The Battle Pass can't be finished by casual players.
So, according too this post:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/95165/archive-player-balance#latest
it takes around 100 hours for someone too complete the battle pass without spending anything, which I didn't know until after I posted on that discussion. The OP says that it's a casual player only problem, but this is a problem for everyone. I think even some hardcore fans would have problems finishing it without spending some cash.
Using the argument of "It's cosmetics only, so who cares" doesn't change the fact it's a clear cash grab for casuals too fall into. Arguments for the battle pass are covered here by another User: https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/749746#Comment_749746
Simply put, the required amount of Fragments needed should be reduced. It's not fair for a good portion of the community too be excluded simply because they don't have the time too commit too such a thing.
Comments
I'm super casual when it comes to this game bit i probalby will buy it if i work my way to gettimg all the wraith rewards on the line. Otherwise ill just do what i can aith however much blight goo i get and buy the blight skins i like with cash
I wish everyone could get everything to be honest..I love this game..I play it everyday for hours through out the day..I just don't have the extra money to throw into the game because I do have 2 small childrens that come first..But would also like to be able to get the cool skins and the cool charms..I like battle-passes but I honestly think that everyone should be able to get everything BUT the cells..I mean I know that wouldn't make much sense then but just like on Black Ops 4..EVERYONE can get everything in that battlepass BUT if you want to use tier skips that costs actual money..and there are people that do it..I think it should be something like that..But eh Ill live without the cute charms and cute outfits lmfao..good job tho BVHR the game is looking great!
Absolutely no one is saying that. You are creating a straw man. Plenty of people buy the new chapters when they come out and many buy the cosmetics as well. This system has served the game well for years and they have grown many times over. They are certainly making money. Now they are opening up a 3rd stream of revenue that is based in free 2 play games and psychological manipulation. Of course a business wants to make money, but there is certain point where it is too egregious.
DBD is a cult game with a stable but not large player base that should be treated well. I think this game requires a lot more thought than most. Honestly, I am surprised so many of you are defending this.
Nobody is saying that. We buy DLC (so no free lunches). All that I'm saying is that if the FREE TRACK is FREE than it should be reasonably expected to be completable in the timeframe set out. I dont have an issue with the battlepass and would have likely paid for it until I discovered that even with the amount I play the game I still am unlikely to have any hope of completing the rift without paying money to complete the tiers - even if I complete all the challenges. Its like saying everyone gets a free drink from the drinks fountain - but you have to pay every time you use the machine for the free drink!
It served the game well enough when they only had to cover the cost of salaries.
Dedicated servers have injected a monthly cost into their overhead that has to be ever increased as more people play with no guarantee those new players will ever spend more than the baseline salary covering initial purchase.
I have gigabit ethernet. I never wanted, needed, or advocated for dedicated servers. Quite the opposite actually. I knew what was coming.
I support Behav10r with the battle pass in so far as I understand the need for revenue and limited ways to generate it.
What is the deal with people like yourself? Why the obsession with getting things that other people cannot have?
Exclusivity in games is a pain. FOMO is used to great effect to get people to pay up before it is "gone." It is gone artificially. It is not an actual item that they only made so many of. It was removed with a few keyboard clicks and could come back the same way. Whether it is paid or earned content, it should always to available as long as the game is around.
I genuinely stopped caring about wasting cash for DBD content that isn't characters, so I'm fine with it.
I somewhat agree and definitely understand the point you are making. I think the issue is "need". If Behav10r needs $10k today to pay X, money received 2 years from now doesn't help. So the question is asked what can be done today to generate that $10k. Timed exclusives can certainly do it, distasteful as they are. I don't think Wicked is in the minority as far as humans go. I think you and I might be though. Most people want status and recognition. If everyone on earth has a PHD would a PHD have any value? Maybe a high school diploma is a better example. I can't think of a single job available to high school diplomas that aren't available to those without one. There are so common and mostly meaningless as to not warrant any extra benefit or pay. At least here in the States.
I’m not stuck on the money, but you are stuck on insisting people who don’t put enough time into the game don’t get everything... uhm that’s the real world.
Yea I get it, it stinks that having a job, kids, social life means you may not be able to complete it all but that’s just the way it goes sometimes.
