Holding "W" will become in the future a problem and needs to be adressed
I also feel that, survivors start to realize slowly by time that just running forward without looping is against most Killers just the smartest strategy. The problem with it is, it is a very boring strategy which removes all kind of skill play in the game but yet it is the most effective one.
But the big question is, how do you want to adress it? Scott Jund made the suggestion to just reduce the map size and reduce the basic M1 hit cooldown and ofc nerf Save the best for last to compensate that which is a good idea imo.
Dont know if that is really the best solution but I agree that this problem needs to be adressed before it is getting abused too often.
Comments
Looping takes no skill
Stealth is boring
Holding W needs to be nerfed
Ya just can't win.
This can’t seriously be a problem. Cmon now. Are you playing Hag?? Maps have been shrunken down already. There is bloodlust. If you’re following someone that long and can’t catch up, you should at least run into someone on a gen. And if not, that means you’re probably being purposely herded into a killer deadzone, AWAY from gens that need to be done. Either way, break off chase if it’s too long. Be wary of who has Sprint Burst/Lithe/Balanced.
Holding W like this is in the game for years. Its funny people need a streamer video to actually learn about it
I've never found this "W Meta" to be any issue at all, and would call it out saying it's nothing like a meta. It's just survivors running away.
If I see survivors at a distance who spot me and run away, I'll weigh up if it's a worthwhile chase. If it's not, I'll abandon it and catch them at a more fortuitous moment.
There's time enough to catch survivors at different points. Play to the killer strength, watch the playstyle of eaxh individual survivor, look for areas where it will benefit you to take them out more.
Deadzones were put in place to avoid jungle gyms and obstacles where survivors could evade killers for days. That was a big issue back then. Now having them removed is a problem, and I just don't understand it.
Choose the chases wisely. No need to waste time on them. A survivor will always make a mistake. This is where the game gets more depth when dealing with the humanistic side.
And when all survivors run away at a distance? What will you do then?
And this is the problem with the current "win" conditions, particularly for survivors. A Killer can still score decently getting kills, even if they happen quickly, but if survivors do nothing but repair gens and escape, they don't earn enough points for even a safety pip. And it's still better for Killers as well if a match goes on longer, providing more opportunities to earn points. I don't play Killer much, so I'm at the bottom of the ranks, but I have rarely left a match without at least 20k points when I choose to play Killer, and I often earn in the high 20s and even hit 30k - and it's because I'm not at all focused on the kill, but instead focused on lots of chases, lots of hits, getting hooks if it happens, and otherwise just running around and having a good time.
So the question becomes how to change the win conditions and the game culture to encourage players to not rush through the match.
I agree with that but how would you change it? The gens are the only objective for years. Players learn how to do them and they do it really fast, also killers play really fast.
However longer games get much more points and fun for everyone
Is it not okay... in a game that has a TON of RNG... that some maps simply will not favor certain killers? In a prior post you said "imagine wanting to play a relaxed game of Pig and you get Red Forest". You have the option to put on a map offering. There is no guarantee that you will get it (since survivors can contest) but if you're that pressed over certain maps, there really is no reason not to do so. I'll usually just be cool with whatever map I'm on, but if I'm tired of getting particular maps/just want to have an easier time on a favorite map/good map for me, I'll toss on the offering for it and tell RNG to kick rocks.
It's not the end all be all of solutions, but it's THERE for when you want an easier game.
Ive 100% heard killers complain about looping. And no, they werent trolling. Im a killer main myself, why dont you ask some of the survivirs if theyve heard kilkers ######### about looping. Go ahead. Ask 😂
Well you complained about loops, then vaults, then pallets, then map size, then perks, and then gen speed. Why not just say you want survivors who cannot escape or even move if you’re honest?
I have never heard killers complain about unsafe pallets. There might be a few who do, but by and large killers complain about large god loops that have no counters. Those absolutely need to be taken out of the game.
I mean, most players in game are bad from my experiences. It would stand to reason that most forum-goers are bad too.
For the health and fun of the game, it needs to be addressed. You can hold w and waste 48 seconds of a killers time without even dropping a pallet or vaulting a window. Factor in picking up the survivor, finding a hook, hooking them, and you just lost 3 gens.
This kind of gameplay is boring for both sides. Survivors should buy time for generators by winning loops and mindgames against the killer. This is more fun for both sides.
I mean, I can grab another Trick out of the Killer-Box:
"It is a valid strategy". Sounds familiar?
That figure is always misleading though. Maps have boundaries, survivors can't simply run that long in a straight line opposite to the killer's direction of approach without running into the edges of the map.
48 seconds of uninterrupted running is like going from one end to the other of any large map like Azarov's. And even then the chase would have to start from one end of the map and there would be no approaching angle for the killer to be 32m away from the survivor at the beginning of the chase without also being able to cut them off if they try to path for the longest straight line available.
