ays12151
ays12151
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@Spirit_IsTheBest said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3799867#Comment_3799867
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3799865#Comment_3799865
You both should at least be explaining on how it's braindead, rather than leaving out any reasoning on how you believe so. Not because you think it's "annoying", or "busted", I'd like to see you both make actual statements on how it actually affects you in matches, otherwise your arguments won't go anywhere.
Survivors don't need to use braincells to know where Pallets are and with this perk the distance between the Pallets is more clear for Survivors and carry them chaining the loops.
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Windows Of Opportunity is just stupid perk that shouldn't exist. It makes Survivor Gameplay braindead.
Previously people didn't use WoO (when it had cooldown) that often because back in the days other perks were much stronger than current.
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@Merciless_Killer said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3798482#Comment_3798482
No it wouldn't. You are just proving you don't know what you are talking about. SM's drones got reworked to not affect survivors on gens. She literally can't defend gens like she used to. Stop lying.
But if Survivors dont want to destroy her drones they gonna get affected by them. The drones are near the Generators. She can use them very well for 3 Genning. You better start not lying my dear. Have a great day.
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Distorion change is one of the best they could do. You can counter Lethal Persue at the start and you can get your Tokens back while chasing with Killer and escaping them. Thanks god all rats will be eliminated from the game - at least the part of them. Good Job BHVR. It's not 2016 and playing hide and seek.
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@Merciless_Killer said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3798364#Comment_3798364
You do realize 3 gen skull merchant hasn't been a thing for a while, right? Jesus you people need to get new arguments. No having one scan line won't make her "more skillful" it will just make her clunky.
Making Skull Merchant doing rotating with her drones would make her more skillfull for sure.
I do realize that 3 Gen Update came out w few months ago, but it didn't eliminate 3 Gen Situations and these situations are mostly against Skull Merchant
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People here that think Predator or other Reworked perks will be meta are crazy. Thanks and have a great day!
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@GeneralV said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3798342#Comment_3798342
You don't even imagine how happy I would be to never see Wesker again.
Bad Weskers are very easy to loop, but the strong ones are very good, because they sacrificied so many hours on him and they deserve respect for that. They just destroy Survivors in chase when others Wesker players can't. Respect for Wesker Mains.
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To be fair most of Skull Merchants players just summoned these changes. Shull Merchants players usually play with boring playstyle (usually 3 Gen) that requires almost zero skill and that's why people hate to play against her. After the Update Skull Merchant will need to rotate with her drone to acutally apply the effect on the Survivor. I know she is nerfed to the ground, BHVR can add some buffs for her, but with 1 Scan Line she is more skillfull to play as, right?
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@UndeddJester said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3796988#Comment_3796988
Wait, the 3% on Beast's Mark's is a multiplier for Bubba's max chainsaw movement speed!?
God damn BHVR, just when I thought I'd gotten used to your movement speed percentages, you sweep the leg again xD
They usually count from Power Speed - same with Spirit Billy etc etc.
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@Devil_hit11 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3796788#Comment_3796788
i feel like most leatherface player will take lazy route and just do short chainsaws like old leatherface before he got reworked. that is why i said that reducing acceleration will make him less skillful to use.
About a second part of you message - I don't like the idea… All I want to make Bubba strong in chase and remove bringing The Beast's Marks everytime and give him some nice new Add-Ons.
What i am saying is that leatherface chainsaw chase is already very strong. Despite that, no one publicly thinks that Leatherface is a strong killer because average perception believes that only strong killers are killer with extreme map mobility which leatherface does not have.
The same was with new collisions. Many people were saying that Bubba will be easy to use and may be out of control on some loops. But guess what happened? Nothing special.
they did this change to attempt to fix infinities vs leatherface chainsaw on maps like Eyrie crow with those branches/twigs but i think issue is the map geometry itself and not the chainsaw hitbox.
First part just doesn't make sense. Like chasing people with 1 Token and it's lazy or something? I don't get it.
Bubba's Power in chase is decent, but not very strong and requires so much skill to use it properly against better players. Most of Killers that have mobility - in the same time they have better chase power than a Killer that doesn't habe mobility - Spirit / Billy / Blight etc etc.
They did decrease hitbox to navigate easier in tight spaces. And it didn't solve the problem with Eyrie Of Crows and some other hitboxes.
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@UndeddJester said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3796148#Comment_3796148
Interesting, I started playing way later than that point.
I keep informed on DBD history by talking to older players, watching old streams and reading guides and noting how they've changed over the years... but I've not really seen much of Bubba in these history dives, so I've never known Bubba's gameplay during that time...
Based on my experience with Bubba, acceleration makes a big difference in scoring hits. Prior to his buff, what made Beast Marks so good in my experience with him is the fact it not only raises your to speed from 5.29 to 5.41m/s (I think... the 3% I believe is off the standard 4.0m/s movement speed), but it also means your acceleration is faster, since you obviously have to accelerate quicker to reach a higher speed.
Doing a little maths 60% of 2s is 1.2s, so for each scenario:
- 3.45 to 5.29 is an acceleration of 1.5333m/s²
- 3.45 to 5.41 with BM gives 1.6333m/s²
- 3.55 to 5.45 in 0.5s gives 3.8m/s²
On top of the fact you're already moving faster and the start and end... if BM is considered good on old Bubba at 1.6333m/s², 3.8m/s² is more than double that...