I'm a casual player and I say, eh. Whatever. If I cant get it all it's really no different than say, fortnite...what's the difference between having 0 battle pass atm and having one that gives free stuff for playing? I say we should just not get a battle pass since people seem to dislike it that hard at this point.
Only that way because people allow it. All scarcity in video games is artificial.
some people want something to work towards, want a time crunch to motivate them, who are you to say they’re wrong?
Battle pass aint for casuals in any game i believe
On the same note, who are you to say that everyone else has to abide by that time crunch just because you want it. Do you see the problem here?
Your entire argument hinges on you telling someone that they can't have what they want because you want what you want.
I'm getting more and more disenfranchised with DbD's cash grabs. The Ash DLC had an obvious issue with MoM that everyone identified, but BHVR played dumb and made sure to get all the cash they could before leveling the inevitable nerf we all knew would come.
Now Battlepass with all the bells and whistles that will appeal to the casual crowd, but only benefit the top 5% of players fully. If you're casual and pay for it, that's your own choice, but I'll pass. I'll likely be passing on DbD a lot going forward as it is becoming more and more dumbed down.
I'm neither a BHVR employee, nor am I being paid for damage control.
I'm merely saying that The Rift isn't even implemented yet. I'm saying: be open-minded about it. Things aren't set in stone yet and this is what the PTB is for: trying things out. So, go over to the feedback forums, and post your concerns there, or bump up a post that already addresses your concerns. I think it's much more likely to be seen by the devs there as a feedback forum is naturally more valuable to them in terms of development than a forum for discussion about anything is.
And I'm not undermining anyone's voice here. I'm just providing my point of view on all of this with suitable argumentation for why I came to those conclusions.
A battlepass is by definition the pay part and when it's aimed at casual and hard-core it just means the reward a you can earn on the pay tier should be able to be earned by both sets of players.
Casual and hard-core don't mean free of pay it's a term for those who play differently or lack of time to play.
You can earn some cosmetics but like the store with some cosmetics you cannot earn the top tier ones by playing for free.
The content in the pay pass was never meant to be free it is an extra addition which is being made soley for the revenue stream. Much like any battlepass you will not be able to earn them unless you pay to join the tier. It's exactly how every battlepass works and why they were designed.
To be fair its coming over that you feel entitled to the cosmetics the devs are making for this pass. We should never feel entitled to free items someone has to pay and work for to produce.
This is absolutely broken logic. No one here is telling you to abide by any time schedule. You are free to ignore it. It's you demanding that in ignoring that time schedule you be given everything based on your personal and subjective acceptable level of effort.
You have no entitlement to everything you want. You do have the opportunity to achieve everything you want in the same fashion everyone else has in being offered that opportunity.
I do see a problem here. The west has created a culture where people who do not own the intellectual property believe they have an entitlement to dictate how someone else's intellectual property is handled.
Okay sweetheart, go through the entire thread and find one thing that I've demanded. If you can do that, I'll read the rest of your post to make you feel better.
I'm not living in a bubble, so there's nothing to burst.
I also addressed this as the following: "a lot of things may, or may not, still change" and "changes are still possible".
I'm being open-minded about it. I neither said things will change, neither that they won't. They may have a track record for not doing so, but they may surprise everyone yet. Just look at how far the game has come since a year or two ago.
Right here. When you take this position your implication is that you have an entitlement not presented to attain the content.
I'm not interested in having a hair splitting session though, cupcake.
If you want to pretend to be disassociated and only acting as a devil's advocate to avoid accountability for your position be my guest.
To those with appreciable comprehension of the English language, ascribing motive to thought when following a conversation is fairly simple.
This. So much of this.
Paying for convenience is the most sinister way to monetize something, because you deliberately create a system with the intention to frustrate the casual user to a point they just go ######### it, take my money and let me skip this hassle.
Instead of creating a good, enjoyable and engaging system.
Just ask yourself, is the battle pass something that helps the players to enjoy the game or just to create artificial exclusivity and cash grab? Will it allow future fans of the game to enjoy the system as well or they are just out of luck, because they didn't knew about DBD before?
I'd be fine if I could choose what to get, there are so many things in the paid track that I want but there are also so many things I don't care about having. I really want Claudette's, Meg's, Jake's, and Nea's outfits (one of Nea's cosmetics is at tier 58 and only uncommon rarity btw) but I couldn't care less about the Trapper's or Wraith's.
