ItzNobody
ItzNobody
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He's a very limited killer, balanced on paper but unable to perform anything outstanding with his abilities. He can't bounce off a wall before pouncing like Wesker, he can't do pinball physics like Blight, and he can't do manifestaion grabs/hits like Onryo. Demogorgon is too loud, with very loud feetsteps and poor add ons to work with. Maybe his basekit is okay, but his add-ons definitely need a rework.
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UPDATE!
This perk has been added to the game... as Crowd Control for the Trickster. If my perk idea inspired Crowd Control, they're incredibly alike only Crowd Control is a Hex perk, then Behavior... can I get a thank you?
Please? 😅😁
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Nvm
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@BigBrainMegMain said:
You knew someone had DS. There's an indicator on the bottom.
Why couldn't you just slug her instead of hooking her? This was on YOU, you knew she was recently unhooked why did you pick her up?
Why are you pretending this perk doesn't exist? Anyone could have DS in between the 60 seconds she/he gets unhooked.
This was on YOU.
Don't blame the perk because you were sloppy.
He ain't blaming the perk cuz he's sloppy, he's blaming the perk for being too much reward with no risk at all.
He says he downed the other 3 Survivors, then picked up the Nea and got hit with an "anti-tunnel" perk. Yes he made the mistake of picking her up to put it so blunt, but what of the pay-off from downing ALL the other survivors? They just got a free pass because of one perk. That is a super power perk to me XD and what if there were more than one Nea's? Sometimes I face a crew of Blendette's and it becomes hard to tell. Just go for the injured one, but what if there are two or three Injured Survivor's?
Decisive Strike really has the flaw of being a pretender, it's not an effective ant-tunnel perk. Often I take the stun then down the Survivor anyway, unless they're pressuring a Generator nearby. What do you normally see from players with Decisive Strike after being unhooked? They block you from hitting other Survivors, they do Generators in your presence, they run over to unhook or pick up other Survivors. Doesn't sound like they're running away from being tunneled, sounds more like they are aware they cannot be touched for 60 seconds.
Slug them? Unbreakable or Borrowed Time might be in effect.
Don't go after them? Well what if they're trying to finish a Generator or rescue another Survivor in my face?
Don't pick them up? Well we are back with Unbreakable again.
Honestly, we do have one experiment to balance Decisive Strike: the Incapacitated Status Effect. Survivors cannot do Generators or escape Exit Gates as long as they suffer from the Incapacitated Status Effect, if I recall correctly. I say that would be a neat way of balancing Decisive Strike, would definitely make it more suitable for anti-tunnel. Can no longer do Generators, can no longer be used as a get-out-of-jail free card during the Endgame Collapse.
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@chieften333 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1764400#Comment_1764400
How in the fresh [BAD WORD] did you use italics?
Write something down, double click to highlight, then select the Italics symbol and ta-da!
Just like the simulation!
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We don't talk about this in the forums for that same reason 🤣you're more or less putting a target on your head by being too honest and observant. Though now that i think about it, setting up a group about this sort of topic might be an intriguing idea. Still shush! I can feel their eyes watching you already as we speak... 😨
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@chieften333 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1764377#Comment_1764377
Like the fabled console optimization.
They said they'd be doing that 2 years ago... still waiting.
This Xbox player will remember that.
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They were never walls to me, more like patched doors. When they announced breakable walls I had in mind Left for Dead when you're playing as an Infected, you could break walls within houses or buildings. These "breakable walls" are implemented for temporary infinite loops unless you break them, which feels more like a chore and gives the survivor free time to make more distance. People say it is like a dropped pallet, you're not wrong because it is just as annoying as one if we DON'T break it.
Definitely feel like breakable walls should be better implemented and need to be more creative and unique, as they are they're just a removable nuisance for killers. They should tweak and change them along the way but it isn't necessarily a priority right now. They have a long lost of things to fix first lol
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@CashelP14 said:
I wonder would Fire Up be better if it started at 35% and decreased by 7% every gen that's popped.
Now that is a damn good idea, converting a late game perk into an early game perk. It would fit better for Freddy, and possibly become a niche perk with value for all other killers. I can see this synergizing well with the likes of Ruin, Corrupt intervention, Tinkerer and Pop goes the Weasel.
This is pretty good, I actually dig this a lot!
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@Chilli_man2400 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1696241#Comment_1696241
You are absolutely right I’ll just say it again. Yes they made a terrible decision with this event you should explain every problem you have but that doesn’t give anyone the right to harass the devs and insult them there human just like us if you want them to change you need to have constructive feedback instead of just hating and flaming them.
Oh of course not, they shouldn't be harassed to a personal degree that would be rude. But they definitely deserve criticism for this year's "event". Lot of people just get done with it and the backlash from other players defending them that they give up and resort to name calling or harassment. Can't blame them for that either I guess, it's mean but not without its causes. Not to mention with their history and repeating mistake after mistake and pushing cosmetics out at a steady and reliable pace while bugs and glitches and errors and issues roam on for updates that take months in between arrival well, it delivers a not so positive insight to what may be a priority to them. There are a lot of contributing factors here and I wish it would be as easy to ask people to stop harassing the devs, but its just one of the effects that happens over time after a lot of stress/frustration I would think.
