Jensen
Jensen
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@HoodedWildKard said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3324236#Comment_3324236
It's not possible to remove a 3 gen by popping 2 gens. There will always be a viable 3 gen left afterwards. And like i said first chase only is bad for you if you let it be so. If you know you can't end it fast enough. Abandon it and pressure gens so they don't pop
Ofcourse it is. But lets say they make the middle gen and now you have two 3gens left. One a bit better one a bit worser, what do you do now?
Defend your 3gen and sacrefice the other 3 gens? Or risk your 3gen? But yes thats possible, you can play as killer with Eruption+call of brine and focus totaly on your 3gen. The survivos will have to come. But yes this works, it works way to good. But the question is do we want this 10Minutes 3gen standoffs?
If you know you can't end it fast enough. Abandon it and pressure gens so they don't pop
But how fast do you know it? And than if you find a new survivor, there are still 2 survivors on gen that you never saw AND the 3te survivor you dindt catched is on a gen now.
@FellowKillerMain said:
The first chase is over when the survivor is down, not when they're dead! Stop tunneling! \s
We are all talking over a down, not over a kill.
I see alot of people here saying "yes but 3gen". You are all right. If you plan on 3gen with Eruption and other slowdown perk, the first chase doesnt matter that mutch, even the first 3-4 generators doesnt matter mutch since you make nearly all hooks with that last 3gen situation. But is that a gameplay that you prefere? Is that the solution if you dont win the first chase?
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@HoodedWildKard said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3324236#Comment_3324236
It's not possible to remove a 3 gen by popping 2 gens. There will always be a viable 3 gen left afterwards. And like i said first chase only is bad for you if you let it be so. If you know you can't end it fast enough. Abandon it and pressure gens so they don't pop
ofcourse it is possible depending on the map and spawn. But lets say they did the middle gen. Now you have 2, 2Gen sitatuation and you can defend one. So you want to abandon the other 3 generators for free? Or do you want to leave your precious 3gen that you plan to defend and risk it with 4survivors alive and ready?
And thats the Situation how you are starting the game. Because you dindt catch the survivor. You got nothing in return.
Abandon it and pressure gens so they don't pop
So you are going to a different survivor. Than 2 SURVIVORS are still on gens you never saw. And this 2 gens will pop. Im not sure if you understand it right. The problem is not that 2 gens pop, that will eventually happen anyway. Its that you get nothing in return
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@dspaceman20 said:
I'm all for nerfing circle of healing so that's it's more balenced but your going to have to buff the other boons. Non of the other boons are good enough to take on their own.
Also can we please have a suggestion that doesn't outright make circle of healing completely useless?
Maybe 1 kick one of the two effects. 50% more heal OR Selfheal.
not both.
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@Raccoon said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3323812#Comment_3323812
I sometimes win games in the first chase as survivor.
Using WoO + Exhaustion, it is not hard to burn enough time to guarantee 2-3 gens are done if people are M1'ing on gens.
If RNG is REALLY good and the killer overcommits, all gens can be done on rare occasions.
A lot of people have trouble dropping chase after the first hit due to 'sunk cost' mentality, which works in the survivors' favor as well.
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The direct answer to your question is that if a survivor is doing well/winning the first chase, there is no other objective for the remaining survivors other than to M1, which advances their only objective. An efficient team will do just that. The longer a survivor lasts in the first chase, the longer people can M1 without needing to Unhook/Flashlight Save/etc that pulls them off gens.
As soon as a survivor loses the first chase, multiple objectives are created in addition to gens (IE saving, healing, bodyblocking, etc).
In subsequent chases/scenarios, a survivor may already be on a hook/chase could be near one of the few remaining gens/it could be on a survivor that has not been previously hooked which doesn't put as much pressure on teams looking for a 4e/etc.
A fast first chase in the killer's favor lets them either try to camp/tunnel someone out asap if they want, go after a fresh survivor/play fair with less consequence, etc.
A fast first chase for killer is just as important as a long first chase as survivor, imo.
Of course, this is all my own opinion, and I could totally be wrong.
I agree with a lot. And this multiple objects that you create are important to give a flow to the game.
But the problem that you are saying is that you have a tunneling and camping killer. Not that this happens after the first chase. This "multiple objects" are important that the games takes longer as 5 minutes.
And im not talking about a "fast first chase". im talking about a succsessful first chase. If the chase needs 60sec but you have a hook, its not good but manageable. If you have a 60sec chase and you got nothing, you realy realy have a problem. If a survivor gets catched in the first chase basicly the normal game goes on.
Alot of killer will start to tunnel or camp after they lost the first chase, because 1 survivor less is pretty mutch the only way to get out of that situation.
@HoodedWildKard said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3323850#Comment_3323850
But that's the thing, I was saying the first 2 gens aren't really that important. I've had a lot of matches as killer and surv where the balance has tipped when there are 1 or 2 gens left. You can lose first chase and pull it back in the late game.
If you have a couple of decent regression perks, holding down a 3 gen as killer is crazy easy and you can often down multiple survs because they either stay near gens or lose. One slip there and killer snowballs.