I love Bubba, and think he definitely needs some attention... but this set of numbers looks like a hand grenade to me... So while I'm with you I spirit, these numbers look very dangerous to me...
After crunching a lot of numbers, making his time to reach max speed 50% of the sweep duration instead 60% makes him like he was before, but without the acceleration drop caused by chilli's, and seems much more reasonable... though this solution still makes BM ones of his best add-ons, and doesn't fix CTG…
So personally I'd be much more in favour of locking his acceleration at 1.6333m/s² regardless of max speed and add-ons, then we can look at fixing everything else.
But if I'm wrong on anything, do please tell me 😅
Carburetor Tunning Guide is fixed since Patch 7.1.0. They added specific code for this Add-On, but they didn't touch general acceleration code. This Add-On applies 0.3 seconds acceleration penalty (from 1.5 seconds to 1.8 seconds).
Before 8.0.0 Bubba Buff - The Beast's Marks was increasing movement speed from 5.29 m/s to ~5.45 m/s (aka 136.21%).With The Beast's Marks he could start at 88.83% movement speed and end at 136.21% so he still needed to accelerate 47.37% movement speed in 1.2 seconds. At base kit he needed to accelerate 46% movement speed in 1.2 seconds so speed Add-On didn't make difference if we talk about acceleration.
I recommend to check Bubba's History on Wiki.
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@Devil_hit11 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3796174#Comment_3796174
i doubt they're going change acceleration because a big part of leatherface's skill is predicting acceleration ahead of time and knowing where you'll be in the chainsaw 5 second later. removing will make leatherface too easy to use.
Leatherface will never perceived as good enough killer because of perception that you need *cross map mobility to be a good killer. So outside of reworking him to work more like Oni's demon fury in 3rd person, nothing else would give a perceptive elevation in power. Texas Massacre game model for his power works is what BVHR's power for leatherface would have to look like for player to consider Leatherface as good as Billy. Anything else and it is not enough. A change like this was entirely change how leatherface works. He would move slower then Oni, like 135% speed but he'd always have his power up making Oni feel like a inferior version to him. As a result, i don't know if a change like that is in BVHR card deck right now.
The first part what you wrote doesn't make sense. If they would add new acceleration code - the skill ceiling on this part doesn't change. Bubba will need to know what distance he can make with new acceleration. The same was with new collisions. Many people were saying that Bubba will be easy to use and may be out of control on some loops. But guess what happened? Nothing special. He just doesn't bump on weird collisions and strong Bubbas need to correct their current knowledge and start learning to use new collisions on their advantage.
If for example his Chainsaw Tokens would click themself automatically - that would be bad for example. But not the things we mentioned.
About a second part of you message - I don't like the idea… All I want to make Bubba strong in chase and remove bringing The Beast's Marks everytime and give him some nice new Add-Ons. I don't want to make him A or S tier Killer, becaue it's impossible, but make him stronger in chase and make him more fun to play as.
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@SoGo said:
I hope the acceleration bug gets patched, it effectively wastes one of the charges.
At least they should create a new code or just change the value from 60% to 30%. At least. But it would be nice to just set constant value and Add-Ons wouldn't have impact on acceleration.
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@ppmd said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3796148#Comment_3796148
His old acceleration wasn't an issue before because he was just far slower right? I don't know for sure how'd I'd feel about these changes without seeing them, but this argument I don't think makes sense.
Do you think it might be better to give Bubba some mobility mode instead of just buffing his chase further? I don't really want another oppressive killer in chase, but allowing Bubba to get around might actually help him create and make more use of dead zones he can easily create.Creating dead zones at current Dead By Daylight is kinda impossible - even with Killers such as Leatherface. Many Pallets on almost every map. With Add-Ons his speed was almost the same - like 0.5% difference so my argument does make sense. Thank you.
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@Devil_hit11 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3795720#Comment_3795720
yeah no kidding. If they want buff bubba, i suggest buffing forced hensitation perk. the current radius is only 16 meters. Perhaps increasing it to 24 meters would be good. I have been using it on bubba and finding a lot of success with it but the perk is often out of range. Works pretty well with Beast marks and Iri flesh.
It's weird buffing an Killer with buffing Killer perk, but about the perk : Yes they can increase the range a littlt bit, but this perk has much worse problem - even if nobody is nearby - perk still gets a cooldown.
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@UndeddJester said:
In regards to this suggestion, it is interesting, but there are a lot of big number buffs there I need to crunch to fully understand the picture… but the initial gut feeling is his acceleration looks pretty cracked in this configuration… I'd be a little worried about him becoming rather oppressive at most loops
This acceleration was a thing in patches 4.1.0 - 4.3.0 and it wasn't a problem at all. My posts fixed problem with Carburetor Tuning Guide where the current code just destroyed this Add-On, because it counted 60% from the whole Chainsaw Sweep - 7.5 seconds, because with this Add-On you have like one big charge (60% * 7.5 seconds = 4.5 s acceleration time).