It is wrong, no doubt about that. The trouble is when someone argues why they should be allowed to do that, and when that someone is a growing number with each new update that passes. It's a real yikes for me, and I feel bad for the devs but at the same time I can see why people would behave this way.
It's like with the star wars movies when people went as far as to harass the actors for playing characters they loathed, its awful and wrong and shouldn't happen but it does and one can see why. Am I defending it? No, I'm just pointing out that their is an underlying cause behind it and that we should perhaps begin fixing this debacle by investigating the root cause first. How did we get here, why is this the reaction? Stuff like that. But yea, it's just a lot that goes on and both sides (devs and community) share the blame. In theory, both need to improve in order to fix this, in my opinion of course.
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@Justalittlepeeck said:
Let me list all disappointments people had this patch. Feel free to add more if I miss some. Of course there weren't only disappointments and the patch had a lot of positive and cool things, however let's discuss negative stuff here.
- No event currency or free way to get halloween skins
- Never Stop Slashing not having mask animations despite the fact it is possible to implement such (look at Oni f/e) and is missing a lot of details from the sketch everybody voted for (like colour of the coat)
- Spirit shadownerf
- Discordance needless nerf + dumb distance requirement to force people tier up the perk
- Discordance nerf was made as a surprise and wasn't listed in PTB patchnotes, so people didn't have an opportunity to give any feedback on its changes.
- Console framerate issues
- Killer's event addon is event only, but survivor's ones could be used even after event expires.
- Macmillan maps generation is bugged.
- Groaning storehouse borderline OP window
- Shelter woods are still shelter woods
- Thanatophobia phobia nerfed more than buffed
- We are going to live forever having less amount of ways to earn tokens (Head On saves don't give tokens f/e)
- Pyramidhead nerf that horribly crippled him and his camera
- Killer having weird models and animations when spawning in the trial
I get the feel that last one was like an unexpected bug the developers saw at the last minute. The fact that they mentioned it in the patch gives me the impression that they threw their hands up and said "F* it! Just push the patch through, we'll get to that next week." Which just makes me laugh out of entertainment haha!
Some personal thoughts, the Pyramid Head nerf isn't that bad. Annoying yes, what's funny is that I feel the changes weren't enough. You can still trick survivors to avoid committing to Rites of Judgement to get that free hit in, or just use the power to knock em down a health state. Still don't understand the reasoning for the nerf, because his power is effective? Just feels like an excuse to nerf more good killers and ignore the ones in need of a buff.
Console frame rates are definitely kicking in. I own an xbox one x, if i get the series x and still this game isn't 60 frames or well optimized then behavior has a big problem.
I would also like to add that "breakable walls" are utilized as an excuse to provide infinite loops to survivors. Oh gees, without bamboozle I have to vault the window or turn left and break this wall, either option giving them enough time/distance regardless so it's a win/win for them. These aren't breakable walls, they're duct tape on doorways. Y'all ever played Left For Dead online? As the infected, you can break walls in buildings and houses, my memory is a bit fuzzy cuz its been a while but in that game you can break actual walls. A good example of how that could be implemented would be in the Ironworks map, the infinite vault has a hole in the wall next to it, which reduces its efficiency while in a chase for Survivors. How about implementing that for breakable walls? Give it a glowing cracked symbol to show it can be broken, make it a bit more subtle so that Survivors are caught by surprise, and then switch them around the way pallets are switched around in each play.
I don't know, they just feel disappointing to me. Breakable walls shouldn't feel like you have to break this else face the infinite loops, it should feel like something terrifying for the Survivors and satisfying for the Killer. Make the walls open new paths in maps, not the old doorways that we had before. Make the material of the wall be different than wood, like bricks for example and give it the sound of crumbling rocks when broken. Just be creative, I felt like this idea was fun but the execution was a half measure to the extreme.
The rest of your list I agree with, this game has a lot of issues and hreed is slowly rising to the top with each update. Better skins? Ten dollars! New even? Tin dollahs! New map?! TEHN DAWLAWS!! You get the idea lol. Just bites that EVERYTIME someone asks for improvement, they get so much backlash from the community itself. If we can't agree with anything, then we have ourselves to blame for this mess.
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@Chilli_man2400 said:
Did everyone just forget that the devs are humans and they need to pay taxes and support there family’s I find it so funny how everyone’s complaining about how there greedy and don’t care about us. But I’m telling the truth yes the rift is a cashgrab and the event sucks it’s not good as 2018 but in the end there running a business they need to make money to pay bills and support everything. You guys are a joke.
Then I would suggest they run that business well and supply their customers with the demands they seek, else both parties will be dissatisfied. The difference is, the customers can play another game. The developers can't just drop dbd without repercussion.
Yes the developers are human, I am glad you understand that. Now try to empathize with the community that have followed this game since 2016, the numerous bugs they delayed to fix until years later (Pallet Vacuum), the bugs they create by fixing things that aren't broken (Hatchet hitbox and Vault speeds were altered before having their changes reverted), and now we are given an add-on for two weeks, and costumes that we can no longer earn.
If the response to why are the developers committing questionable changes is to go easy on them, they are human, or you don't need to stay just leave the game will survive without you, well that's just not handling a good business is it?
