smurf

@kdog23451 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3952951#Comment_3952951
i agree and i regret getting that mad but him saying if you get tunneled and go down your just bad made me angry

That's fair. I bet we've all been there in some way :)

in Tunneling killers Comment by smurf June 28, 2025

@TimberGoingDown said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3952947#Comment_3952947
Here's the problem with the entire thing.
You say that after the anti-tunnel, all of the killers who "put themselves in an MMR they're not ready for" will be pushed back down to their "proper MMR," right?
Who's going to play against all of those same survivors that they "weren't ready for?" Now that there are much fewer killers in that MMR bracket, who's going to play against the really good survivors?
I'll tell you who: The same exact people who are playing against them now. Matchmaking will do its thing and after a couple of minutes will grab a former high-MMR killer and put them up against a squad they have no chance of beating. That killer will get curb stomped because all of the tactics that they used to use against those squads has been taken away, and they'll get maybe 2 hooks before getting bagged at the gates. That happens often enough, and the killer just leaves the game. I know I wouldn't play a game that regularly matches me in unwinnable games to get curb stomped and mocked.

There are two important considerations there.

The first is that those players who are currently overreliant on tunneling may not be as good as people who have somewhat lower killer-specific MMRs who don't tunnel. When players who rely on tunneling lose access to that, their MMRs may drop more than they would expect. That would leave players who constantly rely on and win with only their killer powers and addons to face the top survivor players. That may be enough already that this isn't a huge issue. However, I strongly suspect that top killer players will be especially numerous for just a few from the roster. That will lead to the second thing:

There should be an effort to create cross-MMR balance for more of the killer roster. I think the presence of tunneling is preventing BHVR from having to address the fact that the game is inherently unbalanced in a way that's not healthy. It's not clear how to balance more killers for play across all MMRs, but there are some viable approaches. One would simply be to apply MMR-specific buffs or nerfs to certain aspects of the game. That could be to survivor or killer abilities, or to things like map balance. Alternatively, some killer abilities could be tweaked in a way that enables enhanced use at high skill levels. Nurse and Blight are broadly already like that, where very new players don't typically have the skill, knowledge, and game sense to do well with those killers in their own MMR.

But tunneling remains a low-skill way to ruin a player's match and make them wonder why they even decided to play that day. That's something that shouldn't exist.

in What do YOU think BHVR is going to do to address tunneling? Comment by smurf June 28, 2025

Genrash sounds terrifying.

in Damaged balance for Killers Comment by smurf June 28, 2025

@kdog23451 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3952890#Comment_3952890
how please explain you ######### stupid #########

So… I don't like tunneling either, but I think that sort of comment with anger, and probably profanity and name-calling might not go over well here 🤔

in Tunneling killers Comment by smurf June 28, 2025

@TimberGoingDown said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3952543#Comment_3952543
MMR is a myth. Matchmaking is so lenient that as long as you're not in the "new player" MMR, you're going up against any and everyone.

I have seen no actual evidence of this other than anecdotal player accounts.

Most likely, MMR is still taken into account when attempting to pair players for matches. But if players in a close MMR range aren't available then players in a wider MMR range are paired instead, leading to people sometimes being paired in ways that cause the myth of MMR not being real. Nevertheless, I would expect that top players are likely more often matched with top players when compared with people who just passed the soft-cap.

in What do YOU think BHVR is going to do to address tunneling? Comment by smurf June 28, 2025

@camping_site said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3952795#Comment_3952795
It still has 4 players, DC surv is replaced by bot. It would show actual survivor experience becuase often DC is just giving up in a match already lost - 1 tunneled out 3 gens left etc.

That is correct. Not sure why someone downvoted it.

Players are much more likely to DC in a game that's going badly for them, meaning that some fraction of matches that end in a certain way are selectively excluded from the statistics.

The result is that balancing adjustments are made to only some fraction, F, of matches that excludes matches with a DC. Let's call the fraction of matches with at least one DC, D, for disconnect, such that D = 1 - F. And in those D matches, we may have a significantly higher sacrifice rate than the 60% target; let's guess and call it 75% (i.e. 0.75).

While we balance toward having the fraction F of matches with a 60% sacrifice rate, the remaining matches need to be included to get the real total sacrifice rate. The real total sacrifice rate becomes 0.6F + 0.75D.