Honestly this is starting to get a bit silly. I'm convinced certain people take this way to seriously because you got people giving numbers and all that. Like come on, people counting how much time to do this and that it's too much. Like running, out of all the things those folks want to gripe about? Running. Come on it's a horror game running is a part of it. And ironically when a survivors knows how to loop some of them folks are the same ones who say "Survivors abuse loops". When survivors know how to loop.
Trickster is just the same, I wonder why noone complains about him? I think that Trickster is even worse then old Legion in any direction.
Idk what you are talking about, the maps never got reduced by size. And yes if you hold W against a not mobile Killer you will waste alot of his time.
Here a very simple experiment for you:
Try to make a kill your friends lobby with someone. You guys meet at Haddonfield long fences or Gas Heaven car walls (Or any other kind of very big building or structure) and your friend as survivor will obv just run away from you and you as a normal M1 Killer try to catch up while a timer is on.
Spoiler
It will take for you longer then 1-2min to catch up for just 1 hit.
Now double it cuz 2 health states.
Where are they to run to? Where else out, other than the hatch and gates. Until then, they're still in the pen and I have enough patience to deal with that.
As for what I do: I play the game. Afterall, I still get 4ks and 3ks. I lose some, but that's just part and parcel of the game. I don't blame it on a button.
Exactly
I agree with you but thats not the point. My point is not to gain even more 4ks our of the game.
Here a example: When Legion got released ppl complained about the Killer beeing to "boring" and has no counterplay and requires no skill to down survivors. Ppl started crying enough until the devs gave up and gutted that Killer.
Legion was NEVER op or strong, neither Legion didnt had counterplay... they had infact counterplay but ppl just didnt wanted to adept or in other words it was easier to change the Killer than the mindset of the majority of the community.
Here we have the exact same situation only it is even worse. Holdinw W requires no skill and is very boring to play against, and also it is way too efficient. So instead of convincing thousands of players to not do that becuase more and more ppl begin to realize it and do that too, just change something about it so ppl cant even do that anymore that efficient.
I can see your viewpoint, I think, although I admit my mind is a bit exhausted, so my apologies if I haven't fully.
The 3 options are to either add more obstacles, which I believe were complained about originally, resulting in the current deadzones and concerns. Secondly, increase the speed difference between killer and survivor, which I can imagine will go down very badly, or reduce the map size, meaning more obstacles closer together and the same issue as point 1.
Basically, what happens one way will cause complaints from the other, and as you say, the mindset of a lot of people is difficult to change. So it's just going to continue rocking back and forth.
But running straight has always been a thing at low ranks, and people used their killers in ways to make short work (portion-map management, herding, 3 gen, etc.). And legitimately that has never been an issue for me, whilst being outplayed or making mistakes has. I just feel there are more pressing matters to deal with than a button.
Were you not here for the uproar when Bloodlust was removed for a weekend?
Like, hello?
no, i don't spend my entire life on the forums
Its crazy. They start doing all the moonwalking ######### and hiding red stain to swing at pallet and hope to hit you then see you way off in the distance and they don't like it xD. So now they complain that survivors are just holding W. Its called getting outplayed. Get use to it and deal with it
predropping pallets and running in a straight line is hardly outplaying anything
also complaining about killers trying to actually play loops and mindgame is pretty pathetic like that's the entire point of the game?
Basically if you play survivor please point at a hook and die
You are right then I got outplayed. But imagine you run towards a survivor on a gen and the second he also sees or hears your TR he runs straight away from you, you need around 30-40sec until the survivor reaches the edge of the map, so ofc you will hit him and then he runs straight at the other direction of the map and well you need another 20-30 sec to reach him and hit him.
Now what is the interaction which is more fun? Holding W or mindgaming and getting outplayed or outplaying.
So is running away for the survivors
Ive got 3k hours in this game. Ive never seen a sirvivor do thay
Maybe open your eyes.
Ive seen plenty hold w till i close distance then get to a loop, ive never seen one run from one wall to the other and back again. Doesnt even make sense, why wouldnt they run to one side of the map, play a loop, get hit, run to the other side, play a loop, get downed? They would waste more of your time doing that. I think youre exaggerating a bit with that.
Not complaining about killers playing loops. You can try doing that and I'll just keep running forward and avoid the mind games all together when I know I can because a lot of killers foolishly try the same mind games over and over.
Whichever one keeps me alive. If I see you in the distance coming I run as soon as I see you to make the chase longer. It only benefits me and my team to do it why would anyone give you free distance to catch up and hit them? Anyone that does is foolish and not playing as effectively as they can.
Well when they keep making killers that can hit through loops and over them, people are just going to avoid killers with that strat.
"i will play in a way that makes the game consistently more boring" i hope you don't complain about camping and tunnelling
"Getting countered = Boring" Lol You're no better than the survivor players that call killers they deem OP boring