BlueRose
BlueRose
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@OtakaChan said:
Killers have coup de grace, blood lust and some more. I don't pair MFT w anything else I run it solo. Let us have one good perk please.
Otz's suggestion wouldn't affect you then. If you watched his video all the way to the end then you know the biggest thing he wanted to change is haste stacking and that is it. The other two suggestions are rather small, letting the killer know when mft procs so they can plan around it and try to outplay it/make an informed choice and change the endurance effect into some other type of effect since we already have so many perks that give endurance and it is starting to muddy the water.
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@Kaitsja said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3513563#Comment_3513563
I agree with Otz's assessment of the perk, I disagree with the sentiment that even just the 3% haste by itself is unhealthy for the game.
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3513550#Comment_3513550
I agree with Otz's asssessment of the perk and his proposed solutions. I think it's important that survivors have alternatives to exhaustion perks that aren't single-use one and done type perks.
Without the endurance, MFT is only good because of the unlimited 3% haste while injured.
Tho I kinda agree with you about that but we are heading towards a point where there be too many subtle haste perks on both sides and movement will start to be unpredictable which imo isnt good for the heath of the game and will only hurt newer players when they start learning the game. Otzs worded it best in his opinions post for the Alien PTB. This is about the killer perk Rapid Brutality.
"Killer Perk: Rapid Brutality gives a 5% speed boost after a basic attack for 10s but disables Bloodlust. At first glance, and for most Killers, this perk doesn't seem very worth the risks, but I'm sure we'll find some niche usage for it. Even if it doesn't break the game, I really, really dislike the fact that we're introducing so many subtle movement speed perks. It's going to become a problem at some point when you'll have no idea what the correct play is anymore, since your opponent's speed will be so unpredictable."
As you see Otz isn't just worried about haste perks from a killer pov but from the pov of both sides. I just think we are heading towards a slippy slope if the Dev continues to throw haste on every other new perk they release.
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@Kaitsja said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3513471#Comment_3513471
I had a post typed up that broke down each of those killers you listed, but the tab refreshed and I lost the post so you'll just have to settle for this.
Only Nemmy, Pig, Doctor, Hag and Trapper are disproportionately affected by MFT, and they'd be just as adversely affected by exhaustion perks. Pig, Doctor, Hag and Trapper all suffer from outdated designs.
Tho it is true those killers suffer from outdated designs, MfT is not affecting that all that much. What it is affecting is timing and feeling you learn as a killer to get hits. Otz talked about this in his video where MFT affects the timing that a lot of killer mains have learned over hours of playing and it also affects new players' able to learn these timings also. My main issue right now with MfT and other haste perks on both sides are we getting to the point we getting too many ways to affect the basic movement speed of both killers and survivors. Imo the movement speeds should stay mostly the same thought out the game since its plays a BIG part in chases.
The thing about exhaustion perks btw is you usually only get to use them once in each chase you have and as a killer, you can tell what exhaustion perk a survivor has but MFT is always working and you never know it's in play until the end of the game. This is why I agree with Otz's suggestion of letting the killer know when MfT procs so the killer then can make an informed decision. Right now you cant make an informed decision against MfT since you have no clue it's there or not.
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I'm only going to comment about the endgame comment you had and that I disagree on. While it's true you had a whole game to keep survivors getting endgame but endgame is still a important part of the match as it's the last time killers get the chance to force survivors to make a mistake. I have had a lot of matches that get to endgame with 4 survivors and I walk away with 3 kills bc they made some major mistakes. Hope+MFT makes it where killers honestly have no chance to make a play to force the rest of the survivors to make mistakes. Ever since this combo came into the game I even stopped playing for the endgame and stop using perks like no way out bc there no use to even try now.
If everyone felt the same way as you did we might as well not even have a endgame collapse to begin with. When the 5 gen gets completed they might as well kick everyone out of the match and say "survivors win, killer you lose" But that's not how DBD is designed. We do have a endgame collapse and perks like hope+MfT only hurt killers greatly and deny them from making a move.
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@Saiph said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3513192#Comment_3513192
Both have the same effect though? MFT makes the killer miss a hit that was very close, Coup makes them succeed a hit that was very close.
I'd much rather have Coup against a survivor with MFT, rather than both of us having no perk. So Coup is stronger than MFT in chase.
So, if Coup is fine because survivors aren't going to lose the game based on one chase, then you as killer should be fine with MFT because you aren't going to lose the game on one chase either.
"then you as killer should be fine with MFT because you aren't going to lose the game on one chase either."
This statement is not completely true for killer. If you take the wrong chase at the wrong time you can competely lose a match because of that chase. You may down that survivor yeah but it most likely costs you a lot of pressure and the other 3 survivors finish gens and either get a 3 man out or even a 4 man depending on the hook state of the survivor you downed. On the flip side if a survivor has one bad chase the team can easily recover and get out with no issues. Chases and mistakes have a much bigger impact on killers than on survivors bc it's a 4v1 game.
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@Ayodam said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3503194#Comment_3503194
It still technically requires a slug to work. And the devs need to move away from the habit of deactivating survivor perks during endgame. Endgame shouldn’t by itself give the killer unearned advantages.
The fact you say that tells me a lot about you as a player of dbd. This combo does not require slugging for it to work. A lot of us have had this combo used right after we down someone and are in the cooldown from hitting someone. If it was for slugging or tunneling then I would be all for it but it isn't. It punishes killers for just playing the game and that's not a good design imo.
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Im super hyped!!! I have been wanting an alien chapter for so long!!!
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I'm just tired of For The People and Buckle Up. Endurance on unhooks and even healing someone up from the ground if I slug them is fine but what isn't fine is when I down someone and as Im wiping my blade off someone comes in and picks the person up and now both of them I can't hit. FTP and Buckle Up combo is unfair for killers bc it's punishing them for playing the game imo. It's putting a killer in a lose-lose situation much like how old DH(one for distance) was. This combo has nothing to do with tunneling or camping, just a combo that can be abused by SWF and even good solo groups which I have had a good number of in past week or so. I also think there are way too many endurance perks now where they are starting to overlap each other and kinda making a power creep situation. Why bring soul guard when I can just bring Bunkle up and for the people? Why run WGLF when I can bring the above combo? As I said I only think Buckle Up needs a nerf or just simply make it not work with FTP.
