sonata93
sonata93
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Hag, Billy, and Twins are probably the ones I rarely see. More so the Twins, I think I haven't versed them in months.
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Myers in general is very much a remnant of old DBD days. His base kit is far too weak for the current playstyle/meta; two gens (sometimes three against a coordinated team) can pop before you even get to T3, and he's arguably the only killer who can actually lose his power completely. If you use no addons, you'll eventually be unable to reach T3 as all survivors 'stalk' will be maxed out. After that, he becomes a weak M1 killer with no anti-loop ability. I'd actually argue he is the weakest stealth killer in the game: Ghostface's power is pretty much infinite (other than cool-down), and at least Pig has the traps as passive map pressure.
In all honesty, I think he needs reworking from the ground up. Tombstone needs removing but they could somehow work his mori into his power (like Sadako or PH) so he still has that true horror 'fear' factor.
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Let's not pretend rage-quitting is exclusively survivor sided. I went against a Wesker on RPD before who quit seconds after their Devour Hope got cleansed at three stacks, and a failed Tombstone Myers yesterday. If anything, it's worse when a killer does it because the whole game just ends. Don't get me wrong, I don't support rage-quitting at all but a lot of nice killers will acknowledge a DC and farm with the remaining survivors so the match isn't a complete waste of time.
Whilst I understand what you're saying about shaming DC'ers, it will just create more toxicity. Plus, every time someone DC's there might be a valid reason. For example, I've had to quit a game when something urgent has come up, or my internet connection has gone down. Should people who have to do it from time to time really be 'shamed' for something out of their control?
I think it should be a 3-strike rule every 24 hours. The first DC you get a small, 10-minute ban penalty, the second should be a couple more hours, and the third strike should be a more substantial 12-hour ban. This wouldn't punish people too harshly if they have to DC for a valid reason but really punishes the chronic rage-quitters. People who DC once in a while aren't an issue; people who seem to DC every time they're online show a pattern of behavior.
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@Rudjohns said:
Another instance of SWF breaking the game and forcing devs to balance around it
Solo Q is miserable
I 100% agree, and that was something I kept in my mind throughout the whole match. The current balance in the game is:
(Strongest to weakest): SWF - Killer - Solo Q
It's bizarre that killers can get absolutely destroyed by SWF, but sometimes killer feels overbearing in solo Q. It's a weird balance, I genuinely don't know how they can fix it tbh.
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@[Deleted User] said:
them being comfortable with survivors escaping only 39% of the time on average is big yikes tbh
at what point are killers just being carried by oppressive gen slowdown perks like jolt, eruption, pain res and overcharge? rather than actual map pressure and playing skillfully
inb4 "but dead hard" i dont use dead hard and never have :)
I agree in the sense that gen regression builds have come very oppressive, especially against certain killers - and equally, 39% escape rate seems pretty low/unbalanced.
However, isn't it true that both sides are essentially carried by perks? The gen regression meta has become so popular as it gives the killer passive map pressure, which can be very difficult to achieve without these perks on certain maps (Red Forest, RPD, and Crotus Prenn) and if you're against a SWF/co-ordinated team. This doesn't necessarily mean a killer 'lacks skill', it's because sometimes they've already lost the match before they've even loaded in due to the above factors.
DH isn't the only perk that carries survivors; DS, exhaustion perks in general, OTR, COH, etc are all equal culprits. In fact, I'd argue that most survivors would go down a lot quicker if it wasnt for DH, SB, Lithe, etc - exhaustion perks carry most survivor chases. Of course, nothing wrong with using any of these perks, but both sides have a meta which they use as it gives them the best chance at winning.
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Thanks for all your valuable and interesting responses. It's great to hear different perspectives on this topic.
For the record, I don't for one minute doubt there are countless killers out there who play as horribly and as sweaty as possible (slugging for 4ks, leaving people to bleed-out, etc), so I don't for one minute think it's entirely survivor sided. This experience just sticks in my head because these survivors capitalized off the inexperience of the killer, and went out of their way to make the experience as miserable and unfun as possible.