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Will it at least be optimized for 60 frames instead of 30?
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So now that we have seen the changes for The Executioner, do you feel like similar changes can be made for the Deathslinger or is he fine the way he is?
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So with the PTB live for a while we have our numbers.
The Executioner has reduced speed of 4.4m/s when exiting Rites of Judgement as well as having a 1 second cooldown before being able to attack. However, his Punishment of the Damned special attack has been reduced from 2.75 seconds to 2.25 seconds.
Do you guys feel like this change is good enough, or can more be improved upon for release?
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Most likely they are complacent about it.
The grind is there because if you do find yourself frustrated, you could purchase your progress through-oh wait. They don't have microtransactions for leveling up, they have it for cosmetics.
Well in that case, we could assume where there priority lies. Don't be upset, here buy some of our $10 outfits 😁
Don't mean to sound rude, but I think the grind is not something they have in mind in terms of what to improve or change in the current future.
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@BioX said:
sigh, honestly the forum users here pain me, why has nobody of you seemingly got the slightest clue on how a discussion works and constandly gets stuck in some "us vs them" mindset.
Shall we do an update that survivors can only walk and not use perks anymore and always leave scratchmarks? no ofcourse not, killers would not want that either because 1. they know nobody would play survivor anymore and 2. what would you be even doing as killer? it would be about as exciting as watching paint dry.
Shall we do an update that killers walk at 50% survivor speed and cant lunge anymore and non will have powers? no right? same thing, what survivor would want that, what point would there be in playing.
We play both sides and if you dont you have zero right of speaking.
But apart from all of that, stop constandly bringing up irrelevant "otherside" crap in a discussion about 1 thing.
If we are talking pop, we are talking pop and THAT IS IT damn it.
"lets talk about mori's" "wAit wuT aboUT KeYz"
"ok lets talk keys instead" "wAIt wUt ABout MoRiz"
"sigh lets talk pop" "wait what about DS?"
"lets talk NoeD then" "wait, what about DS"
"fine fine, lets talk DS" "wait what about camping?!?!"
its just completely pathetic.
Though I understand your frustration and apologize for being late to the conversation, isn't your reasoning also the response you seek to your question?
"We play both sides and if you don't you have zero right of speaking."
Well with that in mind, why does it bother you that people suggest if one Killer tool gets nerfed, then a Survivor tool should be given similar judgment as well?
"Let's talk pop." "Wait what about DS?"
"Let's talk mori's." "Wait what about keys?"
I don't think those suggestions are irrelevant, a Killer's Mori can be a shortcut to a victory just as well as a Survivor's key. Furthermore, I would be willing to bet that if say Sloppy Butcher were to receive a nerf, people would rightfully ask well what about Desperate Measures?
These do not sound like irrelevant topics to evade or change the subject at hand, this sounds like looking at the game from both sides. Killers and Survivors each have tools that counter the other, so logically if one gets nerfed then we would ask well why this change here but not the accomplice or counter over there?
It would be like removing scissors from rock paper scissors, or in this case nerfing it. I believe it is right to ask, specifically due to Almo's reasoning, that if Pop Goes the Weasel is loosing its availability by 15 seconds because it granted too much value from its 60 second timer, then why not address the other Survivor perk that also produces a similar effect for 60 seconds?
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Or better yet give us a reward like "Hey, a stranger gave you props! Have 100 iridescent shards!"
But you can only receive props by players who you aren't in a survive with friends lobby with, so that the reward system doesn't become abused or exploited. Would be neat.
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Curious, I've been wondering about which killer to make a post about. The topic would be my thoughts and suggestions on her current state as well as how to improve her.
Amy ideas/suggestions you guys would like to contribute?
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@LordVoidron said:
Easiest Slinger counter is don't move in strait lines or run up to the killers feeding their aiming down and they can't spear you (you will just eat m1 instead)
Coulda sworn I mentioned that in the bit for Survivors on how to handle him... huh, guess it slipped my mind. You're right that is a good way to juke the shot, but I'd advise you do this if you have high sensitivity on movement or as a last fail-safe effort to avoid getting speared.
Same way to counter a Huntress Hatchet or a Demogorgon's Shred, no?
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@Thedogofdeath said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1655767#Comment_1655767
Well on the ptb he can't attack and moves slower for 1 seconds after leaving his power but his Potd attack was reduced by .5 seconds (down to 2.25 sec from 2.75 sec). But right now PH can attack instantly out of his power while hes charging it which Im pretty sure that's a bug. Even if they fix that bug he will still have strong zoning as many people have found the 1 second of him not being able to attack doesn't do much and the reduced cool down for Potd is hardly anything and the cool down wasn't the reason nobody went for ranged hits
What it should be is 2-3 seconds of not attacking but his Potd should be given more buffs and a greater cool down reduction
I agree with you on his Punishment of the Damned, it is silly not to use it when Survivors are locked in an animation as well, isn't that the perfect time to use your power?
Reducing the cooldown helps, but I figured it would be minimal so the .5 second reduction is no surprise. Why not reduce it to a clean 2 seconds instead of 2.25?