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@Nebula said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3496444#Comment_3496444
I never said anything about a kill switch or a massive rework. A lot of killers in this game could be fixed by simple number changes, not huge overhauls. Blight for example, literally just nerf his add ons and he’s totally fine, why does it take 6 patch cycles to address this? Skull merchants three gen capabilities could be addressed by simply tweaking the numbers on her drones. There’s no need for massive overhauls on most of these killers.
Well, my comment was to the OP who wanted the killer to be killswitched and I was explaining why that is not possible. The thing about SM is the devs dont see 3 genning as a SM problem. They see it as a game problem that needs to be fixed with a new system. That is what they are working on.
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@Crowman said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3496444#Comment_3496444
Also the statement of 1200 employees is very deceptive. We have no way to know what the exact number is working on DBD and BHVR is working on more than just DBD. Even if the claim that 90% of those employees were on DBD was true, don't forget that DBD also has people working on the sound, new cosmetics, and a team dedicated to interfacing with the community and those people don't work on balancing/reworking killers.
Of course it's easy for people to criticize BHVR's prioritizes when they don't understand what it's like to work on a team for a big project where each team has a specific focus.
Another thing that gets under my skin is the idea that a big company can just hire more ppl to make the work go faster. That's not how game development works XD It's just so silly and I wish more ppl did research on what goes into making the video game they play. Guess I know is bc I went to school for programming and wanted to be a game dev myself.
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@Nebula said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3495884#Comment_3495884
There seems to be a misconception that bHVR is still a small indie company. They have over 1,200 employees and it’s fair to say a vast majority of them work on DbD as it’s their only big project and more than likely responsible for 90+% of their profit. They make more than $300 million per year.
They definitely have the resources to do these fixes and changes.
No, you don't understand game design and being part of dev team/company. The number of ppl doesnt matter really. The time and resources that they have are already being taken up by projects they are working on right now. They can't just drop everything they are working on to rework one single killer. They can't just create time in the day either or hire more ppl. I never said they were a small indie company, they are not, but they do have higher ups(investors) to answer to and they have deadlines that need to be met. They are most likely busy right now working on the next 4 killers, maps and ect. Im not just saying all this, Peanits said as much in a thread about why devs are afraid to buff weaker killers(https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3480436#Comment_3480436).
That said will SM be changed or see buffs/nerfs? Yes, they will get around to it when they can but ppl need to be patent and reasonable. The killswitch system wasn't made to disable killers who are annoying, it was made to disable game-breaking bugs. If they did killswitch SM till she is reworked we would be looking at a paid dlc killer being unable to play for 6 months to a year since doing those type of changes take time. Look at the twins rework as an example, we have waited over a year now and still have no clue when that rework will happen. There is no telling how long the Sakoko rework took these devs to do. That rework easily could been started 6 months or a year ago.
At the end of the day it's true BHVR isn't some idle company but that doesnt change the fact that they do not have the time or resources to do a rework of a killer fast enough to justify a killswitch. If they could do that rework in a few months sure but we all know, including the devs themselves, that is not possible.
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No matter how much yall want her gone it's not going to happen. The devs have already said that they are working on a system to 3 genning on every killer and they have said they have buffs/changes plan for SM. No matter how many posts you make or how loud you moan about SM they not going to killswitch her just bc yall find her annoying. If they did do that then they would have to killswitch pretty much every killer that has an annoying playstyle like Bubba, sakoto, and ect. Do I want SM changes? Yes but not at the cost of her being disabled 6 months to a YEAR! This dev team doesnt have the time or resources to start reworking a killer and have it out the door within a few months.
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@DY86 said:
Cool guide but they’re gonna have to nerf her tbh.
any sadako playing hit and run style is an instant win atm
The sad part is when they do nerf her she won't get anything in return for chase. Right now she is a one-trick pony doing hit and run and teleporting to build condemn. When you nerf that what does she have left? Nothing...she has no chase power and one addon that gave her some mindgame potential was heavy nerfed. I agree I competely see them nerfing her condemn in a few weeks since I'm pretty sure the devs didnt want her to get 2 or more condemn kills every match. Saddens me bc I also know they won't buff anything else about her kit. :-/
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Im ok with lobby dodges personally but I do think they should hide ppl prestige levels. Personally, I only dodge .ttv lobbies bc I don't want to play on someone's stream and those matches are always so bad for me. I don't know if it's me psyching myself out or what but I always play so badly if I know one or more survivors are streamers.
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@MaTtRoSiTy said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3492395#Comment_3492395
I can't speak on console performance but I can only imagine how bad it probably is now for older gen consoles like the PS4 etc
But yeah you get it, unfortunately there are those people who will see videos such as the one Hens did and they will intentionally go into matches to inflict misery on others. Hell, one of the several SM's I have versed today even has the main comments on their Steam profile bragging about how they are intentionally 3 genning with SM with the intention of annoying other players.
I don't understand how this is okay and people are actually defending it?
I haven't seen one person defending SM 3 gen playstyle. In fact, alot want that part of her to be nerfed and chased be buffed. All ppl are saying, including myself, is you cant Killswitch a killer who doesnt have a bug or is broken. By your logic, they should also kill-switch Babba for facecamping and should had kill-switched Sakoto for her slugging condemn playstyle before today. Like it or not but SM is working as intended even tho she has a very unhealthy playstyle but she isn't broken.
I also will add, you and some others asking for the killer, who ppl have paid to play, to be removed from the game for a LONG time till they fix her. Reworks for this dev team can take up to a year or more. Look at how long Twins rework has been taking, and even sakoto's rework has taken a while. Reworking a killer takes time and resources, things this dev team does not have free of. They can't just drop everything they are currently working just bc some survivors are whining about one single killer in a roster of 32. I bet her play rate isn't even high enough to say that she is in more than 50% of ppl matches. I personally have seen a total 5 SMs since she was released and those 5 SM matches only lasted between 15 to 20mins.
One last thing, the devs are currently working on a new system to combat 3 genning on all killers. You just need to show some patience and stop asking for ridiculous requests like killswitching a killer when they are not bugged or broken.
