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Because it's a subjective hellscape when it comes to making it reportable, especially having something like a generalized "Toxicity is not allowed" rule in the rule list.
Some obvious forms are reportable, like racist and otherwise edgelord tier postgame rage. But anything beyond that... would suck for whoever reviewing reports. Some people barely find anything besides the already bannable stuff toxic, some people find slugging and bringing a good item or perk into a match inherently toxic no matter the context. You need obvious limits, and limits like "don't encourage suicide or do death threats" and "don't be straight up racist" are things the vast majority of people can agree on - the game is better off without that.
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I'd imagine any disconnects that happen after the match is launched will lead to a re-queue timeout once they implement that system after dedicated servers are implemented. Obviously can't know for sure but that should technically punish any sort of offering "dodging", be it moris map offerings or whatever else.
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@TragicSolitude said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/724054#Comment_724054
Wow, you necro'd an old thread.
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/724095#Comment_724095
You are correct, she does not move vegetation. Back when I wrote this, many players (myself included) still mistakenly believed she moved grass. It was soon proven we were wrong. This is an old thread.
Oh lmao, I didn't even realize 😄
I do still like spine chill and iron will though, and I did so in June too so that's something!
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@TragicSolitude said:
Watch for moving grass, watch for birds flying away. When you're inside her terror radius, you can't hear her phase. When you're outside of her terror radius, you can hear her phase (unless she's using an add-on), so listen for that vacuum/whoosh sound.
You can also try equipping Spine Chill. It's the perk a lot of survivors use to avoid being surprised by The Spirit.
She doesn't move vegetation while phasing whatsoever.
Spine Chill is a good perk though that's for sure, and same for Iron Will - which can both help against Spirit. They're not as specialized as many other potential "stealth" perks, so they retain general usefulness in pretty much any build.
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I feel people's personal goals and how competitive they are contributes to it. I am not trying to argue about what's an "objective" win for killers, I'm just saying that two different people might feel differently about the same match.
Yeah, to someone who wants to consistently achieve their goal and win they'll probably want to avoid feeling "helpless" on killers that can be heavily hampered by certain perks, items or if the survivors are experienced enough. To someone who's fine with inconsistency and having "those games" it might be different. I honestly feel the game's design tries its best to make consistency HARD to achieve, as while it's a competitive game by definition it's by no means a game with the top-oriented "esports friendly" style of balancing some games employ nowadays. One match can be perfectly average, then the next the "power" spikes immensely as it's an omegablink nurse vs a 4man swf with 4 syringes or whatever.
And that's another thing, the "high ranks" have a massive variance of skill on both sides. Someone who shrugs it off and moves on if the inconsistency makes them lose at times can still stay there.
But yeah, just gonna go ahead and say that anyone that says anything even close to "I ONLY get toxic ascended 4man SWFs!" are being decieved by negativity bias at best, and straight up spreading disinformation at worst.
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Leatherface because... well, duh. Hag as well.
But Huntress is terrifying in the stairwell as well, especially with bandaged haft / oak haft. She can 1-2 combo people down incredibly quickly while not having much "cooldown time" like at the end of a Leatherface chainsaw attack.
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As survivor, I guess I'm a bit of a generalist? I'm not an ascended looper, but I'm not a master Houdini that can disappear just like that either. And most importantly, I'm not consistent in anything. Some days it's like I predict every mindgame killers try on me and I hit pretty much all greats, other days I mindgame myself while running into a wall as I run away from a gen I blew up. It's pretty fun that way though, and on my "good days" I do feel I'm pretty competent. I'm also that guy that will die for you if I have Borrowed Time and it'll let you get out.
As killer I guess I'm pretty "nice" overall. I don't really care that much about end results like kills or pips compared to having chases I find fun, and when I get survivors that actually try to engage in little mindgames I have the most enjoyable matches for me personally. I think people can play however they want but I choose not to tunnel/camp as it's simply not something I find very enjoyable.
I also tend to not use items/addons besides brown ones. Not because I'm against using them, but because I'm a massive hoarder that wants the collections I have on my Ace and Huntress to grow forever.
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Eh, you're sorta undervaluing stealth. Don't even need a full stealth perk build, but even just Iron Will opens a lot of possibilities. And I'm not talking about creeping around the edge of the map, but making the killer fail to find you when checking a gen, making them waste more time before the chase starts or either completely or temporarily losing the killer during a chase. There's situations where it's a lot harder than others though, based on killer powers, perks and addons.
