Akumakaji
Akumakaji
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@tippy2k2 said:
I can't speak for everyone but there is not a bonus level in the world that would make me want to play survivor in 2v8
As you probably know, I am a killer main, but I have had so much fun playing survivor in 2v8. Actually, I havn`t queued up for killer yet, because me schedule was so busy the last week, but I think I will try it tomorrow; those killer challenges won`t be solving themselves, ya know?
But I think that this mode is a big success. I am really interested to see with what builds BHVR will come up on the other killers. And it would be nice to hae maybe 2 or 3 builds per character, even though its understandible that we got to start small.
Also, more classes for the survivors would be nifty .. on the other hand, this might be a trap: just as random chaos mode, the charm lies in the simplicity. We tent to bloat things up with more and more options, until it just collapses under its own weight. So a moderate number of extra options would be nice, but we don`t need 24 different survivor classes.
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@HerInfernalMajesty said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/422097/2v8-scout
1 million percent. Yes! Scout is my favorite class easy.
I am also a scout main. It goes like natural with Lara Croft, which was best girl since her introduction into DBD not long ago.
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@Hex_Ignored said:
It's a throwing perk through and through, just like no mither. You bring it if you want to sabotage your team.
People are alway too harsh with perks that ain't meta and/or highly optimised.
I think Weaving Spiders has a bigger positive impact on the game, then nomither.
Weaving Spiders is strongest, the earliest in the game it goes off, when it affects all 7 gens. When Sable dropped, I would routinely check the basement and often interrupt a smol happening, but now I would 99% of the time just lose important seconds, and I rarely notice that suddenly a survivor becomes broken.
The broken effect is a bad debuff, but you can usually get the perk off uninterrupted if it's the first thing you do in the match, and that already puts the killer on the backfoot from the get go.
If paired with Laras perk and a BNP you might actually get quite the comfortable chunk out of a contested middlegen without the killer having any option to do something against this. If you really want to pull this off, it's not that hard and it wl all but ensure that you can get that gen down, even if the killer actively defends it.
Is this strong or strong enough to warrant its use? Well, its not meta, that's for sure, but well, it's at least a medium viable way of spending your perks and doing something differently, but I wouldn't say that it's automatically "throwing" or "sabotaging ".
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@I_Cant_Loop said:
The division is caused by people who refuse to play killer or survivor and don't play both roles. You all know who you are. You are the ones who are always posting "killer is OP" or "survivor is OP" stuff. If you don't play one side or the other, you have no idea how the things you are suggesting to make the game more fun for you (for instance, the post where someone suggested that the gen bug should be a feature) will make the game more miserable for the other side. If you don't play both roles consistently, I cannot take your opinions seriously.
Indeed, nothing builds empathy for the other side, then walking in their shoes regularly. These days I play closer to 60/40 killer and there are evenings where I just play survivor with my DBD friendgroup. Getting tunneled in 3min really isn't fun, but neither is getting BMed or facing unsurmountable odds as killer.
I am often the killers voice in my survivor matches, explaining why he might be mad, while also taking a good portion of the survivors frustration into my killer matches. But my bias will never go away completely, I can calmly getting BMed by the killer and explain his frustration, but 3 bad killer games in a row with survivors who just play extremely efficient without BMing me might drive me to tunneling for a couple of games, till I clear me head and sacrificed a cute survivor and then feel bad and appologize in chat
^_- This game can be so weird.
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@Gmoore23 said:
No you're right imo. I've noticed that the forums have what I think are the most toxic people in the DBD community. Obviously they're not just on here, but the amount of recent posts that have been complaining about one side or the other, or even complaining about the devs (who are just doing their jobs and trying to make a good game) is staggering to me.
I came into the forums looking for online friends that enjoy the game, no matter the side they're playing and no matter what the state of the game might be at a given point. But I've more often seen pure division and, honestly, a good bit of hatred between people who I bet would be friends otherwise.
Actually, this forum is the more civil parts of the online DBD comunity ^_- Reddit is basically fully survivor sided, and the Steam Forums is an utter cesspit of toxicity.
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@Xyphus said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3764107#Comment_3764107
Or 3rd situation - everyone gets to bleed out
Undoing all the work the hook respawn mechanic has done in one, fell swoop
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I'll leave my two cents on the matter. Facing a good and coordinated SWF can be one of the most dismal experience in DBD, if feels like your work is cut out for you at every turn, wherever you turn to, the survivors are already pre-running and the moment you do so, someone jumps on the gen on your back, putting extreme pressure on you.
And when you try to pick someone up, someone runs with background Player from out of Nowhere to flashbang you and you never feel save, or you get send to a map with brutal locker setups and 4 Head Ons, etc.
But (here comes to positive but) this aren't the norm of SWFs. You so often have duos that ate clearly marked as such, like having matching names or cosmetics and they often go out of their way to protect one another, playing suboptimal just to see their mate to safety and when one dies the other might give up, to follow them.
Me and my own SWFs, we are definitely not comp team level, we fool around a lot, slap each others butt's while on gens or whatever. We get the occasional save, but we aren't that super oppressive most of the time.
I would love if we could somehow limit the power of be comp team SWFs while leaving he others alone, and I think I have an idea how to do that. Mind you, limiting something is so often equaled to "punishing people to play with their friends", but so many multiplayer games impose certain limitations that aren't seen as "punishment". I think because it was unchecked since forever people are unreasonable allergic to any ideas.
Imagine if in a squad shooter like Overwatch you could run 5 tanks, that would be effective but probably also unfun and unbalanced to face, so that's limited.
And in the same vein, I would limit SWFs power a bit, without being unreasonable. What if we would limit perks to one or max. 2 per team? The hallmarks of a comp team are the plan and often repeated perks, like 4 Resilience, 4 Unbreakable, 4 DHs. If you limited the copies of the same perks by premades you would reign in the comp teams a little bit, but normal casual SWFs would not feel it at all or maybe just a little bit.
In my own regular SWF we have someone with Blastmine and Headon/Quick n Quiet, another one with Flashbang and some healing perk, another sirh some unhooking perks. Everyone has their own fun thing to do and we got really double perks. Just a thought.