And that's higher than the target of 60%. Anyway, I wrote this here so the argument could be represented a different way for anyone who doesn't see it already.

in Dead by gaslight Comment by smurf June 27, 2025

@Mringasa said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3952261#Comment_3952261
Then why not try something new? Get in there and bodyblock for your team mate. Don't just watch from the sidelines. Don't expect them to use up their Endurance taking a hit for you, YOU take a hit for them.
If you're that concerned with Tunneling, start bringing Borrowed Time. It adds a massive amount of extra for the unhooked. Bring a flashlight and stun them while they're picking up the Survivor. Bring a toolkit, or Sabotage, and take down the hooks. Stop being a sideline watcher recording the "tunneling" going on and be a good Samaritan. Bring Babysitter which is actually quite strong in preventing a tunnel. Stop bringing your 3 Meta Perks and an Exhaustion Perk. Care more for your team mates and less about your own ego.
If you're getting Tunneled a lot, maybe it's you that's the problem? If you flashlight blind every pallet, or act like a toxic idiot, you're probably going to get tunneled out. People always want to focus on this like it happens in every single match, but I only ever see it 1 in 20? 5% is too much? Do you know just how that Survivor was playing? Maybe they actually deserve it for being stupid and trying to get the Killer's attention.
There is no need to address a non-existent issue. Sometimes you get killed. Move on to the next match and play some more.

That doesn't make any sense. The answer to something that requires no skill at all to do from one player and which will very likely completely ruin someone's experience on the receiving end isn't to tell people to bring a perk or to tell those players their teammates aren't doing enough.

I've watched some players immediately break chase and run straight back to an unhook, ignoring the unhooker, and immediately tunnel out their target in spite of the teammate trying to stop it. It's actually also shockingly common for high mobility killers to just go back to unhooks so they get an artificially easier match. And we can't say I don't know how other survivors play because I watch them in chase with Bond. So yes, this is a massive issue and needs to get fixed.

It literally is used by players to simply make the game easier and place themselves into a higher MMR than they're ready for. The very sad thing is that I main Pig and don't feel the need to do this. I had a team yesterday that popped two gens on me pretty fast and then got a third one not long after. I had relatively few hooks by the time the third gen popped. But at no point from the start of the game to the end did I think "Well, I might not win if I don't tunnel the person I get at the end of my first chase," or "Wow, gens are going fast. I better make up for not playing well enough by just running back to the hook and tunneling the easiest target."

If I'm losing at a game, or if I think I'll lose the game if I don't lean on some cheap exploit, that doesn't justify me trying to ruin someone else's experience. Maybe if there were one gen left, it could be okay to think about since by that time everyone got to play the game. But tunneling someone out from five gens, and using tunneling to make up for a lack of skill shouldn't exist in the game.

Having said that, you're right that there are occasional people who are annoying. They're not common, but some players on both sides do bm a lot. And I obviously know how annoying it is to see a survivor teabag or blind at every pallet. If I see my teammate doing that, I honestly think they brought it on themselves. But that's much less common than tunneling.

in What do YOU think BHVR is going to do to address tunneling? Comment by smurf June 27, 2025

@Mringasa said:
Nothing needs done. It's part of the game.
Survivors have options. Tunneling was an issue back in the day, when there was no BT or Haste effect off the hook. Even then though, there were options to deal with it if you found it to be egregious.
Borrowed Time, Babysitter, Decisive Strike, the current anti-tunnel effects on the unhooker, probably a number of other Perks as well. These all can be utilized by Survivors to assist their team. People just don't want to use them because they want to play "efficiently", and helping your team isn't efficient. Maybe be a bit less self-centered, and toss on a Perk to help people other than yourself.
It's not a matter of a game mechanic being bad. It's just a matter of Survivors knuckling up and actually helping each other rather than trying to stroke their own egos while whining about how things are "unfair".

But it shouldn't be part of the game because it is, in fact, unfair to have one player be dramatically more powerful than another and then have that more powerful player abuse that fact to ensure one player can't participate in the game from the outset.

It's also pretty mind-numbing when all a killer can manage to do is run back to the hook. If I can't win chases without abusing the need for two survivors to be in a known location with one of them injured, ensure the injured survivor can't get healed, and then chase the injured survivor so I only have to get one hit to finish the chase, all so I can shift the game into a 3v1 without winning chases against full-health survivors, then I need to get better at the game. I'm currently playing about 40:60 killer:survivor, and I genuinely feel ashamed if I find myself taking someone out too fast. I essentially always just slug someone if they were unlucky enough to be the first target, somehow became the second target, and then get downed again.