I'd also love the Brand New Part and vial charms but they're both at the very end. So, if I want to get all the things I like, I'm forced to get to tier 70 and get cosmetics I don't care about and will likely never use.
I responded with a negative attitude because the first thing you wrote to me was "You're entitled." That was uncalled for, and I apologize.
I'll be real with you. I don't like the battlepass at all but that's because I would never pay to work for someone. I would never provide money to do a job.
And you're right, I do feel a bit entitled to get what I, personally, paid for with my hard earned money. As such I would, in most cases, just buy the cosmetic I want. Not purchase a pointless battlepass as all of it will end up on the store anyway.
But I do agree with the people who are willing to spend money on a battlepass that it should be easily accomplished. Why would you spend money for something that only a select few can achieve.
As a matter of fact, I would compare the Battlepass system to a Carnival game. It's rigged so that the majority will fail. The difference is that most people who participate in a Carnival game are aware that it'll be a waste of their money. They're just doing it for fun.
I propose that BHVR lets you keep your intense grind, since that's what you'd want, while also applying an obvious warning for new players that informs them that unless they have X amount of spare time, the battle pass will be impossible for them to complete. This way less people will buy the pass expecting something different.
There'd be no problem with that if they genuinely wanted people to feel challenged by the pass and struggle to complete it. If they're selling to the "hardcore" gamers who have the time.
And after this, I'm done with the conversation. I'd rather not get a ban for arguing with someone over something as silly as a difference in opinion, a mod has already commented on the thread for obvious reasons.
But it HAS been implemented it is the ptb. We also have eyes. Most of us have been playing dbd for years now. We can see when something will be unfair and grindy.
Now is the time to voice our concerns not after.
The only thing exclusive in the pass are the charms. All skins will eventually be released to the store.
This was one of my major concerns when they first announced the battlepass and why I was initially against it, so I was extremely happy to find out that there is virtually no exclusivity.
In the PTB, yeah, not in the live game yet. There's still a difference.
Yes, now is the time to voice your opinion, and I've already told you where to do that (and how: not so rant-y).
Additionally it's up to players individually to decide what's unfair and grindy to them and what isn't, that's not for you to say in their place.
Referring to: "We can see when something will be unfair and grindy."
Look at forum. Seems pretty clear on how we feel about the unfairness of the Rift.
Nothing you said is ban worthy broski. I also respect your opinion. It's honest.
I've seen people defend grindy time sinks on forums for f2p games like Warframe. I understand why they have them for f2p games where the goal is to get the player to spend some money to bypass the long grind. But DBD isnt a f2p game and the grind doesn't need to (or shouldn't) be as bad. I know DE listened to some complaints about things being to grindy in Warframe and they would scale things back eventually...but not always cough (hema) cough!😁
I've seen people defend grindy time sinks on forums for f2p games like Warframe. I understand why they have them for f2p games where the goal is to get the player to spend some money to bypass the long grind. But DBD isnt a f2p game and the grind doesn't need to (or shouldn't) be as bad. I know DE listened to some complaints about things being to grindy in Warframe and they would scale things back eventually...but not always cough (hema) cough!😁
I am always amused by the mentality on the internet of "my opinion should be your opinion". Everyone thinks there has to be a "winner" in an argument/discussion instead of just shaking hands and saying well we don't see eye to eye so let's look at something else.
That aside, some of the arguments I see here are "They need to keep the lights on and make money etc" but a lot of you might be too young to remember video games before DLC and micro-transactions. There was a time when skill would net you rewards, not just your pocket book. Those companies made plenty of money by having good games without any of what we have today. For fun reading, see how it all started here- https://www.usgamer.net/articles/the-history-of-gaming-microtransactions-from-horse-armor-to-loot-boxes
I know "times they are a-changin' and this is the world we live in now" and all that but dismissing it that way is like someone saying, "Dhamer? Oh yeah he eats people. That's just how he is. Its fine. He's wacky". (If you don't get the reference, google it) Don't accept the things you don't like. That's how we got where we are politically.
We need to speak up and if the new system is governed by money, vote with your bank account. Don't just give in and say "Oh well I guess...". If you like it, buy it. If not... don't. Times will tell and the community needs to speak up collectively if they don't like something. Let the people who do like it stand in the back and shake their heads at you (and vice versa).