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@coolgue1 said:
Concjdering the majority of the fourms are killers that just don't want to play a normal match or just blantley force a loss at 5 or 4 gens then complain why everyone is quitting on hook or better yet , more than half th3 community turning clear losses into wins BOOSTING THEIR MMR and the say the game is survivour sided no bro everything in dbd in the last year has become killer sided almost all maps reworked I to oblivion with mabe 8 pallets and 4 windows with the shortest wall possiable to guarntee hit at t1 or the god awful server taking killer hit regerstration over what the actuality were the survvour is instead of making ot clearly sided for that and yes i play killer faily often yes some game are difficult bit guess what their are alway going to be diffult game and their are a lot more easy them hard game most are just a steem roll 3 to 4k easy claps u can legit turn your brain off playing killer now a day
That they changed so much and dialed it more to the killer favoring side (I still wouldn't say that all this aspects FAVOR the killer) and the game still works just shows, how much the game was unbalanced in the survivors direction before, when killers were often the survivors plaything and at their mercy.
I think that we really need some really working anti tunneling system at this point and we need some hard caps for the max. numbers on gen regression, repair/heal speed, haste etc. The "everything goes, no restrictions" worked when there were 120perks and 20 killers, but by now this is a sleeping giant that is impossible to contain and manage and the sensible thing would be to just frankly disallow certain combos or perks on certain killers.
The best example being Awakened Awareness, that was fun and more or less harmless on Trapper, but absolutely insanely oppressive on Nurse … there is literally no harm done when a Nurse main CAN'T use such a perk at all, she will be fine and can try other stuff, but by restricting killers with whom such a perk would be clearly overtuned from using it (probably by The Entities claws), this opens up a lot more design space for the rest of the roster.
I would also prefere that med kits and toolboxes got some sort of special ability that destinguishes them, to give them more of an identiy. One toolbox could maybe instantly sabo a hook once per game, another could eat one failed check without exploding, more or less minor stuff like that, that shapes the way you play with them, like certain purple and iridescent killer add-ons do.
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@Aven_Fallen said:
And yet I see the same Slowdown-Perks as always, despite them all being nerfed, "ruined", "gutted", "dead"…
And I dont see the new Lara-Perk at all.
Because they are still the only line of defense many killers have, no matter that they got diminished in effect. You might rather use a blunted sword or even dagger, then no weapon at all.
BHVR is still clinging to their idea of "completely free builds" with a little restrictions as possible, but they somehow fail to see that this severely limits their design space. Hard caps on regression, gen repair speed etc. would actually improve the game, give them more control about whats happening and open up new venues.
I also think that they shouldn't shy away from limiting or restricting certain perks on specific killers. It would make keeping up a bit more complicated, but again, open up design space. Anyone remember how Awakened Awareness and its lingering effect had to be nerfed, because it gave Nurse pinpoint accuracy, while the perk caused absolutely no problem on Trapper? Why not just flatout prohibit the Nurse from using this perk?
Yeah, Nurse mains might be sad, but there are enough other killers to play, and by limiting ONE killer, a lot of others could thrive and have fun with a better perk.
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@YamamuraVideoRentals said:
Bugs aside, newly released content that is imbalanced aside…
DbD has glaring balance issues - the same ones for years on end. We've slowly come a long way since the game's first inception, like fixing hatch standoffs and infinite loops, but there is still much work to be done, and the game mechanics allow others to make the game extremely unfun and unfair for others. Just a quick list of issues (and there's probably more I'm forgetting):
- Generator speeds way too fast
- Camping and tunneling
- MMR
- Offering dodging
- Survivors hiding when they've clearly lost
- Killers slugging and bleeding everyone out
- Other QoL issues
Issue 1, 2, and 3 are all closely related imo.
#1 Generator speed is a common complaint from killers. As their MMR goes up and they start facing more skilled survivors, or at least, survivors who don't crouch in a corner the entire time wetting their pants, suddenly it feels like there's a million pallets and windows on the map, and organized teams will quickly finish 1-3 gens by time you down the first person. Slowdown perks were very popular for a reason, but many of them were gutted, and in compensation, the time to complete a generator was extended by a mere 10 seconds. Far too little, too late my friends. Because generators can be done so quickly, this causes many killers to resort to other less savory tactics in order to "apply pressure". See item 2.
#2 Camping and tunneling are even more common complaints from survivors. It's not fun being tunneled out of the game. It's not fair. The basekit borrowed time everyone gets hardly does anything, as most people from ages four and up know how to count to ten. The anti-camp mechanic we have currently is a terrible joke. Only people who are genuinely bad at playing killer will get this to trigger unintentionally. Many killers have some ability, be it a ranged attack, a form of teleportation or high mobility, or other zone control that makes proxy camping extremely easy. And even if a killer does not have any such power, all they have to do is stay a certain distance from the hook (which isn't much).
We have been told that "camping and tunneling are valid strategies" for years, but this is bullcrap. I interpret this as meaning they are not bannable offenses (which would be insane) but nonetheless these practices are not healthy for the game. It's up to the devs to change the overall feel and mechanics of their game so that these strategies are not so easy and rewarding. Below, after discussing MMR a bit, I have some solutions to these issues.
#3 MMR has always been controversial since its release, and frankly, it isn't implemented very well. In fact, it's been implemented very lazily. Looking ONLY at kills and escapes provides the least information, and can be wildly inaccurate. The old ranking system we had was somewhat more ideal, but even building from that, the emblem system we currently have is great for keeping track of all the things a player has done during the match. Killers get points for preventing the generators from being repaired, for chasing survivors and hitting them, for hooking and killing survivors, and for skillful use of their power. Survivors get points for repairing generators, running from the killer and avoiding being hit, unhooking and healing other survivors, and simply surviving as long as possible, or escaping.
These were pretty simple systems that kept track of all the things players have done in a match, and the overall kills and escapes can certainly weigh in heavily to determine an overall team performance. When we look at MMR, ideally a team of survivors vs a killer of equal MMR should expect to see around 8-10 hooks, or 2 kills. When adjusting MMR, look at the overall team scores, look at each player's contribution and performance, and decide if their MMR goes up, down or stays the same. Research how chess ratings are calculated and do a system like that.
Finally, swinging back to issues 1 and 2, I propose this: Once MMR has been properly sorted out, we'll do the following to balance the game:
-Matches with high survivor MMR take longer to complete generators. Make the additional time up to a whopping +30 or +40 seconds at maximum. Sounds like a lot? It is. But a good team shouldn't have any issue doing this. Remember that even at maximum, this is not +200 seconds to a match. With three survivors each on a different generator, it would ideally be only +80 seconds.
-Matches with high survivor MMR take longer to open exit gates. At highest MMRs, up to +10 additional seconds maximum to open the gate. This should make getting everyone out challenging, and not a guaranteed open gate just because one person was ready at the switch right when the last generator was completed.
