only seen when the game starts, a survivor cannot adjust to it. And we certainly do not want to have a match.cancelled pandemic because of overused moris.
Why the devs did not do this simply change sooner, thats a valid question. I do not know, the usual answer would be bc. other things were more important. But I guess that they always had the intention to fix both of them somewhat together, but not necessarily in the same patch. They wouldn't just fix moris when they do not have a plan what to do with keys yet. So maybe the key changes are now developed enough that they feel confident to release the mori changes, with key changes following soon after. Thats all my guessing, sure, but would be a reasonable approch, imo.
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@NoOneKnowsNova said:
The way I see it, mainly with the alternative suggestion many people had, is that if a survivor plays immersive, the mori is still having an effect as one survivor isn't making near as much progress to gens. With this it changes nothing.
Did moris need a change? Absolutely, but the alternative was better even if the way survivors played around it was by one playing immersive.
It need not be true immersiveness (meaning someone being useless doing nothing but hiding). Just one player being observant and good at stealth, can totally deny you your mori. Esp. in a 4-man swf, I can see the other three deliberately distracting the killer from the last survivor. For soloQ, sure immersive players will hinder the team in doing progress, so the mori works, somehow, but you still are denied your mori animation.
I guess it comes down to your intention of using the mori. If you use the mori bc you want to kill by hand (e.g. you have a daily), one immersive survivor being able to deny you your mori is a bad thing. If you equip it for slowing down the game, then sure, it would help if the last surv plays more cautiously. Although, finding an immersive player is already a pain in the a**, the hook-all-for-mori might even encourage that playstyle, esp. in soloQ. Not a route I'd lika to take honestly.
Apart from that, sure there may be different opinions about how to fix the moris. But then it should at least be objective and well thought-out, considering pros and cons, in a civil manner. But many other threads about the more change I saw were like "NERF BAD, DEVS DUMB", that does not help anyone.
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@UkilledLegion said:
why survivor can see yellow aura of teammates when he on hook?survivor on hook can give info if play in discord.my opinion its dihonest advantage especially survivors play SWF
Did you even think that through?
Removing the auras would cripple soloQ, and not impact 4-man swf at all! SoloQ wouldn't know anymore when/if someone comes to unhook, wouldn't know where survs do gens (to run their to get healed / work on the same gen), wouldn't know if/where others are being chased. 4-man will just relay all that info via voip. Your suggestion increases the gap between solo and swf, not decreasing it!
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@Kebek said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1805434#Comment_1805434
I think you've mistaken purple tombstone for a pink one as I said I was using the purple one which doesn't slow you down.
Yeah and I don't like to face basic M1 killers while love facing killers like nurse, spirit, PH and slinger that others mostly hate facing. Pips & BP mean extremely little to me but I love using tombstones so I'll use all of them while they are subjectively fun for me to use.
Yes, I confused them, thats right. If you enjoy them, go use them. I was just statint that FOR ME, tombstone does not bring anything enjoyable.
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@Reinami said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1805648#Comment_1805648
Franklins is a terrible counter because of what i said above, just pick up the key and hide it somewhere on the map until you are ready to use it.
If you camp the key it takes 2 minutes. Gens take 80 seconds. What happens when you let 4 survivors do gens undisturbed for 2 minutes?
Not saying that franklins is a GOOD counter, but at least it is an actual one. Mori is NOT.
First of all, they will likely be only 3 survs doing gens, bc one will try to get their key back. Furthermore, survivors tend to play really stupid when you use Franklins, trying to get their items back recklessly although it would be better to just forfeit them. I've experienced this countless times. With mori, the survs will crank out gens like crazy, with Franklins, they fool around trying to get their items back.
Judging from my personal experience, using Franklins against keys nearly always feels satisfying, were using a mori feels stressful, since I have to be fast with kills to even have the chance to use it. Which can be really difficult against good loopers. And even if I mori the key wielder, the key may remain and I have not countered anything.
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@Reinami said:
Why are you nerfing one while not nerfing the other? Nobody disagrees that they both need to be changed. They are both awful for the game. But you can't nerf the only reliable counter to keys, and then leave keys the same. It is going to be miserable for a while now until keys are fixed.