I guess the moral of the story is: don't be an ***hole whether you're a killer or survivor 'main'. Just be kind, respectful, and try and enjoy the game.
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I agree with a lot of this.
I play Trapper from time to time as he's really fun and reminds me of old DBD, however, he is very weak against the current game style/meta.
I think a couple of fixes would make him more viable:
- He begins the trial with all his traps. It's ridiculous that you sometimes have to walk to the other side of the map to pick up one trap.
- Your idea was very cool: if a survivor steps in a trap they get the mangled/hemorrhaged status effect.
- Some of his addons should be basekit, for example: the darker trap addon and the one which randomly opens a random trap every couple minutes.
- An idea I had for an ultra-rare add on was to give a survivor the exposed status effect for 1 minute if they disarm a trap.
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This would require a complete overhaul of the game's design and coding. Considering matches last, what? Like 10 minutes? And survivors have downtime (healing, repairing, etc.) I don't think it's that unrealistic or impossible.
I wouldn't call it 'mindless' when survivors run whilst being chased. Remember, the killer has everything in their favor as they're faster than the survivors and also have powers to help assist them to get downs, so the survivors have to strategize during the chase as they have to preempt the killer's movements.
You're essentially suggesting killers get easy downs and cut down chases to 30 seconds - this makes no sense. Saying that running is 'crutch' for survivors is like saying a killers power is 'crutch': that's kinda the idea.
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Yes, but I would never shame the player for playing her as it's not their fault that her design allows her to be a really strong camper. It's a gameplay issue, not a player issue.
I will say though, I've never gone against a Hag who doesn't just spam traps around a hooked survivor and then just play hook-swap for the whole game. It's just super boring and predictable, so I'm glad you don't seem to go against her all too often anymore. I think a simple fix would be to block her from trapping within a reasonable distance from the hook.
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Hexes in general are pretty useless, in my opinion. The only ones worth running are Haunted Grounds and Retribution as they are activated by the survivor's cleansing (which 99% of the time, they will). Hexes like Ruin, Undying, and Devour rely on survivors leaving the totems lit, which, from experience, is a rarity. Especially when you consider how totems can spawn right out in the open, or even spawn next to a survivor at the start of the trial.
Plaything is also pretty good as it wastes survivors' time whilst they search for their totem, and dare I say it, also NOED as you can get real end-game pressure and snowball from it.
Having said that, I do not miss Ruin/Undying on every Blight in the game. I'd far rather go against Eruption, Call of Brine, etc any day.
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No, because I've been in many games where, as one of the final two survivors, we've been able to finish one (or even two) gens between us and escape. The glaring issue with what you've suggested is that killers would simply tunnel two survivors out of the game before 5 gens are done, which would mean an immediate win.
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I think Lithe is superior because you have way more control over it. Don't get me wrong, you see really seasoned survivors who are able to 99% their exhaustion meter, but most of the time you see people walking around the map to save it, which, in my opinion, is just annoying and slows progress down. Lithe is far more efficient and reliable at gaining distance during chase (when you need it most). Overcome is also pretty good and underrated.
(Best to worst): Lithe - Overcome - SB - BL - Smash Hit
It's hard to place DH. When it works and its timed well, it still remains the best exhaustion perk. However, I think it's too unreliable and hard to use for newer survivors.
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I wouldn't say it's 'intolerable', but I agree there's a huge discrepancy between SWF and solo-queue.
I play mostly survivor but today I fancied playing some killer. I had a streak of a few, really good games where I consistently got 3ks/4ks. However, on the fifth or sixth match, I entered a SWF lobby (I could tell as they had similar/matching usernames) - all with flashlights/toolboxes. To say I got absolutely stomped on is an understatement: I only managed to get three hooks the entire game, and despite running perks which pressure gens (Pain Res/DMS) and using Dredge's teleportation to lockers close to gens being worked on, the gens just kept popping in very quick succession. I struggled to get hooks as they efficiently used body-blocking and sabotaged hooks and I failed to get any momentum as one of them had brought a healing build (COH, Botany, and We'll Make It) so they could heal before I even managed to injure a second person. I had to proper 'sweat' this round, compared to the previous where it just felt fun/balanced. When you play as killer, you get a first-hand perspective of the significant difference between solo and SWF; the aforementioned feeling pretty 'killer sided', whilst the latter feels nearly impossibly 'survivor sided'.
