woundcowboy
woundcowboy
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No chance if the survivors are rushing gens.
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@LordGlint said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3655159#Comment_3655159
Since I can't access the PTB... Is the dash useful OUTSIDE loops? If I crouch and ambush straight, would it cover more distance than just holding W for an M1?
You definitely get more distance than you used to. Not sure if it’s worth doing the dash over standing up tho.
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@ChuckingWong said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3655296#Comment_3655296
Well you probably aren't that good at it seeing as you admitted to playing the trap/tunnel play style. You are used to checking auras on the station and not so much chasing.
Keep practicing. If you can provide footage, that helps as well.
Yea man, I’m sure the best pig players can go through pallets. It isn’t hard to use. My point is that survivors can deny it at most loops by using their eyes and predropping. It isn’t worth her power being nerfed.
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@ChuckingWong said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3655129#Comment_3655129
I am really starting to doubt that you have 5k hours on this game. Im really not sure where you are going with this. You dont need to know where things are or "keep track of" at a certain point in both survivor play and killer play. 5k hours is beyond that point, you should have a good feel of where everything is, especially on killer where you dont have other people that could effect that knowledge (did my team throw that pallet?).
If you dont want to actually test the changes on the PTB you are free to your opinion on the changes. But you might want to actually test things out before forming an opinion. Her chase and anti-loop is now pretty strong on the PTB.
Maybe actually try her out and see what you think. Rather than what you are currently doing.
Just tried it, with addons to help boost it. Still bad, and only works at short loops, which M1 killers can mindgame without dash. At a loop with any kind of wall, you’re not getting a hit. Worthless change.
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@ChuckingWong said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3655075#Comment_3655075
Well luckily you can still do it, you just dont get an aura showing you where the stations are. If you have 5k hours, surely you know how to identify where notables on the maps are without needing an aura to tell you.
Have you played PTB pig currently? Or are you just repeating what everyone says about pig who have also not tested any of the changes out?
Right, because adding yet another thing that killer has to keep track of is a good move. Survivors are spoon fed information with the hud. I’m not wasting time with her on ptb, especially when killer q takes years. I know how the game works and don’t need to see it.
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@Rulebreaker said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3655091#Comment_3655091
So that answer is no
Yes or no, was pig nerfed?
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@Rulebreaker said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3655075#Comment_3655075
So then the question is: can you be successful without it?
I’ll just play a killer that has actual antiloop. Contrary to popular belief, the best players don’t handicap themselves. They use the strongest stuff in the game. If you want to use that logic, then survivors shouldn’t be allowed to stack instaheals or BNPs, or all run adrenaline etc… It’s hard to understand how you think that way only when it applies to killer. Apparently it’s fine for survivors to use strong tactics, but not the other way around
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@ChuckingWong said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3655024#Comment_3655024
I mean if you have 5k hours and think the only way to play pig is to tunnel people and camp the trap removal stations that's fine.
I think that highlights an issue in your play more than the killer supposed strength though.
I don’t see how it’s an issue when I’m successful with it. Maybe the issue is that you and other people in this thread want killers to be played in a specific way, that you approve of. Luckily, I don’t play by the survivor rule book.
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@Reinami said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3654992#Comment_3654992
Ugh. So you think we should balance around average level players then?
Alright well, where are my MASSIVE, and i mean MASSIVE, nurse buffs. Because they nerf her like every 6 months, but her kill rate still is one of the lowest in the game. They should bring back omega blink nurse then, that ought to bring her kill rate more in line with some of the strongest killers in the game, like pig...
Shhh….that’s a double standard that’s just accepted in this community. They want killer balanced around high level play, and survivor balanced around casuals. Totally makes sense right?
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@versacefeng said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3654750#Comment_3654750
The majority of pallets now can be mindgamed by lunging or just using some of your brain. Please give me a break.