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@Crowman said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3492206#Comment_3492206
Also I bet the amount of games that actually get close to the 1 hour mark are very small too
I can only speak for myself but I have seen maybe 5 SM since her launch and none of them even reached the 30min mark. They was normal length matches.
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@appleas said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3491787#Comment_3491787
By killswitching her especially when SM is not bugged, the devs are acknowledging that they created a defective product and pushed it to live. It’s not a good look for the company especially to their stakeholders.
While I have thought that BHVR’s PR is sketchy at times, they’re being smart this time in not killswitching her. Killswitches are supposed to be reserved for bugs. Killswitching her because enough people complained and a custom match happened will set a precedent that people can get other things that they don’t like killswitched if they complain enough in the future on the forums.
I have said it a few times already but people are blowing things out of proportion. From an outsider point of view, people are asking for a company’s product to be recalled indefinitely until it is fixed not because it is faulty or dangerous, but because people don’t like it and some people who were very experienced with the company’s products tested it and their “feedback” was publicized to others.
Ngl people are just letting the fact that it was team Eternal mess with their perception of the issue. How much people still play SM regularly? How many SM matches were stalled out like what happened in the custom match? Are the numbers justifiable to do a knee jerk response via killswitching instead of just adding her rework to the list of things to be done? The devs probably already know the answers and are acting based on them.
I agree with you. I really didnt think about that but it is true. If they did killswitch a killer who isn't bugged/broken it would create a precedent that if enough ppl whine loud enough about something they can get it removed from the game for a long time till that thing is reworked. Honestly, I love to know the numbers behind SM, her pickrate, and what % of matches on a daily basis ppl even go against SM. I bet it's not as high as a lot of these ppl want you to believe. I also like to see match lengths.
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@shalo said:
clarifying and re-clarifying that SM players aren't bad people just that the killer sucks
And yet, every time I play as Skull Merchant I get abuse in end game chat. Every time. It doesn't matter that I play SM as a Stealth Killer and my games are over in 10-15 minutes, the hive mind has decided that SM players are evil and the Killer should be deleted..
Yeah, ppl in this community sucks sometimes. I get hate for playing her and Legion all the time. Honestly, I think dbd is on of the most toxic games other than LoL. A lot of ppl in this community act so entitled and be little ppl when they don't get their away or if you play something they don't like or find unfun.
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@ReikoMori said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3491787#Comment_3491787
They did the same to Legion for a long time even after they removed the ability to moonwalk down someone with deep wounds, fixed the issues with stacking Filthy and Nasty blade, turbo nerfed and then reworked Frank's Mixtape and Stab Wound Study.
People DC'd on the Twins a ton as well, there was literally the multiple years of hostage Doc and the Forever Freddy days of his original power which caused a ton of DCs. It seems we've been playing this game the same length of time so you would have had to have seen this or at least been aware of this.
The response to Skull Merchant is extremely skewed because the level of baseline hate for her is so much higher than any other killer. Hate she doesn't really deserve considering where it usually stems from has nothing to do with what she's capable of in game and everything to do with people getting hyped up on leaks for Predator or generally being super snobbish about what does and doesn't belong in horror. So a ridiculous level of hatred paired with a generally very weak power that has one grossly over performant strat at the expense of truly being good at anything else means players are going to respond negatively in a seemingly outsized manner.
Most of the folks on this forum that call for her to be killswitched or deleted are also the same ones who were cranking out threads talking about how Skull Merchant doesn't even belong in DBD to begin with.
Yeah SM was the most hated killer before anyone even got to play her. I remember all the posts calling for the devs to delete her just based on her design and looks. They called her a fortnight character and sex bait. Meanwhile these same people would drool over any shirtless cosmetic for a male survivor. These ppl are extremely bias towards SM. I know I went up against few SMs when I played survivor and none of those matches lasted super long. Most of them was around the 20min mark in length. Meanwhile the longest match I had was a plague match(around 30 mins) when we 3 gen ourselves against her.
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@Dustin said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3491066#Comment_3491066
Calling for her to be killswitched till she gets reworked may make sense from a balance perspective but not from a business perspective. BHVR would either have to compensate players who spent money on her or put her remake as a priority. Given how their schedule is, prioritizing her remake would push other profitable projects down the line like cosmetics or new chapters which once again makes no sense from a business perspective.
This reminds me of the argument people had when Decisive Strike got reworked and people were demanding refunds because the perk got changed. Same thing happened with Freddy's complete rework. I'm pretty sure there was a statement about it that refunds wouldn't be granted. Granted I get it if the killer is killswitched for months but to be honest there's been plenty of stuff killswitched for a long duration of time. The only thing that was disabled for a lengthy period to my knowledge was Jonathan Byers from Stranger Things and that was before killswitch - can't recall if people got compensated somehow but I thought they did.
To be quite honest - I actually agree with people suggesting the killer needs to be killswitched. Genuinely one of the worst designed things I've ever seen added to this game and I've played since 2016. I'm still thinking of hatch standoffs, pallet and window vacuums and really poorly designed perks when I compare SM to old DBD. I also don't believe people are overreacting. Skull Merchant is the only killer I've consistently seen people either DC or walk up to the killer and point to a hook so they can go next. The majority of people who value their time would rather suicide on hook against SM.
The thing is we not talking about months for a rework. This dev team take much much longer to rework killers. You looking at disabling a killer for at least a year or more. The reason I said this is because of the promise Twins rework that was teased over a year ago. Even sadoko rework we getting most likely took them a long time to do and we just didn't know they was doing it. If was just few months then I agree they need to Killswitch her but I doubt it would take few months to rework her. Not with this dev team and the amount of time and resources they have. Most of their dev time is tired up in making new killers so they can keep up with their 3 month schedule. I don't know a single game that has removed a character for that long.
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Yeah, I saw the post on twitter. I still think they are very late on posting that XD At this point in time they should just have posted the patch notes but whatever. Still, tho there is barely anything that being changed. So my worries are still there for her. The CD changes are nice but I still don't think she going to be in a good place after this rework. I also can't believe they didnt change any of her addon changes. R.Watch still being nerfed is heart breaking and the irl tape is still going to feel like a must-used addon.