It blows my mind that people see it as alright to just essentially tell someone they don't get to participate in the game we all chose to play together with everyone else just because one person thinks they aren't good enough to win if they don't do that. If that's the case, then the killer player is outside their skill range with their chosen killer. Anyway, I'm just tired of seeing people state that something is in the game, so it must be alright to do. Rant over :(

in What do YOU think BHVR is going to do to address tunneling? Comment by smurf June 27, 2025

@LordGlint said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3951379#Comment_3951379
Nah, hopping in a locker for half a second REPELS her crows, not summons them.

lol Would have been funny (and maybe a little infuriating) if getting crows like that led us into some kind of anniversary event effect. Like if there were anniversary crows in matches who did real stuff.

Then we might discover that Tryks was behind it all along :)

in Survivor Is Unplayable Comment by smurf June 26, 2025

@LordGlint said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3951324#Comment_3951324
Forget the obvious?
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/8HQOT00Y0M5L/image.png

What if she's behind the crow epidemic? 🐦‍⬛🐦‍⬛🐦‍⬛

in Survivor Is Unplayable Comment by smurf June 26, 2025

I have to say that I should have seen that coming :)

We can call in The Artist. Her knowledge of all things bird might rival yours. Or she might just like birds...

in Survivor Is Unplayable Comment by smurf June 26, 2025

@hermitkermit said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3951324#Comment_3951324
I like the way you wrote this 🤭 very poetic Smurf, makes me want to paint my face and start speaking in sonnets <3

lol I was trying to write it like an old-timey leader on the radio à la 1920's to 40's style. Glad it kinda worked :D

in Survivor Is Unplayable Comment by smurf June 26, 2025

The incidence of survivors contracting crows during seemingly innocuous activities is alarming. Crows are spreading at an unprecedented rate. It is clear that we, the people of the Entity's realm, must come together to find a way to stop the spread of the public health crisis these crows represent.

It will take the effort of survivors and killers alike. We'll need The Blight's deep knowledge of alchemy, Orela's medical expertise, Mikaela's magic, and David's ability to just punch the birds as they accumulate. Ace is not permitted within 10 miles of the mitigation effort, lest he gamble our efforts away.

But for real though, it's messed up to get crows when you're on a gen or doing the exit gate...

in Survivor Is Unplayable Comment by smurf June 26, 2025

@NightWolfsFury said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3949747#Comment_3949747
This has been a BIG problem with a lot of the older killers. There’s no way to solve this without outright reworking many of the killers into something completely different than who they were.
For example: how do you fix Ghostface…? There’s nothing lore-wise (or license-wise that would be acceptable by the license holder) that allows him to traverse the map quickly.
I guess maybe make him another Houndmaster and allow him to do mini stalks through cameras near survivors and while he follows a path to the found survivor, he goes X faster? Idk. But then you also have to solve every other M1 killer, like Myers, etc.

Ghostie could have an ability called something like 'Two Places at Once', where he would be able to project an image of himself crouching around a corner to make survivors think he's there. Then, under certain conditions, he might be able to gain increased speed to get to another location on the map just a little faster. Lore-wise, that might be a bit like the way he instills fear in people who are even in the same town where he's active, and they're never quite sure where he'll turn up next :D

in What do YOU think BHVR is going to do to address tunneling? Comment by smurf June 24, 2025

@TimberGoingDown said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3950155#Comment_3950155
"IF you die on hook 6, you can definitely still be tunneled.
Survivor One: Hook 1, 2 and 3.
Survivor Two: Hook 4, 5 and 6."
Survivor two wasn't tunneled.

Survivor one was tunneled and then survivor two was tunneled.

in What do YOU think BHVR is going to do to address tunneling? Comment by smurf June 24, 2025

@Nomade said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3949503#Comment_3949503
Why are yall still calling it problematic after all this time? You get tunneled because your the weakest player on the team. Its a natural part of the way the game is played. What you want killers to chase the strongest survivors and ignore the weaker ones, wasting more time and giving the survivors even more of a leg up?