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Yeah if Mikey ever gets a rework I hope to god they keep Scratched Mirror. I went against a SM Michael on Lery's before and it was genuinely terrifying; it makes me remember this is actually supposed to be a horror game. 🤣
Tombstone should go as an add-on, but I think it'd be awesome if they could build his mori into his basekit power - kinda like Sadako and Executioner. It would still add that fear-factor that Tombstone has, but without the BS of being able to get someone out of the game so easily.
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I agree that it's slowly becoming meta again, but when I play killer it's nowhere near as frustrating and unfair as old DH. It's so much easier to bait out and 0.5 seconds is - all things considered - such a short window of time for the perk to actually work. "DH for distance" is no longer a thing, and it feels much fairer in the sense that the survivor needs to time it perfectly, whilst old DH was truly the definition of "press E to win".
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I think he's a pretty well-designed killer, and while he may be strong, I think he generally feels fair.
The two most important things to consider when countering him:
- When you have two or more lockers side-by-side, just lock one of them. When Dredge transports, the game treats multiple lockers as one transport location if that makes sense, so if one locker is locked and the other is unlocked he'll still default transport to the locked one. Once this lock has been broken, you can then lock the other locker(s) so that it'll slow him down again when transporting to them. This means you get full use out of both locks.
- Secondly, I agree that I used to feel the same about Nightfall - it felt a little overbearing and made it easy for Dredge to creep up on you. The best thing to do is work on a gen that's out in the open with a clear vision, as Dredge will be highlighted in white so you can see him coming from a distance. Alternatively, some people like to play stealthily whilst Nightfall is active which is fine, but I think it's better to work on gens and pressure them.
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@predalienman1 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3185876#Comment_3185876
I will feel better if someone actually tries to change my mind.
Dude, you obviously came into this discussion with your mind already made up.
I'm not about to 'change your mind', but what I will say is that both sides have annoyances and complaints about their opposition. From experience on this forum, many people aren't open-minded to seeing it from both sides because they've had some bad experiences playing either killer or survivor. All a killer needs is a few matches against some really strong SWFs to decide the game is "survivor sided", whilst a survivor just needs to play solo-queue for a bit and experience Nurse and some tunneling/camping to decide it's "killer sided" - you see a theme here? For every complaint you have about DH or a gen-rushing squad, survivors are just as entitled to have a strong opinion about, let's say, a range add-on Nurse, Alchemist Ring Blight, or a face camping Bubba. Do you see? Discussions like this are just fighting fire with fire and aren't productive when discussing the overall health of the game.
Instead of us all making it a 'us vs. them' thing and competing to see which side has it worse (which, no offense, this discussion is doing exactly that), why don't we all mutually agree on certain things in the game which needs fixing which would benefit both sides? For example map design and layout - we can all agree (whether killer or survivor) that they're not great and need fixing can we not? Also: MMR... I think we can all agree that there's something seriously off with this.
Also, this doesn't particularly benefit the killer but the gap between solo-queue and SWF needs to be addressed. I only mention this because you say countering Hex's requires 'team work and game knowledge', which it does, but that's no easy feat when playing solo-queue. You don't know what you're gonna get, and you also forget there are casual players in this game who only play for a few hours.
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The nerf from 1-second endurance to 0.5 was unnecessary. In theory, the new DH is really good, but it just falls short in execution because it's so unreliable. People love to say "it's about skill", but even the most perfectly-timed DH can fall flat due to ping and game servers. When it works, it's amazing and far supersedes old DH, but at the moment, it's just too risky when you compare it to failproof exhaustion perks like SB and Lithe.
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The Legion!
All four members appear to be really small, so it makes me laugh when you see one of them pick up big survivors like Jeff, Adam, etc with one hand and carry them over their shoulder like it's nothing. 🤣How on earth are they able to do this considering their size/build?