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@appleas said:
Calling for her to be killswitched till she gets reworked may make sense from a balance perspective but not from a business perspective. BHVR would either have to compensate players who spent money on her or put her remake as a priority. Given how their schedule is, prioritizing her remake would push other profitable projects down the line like cosmetics or new chapters which once again makes no sense from a business perspective.
I think people are just overreacting to this whole fiasco. It was a custom match to test the potential of SM, that’s about it. Unless people were copying this strategy and applying it to public games constantly, the amount of people who might actually have an hour long game is probably going to be a statistically small amount. I recall Hens also did another video showcasing how long it would take to break a 3 gen on Dead Dwag with pre nerfed SM so this video is nothing new tbh.
Maybe people more familiar with comp Meta can shed some light on this but are stall + 3 gen games common in the comp scene? If even Team Eternal rarely comes across such a playstyle that it would make sense that they would have a harder time as compared to the usual looping and being efficient on gens playstyle.
Agree no business/developer would remove or temporary remove a paid character for what could be a year or more just bc of all this. I would understand if SM was like the only killer in the game and 50%+ of the DBD community matches was 50min SM matches but I highly doubt her play rate and percentage of all DBD matches will remotely reach that high of percentages. Just doesn't make any business sense.
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@jesterkind said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3491055#Comment_3491055
Has that ever happened? It's definitely not happened for any PTB in recent memory, unless I'm missing something.
Most the time they do make changes from ptb to live. The thing that has me worried is the fact we haven't seen what these changes are yet. Usually they release a dev update a week before the live update telling us all the things they made changes to and what feedback they listen to. We haven't seen that with this ptb. It making me believe they not changing anything and going to release everything as is from the ptb this week. We just have to see tho but I am worried.
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@foods said:
going on 5 pages arguing about how a killer that lost is broken and unfair
never change survivors
People are just talking in circles at this point about SM. The message is pretty clear ppl don't like her and they only want to see her removed from the game or reworked. Personally, I like SM but I do think she needs some major help. Nerf her 3 gen playstyle and buff her chase/other parts of her kit. But what I don't agree with is the extreme viewpoint of a lot of these survivors where they want a killer, who ppl have already paid for, to be removed or killswitched till a rework happens, which would take a year or more to do with the current dev team. I could only see that if more than 50% of everyone's matches were 50 min SM matches but I highly doubt that. She is one killer in a roster of 32 and I bet a lot of these ppl may see one or two SMs a night if at all. I know when I played survivor I mat have seen one SM in a week of playing. That is not enough SM matches to warden a killswitch imo.
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What if the killer DC? Again these arguments I see are all ways from the pov of the survivor DCing. Do realize killers dc also. Killer will DC if they see a map offering, get blinded when picking up a survivor, lose two gens in the first chase and ect. Unlike survivors killers won't have bots to replace them that means a match will just end and survivors won't even get the chance to play the match out.
If you remove DC penalties all you doing is encouraging both survivors and killers to DC whenever the match doesn't go thier way. This will lead to killers playing more pve matches and survivors not being able to play at all. I will say right now as a killer main if I see a map offering I will DC the sec I load into the match. That if the DC penalties are removed.
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@Pulsar said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3490362#Comment_3490362
I cannot recall any specific interaction with you that would have had this effect. If I did make you feel that way, I can assure you that was not my intention. I deeply and sincerely apologize if it came off that way.
Things in DBD can be a skill issue. It can also not be your fault. For example, if you took a new player and matched them against Team Eternal, you wouldn't expect them to win. Is that a skill issue? Yes. Is it the new players fault? Absolutely not. If you are casual, there is a lot of pressure against you in DBD. Playing against non-casual opponents who are better than you is a difference in mindset and in skill, but it isn't inherently your fault; it's on the MM. I have a tendency to assume that people always want to be better when they complain about something, but sometimes, they just want to vent. They don't want solutions, they just want to know they've been heard and that they aren't alone.
What do you propose we do then? This is SM's most popular playstyle and it is genuinely ruining people's games and there's often nothing they can do about it. Obviously, that can't be allowed to continue. BHVR is definitely getting a lot of bad publicity from it; whether they care or not is a different story. For the health of the game though, we really can't afford to wait a year or more for a Skull Merchant Rework whilst she's out here doing stuff like this on a regular basis.
Well I say we wait and see. Devs have said several times that they are currently working on a system to combat 3 genning in general. They believe 3 genning isn't just a SM issue but a game issue that they trying to fix. Do I completely agree with them? Kinda but I do think she makes the problem much wrost. I just don't see them kill switching a killer for more than a year. This isn't about what you want or what I want. We are not devs, we don't work for the company. This is about what they are willing to do and what is in there power. I just don't think killswitching a killer for a rework that could take up to a year or more is something a game developer are willing to do. If they did do that I would think they should offer refunds ppl money back bc they are taking away paid content that ppl paid for. I know if a killer I paid for was disabled for a whole year I would want my money back.
Again I'm talking about what the devs are willing to do not what ppl want them to do. I'm being realistic here. I been to programming school and I dreamed of being a game dev so I kinda understand why certain things happen. They can't drop everything they doing just to rework one single killer even if she problematic. I guaranteed the amount of SM games that are played on a daily basis isn't even that high compared to the other killers. When it comes to development it's all about time and resources, DBD devs have said that they just don't have enough of either to rework a killer in a feasible time frame.
Either way all we all really do is wait and see what the devs will do next but I can 100% guaranteed killswitching sm isn't even on the table. I think she would only be killswitched if the devs believe they could rework her in few months but I doubt they able to do that considering it has took them a year to work on nerfing and reworking sadoko condemn playstye and we going a year and 1/2 for the twins rework.
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@Pulsar said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3490236#Comment_3490236
For you, I'll ty to do this as objectively as I possibly can. Let me know if it sounds biased or egotistical.
I'm not sure if you've looked at a lot of my posts, but I am not in favor of balancing around the top. Reinami and I have gotten into arguments over that. I do not think that the game would be in a good state if it were balanced around players like me, let alone comp teams.