-Matches with high killer MMR take longer to sacrifice survivors. It can take up to +30 seconds maximum for a survivor to progress to the next hook stage. Therefore, if the killer is camping, this gives more opportunity for the joke self-unhook timer to fill up more, and more time for the other team to reset, reposition, or even just do gens.
-Matches with high killer MMR have slightly more windows and pallets. This will make the killer's job harder, just as the survivors' objectives have been made harder.
-Matches with high killer MMR grant survivors longer haste and endurance times when unhooked. Up to +20 seconds maximum just based off of MMR alone, which should be plenty of time to get to another loop or tile.
-Matches with high killer MMR have increased anti-camp system ranges. Up to +12 meters at higher MMRs. But of course, other survivors in this increased range also foil the system and will prevent the bar from going up.
Final anti-camp and anti-tunnel adjustments: When a survivor is on hook, or unhooked, the server checks how many hook states that survivor has compared to other survivors. Example: Dwight has been hooked for the first time, and Meg, Jake, and Claudette haven't been hooked at all. Dwight has one hook state, the others have zero. That's a difference of one hook state compared to each survivor, and therefore, three total. While Dwight is hooked, the anti-camp system actually has a +30% additional range, and the bar fills up +30% faster. When Dwight is unhooked, his endurance and haste effects will last +30% longer, and the haste effect is +30% stronger.
Then, let's say Meg is hooked next. Dwight has 1 hook state, Meg has 1 hook state, the others have zero. So she'll get those same bonuses, but only at +20%. Then, let's suppose Dwight is hooked again. He now has 2 hook states, which is 1 more than Meg, and 2 more than Jake and Claudette. This will therefore further increase the effects of the anti-camp and anti-tunnel system by +50%.
Other changes: The anti-camp system still works during end game. If a survivor is hooked in the basement, the entrance of the basement is used to determine "camping distance" if it is closer.Lastly: because I also know such tools are used "offensively", the endurance effect granted from unhooking shall be negated if that survivor were to take a protection hit (grace period 5 seconds from being unhooked).
#4 Offering dodging. We have all probably seen this done by streamers, or done it, or at least had many of our own games prematurely end before they even began. I don't think there's any proper way to prevent this, other than keeping all offerings hidden. Let them be revealed after the game map loads (check offerings and perks with ESC), and people who choose to disconnect after the fact will receive proper punishment, as they should.
#5 Survivors hiding/AFK. There have been many topics about this already. When the game is just about over and the survivors have clearly lost, sometimes they all tend to be "rats" and continually hide and stall the game. At this point, they aren't even trying to complete objectives. They're just hiding, doing nothing, hoping the other person gets caught first. Well, we need crows. The current system won't give survivors crows who are continually moving around but doing nothing, nor will it give survivors crows who hop from one locker to the next. Simply put, what we need is a system that keeps track of what the survivors have accomplished recently. In two minutes, they will need to either heal another survivor, cleanse a totem, open a chest, open a gate, repair 20% of a generator, or interact with a select few number of killer items.. or start getting crows.
#6 The 4k slug and bleedout is just toxic and wastes everyone's time. Give survivors the ability to pick themselves up. Or give survivors a surrender option. Or do that thing you had years ago where the match just ends and everyone gets morid. I don't care what you do, just don't make everyone wait 4 minutes for the most boring and anti-climactic end of what I'm sure was a very "fun" match.
#7 Various Quality of Life issues:
- skill checks: Ever notice how like 80% of the time you're about to leave a generator, then a skill check decides to happen and blows it up? This has got to stop. Seriously.
- Hit boxes: Be it wonky ranged attack hit boxes, killers being fat shamed, invisible sky boxes, getting slowed down and caught on literally nothing, and really strange collisions, all our game maps need to be polished to the point where this never happens and isn't a source of immersion breaking and frustration.
- Totem locations: It really isn't good when totems are right next to generators in plain view, you know that? There is supposed to be a risk/reward to totem perks, but the reason most people either don't bother with them, or feel they must also run Undying is because often times totems are way too obvious and found too early in the games. At the very least, they should not be in plain view of generators, not completely out in the open next to a rock, and survivors should not spawn right next to them.
- Chests and killer item locations: This is one of those situations where again, I feel the coding was either very lazy or very poorly thought out. Killers like Onryo and Xenomorph in particular need their items in the best strategic places. Regardless, the placement of chests should not be prioritized over other objects that are far more impactful to the game.
- Colorblind settings: The game has been out for 8 years now, and all we have are some filters that don't actually do anything to help. Scratch marks and auras are the very big issues here. Give us a system in the menus to customize what color the scratch marks are, and also to customize the aura colors of various perks. This will be very helpful in the case that there is overlap.
I want to agree with a lot of your points, but there is one that REALLY rubs me the wrong way, and that the one that I will be commenting on ^_-
4) - Offering dodging
There is a better solution then just keeping them hidden, because offering dodging is a symptome, not a cause. Beside the couple of times when a new map releases and people want to experience it and/or get their map achievment done, offerings are used by premades with a plan and to stack the game in an absolute unfair manner against the killer.
Yeah, there is the occasional player who just played one for fun, but I would bet mony on it that about 100% of the times some survivor claimed "What, are you tripping? I only played "the Game offering" because I was tired of seeing the same three maps again. I didn´t know that it was considered survivor sided, never heared of that before", that they were lying.
It has been suggested so many times by now and I see it the same way: map offerings need to be reversed. They should not give one side an unfair advantage by chosing the map of their liking, BUT cause the burned map offerings realm to close up for the upcoming trial. This way a SWF could very well manipulate the map selection in their favor, but only if everyone was burning a different offering, thus skimping on BP or hatch offerings, a somewhat tough choice, for not guranteeing the map they might want for their shennanigans.
And it would FINALLY be an incentive for killers to actally play certain map offerings. You can bet your behind off, that I never played even one single Eiry offering with any of my killers. But Trappers might now play it, just to avoid the map that 100% counters ther power completely and lets them play without a power.
Hiding Map offerings and forcing killers into matches that are stacked against them won't do any good and might lead to games on end where survivors face killers sulking in a corner.
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I guess the general lack of enthusiasm to support his cause scared him away. I was curious myself ^_-
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@AmpersandUnderscore said:
It'll be forgotten about immediately, and won't change slugging for the 4k in the slightest.