But once the chase starts, and especially if it's around the stupid non-mindgameable Blood Lodge type pallets, it's only natural that survivors will make every pallet last as long as possible. Even if you disagree with how effective it can be in the current state of the game, blaming the player for doing so isn't the right way to go about it at all.
I feel a nice change would be to cut down hard on the pallets with no LOS blockers or potential for higher brain activity on either side while running them. More tiles with walls, less tiles that are just piles of garbage with a pallet between them... maybe with some sneaky hatchet-sized gaps in them, but that might just be the Huntress "main" in me being a little biased 😄
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@Zixology said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/719539#Comment_719539
If that were the case, then games like COD wouldn't have such big player bases
In the COD community there has been a lot of whining whenever skill based matchmaking is implemented or thought to be implemented.
And while some of the reasons are potentially understandable if they were true at all (like being afraid the game prioritizes skill too much over connection quality) there's a group of people there that genuinely believe "skill based MM makes youtuber videos/streams less exciting because they can't go 50-2 as much" which is absolutely hilarious and pathetic.
The usual "i don't want to sweat every game" and "i want to use weaker guns" is there too of course.
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As said, to prevent EGC from starting, or to prevent blood warden.
It can backfire though. If no one is near the gate and the injured person getting chased has to open it it can get them downed, I've seen it from both sides several times.
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Dailies. If i have one on that killer that is, otherwise it's Rancor time.
I'd rather use any bloodpoint offering to be honest, even a brown one.
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It's a good rule to go by to let the killer initiate any farming games. If they don't, just assume they'll kill you. But if they smack a gen and nod at you then it's farming time 😄
And also, look at it another way. Unless you genuinely get sniped by a billy and then left to die/hard camped to death, double BP doesn't just turn good games into amazing games, it also turns bad games into average/okay games. You're still gaining from it even in games where things go badly for you.
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Hey now, dabbing is for Nurse and Nurse only. She can have the T-pose though.
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More or less like normal, but with a handful of farming games as both survivor and killer.
Luckily haven't ran into the people you just know are going out of their way to deny people points yet, hopefully it stays that way 😄
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I use it in a bit of a self-healing meme build.
Second Wind, Inner Strength, Unbreakable and Adrenaline. I've been having lots of fun with this build, even though I'm not claiming it's "good", viable or whatever 😄
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I don't even know if it's possible to do on an automated region-by-region basis but I feel matchmaking should either be relaxed in regions with lower player counts/an imbalance of killers and survivors. Either immediately upon search, or simply speed up the already existing mechanic where it widens the acceptable rank range the longer you've searched.
I'm not talking rank 1 vs rank 20, but just increase the range of rank compositions it considers acceptable. Assuming there's not some ascended way to abuse it intentionally of course.
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@Rin_is_my_waifu said:
Git gud survivor main
Their post is 100% about the potential monotony of going against one killer over and over. Going against the same killer all the time can get boring no matter which killer it is, they didn't say anything whatsoever about balance or Spirit being a bad thing herself lmao
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@Warlock_2020 said:
Honestly, one of the biggest reason the forums are so divided is because BHVR refuses to mitigate it. They limit personal attacks, but allow silly posts about "Survivor Mains this" "Killer Mains that" and it only further divides the community. If you are someone who plays both, but favors one side due to personal reasons, you see it much more clearly.
If BHVR deleted the posts that focus ONLY on accusing one side or the other of childish/toxic behavior, I think much of the divide would fade to a tolerable level. Just look through the forums and you will see scores of pointless posts that do nothing but demonize the other side. Those are allowed to grow and fester.
I don't mind the terms themselves as obviously people can use them to describe themselves, and everyone can have fun poking at obvious stereotypes at times.
But any posts that basically use "you're a <role> main" as an actual arguement should a lot of the time automatically be considered trolling if you ask me. When that's the core message of a post it usually doesn't add anything of value to the conversation other than someone screaming into the void at someone that dares to disagree with them.
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@RinWaifu said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/714472#Comment_714472
LOL, if they want to play casually them play KYF, atleast try to defendes CheatWithYourFriends
Implying using VOIP apps is cheating is completely unproductive and a waste of time. It has been explicitly stated on this very forum that it's not considered cheating by the developers themselves.
@Peanits said:
Third party programs are only at risk if they are not authorized by us. We have stated in the past that voice chat is okay to use. As a result, voice chat is not cheating.
But assuming it was, how would we enforce this? How can you prove that people aren't communicating with their phones, or by playing in the same room as one another? You would end up in a mess of finger pointing and there is absolutely no way to prove it. We would be banning people purely on speculation, and that is not something we want to do.