My balance ideas are always striving for the average to above-average player. You know, where most people fall. The SM in this match was, in my opinion, in that bracket. They understood the Killer well, but their gameplay was about what I'd expect of someone with 800 hours, being above-average but not outstanding. That's not a knock on them, to be clear.
Ultimately, kill-switching SM whilst her rework pends is likely a necessity. She is already not looked upon favorably and while there may be some good SM's who do not ever camp 3-gens, there are a lot more that do. Certainly, these videos will inspire more players to pick up that playstyle because they've seen how effective it can be, which will then cause an influx of complaints (likely valid) about the Killer.
Honestly Im not even sure why I'm doing this to myself by replying to you since I do have you on my ignore list and I don't really see your comments but I did see this one that your reply to mine so here we go I guess.(Guess I hate myself)
You may want to balance around mid-tier/avg player but some of your comments toward me in the past make me think you like bragging about how good you are at dbd. You compare your exp with perks and other things to my exp and made it sound like Im bad/worst than you and that's my fault. I don't play this game for a living and I dont want too. I play games to have fun and thats all. I never once in this forum said I am great at this game in fact Im pretty trash I think. I go on long-losing streaks against much better survivors than I and all I get at the end is "gg ez" and ect. In fact, that is why I have taken this month competely off bc I stop having fun on Killer altogether. The game isn't fun right now and I was raging and quitting almost every single match. My DC timer reach 12hrs it was so bad. Personally, I just don't like you at all and never agree with you on any point.
As for the SM thing. I said it a lot in this thread and other places. I do think she needs a rework and I'm completely open to it but I think expecting the devs to killswitch a killer while they are being reworked is silly, crazy, and right-out dumb. The devs never going to killswitch her bc they know it will take more than months to do so. If the devs decided today to rework SM I guaranteed that it would take a year or more before it would be finished. It's not feasible to remove a killer/character from the game for that long. If it would be just a few months sure but we both know it won't take a few months to rework a killer. Sometimes also the reworks are worst than the og killer, look at Freddy. Shoot look at Sadoko, based on a lot of ptb feedback she may be in a worst place after her rework, and that most likely took a year to do. Either way, I do believe SM needs a rework but I don't agree with kill switching her for that period. I cant think of one game that competely removed a playable character for a whole year to just rework them. You and so many others on this forum are so unrealistic with y'alls requests and act like you don't know this dev team at all.
Anyway, I will not be replying anymore to your reply from this point. Im hiding your comments again. Have a blessed day.
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@HamsterEnjoyer said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3490236#Comment_3490236
I just hate opening the forums and seeing everyone (especially one person here) saying how everyone who plays this specific killer are terrible people and demanding we have our money wasted simply because they find it 'unfun'. Which I think is funny cause when COH was meta and causing hour long games there was radio silence. I guess hour long games are only okay when the survivors are in control of when it ends not the killer?
I agree with you. I like playing SM and even knight but I get hate for playing them even tho I don't play them in an unfun way. I know I would be pretty upset if they delete SM or killswitch her for a year but these ppl don't care. They only care about their fun. That's why they also want dc penalties gone. They only care about their own fun and see dbd as a single-player game. I even get hate for enjoying legion(who is my main). You can't make anyone in here happy. I bet if they did rework her ppl would continue to complain. Shoot look at Wesker, who most would say is the best design killer in the game, I see a lot of posts about how ppl hate playing against him.
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@HamsterEnjoyer said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3490170#Comment_3490170
Yes yes I know you hate skull merchant and anyone who plays her no need to remind us we've got the message loud and clear
Ppl on here like to beat a dead horse when it comes to SM. Honestly, I don't mind ppl asking for a rework bc I too think she needs something but what I do mind is the nerve of asking for a killer to be removed/kill switched when they know a rework would take more than a year to do. Be realistic with your requests, trust me ppl would take you more seriously.
Personally, I don't care some comp team was held in a game for 50min. I honestly hate team eternal. Comp players like them and even Pulsar are all the same in my mind, they are loud and egotistic players who think they are better than anyone else. They think ppl can reach their level of play when reality most ppl can't and won't. A lot of us don't make playing this game a living. Anyway, I'm glad I took a break from dbd. I'm only here to see what ppl are arguing about.
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@JustAShadow said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3489946#Comment_3489946
Haddonfield was disabled for a few months when the rework was in progress. I don't see why SM should be treated any different.
Reworking a killer and redesigning a map are two major different things, man. You cant compare the two. For one thing, no one pays for the maps. You don't buy a dlc for the map since the map is there for everyone in non-custom games. Also coming up with a new power would take more than just a few months in dev time. Clearly, you have no idea what goes in when developing things for a game and the time it takes to do things. A kill-switched map for a few months vs a kill-switched killer for a year or more are not comparable.
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@JustAShadow said:
BHVR should just killswitch her until she's completely reworked like they did with Haddonfield.
You do relieve how long that would be right? How long did it take for them to rework Sadako so her slug playstyle is nerfed? On right a year. How long have they been working on twins rework? Oh right over a year now. You and so many others are basically asking for a killer that ppl did pay for being kill switched for more than a year since this dev team doesn't have the time or resources to do a killer rework in a timely fashion. Honestly, I think every single one of you is so silly to ask for a killer to be killswitch by a team of devs at takes years to rework a killer.
That said I do think she needs a rework and I do think her 3 gen playstyle needs a major nerf. The thing is, unlike so many of you Im realistic about the capability of this dev team. It's unreasonable to expect this dev time to killswitch or remove something they have worked on for a year(it you believe that or not but AMA did say all killers take a year of dev time to do) for who knows how long. Plus what about those who paid for her and enjoy playing her? I'm one of those but I have never camped a 3 gen with her. I use a chase build with her two purple addons and I actually enjoy playing like that. I don't win that much but I do have fun doing so. All Im going to say is yes she needs a much-needed rework but she doesnt need to be killswitched or removed.
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@OnryosTapeRentals said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3489865#Comment_3489865
This has me a little anxious actually. The silence is making me think that they're going to go ahead with the Sadako changes.
I'm with you!!! I'm little worried they didn't listen to ppl feedback on her rework and she going to be released as it. Guess we find out next week.