Mori does NOTHING against keys! If you mori the key user, the key will likely be left behind and picked up by another survivor. And by removing one player from the game, the hatch spawns sooner, making it even easier for the survs to escape. If you really want to counter keys, take Franklins and camp the key!
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@Kebek said:
I'm about to use all my 150 purple tombstones before they manage to ruin them too.
Purple tombstonwe is not even that good (bc. you are slowed down), tombstone piece works better. Furthermore, I find tombstone trials to be very boring, for both survivor and killer. And it's a sure way for ALL to depip, besides minimal BP gains. There's just no reason to use tombstone unless you want to get Evil Incarnate.
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No need to disallow moris imo, it screws your emblems so you won't get merciless regardless.
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@chieften333 said:
Oh lord, I never thought about overcharge and oppression, does that work??
Most certainly wonit won't. Overcharge is only applied when damaging a generator by kicking. Opression just lets the other gens regress.
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@kingdingelling said:
I just did it again this time 12 hooks everyone dead everyone 3 hooked and still gold..... this is frustrating with this killer in red ranks.
Does anyone know how i could send em the YT links .
Maybe a link or whatever i never reported something
Guess it's buggy then, maybe do a bug report.
It's not the first time adept does not work, btw. When plague came out, I managed 4 iri emblems in my second game, but the achievement was bugged and did not get done. I finally got the achievement weeks later, when it was a hell lot more difficult since survivors knew how to handle her in the meantime.
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@IgiOne said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1784110#Comment_1784110
If you delete a daily ritual, the game gives you another one.
You can only replace an unwanted daily with a new one once per day.
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@AhoyWolf said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1784446#Comment_1784446
Thanks!
Also I think you meant Mother-Daughter Ring, not Father's Glasses, those just make Blood Visible.
Ah, yes you are right, Mother-Daughter ring removes them as a side effect, confused that. Gonna change that in my answer as well ^^
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@AggressiveFTW said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1784446#Comment_1784446
Lithe doesn't remove scratch marks.
Correct, meant Dance with me, gonna edit that
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@AhoyWolf said:
^ Title.
Yes, currently you see your own scratch marks as if you are the killer, meaning every survivor or killer perk, power or addon having an impact on scratch marks will be recognizable. That includes:
- Distortion, Dance with me, Poised, Babysitter will remove your scratch marks.
- Lightweight makes them disappear faster.
- Predator will tighten the trail.
- Legion using frenzy will remove your scratchmarks!
- Spirit using mother-daughter ring will remove your scratchmarks!
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Yeah, I was wondering that, too. I remember a thread some weaks ago where someone was glad it was gone, but I haven't seen any official statement whether it's a bug or intentional.
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@landromat said:
If one of your teammates has opened the chest you can't see it's aura which means you can't spend all your tokens, which sucks. Make opened chests visible again. Maybe make it highlight item only if opened chest has it inside, but highlight chest if it's empty
The aura of opened chests were removed when plunderers was buffed to also show the items laying on the ground. Instead of adding the aura back to plunderers, the aura could be added to the new perk, that would make sense, imo.
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@Slendy4321 said:
I'm looking forward to all the festive Dwights, Clowns and everyone wearing ugly sweaters it's going to be a great month!!!
I'm using bills sweater all the time :D
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@Aven_Fallen said:
Yeah, this is the usual case. But Killers claim that they will be able to play "more chill" when they know they play against Solos.
No Killer (and I mean: really no Killer) will equip Meme-Perks when going against 4 Solos.
No killer, really? If I could know for sure I'm against 4 solos, I certainly would swap out all my usual perks except BBQ (bc bloodpoints) to play something more gimmicky, using niche/bad perks like Cruel limits or Furtive Chase. Hell, some weeks ago I only played with random perks (+ BBQ) on all my killers just for a change.
I do not play for the 4k (if the team did not annoy me, I usually let the last one escape through the gate, or the find the hatch before me), but the games have to be enjoyable. Having to see four escapes with just a few hooks, because the gens are flying, since I only have meme perks equipped, thats just no fun at all, and I won't play more then 2-3 games like this until I switch back to the strong perks. With 4 solos, I can be quite sure that they won't play optimally and waste some time here and there, giving me time for memeing around.