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'Smoke and Mirrors' (Survivor Perk):
Your need to survive has enabled you to deceive even the most cunning of killers.
If you remain undetected in the killer's terror radius for 30/45/60 seconds, press the active ability button to produce a random set of scratch marks within 12/16/20m of the killer's current location. Your own scratch marks are suppressed whilst the perk is active.
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@danielmaster87 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3173838#Comment_3173838
How long are y'all gonna refer to this recent 'killer-sided update' as the reason why the game is fine for killers universally? It's not. Trapper, Pig, and Ghost Face are still nowhere near Nurse and Blight level, and even they lose a lot. There are not countless ways of getting early game pressure; you're still losing from the get-go as killer. That hasn't changed, because you can't be everywhere at once. If survivors have to a do a gen for 10 more seconds, they can cry me a river. Killers have spent an additional minute getting 1 person down 1 time because of absolutely safe loops, second chance perks, and body blockers, which became stronger because of the "killer-sided update".
Objectively speaking, the update was killer sided. Aside from the BT base-kit, survivors got tons of nerfs and even the 'buffed' 'new meta' perks (OTR, Botany, etc.) are still nowhere near as powerful as the old, pre-update survivor meta (DH, DS, etc.). Nor do they compare to the many, many buffs that killers received in the update. Also, mentioning killers that are considered weak by many doesn't mean the update wasn't killer sided - all that does is highlight which killers seriously need a rework/buff to their own, individual basekit, and the glaring holes in their design.
Sure, the gens now "only" take an extra 10 seconds, but that's 50 seconds across all gens, so nearly an extra minute. That also doesn't take into consideration the boring, relentless, gen slow-down/regression meta that a lot of killers are currently using. The update did exactly what it was supposed to: give killers more pressure and slow down gens. Although no 'official' data has been released, no-one can deny kill rates have gone up, and escape rates have gone down. We all know that from our own games.
How did 'second chance' perks and body blocking become stronger because of the update? All the 'second chance' perks that killers complained about (DH, DS) have been nerfed into oblivion and their usage has dropped significantly. The only really strong 'second chance' perk nowadays is OTR. As I said in my previous post, base-kit BT only affects you if you actively hit someone off the hook, and body-blocking is a viable strategy; no different from a killer proxy-camping or tunelling. Sure, not a 'fair' strategy and it sucks to be on the receiving end, but proven time and time again to be effective.
Finally: run Lethal Pursuer if you struggle with early game pressure. Of course killers are 'losing' at the start: isn't that the whole fun of killer to build pressure and get downs? Corrupt base-kit is basically free early-game downs, when killers already get free kills in the EDC because of the patch making DS, OTR, etc useless in the end game.
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@Marik1987 said:
I would think this would be fair. If survivors gets a whole Meta-Perk Base-Kit, why dont do the same to killers?
The difference is that pre-update, a killer could just hit a survivor straight off the hook and put them straight back on. This made for grossly unfair/unfun gameplay - particularly for solo-queue and new players. BHVR fairly balanced this massive survivor buff by buffing many aspects of killer gameplay. To name a few: base-kit STBFL, reduced gen-speeds, reduced survivor speed-boost from injury, no end-game 2nd chance perks, and buffed bloodlust. Call me biased, but I would argue this was already a fair trade-off for base kit BT, which I'll add, only affects you if you hit a survivor off the hook - if you don't play this way, you won't even notice base kit BT.
The whole update was very killer-sided, which was fair because survivors dominated for too long. However, they need to look at statistics from the recent update before even considering base-kit Corrupt. If the statistic shows killer rates have increased (which I'd bet a lot they have), adding base-kit Corrupt will just be overkill. The buffed-gen speeds are already enough and there are countless perks/addons which enable you to get early-game pressure.
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At the end of the day, Killer's have equally powerful perks/powers so is it not only fair that survivors have something similar?
Working on your premise: "why is a 3rd health state a thing"? Why are instadown perks/addons a thing? I have no problem with it personally as it's a basic game mechanic, but you can't complain about third health states when killers are given substantial opportunity to get insta-downs through their powers, perks, and addons.
