Adjatha
Adjatha
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- Adjatha
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A lot of people thought Corrupt Intervention should be basekit, but instead it got massively nerfed.
I'm not saying Kindred should be massively nerfed, but basekit Borrowed Time seems like PLENTY at the moment.
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@Chilli_man2400 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3047733#Comment_3047733
There is not one video of the devs facing a slinger. Also like the guy above said his nerfs were justified cause his ads made so many lose lose situations it was not fair at all
Oh right: that mechanic where survivors can juke just like every other killer attack, works at tremendously short range, has the tiniest little precision hitbox instead of Huntress' brickhouse hatchets, lets survivors use terrain/pallets/vaults to prevent a hit, and requires the killer to recharge after every single attempt.
What a terribly unfair power. So many lose-lose situations! They can only reliably hit even moderately skilled players at lunge-distance, but surely that's a total lose-lose!
You know what? I bet it was B O R I N G too! Probably O P P R E S S I V E for the game! If only all killer powers could be high-risk, high-skill, low-payoff! The game would be way more fun for everyone!
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"And let's put in an auto-kill mechanic that's too difficult to build up, can be removed with a trivial amount of non-effort, doesn't warn the killer when they're near to it, and is entirely in the survivors' hands to build it up enough to even function! And then we'll use that as the excuse for why we don't buff her actual power!"
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@Chilli_man2400 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3047717#Comment_3047717
whats that do I hear a biased killer main spewing bullshit that’s not true? Oh I do believe it is. Good job everything you said is not true
I mean, there's a YouTube video of Mathieu Cote getting flashlight bullied in a Korean Twitch event and shortly thereafter, they nerfed flashlights.
If you think public shaming doesn't motivate devs to lash out at the thing that humiliated them, you're not treating them like people. It's only human.
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He's terrible now. Feels terrible to play, has terrible results, and is terrible compared to every other ranged option in the game.
All of his nerfs should be reverted.
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Definitely not in the game yet.
Quit the game eight months ago. Came back to play 12 games for the masks, got 0k on around 10 of those games. No desire to go for a 13th.
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Bots can't come soon enough.
My biggest hope is that they'll actually do a really good job on killer bot AI to the point that we can push all 3 and 4-man SWF teams completely into bot killer games and rid them from the core pool. They get a high difficulty game type to abuse, and everybody else can actually play the game like it was intended.
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@Bardon said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3046123#Comment_3046123
One Internet Point for your excellent use of Pagliacci in a post!
Laugh, clown! At your broken love! Laugh, at the grief that poisons your heart!
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Trapper really needs:
- His traps that start on the field to start off set (and make him immune to stepping in his own traps)
- His traps that have been used/disarmed to re-arm themselves after a period of time (longer than the addon, but faster than Never)
They could buff Meyers by doubling down on his non-exposed T3 benefits. Make him Lunge further and Vault faster than every other killer by an appreciable amount, both in T2 and T3.
Sadako needs all of her CD numbers basically slashed in half. For that matter, turning off TVs and taking/returning a video tape should take at least as long as cleansing at a Corrupted Fountain (8 seconds), not the 0.5 seconds it currently does.
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Hexes are a complete joke at this point, and ruin is the Pagliacci of the bunch.
The only one not useless, incredibly niche, or nerfed to near-uselessness is Devour Hope. And don't worry: people will complain that one into an early grave as well soon enough.
Even if you leave out the hilariously imbalance of Boons, the whole "big risk for big reward" is just flat-out not true any more.
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This game has far too many phases of "the survivors have zero fear of the killer."
Putting even ONE window of 20 seconds to open the exit gate, where survivors can't just Perk their way to immunity, is the absolute LEAST they could do.
If you're 99'ing gates or waiting in the exit zone to teabag, that should come with a real risk to both yourself and your team; not serve as a victory lap to rub it in on the other side.
Nobody would watch a horror movie series where the characters all survive, even the jerk character who everybody hated and went through elaborate measures just to make the audience hate them.
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I would GLADLY sit in a 20 minute queue to avoid SWF.
I don't have any particular grudge against any of the killers, and wouldn't with an off-toggle.
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CoH and boons are bad for the game because a single perk, brought by a single survivor, from a possible pool of 16 perks, either: invalidates half of the killer cast by removing the hit-and-run gameplay style, or removes one of the killer's 4 perks by forcing them to take the 'destroy boons' band-aid that BHVR is adding.