No, you’re actually just wrong
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@ChuckingWong said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3654942#Comment_3654942
1. not a bad killer
Is she bad because she sucks? And sucks because shes terrible? And terrible because some streamer said it and now you take it out of context thinking that applies to you?
2. a nerf to a low input high reward playstyle. But a buff to her chase/ambush
I have 5000 hours in this game. I don’t need a streamer to validate my opinion. Pig is a weak killer who can’t chase. The one thing she did have is now being nerfed.
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@ChuckingWong said:
In the top 10 kill rates.
Pig gets a buff to chase, a slight nerf to camping/tunneling out trapped survivors.
Really dont see the issue.
If people think this is an overall nerf than they need to change up their style of play.
Its called slowdown, not a handout kill the moment you put a trap on the survivor.
Another person justifying nerfs to a bad killer….modern dbd community xD
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Absolutely, yes. And too many of them guarantee safety for the survivor. I would be fine with a high number of pallets if most of them had a mindgame. The other problem is that good survivors know they don’t even really need to use them, since they can prerun as the killer approaches and waste a ton of time.
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@Firellius said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3654731#Comment_3654731
She's not getting a nerf, she's getting an overall buff.
The dash will not make a difference. It will still be beaten by predropping and long loops. Nerfs to her base power are far more impactful then those irrelevant changes.
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@Firellius said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3653891#Comment_3653891
Says the person having an absolute meltdown over being somewhat less likely to RNG into freebie kills.
Survivors aren't getting handholding with this change. Pig is losing hers.
So again, you’re saying that one of the weakest killers in the game deserves a nerf?
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@LordGlint said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3654332#Comment_3654332
How about trying the changes before determining that the buff to her chase won't work. If the survivor is just predropping every semi-decent pallet rather than looping, they're going to run out of resources...
No they’re not. There are too many resources on most maps. If their teammates decide to do gens, it’s over
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@LordGlint said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3653859#Comment_3653859
You're wrong... The RBTs are consistent. Your 4 traps are guaranteed to require exactly 12 searches total. Each individual one is different, but the total slowdown provided from 1 game to another is consistent. The days where you could have 4 headtraps come off fast are over. When's the last time you've so much as LOOKED at this killer, lol? This happened a WHILE back.
You don’t have time to get a trap on everyone, if they know what they’re doing. BHVR added that, and things like new grim to try and encourage spreading pressure, when in reality you’re better off hard focusing on one.
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@Thusly_Boned said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/405718/are-the-devs-serious
I don't see how this appreciably affects the slowdown, honestly. It makes a headpop a lot less likely, but against anything but total babies those were super unlikely before. The traps still need to be dealt with, and dealing with them won't be any quicker.
If they had drastically reduced the time it takes to search a Jigsaw box or made it so you can escape with an active trap on, that would be a whole other thing.
All these changes do to RBT dynamics is that it makes it less likely that absolute potatoes will die to them.
Survivors didn’t need anymore handholding changes.
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@jesterkind said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3653859#Comment_3653859
There's no strategy or consistency to empowering killer fundamentals? I'm not sure what you're saying.
You're not really hoping for anything, you're capitalising on the fact that there's a survivor guaranteed to not be on generators. Even if one survivor gets it off first try, the normalising of her RNG means you're guaranteed to get more slowdown off the other traps. If you're trying to harass survivors away from boxes consistently, best case scenario you're splitting your attention away from the other survivors you need to pressure and everyone's just less threatened by you than they could be.
More realistically, you're just giving up generator progress while you're also preventing the traps from actually providing any extra slowdown. How can that survivor's trap be slowing down the game more than if you were chasing them... when you're chasing them?
(The timer nerf also still barely matters, to be clear, we won't be drifting away from that point.)
I already responded to that point- if the 30 seconds don’t matter, there was no reason to make the change. Like you can’t have it both ways. If you’re saying 30 seconds isn’t impactful, then why would they change it?