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Little off topic but anyone else think it's strange we haven't seen the post PTB dev update? Usually they released a dev update a week before the live update saying what they changing from the ptb to live. I'm wondering if there will be any changes from the ptb.
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I agree with Hens, I do think her 3 gen play style needs a major nerf and she needs buffs in other areas as composition. As someone who likes SM I would like to see her get a rework of some sort. At least he not being over dramatic and calling for her to be removed or Killswitch tho. Some of the ppl on this forum are way to extreme about things. Yes the killer needs changes but killswitching her isn't the answer.
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Tho I do agree she needs work but I don't agree to kill switching her. If they killswitch her to just rework her that would mean it would be a year+ of a killer being unplayable. I'm sorry that not going to happen no matter how many times you and others ask for it. This dev team takes forever to rework killers, look at twins, and even sakuko who was in the same state and also had a really unfun play style like sm for a year before they even decide to touch her. I get it ppl hate her bc the easiest way to win with her is 3 genning(no all of us do that btw, I never pick 3 close gens on any killer and guard them at the beginning of a match. If a 3 gen happens its bc the survivor allow it to happen.)
My point is, asking for a killer to be killswitched when nothing 'game-breaking' is wrong with them is dumb. Yes SM has problems and can be unfun to go against but there is nothing game breaking wrong with her. Also, consider how long this dev team takes to rework killers before asking this type of stuff. It takes them a LONG time to do anything about killers. Its fine to ask for changes to a killer bc they have a playstyle that is really unfun but don't ask for a killer, who ppl paid for, to be disabled till they get reworked bc you basically asking for them to be unplayable for a year or more. I know I would be pissed off and expect a refund if they did that.
Also, I'll add the devs have already said several times they looking into 3-genning. They are working on a system to help with that since they don't see 3 genning as an SM problem but a game problem in general. We see what happens from here but asking for a killer(who isnt broken) to be killswitched is silly esp when they could easily be killswitched for a year or more.
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@txcrnr said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3487054#Comment_3487054
Ok, so… why are killers not punished for lobby dodging? Why can killers still force close task at loading screen to avoid a map offering they don’t like? Seems pretty one sided. And doesn’t having DC penalties just mean they’ll AFK or let go on hook?
I'm guessing you don't want DC penalties correct? Okay so let's say they do take away penalties. You do realize that means both sides, killer and survivor, will not have penalties. So what do you think is going to happen when a killer sees a map offering, lose multiple gens in one chase, get blinded while they pick up a survivor and ect? They will DC and guess what killers don't have bots so that means the match will just come to a end and the survivors won't be able to finish out the match. If you don't like killers lobby dodging I'm guessing you going to hate when you load into an match to have it admittedly end just bc someone brought a map offering or ect.
That said I do agree that they should hide player's prestige levels till the end of the match but I honestly don't think lobby dodging is all that bad since there is a backfill system in lobbies. Be honest, how long have you waited in lobby for a killer to accept to play against you? I know I never had to wait more than a minute personally. If the average wait is 5 to 10mins then yes that's a problem but I honestly don't think it's that. The backfill system acts pretty fast to fill the empty alot in the lobby.
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You know what I find it very interesting that this whole argument is from the point of view of survivors DCing and I haven't seen many ppl bring up killer DCs. If you remove DC penalties that means you also remove it for killer and right now killers don't have bots, so that means when a killer dc for whatever reason the match will just end. Killers are just as likely to dc for any reason just like survivors. As a killer main who wants the penalties to stay, I will say this, if penalties did go away I will 100% will DC if I see a map offering. Survivors this also means the chances of you completing challenges for the rift go down if killers start DCing a lot since as I said matches will just end and you won't get the chance to do a totem, touch a gypht, and etc. I think what will happen if DC penalties went away is killers will have more pve matches than pvp matches(esp the killers who ppl hate to go against like wesker, sm, knight, blight, and nurse) and survivors (esp swfs) won't ever see the end of a match since killers will most likely dc if they lose to many gens in one chase, see a map offering used, get blinded as they pick up a survivor and ect.
In my opinion, DC penalties are a necessary evil since they are punishments for those who broke the commitment they agree to when they queue up. I don't know many multiplayer games that don't have some kind of penalty when leaving a match/duty early. I give two examples of games I play a lot other than DBD, Overwatch QP gives you a 75% exp reduction for x number of games for the battle pass and ff14 locks you out of queueing for all duties for 30mins if you leave a dun/raid early 3 times in a day. Btw both of these games have a backfill system to replace ppl who leave, something dbd doesn't have.
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She not getting a rework as far as I know, I do know in the AMA they said they have an update but they didnt say rework. As for 3 genning they already said they working on something to solve the 3 genning problem in the game. Devs dont see 3 genning as just one or two killer problems but a problem in the game itself and they doing a system to stop 3 genning.
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I start off by saying that I also think they could delete BL2 and BL3 but not for the same reasons you listed. I don't think BL2 or BL3 rewards the killer in fact I think it misleads killers to stay in the chase for too long. If you depend on BL2 and BL3 all the time to get downs you not going to win that match, gens will be done and 2 or more survivors will escape. That said I do think BL should still be in the game bc of the map design. Dbd suffers from poor map design and not going to change in my eyes. The devs will continue to make safe maps where loops can easily be chained together and allow survivors to extend chases for so long. Maps like Graden of Joy and Shattered Square will continue to be made.
Also, I don't think you can compare MFT and bloodlust since they act differently from one another. MfT only has one condition and that is to be injured which is a state a survivor will be in at some point no matter what. I know it has another condition but being exhausted is something a survivor more or less can control mostly bc killers only have 4 perks that can cause exhaustion, two of those perks require survivors to heal(one they have to be inside the killer TR), one requires the survivor to be injured as you hook someone and that perk has a long cooldown, and the other just requires the survivor to touch gen(the best one in imo out of the 4) and not all killers have addons for exhaustion. Outside these two conditions, there is no other way to lose MfT. Now look at BL, it requires the killer to be in chase for 15, 25, and 35 secs, now if you stay in the chase for more than 25 sec imo as a killer you doing yourself more harm than good since that giving time for the other 3 survivors to group up and finish gens. BL is also really easy to lose as a killer, you lose BL when you: break a pallet, hit a survivor, use your power, or lose the chase. As you can see killer cant keep BL like survivors can keep MFT.