If you find you're losing to much in the early game. Don't go for downs straight away. Often the first surv you run into is seeking you out unless you chase them off a gen. Don't commit, ignore them or injure them and let them run off. find the first gen being worked on and pressure it can help stop those early pops. Corrupt intervention is an awesome perk for this. Forces them to look for gens and narrows your focus early game. Or gives you prep time to setup traps/portals etc with trapper, hag or demo.
You seem to misunderstand it a bit. I never said the first gen is the most important gen, thats obv. the last one. Im also not saying that its impossible to win.
If you loose the first chase, your 3gen might be allrdy gone, since the chasing took you too long and you dont have pressure to stop them with the gens. With 4 survivors alive and noone of them on hook they can basicly to every generator they want.
Often the first surv you run into is seeking you out unless you chase them off a gen. Don't commit, ignore them or injure them and let them run off.
I dont agree with this, why should the first survivor seek you out, when he have no clue where you are and he can do gens instead? A survivor who only wants to train running and dont care about the win maybe yes, but normaly not. And the idea you are talking here is playing around with 2 survivors without dowing anybody. What you are forgetting is that the 2 other survivors are still making gens. If you go on with this game for 5minutes you lost it.
Corrupt intervention is an awesome perk for this.
Thats true, i guess thats why allready one guy said maybe this should become baseline since its a more healthy play
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@HoodedWildKard said:
A bad first chase is an issue but that's usually just a weak survivor getting caught and will happen repeatedly. But it's the late game that really counts.
The first 2/3 gens are so easy to do without tying up the killer in chase. You can stealth it. But when you are down to last 1/2 gens the killer's focus narrows and it's more important for someone to be able to run a good chase to keep the killer away. If you're unlucky/bad enough to get 3 genned, then it's possible to finish it. But you need at least 3 survs with almost perfect co-ordination, to get it finished and flip flop the killer between gens while still making progress. Or a killer who will play ball and commit to a chase and allow the gen to be finished.
And thats exacly what i said. The first chase doesnt matter mutch for the survivor.
You are talking about "bad player" and "good player" that you have or dont have. They are not more important earlier or later in the game. A good player who can drag the killer away. Im talking about 1 chase that is just 10 times more important as any other chase.
Losing the first chase as killer means loosing 2 gens. No other chase is that important for the killer. No other chase gives him that mutch of an handcap. Losing the first game basicly mean you are starting a new game but instead of 5 gens there are only 3. And if you are unlucky your 3gen is allready gone.
And for that 2 gens gone, the killer got nothing. No pressure, nothing (since he didnt got the survivor).
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@Dennis_van_eijk said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/361715/first-chase-is-too-important
That is why you need to pick your fights.
If you chase a survivor, identify asap whether they are good or not and what loop they are at.
If they are strong or at a strong loop, or both, then leave them and find the weaker link.
Even against strong survivors, there is always 1 that is weaker than the others.
Go for them and increase the chances more towards you.
Thats all true. But not what this thread is about. In the first chase, well you only found 1 survivor. This is the first time you are seeing him run. You dont know if its a good survivor or a bad survivor. And how long do you need to see it if its a good survivor?
So lets say you find your first survivor, follow him for lets say 10sec and think "well thats a good survivor" are you stopping the chase? I mean you dont know where the others are and dont know how good they are.
You are saying "Even against strong survivors, there is always 1 that is weaker than the others." but how do you know in your first chase which one?
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@Deathstroke said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3323287#Comment_3323287
No it goes both ways quick down for killer and is usually win. Ofcourse sometimes survivors can make comeback but so can killer. Usually I only lose that kind of game by going for multiple hooks like trying to 2 hook everyone before killing. Usually I achieve that but still 2 or 3 survivors can escape as that still takes lot of time and is not optimal playstyle for killer.
No. What makes you think that? We are comparing it to the "standard".
Is the standard game for you that you make 2gens in the first 2 minutes?
So basicly you think 1vs4 on 3 gens is the normal?
@Raccoon said:
The first chase is important for both sides.
It's importance grows exponentially if either side is playing hard.
Why is it important for survivor? What would you say is the "standard" and how is your game getting harder when this standard does not apply? What makes the first chase more important as the forth?
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@SMitchell8 said:
Mid game is more important. I've had loads of games where I've started really well and have the upper hand but then they recover mid game and get back into it leaving me scrambling around late game.
You need constant presure ALL game every game. Any lapse and the survivors can turn it around.
Im not sure if you understood my statement right. Im not talking about a "good" early start, im talking about a bad one and the impact on the game.
A start where the killer gets the first survivor and hooks him is pretty mutch the standart. Im talking about the situation and the consequences when this doesnt happen. Ofc you still have to play the mid and endgame and cannot go afk after you did 1 hook.
You need constant presure ALL game every game
Thats the point. If you are losing the first chase, you dont have any pressure and 3 survivors on gens. You basicly instand loose 1-2 gens without any hooks.