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@Eelanos said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3653371#Comment_3653371
I think the extended timer is to reduce edge cases. It hardly ever happens, but I've had a couple of times where leaving immediately to start searching boxes while having the trap that requires the highest amount of tries to disarm would not be enough to search all the boxes you need.
It's a once-in-a-blue-moon issue, but I've gotten killed by a slightly too short timer before. It feels terrible because you're left there thinking "What was I supposed to do... I just got RNG'd to literal death."
Think about that the other way around: you get your head trap off almost instantly and Pig loses her pressure to rng. I’ve had it happen where everyone gets their trap off fast and she is stuck without a power.
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@jesterkind said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3653791#Comment_3653791
I won't contest that thirty seconds is a long time in this game, but not when contrasted against the entire trial. Thirty seconds more on a timer could just as easily translate to twenty extra seconds off generators searching boxes, depending on the size/shape of the map and anything else that happens in the trial. In general, I just don't see how that at all affects any Pig that isn't going out of their way to try and force head-pops.
If you're playing her to her strengths, it's neutral. It doesn't make a difference, survivors are very rarely getting it down to the wire to begin with.
To the last point: We aren't watching a movie, we're playing a video game.
There’s no strategy or consistency to that playstyle though. You’re basically just hoping that they don’t get the RBT off early on. It’s better to have control of a zone of the map.
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@jesterkind said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3653689#Comment_3653689
I say that because it isn't?
The strength of the RBTs is that they are passive pressure. The usual sweet spot good killers are aiming for, with one on hook, one in chase, one going for the save, and one on generators, is massively empowered when the one on generators actually has to go search a box to avoid dying.
So, when you're ignoring that strength to go harass someone who already has a trap on, in most scenarios you're doing something substantially weaker. The point of Pig is to occupy multiple survivors and not be chasing people who already have hats on, that's purposefully hamstringing your own power for basically no benefit.
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3653687#Comment_3653687
See above. The RBTs are passive pressure, not meant to kill survivors outright.
If it’s a weak strategy, why does it get me wins? Also, I am putting pressure on multiple survivors and NOT just the one with the trap on.
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@Aven_Fallen said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3653680#Comment_3653680
^ this.
It does not matter if the timer is 2,5 minutes, 3 minutes or 10 minutes. The Slowdown is the same, at some point the Survivor HAS to get rid of the RBT.
If it doesn’t matter, why change it at all? Your argument is faulty.
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@jesterkind said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3653669#Comment_3653669
But you still get the slowdown. The slowdown hasn't gone anywhere! It still does the exact same thing, that's the reason that this timer nerf doesn't matter.
The only thing that gets weaker is harassing survivors away from the boxes, both because you can't see the boxes and because the timers are slightly longer. This is both not a very strong strategy and quite an unhealthy one, so it's fine for this to get a little weaker- and it's not even by much.
If you want slowdown, you still have that. That hasn't changed.
I mean you keep saying it’s not a strong strategy, yet I have success with it. The weak version would be straight up tunneling/tracking the survivor wearing the trap, which is not what I do.
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@Firellius said:
Y'all maybe don't wanna hear it, but RBTs are absolutely awful and the main reason Pig's in a bad spot. A lucky Pig is the strongest killer in the entire game, and unlucky one is the worst. All these changes do is block some of the most asinine gameplay styles. On the survivor end, nothing changes, except there's a slightly smaller chance that Pig AFKs in front of the box you need.
Well, that, and she's stronger in chase now.
RBTs should be slowdown, NOT utterly and completely randomised freebie kills.
So she needed a nerf? Ok lol
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@jesterkind said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3653647#Comment_3653647
I mean, why? If someone's dying to a head pop, they're massively screwing up. You think thirty seconds is really gonna make that much difference if someone's flat-out ignoring their trap?
The only other time you could possibly get a head pop with Pig is if you're hard-focusing one guy down by harassing them away from boxes, but you can still do that, you just give up more generator progress. Also, good, it's good that one strategy became a little weaker.