Getting tunneled in like over 90% of cases is a skill issue that is being blamed on the killer because heaven forbid people actually take some responsibility.

Do you mean tunneling at 5 gens, tunneling in egc, tunneling at any time in the match, or something in between?

in "Tunneling is the only way to consistently win" Comment by smurf June 23, 2025

I take a similar approach in the sense that I always keep in mind that I'm playing with other people. If someone is having a bad match already in the early game, I give them chances to keep playing and enjoy their game.

Having said that, I also try for 3k in most of my games and give hatch to the last survivor. My goal is to make sure we all have fun, maintain my MMR to avoid dramatic skill mismatches, and try to do well. In that context, I also usually try to down the fourth survivor before giving them hatch. But my most important goal by far is to make sure we can all have fun :D

in Looking for Opinion: A Different Approach to Playing Killer Comment by smurf June 23, 2025

@horroricon said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3949202#Comment_3949202
you expect the killer to play your way, join in on your fun but the killer might not have fun that way. Sure everyone should be able to have fun but bottom line is not everyone can have fun when 2 sides have different views of what fun is. if you don't run and let the killer get you then you absolutely deserve to be tunneled out lol.

@Scarlett1111 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3948949#Comment_3948949
As someone who has quite literally not taken Bardic off any of my builds since getting it (except to do spiders meme builds), it feels extra miserable when I'm just playing off spawn or near a gen I am near and the killer goes and hard focuses me for just trying to have fun, is the perk mid? Yes. Does that mean I deserve to get tunneled because I chose to not immediately cancel it so you could chase me? Not at all. Is this fairly uncommon? Sure, about 1/4 games, but I know for a fact when someone is playing that silly instrument I am leaving them alone or walking up to them to nod at them in agreement. Everyone deserves to have fun playing the game.

I think there's a good compromise when the killer doesn't want to be playful where the killer waits and watches the song finish before chasing. But when we act all silly, I think we also have to acknowledge that there's a risk involved.

I'll usually try to boop at some point in any match against a Pig. But I have to accept that I might be giving the Pig a free hit if I do it before endgame. Similarly, I kept doing the indoor gen on the new map for a while and would run up on the stage to play a lute for the killer. Sadly, no killers have applauded my efforts :(

But you're definitely not the only one who tries to lighten the mood with the killer. I did get a Xeno to watch me play the whole song outdoors before he hit me and chased earlier. Also, 100% of killers have spared me when I open the secret room on Nostromo and play a lute in there for them :)

in When will killers stop tunneling?? Comment by smurf June 23, 2025

I want to bring a map offering in the Freddy map queue.

in Offerings hidden - rendering the whole feature useless Comment by smurf June 23, 2025

Oh, I know it's not generally PvP, but have you played State of Decay 2?

It's heavily stealth focused. And while it's more of a post-apocalyptic survival game, if you play on the hardest difficulty, you're very unlikely to survive without stealth. Some enemies (or groups/hordes) are also almost always best avoided except when you carefully plan your encounter. And things can always go wrong, especially if you're not careful and get caught at the wrong moment! Very fun and tense :D

in Recommendations? Comment by smurf June 23, 2025

@OPXtreme_ttv said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/448931/recommendations
This is exactly why Lights Out should come back, it was thee Cat and Mouse gamemode, and for some reason its been gone for almost a year

Yes please! I loved Lights Out! It brought back the first bit of horror there's truly been in the game for a long while :D

in Recommendations? Comment by smurf June 23, 2025

@TragicSolitude said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3948981#Comment_3948981
But I find it weird that when people learn about tunneling and camping and how it feels to be on the receiving end, they don't adjust their playstyles :(
My best guess there is that it's a matter of what feels worse to a person: does empathy for the other side make winning when tunneling feel lousy, or does it feel worse for the player when they lose? Survivors themselves may have a hand in which way the killer player leans: the more a killer player experiences bad winners who gloat when the killer tries to spread hooks, the more likely the killer player will have less empathy for survivors.
But that's an educated guess, not a statement of fact.