He would be strong Killer in chase that still chase many ways to counterplay. I'm pretty sure he wouldn't become boring Killer to play against like Xeno & Chucky.
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@UndeddJester said:
A lot of stuff to unpack there, but the main thing I think Bubba needs is his acceleration to max speed be unlinked from both his chainsaw sweep duration and his max chainsaw sweep speed.... at the moment he's too add-on reliant.
Currently his acceleration is defined as 60% (1.5s) of the chainsaw sweep duration (2.5s), and the difference between his slowest chainsaw rev speed (3.45) and max chainsaw speed (5.35). Back when he was a base line 2s duration, this 60% gave him 1.2s to reach max speed, which was then modified by chilli's.
His issue back then was Chilli's required Beast Marks to function on the longer duration, but if you werent taking Chillis's, BM gave you a faster acceleration and allowed other add-on combos. With chilli's now basekit his longer chainsaw sweep at base makes him slower in catching up to survivors after he starts charging his chainsaw than he used to be... and is even more pronounced if you take another chilli add-on... so he's now even more reliant on Beast's Mark's to offset it to function like he did before. I consider the new chilli's add-ons bad now for this very reason.
You also can't really mind game with a quick rev any more cause the 3s duration to tantrum makes it so even a minor sneeze at the chainsaw is building tantrum too quickly.
At the moment I consider Beast Marks (or Scratches on a budget), and long guide bar mandatory on him.
If his time to reach max speed was made 48% (1.2s) of the sweep duration at base however, and both Chilli's and Beast Mark/Scratches moved that 48% up/down relative to how they change his acceleration timings so that everything was consistent, that would fix a lot of his add-on dependency and actually allow us to use his other add-ons.
EDIT: actually made a slight mistake, cause I forgot he was buffed from 5.29 to 5.35m/s on his chainsaw max speed... doesn't change much of my point. But for clarity:
- Old Bubba at base has acceleration of 1.5333m/s² at 60% of sweep duration.
- New Bubba at base has acceleration of 1.2667m/s² at 60% of sweep duration.
- Instead of 48% it should be 49.5% (1.239s) to get the same 1.5333m/s² acceleration on Bubba.
Might as well make it 50% as a slight buff to Bubba isnt a bad thing, then shift it accordingly for Beast Marks/Chilli's
Once that's fixed, carving a place for him in DBD would be much easier...
I know all stuff about Bubba, but it's nice to explained it to others!
Currently, Leatherface minimum acceleration is 1.5 seconds and maximum acceleration 1.92 seconds (including Award Winning Chili & Carburetor Tuning Guide). Acceleration thing needs to be changed and bring it back to old form from Patch 4.1.0 - 4.3.0, where he could reach maximum speed constantly after 0.6 seconds.
Here I put old screen of his Acceleration and how should it work.
That's why back in the day his Add-Ons like Chilis & Carburetor Tuning Guide were much better, because they didn't increase acceleration time.
About triggering a Tantrum fast - 3 seconds. It shouldn't work like that. It's a bug or unintended change, because BHVR didn't mention any nerfs for Bubba in Patch 8.0.0. They decreased Tantrum duration and accidentially decreased Overheat Trigger.
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@sickdeathfiend said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3793178#Comment_3793178
obviously your mmr was at the lowest it can be if their hours were that low, so probably easy games, makes sense. For the majority of players, that is not the playing experience. Def not mine.
Killers weren't weak, but good communication can destroy many Killers in Public Games.
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@Azulra said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3793171#Comment_3793171
I don't really ever see any Freddy's, Pigs, or Ghostfaces using Corrupt very often even more so with Onryo players. And I don't really see as many Singularities using it now with his new rework.
The Billy add-on I mentioned wasn't his charge speed add-on, it was his Thermal Casing add-on that you suggested to be changed so that it increases his movement speed while charging the chainsaw by 2.5% which, by nature, encourages back-revving.
Nurse is the strongest free killer in the game. She is slower than the survivors when it comes to her "running" speed meaning it is physically impossible to run after a survivor and you're suggesting a 12 second cool down to her power for missing which would force her to run after survivors. This would significantly lower her power level which would give other DLC killers the ability to pass her on power level. Also, no, Blight isn't a free killer because he's a DLC killer. There's base-game DLC and Licensed DLC and the only free killers are the ones that you start with upon playing the game for the first time which are Trapper, Wraith, Billy, and Nurse.
Spark Plug giving +12% charge speed would make the downside of Beast's Marks essentially non-existent and would make how fast his normal charge speed annoying for a lot of players.
The reason that Shadowborn change would be very unhealthy is because +10% Haste for 20 seconds means that the Haste would last significantly longer than any blind the survivors do to you and that much Haste on a killer is already strong enough to, essentially, guarantee a hit which would be fine on its on for the most part until you realize that there'd be a 30 second Exposed effect stacked on top of it meaning that it'd be, essentially, a guaranteed down for blinding the killer which would be making so many people upset.