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Some competitive "animosity" can be healthy, as it is a game about beating someone that wants to beat you afterall. Obviously while you're in a match it is you vs them, and that's fine as that is very accurate.
But some people take it from a competitive mindset to straight up rabid tribalism that they take out of the game, complete with cheering anything that's negative for the "other tribe" just because "bad happen to them = good" or something. Those people seriously need to take a break from PVP games entirely if you ask me.
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@MemberBerry said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/714512#Comment_714512
You're sarcastic, right? A SWF team has a much higher chance of winning because of coordination potential.
That's not a mechanical difference.
A mechanical difference would be something like SWF having repair speed penalties or as OP proposed, that they can't rank up or gain BP. The things that makes SWF strong aren't mechanical advantages because as you said, it comes primarily from their ability to coordinate.
As far as the game is concerned SWF is just a way to put several people to the same lobby and nothing more.
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Cheating in a slug race? That's a capital crime right there 😡
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A lot of people are probably planning to use 2x BP to deck their Demogorgon out with some nice perks, I'd expect quite a bit of Demo during and after the event to be honest.
Then there's people that don't own the DLC, simply don't like playing it or are "too competitive" to use demo I guess.
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I'll probably farm from time to time and play normally otherwise. My normal playstyle is pretty nice and fair anyway I guess, but I won't expect others to do anything but play normally unless they prove otherwise.
The way I see it people can play however they want. Just don't be one of those people that go out of their way to deny others of points to get a fix of schadenfraude.
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@snowflake102 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/714505#Comment_714505
I know that :) but it's just my opinion doesn't mean it won't happen I'm just upset that players complain about every change that the devs do.
I mean I totally agree with you there. People are way too negative and blow nerfs/buffs completely out of proportion for example.
It's quite understandable that people complain if they suddenly get longer queues than before though, and the people that seem happy about it just because it hits survivors/SWF the most doesn't help with the cringy cycle of hostility either 😄
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No.
There's no mechanical difference between solo and SWF as far as the game itself is concerned, and that won't ever change.
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If you want people to go back to lobby dodging to get their friends as solos like they did before SWF was added, go ahead. What you propose would make people wait longer between games than ever, as between the people that simply stop playing the game and the people queue-sniping their friends there will be a lot of extra waiting for everyone else that plays the game.
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When I'm being hard camped, with Kindred, and yet I see 2-3 auras crouching within 20 meters of the hook.
That's the only thing that gets to me that hard.
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@Warlock_2020 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/713776#Comment_713776
And I've seen killers who intentionally derank to destroy low tier survivors. Again, that power role to the extreme. Nothing like an expert Billy or Nurse destroying a bunch of rank 18s while rank 18 themselves with full t3 perks. Most even admit it.
There's quite a few hilariously hypocritical mixes of opinion out there when it comes to deranking. People excusing "their side" for doing it because they "don't want sweaty lobbies" or "don't want to go against so many nurses and spirits", while demonizing whoever playing the other side as bullies that want to play omegablink + mori against rank 19s or military grade SWF death squads wanting to bully fresh installs.
It's bad no matter who does it, and even worse when people delude themselves into believing it's okay when they do it, but not when their opponents do it.
EDIT: Not accusing you of thinking like this in any way, just agreeing. All sorts of people do it, and some people don't even have the balls to just own the fact they do it and need to make up flimsy justifications for it.
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Sounds like some sort of actual disconnect/crash. Either that or someone "good guy" deranking by playing most of the match that has truly mastered the art of the perfectly timed DC.
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There is no perfect solution. No matter what someone will be "screwed" in one way or another, so it's just up to the devs to decide which is the "lesser evil" so to say. Personally the only bad thing I've noticed are longer survivor queues, as I usually play survivor with people that are around my rank (and if they haven't played for a bit, around or above my skill level anyway). For others it might of course be different.
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@Tucking_Friggered said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/713817#Comment_713817
2 in 10 you might be speaking on behalf of. The other 8 in 10 I point towards. I'd wager 1/2 of the 2 in 10 you represent are simply groups incapable of bullying anyone because they lack the talent.
I mean with that mindset I can only imagine you have a very loose definition of the word "bullying". Playing with someone else doesn't immediately give people some sort of brain virus that makes them a twat in-game.
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Well, two quick tips I guess.
Mix it up. Mindgames like doubling back are good and all, but you don't want to make your unpredictable action predictable. Sometimes you try trickery, sometimes you try brute force and just hold W. And mix up the mindgames too. Fake that you're doubling back, that sort of thing. Don't become too predictable.