I'd guess that's most of what plays into it 🙂

in When will killers stop tunneling?? Comment by smurf June 22, 2025

@TragicSolitude said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3948918#Comment_3948918
There is a reason to spread hooks though: None of us should ruin the entire match for other players by tunneling.
I genuinely don't understand why anyone would tunnel as their primary approach from the start of the game, knowing the impact it has on the people they're sharing the game with.
Have you ever watched a new player stream their first matches as killer?
As I said in a previous comment, DbD doesn't teach killers to spread hooks or pressure gens. The most intuitive way to play an elimination game is to take each opponent out one by one.
New players don't think of it as ruining anyone's game, they're just playing the objective. I've seen this in action watching new killer players stream. They're trying to figure out the basics: DbD isn't like anything else, skills and knowledge from other games don't transfer over. In one case, when some people who were long-time players started telling him how to play in chat, to spread hooks, he did try it out. And he lost badly, with fewer kills and a much lower Bloodpoint earning. So he went back to going for each survivor one by one, because to him it made no sense to play to lose.
DbD is not designed for intuitive and/or efficient play to be fun for the opposing side. It's a game design problem made worse by the fact that there's no tutorial to teach people to play un-intuitively (pressuring gens and spreading hooks instead of focusing on the objective of taking each survivor out one by one). The game doesn't give new killer players a thumbs up for getting more hooks. It used to give an "Entity displeased" message for no kills; now it's just "The Entity hungers", which is less morale crushing for new players when they lose, but there's still no glowing praise for prioritizing hooks over kills.
When the game rewards new players for playing a certain way and doesn't even attempt to teach them otherwise, it's only natural they keep playing that way.

That's very true :D

I actually remember when I first started playing and felt a little jarred when someone said "camping is insane!" I didn't know exactly what camping meant, but I guessed correctly and stopped doing it because I realized what experience it might cause for players on the receiving end.

I think a small but useful adjustment would be to decrease bp for hook trends characteristic of tunneling, and increase bp rewards for not tunneling.

But I find it weird that when people learn about tunneling and camping and how it feels to be on the receiving end, they don't adjust their playstyles :(

in When will killers stop tunneling?? Comment by smurf June 22, 2025

@PetTheDoggo said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3948918#Comment_3948918
There is a reason to spread hooks though: None of us should ruin the entire match for other players by tunneling.
So only reason is that killer is supposed to care about survivors, while most survivors don't care about killers…

I never first hook tunnel, unless survivors really annoyed me, which is rare and I don't like when killers do it, so I try to play in away to not annoy them as well.
I think tunneling at 1-2 gens left is reasonable tho.

That doesn't change the fact there is not any logical reason for not tunneling. In many cases, it's simply best thing you can do to win and game gives you no reason to act otherwise.

Sure, it would be good if players on both sides were nice to each other, but they are not. You either need to punish killers for tunneling, which is unlikely to end well for multiple possible reasons, or reward killers for going after fresh hooks before killing a survivor.

I'm not sure I understand what people mean by 'survivors' and 'killers'. Are we talking about players who play both roles and just happen to be playing survivor or killer? Or are we talking about the small number of players who are disproportionately playing one role? It's a genuine question because I think most of us play both roles :D

Either way, I guess my experience is vastly different to what you described. I drop survivors at hooks if they've been unlucky enough to get found repeatedly near the beginning of the game. That way they can get picked up and keep playing. And I find that survivors pretty often want to play around with me as killer, boop, or sometimes show me something in the environment. Maybe that's because I main Pig though.

On the other side though, I'll bring items or perks just to interact with the killer. Most often it's Bardic, Pebble, or a Halloween flashlight :D

I think it is logical though to consider the experience of other players. I've definitely had games where I'm nice to someone that later tries to bm, but most of my killer games end in ggs and glnm style comments.

in When will killers stop tunneling?? Comment by smurf June 22, 2025

@PetTheDoggo said:
Maybe give a reason to spread hooks? There is simply none right now.
Old BBQ did this very well…
Survivors also need to learn to use longer hook timer. I am usually more annoyed by my teammates than killer for tunneling. In most cases, it was caused by survivors imo.

There is a reason to spread hooks though: None of us should ruin the entire match for other players by tunneling.

It's always unreasonable to look at one person playing a game with other people and tell them "You don't get to participate in this game because I'm afraid I won't win if I don't do this."

If I tunnel out the first person I hook and then get a 3k or 4k as a result of that, I'd say that's a 'loss' for me, if there is such a thing as winning or losing in this game. In doing that, I ruin the experience of one of the other players by making them essentially not able to participate in the game. And the match is likely ruined for the remaining players also since if this is done well, the other players have little chance of finishing all the gens as a result of me treating a person poorly and engaging in what is essentially a cheap, easy way to get one player out. I don't see how that's not the best reason by far to not tunnel as a primary approach to the game.