Like, congrats: you just reduced the killer perk selection by 25%! How SKILLFUL of you!
It's wildly better than every other healing perk on the survivor side, even after THREE WAVES OF NERFS. The free-equivalent is also getting mega-nerfed, which makes CoH even better in comparison.
COH is literally: Pay-To-Win. And that's not good for the game.
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Pain Resonance actually did get a second nerf that is easy to miss:
Saboteur now shows the survivor which hooks are Scourge Hooks.
The whole thing about Pain Resonance is that it requires the killer to take their victim to a specific spot: one of only four hooks on the map (unless they're also running Monstrous Shrine, but who would). That means that attentive survivors (or every SWF team) can just see where the survivor went down, and Sabo the nearest scourge hook. Or, if the survivor being chased is one with Sabo, they can just run to a spot where there are no scourge hooks around and the killer can't make it to one.
Sabo is, for sure, becoming a part of every SWF team comp perk selection. And if you think Pain Resonance is too strong, you can just take Sabo and negate it yourself.
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Being rewarded for catching everybody once both feels good AND rewards gameplay that survivors are less likely to feel bad about going against.
It's a win-win and its removal diminishes the game as a whole. They needed to loop those effects into base game changes, not strip them out completely.
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You say that, but Pyramid Head is the single most over-hyped killer in the game, with people calling this B-tier character S-class.
And he has the absolute worst selection of addons in the entire game.
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How about we take a third to half of the pallets away from every map and then try it your way? You know, so they're actually a SCARCE resource, to be used sparingly and at times when they would do the most good? Instead of blinding running from one to the next throwing every one and staying undamaged for the entire length of the game?
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Self-Care fell onto the grenade meant for CoH.
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They buffed Clown! In a way that can also help survivors. And it fixed none of his problems.
They buffed Wraith! They did a good job! Oh no people like him now! N E R F E D!
They buffed Trapper! They made it more likely for survivors to escape your traps! They didn't fix any of his pre-game problems!
They buffed Sadako! They improved her by a ton! Oh wait, she was so bad originally that even with all of those, she's still in the bottom three of all killers!
They nerfed Pig!
... what, you didn't think they were going to BUFF pig, did you?
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The answer is no. When they release an A-tier killer, they inevitably nerf them. Even when they release F-tier killers, they're reluctant to move them up above low D.
They will never release another S-tier killer, except by accident (Twins before CoH and the various pounce/addon nerfs, for example) or if they're incredibly difficult to control (like Blight and Nurse).
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SWF groups of 3 or higher should be bot killers only, where they can just dial up the various stats according to group MMR. Then, killer players can stick to 1s and 2s and get balanced properly.
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@Devilishly_Rowdy said:
"Lets buff the hell out of survivors and buff killers a little bit too" This is the meta change in a nutshell
Now you have to go through 4-5 health states to down a survivor. Survivors hooked during endgame literally get a free escape when unhooked. A survivor meta perk made basekit. The second chance perks were SLIGHTLY nerfed (some are even better now), but they gave survivors new second chance perks in return.
And what do killers get in return? Literally negligible 0.2% this and 0.2% that, kicking gens takes off a whole 2 secs worth of progress! Killer meta perks destroyed (unlike survivor meta perks). The only noticeable buff to killer is the Overcharge+Call Of Brine combo, but that'll soon be nerfed too, as it is "unfun" for survivors.
The only right thing Behavior is doing is looking forward to introducing bots, they're gonna need bot killers real soon.
Yeah, you're right. Even just down to the perk-rebalancing. All seven killer "meta" perk got worse. Of the survivor perks, only 4 got worse. One was a side-grade (DH) and one was a straight-up buff (BT). And those two make up the 1st and 2nd most used perks on survivors! You'd think those two would've been the ones to get gutted.
But no!
Weird how that works, huh?
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Sell unwanted addons? Oh man, you could P3 Pyramid Head for pennies! His stuff is the biggest GARBAGE in the game!
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There is zero reason why the token mechanic of BBQ and WGLF is not a base-game mechanic. Both of these encourage players to play in ways that make the game more fun for everyone involved. Both give players alternate game-goals beyond "kill/escape." Both help reduce the BP grind for New Players, just starting the game and Old Vets who are trying to get every perk on every character.