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For survivor, I absolutely love We'll Make It. You can heal a recently unhooked survivor in half the time, and in a matter of seconds if someone else is healing with you. It's seriously slept on considering you can make such a good comeback from pressure applied by the killer. I get value out of it every single game and it's even come in clutch at times. One of the best altruism perks in the game I think.
For killer, I'd say Thrilling Tremors. Just a solid perk that gives you critical information when carrying a survivor. I see it a lot against Ghostface seeing as it's his teachable, but very rarely see it on other killers. Very underrated in my opinion.
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Absolutely not. The gen speed buff during the big update combined with stacked gen slow-down/regression perks already makes this aspect of the game ridiculously dull for survivors. Delaying it by 20 seconds will only make it worse, and will be tilting the game far more towards killer-sided.
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At face value, yes - she has a low kill rate. However, I'd like to see the data which outlines her kill rates depending on the players' MMR. Her low-kill rate is probably linked to the fact that many people (particularly console players) find her difficult so only give her a couple of games before giving up. Baby Nurses are most prone to bullying because if you don't know what you're doing with her, she's so easily countered and absolutely annihilated by any survivors with a bit of common sense. She's not like other killers who can do moderately well even at low MMR because of their ease-of-use and player-friendly abilities (Bubba, Hag, Trickster, Nemesis, etc.).
If there was a graph showing Nurse's kill rates in ratio to MMR, I'd imagine it's an almost flat line up until a certain player's level and then there's a sudden, almost vertical spike. A killer with such inconsistent kill-rates is not indicative of them being weak or underpowered (as the OP said), it suggests issues with core game mechanics and killer design.
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Tbf, the new patch is still relatively 'new' considering it only launched a few weeks ago. I'd imagine they're giving it more time for the initial drama to subside before making any official statement or changing anything.
The overwhelming feedback is that DS stun duration needs reverting, and killers stacking multiple gen slow-down/regression perks have made games taxing and, at times, very drawn out and boring. They'll never revert DH/NOED/Ruin nerfs though - they were the three most problematic perks in the game and, by all accounts, these nerfs were very much needed.
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You'd think so, but then reading this discussion there are people getting maps which I never get multiple times in a row.
For example, I rarely get Lery's and Dead Dawg yet I've seen people here seem to be getting these a lot. Honestly, 9/10 games for me are either Macmillan, Autohaven, or Red Forest.
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The mechanic itself isn't a problem and thematically makes sense considering the animation of a survivor getting sacrificed.
The issue is hook spawns, particularly on large maps. For example, if the hook in the main hall of RPD gets destroyed and you down someone by the exit gate, it's physically impossible to reach another hook without Agitation or Iron Grasp.
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We all make mistakes and sometimes misjudge situations, but two solo-queue players stick in my mind as WTH moments:
- I went against a Nurse the other day and had a Mikaela and Claudette on my team. Me and Ace were trying to plug gens but these two were just stealthing around the map and doing nothing productive. Anyway, I get downed and hooked but as the Ace came for me he got into chase and got downed. I then reached the second stage whilst Ace was hooked, meanwhile, Mikaela and Claudette were both injured and Mikaela proceeded to bless a totem for CoH and heal herself and Claudette. I had a matter of seconds left and Ace reached second stage. When I was sacrificed I decided to spectate and I couldn't believe what I saw: the Claudette ran up and farmed Ace right off the hook in front of the Nurse. Despite having no hooks, she left the Ace for dead and ran back over to the gen that Mikalea was on. Ace was sacrificed and then they were both just walking around the map and trying to evade the killer. Eventually, the Nurse got them both so I was glad neither escaped lol.