As @AmpersandUnderscore also very accurately pointed out, there are times when tunneling can make sense. If you're in egc, it usually is expected and probably reasonable for the killer to camp and tunnel people. And at that point, everyone has played the game, had the chance to lose their chases for real, and had a chance to enjoy the game. But it's never reasonable to play a game with other people for fun and then essentially make them unable to participate in the game. I genuinely don't understand why anyone would tunnel as their primary approach from the start of the game, knowing the impact it has on the people they're sharing the game with.

in When will killers stop tunneling?? Comment by smurf June 22, 2025

@badgerman97 said:
On Booping: An Open Letter
Dear Survivors,
Booping is an ancient and sacred tradition, and must be treated as such. It must be taken delicately and with Mandy's permission. It is not an easy win tactic nor a get-out-of-jail-free card. Please don't expect me to warm up to you if I've finally cornered you after an entire game of getting pallet dropped and blinded.
Sincerely,
Me

lol I try to control when my survivors will try to boop. My goal is to honor all boops, but also keep my MMR from tanking :D

Also, if someone tries to bm, booping may be pulled off the table ;)

in The Pig Pen Hangout Comment by smurf June 21, 2025

@ArkInk said:
Hope they patch this out entirely. New players must feel awful dying early in chase and getting told they're sandbagging in a game with one of the worst tutorial and skill curve experiences out there.

Actually I think you're right. Now is exactly the time when BHVR doesn't want this to happen. With a huge influx of new players due to the FNAF chapter, DBD needs to be in a state where new players aren't getting warned that they're engaging in bad gameplay just because they're new. That might cause a lot of people to put the game down before they spend much time on it, and then not pick it back up. If it's as bad as it could be considering what we saw in that video, patching this out might need to be one of the highest priorities for BHVR right now.

in Actual Footage of Go-Next Prevention In Action Comment by smurf June 20, 2025

@NikolaiYaroslav said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3946535#Comment_3946535
My friend who plays survivor did three generators, broke a hex totem, escaped and got hit with a DC penalty and lost a grade. That was today. Yesterday, I was playing around as Killer just stalking people with Undetectable and then jump scaring them. Broke some generators, killed 2, let 2 go, and I got flagged for inactivity, hit with a DC penalty and lost a grade (I didn't even think that was a thing for Killers). Don't know what's going with these systems, but if I get punished for playing around in a game then what's the point.

No more goofing off and being friendly? Pretty sure that's the wrong direction for the game. A lot of people get a match where the killer has mercy or just decides to do memes and that can be a fun break from the sweating.

And how am I going to be basement Bubba?

in Actual Footage of Go-Next Prevention In Action Comment by smurf June 19, 2025

It definitely sounded to me like things might get a little heavy-handed with the go next prevention, but this looks absurd. There was also talk of increasing the penalty and even requiring players to complete a certain number of matches normally before decreasing a player's DC timer.

Under the current environment that's a terrible idea. I get occasional server disconnects when my internet is completely fine, but I still get a penalty for it. And I understand that it's not easy or even necessarily possible to distinguish between an intentional disconnect and a server connection error, but such things are frequent enough to regularly punish completely innocent players. Imagine if I tend to get am average of 1/30 games with a server disconnect. Since server disconnects are essentially uncontrolled almost random events, that means that some of the time I'll likely see a penalty, try to play enough matches to reset the penalty, then be unlucky and get a server disconnect again and instead have a longer penalty.

But now players can be punished if they jump over to survivor and get tunneled or even just happen to be unlucky in match. That means that penalties will probably be stacking up for a large number of players who didn't do anything wrong. A likely consequence of this is that players will get their penalty, go do something else, and end up playing the game less, resulting in fewer people who spend time playing DBD.

in Actual Footage of Go-Next Prevention In Action Comment by smurf June 19, 2025

@Iron_Cutlass said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3942824#Comment_3942824
But isn't this a bit of an oversimplification of how current AI models approach responses to prompts?
Yes, yes it is.
But keep in mind that if I provided an insanely technical explanation most people would either fall asleep or just not read it, OR in the case of OP, probably shove it into an AI and ask it to explain it in simpler terms. I kind of just have to dumb things down a bit as a result, as I mentioned before, critical thinking is dead… actually thinking as a whole is dead, just shove it into an AI and let the computer think for you. :(

lol That's fair. "ChatGPT! Please tell me what I think!"