They put a Hook Counter in the game, for goodness sake (and even make the killer version completely useless for no good reason). Bake in BBQ and WGLF. They objectively make the game better.
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The classic case of "take a popular killer, change their core rules to make them objectively worse in game and less fun to play, watch the number of active killers go down." Right up there with Spirit, Deathslinger, and Freddy.
"Fun to play" and "rewarding to use" are never the questions on the balance team's mind. It all comes down to numbers. How many new players are dying to a given killer. How many influencers are screaming about 'counterplay,' 'boring,' 'oppressive,' or any other of the go-to buzzwords people use to sidestep making an articulate argument. How many killer players are they willing to lose if they gut somebody's favorite to make the game that much easier for survivors.
It's pretty miserable.
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It's incredibly stupid that Borrowed Time, the second most used survivor perk in the game, got SIGNIFICANTLY BETTER in an initiative that was supposed to shake up typical perk loadouts.
That being said, Dead Hard needs to go. The revised version retains nearly as much power as the current version and it will not, in any way, discourage 3 out of every 4 survivors from running it. And the idea that any game has an option with a 75% pick-rate is one of the most embarrassing instances of game imbalance that I've ever heard of.
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Why would they stop? It's been plainly shown that if a loud enough voice can complain about a given killer, that killer will eventually be gutted. Regardless of how weak they are or how invalid the changes make them. Just look at Spirit or Deathslinger, or the recently-buffed-then-rapidly-nerfed Wraith.
It really just comes down to volume.
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They actively TOOK AWAY a reason for killers not to tunnel by removing the tokens from BBQ & Chili.
Perks like Grim Embrace completely miss the point that hooking each survivor once can take a REALLY long time to do, between the size of maps, the ability of survivors to hide, all the gen work going on while a killer is trying to find a new chase, and the sheer length of time it takes to down any one survivor, much less all four. The point of BBQ was that it gave you a great reward after the game was over, so it didn't matter that it took you 80% of the game to get to it.
No Way Out gives you an end-of-game bonus, but one that typically means maybe 1 or 2 extra hooks. Usually, it's just a little bit more time to use NOED (which has been nerfed and will now be much easier for survivors to take down without having to spend time on totems during the gen phase of the game). It certainly has uses, but even if you don't get all 4, you're still getting some bonus, which makes it less critical to disrupt the normal flow of the game.
Grim Embrace, on the other hand, is a complete failure. In balanced matches, you typically don't get a hook on each survivor until there are 2 or often even 1 gen left. At that point, blocking progress for a brief while isn't actually stealing that much time from the survivor team. AND you get nothing if you can't get all four before the last gen pops, which is flat out worse than NWO or (old) BBQ. The perk ought to block all progress for a length of time each time a new survivor gets hooked, and increase that length of time with each token, until the 4th one blocks gens (usually the last one anyway) for a much longer period.
But really, what the main issue is: there should be a REASON not to try to drive a single survivor out of the game as quickly as possible. And what that comes down to is: survivors who have been hooked, should not be as efficient as ones who haven't. A survivor who has been hooked should repair gens WAY slower than untouched survivors. That encourages killers to track down and one-hook each survivor as their absolute top priority.
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Thanks for the math.
The tl;dr of it seems to be that Scourge Hook: Pain Resonance seems to be the most efficient option (assuming you are getting downs). Though, the value of this perk has ALSO dropped, due to Saboteur now showing survivors (read: SWF) which hooks are Scourge Hooks. So, teams with a counter-killer-player can pretty soundly shut down your regression.
Also shows just how savagely Ruin got gutted. What a joke to leave it as a Hex.
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I don't have the numbers, but there may be fewer hooks on Midwich than any other map. It is extremely common for one or more hallways on either or both floors to have zero hooks anywhere on them. Every hallway should have at least one hook, but who knows what the map design team is thinking these days
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@MrJack20252 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3027714#Comment_3027714
i hate when people just tell me that, in high mmr survivors just avoid torment in loops leaving the loop, even if it cost them their life because they know that being tormented is 100% worst than just being hooked and they constantly try to bait your M2 and dodge it, you can't really use PH if people knows how to play around him.