Even then it won't be enough, I would say increase his control when using Rites of Judgement so that the attack isn't so predictable. Increase the speed of the animation so that it reduces the slight window a Survivor has to dodge it, and increase the range that he gets from his add-ons that affect it.
As of now his green add-on increases his range of attack by 1.5 meters totalling to 13.5 meters when added to his default 12 meter range. Increase the add on range to 4 meters, so he gets a 16 meter range instead with an add-on plus the lower cooldown. Or keep the cooldown and increase how fast his attack hits, I feel like these would be good steps in increasing the use for Punishment of the Damned overall.
As I said in my post, I do appreciate the developers for giving him something of a buff to make up for an increased cooldown, but in this case I don't think it is enough if you want players to use Punishment of the Damned more often.
But maybe I am being biased and giving him too much of a buff, what do you think?
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So I wonder how is The Executioner now that the PtB is live, did the change hurt him or can he manage to be strong still?
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Gotta say on the positive side here, this psot has definitely exceeded my expectations as to whether it would get noticed or not haha, far out! 😁
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@CaulDrohn said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1653501#Comment_1653501
Huntress cannot throw a hatchet instantly, and her winding up can be heard and reacted to. She also cannot hit imidiately after putting her hatchet down. If you get hit during a vault, it's usually bc you messed up and/or the huntress outplayed you. The chases feel much more engaging, because there are situations were you have the adventage (in high loops), and situations where the huntress has (open field). It feels like an even playing field.
That's not so much the case against DS, bc his insta-aim, insta-shoot and no cooldown on canceling his power skew the playing field hard into his favor. It's not so much about what you can do to prevent being hit anymore, but whether the DS hits his shoots or not. You are at the "mercy" of the DS slingers skill, which can make the chases either unsatisfying (if you escape DS just bc he is bad and does not hit his shots) or frustrating (bc the DS hits every shot with little you can do about it).
Of course there are exceptions, unfun chases against a huntress and fun chases against DS, but on average I feel it's no stretch to say that being chased by a huntress is preferred by many to being chased by a DS, just because the chases are much more enjoyable with the former one.
Well you make a fair point with the Huntress wind up and cooldown, she has add-ons to reduce that but not to the extent of Deathslinger so you are correct. I suppose it makes sense, she has long range and is a threat from all angles so the Deathslinger should have the edge with his limited range of 14 meters.
I'm not opposed to adding a cooldown to The Deathslinger, but I do feel it is not needed. Playing to your home field advantages and utilizing the map environment and obstacles is a great way of delaying his shot, always breaking line of sight, and always keeping a pallet between each other. It is similar to how you face off versus a Nurse and a Huntress, you want to play stealthily from a Nurse because in the chase there is no obstacle she can't overcome (dead zones I would not count, since that's just a bug or glitch in the system). You want to pre-drop pallets on a Huntress to keep a layer of comfortable distance between you two, so that she either breaks the pallet thus providing a window of escape furthering the chase, or to test her aim and thus crouch against any obstacles like junk or broken cars to remain safe.
Unlike the Huntress, the Deathslinger is no longer fatal upon his second shot unless he closes the gap. Unlike the Nurse, the Deathslinger can succumb to obstacles like most killers. I agree that his quickshot skills are unmatched and leave no reaction time, but I see it as an advantage he has to have. If he did not capitalize on his shot, then what does he capitalize on? If zoning a Survivor is unfun and so the Deathslinger should not do that, then what should he do?
His limited mobility, low range and weak generator protection capabilities paint the image that this is a chase heavy killer, so when discussions arise for the need to weaken his chase potential, we must proceed with the highest amount of caution not to break this killers stronghold and drop him from manageable to weak.
Thank you for helping me understand the difference in the chase between Huntress and Deathslinger, I hope in return I was able to shed some light on why I do not oppose changing his quickshot, but why I believe everyone should think carefully on what they ask for and perhaps analyze the Deathslinger a second time just in case.
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@LuffyBlack said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1650327#Comment_1650327
You were very polite, gave your opinion, and didn't act in bad faith. I have no idea why them and that other person behaved the way they did. You didn't even insult anyone.
Thank you. I actually have a bit of a temper now and then, but I do my best to maintain a polite and friendly atmosphere. I appreciate the kind words, but azame did agree with me in his reply afterwards.
We have a lot of negative people around the forums, so my idea is to keep a patient environment to control that. Not to challenge them or be rid of them, just to not react in a similar angry manner and show them to be more friendly. You know, the golden rule of treat others the way you would like to be treated.
Thank you again for the kind compliment 🙂
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@KIKI_ said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1634626#Comment_1634626
Your post was great. Too bad some people didn't take the time to properly read it!
I think the main problem with this killer (along with some others) is that most people fail to see this game as an asymmetrical game. And that's pretty much it. They ask for counterplay on 1v1, failing to see that their true power should lie on beating the killer as a team.That's one of the strongest problems this community has in my opinion.
