Survivors want to play against good Killers
It's just true. Almost all Survivors want to be chased and have a challenging match. Especially at high ranks.
Doing gens and escaping isn't the fun part of this game. It's being pressured and feeling like the match could go either way. Having stressful chases and amazing clutch moments. Survivors might complain a lot, but they really do want good Killers. Not campers, no ed users or babies that don't even resemble a challenge.
Comments
If the first hit happens before you passively fall asleep, you're doing something wrong. If you're close to falling asleep, try to hide rather than initiating a chase, or fail a skillcheck. If you're getting shot by the Deathslinger at a pallet, you're being too greedy. DROP. IT. EARLY. It's the same as Doctor, Clown, and Snare Freddy. DROP. EARLY. Greed WILL get you killed.
As if there aren't a million examples of Killers posting this exact same garbage. 🙄 There are always THOSE people, on both sides.
I won't deny that getting DS'ed after hooking another survivor feels really unfair,but why didn't you just hit her twice and down her that way?
You do know that matchmaking for SWF is always supposed to look for the highest ranked player in the group,right?
What you described was how it used to be in the past at one time.
That survivor was obviously trolling
People keep saying that, and yet I've been posting screenshots now for over a week showing that - even with instant queues - I'm regularly seeing SWF's with red rank players, but only when they also have a low rank player queued with them.
It's not "sometimes", it'll be literally every game over the course of an evening. I posted one screenshot about every 10 minutes one night in a thread just showing how it works.
So yeah, either it's not working right, or people have wrong information. Because that's clearly not how it works.
How do you know that all of them were SWF and not the broken matchmaking we currently have?
Because first matchmaking was looking for the lowest ranked player (the biggest number)
Then it got changed to look for the middle.
And now it should look for the highest ranked player (the lowest number).
Because I can clearly see it on Steam?
I did a whole thing not too long ago just chronicling matches, peoples ranks, and if they were SWF.
At rank 16 I never saw a red rank UNLESS it was SWF. If it was SWF, it was almost exclusively "High ranks with one low rank". Even if it was just a SWF of 2 people.
This was every game, every night. Actually, I've been recording them today as well. I also tested it from the other direction, queueing as a rank 20 survivor with a group of high ranked friends.
Either the intended behavior does not function properly, or it's not the intended behavior. I don't know which it is. All I know it's that it's EXTREMELY consistent behavior right now.
@McLightning
Because broken doesn't mean countered.
Crying exists on BOTH sides, if not, then are we to assume killers are the only ones asking for fair nerfs all the time? This is exactly what people mean when they say that statements like these are "biased". You are unable to separate legitimate constructive feedback vs those who simply complaining without anything substancial to back it up.
Survivors DO want strong killers, but strong again doesn't mean Broken. I'll gladly die if it means that I had at least a chance at playing the game. I don't have to win every single match.
So to reiterate not everyone who is complaining about DS and BT not working against the cage mechanic of the Executioner is saying he needs to be "nerfed", but there has to be legitimate counter (option) because they can simply camp and tunnel off the hook without there really being anything anyone can do about it. That's it.
There has to be a fine line. You can't just introduce a broken mechanic and be OK with it, because that's not the definition of being GOOD. Being good is about taking the time to properly learn a character or their perks and out-playing the opposing side. A mechanic that is a luxury being abused doesn't require skill.
I mentioned in the post how often the aim-animation-thing (because it's not "auto aim," it just "adjusts" the aim so the animation looks right... or something) messes up and hits the hooked person instead of the unhooker. That's actually as frustrating as anything in DbD. But it all happened very fast. I hooked the person, and before I could move she was there making the save. It was a while back, so I'm not sure I even realized in the moment who was making the save. But let's say I did hit her, then she makes the save and the person who just got unhooked body blocks with BT. I still lose.
I did chase her down and kill her after that. I had been going for my BBQ stacks and wasn't trying to kill anyone, so I'd played really nice even though it had actually been kinda stressful trying to slow them down without killing anyone because they really flew through those gens, but that DS annoyed me enough that I killed her and two more survivors after her. I mean, there was no reason to do that when I went far away from the hook every time. It was only done to frustrate the killer, and with DS and BT sometimes there's no right choice. I got lucky; if they'd been near an open exit gate, that would've been it. Maybe they thought me playing nice was me being bad (not that I'm good, but I'm not completely incompetent), who knows, but there's still no reason to do that against a non-camping killer.
it's like that on both sides, i promise
That's not good killers. That's good match making.
Depending on the survivors, if they swf, their build and if their good-but HOW good- a good killer can take away all sense of "going either way" by straight up stomping them early on. What you're describing is a match making system that puts an evenly skilled killer against evenly skilled survivors. I agree.
Problem is a lot of stuff that good survivors do require no skill and ruin chase-same with higher levels of good killer- no killer goes " oh wow. Looping that one thing because I have no way to punish it out of mindgames was fun...it could of gone either way!" they just sigh to themselves knowing that if they ditch the chase now the time sink so far will cause bad gen momentum.
Same with when a killer tunnels a dude to get him dead as quickly as possible. The guy just off the hook is screwed, especially if his teammates make bad saves. Because once you're injured it's very hard to get out of the radius of where the killer can assuredly get you unless you're very good at hiding and have iron will or something. But tunneling is sorrt ofo ne of those things at high ranks you might have to resort to...much like looping...to have any chance on a meta level of not letting things getting out of your hands.
even if you're both flipping fantastic at the game.
The word you are looking for is "aim dressing"
Normally if someone tries to save directly in your face you hit them once,they save during your hit cooldown and then immediatly down the unhooker.
And i mean,if you didn't try to kill them all then you should expect a harder match.
