Should they consider removing Oni from 2v8?
I don't really like 2v8, but I played a couple games because my duo thinks it's fun (plus higher bloodpoint bonus). But every game was Oni. I'm not even exaggerating. You play 2v8 there's a really good chance you're gonna face Oni. He is just so good in 2v8 that players refuse to try someone else. This really contributes to the staleness of what used to be a fun mode.
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I despise spirit in 2v8 because i either got a screeching legion or a roaring oni in my ear, making tracking thi bi even harder.
But i despise 2v8, so thats another thing.
With a few other exceptions: ditto. This forum will disagree and show that via downvotes but every lobby without fail has 3+ Sprint Burst classes as well as 4-5 other classes but my point is that on command AoE Sprint Burst on a microscopic timer is genuinely one of the most aggravating pain points for 2v8 for most Killer players. Hence why Oni, even after the nerfs, is a popular pick. He sees your on command Sprint Burst and goes "lol, lmao"
I'd be 100% okay with further nerfing Kazan IF, and only IF, the Sprint Burst class gets retuned/nerfed.
I wonder if the SB nerf will affect the 2v8 one
Only change I want on Oni is his controls in his power reverted I'd be okay with him getting it all the time if he wasn't so easy to land hits with in 2v8 in power. They just read awful in 2v8.
Well take down my feedback that i think the OP is wrong and oni is fine and fun to go against.
God, I hope so. We can only wait and see.
Feedback sharing is an incredibly nuanced practice, it's part of the process to review a lot of information and opinions when sharing with the team!
You are correct, I just tested it with bots in customs.
Strange indeed that the wiki implies they do.
It's an event, that is already unbalanced. They(players) want to make it more balanced, but at the same time they also dislike when their side is touched.
In my honest opinion touching oni(and wanting to remove them because "they are always in power") is not smart and explains more what their intentions are.
I enjoy facing Oni in 2v8 because in most cases I can tell when they are approaching. It's their partner I have issues with when in power... Which is my skill issue not the killer itself
Was gonna try to make and post a video on that but had some technical issues last night... My kid tossed my TV remote in the dog's water bowl.
No they should not and they should bring Legion back with changes I suggested a while ago. Making him fast downer that does not need to hit every person in the map to be able to down in his power. This would even make him less of a problem as there would be limit of how many hits he can get in a frenzy as either three or four hits would get him out of the power either causing a downing of a survivor or him hitting someone full health to cause damage.
Oni in 1v4 is fine because he is balanced by the fact that he only gets orbs from injuries he caused, addons he brings and whenever he gets a down in blood fury he has to choose to either slug or pick up and end his power. He often has to waste a lot of time carrying survivors to hooks.
In 2v8 afaik none of that is true. In all the games I've played vs Oni in 2v8 it always seemed like he could use blood fury to get 2-4 downs and have his partner do most of the caging with Oni maybe doing some caging when his power ended or was close to ending. Then Oni could spend mere seconds collecting more blood orbs and RAWR!-off he'd go again.
So his power should not work as easily as it does in 1v4, since every killer-teammate knows and is happy to follow his carnage and cage his slugs for him, while occasionally M1ing survivors to help him with the orbs or bodyblocking survivors so Oni can oneshot them.
No, Oni mains have every right to play in this mode
5 downvotes and counting purely because you dared say a beloved Killer shouldn't be taken out back and Ol' Yeller'd like Legion. I love these forums.
I'd agree with you in 1V4. But in 2V8 it felt pretty punishing to be knocked out of power as Legion because it denied an opportunity to generate pressure for your teammate. And pressure is all they had in that mode. They were half a Killer otherwise. Their power didn't allow them to get the downs necessary to send a steady number of Survivors to cages, they had to rely on their teammate doing all the heavy lifting in that respect. Some of the other Killers are strong enough to carry the team alone, but not Legion.
All of this is academic, anyway. Legion are gone from 2V8 and they're not coming back anytime soon.
Please don't forget that there are lots of DBD players out there that you'll never hear from because they're just enjoying the mode for what it is. They're not here on the forums or on reddit complaining about every little thing.
It's good that feedback sharing is a nuanced practice and that we get to hear from you all in the community streams, but I feel like we don't always get clear reasoning from BHVR as to why decisions are made on the back of that feedback. I never did feel like we got a detailed explanation for why Legion got removed from 2V8. Was it simply because lots of Survivor players complained about them being in the mode? Or did you guys have solid numbers to prove they were actually driving players away from 2V8 (with a high DC rate)? Maybe their group Kill rate was a little too strong combined with certain Killers? On those last two points, I didn't see any differences in my Killer queue times when they were in 2V8 and they actually under performed compared to the other Killers that I play (Chucky & Billy). So that leads me to believe that it was the first reason (player complaints). If so, there's no nuance being taken on board to make a decision like that. I take that to read BHVR considers 2V8 to be a Survivor side favoured mode and if enough Survivor players want a Killer gone, then they're gone.