I personally had three matches on my first day after the patch, where I thought "dang, I will need to slug this one, that hook was used up before", but then I remembered and lo and behold, that hook had respawned. No slugging occured, I hooked that survivor immediately :)
And since then I have not once slugged, because the survivors ran into dead zones. I slugged here and there for the 4k, yes, when I felt that I was up against a full SWF and they didn't show much personality all match besides BMing me, but my overall toxicity has gone done … until the generater bug reared its ugly head. Now I got to slug again, when I believe that the survivors aren't in a SWF, for fear of 2 or 3 gens completing. Isn't bugged DBD a thing of wonder?
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@TragicSolitude said:
Any perk that helps the opposition, usually sort of filling a skill gap or making up for a gameplay flaw, is going to be disliked by the opposing side because it makes it harder for them to exploit a weakness. If it's not a perk, it's an item or add-on (or, in the case of killers, a power). Anything that your opponent thinks helped you win will be called a 'crutch,' because they prefer to think they are more skilled and thus would've won themselves had that perk/item/whatever not helped you.
That's human nature in competitive play. (And all a generalization, of course. Not everyone is like this, but you will come across this type of mindset a lot.)
Complaints about perks that put you in a no-win situation, like the way Decisive Strike could so often do throughout its history, are more valid, but you can't really blame the person for running something that gives them an advantage; it's on the game devs to avoid such things and fix them when they do occur.
"Grrr, you whiffed 3 times against my 360s, so you are clearly bad and didn't deserve that 4k."
or
"OMG. You had no indication that I was hiding there and would never have found me without your cruch bird perk. Who uses spies with Clown anyway?"
or
"Batteries Included is so dumb, not even (gen) dead zones are safe to loop. Survivors got nothing"
are all discussions that happened in my post game chats, od course verbatim and slightly defanged to not get me banned here. So even clearly off-meta perks can and will tick off someone out there.
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That's your typical "moving the goalpost" behavior.
Like, when we (rightly so) got DH and MFT nerfed I made a vow not to complain about any other exhaustion perk, and I stayed strong, even though some of those saw a clear uptick in use, that's whats expected when something good gets nerfed.
You got the occasional rage post about someone losing against 4 SB or Lithing away to safety, but for the most part the survivor situation is pretty much under control.
Now, killer got a lot of their gen perks nerfed, and many STILL used that perks, because there wasn't much else to slot in. Weave Attunement showed many how good aura reading could be, and now many of us love to use aura readings builds, and that's what's getting complained about, now.
But here is the thing: while gen regression perk can be very hard to work against, aura reading perks on themselves don't do anything, they help you to initiate the hunt, bit you still need to complete the hunt on your own volition.
It's the same why getting hit by DH felt so awful, when it invalidated a 70s hunt 4 frames before it ended, while SB has its power front loaded and you get to decide in the first 10s if you want to continue chasing hat survivor.
4 Aura reading perks is indefinitely more healthy for the game then 4 gen regression perks,so please, just bear with it and adapt. Don't worry, we will find something new to complain about soon enough, anyway.
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When I read the title, I wanted to comment on the upstair gens on Hawkins, about the park gen on Greenville and to the lesser extent the upstair gen on Dead Dogs, but you already got most of these covered.
My friend with whom I regularly play always rages hard, when this gens are done first and expresses her hatred for randos.
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@Thusly_Boned said:
If SWFs were identified pre-match, it'd be the end of SWFs. 95% of killers in public matches would dodge anything more than a two person team. Myself included, except on the rare day when I'm feeling especially spicy.
Would this hurt me directly? As a strictly solo surv player, no.
And I'm willing to bet that many killer mains think they'd be okay with the end of SWFs, but it would kill the game if you essentially told people they effectively couldn't play with friends anymore. No one wants that.
My solution to the perceived dominance of SWFs is pretty simple: don't allow duplicate perks in a SWF and maybe a max. of two duplicate items. This would impaced casual SWFs, like the one I play in, very little, in our SWF most players have their favorite perks and don't go for meta builds. We don't escape every game, but a healty amount of times and we mostly have fun doing our own thing. But the organised seal teams would be toned down a lot, when not everyone could be running Resilience, DH, Unbreakable and their one token flavor perk, which would be either Windows, Iron Will, Head On (on Dead Dog) or the new Finesse.
People playing together isn't the problem, its this organised groups with a gameplan that they hope will make the killer DC, that are causing most of the backlash against SWFs.
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@Phantom_ said:
Almost certain that this is just a bug. Same with how Survivors can open gates without the "opening" animation being shown. Case in point:
I love Laras 1000-yards-stare as she focuses on the leaver to flick itself.
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@Caiman said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3764450#Comment_3764450
I'll take at least knowing who I'm facing so I can decide if I want to bother with the match.
And killers want to see SWFs, so they can decide the same. Now everyone is a full-time lobby shopper and queue times are hell, forever.
Yeah, showing who is in a SWF before the match is a pretty big no-go, BUT I still don't unterstand why its hidden AFTER the match. Sure, some peeps would make a word document of all the SWFs they encountered and check every time they queue up, but I rarely ever recognise a survivor that I played earlier, unless its super obvious.
The thing is that a lot of SWFs try to gaslight the killer, ala "no, we are just randos and played for the first time. You were just bad." or deflect attacks about the broken nature of some SWF tactics by claiming "lol, we are soloQ. Git gud. ggez."
Just show after the trial, who was in the SWF with whome, its no big deal, unless you really want to obfuscate something. But there is ONE thing that killers would notice with this system: how many of their sounding wins were against duos and trios and even full SWFs, who played suboptimally because they wanted to safe a friend. Especially duos are prone to this behaviour, with one often giving up when their mate dies, because they don't want to keep them waiting for too long. Behing HONEST with this information AFTER the trial would relativate a lot of the common "I get matched with full SWFs every second game and they are just impossible to beat" salty crybabies.
Source: I play in a full SWF all the time, and we are mediocre at best, but always try to cover each others behinds and going for risky and absolutely fullhardy rescues.
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@AmpersandUnderscore said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3764665#Comment_3764665
The reassurance version on the ptb paused the hook progress for 30s and was on a 40s cooldown. There was no limit of 1 per hook stage.
So, in theory, if 2 survivors ran around the hook using reassurance on cooldown, and the killer just let them, they could pause the hook state indefinitely. It could've been a hostage situation for the survivor on hook, and was easily avoided by letting the survivor on hook cancel the effect.
But people cried and got it changed into what it is now: one use per hook stage. It's just a striking coincidence that the change also made it so useless against camping that they had to put in an anti face camp feature later on as well.