And unhooking in front of you really isn't toxic but rather a pretty stupid move
I generally play killer but got into red ranks as survivor somehow. However, playing against killers that aren't very good make the game a bit dull to my perspective. So I rather hop on killer, torment some survivors (the cocky ones.) I went against a rank 4 huntress who got two kills cause people were being overly altruistic and didn't know how to fake unhook.
I think the problem is how they think using second change perks right off the bat makes them godly. Had a game where a Kate used unbreakable on shack pallet and then used it to stun me. Good job, you wasted a second chance perk and a great pallet with 4 gens left.
Aim dressing, thank you. Brain fart, there.
Oh, I do know it's a harder match when I don't kill. I accept that. I remember that one being especially difficult, though I don't remember why. I think because I was trying to refrain from slugging a lot to slow them down. Usually I slug to slow down gens, but I think I'd recently gotten a complaint about slugging so I was trying to be nice and slug less. Yeah... only total potatoes don't get gens done when you're neither slugging nor killing. There's really no way around that.
"Normally if someone tries to save directly in your face you hit them once,they save during your hit cooldown and then immediatly down the unhooker."
Normally, yeah, but I think I was in the wrong spot to lunge, and if you don't lunge then you automatically grab. But either way, against hook campers I've managed as a survivor to take a hit, make a save, and then the survivor I just saved takes a hit with BT and we both escape. If the survivors play it right you won't necessarily get to hit the unhooker a second time.
"And unhooking in front of you really isn't toxic but rather a pretty stupid move"
I don't consider it toxic, just rude (when the killer's not camping). And definitely a bad play, which even when I'm playing nice I usually try not to encourage those. I used to give free unhooks, but the more I get farmed off the hook as a survivor the less I want to encourage that kind of crap from other survivors when I'm killer. Make a safe save or let someone else make the save, because if it were almost any other killer but me that stupid move would get the unhooked survivor killed. Not cool, man.
What is fair play by killer? Seems like survivors opinion about it is to play as dumb as killers can so survivors can all escape. I'm honestly curious.
From my perspective as new player, most efficient way to play killer is to tunnel always. Cut down survivors one by one. I haven't done anything that could be seen as unfair or toxic playing but in return I still get mostly clicky-clickys, teabags and ggez baby killer in chat. And this is while survivors are way higher, more experienced than me running meta perks while I'm not even allowed to use noed.
I only get GG's when it's easy for the Survivors ("ezgg"), and I only get salt when it's hard for them.
Survivors don't want a challenge; they want to bully the Killer and look cool doing it in front of their friends.
I hardly ever see a Killer initiate the insults during end game chat. It is usually Survivors that start. If there were a million examples of Killers messaging like that, you would see it more often on the forums, instead, it is usually Killers posting screenshots of derogatory remarks by Survivors.
Very insightful.
The problem with this logic is that when survivors face a good killer. They claim that the killer is broken and cry nerf
Ahh yes. Because a killer that can quickscope so that survivors have no reaction time, and a killer that can infinitely place down objects that slow the opponents without any cooldown or penalty = counterplay.
True. Gen simulator sucks.
Maybe I was wrong all along, look at this goddamned hero of a survivor:
It gives me hope for the future. (For context, the first line in the chat was "what a camper" from another survivor, after they set up an epic 3-gen by doing the Saloon, Hangman, and "bushy" gens, leaving 3 all together in the town jungle gym area.)
Oh yes it is super rare to see a reasonable survivor. Perhaps this blessed occurrence is a sign that the winds of fate might soon blow in my favor!
Most killers have counterplay built into them as their core concept. The main exceptions I can think of are: Nurse, Spirit, Legion, and now PH. Most of those got nerfed/are generally disliked by survivors. I wonder why?
Maybe it is because they like the ability to deny a killers power? Just a thought.
Legion IS counterplay. 4 second stun to leave power (double the length of a pallet stun). Hitting a Survivor normally halves the Power Gauge. Deep Wound is basically just slowdown and non-threatening.
Keeping everyone injured isn't just a Legion thing either. In high ranks, running sloppy butcher will make Survivors quit healing and just slam gens. Half my Ghost Face games are just everyone staying injured because they're paranoid about Nurse's Calling.
They like to be able to influence the outcome of a trial. They want to feel outplayed and feel like they outplayed the killer. It's not just about being able to "deny a killer's power", it's about engaging in skillful interactions and having outcomes of those interactions that feel deserved. Hence why players complain about second chance perks, which can make those players feel like outcomes were shifted in a matter undeserved. Hopefully this comment can encourage you to engage in more thoughtful and constructive discussion about counterplay and fun in the future 😊
Most of the powers survivors are more than ok with are ones they can interact with/disable. Trapper? We can disarm his traps when he isn't looking. Demogorgon? We can destroy his portals. Plague? We can deny cleanse (although not as strong as it used to be). See a theme here?
Maybe you are correct about PC. But on console, this is definitely the theme.
They apparently didn't have any on release, and people still complain about them negating pallets and window vaults for easy first hits. That wasn't the point, however, and you are using that one thing to nitpick away from what I am saying.
Well idk about the general opinion of the population but me and my friends hate Trapper and Plague. Both m1 killers, one forces you to stare at the ground all game and the other takes away your healing and stealth options. Some of my friends like bullying baby Trappers, but they're the minority and the majority of people I know would rather face a killer with a more interesting and challenging power, like Billy or Oni. Of course this is all subjective. The survivors I see in my games as killer don't complain about the killers I play(Trapper, GF, Billy, Demo), but I know that my experience is not evidence of any popular opinion.
It is indeed subjective. A lot of the ones I go against complain because I play Legion and Deathslinger well.
the problem with taht is that good killer would never ever commit for a good survivor thats the easiest way to lose a match. so wont happen unless you are nurse/spirit