- The other instance was a Laurie who was the most selfish player I've ever met. Myself and the other two survivors were doing all the work (gens, getting chased, going for saves, etc.) whilst she'd just work on a gen for a little bit then get into a locker the second she heard a heartbeat/TR. The last gen pops and me (Jake) and Dwight were both on death-hook, whilst a Feng had been hooked once (no hooks for Laurie lol). Unfortunately the killer had NOED, and Laurie just camped the exit gate and set off the EDG whilst we all looked for NOED to try and save Feng from being sacrificed. We save the Feng, but Dwight goes down in the process and gets sacrificed. Me and Feng run for the gate but it was a Myers and despite NOED being cleansed, he pops T3 and downs me... meaning only Feng escaped ( which I was fine with as she was a great teammate). When I got to the ending screen with player information, I was NOT surprised to see Laurie running Self-Care, Left Behind, Urban Evasion, and Iron Will (basically a selfish survivor build). She only got like 11k points, and when Dwight called her out in the chat, it wasn't because she was doing a daily or anything, she was just like "every man for himself" lol.
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It's probably RE hype for the upcoming chapter, but I've always thought Neme is popular tbh.
He's pretty strong, yet easier to use than most other upper-tier killers, yet he has the ease of use of most M1 killers but with a stronger power and more map pressure.
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I was disappointed when I read about Wesker and his power; he's essentially Nemesis 2.0.
Out of the more recent killers I'd say Dredge is the most unique. His teleportation is by far the most flexible as there are so many lockers, therefore he's not restricted to pre-generated spawns (like Sadako or Freddy), nor does he risk having his teleport spots removed by survivors (Demo).
Whilst changes to the environment aren't exactly 'new' (Freddy's Dreamworld, Pinhead's Chains), Nightfall feels by far the most oppressive and difficult to play against.
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Clown. I absolutely hate the screen effects when he throws a bottle at you (it gives me a headache) and I just find everything about him super annoying and obnoxious.
As another player has pointed out: it's always a repeat of him using a haste bottle and then spamming you with the pink bottles.
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I love playing GoJ for this reason: it feels super rare so it's always a surprise to play on it.
I think the issue is there are multiple different realms with multiple maps (Red Forest, Macmillan, and Autohaven), whilst many others have just one map (Eyrie, GoJ, Haddonfield). In terms of probability and the 'randomness' of map selection, you're far more likely to get one of the aforementioned Realms instead of, say, GoJ or Gideon.
It's strange though, despite what I've said I seem to get Eyrie of Crows quite regularly, whilst GoJ is once in a blue moon. It surprises me that they don't increase your chances of going to a new map when a new chapter gets released.
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This game will never be truly balanced for one simple reason: there are too many variables in any given match that determine the outcome.
In one match, there are all the following variables at hand:
- Killer skill/MMR
- Specific killer and their specific power/abilities
- The skill/MMR of four, individual survivors
- Map size/number of pallets and loops
- Four different perks for killer
- A combination of 16 different perks between all four survivors
For these reasons, no matter what BHVR do to 'balance' the game, someone will still have something negative to say about it. Look at the recent patch; don't get me wrong, there are aspects of it that are terrible, but other aspects are good. That whole patch was delivered as a direct response to consistent feedback from the community (the killer hatred of DH, survivors hatred of NOED/Ruin, base-kit BT, etc.). Like I said, BHVR is by no means perfect, but I think it's disingenuous to say they don't listen to feedback or try and keep their players happy.
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It's nowhere near as common as it once was, and even when you do come across it the killer tends to just get one down because the totem is much easier to find due to the aura mechanic.
This version feels much more balanced and less oppressive.
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Killer meta has not changed one bit. In fact, it's old killer meta (gen slow-down) with bells on. Where killers used to always run Ruin, they've now swapped it out for perks like Thana, Overcharge, etc. because they haven't got the risk of it being cleansed in the first 30 seconds of the match. Of course, you then still see the typical aura reading perks like BBQ and Lethal Pursuer.
Survivor meta has changed quite a lot, in my opinion. Exhaustion perks are still meta but DH has been swapped out for SB/Lithe. You rarely see Iron Will anymore, or Spine Chill. Interestingly, OTR isn't as popular as I thought it'd be... don't get me wrong, I see people run it but it hasn't become the 'new' DS/DH. Healing builds seem to be more popular now.
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I'd love to see the Winchester brothers from Supernatural as a paragraph (not a full chapter as there are far too many supernatural beings fron that show to choose a killer).