Even at max stacks you can still get a save against a killer with STBFL because of the AFC system. I know this because I tested it when the new system first came out. By time the killer reaches them they've already filled up the unhook bar so hitting them won't even stop the unhook from happening meaning that both survivors will just run away. Plus, even if BHVR did this, they wouldn't have that part working during endgame where most of the face camping happens now because BHVR essentially made it clear that face camping is actually encouraged during end-game to "secure that final kill" as they said which is also why AFC disables during that time.
The Hindered on Nemesis was shown to not be problematic since everyone who played the PTB pretty much all agreed that it wasn't all that bad since you 1) took no damage for getting infected, 2) got a major speed boost for getting infected meaning that all the Hindered really did was reduce that speed boost's effectiveness, and 3) since there's only 4 vaccines(one for each person) that means that you're more than likely only ever gonna get this Hindered 1 maybe 2 times in the match.
With your changes you said that Nurse, Billy, and Blight wouldn't get the base-kit version of it nor the perk version of it. Also, regardless, you physically CAN NOT EXEMPT killers from using any teachable perk no matter how you feel about it as this goes against the fundamentals of "teachable perks."
As I said before, THEY ALREADY TRIED THAT with Windows and nobody liked that. The perk originally had a 60/50/40 second cool down and absolutely everybody hated it, then BHVR dropped it down to a 30/25/20 second cool down and everybody still hated it, then they removed the cool down altogether so everyone would stop complaining about it. The ONLY way I would change the perk is make it so that WoO only shows the auras of windows and the pallet aura part should, honestly, be transfered onto maps so people would actually have a reason to use maps.
I'm not gonna respond once more - mostly I disagree. Spark Plug thing was very funny to read though 😅
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@Toystory3Monkey said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3793174#Comment_3793174
Bubba didnt get any specific interactions with the system itself, only a tweak to his power.
Similar changes could be made to Nurse/Blight/etc like making their power start on cooldown.
And, obviously, if some design feature is bottlenecked by certain killers, you either dont add it or tweak those killers till they no longer bottleneck it. Or you just ignore them as exceptions - trickster/huntress/bubba with anticamp system who can proxy and guarantee downs just as easily.
In my opinion your mindset was wrong and I just gave an example.
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@ExcelSword said:
You say that Nurse, Hillbilly and Blight don't get to have corrupt intervenetion because they can traverse the map in seconds. What about Dredge? He can travel across the map faster than all 3 of these killers, so much so that Lethal Pursuer means he can be in a chase within the first 20 seconds of the match.
Perks and game mechanics should never be as generic and non specific as possible. They already removed old Tinkerer and added the special attack requirement, that is as far they should go. Singling out killers will just make people that play those killers feel like they have less options. Corrupt already deactivates if someone gets downed, that's as good to reducing the imbalance between killers as it can get.
Also the hinder change on infection for Nemesis feels a bit odd. We have not gotten to experience what the 20% hinder will feel like, since the Devs confirmed it is bugged and will be fixed in an upcoming patch. Might as well wait for that patch to come out before making changes to it.Dredge starts the Trial with cooldown on his Power 😂
Dredge can't down Survivors that quickly as Blight, Nurse or Billy. Nonsense Argument from your side. -
@radiantHero23 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3793175#Comment_3793175
But what about the swf that are not on voice comms?
To be fair it's a good point, but usually 4 Man without VC happens very rare. It usually happens on Streams from DBD where Streamer play with his viewers. Still 4 MAN without VC - they at least know their perks, they know how others play and they can adjust their gameplay.
We can remove the limits, but it would make real SWF-s less skillfull and more powerfull…
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@VomitMommy said:
Overall nice changes, but I definitely wouldn't go path excluding specific killers, or SWF from any changes.
Why exclude those killers from Corrupt change for example? They are going to end it by downing survivor way before time limit anyway.
I like aura reading around hook (I would change it you simply see anyone outside of your lobby).
I am not really fan of dropping pallet display, it's going to make protection hits so much easier...
"I am not really fan of dropping pallet display, it's going to make protection hits so much easier..."
That's why it would be aviable only for Solo Q - they don't have communaction and they usually can't take hits.
"Why exclude those killers from Corrupt change for example? They are going to end it by downing survivor way before time limit anyway."
These Killers are just too strong and it would be overkill I think and if people would hear that Nurse can get free Corrupt - this change would never come through… And these Killers just do not Corrupt as other Killers. Blight and Billy has moblity and Nurse is… a Nurse…
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@sickdeathfiend said:
I stopped playing Killer because it's too easy. This is a problem BHVR has created, they intentionally disabled the ability for survivor teammates to communicate in anyway in a game that requires coordination to win (lol). Therefore it will always be severely underpowered and frustrating to play soloq survivor, which is the largest % of players. This issue will ultimately kill the game imo.
In before someone says "Voice chat is tooooxxiiiiic". Voice chat is not necessary, there are a multitude of ways to communicate. A common way is the comms wheel. Only having a wave and point emote is laughable.
I started playing the game around when the Hellraiser chapter released, and was a killer main for a long time. Killer felt challenging and fun back then, but now its so mindlessly easy as killer that it is just not fun to play anymore. I mostly just play survivor now until I get frustrated enough to quit because of how oppressively OP killers feel and how bad the soloq experience is with a lack of coordination of any kind. We STILL don't even have the ability to see what our teammates perks or even offerings will be in the lobby!