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Your situation:
- Killer finds early a survivor
- Killer injuries survivor early in chase
- killer downs survivor early in chase
- STBFL
- PIG
- Pain resonance
- DMS
- killer camps
- 2nd survivor doesnt see the killer (because its a stealth killer)
- 2nd survivor gets graped
= you are in a huge disadvantage
My situation:
- Killer loses the first chase
= you are in a huge disadvantage
The difference between the first and any other chase is that 3 Survivors are on gens. Im not sure why you made so mutch condition to your situation because the base problem that puts you in the disadvantage is that you have 2 survivors on hooks. the other conditions just make your situation worser, but the problem doesnt change that mutch later in the game.
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@StarLost said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/361715/first-chase-is-too-important
Yes...but it's just as important for survivors.
A quick down early on basically gives you control of the match for a while. Two quick kills and you snowball almost instantly.
In my opinion its not that important as it is for killer. I would call it pretty mutch the standart that the survivor wins the first chase. Its compareable with a doubledown of the killer at the start. a doubledown, brings a killer at least 3 maybe 4 downs and the survivors have done nothing on the gens.
But thats a double down. The killer is in the same situation when Since 3 other guys were making gens you only have maximum 4, but more realisticly 3 gens left until you have your first hook.
Remember that the survivor only have to do 5*90=450sec gen. If you fail the first chase, and hook on the 2nd, 2 Survivors did the whole time gens. And one did like 50% of the time a gen. So your first hook comes like at 90sec, that means 2.5 gens are done when you are at your first hook.
@Blueberry said:
The better player should win, but yeah it is overly punishing early on as killer as that's when you have the least map pressure.
Honestly I think almost everyone in the community thinks Corrupt should've been base kit at this point.
I agree with both. I dont say that i have a solution to the problem, just wanted to ask you guys how you think about the situation
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You are talking about clown? One of the worest kiler atm? A basic m1 killer?
Pinky is a red addon so rare+he have to hit you with a bottle + he have to hit you with m1.
gas clouds no longer slow survivors, because right now being exposed and slowed is a guaranteed death sentence
That would take the addon from A to D tier, because that makes it pretty unusable.
Limit the maximum amount of bottles you can throw before reloading by 1 (similar to Huntress Iri head)
But Huntress axe has a higher range + flys more straight and less in a curve AND DOWNS WHEN IT HITS.
With clown bottel you still have to make the m1 attack. For example you could hit 1 player with a bottel but a other bodyblocks you.
You have to keep in mind that what Pinkyfinger makes so strong is that it blocks 2 addon spaces. Because you have to play it with a more flask addon or its pretty weak. On his own basicly all purple addons and alot of green are better than it.
@Emeal said:
All you need is a competent Clown and you wont have any gameplay as Survivor.
bHVR should change this addon, change it to something like bottle hits increase intoxication duration.
Thats true for most killers. A competent Nurse or Pyramidehead is (in my opinion) way more dangeous. Against clown you can be a competent survivor, against a good nurse not.
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Nope. Using a feature of the game should never be banable or punishable.
And a punishment will never stop this kind of play. We are seeing it on so many other salty games like league or dota
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@hastarkis said:
As far as this IS to annoy/mock the killer in most cases, you just can't prove that, therefore your report will do nothing, I'm afraid. Maybe this survivor was waiting for you to thank you for fun game, how is this unsportsmanlike? You never know for sure.
Even if you'd record 30 minutes of them butt-dancing on the hatch while looking at you, the only thing bhvr can do is ask why didn't you come to close the hatch or force survivor to leave as you have all your tools for that.
For thanking they could just write it in after chat. Im not sure how delaying the game until i found him and the hatch can be "thanking".
If you do something just to annoy the enemy its ofcourse "unsportmanslike" I mean if thats not unsportmanslike what else is?
You never know for sure.
Yes and maybe the killer who is afk the whole game, just want to gift points to the survivors and is not using a bot. Or when they write "noob" after the game they are trying to motivate you to get better. You never know for sure... Thats why we are speaking about "unsportmanslike" behaviour and not from unsportmanslike motives.
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@HoodedWildKard said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3322516#Comment_3322516
And that's the idea, if the game takes a bit longer then more BP all round. Survs get a distraction to get more gen progress, something to unhook and heal. Killer gets all of their hook states more points as they chase, injure and use abilities on the bot and won't lose their adept just because one player threw their toys out of the pram the second they got downed.
Hmm you are realy playing the game totaly different. I mostly play killer main and never have any BP problem. So if you would give me a chance to quit a game that is a wraste of time (and a 3surv. 5gen game is that) i would take it. Because i know from the start how this will end.
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@HoodedWildKard said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3322352#Comment_3322352
Still better than being a man down. When a survior DCs early (which is most DCs) the team has zero chance anyway. Literally only 2 killers, oni and myers get a marginal advantage from farming stuff from a bot.
And using the bot to keep last survivor in the game? If a killer is sweating that hard for a 4k they will simply slug. Or even do it with a live survivor. I've did that yesterday to catch someone who'd been hiding all game lol.
There's no real downside to popping a bot in to replace a ragequit. On the same hook states of course
I mean true, there is not a downside, besides that the game takes a bit longer. I think the end will pretty mutch be the same. I allrdy played against bots.
@HoodedWildKard said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3322421#Comment_3322421
Not if they still get DC penalties.
DC penelty stop nobody from leaving. Never did never will. Because when they Ragequit, they are doing exacly that Quitting out of rage without thinking.