Also, a Shining chapter would be awesome! Overlook hotel map (split into different maps though as we'd have another RPD situation lol). Jack as killer and Wendy as survivor.
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I see where you're coming from, and I really like the idea of the time being deducted depending on the number of downed survivors.
However, the key issue is that when you give new/low-mobility M1 killers a buff, you also inadvertently buff absolute monsters like Nurse and Blight. You say it'll help new killers 'not have a horrible time', but what about new survivors? This will make gens even more difficult to complete, especially since the recent patch with the unanimous feedback that it's really damaged solo Q.
A good, well-thought suggestion but I just don't think it'd be viable.
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The tea bagging doesn't bother me so much. At the end of the day, it's not that deep and it's just a video game, and ultimately, these types of things will always be around as long as there are multi-player, online games.
However, I agree that hanging around when they've clearly won is so annoying. It just shows a complete lack of respect for other people's time when the game could already be over and you could enter your next lobby. The same can be said for killers who slug all survivors and let them bleed out - they need to get some fresh air and touch some grass.
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The absolute worst kind is people who stay behind until the very last second and deliberately try and get the killer's attention by spam vaulting/exiting lockers. What does this achieve, exactly? A quick little fix of dopamine from rubbing your win in someone's face? As a survivor main I absolutely hate seeing others do this and always make a point of leaving as soon as I know everyone's safe/the game's officially over.
It's so satisfying when this behavior backfires and the killer gets a last-minute hook/kill or a Blood Warden play. 🤣
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@MommyHunktress said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3114860#Comment_3114860
the fact you dont take chase is selfish. if i save someone i refuse to hide, and when im killer i will tunnel anyone whos savior is nowhere and you know what i LOVE when their savior starts running to take hits because they see me tunnel and then you know what i do? i slug them and then tunnel the person unhooked. I will NOT let a survivor do some stupid crap to their teammate without punishing it, turning people against their friends is by far one of the best ways to fix problems. thats what bootcamp taught me, if you make a mistake and then ebveryone gets punished you are less likely to do it. yeah he showed himself but whose to say he wont try it again and that survivor wont be tunneled if he doesnt hide. I literally had a bill let this nea get tunneled out of the game and so instead of her 3rd hook i slugged her, because in actuality im not a total jerk.
So you think 'turning people against their friends' and deliberately tunneling/slugging people is an effective way of fixing problems within the game? Sorry, but that makes no sense whatsoever.
Taking hits for a recently unhooked survivor is not, by any means, 'stupid crap'; it's a viable strategy that most co-ordinated teams use. People do that to make it harder for the killer to do exactly what you said: tunnel. Swapping health states/hooks and taking protection hits is a basic strategy for any coordinated team.
Also, I'm not sure how slugging that Nea you talked about did her any favors? Sounds like she already had a miserable game and she probably just wanted out so she could move on to the next game. Slugging is boring and unfun, so you essentially punished the Nea for Bill's bad gameplay.
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First off, not all survivors are out to "always give you a bad experience"; just because a certain fraction of survivors are clicky-clicky teabaggers, doesn't mean we all are.
Sure, the game makes it so that (in some instances) camping/tunelling are effective strategies, but going off that logic, SWF is the most effective way to 'win' as a survivor, yet some killers are constantly complaining about SWF, with some going as far as saying it shouldn't be in the game or there should be an option to disable matchmaking with SWF's. You see the problem here? You're perfectly entitled to say that you like camping/tunelling, but others are equally entitled to have an opinion on it, too. It's a viscous cycle: the more killers camp/tunnel, the more survivors go out of their way to make the experience frustrating for the killer too (body blocking, flashlight saving, etc.).
Is it effective at times and probably gives you a better chance at winning? Sure. But remember, there are other humans who are playing this game who just want to have fun, so yeah, you're not obliged to play in a 'fair' way, but don't be surprised when people get annoyed/frustrated when they've waited 10 minutes to load into a game only to get face-camped. Not exactly fun or engaging gameplay, is it? Also, the counterargument is there are tons of good killers out there who manage to get a 3k/4k without resorting to easy tactics like camping. When I play as killer, the fun part is traversing the map and spreading pressure and using your perks to their maximum potential. Not sure how guarding a hook to kill someone early is "fun" but, each to their own... I guess.