in ChatGBT says survivors bring map offerings more often than killers. Comment by smurf June 16, 2025

@Iron_Cutlass said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3942779#Comment_3942779
Because it's true statistically.
ChatGPT is a Generative AI Language Model.
If you dont know what that means. ChatGPT only predicts the likelihood of the what word is likely to go next and inserting the most likely result, often relying on resources and information found on the information to train.
If the topic is Dead By Daylight, it will use Dead By Daylight as a source and use it compute the likelihood of each word to generate a response. To put it bluntly, it does not understand what DBD is, it's not trained to, it's just calculating what words fits the best next, which can be subject to bias based on what it uses as a source.
So no… it's not statistically right. It does not even use statistics to come to a solid conclusion, it just uses statistics to predict which words look the nicest on a screen so it can get virtual points that internally reward the AI for doing a thing "correctly".
And BHVR doesnt play their own game and asking AI about it proves it.
BHVR does play their own game. They played against many different content creators to showcase 2v8 and have many times played their game in front of other people. As to rather they are skillful or not is subjective, but they definitely do play their own game.
As mentioned before, asking ChatGPT is nothing to go by.
Dear god is this really what the internet is becoming. Istg if I see another "I used AI to determine (thing)" Im going to lose my mind… "Critical thinking is dead." "@Grok what does this mean?" "Context?" AAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHH.

I agree that current AI models can't provide authoritative information about nearly any domain of knowledge. ChatGPT definitely makes mistakes when it's prompted with queries from my field of expertise. And it doesn't seem to have enough clear information from its training data to provide expert knowledge about DBD.

But isn't this a bit of an oversimplification of how current AI models approach responses to prompts?

My general understanding is that current generation LLMs are presented with training data which they classify by detecting properties of different entries in the training data. That's done by application of a complex set of filters which are used to produce a set of values in an 'n-element' vector for each entry in the training data. The filters use a variety of processes to probe different types of patterns in their training set. After the training process, the resulting vector representation of the training data tells how the different elements of the training data are correlated. I imagine the training process is also designed to categorize individual elements in parts of its training data (i.e. words and letters), but I haven't looked under the hood so to speak.

Nevertheless, when a user provides a prompt, the model then uses a similar process to classify ('understand') the prompt in the context of the information it has been trained on. Then it structures a reply based on how the prompt correlates with its classificationof the training data. If I understand correctly, there are some papers published in recent months that show current models are designed to generate a context for each response prior to performing the generation of each word in its reply. That is, the AI determines a set of parameter values to define a broad structure of the theme it will respond with. Then it begins the process of determining which words lead to a representation of the parameters it has calculated that represent the broad structure it will reply with. In that process, certain predefined parameters are optimized which instruct the AI to perform in a certain way. Those parameters are used to inform the type of reply the AI provides in the context of its classification of the prompt with respect to the training data.

That suggests that such models are doing more than determining the statistically likely next word. Instead, they create a large database of relationships between different entries in the training data to determine what things are related to other things in different ways. Then they're designed to place each prompt into the context of the training data, then structure a reply that most likely tells the optimal response to the prompt given the correlation of the training data to the prompt, and the way that text is statistically ordered. In that sense, we can think of it like autocomplete, but the processes used to do that are much more complex than just determining the next word based on statistics.

Correct me if I have that wrong; I'm not an expert in the field :D

Either way, I agree with you. ChatGPT is not an authority on DBD...

in ChatGBT says survivors bring map offerings more often than killers. Comment by smurf June 16, 2025

@HeroLives said:
if they ever nerf nurse to the ground I want to see hag buffed to nurse tyranny levels. Make her a dbd super villain! Why? For the plot.

That's not a bad suggestion for how to nerf Nurse. Once any survivor is sacrificed by the Nurse, a Hag appears on the map and chases the Nurse. Nurse can then be injured, downed, and hooked by the Hag. Nurse, being slower than survivors while not blinking, must then rely on her blinks both to chase survivors and to evade the Hag.

in How many years will it take before Nurse gets nerfed? Comment by smurf June 12, 2025

@Reinami said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3939957#Comment_3939957
BHVR released the outcomes, it is literally counted as a draw and not a win.