A leaverhell is a way better system. If you are leaving games, you will que with other leavers. Than 2 things can happen:
1.) You learn your lession
2.) You dont bother the "normal" players anymore and stay in the leaver hell.
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@HoodedWildKard said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3322363#Comment_3322363
And when someone DCs in the first few minutes? If i suicide on hook everytime someone DCs early then 25-30% of my matches are just automatically written off.
How i said if there is a surrender button, you just press it and get your Points you earned so far gold your items and gg.
Because if a survivor dces in like the first 1-2min its GG anyway. As killer i would realy love if i could surrender in such options, because its a wraste of time. If a survivor dces that early its impossible for suv to win.
Even if i would just hook 1 and facecamp him for 2minutes
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Sure.... First let the killer chase you for 10-15sec, and when hes short before reaching you, you speed away. Because thats what the game needs, longer chases...
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@Batusalen said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3322252#Comment_3322252
The killer getting a 3k is the killer playing good, the amount of generators left is totally irrelevant at all levels for him (in fact, a 3k is already a win for the killer in terms of MMR, the 4k is just that little extra). Giving more advantages to survivors in the hatch phase is only punishing the killers more for playing good and not slug the 3º one to go for the 4k.
And 2 to 5 meters of aura reading is nothing, you would hear them even before you see their aura. Not even with a 32m aura radius would you see the survivor in the exit gate if the hatch spawned in the middle of the map.
I would love to see a change in how the hatch mechanic works, but your idea is not the way to go.
I think its a difference if you have 5gens left of 0. Because one its a "close win" the other is a obvious win.
The Aura reading helps alot when it comes to hiding even a small aura of "just" 5meters. Yes you hear them when they are running or injured but not if they are just hiding behind cornors, wallsa nd stones.
You could check exitgates when seaching for hatch and just check with your aurareading that the suv. is not hiding there.
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@HoodedWildKard said:
Title. with the amount of DCs we see in games, makes it pretty unfair on survivors. If a player DCs early, it throws the entire game in the killer's favour.
Like last time I decided to bring Franklin's as killer someone literat DCd after I hit them and they realised I was using it. I didn't even down them, they just dropped their flash light and 5 secs later just noped out of the game.
If we fill those spots with bots, then at least survs have a team mate still, and the bots are pretty good at gen rushing lol. Even killers, nothing more annoying as surv when you're finally getting a decent game and killer ragequits after 2nd or 3rd gen is done, you lose out on a lot of BP, so backfilling with a bot killer at least lets you play out the match for the BP you deserve.
But woulndt it be easier and better to just surrender the game and start a new one? As soon 1 leaves, everybody is able to surrender (when not in chase) the game and retain their items they get the bloodpoints they earned so far.
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@DaManOfGaming said:
There are too many killers holding the game hostage by camping hook.. this could be solved if hook progression would pause after the killer has been in close proximity for too long. That way survivors could have a fair chance.
Its a game element. Just go there with 2-3 people and free him.
The killer cannot camp the hook and win the game since you can do all the other gens in that time. And besides Bubba and hilbilly nobody can do something against it. But the strongest you can do against "killer camping" is just doing gens and win the game. But ofc, if im close to a hook and i see 2 suv. approching, why should i leave the area of the hook?
And its not "holding the game hostage" you can still make gens and finish the game. There are also talents for suvivor to pause the hook progression. If you think thats a problem just pick it.
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@Wowie said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3321593#Comment_3321593
I feel like you're speaking from a genuine place of low skill. How long have you played Dead by Daylight? Unless one side is playing very, very poorly the endgame does not stretch to 30 minutes anymore. Pre-2019, sure.
It's fine as is. There does not need to be any change whatsoever.
Please read again. (what did we talk about?, in what situation would the endgame take 30 minutes?)
@Batusalen said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3320662#Comment_3320662
So, survivors need to be rewarded even more for losing to the killer? The hatch already give the last survivor 2 free escape chances, the hatch itself and the exit gates when it closes. It such a reward that many people are not even taking the first one and instead of looking for the hatch they just wait at the exit gates for the killer to close it.
Also, this wouldn't solve what you are trying, as survivor would still hide the moment only 2 are left. It would only make the hatch to benefit even more the last survivor, whatever he did something the rest of the game or not.
No it would reward the killer for playing good, and make him more likely to win if he gets to that stage with more Gens. Since the killer gets Aurasight than it would be mutch harder for the suvivor to hide at the exit gates.
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True, remove Slowdown, exhaustion and endurance perks.
As killer i think all 3 are not very funny. You need slowdown perks to counter enemys exhaustion perks.
endurance perks like DH or Off the Record are just frustrating to play against. Its just not a fun element, you cannot use launch attack if they have DH or if you dont know that they have DH. The game feels balanced on 2hit-> down, not 3hits.
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@SassyNoodle said:
Can you please do something about killers that are idle and have their button locked to keep swinging their weapons? It seems way too common these days and makes the matches undesirable because we cant disconnect without a stupid penalty. Either auto DC the killers with a penalty for being idle or put in place a better system for survivors to DC without penalty so survivors dont waste our time just doing gens and wasting offerings and escaping just for the sake of not having a penalty.