We do not play in the same game, right? Me and my friends - not even very experienced - they had like 1-2k Hours each and I was the only that had 6.500 hours. We played like 30 games without any perks and items, but we played for win. And what? We lost a game against Iri Blight that tunneled hard (we had no perks) and we lost like 2-3 games and now I don' remember them - I think it was Nurse and Billy - other games - completely disaster.
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@radiantHero23 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3792774#Comment_3792774
Nemesis: zoning is not something i would promote. From what i read, this addon heavily rewards zoning. Therefore im against it.
If you give solos or duos a mechanic that makes the game nicer but leave it out for 3 or 4 - groups, your punishing them for playing in groups. Is what it is sadly.
Bubba: thx for clarifying. Im not too invested into him, therefore this was really helpful.
It's not a punishment, because 3-4 groups do not lose anything. They can do that using a few words on Voice Call.
Solo Q would be able to acutally cooperate a little bit more and it would help them. I do not steal something from SWF-s and give it to Solo Q - I just would make cheap copy from SWF and add it for Solo Q.
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@Toystory3Monkey said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3792781#Comment_3792781
Either all killers get it or none. Otherwise you're excluding people from QoL features simply for existing and it feels bad. Not all nurse players are gods wiping survivors with 4k5.
Weird mindset to be fair. Quick example - they added specific Anti Camp Feature only for Leatherface - so it also would be hurting Bubba Mains for existing? I just know that adding base kit Corrupt also for Killers like Nurse would detroy the idea of adding this feature.
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@crogers271 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3792795#Comment_3792795
Balancing a game around the beginners is horrible idea. It's good to add some features that would help them learning the game, but do not balance the whole thing around them.Didn't say balance game around them, but you also can't ignore them. Designing the game around any single bracket of players is a bad idea.
If you get SoloQ closer to SWF (not close, but at least closer) it will make game much easier to balance.True, but what are you willing to give up from a design perspective? I like the way the soloq game is designed. I don't want to know where the other survivors are, I want some mystery about what is going on. I think the devs believe that also makes for an overall more enjoyable game experience. Balance isn't everything.
I wouldn't ignore these players, but I wouldn't balance the game around them and that's all.
Soloq : Topic problem at current Dead By Daylight - SOLO Q and you gonna say Solo Q has very interesting and good gameplay. Maybe you do, but 90% of people don't. And that's why I would help Solo Q a little bit and in the same time wouldn't overkill SWF-s.
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@Azulra said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/425968/would-it-be-a-good-dev-update
Most of these changes I find to either be unhealthy or just bad in general.
The survivor gameplay changes, as BHVR said, wouldn't ever be a thing since survivors are supposed to get as little info as possible plus they'd make 2 perks completely useless.
The killer gameplay changes are primarily just needed for killers like Trapper and Myers and that's it.
The changes to Billy are essentially all bad and one of the add-on changes would even encourage back-revving survivors which is unhealthy.
Nurse physically can't be nerfed that hard at all since major nerfs to her would mean EVERY paid killer would also need nerfs since they can't have paid killers being stronger than any free killers otherwise the game would, officially, receive the Pay2Win tag.
Nemesis base-kit changes don't justify each other, but the longer crate opening would be good. Adrenaline Injector would be the only actually good change for add-ons since one of them is redundant, one of them encourages using M1 which is more boring than M2, and the other one is just pointless since it just gives one-time-use effects.
Bubba doesn't really need those buffs exactly since he just received some amazing buffs to his kit and, just like with Nemesis, only one of the add-ons would be good and the others would either just be hard nerfs and unbalanced(especially with Spark Plug).
Shadowborn would quickly become an unhealthy perk for the game real fast.
Corrupt Intervention shouldn't be made unavailable to ANY killers since that is the ENTIRE purpose of teachables and wouldn't make sense.
Save The Best For Last should be buffed back up by the 1% they took from it, but the deactivation for the perk isn't needed due to it just being a major redundancy since you can't face-camp within 12 meters anyways and being past 16 meters would likely result in the unhook happening before the hit with STBFL can even land meaning the survivors can still get away regardless if they get hit.
Surge would be nice to work with an M2, but the cool down, just like with several other of your suggestions, would primarily just be a redundancy since the only killers who'll typically be able to do this would mainly be Bubba and Oni.
Alert buff would be nice. That's all I have to say for it.
Breakdown is already a frustrating enough perk as is so it 100% doesn't need the respawn timer increased.
Calm Spirit, even though many people don't like the debuff, I actually like it just for the fact that it makes sense with the fact that you're not rushing your chest opening actions and such which is what makes it quiet. Plus the perk does need some kind of downside with how many positive effects it gives.
Resilience I'd actually prefer that change.
And, finally, for Windows Of Opportunity this change would be HORRENDOUS. If I remember correctly, BHVR attempted to test how people would feel if it had a cool down at all and they were hit so hard with so much backlash that they got rid of the cool down immediately. I don't even use the perk all that often whenever I do play survivor(mostly because it doesn't help me that much), but even I know that it having a cool down would be aweful.