And also learn which pallets are safe and which are unsafe. A survivor commiting to some unsafe pallets basically means you will hit them if you play it right, and on the Badham reworks and the new map there's quite a few pallets like this. But do not fear pallets, ESPECIALLY the safe ones. You want them gone.
And a Billy-specific tip that sort of goes into the unpredictability - fake your chainsaw charge sometimes by pallets. Survivors don't know if you're keeping your chainsaw at 95% or 5%, and they might get greedy and go for another loop which can let you cancel your chainsaw and get a M1 on them.
I can't really give spirit tips, but there's lots of people that play her on here. Hopefully they can give you some tips 🙂
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What sort of utterly ascended mindset makes people happy someone has annoyingly long wait times? Is this some consequence of only playing one side or what? Either way it's just straight up pathetically petty.
Believe me I was annoyed by long killer queues and I greatly appreciate that they are shorter, but this doesn't have to be some zero-sum game.
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EGC doesn't care who it favors, it's only there to put a hard limit on how long the game can go on for. Sometimes it benefits the survivor, sometimes the killer.
And a little tip if you're trying to open the gates after the hatch is closed: do juuuust enough progress on your chosen gate that the first light doesn't turn on, hide and wait for the killer to come check, and then commit to it. Cuts down the time you spend while commiting and it has honestly saved me several times. And oh, pray the killer doesn't have Whispers of course, in that case they came prepared and you're screwed 😄
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It's not "good", but it's a really fun perk to mess around with. You can pull off some great plays with it, the first time I jumped in a locker with quick and quiet and bonked the killer on the head just as they realized where I went it was hilarious... and every time afterwards too. It's like Diversion, a lot of the time it won't work but when it does it's fantastic 😄
It's genuinely sorta useful to escape the basement at times too. If good old Leatherface is waiting by the stairs, just get in a locker. When he comes for you just bonk him in the face and run out of there.
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As said it's not so wiggling free is something common, but to make sure the killer can't be too selective with their hooks. Imagine if the killer could take you basement or hook you in the middle of their 3gen or something every time they downed you no matter where you went down.
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@Mochan said:
I see too many killers seeing the glass half empty.
Sure, you got hit by DS even though you weren't tunneling.
BUT that just means you're absolutely killing it in game because you just hooked and downed two people in under a minute. What's not to be happy about?
Pretty much this.
Even if you do genuinely down people so fast that you get hit by DS after hooking someone else, getting rid of a DS while you actually have someone else on a hook is the absolutely best time you can possibly do it.
Picking up one, one on the hook and at least one going for the save, so at absolute most one survivor working on a generator when it happens unless it's near the end of the game and they're going for some adrenaline play.
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It's a necessary "evil", blame the people that abused the system for malicious purposes.
If you really want to and you're on PC you could just start a new Steam account and family share to it unless I'm mistaken. You'll start with a fresh account and it'd still be unfair, but no point sticking our heads in the sand pretending it's not an option.
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99% of the time I just go "Darn, should've remembered that was the recently unhooked person and left them on the ground for a bit"
As I don't tunnel on purpose, but obviously I'm gonna hit someone that basically runs in my face. And sometimes my goldfish memory makes me just forget it's the guy that was unhooked 40 seconds ago 😄
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Because it's completely unfeasible to actually prevent people from communicating with eachother if they want to.
Not only would checking people's systems for VOIP apps be a very unpopular move, but if all else fails they could just use discord, skype or something else on their phone. And that's without getting into how Steam itself has voice chat, and the same for consoles (not sure about Switch to be honest, but for Xbox and PS they have their own party chat systems). People that are geographically close could even just go full LAN party and play in the same room if they wanted to.
@Bloodlust_Gamer69 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/711277#Comment_711277
You could remove swf
Already been mentioned, but people just lobby dodged and queue-sniped eachother until they found eachother before SWF was added. Sure, you could punish lobby dodging, but I'm sure killers wouldn't be thrilled about being forced to play against 4 confirmed to be competent solo survivors with pimped out toolboxes and thousands of hours each.
And that's without even getting into how a game like DBD not having a play-with-friends mode would make it a lot less appealing to potential new players.
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Both. Know how to run, but know when to lay low as well.
Some killers and situations change it though. Against Nurse you probably want to avoid detection whenever possible, and if you're confident you're the strongest runner in the lobby it's pretty good for the other survivors if you go out of your way to make the killer chase you instead of them.
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Discussing which level of play the game should be balanced around is a genuinely interesting topic, but applying mechanical differences to the game based on the ranks in a lobby is an incredibly arbitrary and forced way of doing it.