Im on the other side, i am one of thouse killers. The solution is easy, give killer a surrender option like survivor have. There are games that are just so unfair matchmaked that you dont have any fun with it. But instead of suvivor who can surrender, the killer have to stay the whole game.
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@Warlord1981NL said:
Start the countdown then. The current setup is just punishing killers for playing well.
start the countdown when? ATM it is starting when you close the hatch
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@Wowie said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3321201#Comment_3321201
It's more than just finding hatch first sometimes. There are some really intense and enjoyable endgame chases that I've experienced on both sides.
With my change, this woulnd end.
@Warlord1981NL said:
Hatch should completely be removed and doors shouldn't power. Just game on.
Than you gonna play hide and seek for the next 30minutes. Because suv. know he cannot finish gens. I think the endgame collaps is very important. It dont have to be activated by hatch but some kind of game limitation is important
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@Wowie said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3321187#Comment_3321187
Sounds like a skill issue to me
For what? For finding hatch first? There is realy no skill needed for it.
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@Wowie said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3320662#Comment_3320662
if you're forced to take hatch then your team did not play good. personal skill is irrelevant.
it's meant to be an intense 50/50 moment if it comes to it.
Its often not only "your teams" foult. And yes you get 2 times a free 50/50 chance, but for what?
And for some killers it feels superstupid, because not all killer on all maps can secure both doors. So you have a 50/50 game for finding the hatch. And a 50/50 game with doors.
And the survivor who escapes like this doesnt have archived anything. He could be AFK from the start, the team dindt do even 1 gen and he escapes.
Im not sure where a coinflip is "intense". You can also just dont do the hatch coinflip and hide at a gate. Depending on the mapsize and killer its a gurantee win.
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@HugTechLover said:
Hatch is fine how it is. Doesn’t really need changes imo.
Why? Isnt it better when you get rewarded for playing good?
Atm they could also just end the game instandly and flip a coin. Would have the same result
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@LooeDbD said:
I straight up just got told nodding is toxic
i was doing this https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7JBKHK4KHA0
Ofcourse, i mean you are doing it to annoy the survivor. You dont get a benefit from it, you even are slowing yourself down when you nod instead of walking to the next survivor
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@SmolBlob said:
I think it would be interesting if BHVR tested out the following:
- Basekit Endurance after unhook changed to invincibility + collision removed (to prevent bodyblocking for allies) for 15s as long as Exit Gates are not powered. If Exit Gates are powered, is Endurance + collision removed.
- Hooking a survivor that isn’t the most recently unhooked one gives an additional reward
- Maybe like IDK, automatically damages most progressed gen by X%/damages all gens by some lower Y%/etc.
- Leaving 24m or so area of the hook gives additional reward as long as you stay out of those 24m UNLESS you’re in chase
- Maybe like IDK, basekit temporary Ruin-like effect to reward pressuring survivors off other gens, or BBQ aura style effect to give next place to chase, etc.
- Nerf/readjust slowdown perks and whatever else necessary to match
So nerf killer? Why not just give them 30sec endurance and a free DS for everybody?
Do you know what that will change? Nothing. Because as stronger Survivors are getting as stronger it is to take one out. The Problem is that especally the first gens are falling way to fast and there is not mutch that a killer can do to prevent that.
So when it comes into the 3-4gen Situation you are eather playing against 3 suv or 4 suv. Its easy. 1 dead is more worth as 6 hooks. I cannot stress this enoth how important a kill is. And as long its that important, as long killer will do everything to try to secure one kill. With CoH in game Injuries doesnt matter anymore and dont help you on a down.
When i have 1 suv down at 4 gens, i nearly allways win. It doesnt matter that they have 7 hooks left. I hook 1, chase another. Than he frees him, i down the next one and so on and so on.
3) Why the bonus only as long as hes not in chase? I mean i think the idea is good. I think "Monstrous Shrine" should be basekit on every hook. Because now a hook doesnt put enoth pressure on the suv.
4.) Killers only need slowdown because of the exhaust and endurance perks. Because it takes so long to get a survivor. Lets say I chase a good survivor and need 60sec to hit+down him. In that time the other can do gens. If 2 are doing the same gen, that means that Gen is done.
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@Little_Kitten said:
There is tunneling and tunneling.
Case 1: there is 1 generator left to repair, I didn't make any kills, because I got caught in a hurry (and I played fairly during the game) I have to put pressure on the players; I meet a player who just got dehooked; yes, I will prioritize getting him out of the game.
Is this tunneling ?
Technically yes. But completely understandable.
Case 2: The killer starts his game. He puts a survivor down. He hooks him. As soon as the survivor is unhooked, the killer comes back on him, hits him once (BT), a second time (DH), a third time, hooks him again. He comes back on him again, hits him once (BT), a second time (DH), grabs the DS, puts him back down, hooks him again.
Is this tunneling ?
Technically yes.
And here, on the other hand, I don't mind saying that the killer played like a *******
Lets go to case 2. For example i dont play a seaching perk like Barbecue & Chilli. I hook one, and i have no clue where the suv. are. Than after like 10-15sec i hear the unhook behind me.