"The killer gameplay changes are primarily just needed for killers like Trapper and Myers and that's it"
I disagree with that. For example Killers like Demogrogon or Bubba also need Corrupt - basically if you face Survivors that are just good - not insane, but good, having Corrupt Intervention is must have at current Dead By Daylight and many Killers lose a slot for that. Basically I can say that most of the Killers need that perk if they want to play for win otherwise they gonna lose 2 or 3 Generators fast if Survivors won't make serious mistakes. List of Killers that usually bring Corrupt in my opinion.
Trapper - Myers - Hag - Cannibal - Freddy - Pig - Plague - Ghostface - Demogrogon - Oni - Nemesis - Sadako - Singularity - Chucky
I would add even more Killers for this list to be fair. It doesn't matter that for example Oni is a strong Killer, but without Corrupt gameplay starts at 2 Generators left or even more.
Changes to Billy : I would nerf only one thing that makes him that strong, that really really strong - the intial Turn rate and you gonna say it's a bad change. This nerf would bring back more Skill on Hillbilly where he is very strong now, but if you say so… About the Add-On that would increase charge speed by 5% - there are much better Add-Ons on him and this Add-On wouldn't be unhealthy. Stop overrate Add-Ons that modify charge speed - it's not 30% or even more that Billy could reach in 2016-2020. He already has Add-On that increase charge speed by 20% in both states and it's not a problem at all.
What are you talking about the Nurse? I just don't understand. If it's a joke - not funny at all. My suggested change would award Survivors for great play against her and that's all. I wouldn't add 200 years cooldown on her Power after missed attack or something like that. She still would be S++++ Tier Killer as she is now. Dead By Daylight isn't even in 1% close to be P2W game. The strongest Killers as The Hillbilly, The Nurse, The Spirit, The Blight are aviable for free or Iridescent Shards. With your logic they shouldn't buff Licensed Killers and they shouldn't nerf Oryginal Killers. That's weird statement.
Bubba - How in the world 10% faster charge speed would make Leatherface unbalanced? Other Add-Ons changes would make these Add-Ons worth to play with. I explained why I would change specific Add-On - for example Carburetor Tuning Guide. Additionally, some of my suggested changes are just a fixes to his Shadow - undocumented nerf in 4.4.0 Patch. Increased movement speed would eliminate obligatory to run The Beast's Marks Add-On in every Trial and other changes to Add-Ons would make better Add-Ons variety on Bubba. He still needs some final Buffs that are easy to implement - not a total huge Update.
Shadowborn - how in the world this perk would be very unhealthy. Killer lose 1 Perk Slot to get MAYBE 1 down on Exposed Status. After that, the Survivor gives information about this perk and it's completely useless. Nobody would run this perk as meta.
Save The Best For Last - This perk do not allow Survivor to do a Trade if Killer has many stacks. Did you think about it at all? I would bring back to 5% and it would be nice - also wouldn't lose stacks from M2 Attacks, but I would eliminate only one unfun aspect of this Perk - Camping. Killer can just go back to the hook - he doesn't need to camp. Let's say they have 20 seconds left to unhook - they can't do that, because STBFL will just completely destroy them for that.
Nemesis - Base Kit Changes I would make are very close to current version. Currently the Hindered Power isn't correct and it doesn't work at all. But if they would fix that - The Nemesis would become problematic topic, because 20% it's a massive slowdown and it would create two taps. So I would decrease it from 20% to 10% and slightly increase the duration or even don't touch it. About the Add-Ons - when I thought about it I think zoning Add-Ons isn't a good idea, but you said it's good idea, kinda weird haha. Other add-ons to be fair… I like. You get Mutation - you get very nice effect for some time.
About Corrupt - I made a change for Corrupt for Killers that have base kit part of Corrupt. The Nurse, The Hillbilly and The Blight would be able to use current, not changed Corrupted Intervention.
Surge - cooldown is just additional minor thing. Wouldn't make a huge impact. We can just remove it to be fair.
Windows - this perk totally turn off Survivor brains, so I would make it perk healthy for learning the game, but many people just can't play without it. Survivors should have knowledge where Pallets are or specific renders and one perk shouldn't completely fixing that in my opinion. Chasing weak Survivors with this Perk and Lithe is just the most boring chase ever…
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@PuddleOfBludd said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3792745#Comment_3792745
Yes, but that bass kit information on where the generators are gives the killer plenty of information as to where the survivors are going to be going. And they don’t need to equip a perk to have that information. WoO requires a perks slot. So, killers base kit starting the match knowing exactly where to go on the map to find survivors is fine, but survivors having to use a perk that tells them where to go when they are being chased is not fine?
There is a generator on Killer Shack and there is not Survivor… Ups… Your theory already doesn't make sense. If you would bring argument with Lethal Pressure - let's make Windows Of Opportunity also work for first 10 seconds 😘
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@crogers271 said:
Survivors see auras: I could see the idea if a survivor is within the range showing auras, but the pallet drop doesn't seem right. This is conceptual game dev idea though about whether soloq should have a unique feel or not.
Basekit Corrupt for Certain Killers: So this is somewhat similar to a Jund idea of giving different killers different gen kick speeds as a way of slightly buffing the weaker killers.