Yes, that's correct. PH has significant counterplay options for survivors, but was nerfed in rapid succession like four times within a week or two of release because he was new and BHVR was super reactionary at the time.
It'd be like Clown getting nerfed because surivors never left loops and he's strong at loops.
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I have posted MANY times in MANY threads much to the same as your assessment. What it all boils down to is: PH has the ability to negate BT and DS against bad survivors. Despite these two perks being OPTIONAL, this terrible sin has condemned him to some of the worst (non-butchering) balance decisions in the game.
Is PH better than post-nerf Freddy, Wraith, Deathslinger? Yeah. Does he need all the layers upon layers of self-nerfs his kit has baked into it? No. Does he deserve a complete addon overhaul from top to bottom? For sure. Will he ever get one? Probably not.
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There's no good reason why they didn't do a map for Trickster. That could've been super rad.
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New Corrupt and Ruin should probably be baked-in mechanics. Killers are at their absolute weakest at the start of the game, so any role boosts should go towards that phase. As killers do better, losing those benefits gives survivors more of a fighting chance.
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They're absurdly weak and frustratingly unreliable. NOED is the only thing that has any chance of actually getting some use in the vast majority of games.
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That nerf is a significant nerf that does not invalidate the whole point of the perk.
Compare that to the Hex: Ruin rework, that might as well have been a giant flashing "DON'T BOTHER" prompt that flashes any time you try to select the perk.
Or compare it to the Borrowed Time rework, that tried to get players to stop using it by giving 50% of it to everyone for free, improved the base perk by +50% on its existing immunity, AND gives +10 seconds of +7% haste, making it better in every single way.
If only ALL the meta perks had been handled with the evenhandedness of Pain Resonance.
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There's zero good reason why killers don't get the exact same hook-state interface as survivors. They're the ones who did the hooking in the first place. All the current version does it punish forgetful players for no reason.
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There are SO MANY survivor tools to negate hexes, it's crazy.
They last for so little time and take so long to actually do something. And the two that actually saw any play ever got overwhelmingly hit, despite the "this boon literally invalidated a third of the killers in the game" has been nerfed three times and it STILL has the thing that makes it game breaking.
Hexes are dead. Just remove them.
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Despite the fact that I mostly play killer, and mist mostly helps survivors, I am all for bringing back effective mist (and darkening the super-bright stages we've been getting).
The atmosphere of the game is far more important than I think the folks at BHVR realize in this day and age.
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Almost as if if you're using white text, you should put a black outline around it.
Graphic design 101
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@ChurchofPig said:
The only thing is for DH to work now, you need to be spot on with reading the killers movements. It is, after all, a 1 second effect.
The old one was 0.5 seconds and it certainly seemed to work pretty well. I'm confident that DOUBLING the available window of use will keep DH firmly in the meta
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@Rogue11 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3022152#Comment_3022152
Similar to how they said they intended to shift meta away from slowdown perks and then proceeded to buff half of them...
You are cherry picking a distance where the survivor is already right next to the pallet. Let's set the pallet 8 meters away and see what happens. How about looping the long away around shack to squeeze out an extra loop? There are many situations where it was strong before and won't be now. See how it plays on the PTB and go from there. It's still a perk and should still have utility, whether you like it or not.
Now who's moving the goal posts? You said "dead hard for distance" and 4 meters of invincibility is distance, my friend. And it works out to be 14 meters if the killer actually DOES swing during Dead Hard, with the speed boost the new DH will give, compared to the 11 meters the survivor would've gotten in the old system. Plus, you can use it to get a free vault, never accidentally deposits you up against a wall, and lets you be immune to attacks while unhooking, which the old version never could.
The new iteration ISN'T a nerf. It either needs to get legitimately NERFED so that fewer than 3 out of every 4 survivors use it, or it needs to be removed. Full stop.
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@Rogue11 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3022129#Comment_3022129
They did nerf it by removing Dead Hard for distance. But hey, lets move the goal posts again.
A survivor is being chased by a killer. The survivor has Dead Hard available to them. There is a pallet nearby that they are running towards.
Under the old Dead Hard, the survivor presses E to get up to the pallet. They move around 4 meters forward, remain invincible for the duration, and drop the pallet. The killer does not get a hit and the chase continues.