The killer is supposed to be the power role, you should always be at a disadvantage when in a 1v1 situation. Going down in a chase, is not losing the game. You are supposed to get caught, the key lies on how much time did you manage to buy to your team. Even dying don't mean playing poorly in this game, but people fail to see it that way and therefore - deathslinger don't have counterplay. Truth is deathslinger is quite weak
Very true, i'm kind of stumped that people have this reaction regarding the Deathslinger because quite frankly, we have a better and more lethal ranged killer when compared to this hunter, our Huntress. And well, the problems people point out with him can be replicated with her as well. Not identical but very similar to a degree where I have to ask, well if he is such an issue to face why have we not heard of similar arguments when comparing this killer to the Huntress?
Not saying the Huntress should be nerfed as well, she's fine as is though could use a tune up with her aim precision and hatchet hitbox haha. Small things though, I can work with what we have and so can a majority of Huntress players. Maybe comparing the Deathslinger and the Huntress isn't a good argument, perhaps I am overlooking something, but I can't help but make that comparison in my head.
Overall, Deathslinger is okay but it takes a bit of work using his power just to land a basic attack unlike the Cannibal or the Shape, and his chase power though good is not enough to manage his major weakness in mobility and generator defense without supporting his kit with perks like Save The Best For Last. Definitely mid tier, but not top tier in my opinion.
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@LuffyBlack said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/193347/deathslinger-has-no-counterplay
I like that you provided actual counterplays. This thread needs to be pinned.
Mighty appreciative of that!
Unfortunately the main argument I was defending for him, that being his ability to zone the Survivors, is now mute since the Developers are attempting to remove that similar ability with The Executioner. So I fear that this essay of mine was for nothing, darn.
Ah well, adapting is the way of life after all. Let me know of any other controversies surrounding Killers in this game and I'll be sure to provide a detailed analysis and guide for it! I quite like how this one came out and well, if it helped influence or provide a new perspective for some then it got the job done! 😁
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@CaulDrohn said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1651297#Comment_1651297
He's about mid tier, but not one of the worst. He is not as easy to play as other killers, you gotta make good decisions with his portals and when to use shred. Yes the portals give him mobility, but placing portals is time comsuming and can be detrimental if you place one at the wrong time. DS is only deadlier than Demo in a chase bc. he can insta-scope/insta-shoot and the shots are too fast to react; Demo's shred cannot be be activated instantly, and a survivor can dodge it. That makes for way more enjoyable chases, and a competent Demo player will still be able to down you fast.
Ex-Demo main here 😄
Demogorgon is okay, i would say he is the definition of meh. The perfect example of mid-tier. Which is okay I guess, but I wish there was room to make him play as a top tier killer with great use of his kit. Obviously you can play him really well, honestly I can't go into detail without making a big ass essay myself, so i'll have to leave it at that. Might make a future post for the Demogorgon later to explain what add-ons need improvement or if its base kit should change.
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Short.
Simple.
Superb 👌
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@[Deleted User] said:
I'm really baffled by people who think POTD is only useful on animation locks. If you're not hitting people on normal loops and jungle gyms you just didn't play him enough. I play him almost everyday and I never go for the cheap bait tactic, it's just boring and not rewarding enough.
"But he makes a visual and sound notification when he is going to use it" so does Huntress, Demogorgon, Doctor, Nurse etc. Are their powers bad and predictable? Not every killer must be Spirit you know.
True, and I feel that this change well promote a more flexible usage of POTD in a way, but I also fear that it may not do enough. If I had the choice I would leave Executioner as is, however I would be foolish to turn a blind eye to the complaints people have with him. I appreciate that the developers are not only addressing this but also providing a means to keep his power strong so to speak. I just wonder if the cooldown reduction would be enough 😕
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@EuphoricBliss35 said:
PH main here. I don’t know how many of these threads need to exist. Do a search before posting.
changes are needed and welcomed, what I’ve been asking for (mostly, they didn’t touch cages but that’s ok for now) since his release for better balance and counter play
I'm aware of the threads but none of them are mine. I would like to contribute and add my own thoughts and ideas, my own voice to be heard, rather than to stay silent and move along. Basically, I'm passionate about this change and I would like to assume that so are the others. I'm sorry if this post was to your distaste though, my intention was not for that.
Changes are welcomed, but most be carefully monitored. That is part of my discussion here. Was never against the change, just voicing a concern that the con outweighs the pro.
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@azame said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/194918/im-worried-for-the-executioner
So in other words you are worried because he isnt going to be able to put you in the lose/lose situation. Nice try g
I'm worried because his power may lack the reward it offers for the risk it takes. I'm not opposed to his change, I am addressing that the buff to make up for it may not be enough.
This isn't me being biased, I wrote this post thinking of how this change affects both the killer and survivor.
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@ClickyClicky said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1640726#Comment_1640726
Lol if you try to shut down a strong window as Trapper thats the first place survivors are gonna look for a trap.
From my experience as Trapper, you want to place traps in routes where loops will be but not precisely where loops are. Example, dont trap a window, trap the corner they hug while running around the window loop 👍
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@Raptorrotas said:
Whenever I see these no xounterplqy threads, I remember "Souls at astake" and its permanent and free deadhard combine with the "killer is attacking"-jingle warning sound.
Thats what people want against DS, nevermind the huge amount of time wasted with reeling in survivors.
Yea my bad if ya getting tired of these threads 😅 but I hope it was entertaining somewhat. I totally get some people feelin annoyed by all this.
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@NekoGamerX said:
they to many of these threads.