The problem is which killers are meta varies based on region and MMR. A basekit corrupt would make many killers incredibly oppressive at lower levels.
Perks
Shadowborn: This is pretty close to 'if a survivor blinds you, the survivor is downed'. I could see a smaller buff to the haste, or a change to an exposed effect, but combined seem way too strong.
Some Killers without strong perks can be too opressive on "low levels". I wouldn't take it as an argument that some Killers would be too strong with 50% Corrupt Base Kit. At low levels they won't even do much at the start of the Trial. Balancing a game around the beginners is horrible idea. It's good to add some features that would help them learning the game, but do not balance the whole thing around them.
Survivor Gameplay Improvements - these changes would make SWF-s even more powerful and it would eliminate skill such as good communication. If you get SoloQ closer to SWF (not close, but at least closer) it will make game much easier to balance. My suggested changes are simply like that : In SoloQ you see which Pallets are dropped by your Teamamtes, so you know where are deadzones and added Kindred base kit to make Unhooks plays easier due to lack of communication.
Shadowborn - what's a point of using Shadowborn now though? My suggest would give a choice for Killers. Do I want to use Shadowborn and try to make Flashlight as my own weapon or I just want to counter the Flashlight with Lightborn. Survivors nowadays have many resources to counter 30 seconds Exposed, trust. Additonally, not every Killer would make a huge value from Exposed Status, because it simply better to use special attacks sometimes.
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Do not use Kill Rates as a method to balance the game. I know BHVR kinda do that, but it's not a good solution and as I mentioned in previous response - it's not hard to add more Killers that wouldn't have this feature base kit. They added base kit Borrowed Time that was must have back in the days - the same is with Corrupt nowadays - in my opinion. Even Escape Rates were much higher like X years ago, Borrowed Time was a must have perk. So Kill Rates don't matter in my opinion.
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@Toystory3Monkey said:
Excluding some killers from certain basekit mechanics is a really bad idea.
You won't be able to correctly identify which killers need to be excluded from basekit mechanics because things like Spirit definitely dont need a 5th perk slot for free, yet you've given them a pass.
That just becomes another headache to manage.
also 12s powerless nurse is definitely a funny joke, keep it going.
It's not hard to add more Killers that wouldn't use base kit Corrupt feature. I think it needs some work, but it would be a good idea to add some Killers new statistics - faster speed actions, modified stun durations and some features like Corrupt base kit. Many Killer just need to run Corrupt every game if they want compete and win a game. It's like Borrow Time for Survivor before the Patch 6.1.0.
Remember - these are just suggested changes and I thought about more Killers, but I started from S tier Killers to limit them.
The Nurse has her own, weird way to counterplay, but the is on the top since the start of Dead By Daylight. This change would make Pallets actually viable and great play from Survivor would have some impact against the Nurse. Additionally, Decisive Strike would actually help Survivors while playing against a Nurse.
Just an example - when Cannibal gets a Pallet Stun during his Chainsaw Sweep - he has stun and he lost probably like a few Chainsaw Charges and Survivor have a distance. Survivor played very well, he got an reward. Why wouldn't it a thing with the Nurse. Okay you can say, that if you perfectly read her movements and don't let her see you - you can counter play that, but I thought about adding new counterplays such as Pallets.
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@radiantHero23 said:
Actually some great thoughs!
I especially like stbfl and the survivor basekit changes. However, I think punishing people for playing in swf is bad. This is the hole BHVR dug themselves.
Add faster crouching for Piggy basekit and you got me. ^🐽^
Edit1:
I dont think adding a basekit mechanic for killer and excluding some is not good design. This leads to the discussion what killers would be good enough to not get this mechanioc and what killers would be bad enough to warrant the mechanic. I dont think this will ever happen, despite the idea being solid.
Edit2:
maps: rework gideon meat plant. This map is awful and should have changed years ago.
Nemesis: adrenaline injector seems like a complete zoning addon to me. I would not encourage that part of the Nemesis´s power. Make the first part 0.2 and leave the cancellation part out and its fine by me.
Bubba: i thought he was in a really good spot after the last update. Therefore the suggestions you make seem like overkill to me. If im wrong there, please correct me.
In my opinion Corrupt Intervention is must have for many Killers - from the weakest to B+ Tier and even higher sometimes. Free Corrupt would be overkill for Nurse, Blight and Hillbilly, because The Nurse just breaks the basic rules of looping and she is obviously the strongest Killer in the game. The Blight and The Hillbilly can travel the map in a few seconds, so Corrupt isn't that needed and it would be overkill in that scenario.
Corrupt is like Borrowed Time on Survivor before Patch 6.1.0. If you really want to win a game and don't lose 3 Generators that fast - it's must have.
Maps - Yeah of course more maps need changes, but I just focued on very boring 3 gen problem on certain maps and obvious overpowered maps like Badham & Eyrie.
The Nemesis - I had the whole list of Add-Ons changes here that as I whole it would make sense, but I decided to not post it here. But overall, I don't see a problem in this Add-On.
The Cannibal - Acceleration buff is just a fix for his Power - just a fix of horrible shadownerf he received in 4.4.0 Patch.