I can do 2 things now
1.) Random roaming the map
2.) Go into the direction where i know that people are. Maybe now, as the freeing survivor without any hook stages you should bait the killer to follow you. "Baiting" means NOT standing at the other side of the map and ducking, it means you have to give me the feeling that its worth following you. If i know i have at least a 60seconds chase, i wont follow you.
If i can choose between somebody who i allrdy hooked, and somebody who i never hooked and they are both at the same difficult why should i follow the one without hook stats?
To case 1:
Do you know what puts a fuckton of pressure on survivor? Killing one. Because than as sook as you hook 1.:
1 is on hook
1 is freeing him
1 on gen (if hes lucky)
But mostly its:
1 on hook / 1 freeing him / 1 in a chase with me.
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I think there are several problems than bring uns there.
First is that the first 3 gens are falling way to fast. In a game that takes like 15minutes, the first 3 gens normaly fall in 2-3 Minutes. So for the rest of the 12 Minutes gametime you are just protecting a handful of gens. When you dont have mutch gens, slowdown perks are ofcourse very very strong.
The Problem is that exhaustion perks makes it longer to catch a survivor. Perks like "Off the Record" are making hunting perks worser, perks like "Boon: Circle of Healing" make chases without a sucsessful down worse.
Before it was like this:
When I injure 1 Suv. 1 have to him and heal him, i chase 1 survivor. So only 1 surv can be at gen.
Now when i Injure 1 surv, and chase 1; 2 survivor can be at gens because the injured one can heal himself. That increses the pressure from the survivors on the killer massive. For that the killer needs, or wants to use slowdowns.
So when survivor are using perks, to counter chasing perks from the killer, its normal that slowdown perks are feeling stronger.
In my Opinion. Perks like "Call of Brine" can be nerfed because they dont need any skill. For Eruption you need a sucsessful chase. I also dont understand why call of brine starts with 200% regression and overcharge starts with 75% and slowly goes up to 200%
Also i think that slowdown perks, are only very strong with 3gen situations.
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@SmolBlob said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3305938#Comment_3305938
Because they queued up, and them ragequitting because they’re too childish and entitled to handle a game that isn’t the way they want ruins it for all 4 other players.
How i said, just que people who ragequit together. Than they are eather learn it how mutch that annoys other players and stop it, or they are forced to play with each other what leaves the rest out too
@MrKrabsArgArgArg said:
I think they should have it so if you DC or suicide on the hook too much you don't earn blood points on your next game, in addition to the DC penalty. Then if you keep doing it, the amount of games you won't earn BP increases. I'd say a max of 3-5 if you have a bad pattern
That wont help anything. People are not rational thinking "hmm i have to stay so i dont loose the bloodpoints". And you dont know how mutch BP some people have. As main killer i have more BP as i can spend. In a normal game i get like 30-40k, in the evening i often get the +100% bonus that makes 60-80k every game.
i guess good surviver make similar
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@willymancer69 said:
Hi!
Apologies if I am putting this in the wrong place-- I created a forum account today after 4 years of playing the game to make this post because I'm at my wits end.
For reference, by self-kill I mean the survivor kills themselves on hook from 0 hooks to dead from one hooking event OR, upon someone being able to unhook them fast enough so they can't kill themselves, the unhooked player runs at the killer to be downed and then killed.
Today, the number of rage DCs and self-killing is staggering. A year ago, a DC was rare and even then survivors and killers alike would feel bad about a DC, that they'd mutually farm for the remainder of the game. I'm not saying that was good or bad, but speaking to the rarity of the situation and mutual feeling of knowing rage DCs is a bad practice.
In the past day, only 2/10 games I solo queued for had no one rage DC or self-kill. DCs happen usually upon first down in the early game or right before death on second hook. The first situation is much more punishing. In response to this, someone usually self kills or DCs in short succession.
Please create heavier punishments for DCs past a grace 1 DC, or, tie it to a different punishment if it happens after a certain event (ex. A down). Additionally, please try to find a mechanism to either punish players for self -killing (0 hooks to death) or lower the punishment for the survivors that stay (bloodpoint and rank tick/pips specifically). A nice solution would be 0 de-pips if a player DCs your game regardless of what follows.
In either case, please, please do something. It's gotten so bad these past few updates that my friends and I are considering leaving after many happy years here. The DCs and self-kills have made the game incredibly not fun to play.
Thank you for your time reading this,
Mads
Or very easy, make surrender Option for killer and surviver. So you know who surrender and who dont, and can place the people who surrender less likely together
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@SmolBlob said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3305636#Comment_3305636
If they are too obvious about it, it can get them banned from the game rather than just a queue ban. And if they’re pretending to play at a normal-enough level to avoid said ban, then the goal of forcing them to play instead of quit was still achieved.
Hook suicide mechanic is outdated and used to DC while avoiding the penalty for DCing 99% of the time.
A surrender mechanic with heavy restrictions is fine, but hook suicide still should be removed for that reason.
"then the goal of forcing them to play instead of quit was still achieved."
Why should that be the goal? The goal is that all players have fun within the match. They will just run into the killer 3 times. How i said its pretty mutch impossible (especally for a program) to detect the difference between a bad player and a player who suicides.