Sorry about that, hope this one was at least entertaining 😅😁
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@CaulDrohn said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1636034#Comment_1636034
Your point about the 9 meters is actually the glaring issue for me against DS. Nearly every DS will bring monitor on top of his totally messed up TR. So he can sneak up to you this close and sometimes even spear you out of nowherer before you heard anything. I just feel it shouldn't be possible to hit a ranged attack out of the blue and still be so close. Huntress has her lullaby. Mikey can be heard breathing when close, GF' clothes can be heard. Pig has to unsheash or roar, Wraith has to ring his bell (or at least his uncloaking can be heard when near enough). But for DS with Monitor, nothing. You can be speared instantly without preparation. I think he would need at least some audio cue that he starts aiming, that would give survviors are short timeframe to react.
Unless I aim mistaken, he does have an audio cue when he is aiming and you are in his cross hair. It's very subtle though, and I believe it was there when he was first introduced. Sounded like a quick ring of a bell, but it is hard to hear cuz of his music.
The short terror radius is one of his stronger advantages, it can help to keep an eye out as a Survivor and be on the lookout to help avoid being ambushed by him. It's not a complete counter but besides Spine Chill it's the best you can do. That and try to keep yourself close to pallets or large obstacles to take cover from should he get the drop on you.
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@Kind_Lemon said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/193347/deathslinger-has-no-counterplay
it's not a question of "fair". It's a question of "fun" and if the survivors in a Deathslinger (DS) match can be anything more than bots/moving targets.
A lot of survivor fun comes from being reactionary, and many killers enjoy pushing a survivor to react in a certain way to get a hit. With DS, survivors can't be reactionary (the only thing that matters are the physical objects in the map and if the DS misses or not), and that sucks a whole load of fun right out of the game for a majority of more skilled players.
I can see that, and I am actually very very thankful you said that. You gave me a new perspective that I didn't think about, thank you for that.
If I may contribute to your point, I felt like the fun with playing against Killers like The Spirit, The Nurse, and The Deathslinger for example is that they are powerful in the chase. I understand what you mean, it is a lot of fun being in a chase and managing your ground, but part of the fun for me against these other killers is that I can't face them head on like i can with Legion or Wraith. No, you need to hide and keep your distance. So for me, it's fun because it brings me back to horror on its ground roots, facing a threat you cannot best. So for a moment, the game becomes Outlast and hiding becomes the better option. Hiding at a corner or inside a Locker and seeing them walk by and leave, it's spine tingling and very satisfying to evade those encounters.
And I think not a lot of people like that, hence why they dislike playing against Deathslinger for example. I hope I helped explain my perspective back to ya, but serious credit for explaining yourself incredibly well 🙂
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@FFirebrandd said:
To the OP. Deathslinger being Tall is both a Pro and a Con. Its a con for the reason you said it was. It is a pro because on certain short loops, the Deathslinger can spear you over the loop, wrap around the edge of the loop and bayonette your face before his chain breaks.
Also whenever I see people say Deathslinger has no counterplay... I just have to wonder... have you played as him ever? Here's a big hint... the spear by itself cannot down you. He needs to reel you in and stab you for that to happen. If he's able to do that, that means you got outplayed and shot in a spot without something for you to get yourself stuck on. If you do manage to get stuck on something during the reel and you are already injured... congrats you just wasted a TON of his very precious time. Your goal isn't to not get shot... because you are going to get shot, its to not get stabbed after the shot.
Also I'd just like to say... it is possible to outplay getting speared through a window. I'm pretty sure it isn't easy, but I've had it happen to me a few times where I reel someone to a window, swing, and then don't hit them. Usually that happens when the Survivor is able to be all the way to one side of the window then quickly rotate to the other right as or right before I swing.
Yer right, it is a pro in that manner as well. Best example would be the pallet loops in Blood Lodge, Slinger can snip right over them and best ye can do is zig zag on your movements to throw his aim off. I didn't list that as a pro but I'm aware of it, could fit it under the pro of his bullet having a small hitbox.
Deathslinger is good at a lot of things once he is up close, I just don't see why so many say he got no counter to him. If the Killer got a weakness, that's a counter.
Hide from the Nurse. Keep obstacles between you the Cannibal, use windows versus Hillbilly, and pre-drop pallets versus Huntress.
Then people say ya can't do nothing against his shot when hes 9 meters close. Why is that a problem? If I am a killer and I am that close to you, I sure hope i'd be getting a reward for that. And why is this an exclusive issue for Deathslinger when the Huntress can land hard to dodge shots up close as well? Her Hatched hitbox is larger too, so I would probably say she got a bigger advantage within 9 meters then our cowboy here.
I just hope people start to open up to these ideas and explore em a bit. Closing yourself off from suggestions hinders your ability to learn and progress, and that bites. Sure glad to know you caught me slipping on that pro, thanks for the reminder sir.
Here, have a cookie! 🍪
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@CaulDrohn said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1634879#Comment_1634879
You missed the point as well. It has nothing to do with stomping a team. It was claimed that DS has counterplay, So as to proove this, the one that claimed it should play against a real good killer (zubat) and show us his counterplay. Just a chase in custom games would be enough for demonstration. Nothing more.