Current Leatherface still needs to run The Beast's Marks to compete against better Survivors, so I would add it fully base kit and keep only 1 movement speed Add-On as Ultra Rare rarity. Small buff for recharge rate - Spark Plug base kit, so I added a new effect for this Add-On. A few changes to his Add-Ons that could perform well, but overall they mostly nerf his Power rather than buffing him. Added effect on Carburetor Tuning Guide could in some terms solve the problem with Pallets - With this Add-On breaking a Pallet takes all your Tokens and you are basically useless for the next few seconds. The Beast's Marks - maybe I would nerf speed bonus from 3% to 2.5% or 2%.
"Punishing players to play SWF" - I don't know maybe I wrote it wrong, but I meant that if to the Lobby join Trio or 4man - this feature doesn't work. If game matches 4 soloq players - it does work. If game matches 2x2 - it does work.
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I had weird idea back in the days. Nowadays Killer have 3 overall statistics - height, Terror range & base move speed. There should be more statistics for Killers like for example: Stun duration with a Pallet, Stun duration with DS, Breaking Speed, Vaulting Speed & more. For example Trapper would have Brutal Strenght base kit and shorter stun from DS - where Nurse would have like 6 or 7 seconds stun with DS. These type of modifications.
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These two perks combination requires from Killer 2 slots for perks. Additionally, Survivors have a counterplay against this combination. Just drop item in the corner. That's all. Killer play with 2 perks now.
Also "Why Killer get free Aura Reading for 0 effort"… Ekhm… Exhaustion Perks - bonus speed for free…
🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
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I think 8.2.1 will be released tommorow - 04.09
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Oh yeah. I forgot about it.
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it's bugged and they need to fix it
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New Ormond & Yamaoka variants shouldn't be a thing. These maps are horrible. Instead of adding 2 new Ormonds & 2 New Yamaokas they should touch Badham variations. Instead of adding bullshit new tiles on Coldwin Farm they should add some new Pallet loops on Haddonfield.
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Bubba : I would open a restaurant with my special chili.
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I have a feeling and I can tell from my experience that Killer Mains are stronger mentally. I had so much fun to play with random Killer players in 2v8 Mode and they usually were very kind on post chat for their Killer partner. When I play Killer in 1v4 and I just have very nice cinema watching Survivors in post game chat blaming each other - it's sad, but it's a true.
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@TieBreaker said:
I don't think offerings should hard counter perks. Especially when you have to waste a bunch of time to activate the perks. Not to mention, that if you add something like that, the next one added will be an offering that disables killer add-ons.
We have offerings that give 20 times better advantage than counter a perk. Map Offerings.
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There are so many Pallets that dropped are almost impossible to win a mindgame on them without BL1.
About maps… Macmillans are not Killer Sided - they are just not that unbalanced as other maps. Just an example.
Garden, Eyrie, Badham, Greenville, Gas Heaven, Groaning Storehouse, Nostromo, Toba Landing and more. All of these are Survivor sided. Give me an example of Killer Sided Map (maybe the new map from Vecna).
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It's weird how big advantage you can get because of Map Offering. It should be gone.
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@HexHuntressThighs said:
Survivors who get hit by the Whip, get the normal on hit speed boost which is 150% for 2 seconds I believe. But Nemesis applies the 20% hinder making it 130% for 2 seconds instead.
Yeah, but there is an Add-On that increases the duration of Hindered by 3 seconds.
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@Devil_hit11 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3787198#Comment_3787198
the survivor get so much distance on speed boost that 20% for 3 second is not that significant. Forced hesitation is 10 seconds which is long time in dbd. it is why i said for long time that they need to lower killer's attack cooldown and the m/s boosts.
it's not about distance… everyone would notice a Survivor slowed down by 20%…, but it's not a thing. It doesn't work.
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@Choaron said:
I remember it working normally on PTB. You realize it's only when they get contaminated, right?
I can read things out and I can see if these things are matching in practice. Yes I know about it…
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@totallynotamegmain said:
yes, it’s only when you contaminate them.
Okay, you get the Hindered Status Effect, but the Hindered Value is incorrect. If it would work as intended, Survivor should run with 80% speed for 3 seconds while using Licker Tongue. Sprint is gone after 1.8 seconds, so for another 3.2 seconds Survivor should run with 80% speed - same as Forced Hesitation. I'm pretty sure it doesn't work and the value of Hindered is 0% or very low number.
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8.2.0 tommorow and this bug still exist and we didn't even get any information from Moderators from forums is it a bug, intentional change or something else… GREAT…
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The Cannibal
Carburetor Tuning Guide
- Automatically consumes all Chainsaw Charges while triggering a Chainsaw Sweep.
- Increases the maximum Chainsaw Sweep duation by 1 second (was 0.5 seconds).
- Increases recharge speed by 20% for the next 8 seconds after Breaking a Pallet (NEW).
- Grants ability to start a Chainsaw Sweep with maximum movement speed.
Iridescent Flesh
- Successful Chainsaw Hit replenishes all Chainsaw Charges.
- Successful Chainsaw Hit grants 1% Haste Status Effect until the Chainsaw Sweep ends (NEW)
- Limits maximum Tantrum duration to 3 seconds.