Another issue I have MFT is the fact it hurts lower-tier killers but does nothing to high-tier killers. Nurses, Blights, Spirts, and Weskers care less about MFT because they all have powers that help them in a chase. Meanwhile, Trappers, Pigs, Freddys, and Sadakos do feel MFT in the hands of good survivors since they are mostly m1 killers with no chase powers. Before someone says it, yes I do think the devs should rework/buff lower-tier killers but the reality is they won't. Peanit has said in another thread that lower-tier killers dont get looked at a lot of times bc of time management and priorities. They just don't have the time or feel like some of these killers need changes. They think Trapper is fine and have no plans on buffing him even though pretty much everyone who plays the game thinks he is the worst killer in dbd. So I don't get why ppl continue to ask for lower-tier killers to be buff when the chances of them getting changed are so low, to begin with. I feel like it's a fantasy now more than anything.
Either way, MFT only makes good players, even more, stronger and makes already easy maps to loop even easier. My main problem isn't really with MFT itself but with map design. I think maps are made way too safe and easy for survivors but devs have shown me nothing that shows me they can make a balanced map in the past year. So imo is easier to ask for a perk to be changed than a map or killer changes since the devs have shown they rather change perks more than other parts of their game.
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They could do other types of punishment than locking you out of matches x hours. Overwatch has a system where if you dc from QP too many times you get a 75% reduction to exp earned for x number of games. Maybe they just make it where you cant earn BPs or Rife Exp for so many games if you dc. I do think there should be a punishment for DCing tho bc if there wasn't you just have games full of bots all the time and the game will just turn into a pve game and not a pvp game.
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Thought I understand why there are ppl who want dc penalties gone and part of me wants that too but I feel removing them could lead to hurting the game more than helping. I can't help to feel that if there was no punishment for DCing at all, it would just lead both killers and survivors to dc the moment they feel like they are losing. This could lead to killers having to play against more bots than people. Turning a pvp game into more of a pve game which a lot of ppl don't want. Including myself since I find going up against bot super boring and if most of my matches were bot matches I would stop playing dbd altogether. Also, SWF would have a harder time finding full matches since most killers would dc the sec they believe they going against one
That said the devs could remove the penalties and see what happens. If what I said comes true tho I think they need to act fast and reenable dc penalties as fast as they can.
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The game is boring to me anymore tbh. I don't know if I'm just burnt out or what but I honestly don't find dbd fun to play right now as the killer. Matches all the same, I either completely stomp the survivors, or the survivors completely stomp me. I rarely have exciting matches anymore or chases. I know I've been against MfT and I think I understand why I hate the perk even if it's not super strong. It's bc its so boring to go against. There really no mind games I can do as killer(as far as I know) to counter this perk and it's a pure speed increase perk. Maps don't help either because I'm tired of chasing survivors around tiles that are easy to chain together and losing more of the one gen in the background bc of it. Overall I just think I need a break from dbd. I picked up Hunt Showdown doing the stream sale and I have been loving it even when I get my ass kicked every match. At least it is fun to play around with the guns and ect. I'm also looking forward to getting the TCM game next month and trying it out, hopeful it be fun.
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@Kaitsja said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3481545#Comment_3481545
It doesn't matter if it costs you the match. The reward is that you're pretty much guaranteed a down at that point. It rewards you for playing badly.
One down doesn't mean anything if it cost you 2 to 3 gens XD You do realize dbd is a game about time management right? The cost of getting to tier 2 or 3 to get a single down means so little. Either way, I do agree with most that BL2 and BL3 could be done away with but I do not think BL2 or BL3 rewards killers, they only promote bad gameplay by staying in a chase for too long. I do think we still need BL1 tho bc of map design. On some maps you have to have bloodlust one to just catch up to a survivor like Lery's. I also add that getting a down mean nothing in dbd, shoot hooks mean nothing. What decides matches is killing a survivor as fast as possible. That why most killers camp/tunnel since downing and hook different survivors is not rewarding enough.
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@Kaitsja said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3479600#Comment_3479600
Bloodlust 1 is a bandaid for bad map rng, but without any true infinites in the game anymore there really isn't any need for BL2 and BL3 as they just reward you for playing badly.
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3479927#Comment_3479927
A lot of the killers people say are weak is simply a case of them not being good at those specific killers. "Weak" killers aren't losing interest because of MFT. They were losing interest before MFT because killers like Wesker, who are infinitely more fun to play as and against, exist.
And yeah, strong killers don't need bloodlust but is that any excuse when they benefit from it all the same?
Is it really a reward if I have to take the time to get to BL3 and then hear 2 to 3 gens popping after I get a down? If any killer is depending on BL3 to get a single down they already losing pretty badly and really not getting rewarded at all. Personally, I want BL2 and BL3 gone just so teaches ppl to leave chases more than stay with them but to say the killer is getting rewarded isn't really true. It's not a reward if it means you going to overall lose the match.
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@Devil_hit11 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3480687#Comment_3480687
i think your post is good example of subjective bias. I think big part of what killer play has to do with how smooth a character feels to play. if a killer has a lot of cooldowns, feels clunky and not intuitive to play. The killer will get selected less. The last part is fun factor. Legion is smooth as butter to play. he is intuitive to play. He likely feels fun to play for those that like high-speed pressure injure play-style.
Otz once talked about this in regards to pyramid head where he plays a less pyramid head post-changes because he feels like the character feels a lot more clunky to play. I share that similar opinion that killers that feel weird to play are hard to pick-up unless you just like suffering through gameplay. So while power-level is factor in playing a killer, I think fluidity of a killer plays major part in killer's enjoyment. You can have fun as killer in losing as long your finding joy in the gameplay you play. power-level is part of the killer but it is not everything. Fun-factor is most important when playing killers. The more killers are fun to play, the more variety you are likely to get.