No it’s not. If I want an antiloop killer I will pick slinger, huntress, or Spirit. 0 reason to choose pig. Pig was appealing because of slowdown and map control. So once again, even if it’s a playstyle you don’t like, it is still a nerf.
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@jesterkind said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3653635#Comment_3653635
I feel like a broken record, here, but people are not supposed to die to RBTs. That is not why you put an RBT on someone, it is not the goal, you aren't supposed to be relying on people dying to RBTs. In a Pig game where everything goes reasonably well and your power is firing on all cylinders, nobody will die to an RBT.
Play a hundred games, if Pig's power is working, nobody will die to an RBT.
That is not what they're for. That isn't the value you're shooting for. I'm going insane, this is what insanity feels like.
I’m not disagreeing about the traps’ purpose. As it is now, I do get an occasional head pop. That will now virtually never happen.
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@jesterkind said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3653609#Comment_3653609
I mean... okay?
She's still getting overall buffed even if a very specific thing you liked to do gets slightly weaker.
It’s not a net buff. Survivors will still just predrop or hold W and the dash will mean nothing. There was no reason to nerf the time either, as most survivors currently get the trap off in time. It just reeks of a change to, once again, boost up bad players.
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@Devil_hit11 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3653575#Comment_3653575
a lot of people only play pig for the ability to camp boxes and head-pop the survivor. that is why it is a nerf. It is not exactly healthy play-style considering your only required to put the survivor in dying state a single time to get what is essentially a passive mori for camping.
Even if you disagree with the playstyle (which shouldn’t matter) this is a nerf. It was efficient and effective. But hey, at least her dash is .2 seconds better now.
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@jesterkind said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3653566#Comment_3653566
It's the only conclusion to saying that the timer nerf in any way affects the viability or strength of her head traps. An increase of the timer on RBTs doesn't change the fact that you're dragging survivors off generators to go search jigsaw boxes, and that's what her power is for.
So, the effective playstyle of Pig - trapping survivors so they're off generators then occupying other survivors with chases, hooks, and their own traps - hasn't changed. Her ability to use stealth and Ambush is getting at least a little bit better. And finally, specifically harassing one guy off a box until they get a head pop got slightly weaker.
This is somehow an overall nerf to Pig? Her main thing doesn't change, her weakest elements get better, and a suboptimal playstyle gets very slightly weaker?
That’s not how I played her. I would use the information of box location to narrow down where the survivor was able to go, while at the same time defending a gen spread and pushing other survivors off. Now I can’t tell where the boxes are, and the increased time puts less pressure on the survivors. I didn’t play for head pops. I would take current pig over this nonsesnse.
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@jesterkind said:
These changes are revealing that apparently a lot of people think Pig's traps are for killing survivors and not for slowing the game down.
The timer before a head pop getting thirty seconds longer isn't going to change the fact that you're dragging survivors off generators to go search boxes. The entire point of Pig's power is that it guarantees a head pop won't happen if survivors willingly give up generator time to go search boxes. All thirty extra seconds will do is provide slightly more team counterplay if the Pig is trying to hard focus down one person with a trap, and that's not even viable to begin with.
So, the timer nerf doesn't matter and the box aura nerf is a little more noticeable but ultimately doesn't matter. In exchange, we at least have the beginnings of giving Pig a proper chase power and improving her stealth. Yeah, the devs are serious, because this is a buff overall.
No one in this thread is saying that. A very effective playstyle with pig is to put a trap on someone and then pressure them off of boxes so that they get close to a head pop. That isn’t possible anymore, and her “compensation” is a mediocre antiloop dash. At that point, why not just play a good antiloop killer?
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The funny thing is, antiloop killers can still be dodged (or just prerun.) It isn’t easy to hit a competent survivor who knows how to dodge. The standard for something being “OP” in this community is basically that the survivor has to make some kind of play and can’t be 100% safe.