Under the new Dead Hard, the survivor presses E. The killer can:
- Not swing. The survivor advances around 4 meters without danger in the full second of invincibility, drops the pallet (probably stunning the killer unless they back off), doesn't get hit, and the chase continues.
- Swing. The survivor takes the hit without going down, runs at 150% speed, drops the pallet, and continues to run at 150% speed, actually getting more distance than they would've under the old system.
Explain to me how they 'removed' the distance aspect of the perk?
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@Rogue11 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3021767#Comment_3021767
I thought the problem everyone had with Dead Hard was the uncounterable distance part? Isn't this what killers wanted? Now it takes skill and timing to dodge the hit. Or did you just want the perk deleted instead of balanced?
The actual, posted stats that the Devs shared said that 75% of survivors use Dead Hard.
There's a simple principle in game design that says: If everyone uses one option, that option shouldn't exist because it's no option at all.
If they're not willing to actually nerf the perk, they should just delete it instead, yes.
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@Rogue11 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3021387#Comment_3021387
How are you coming up with 12 meters of distance when it's 1 second of activation with no speed boost. That's 4 meters at normal survivor movement speed...
When you get hit (even when you're Enduring), you get a 150% speed boost, which lets you move at 6 m/s. Since the duration of the speed boost was 2 seconds, that means 12 meters, while the killer is hit-stunned.
Using the updated values, that head-start is 10.8m. The successful attack cooldown is 2.7 seconds now, which means you're actually getting (1.8 x 6 + 0.9 x 4) = 14.4m.
Once again: you have twice the window of invulnerability to get hit, you have more control over your movement during invincibility, AND you get WAY more distance.
The idea that this change is a 'nerf' to the SINGLE MOST USED PERK IN THE ENTIRE GAME is a complete joke.
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Freddy had a high kill rate because survivors didn't bother to wake themselves up and didn't change their looping tactics to 'throw pallet and hold W' back when he was on top. So, basically, he did very well because survivors chose to play poorly. He's been nerfed up down and all around, so most people have given up on him. The few who do still play him are likely skilled players, and the character's kill rate looks much higher but only because the sample size is so much smaller.
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DS didn't lose the "jump into a locker and be immune to damage" exploit at all, but sure. Considering CoH wasn't touched, DH is essentially the same, and BT actually got buffed, let's go ahead and revert the stun duration and survivors can keep using the same four perks ad nauseum for every game and against ever killer.
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@Seraphor said:
1. It cannot be used purely for distance any more, you have to use it at precisely the right time.
2. It cannot be used to avoid powers. E.g. bear traps, trail of torment, shock therapy, etc.
3. Using it successfully requires you to mend, so there's a time cost.
4. You cannot use it if you're already under the effect of Deepwound. E g. BT or Off The Record.
The duration increased from 0.5 seconds to 1 second, so you actually have to be LESS precise. And the reward of getting a full speed boost AND the killer being locked into the 'hit stun' versus the 'miss stun' means you get way MORE distance than before. Also, you can now use it to vault or unhook with complete safety from attacks (other than grabs, but you can still just instantly release the rescue to fake out the grab and then you're still uninjured, since Grab Validation got thrown out for 'just attack instead').
This rework will, in no way, discourage a majority of survivors from running Dead Hard every game.
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I agree, but would also add that Endurance needs to give the survivor a white aura. There's no reason why this "don't hit the guy" condition is kept secret from the killer, when things like Exposed are revealed to survivors.
It's the same idiotic notion that led to Survivors getting an accurate hook counter for every team mate, but killers only getting a 'total hooks' wheel. Like, they're the ones who hooked the guys in the first place! They KNOW how many times somebody has been hooked already. Not showing them the accurate information doesn't prevent tunneling. It just makes it feel like the people in charge of the UI don't care about killer players.
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@Marcavecunc said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3021373#Comment_3021373
Someone mentioned that BHVR confirmed in a tweet that it will have a visual, so you'll be able to know when the survivor activates it and act accordingly.
Killer swings still have an animation delay to them, so survivors can just wait to see the wind-up before hitting the button and get away for free every time, though. The visual cue only helps killers for survivors who just hit the button in advance. Which, since it gives them a second of invulnerability, they'll always do one second before getting to a pallet/vault, with nothing killers can do about it.