I mean he can also start to make gens, and fail every or nearly every skillcheck. He will find a way to quit the game as fast as possible, the only difference is how mutch dmg he will make the team in the meantime.
Why not just make surreindering players, play with other player who surrender? Than you (who never surrenders) will only play with other players who never or rarly surrender
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@Entitled_survivor said:
I can guarantee you ruin wouldn't see much more play than now even with 200 % regression rate,,wanna know why ? because it's a totem perk you can find and cleanse relatively fast,,,wanna bring undying to protect it ? you now have used to perk slots and around the 3-4 mins of the game max you will be left with two perks,,Any other regression perk except maybe pop is way more reliable atm
Thats wrong because well when it was 200% it was played alot
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@burt0r said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3305655#Comment_3305655
Ehm unbreakable basekit was in planning exactly because of the instant Mori when all survivor are either hooked or slugged?
That's the whole idea bhvr had and tested a month ago?
unbreakable basekit would destroying slugging in the whole game, and would destroy one tactical element of the killer. In my opinion the problem of slugging people to death is not that bad to remove the whole slugging mechanic
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@TealJade said:
What's your opinion on bleeding survivors to death without hooking at all?
On EU servers there are some killers deliberately do this for 'fun'. Yesterday I played against a nurse and at the end there were only me and a Mikaela left in game. The nurse downed Mikaela, slugged them while chased and downed me, which was understandable. But 2 minutes in while i was on the floor, Mikaela was bled to death. The nurse continued to stand next to my character to bleed me out, and only picked up last second for hook points. So yes, there were hooks around me, the nurse just chose to bleed me for 3.9 minutes for 'fun'.
While slugging could be a strategy to win the game, I think in the above case is unnecessary slugging. Standing over another player's character to bleed them out is a form of toxicity, trolling, griefing, or refusing to participate in normal gameplay (whatever you want to call it).
Sadly this nurse i played against repeatedly do this to many survivors. DBD devs say they don't tolerate toxicity in the community. I'd like to see if they would do anything to prevent these trolls to ruin others' experience.
What's your thoughts and experiences? Do you think unbreakable base kit could solve this problem?
How about not unbreakable basekit, how about when everybody is down the killer just wins the game? Because if i understand your problem right, your problem is that you dont die fast enoth while you dont have a chance anymore.
Or a surrender option
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@SmolBlob said:
It’s a loophole to avoid the DC penalty while achieving the exact same end result: Giving up for an utterly stupid reason (other than hatch). If you queued up, you should be forced to play out the game. Simple as that. If that upsets you, don’t play multiplayer games. The other 4 people in the lobby deserve better than someone selfish who will instantly give up the moment the match goes south. There’s a reason the majority of multiplayer games instate DC punishments. It’s to ward off problem players like that.
- Unhook attempts are removed entirely (unless Deliverance) or penalty is changed to something other than time remaining.
- Struggle skillchecks are removed entirely or changed to only count for Bloodpoints.
- Give Up option for hatch if only 1 person or less standing. AKA, everyone else downed/dead/hooked/escaped.
- AFK players are automatically kicked and given the DC penalty as if they DC’d.
"B-B-But people will just sandbag instead!11!1!" If they are too obvious about it, they risk a ban. If they play enough to just be a typical bad player, then the goal was achieved: Forcing them to play it out instead of ragequit. And the excuse is irrelevant in the first place. If someone ragequits, the game is already ruined. Them sandbagging instead of DCing doesn’t ruin a game that wouldn’t already have been ruined.
I dont think this is a good idea. If somebody lost the will to play they will do it. Than they "accedently" will run into the killer 2 more times.
I think its not or just very hardly possible to the difference between a bad player and a suicidial player.
The solution is easy, make surrender possible without a walkaround and que surrendering player with surrendering player.
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@DEMONANCE said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3304907#Comment_3304907
there a few issues with this
first it already doesn't take a long time to be sacrificed and if survivors put other objectives over saving there's a very high chance that the survivor on the hook is getting to 2nd stage or just be dead.
second it punishes soloq which is already a role suffering from lack of coordination (there are already a lot of complaints that survivors getting left on hook by their teammates)
third the killer can abuse this by just going out of range for a few seconds then coming back to defend the hook and force the 2nd stage before survivors can make a play.
fourth there are already a few big/maze like maps in the game which make getting from point A to point B take longer than it should (rpd and mother's dwelling are the biggest offenders) so this will be a problem that soloq survivors will also suffer from.
imo hook states are perfectly fine problem with killer rn is mostly maps not how long sacrifices take.
Im not sure if you understood it right.
1.) Yes it doesnt take that long, but it takes even longer when the killer is close to the hook.
2.) Than he will die anyway, 12 seconds faster or slower wont matter than.
3.) No that obv. dont work as same as it doesnt work for monstrous shrine. If the killer stays close to defend the hook, he wont get the bonus. So he can choose between defending the hook and pressure this way the suv. or he can go away what makes the suv. tick down faster but easier to rescue.
4.) Yes its strong on big map, same as camping/defending the hook and not leaving it.