And don't know how this would turn out, but I guess it would be a glaring defeat for the claimer. Not just bc. killers are meant to be stronger in 1on1, but because DS has some uncounterable tools like aim spamming / free zoning, which removes any real counterplay, so it boils down to whether DS hits his shot or not.
What would be considered a victory in that scenario for the Survivor?
People forget when you in a chase, you try to delay them from getting to ya as long as you can. I would like to escape the Killer, but that's not my decision to make it is theirs. If the Killer wants me dead, I'll be dead, but ye bet I will do my darnest to make him earn this here kill!
I'd be laughing if the match starts and the Survivor finds the hatch and leaves asap as the winner 😂 that would be fun.
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@ZaKzan said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1634860#Comment_1634860
That challenge is the stupidest thing ever and there's a good reason no one has accepted his challenge. Survivors, by design, aren't supposed to 1v1 killers. What does that even mean anyway? Survivors are meant to waste the time of the killer, not beat the killer.
We can assemble a survivor team made up of survivors that are comparable to the skill level of zubat and he will get dominated every single game if he plays a bad killer like deathslinger. The fact that people think that a survivor must be able to outrun or beat a killer on a cat and mouse game where there's 4 survivors and 1 killer is the single greatest problem this game has in term of balance. This is a PvP game, but it's also a team game, from the survivor perspective. It's also odd that in talking about balance, Scott uses the context of one of the best killer players in the game vs an average survivor group because good survivor groups are rare and I guess survivors go up against top tier killers every game.
👏👏👏
Someone grab Behavior and tell em to hire this man here!
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@MrLimonka said:
There is a counter against deathslinger - you can pre-drop pallets. He only has 110% speed, so he has much smaller pressure... Sure, he can zone pretty well and is good in chases, but that's why he's slower than other killers.
If you pre-drop a pallet, he can only injure you, but not down you.
Now compare this to PH. Not only he has 115% speed, he also doesn't care about pre dropping pallets. You don't drop it? He can instantly M1 then. You drop it? He just uses his power to down you over it. It is PH who has no counterplay.
Edit: Whoops, didn't read the whole post. Still, my point stands
Let me tell you @MrLimonka I identify as a Pyramid Head Main and I don't take kindly when people be mentioning how powerful he is cuz I don't want Phineas to be killed like they did to Ferb, ya got that??
Kidding, i'm kidding 😆
PH is definitely tough to handle, he does a lot of mindgames that are in his favor same with Spirit. You can't tell if he's dragging his dic-i mean sword for show or if he's prepped to punish ya as soon as you drop that pallet. He's a 60/40 mindgame, try to play chicken with him and keep to wide areas so his Punishment of the Damned sturggles to land. I suppose just like in Silent Hill, the best counter to Pyramid Head is keeping your distance from him or else...
Also thank ya kindly for giving my post a read. Ya get a cookie! 🍪
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@Tricks said:
Snapshot slinger has no counter-play. The drawback is you have to be good at snapshotting.
Thank you kindly, people ain't good at quick snip asap that stuff takes practice. Just like learning to play against a Deathslinger takes practice, thanks a bunch the quick but to the point reply 😁
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@Lufanati said:
if Deathslinger did have counterplay within the chase, he'd just be dogshit. That's just kinda the way of the game. He's slow, has no secondary power or any sort of utility.
He's not the only killer with little to no counterplay within the chase anyways. A good nurse, a good spirit, a good blight, even a good doctor using the range add-ons, they'll all down you pretty much no matter what you do, and there powers have other uses to boot.
If deathslinger's chase was nerfed, he'd need substantial buffs in other areas to avoid falling to the bottom of the tier list.
Could not have said it better me-self! Congrats @Lufanati, ye getting promoted to Deputy!
On a serious note, I agree completely. If his chase potential is too much, then you would need to nerf that but compensate with a great buff elsewhere to keep his momentum. As he is, I think he's strong enough. If you down the Survivors quick enough, it makes up for his lack of map control.
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@Leachy_Jr said:
All the arguments about deathslinger boils down to whether you think a 50/50 is counterplay or not. I think survivors should actually have a chance to be downed so I'm fine with the 50/50.
Some people will say a good deathslinger wont miss but I can tell you from a slinger main standpoint that it is total BS and there is no situation where a slinger can hit EVERY shot.
Preach brother! I think he's fairly balanced, lot of ways to counter or delay the slinger.
I don't get the argument about being unable to dodge him when he is close though. Why does the Huntress not get the same reaction? She can snipe you from far and up close without having to reel you in.
So what makes him more of a problem, is it his small terror radius? Is it cuz his 18 meter bullet shoots faster than the infinite range Hatchet? Really I believe it is cuz a lot of people don't like playing against Deathslinger, and that's perfectly fine. Just, don't be saying he got no counterplay, the man isn't the strongest killer and I'd hate to see him nerfed cuz of this.
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Thank you kindly, blessed stranger, for dropping some wisdom upon our sacred land!
I don't watch Scotty but if what you say is true then that helps a bunch with clarifying things here.