But don't worry, people were just really, really worried about 3 players, including the killer, holding someone hostage. It had nothing to do with making a camping solution ineffective before it went live, oh no. Never that.
Even though the hostage issue was, again, completely resolved by letting the hooked survivor cancel the effect.
My prefered solution to the whole thing: give every player with Reassurance 3 tokens, tokens can be used every time you are in range of the hooked survivor and they aren't under the effect of Reassurance. Tokens don't refil, this will but a max of 12 tokens in the game, or 9 affecting the same survivor, amounting to a max of 4.5mins on the hook, IF three survivors spend all their tokens on that one poor survivor on the hook and the killer doesn't intervene in any way, only slightly longer then the full bleedout timer. And the "press E to chancel the effect" could still be implemented.
The token system would allow one single survivor to keep the one on the hook alive long enough, that camping them out won't be worth it for the killer, leaving two survivors to fully commit to gens, and that one survivor theoretically being able to progress a gen by 45s or something in that ballpark. THIS would make the perk more then a nusiance, without it being super oppressive and removing all strategie.
One other aspect I was toying with was to increase the range of the drive by by +1.0 or +1.5m per missing token, so that the perk could be activated from further away, lending a certain strategy to that, too. Often you have to get so close to the hook that you could possibly just unhook the survivor, defeating the perks purpose (I know that this is not always the case, but the 6m ((I believe)) are awefully close). I actually prefere not to camp survivors out, but hunt and chase the others, and if the meta shifts in a way that Reassurance becomes widespread, it wouldn't affect my games too much ^_- And I guess we would see much more healthy games in general.
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Damn peeps, I am all for a good conspiracy theory, but some of you are really looking for that potential one bad appel in every truckload of good, just so they have something to complain. A lot of other season passes have this basic infinite climb after the main climb with lots of meaningless rewards, just so that peeps can enjoy the climb once they are done.
One here is one thought for OP: you don't HAVE to climb to lvl 200, just take whatever you get out of it as a smol bonus.
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For real, though:
Deerstalker probably burst so many dreams of cool plottwists in DBD, but thats just the nature of fighting The Entity.
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@BlightedDolphin said:
10 seconds is way too much. Even if they just made it so the guard has a 10 second cooldown but the other 2 only have the original 3 second cool-down I think he would be fine.
Carnifex though will still be bad simply because of how ridiculously clunky it is to get him to break a pallet. Just make it so the drawing bubble spawns inside the Knight rather than in front of him so that the pallet doesn't block me from placing a guard and I don't need to readjust myself constantly mid chase!
CarnifeCarnifex should work differently then the others and just appear by looking at a breakable thing within say 6m and pressing E, together with a very short animation slowdown, but then he goes on a 30s rework.
Besides that, all 3 guards could have individual cooldowns and you can summon one basically immediately after the first one despawns.
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A crazy foil to this would be killers being able to mark one Exhaustion perk that they didn't want to play against, as the exhaustion perk is often the most defining build of a survivor and the closest thing in the direction of power with cooldowns, besides items.
Just imagine if all those DH players had found it nearly impossible to queue up for a game. In the same vein Nurse players or those using the newest killers shouldn't be penalised just for their choice of killer.
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@Deathstroke said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3764315#Comment_3764315
Killer adepts you need just 4K and well before they were easier when they required +2 pip which is pretty easy to achieve on lower grades. But well killer adepts are still easier to get for me at least than adepting survivor in soloQ.
I would say it was pretty unreliable in the past. Yes, after a grade reset it was pretty easy to do, but a week or two in and it became very challenging. I remember how I tried to adapt Artist when she was new and Pyramidhead whom I bought around the same time. I was in the iri ranks and had several matches were I got nearly everything perfectly, but that one heal in a corner lead me to not pipping up twice etc. It was hellish.
On the same vein, some killers had very bad kits and perks for gaining two pips, Plague was notorious for that, as her kit basically meant she was lacking in one department and you just couldn't use your power too much, or you would fail. Myers also would often lack in the chase department, because his preloaded instadown let him end chases in like 3s. Pit and her headtraps were another problematic adept. There were special guides and tutorials of how to do certain killer adepts. It was a hot mess and I am thankful that they changed it to only a 4K, that's at least something that will happen sooner or later.
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@MechWarrior3 said:
Better locker spawns, tone down the noises he's makes a little while in nightfall or undetectable. He is loud. Haddies Calendar base kit. @Blueberry honestly would know better than me, but from what I have learned from him this is what I could think of.
Its so counterintuitive that Dredge, while in his scary nighttime mode and stealthed, is soooo loud that you can hear him from the other side of any tileset.
Op specifically was against optimised locker placement, but I had a game on Lerys where my initial thought was "oh well, at least its an indoor map with lots of lockers", only to realise that the map literally had two quarter's without ANY lockers.not only did it gimp my ambush potential, it made moving over the map a pain, when I couldn't even react to a loud noise notification. Ugh.
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And please let us tag perks with favorites. I have some 10-15 perksthat I like a lot or that I might want to throw on as a counter, when I see an obvious SWF group. I might not want to dedicate a whole loadout slot to a counter build, but be doing it faster on the fly
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Here is an idea: you can tag one perk in the shop. Once you reach a new devotion level, that perks immediately gets unlocked for purchase, giving devotions an ongoing and somewhat reliable effect. Under this systems, new killers and survivors perks would be protected for 90 days.
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@Spirit_IsTheBest said:
Plague should lose her corrupt purge by any stun, no idea why it was only a bug, it should be an intended feature, I feel like her power is a lose-lose situation, you either stay broken all game, or give her one of the most powerful abilities in the game by cleansing, which is not fun to verse at all.
Chucky in my opinion is in an awkward position ever since his scamper was removed, I think it should return but increase the time to scamper by a lot more and add a delay window to hitting for 2 seconds afterwards, so the "free hit" aspect can be avoided easier. Increease his cooldown to 15 seconds in return.
Regarding Chucky, I am not saying that you're wrong, but just out of curiosity, what purpose would a scamper serve, that was "increased by a lot"? His old scamper gave him und ability to stay in the survivors heels and reliable hit them before they completed the short trash loops, but the timing was still pretty tight, if you dillydalied and turned to he wrong side for even a splitsecond, you wouldn't catch a survivor.
Scamper was more of a general problem (ignore one of the survivors main resources-> pallets blocking the way) instead of a mechanic that could easily be tuned up.