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@Pulsar said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3651736#Comment_3651736
Okay, so we get rid of tunneling, that way the game is focused more on "skill"
I actually think @Reinami had a very good idea regarding this a couple weeks ago that I quite liked.
Neither side has any wiggle room anymore, that I agree with. However, what I do not agree with is this notion your floating about being able to play sub-optimally and still win against an optimal team (assuming a reasonably fair match in terms of skill level)
Yes, I’m saying the game should be balanced around hooks, not kills. Chasing is the main skill part of the game, and the most fun. The problem is that you are mostly locked out of this part against optimal teams. I don’t mind meta or optimal play, but I feel DBD’s current meta loop is the worst it has ever been.
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@Pulsar said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3651658#Comment_3651658
Okay, so just stack slowdown and tunnel if winning is your only goal.
I really don't see what your issue is. You lose a match every hundred games, it's not a big deal. I get it, it sucks when you feel like you haven't been outplayed but rather have just been put into an instant loss.
Guess what, those last hundred games you tunneled, proxy'd and run four slowdowns? I bet those people thought the same thing, but your response would likely be that it's a skill issue for them, but somehow it isn't for you.
It is definitely more often than 1in 100….lol. Not really sure what you’re saying. I don’t see how playing optimally is a skill issue. Nowhere did I say that the survivors playing optimally is a skill issue. My gripe is that BHVR incentivizes the killer to play in a boring way more and more with each update. Their solution to everything is to nuke perks, while not addressing core gameplay issues. The vast majority of core issues that they do address are on the survivor side, leading to the killer being at a further disadvantage.
It’s frustrating because I think, in the past, the game has been in a better spot and leaned more towards skill being the determining factor. Unfortunately, complaining has pushed the meta to what it is now. Players aren’t expected to learn, and balancing changes pretty much address the loudest voices in the room, with little consideration of whether these complaints are valid or not.
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@jesterkind said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3651642#Comment_3651642
I could point to streamers/youtubers that are quite skilled and don't tunnel and camp, for the record, it's cherrypicking either way. I would also like to point out, independent of that fact, Otz would've been tunnelling and camping because he was doing winstreaks where the entire point is minimise even the slightest potential of losing.
In a regular game, without that extreme incentive, you don't need to be 100% optimal all the time to stand a decent chance of winning, especially considering you and I stand a very small statistical chance of being in Otz's skill range.
Spreading hooks becomes much stronger when you buy yourself time to do it well and make a few mistakes. Time like, for instance, what you'd get when there's no generator progress being made at all for twelve seconds.
Also, it mustn't be breezed past that there's a difference between "not optimal" and "weak". Spreading hooks is very efficient and strong if you have good macro gameplay, it's only strictly weaker than tunnelling because of how hard to punish tunnelling is.
I play to win every match, so I play optimally. Like you can argue (though I disagree) that you don’t have to camp/tunnel, but that doesn’t change the fact that it’s more effective. I’ve experimented with many builds/playstyles in my time playing dbd, and playing defensively is almost always the better option. Spreading hooks only works if the survivors aren’t doing gens. By the time a non-mobile killer walks away from the hook to a gen the survivors are working on, they will have decent progress on it. While that’s happening, someone else is getting an uncontested save. It’s more efficient to be in the area to prevent or contest the unhook, and an even greater thing if there are gens near the hook. Camping puts pressure on the survivors to eat health states, or risk a 3v1.
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@jesterkind said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3651623#Comment_3651623
If you're not able to take chases and have to camp and tunnel in the current state of the game, there's something wrong with your macro gameplay. If you're bringing the strong tools and you're making sure to occupy multiple survivors at once (etc etc, I'm assuming I don't have to explain macro gameplay), the slowdown meta is considerably stronger than before.