I agree with you, I love Legion bc I love the high speed of bouncing from one survivor to another. It feels so good when you get that 4 man chain and down someone on the 5th hit, it's a rush no other killer gives me. For clunky killers, I say Knight is that for me. I love the knight in theme and his power but what I don't like is how clunky his power is in chase. I like using the Big guy to break pallets that are just dropped and walk through the new broken pallet to get a hit but most of the time the action is harder to do bc you cant use your power if something(the pallet in this case) is blocking your ord from spawning. I just wish you just order a guard to do action without having to enter the orb since they already highlight gens, walls, and pallets. I don't understand why I cant just order a guard to do something to a highlighted object without having to go into the orb and then order him to break it.
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Personally, I have my own theory on why lower-tier killers aren't really touched. The two main reasons I believe this is are:
1) Data. The devs have said and shown us that they do use data for decision-making when comes to balancing parts of the game and killers are one of these things. For example, look at Trapper, most ppl in the community would say he is the weakest killer and isn't in the greatest spot but the devs have said in the AMA that they think he is fine. In fact, they think he doesn't need anything right now since he is a new player-friendly killer and they want to keep him that way. I think they basing this on his killer rates in the newest players' lobbies(low mmr) where trapper can dormant a group of survivors but in high mmr lobbies he drops by a lot. The same can be said about nurse why they don't nerf her super hard, lot of players don't play her bc she has a high-skill floor so the data would show she has a low pick rate on avg. As I said data plays a huge part in the dev team's decision-making.
2) Time and resources. As we know the devs and high-ups in BHVR love their new killer every 3 months formula and thanks to the AMA we know its takes a year to make a killer for this dev team. This means the devs are always working on a new killer all the time to keep up with this release schedule. I can imagine this leaves little wiggle room for changes to the killers we already have. When they do get around reworking a killer it takes a long time to do so. Look at the Twins rework that was teased a little over a year ago. We still haven't gotten in word on when that rework will come out. I'm still surprised we even got a Sakuko semi-rework in the next patch and Im wondering how long that even took them to do.
Overall I don't think the devs are scared of buffing or reworking weaker killers. I just think the data tells them that some killers are fine and the fact they don't have the time to commit to major changes to every low-tier killers. Personally, I wouldn't mind if they drop the number of killers we get to 2 a year and take the time to make the game and all the killers better.
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@MikaelaWantsYourBoon said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3474960#Comment_3474960
This test was years ago. DbD changed so much, it's not same game anymore.
And killers are using Bloodlust for their advantage. Smart killers know where you have to break pallet and where you can Bloodlust survivor. If this is okey for game health, i don't see any reason to nerf MfT.
The only nerf i want is , haste effects should not be stackable. That's all.
That may be true I'm just going by what others have said. I wasn't playing in 2020 when that test happened and I don't know the states of the maps back then. Also what you just said can be said by survivors also. Smart survivors know how to use loops and chain pallets and windows together to waste as much time as possible of the killers. Mft just makes it even easier for them long side the map design.
My point is I don't care if they delete bloodlust but to do that maps need to be more balanced. Right now ALOT of maps are super easy for a decent to high experience survivor to loop effectively. MfT only just makes even more easier for them. DBD is game about time management and a perk that helps extend a chase even by just few seconds (2 or 3) is huge. Killer has a lot less time than survivors bc it's only one killer and four survivors. While you chase one person that means 3 others are working on two to three gens. Is MfT op? No I never said that but it does make the game feel much more wrost for a killers who doesn't have no movement or chase ability.
That another issue I have with the perk and bunch of other perks. They don't effect each killer the same. Perks like MfT only hurt the lower tier killers and not the higher ones like nurse or blight. Now I know what you will say "well they just need to buff those killers." Let's be real here the devs are not going to buff each individual killers, especially ones they think are fine (Myers and Trapper). Even if they did, their ability to do in a timely manner isny there, Twins rework has taken over a year to do, or they sometimes make a killer wrost if they try to change them, look at the PtB and see how the sakaro rework is working out right now (spoiler alert she looking like she going to be in a worst spot than before). It's like the old saying goes "If ifs and buts were candy and nuts we would all have a Merry Christmas." If the dev was better at balancing map and killers we wouldn't be having this discussion and a perks like MfT won't feel as bad for the other side.
Say what you will about MfT since you free to have your own opinion but I seen a lot of people even outside this forum, some streamers and some non streamers, say the same thing about MfT. It's little too strong of a perk and needs to be looked at some point. It does very much have a impact on games and it will most likely be meta going forward if it isn't changed.
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@Kaitsja said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3474867#Comment_3474867
Plague's whole thing is downing survivors with her corrupt purge.
Not if they refuse to cleanse which has been a counter for her for a while. You get few fountains to use and after that you have to depend on survivors cleansing. If they don't (which most who running MfT won't cleanse) you become a m1 killer who is tall and survivors can easily see you. Mind gaming as plague is already a challenge and MfT in the hands of decent survivors hands make it wrost. Yeah I eventually down them but so much time was wasted while doing so I'll lose multiple generators in just few chases.
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@DredgeyEdgey said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3470346#Comment_3470346
Speed that is lost when
using powerful
Getting stuned
breaking a pallet
getting blind I think
Getting hit
It's also kept for the case that they ever create an infinite by accident wich is rare but not impossible
Yeah, they love to bring up bloodlust and never say anything about all the ways killer loses BL and also the fact it takes time to build up the tiers. Meanwhile, the survivor with MfT is "Hey look at me I'm 3% faster just bc Im hurt and not exhausted."
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@MikaelaWantsYourBoon said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3474362#Comment_3474362
So? Just because it's 4 v 1 game, why killers have free haste effect which rewards them for bad play? Bloodlust was needed when we had infinities but this is not case anymore.
If 3% speed bonus is busted, then bloodlust should go too.
You do realize they did do a weekend with no bloodlust a few years ago and from what I understand it was really bad. We may not have infinities anymore but the maps are nowhere near balance enough to allow bloodlust to be deleted. Tiles still spawn in chains that are really easy for any survivor to loop around and waste a lot of the killer's time. The other day I had a map that had three pallets and a window that spawn so close together. I will be happy for Bloodlust to be gone if they can prove to me they can make balance maps for once and not survivor-sided messes like Graden of Joy, Toba Landing, Borgo, and Eyrie.