On a second reading, you might actually not propose for scamper to take longer, but for the cooldown to increase. Hmm, that could work, but a killer without a power is a sitting duck and Chucky is slow. He can still get some hits in by winning easy mindgames, but a too long cooldown is just not fun to play with.
On a sidenote: curving his charges was the most fun, and it WAS skillbased. Now its so unreliable, unless the survivor is running in a straight line or in midwich.
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I find it ironic, the respawning hooks made me slug decidedly less, but now I am slugging more brutal then ever before, because I need to preserve the survivors on deathhook, unless I am sure that they are a swf and probably stay to observe the match. Only once they are all slugged and potential Unbreakables are taken care of, can the hooking begin.
So this is a historical situation, where a mechanic is actually making soloQ survivors stronger then SWFs.
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@Rumplestiltskin said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/420986/about-the-gen-bug
It would be a poor design and as others have pointed out, would lead to a rapid drop in Killer players. There are plenty of tools in the game already for the Survivors, as a team, to make use of in regards to tunneling. Most of these tools weren't around for years and teams managed to get by. What I have noticed is that every time they add another base kit or perk option against tunneling, Survivors become more and more self-oriented. They don't go out of their way to take chases, hits, or play much as a team. It seems as if most Survivors today feel that the Killer should be chained to a tree so they can run around it taunting. How is it Survivors got by without all this help before? Why is it no matter how many things they add, Survivors just demand MORE? For the record, I play both Killer and Survivor. I've been around since year three of the game. I don't have many posts here because I came to find out about the Generator Bug and created an account to comment on it. Survivors already have MORE THAN ENOUGH to deal with the things Killers throw at them. At this rate, Behavior better get cracking on improving those Bot Killers because something will eventually give.
One of the most impactful and useful effect of tunneling is, when SWFs suddenly all rush to the area and try to defend their hapless buddy, taking hits, bodyblocking and NOT doing gens. It really gives you as the killer a breather and moment to ascertain the situation at hand, I sometimes just downed the survivor on deathhook, when I got one of their friends. But if they brought a map offering and/or played with lots of dirty tacticsthemselves, then I don't hold back.
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I must admit, when anti-facecamp was added to the game, I was super on the fence and against it, fearing that it would disrupt my gameplay too much and give SWFs another super unfun and unfair tool to assert dominance, but after the nerf that the bar didn't start immediately and kicks and environmental destruction would halt it, antifacecamp has become 99,95% a meaningless mechanic.
I still think that it's tough to balance and fine tune, but it appears that BHVR has all but stopped their attempts at doing so. When it got introduced I was scared to even threat into the space around a survivor and took a couple seconds to give hooks a wide berth, but that was totally unneeded. In all my time since the introduction, I personally got to use it exactly once, and as a killer I maybe saw survivors unhooking themselves 2 or 3 times, but only when I was already winning hard and I gave them a big staredown before strolling off. I MIGHT have set up a self unhooking maybe once or twice, but taking extra long searches around the bushes in the area, because I legitly saw a survivor, and when they moved away, this couldhave filled up the bar, but overall its a very weak and nonexistingmechanic.
Here is a thing, BHVR: please fine tune the effect, but whatever you do, let BOTH sides see the bar fill up. Transparency is key with this mechanic, and a killer who sees that he is close to filling up the bar will probably actually leave the area. Being open with the effect for all sides would also help to bring everyone on par what's happening and how the mechanic works, instead of "I believe of you smack the wall next to s hook and turn around 4 times, it slows down the bar enough, to chase a survivor around the hook", just show us the cause and effect and let everyone see it with their own eyes how it works or doesn't, and you will have much more valuable feedback this way.
EDIT: on a sidenote, the number of ACTUAL facecamping and killers staring into my face till I died have actually fully declined to zero. But I still think that the mechanic could be a little bit more effective and pronounced.
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@burt0r said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3764100#Comment_3764100
You need to add or quote them in your original answer too. Maybe they haven't seen it.
Thanks, I edited a shout-out in :)
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The thing is still pretty rough to compare. If a killer had shattered hope as basekit and snuffing a boon actually broke it, CoH would never have felt as oppressive and dealing out wounds made meaningless. In that case, yes, going 30s out of your way to snuff and brake a boon location permanent would have been totally in line. But the truth of the matter was (and to a point still is) that survivors can easily set up a health camp in a far off zone of the map. With a non-permanent solution, and a new boon springing up in its place before the killer comes back from their stroll, expecting them to take this 30s time off multiple times for the killer spot is just implausible. That's not a counter.
I actually never understood why killers Hex mechanic was an actual risk management gamble, with the effect potentially being removed entirely pretty fast, while survivors could boon ad infinitum. Many killer perks, like Coup de Grace, Merciless Storm or Tinkerer have limited activations per match, yet killers were expected from the get go to work and thrive with this limitations, yet it was never even tried with the boons, even thought some four iterations of patches and reworks.
The old CoH could have a place if boons had such a natural limit, like only boon each totem once, yet back in the days I heared survivor complaints in the discussion to always claim that they wanted full usage of all their perks and if a perk couldn't be used anymore at one point during the trial, they wouldn't use it least they played with only 3 perks, ie unable to boon of that at one point had worked through all 5 totems.
Mind you, not ALL survivors talked like that, but it was a point that came up time and time again, so it was a sizable chunk of the population that hated the idea of high risk vs high reward.
Circling back, once you know Franklin's/Weave Attunement is in place, taking the items into the far corner is a one and done slowdown for the survivors, but afterwards the killer can't bring the items back into play. Imagine if, after dropping the items off, the killed could spawn one item at a time at the busy places of the map by standing still and pressing their action button for 6s, like rebooning a snuffed totem. THAT would be busted, and the counter to carry items away would no longer be a viable counter.
On a sidenote, I have proposed a new system of overpowered perks in the past. The idea of this perks is that you could slot them into variable perk slots, and their effect would increase or gaining more and more utility. Like "CoH 1 slot: totems can only be booned once per totem", "CoH 2 slots: reboon snuffed totems" "CoH r slots: maybe double the AoE". Multislot perks could open up so much design space, it's mind boggling, but I should try to make this a new topic ^_-
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@TragicSolitude said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3764099#Comment_3764099
Aw, why thank you 😀❤️ That's probably one of the nicest things anyone's ever said on these forums.
I am sorry for the confusion, please learn how to play the game and git gud, biased killer/suevivor main or uninstall the game (I hope you feel a bit more at home now :*)
But for real, it was meant as an honest compliment. These last days I had a lot or pretty fun and nice matches with only a smattering of tunneling maybe the tides are changing? One can only hope.