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How's it selfish, exactly? Sure, if they do nothing all match and bring selfish perks like Left Behind. However, that specific survivor you mentioned was still being efficient and helping the team out (doing gens and going for saves, as you said). You have to remember not all survivors are good at being chased/looping, so I'd actually argue in that situation it's the most optimal thing to do (only if they're doing objectives, of course). Also, in the current camping/tunneling meta (you even admit to doing this yourself), some survivors feel their best hope at surviving is by playing stealthily, which I'd argue is better if you feel you're not able to waste the killers time by looping/being chased.
Also, every player is different and approaches the game differently. One of my good friends who I SWF with has vision difficulties and being chased on dark maps (Azarov for example) or going against certain killers (Dredge with Nightfall and Freddie with Dreamworld) can be difficult for him, so instead he will be more stealthy and objective focused (gens, rescues, totems, etc.) whilst I take the pressure from the killer. So, in my opinion, you should be more sensitive towards others, and tunneling people because you don't like their playstyle is not a productive or cool way to play the game.
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As a survivor main, I say that's simply not true.
I actually agreed with most of the changes/killer buffs; the main complaint was that buffed Thana stacked with other gen slow-down perks had become way too oppressive on Plague and Legion as you spend most of your game injured, and therefore, gens became even more tedious and boring. Also, people complained about Thana Legion and Plague long before the perk got buffed.
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@Sludge said:
Resident Evil has so many crazy monsters Wesker is kinda bland
I have to agree with this. Nemesis was a good choice as he still really fits the scary/horror aspect of DBD; Wesker's just a tall dude wearing sunglasses. He just doesn't look particularly scary or foreboding like most of the killers in DBD, especially when you look at how creepy more recent killers are (Dredge, Sadako, Artist).
I will look forward to a new killer and new perks though, it's always a nice refresh for the game.
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Hatch shouldn't ever allow multiple survivors to escape; it's the last resort for the final survivor who has little hope of opening the exit gates (especially against high-mobility killers).
However, I do wish they'd change its location spawned once the gens were done - not once there's only one survivor left in the trial. this would at least give the final survivor a bit more of a chance of finding it.
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Whilst I appreciate what the devs did for this map in terms of appearance/aesthetic, the current version should never have made it into the game; It's far too big and convoluted.
The two things I hate the most:
- Playing solo-queue survivor and trying to get any kind of organization with your team feels near impossible. A survivor get hooked on the opposite side of the map... you spend most of their first hook stage trying to get to them/find the hook. I've lost track of the number of times I got to second-hook stage on that map because of this exact reason. You can see the auras of other survivors trying to find their way to you.
- The second would be playing as killer and finding hooks. Hook spawns on this map are whack and good luck getting a survivor to a hook if you downed them at one of the exit gates. Why are there no hooks by the exit, when pretty much every other map generates hooks near the exit. Specifically other indoor maps like Lery's or Gideon.
I think we'll all enjoy this beautiful map more once it's made more accessible and playable for both sides. It's way worse for killers though; getting map pressure is so difficult when gens are so spread out.
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How would this be fair? In the recent patch, not only did gen speeds get buffed, but killers got a load of buffs to gen slow-down/regression perks. Survivors have had to endure weeks of Thana, Eruption, Merciless, Overcharge, Jolt, etc., most of which by the way, stack with each other. You're also forgetting that it's only really Thana that's getting a huge nerf (and rightly so).
The only powerful gen speed perk is PT, which is absolutely fine as it is. Resilience relies on the survivor staying injured (which therefore makes it easier for the killer to get them down), and others (Deja Vu, Overzealous, etc.) are so rare/situational and are not even particularly strong perks.
So no, I don't think it's fair to nerf the couple of perks that survivors have to counter all the buffs that killers have received.
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I think a soft base kit Kindred (without the killer's aura), as well as survivor actions appearing by their names ('hooked', 'rescuing', 'working on a gen', etc.), would make such a massive difference.