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For survivors it'd be Ace or Kate, simply because I like how they look and some of their cosmetic options. Ace is also pretty quiet by default, which is nice. Special mention to Jeff for being pretty cool too.
For killers I find Huntress the most fun, but when it comes to the artsy side of things it'd be Demogorgon or Myers. I'm just a bit of a sucker for the unique sound design they've got going on, and they look good too. Spirit's almost up there too, very cool and well done design.
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Toxic people are toxic, yep. Not to mention that people have wildly varying definitions of what they consider "toxic", so there will always be conflict.
To me nothing that is working as intended, isn't being a rage goblin in chat and not straight up cheating in some way is toxic. If people want to tbag, leave everyone to bleed out or "play for salt" in general that's their decision and not mine, even though I personally find the latter kinda pathetic. My opinion doesn't matter if that's what they want to do and it's not against any rules.
To someone else slugging is inherently toxic, to yet another person using strong perks is toxic, and then somewhere in the back there's someone who thinks hardcore trash talk is 100% fine and just part of the "banter". There's going to be disagreements.
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Try to not be the first survivor that gets found and especially hooked. If the killer genuinely has camping + tunneling on their mind from the start, this alone will massively decrease the odds that you end up being the one on the recieving end.
You can also bring DS + Instaheal to make killers have to work as much as possible for it if they want to tunnel you. If a killer tries to speed a kill up by proxy camping + tunneling instead of straight up camping that can still lose them the game if the survivor they're chasing has the right tools and knows what they're doing, especially if they recieve borrowed time from other survivors.
The obvious "just rush gens" is a thing too, but I understand that when a killer truly hard camps and that seems to be the only option it's horribly boring and uninteractive if everyone approaches the situation right, so I tried to give more individual-focused tips. Killer just stands there and gets no altruistic survivors to punish, survivor on the hook at most mashes spacebar, and the other survivors just hold m1 on gens.
I wouldn't trust automated systems to decide what counts as camping or tunneling in the first place, outside of blatantly obvious stuff like "if the killer stays within 10 meters while there's no survivors on the same continent as them". And that's already punished by emblems as well as them essentially throwing the game emblem-wise and usually kill-wise as well.
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@Mr_K said:
Range addons decrease the charge time to distance ratio. To properly balance, the ratio should remain the same as base. You want to go further you have to charge more.
4 and 5 blinks def need to go. 3 blinks will probably stay due to the achievement requirement and bhvrs unwillingness to change them.
This. Range add-ons should increase the charge cap if anything. Allowing the Nurse to charge longer than usual before hitting full charge, and therefore going further. Hell, with this method I'd even be fine with an ultra rare that gives tremendously increased blink range (or "blink charge capacity" rather). Eliminates the extended range indirectly buffing the charge-distance ratio and blink movement speed.
A further bonus of this is that when it comes to muscle memory it would have the same charge-distance ratio as base nurse, so putting on or taking off the add-ons wouldn't feel any different.
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That's how you make people play in the most boring way possible for both sides - simply running from pallet to pallet and dropping it early, or just humping the strongest/least mindgameable structures as hard as possible. Because if this was implented "right" it'd just make jukes and losing the chase a truly unrealistic option.
Mindgaming and juking is the last thing you want to nerf if you want chases to be interesting and fun. When both players participate in them that's chasing at its best.
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Because they're mad about something. That's it.
Does it justify being a twat? Not at all, they're idiots that need to control themselves or just get themselves banned as fast as possible. But that's it for the vast majority of cases, it's not some deep evil conspiracy.
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@Blueberry said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/707198#Comment_707198
Yes, "steal his 4k".
If the second to last player suicides to give hatch when it would have otherwise been a 4k.
"There's nothing to steal, kills and escapes aren't deserved until they're fully carried out"
That was a kill without him suiciding. That was earned because he had the 4 man. I never said it wasn't within the games boundaries but it's extremely unsportsmanlike. Being unsportsmanlike is fine, but then don't complain about slugging and dragging the game out as long as possible because then he's just playing the game how you started it.
I'll agree that since it was a doc in particular with I. King and I assume he shocked everyone enough to apply Restraint to them, hiding for the remaining time of bleedout/hook time would be unlikely. Not impossible as we can't know the skill level of the players involved, but probably fairly negligible odds.
I see your point even though I don't think suiciding on hook in that situation is unsportsmanlike in particular, to me it's more another form of altruism in a way that can be prevented by slugging. So I guess it's more of a case of conflicting views on the situation(s) at play.