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This would work as an analogy, if the killer could make the item, that you dropped into comp corner, re-appear on a busy part of the map, ideally with some line of sight brakers, by pressing and holding their kick button for 5s. A little bit of slowdown to reap massive benefits and that takes the other side an unreasonable long time to clean up, again.
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@TragicSolitude said:
the reason survivor queues are so long
A "queue" is the same as waiting in a line. You wait forever in a line when the line is long, meaning there are a lot of people ahead of you. When there are fewer people in line, then you get to the front of it quickly. To continue this analogy, killers in this scenario would be the cashiers, and the more cashiers there are to take the next person in line then the faster the line moves.
If your survivor queues are long, there are too many survivors and you need more killers.
You often write some very good comments, but this one here, this is modern poetry and hits, nay, SLAPS like a ton of bricks. Bravo :)
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@bazarama said:
Night night Knight
I love Knight the way he stomps around the map and his sword is a great base weapon but good lord does he suck following the new nerfs.
Ended up playing for a few hooks as against half decent survivors his guards are practically useless.
Far too easy to avoid or loop around and grab the banner.
Cool down is also far too long.
Maybe we need at least a smol Squire who picks the banners up and moves them out of the way.
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ANd actually, why can't they just throw everyone into the same queue? Some games you are with 3 friends, others with 7, you never know. Imagine in a game like Overwatch when you would have to manually decide if you want to defend a train or capture a flag. Just do und variations naturally.
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Whatever we decide on, he formal name shall be "a murder of murderers".
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In the past I sometimes would slug the last two survivors, when they went down in deadzones and try to coax them to crawl towards a hook or bleed out. A surprisingly large number opted to crawl into a comp corner, just to spite me and waste everyone 4mins.
Well, I had at least three games yesterday, where I was already on the verge to do so, but when I looked around, the nearest hook had respawned. This is such a beautiful mechanic. I understand that there was an element of strategy towards hooking in the past, but sometimes it was just unfeasable to walk out to the far corners of the map, just to preserve the middle hooks, and I for one am more then willingly to openly embrace the new system and rather hook then slug.
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@Pulsar said:
Ever wonder what a month in the life of The Pig is like? It turns out she’s quite busy, ambushing and fitting traps to Survivors well over a million times.
Survivors have been kept busy as well, collectively searching an average of 6.85 Jigsaw Boxes per match for the keys to their Reverse Bear Traps. These traps ultimately don’t kill many Survivors directly, killing an average of 0.17 Survivors per match, though the time spent searching for their key may be costly.
Let’s talk chases! Survivors spend an average of one minute being chased throughout the match, throwing somewhere between one and two pallets in the process. Before you accept your “Best Survivor Award”, keep in mind that these are averages: Some Survivors may be chased more than others in a given match, and others may not be chased at all!
On the Killer side, we checked how often each tier of Bloodlust is reached. Bloodlust I kicks in at least once in about half of all matches. However, the higher tiers are far less common.
If The Entity had an accountant, they’d be sweating buckets. With more than 88,000,000 matches played, over 13 trillion Bloodpoints were awarded throughout the Blood Moon Event – that works out to an average of 4,754,921 Bloodpoints per player.
This one goes out to the good sports who managed to set aside their differences after being hunted or battered by pallets and said ‘gg’ over 574 million times. Those who prefer to show their appreciation quietly have given props to other players more than 151 million times!
I knew you were knowledable about the game, but dayum, thats some sweet data you shared.
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Truth be told, this wouldn't be that bad. The only problem would be this games, that are the whole time on the razors edge, where you JUST barely manage to knock a gen down a bit to get the hook in and then speed back to defend that gen, etc. This games would completely fall to the survivors, because you would lose all of your defense tools.
I am not saying that every nerf had to be countered by an equal nerf to the other side, most of us can see past this, but the game is often too tightly balanced and I fear that we would lose the fun and tight games entirely with this change, if we don't reel in the survivors gen rushing abilities. I just have no good idea how so.
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@Akumakaji said:
While killers are in a pretty good spot at the moment, toxic behaviour of the other side will always be a way to curb the excitement and fun of the game. Every killer beyond their 3rd game know the painful conondrum of waiting for the egc timer to fill up, or face the survivors waiting at the exit gate, twerking at you, giving you a light show and rubbing it in that you failed to hook and kill them. Nothing wrong with being happy that you made it out alive, but really, this gets old really quickly.
So, please BHVR, realise this perk idea of mine and I promise you that it would be an instant hit and easily thow some meta perk out of the top10. I know for a fact that I would equip it in perk slot 1 of every single of my killers and never take it off.
General Perk: Just Leave
Effect: when lingering in the exit gates area for longer then 40/30/20s The Entity blocks the exit gates for that survivor, they become exposed and their aura shown to the killer for 6/7/8s. The block and exposed status effect persist till the survivor moved away 40m from the exit gates. Survivors leaving before their timer has filled up gain a +5k BP score event "Awesome person!"
@Akumakaji said:
Just Leave:
The survivors dispear in the face of assured victory is the sweetest morsel for The Entity and it loves to toy with their hopes and relieves.
After the exit gates are opened, standing within the exit area for 20s or crouching more then 5 times in total reveals the survivors aura to the killer, blocks the exit gates and exposes them. To get rid of this effects the survivor has to move further then 28m away from the exit gate.
@Akumakaji said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3305331#Comment_3305331
I talked about this in the other tread about letting players bleeding out, but I got the following situation more then I dare to count:
I killed two survivors in the same region of the map, turning it into kinda a hook dead zone. The last survivor knows that they can't make it out, but instead of taking the loss like a decent human, they decide to grief and run into the corner of that dead zone. If you pick them up, they will wriggle out and run back. This are the kind of players that would quite literally bleed out to death then to admit defeat and give the killer their win. Its quite the same as a Wraith standing over you gloating, while hitting their bell for 3min straight: petty dickishness.
Regarding the t-baggers at the exit gates: yeah, in theory you can just flush them out, but thats still giving them what they want. I really, really, REALLY hope that we will get the perk "Just Leave" this year. Please BHVR!!!!
Just Leave: when standing in the opened exit gates zone for longer then 15s or crouching for more then 3 times, The Entity closes up the gates for you and you gain the exposed status effect till you distance yourself further away then 24m.
Me and millions of other killers would perma-equip this to our loadout and never look back.