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@DEMONANCE said:
use monstrous shrine
From that i picked the idea. I think it should be standard for every hook without using a extra perk. Because it rewards a playstile thats benefital for the game
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Yes thats true. You can better use CoH. There you can heal yourself at 50% speed, and its a bonus for the whole team.
I dont understand why Selfcare is on 35% and Circle of healing (where the whole team benefits) is on 50%.
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@Campingbubba said:
Sometimes i want to use low tier killers like the shape but i cant because im irridescent. So i think adding an unranked mode would be a great thing.
I dont understand why you cant do it? You wont drop out of irridescent if you loose. You can max. loose the progress to the next level (eg von irridecent 3 to irridecenr 2)
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@dgbug said:
DBD's shrine of secrets is outdated, they have the cosmetic pricing of an f2p game, most meta perks either have to be grinded for for an insane amount of time, or have to be bought, and just because the best killer is free doesn't mean you can use them without either spending an INSANE amount of time grinding, or just straight up paying, and you still can't use perks like eruption without paying.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AO98DbQr4UU
And no, Mandy. DBD isn't "not pay to win" because nurse exists. That's not how it works.
I agree on his Argument with the shrine. Its pretty unlikely to get the perks you want, and the shrine should be reworked so its not "luckbased" anymore. All Perks should allways be avaiable
I disagree on some major points
1.)
If i understand it right, you dont have to buy tier 3 perk with shards. Tier 1 is enoth and the rest you can do with bloodpoints. So its just 2000Sharts per perk you need. That you can even buy perks, is a pretty new feature so please dont try to tell that this makes it p2w just because you have to make the rest with bloodpoints.
2.) His talk about "Grinding", in dbd there is no grind. There is littlerly only the game that you play and get bloodpoints/sharts for it. If it feels like a "grind" for you, just stop playing because there is nothing else. There doesnt come a point where the "real game" begins, this "Grind" is the real game.
Its like saying "i hate this grind in diablo 3 allways doing rifts". Idk maybe just play another game.
3.) Hes taking League of legends as "good example" for a free to play game, because you can unlock everything. Later he clams that in DBD it is possible to unlock the killer and suv. but it takes way to long. In League it takes over twice as long to unlock everything.
Hes counting the DBD time with 25000 bloodsharts per game, that is wrong. Espacally if you play kiler and also if you are using addons that increase your exp.
4.) maybe i edit later
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100% agreee
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@Cybil said:
Survivors need hatch to make the game more interesting. It's objectively a good mechanic.
How is this a "good mechanic"?
You are running around, the killer is running around. Who has more luck wins. The hatch alone is just 100% luckbased and have nothing to do with skill. Even worse, it doesnt reward or punishes the suv or the killer in the before hand for playing good.
Its like a new game, but this time its only luckbased.
@KevinezMoi said:
If you really need those 4 kills every game you can just slug one of the two survivors remaining and then look for the last one. This way the last survivor won’t escape through the hatch. Unless the slugged survivor bleeds out
Thats a solution but also something nobody wants, not killer and not survivors
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Or you just remove the DC panelty again. Because standing at the gate waiting for the survivors to finish the game is fun for nobody
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The Suv can just do the last gens, and eather the killer is stopping them (they
@Maxi605 said:
Matches go too quickly, not really a need for something like this.
What is the Problem? Atm if the killer surrenders, he will just go afk until the end. Thats the alternative to Surrender as a killer.
Thats not better. Just because you dont implement a surrender option, doesnt mean that the killer will "activly" play until the end. Some might still surrender just now, they are delaying it. The suv dont even see how often this happen. Many of em think its "normal" when the killer dindt even attacked em once in the game.
And honesly some games are way to frustrating to play it. Last game for example i got Silent hill with wisper and BBQ against 4 very good survivors. Absolutly no chance (thats oke happens) so i stand in the corner so they can finish it fast. But they dont finish it. They want maximum points so they flashlight and play around me for another 10 Minutes. And i have no chance to stop or shorten this.
And this games are realy realy realy destroying the fun. Its not nice to get trolled and there is no possible way to do something against it. I mean i cannot blame the trolls that mutch too, they want the bloodpoints, so they do as mutch as they can to get them. And that means as longer the game goes on, as more bloodpoints they get. Its just very frustrating as killer
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Just on the opposite pov: it'd be so annoying to wait in queue just for a killer to end the game early because they're mad their first chase took longer than 30 seconds.
ATM the killer is just standing in the corner for 5 Minutes until you finished the game.
It's already annoying dealing with teammates who give up on hook or dc because they went down in 15 seconds at the start of the match. But at least it doesn't immediately end a match.
How you said, survivor can do that. They can choose after they get trolled "do i want to play this? 5Gen 3suv?" The killer cant do that. He is foced to stay as long as THE SURVIVOR CHOOSE. He cannot finish the game faster if the survivors are better
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That is ment as a suggestion.
Thats why i thoud about that the killer should be able to open the gates at any time, so basicly he tells that the game will end in 2 Minutes, the suv can still do (if the killer is afk) 4 gens and escape. At the moment, the survivors can strech the game as long as they want and there is nothing stopping them.
Thats why it would be cool. Also the killer could use it as a challenge, like "i bet i can kill them in 2minuets".