Yeah, that's what I remember too.

I think the abandon option is great for the game's health overall since once the match is essentially done, it provides a way to cut short or avoid some of the most annoying/obnoxious things that happen in the game. In that context, I support the killer being able to abandon once all survivors are in an open unblocked gate.

Having said that, I also think the MMR impact needs to be tweaked. It sounds like a lot of people see the MMR result as a defining feature of their match. I don't share that opinion, but it's probably healthier for those that do if the MMR result could more accurately reflect the result of the match.

Also, if abandon is a draw for survivors, there's an obvious exploit: I could bring Plot Twist and try to use it to abandon any time I think I'd lose to avoid my MMR going down.

in Killers should be able to abandon when the gates are powered Comment by smurf June 11, 2025

Only if Trickster gets a custom weapon called Lucille.

in Walking Dead chapter Comment by smurf June 11, 2025

@subdl said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3940402#Comment_3940402
I understand and respect the view that each player interprets the game through their own values and judges whether a match was good or bad accordingly.
However, since DBD is a PvP game in which real human players confront each other with opposing objectives, it’s entirely natural that many players — especially killers, who are outnumbered and bear sole responsibility for the outcome — seek a clear sense of victory and defeat.
From that perspective, it’s not unreasonable to expect that the moment of victory should be accompanied by an appropriate and satisfying conclusion. When that is missing, it’s only natural for players to feel discomfort or dissatisfaction.
My frustration with the current system doesn’t stem merely from the inconvenience of having to deal with bots. Rather, it comes from the emotional disconnection — the sense that the fulfillment of victory is suddenly cut off.
After carefully making decisions under pressure and finally achieving a 4K, you’re told, “The players you were facing have already moved on to their next match. Please handle the rest against AI.”
That moment of triumph is rendered hollow.
Can you imagine how demoralizing that feels?
To make matters worse, if you find the cleanup bothersome, you’re prompted to press a button labeled “Abandon.”
This feels absurd. It’s as if, after winning a chess match, you’re told, “Your opponent has already left. Please either put away the pieces yourself or abandon the match entirely.”
In a real match, both the winner and loser remain present and conclude the game with a handshake.
The idea of the loser vanishing while the winner silently packs up the board — that’s not a proper competitive experience. It lacks closure, dignity, and respect for the match that just took place.
This kind of structure causes significant stress for killer players in particular.
Of course, I don’t deny that everyone interprets the game differently.
But at the same time, I believe many players would agree that a well-designed competitive game must provide an ending that properly reflects the outcome.
In the current state of DBD, survivors — the losing side — move on without witnessing the conclusion, while the killer — the victor — is left behind to do cleanup alone.
That kind of ending is fundamentally broken.
And the fact that the developers failed to anticipate or design around this leaves me deeply disappointed.

Thanks for the well thought out explanation!

I think you make a reasonable point about the cleanup phase. It's pretty normal in most in-person games for an opponent to be able to concede, but there could be a more appropriate reward if the opponents aren't going to stick around.

Only having the option to 'abandon' the match once all opponents have given up could feel a bit like the experience of the game itself was abandoned. It does feel like renaming the button to fit the scenario might help with part of that since it could at least give a sense of the outcome of the game, which is often all that can be asked for in an online game.

Personally, I usually give hatch to my last survivor. There are times when I end up downing two or three in quick succession though, and so they just all abandon. I don't mind so much, but it's true that I can't give hatch in that scenario, so that little joy is missing. But I find that usually doesn't happen, and I very much appreciate the abandon option. But if it were labeled 'Accept Outcome', 'Accept Victory', or or even changed its label for each player, given their outcome, I imagine that might add something in that might otherwise be missing.

in Killers should be able to abandon when the gates are powered Comment by smurf June 11, 2025

@crogers271 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3940427#Comment_3940427
That thread was discussing the abandon feature in the case of a 3 gen.
The last patch clarified that survivors abandoning counted as a loss for them. If the killer abandoning in that situation also made it a loss I'm not sure how any MMR system could handle it.
The posts from Mandy there and the next thread that was meant to clarify things complicated MMR discussions quite a bit.

Thanks for the link to that thread!