I have been trying (pretty unsuccessfully, as you should be aware) to get BHVR to implement this new general killer perk into the game. I know for a fact that I would log this perk into every killers first slot and never take it of, and thats a FACT!
New general killer perk "Just Leave"
Effect: when lingering in the exit gates area for longer then 40/30/20s The Entity blocks the exit gates for that survivor, they become exposed and their aura shown to the killer for 6/7/8s. The block and exposed status effect persist till the survivor moved away 40m from the exit gates. Survivors leaving before their timer has filled up gain a +5k BP score event "Awesome person!"
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@ays12151 said:
Perk is very good when Survivors don't try to counter this Perk and that's… good! There is no reason why perk shouldn't be more opressive, because Survivors are too lazy to counter the perk… The mentality of some Survivors Players is very questionable…
If Survivors decide to counter this Perk, it loses to much Power and Killer just loses 2 perks slots.
Last game I noticed for the first time, how all the items that I had previously slapped out of survivors hands, were wandering to one corner of the map. It was a little bit of slowdown, but not much ^_- I wished I had two other perks slotted and not a gaping hole in my loadout, but alas, thats the game.
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@Spirit_IsTheBest said:
Generator speeds are an issue apparently, so it's time to nerf pig.
Thats the right DBD spirit!
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@HexHuntressThighs said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3759614#Comment_3759614
The perk definitely is not fine, it’s literally one of the worst perks in the game without Franklins devise to help it. It needs to be reworked entirely.
The perk has a strong and useful effect, this alone makes it sorta "unfun" for some survivors, but why would you want this nerfed? The perk alone is rather useless, it needs to be paired with Franklins (I know, another perk that survivors kinda hate ^_-), and thus already uses up half the killers perks slots - slots that can't be used for the dreaded "omg every killer is using 4 slowdown/gen perks, I can't do gens!" combo.
If you don't want to FORCE killers not to use slowdown, you need to give them strong perks that are either fun or impactful to the game. And if you call for nerfs everytime something comes along that could shake up the meta, nothign will change.
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@GoodBoyKaru said:
Honestly there's a lot more nuance to his kit than you'd expect. Torment Tunneling is a pain, I completely agree, but there's not really a way to solve that that doesn't involve removing half of his identity and making Cages more like hooks, except for making Torment even harder to apply (when it's already a pain in the backside to do so). I find him fun because I play him, a lot, and you'd be shocked just how easy it is to read him once you've gotten good at him. My best advice is genuinely and honestly to drop your item as soon as you can (either use it and lose it or find a safe space), because any Survivor who holds an item is 50x easier to hit than anyone without due to it disappearing whenever they perform any animation, or queue up to perform one. You can tell someones going to vault a solid 0.5s before they actually start the animation all because their flashlight disappears.
Dang, I suck at reading survivors items, never got the hang of it, but it seems to be THE skill I should invest in, as I play Pyramid Head so much.
For me, the zoning part is useful and its fun to block a pallet that a sneaky survivor just wanted to run back to and dunk on you head, only to smack them what feels an eternity later, but this is also the part that survivors can easily predict. I rarely get hits at short loops these days, as some survivors are just that good and patient, knowing full well that they have all the time in the world unless they step on the line.
But blind prediction shots, this are the ones where I get so much payoff, because most survivors aren`t adept at evading them, as they are just running their regular loop.
EDIT: oh, and flicking? I tried it one eveing and got nowhere, so I dropped it.
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@BoopDaDoop said:
I am undoubtedly biased towards the killer side I'm not going to claim to play survivor consistently in any way but I am prone to read discussions silently.
The main cause of my confusion is that you don't want to just see pop pain res Grim embrace every game but when the devs introduce a new exciting perk that has counterplay and requires a synergy perk is the most complained about thing. I understand near constant aura reading can be annoying and on some maps ot may be problematic but I've never felt it carry games. If you don't want to see the same 4 perks but when the devs introduce a strong info perk like this or ultimate weapon it is complained about.
Disclaimers:
1.)this is a genuine question post not me saying you are objectively wrong for thinking weave attunement is problematic I just want to try and understand the other point of view.
2.) I am not always the best at judging balance I liked old mft because it didn't plummet my dopamine when I saw it like dead hard and sprint burst do.
3.) This isn't an us vs them discussion let's keep it that way this is for survivors who can calmly voice their issues with the perk so I can try and understand why it is currently so hated
4.) Yes I understand the need for a nerf on 2 story maps and it's synergy with certain killers.
Welcome to the forums, it might sometimes get heated here, but it's mostly civil.
I totally feel you, I am a killer main myself, but still play lots of survivor, evident by the fact that I managed to finish every last killer and survivor tome challenge (actually, I am slightly lying, as I am at my very last challenge and taking two protection hits away from finishing them all, but you get my drift :P)
I still think, for example, that Ultimate Weapon could have been nerfed a bit less hard, it's main problem was that the effect stayed with the killer and thus allowed checking potentially the entire map with one activation and the extremely short cooldown, but due to the scream it just gave a momentary screenshot for the killer of the survivors position, not even an indication in what direction the survivors where running. But people hated it, because it couldn't be countered by Distortion, just by the otherwise useless Calm Spirit.
And now it's the same with Weave Attunement: it basically needs Franklin's to be fully effective, on its own it's very lackluster. With this it's basically like Head On that's only effective if used in conjunction with Quick and Quiet, thus picking this perk essentially locks down half your perk allotment. And for that it's effect should be strong and tangible.
What I like with Weave Attunement is that I often get passive info throughout the whole trial, like when a survivor passes through an effected room or seeing one jumping on a gen, but most time I can't act on this info, so just knowing that someone is somewhere doesn't mean I will instantly jump and interrupt them, it's still good to keep in the back of my head, though.
Regarding strong, but fun perks, I really felt for survivors and MFT. Survivors had no strong new perk for a long time, and then MFT was obviously a problematic perk and had to go and I totally understood the frustration from the survivors side, but perks that mess with all the carefully tuned in timings off all the loops is bound to be problematic.
Same for Lara Crofts new Finesse perk, that's practically sure fire to be nerfed, because the timings are already so tight when hunting around a windowed tile set, this perk will mess things up royally again. The problem is that fun perks for one side are often very rage inducing or shall I say "unfun" for the receiving one and that's always a dance on the razors edge.
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Did my message get removed or dud I mess up while posting? I don't wanna repost if I did something wrong ^_- even though I think that there was nothing wrong with my text.