TL;DR: Pay for the rift or don't. Just stop thinking you are right and everyone else is wrong. The old days are gone and we have to learn how to navigate the new system to work FOR us.
The battle pass is a complicated issue ad I really do remember the days when we got rewards the old way.
Well actually those would be a little skewed because if you seperate them sure, BUT if you take into acount during the matches you complete the Battle Pass goals. You are earning devotion XP before you run out of Battle pass completion.
I would have to say lets just guess that maybe it knocks a quarter off of it. Of the time so maybe 75 ish hours?
The pass is for people that don’t have a reason to grind the game, and became bored of it, not for the people who don’t even play enough to do it
I just saw this and I am honestly starting to get pessimistic about the rift.
I am still planning to play the free route and try to get as far as possible and see what tier I reach but I am starting to think I won't get far. Unless the devs get enough feedback about it from the survey and change things.
So they should not buy it. Its not for them.
even the free one cant be completed. Thats the issue. It was designed so you fail from the start.
Bhvr has shareholders that want a certain profit to be made and the battle pass is a way of satisfying said shareholders. Even if its scummy which it is they are beholden to these people
In all the games I've played with a battle pass are all easily achieved by consistent playtime (fortnite, rocket league and destiny 2). This follows the fortnite formula where u can rebuy it next seasons so casual players like me thought its just a one time investment because you can just reachieve but I'm sure glad I found this thread to set me straight.
And yes, it's a battlepass, its meant to be for casual players, not just complete sweats
Casuals won't make this game survive in the long term.
I was a supoorter of the battle pass prior to seeing the time it takes. Cosmetics are very expensive right now$10 per costume. I was excited for basically a dlc pack of cosmetics and unique challenges to get more Bloodpoints, something I'm greatly lacking because I spend maybe 4 hours a week playing games. All games not dbd time exclusive.
I'd be paying$10 for the chance to get maybe 2 rows of that stuff because of my time. No thanks.
Just give me a$10 bucket of dlc cosmetics like the Charity Pack!!!
I would much rather if the battle pass was actual complete able and didnt reward you back your Auric Cells than the current predatory version...
Yes, but the west for the most uses a fiat currency that has debt built into the system. If every dollar on earth of the currency was confiscated the debt could not be paid back. The initial bond the government took out to acquire the cash came attached with interest that was never printed. This continues year after year. It matters because it means that the currency will continue to inflate. What you could afford back in the early days of video games simply does not exist as a possibility now.
There are higher corporate taxes, more entitlements including employee entitlements and more competition from other companies that can afford to offer more. The programmers you hire are not going to dismiss raises and perks commensurate with their talent and education because the public thinks it's due everything until the company closes for the initial cost of the game.
Another issue is back in the day once you bought a game you were done. Very rarely did it come with support and patches. A many a game from that generation has bugs you can still repeat today. Not to mention the online play and anticheat improvements that have to be ever present lest hacks be developed that ruin the game for everyone.
Is Behav10r likely raising money beyond present requirements? Sure. But it's smart to do as it gives them leeway if and when things slow down. It also allows them to procure more expensive licenses.
The positive to this is that if it's profitable the game can look forward to becoming ever better and it's future is secure. There aren't to many times on earth something profitable is discarded. In the reverse, a game that has no means for growth and barely scrapes by is likely discarded in the future when it requires more headache than return it gives.
Same. If the Auric Cell rebate is why we aren't going to be given a fair shot at finishing it then remove the rebate. I can pay ten bucks but I won't if I can't finish it.
No, I’m saying that if I can’t do something to get things I want I’ll accept it. As long as it’s not an actual competitive advantage I don’t care
That’s weird you say EVERYONE identified the problem, we had survivors up until the end claiming MoM was fine, not overpowered at all. Did they not identify it? Or are they just saying that because they want an OP perk?
This is how it starts. It always starts with cosmetics. That's what happened with CoD. Now they putting weapons, a competitive advantage, in loot boxes.
The people here are maddening. This exact same timeline has played out numerous times in video games and people still keep defending it.
I’m not defending it, I’m defending what it is right now. I reserve the right to change my mind later if they start putting cheats, perks, addons, or something similar in the future. I will not grab pitchforks and torches about what MAY happen.