Even if you don't like Pain Res, even if you want passive slowdown, there's so many strong options. Deadlock and Grim Embrace, for instance, are very powerful stall tools that don't require you to go out of your way, if what you liked was the passive nature of Ruin.
They aren’t the end all be all obviously, but I see the same thing happening when I watch DBD streamers. Unless they are playing blight, they have to use some form of camping/tunneling to win. During his infamous streaks, Otz directly said he was tunneling and camping people whenever possible. What’s more likely: me and the professional streamers lack game sense, or that there is a balance problem?
I dislike grim embrace even more than pain res. 12 second blocking isn’t impactful and spreading hooks is not the optimal way to play. I tested out various builds with it, and then I took it off. I always had more success by, again, camping and tunneling. There’s no reason to run grim embrace because it’s counter to the effective strategy.
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@jesterkind said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3651603#Comment_3651603
That's just running down why those perks are weaker.
The current regression meta is just flat stronger as long as you use the currently very strong perks. Even looking just at regression (which is a mistake since other forms of gen defence are also stronger now), you've got Pain Res, Eruption (depending on killer), Surge (depending on map), and of course, still Pop. Even accounting for perks that were changed in 6.1.0, they are proportionately stronger than before that patch-- take Surge. It's always had a number of 8%, but it's now 8% of 90 instead of 8% of 80. Even disregarding the cooldown buff, it's just stronger than it used to be. Eruption retained its % buff from 6.1.0 so it's better off for actual regression, and Pain Res was reworked to provide stronger regression after that patch.
Add in the other forms of gen defence for the overall slowdown meta, and it's just stronger than before, there's no competition. Ruin/Pop might've been healthier, but it was weaker.
Well I disagree. Back when those perks were meta, I was able to take way more chases. Now I have to camp/tunnel. I didn’t magically get worse at the game. I’m not sure what you’re seeing. Gens regressing, at a fast rate, without having to kick them was incredibly powerful. Compare that to pain res, which only works once per survivor, is attached to rng, and doesn’t even tell you which gen is being worked on. Even in the worst scenarios, old Ruin provided more consistent value and slowdown.
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@xEa said:
A friendly reminder that this perk, while clearly way to powerful, has not received it's well deserved nerf. We are aware that it might take some time to fully collect data and take action from your conclusion, but it is an absolute no-brainer that this perk should not work with DMS.
From there on, we have to see how strong it is, but if we let the 12 seconds per hook stage, the 40 seconds on 4th stage probably needs to be nerfed to 20-30 seconds.
Even with this nerf, i suppose it is still one of the best perks in the game, but it would not be close to gamebreaking as it is right now. Especially true on Billy, Nurse, Blight, Wesker ect
I stopped running it, as I don’t think it’s any good. You don’t have time to hook all 4, and it’s better to focus one out of the game early.
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I want to be able to hook someone, and make it to another person on a gen without losing multiple gens. I want to play a tile and have some chance at a mindgame that isn’t massively in the survivor’s favor. Irrespective of how good your chases are, the math literally isn’t there for a killer to be able to chase. You have to wait near the hook and patrol gens in that area.
Every single other era of DBD had better gen regression. I haven’t played in 6 months. Current gen regression is either not impactful enough, or too situational. COB, overcharge, surge, ruin, are unusable. Pain res is way too rng, and there are tons of matches in which I get little to no value. Corrupt, which I have never liked, still allows multiple gens to be worked on and becomes a dead perk very early on. I want to chase, not basically stand in place until someone comes to save.
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@Pulsar said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3651120#Comment_3651120
Are you good at Killer? I assume you must be, since you played in comp.
I dabbled in the comp scene for a bit. Did Community Cups, scrim nights etc etc.
Even on low-tiers, I'm winning the vast majority of my games. Hell, I beat an actual comp team as Wraith of all people. Wraith isn't bad, but I'd hesitate to call him high-tier.