Completely agree. Oni being constantly in power is only an issue because of how hard it is for survivors to counter him in power. He just turns too well in 2v8.
I believe Oni players would also be happier being in power more often with less turning ability, than keeping their turning ability but having significantly less access to their power, which would be the only other way to balance him in 2v8. Simply put, killers want to use their power as being in power is fun, so BHVR should nerf the turn radius as a priority.
If BHVR nerfs Oni's turn radius, most of the issues with Oni in 2v8 will go away.
Yeah this is pretty much what I want to see next if anything
I don’t know about removing him at first maybe try making changes and see how it goes if it doesn’t fix the problems then remove him
Definitely don't remove him, as the roster is already small enough, but I do think he needs some adjustments.
That should've been what happened to Legion too.
No he doesnt need a nerf, leave him alone
definitely the strongest killer in 2v8 after making blight 4.4 it’s annoying aswell because he’s piss easy.
Legion is not incompatible with 2v8, they just didn't bother trying to make them more well received.
Especially because Oni was always the problem imo, people just didn't want to accept that and blamed Legion instead.
For an Oni to get 3 downs with one use of his power in 2v8, those survivors have to play terribly, so they deserved those downs. One getting 4 downs is mathematically impossible unless he downs two survivors with one strike right before it ends, which is extremely unlikely to happen in any game, survivors would have to be grouped up on the worst timing possible while an Oni is downing people near them.
Blood Fury has the same duration in 2v8 as in 1v4, 45 seconds. But in 2v8 he loses 10 seconds every time he downs a survivor and he doesn't have add-ons to change any of that. And he has a 3 seconds cooldown after each successful hit.
Which means that, for him to down 3 survivors in one use of his power, he has to do it all in the span of 25 seconds, in a map that is far more pallet-dense than 1v4 maps and also has longer and safer loops that are shaped in ways that make them harder to mind-game or even turn around while dashing. He also has a 3 seconds cooldown after each successful hit, which means he will only have 19 seconds to do it. That is straight up only possible if the survivors are playing really badly.
Most of the time in 2v8, Oni just gets 2 downs with each use of Blood Fury. And healing is so much stronger in this mode it's far easier to reach the slugged survivor and get them up before he downs the second person and returns. For a power that requires charging, that is not too much at all.
His partner can only do the caging if they are together (which is often suboptimal. If the killers stay together the whole game, they won't spread the pressure and gens will fly) and even then, there are many in solo queue that don't pay attention to that. The only way of garanteeing a partner to pick up downs is to play with a friend. If Oni doesn't have that, we will have to slug in a game mode where slugging is much weaker. And again, slug ONE person and down another, rarely more than that.
Plus, people keep saying here that he gets too many orbs from too many survivors, but they forget the map is also much bigger and the Oni needs to walk more and waste more time to get blood orbs… in a game mode where gens can go insanely fast, and healing is also stronger and survivors have far more information about each other, which also makes easier to mitigate the amount of blood orbs. Hell, there are better ways of making sure Oni's power is available the whole match in 1v4 than 2v8. In 1v4 Oni has access to perks that inflict broken, mangled and other healing slowdowns. Survivors are often forced to do gens while injured and leave a ridiculous amount of blood orbs on the same place, so Oni can just pass by and fully recharge in just one spot instead of walking around collecting them. A similar thing happens when they self-heal. In 2v8, Oni has no perks and survivors doing gens are more often joined by others who see the aura and are quickly healed, so less orbs in one place.
So Oni is fine. At best he might need a few tweaks, but he's nowhere near this overpowered monstrosity people here are claiming he is.
He gets buffs because literally everyone, killer and survivor, gets buffs in this mode. There are more pallets, loops are safer, healing is faster, maps are bigger, survivors give sprint burst to everyone in an area in activation and also have more information about each other, can see killer's auras more often than any perks allows for except for Object of Obsession, and they also know when killers can see their auras.
They are not. Or at least not without getting nerfs at the same time.
Legion got more people to chain hits, sure, but they needed to hit twice as many survivors on a much bigger map to get a down. If it weren't for the buffs their power got in the mode, they would NEVER get those 8 chained hits. So not an inherent buff. People considered them problematic because they could team up with any killer and leave anyone injured for them, not because of double survivors alone.
About Oni, as I've explained above, the map is bigger and he has to walk more to get blood orbs, survivors heal faster and leave less blood orbs in singular spots, loops are bigger and safer and they can also rebuild pallets. So of course killer powers need to be stronger to catch survivors in them.
Nemesis was dog water in 2v8 until a while ago. He was literally considered the weakest 2v8 killer for a while. Only became crazy strong with the 4 zombies.
Hilbilly gets NOTHING from having more survivors on the map. He is not powered up in any way for having more survivors near him like Oni or Legion, but he still gets the disavantages that come with this game mode, like the extra safe loops and much bigger map. That is a inherent NERF to killers without mobility, not a buff to those that have it. That's why Nemesis was so weak at first and then got buffed.
But... That injuring part is there for every killer? Most killers enjoy having someone help spread pressure?