I ain't trying to win a discussion with my post, I'm just trying to shed some light on the Deathslinger and giving ideas for ways to counter him. Obviously if you can use his strengths really well and cover his weaknesses with perks then yea, dude be shootin up a storm and clappin all the cheeks of the wild west! But isn't that any killer if you play em right? Just some killers are more lethal than others, that's all.
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Just about, I'd agree with ya there. I find it fun going against him but i understand if others don't. I wouldn't say disliking a killer automatically means they are overpowered, and a lot of people forget that. Thanks for understanding, bub.
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@BioX said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/1634875#Comment_1634875
@SloppyKnockout as well
right the points is that we should balance killers around the top 1% of players out there.....yep that makes sense.
I was ready to leave a strong reply to Scott's video because in general I tend to not agree with him at all but at the end he made a conclusion that was my entire point: "ultimately this is a nothing burger, im talking about nothing here because very few people play at that skill level".
EXACTLY, so many seem to completely forget the human argument, the fact that you want to push zubat to prove a point rather then doing it yourself shows the exact non-problem this is.
Most deathslingers miss shots and you can fake loop a jungle gym and just keep running, multiple circles around a map while gens get done with this slow killer on your tail, apart from some maps (Midwich) deathslinger is rarely ever a real problem.
This is also the entire reason why Hag is not that much of an issue, not enough play her well enough that she becomes an issue.
@BioX Is there a way for me to pin this comment all the way to the top?
A lot of people forget that a lot of the devoted dead by daylight streamers are on a whole different league, or the top 1% of Top Tier skill/experience. So when Zubat claps cheeks at a fast pace with Deathslinger, or Tru3Ta1ent feels that the Clown is S tier, well they have the advantage for being just really damn good at the game. And the majority of the player base are casual players, so of course the game should be balanced around the casuals.
I could continue but I'd rather keep this response short. You get my vote for being my favorite comment so far!
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Generator speed is not counterplay, I agree. Repairing Generators is basically holding down a button for so-so seconds, repeat for five Generators total and done. I would call that abusing the game's objective haha 😆
I appreciate your response but your counterargument is a bit odd. Deathslinger not being fun to play against is subjective, we each have our tastes and we all have that one Killer we despise going against.
" If the killer is within about 9m and they are a decent shot, you literally cannot do a thing except avoid that situation in the first place, which is unreasonable."
I would say this is entirely reasonable. Killers are meant to be a threat after all, and you will find plenty of Killers who become lethal within 9 meters of proximity to you. Cannibal, Hillbilly, and Oni each have a power which can put you into the dying state instantly. Ghostface and The Shape could stalk and expose you, mimicking the same result. The Huntress who is our original ranged killer is given what one would call a free hit with her hatchet if she were that close to you.
Does this mean we have too many killers that are unfun to play against? That is subjective and I would argue that is not the case.
Does this mean more killers have no counter at such a close range? Yes and no, you can still fight back through different methods. Lockers and Pallets guarentee temporary safety from chainsaws, in fact a pallet is able to counter all of the killers I listed above to a degree. The Huntress can snipe you over the dropped pallet, and the Chainsaw Bros. and Oni could break the Pallet with their power as well. This does not mean the pallet is useless, but it stalls for time and gives you quick relief.
"Dodge behind a tree? I'm gonna shoot you. Drop a pallet? I'm gonna break it and shoot you, or play the tile and shoot you. Hold W? Bang."
All of that is correct to a degree, but you may be ignoring the point of what it means to counter a killer. If you are in a chase, the object is to delay the Killer from successfully downing you for as long as you can. Yes, we would like to escape from the Killer but that is out of our control, if the Killer wants you dead then you will die. This is why tunneling is frowned upon.
Dodging a tree won't guarantee your safety from a Deathslinger, but if you find yourself distant from pallets then yes, utilize them as best as you can. Even if there is a 1% chance of evading that shot, better to take it then to run out in the open. If I drop a pallet and you decide to break it, yes you might take the shot and down me. But by breaking the pallet, you have given me time and distance to search for another pallet or obstacle. I could run left and right in vain hoping you would miss the shot similar to how we counter a Huntress' Hatchet, and if it works then great. If it doesn't, it was worth the effort.
Countering a Killer does not mean escaping them, it means buying your allies time to finish repairing Generators. There are plenty of ways to counter any Killer by studying their strengths and weaknesses. I listed them above which you did not mention, so I assume those are not weaknesses for you yes? If you are a great Deathslinger, than perhaps you are just good at capitalizing on his strengths and so you view him as a more powerful killer then other players would.
There are plenty of ways to counter a Deathslinger. Abuse his slow speed to buy yourself time when he breaks a Generator or Pallet, take cover by any means while maintaining distance from him, be careful if you find yourself under his aim. Although I believe Generator speed is not a counterplay as every Killer can fall victim to this, I will argue and say Deathslinger has more trouble than most Killers when it comes to protecting his Generators due to his slow speed.
I hope I was able to help dissect my perspective and grant you a different view, thank you for the reply 🙂
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The nerve of some people! 😂 The guy has a point however, but I'd rather explain as much as I can on an essay than to be quick and leave out so much on an advertisement post.
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You could say steal, I would say more along the lines of inspired haha. I should remind you this is a fan made make believe chapter, it would be amazing if we could get a Resident Evil chapter!