As a former comp player, you aren't meeting people with your skill level or background consistently. You should be winning consistently, even against four man's. If I'm winning consistently, and you have more experience than me, you should be too
When did I say I wasn’t winning? I’m talking the matches in which you load in and have no chance. I used to be able to play for chases and have success, since gen regression was strong. Now even against a group that isn’t that great, I have to play in a very defensive way. It’s boring. Killer should be balanced around chases, which I think everyone can agree is the fun part of the game.
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@Gabe_Soma said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3651035#Comment_3651035
You can't even know whenever you are playing against a 4 man SWF.
But it's easier for you to accuse survivors to be part of a gaming group instead of taking your responsibility for you losses, isn't it?
It’s pretty easy to tell by checking their Steam profile/friends list. Plus you can tell if the group has coordination or not
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@JeanGreyarea said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3650930#Comment_3650930
Because bhvr wants more people playing their game, not less. Nerfing or removing swf would just turn people away from the game. From a business perspective it makes 0 sense to do that
People would still play. The vast majority of people who say they are quitting are full of it. If all they care about is chilling with friends, they shouldn’t mind losing a little more.
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Between solo and 4 stack? My reading of this is that solo q is in line with what the devs want, while 4 stacks break the balance.
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@Dreamnomad said:
I think it is worth noting that 2 swf has a lower survival rate than solo q and has identical survival rates at average and high mmr. Also noteworthy is that 2 player swf is the most commonly played version of swf. It is only at high mmr 4 player swf that the survival rate is substantially higher (and even then below 50%). The only logical conclusion is that SWF is not the problem that the forums would have you believe.
A nearly 10% gap between 4 stack and the rest is a big problem.
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@Gabe_Soma said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3650024#Comment_3650024
You can't nerf SWFs without nerfing SoloQ in general that's what I was referring to.
For the same reason killer perks shouldn't be nerfed just cause Nurse/Blight exist.
Why couldn’t they apply a debuff of some kind to a 4 stack?
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Definitive proof that 4 man SWF breaks the balance they are aiming for. That’s basically 50% when they say they want 40.
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@ChuckingWong said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3650219#Comment_3650219
Yea but asking for changes to the game based on those types of players, knowing full well they do not represent anywhere near the majority of the player base, is silly.
You'd have more people quit the game then stay.
Im pretty decent at survivor but nowhere near as good as comp teams. And I would leave the game if they just insist on creating nurse after nurse after nurse. Wouldn't you agree?
I don’t think they’d quit. People complain about killers now and for literally years on end, yet they don’t leave.
As for your point about Nurse, sure, variety is better. If the game were better balanced, you could use killers like pig and doctor and have better matches.
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@ChuckingWong said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3650203#Comment_3650203
Noone in this game runs into comp swfs a majority of the time.
Not even people with more hours than several of us combined and play this game as a career, run into comp SWF's a majority of the time.
Just because it doesn’t happen a majority of the time doesn’t make it ok.
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@Xendritch said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3650064#Comment_3650064
So everyone is in high MMR but magically only you get the actual high MMR survivors?
Not at all. I win most of my matches because, as I said, most people aren’t good at the game. Unlike the lower bracket killers though, I run into the sweat/SWF groups more than the average player does. That’s when the game’s imbalance is on display.
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@Aven_Fallen said:
Just want to point out the "low" Killrate of Nurse. It is "only" 55%, but this includes completely new players, since she is a free character and therefore some people will really tank her stats. She also has a steep learning curve (high skill floor at least), which means people will probably perform worse with her when learning her (and better once learned).
So the Killrate of Nurse at high Level will probably be absurdly high. We dont get stats for this, but probably because it would be so obvious that she needs changes. I guess she will at least be on the level of Skull Merchant when it comes to Killrate (for a different reason tho, mainly because she is busted, while for Skull Merchant many people just give up)
Last time we got stats for high MMR nurse, she wasn’t even in the top 5 killrate. And that was before she was nerfed (again)