danielmaster87
danielmaster87
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I don't think so. As survivor, it's balanced, but then the matchmaking just gives you a killer who's actually trying, and teammates who clearly aren't. If it weren't for that, survivors would be dominating every single match. Their best meta perks ever are still meta after like 8 years: DS, Dead Hard, Prove Thyself, Adrenaline, Unbreakable, OTR a bit later. Why? Because they're strong. You can say they're not strong, but I think their results speak for themselves, especially in swf. People say the maps have gotten weaker; I don't see it. If you put on Windows or Zanshin, you can see how closely spaced all the pallet and window loops are. I mean, you get the killer to break 1 pallet while he's chasing you, that's already a bad, potentially game-losing chase for him. Your teammates and you just need to be efficient, and even then, if you're efficient in looping OR on gens, just being good at either one will do. Sometimes it feels like perks make a big difference, like you could have really used Unbreakable against a slugger, or DS against a tunneler. But if you see those scenarios so often, or you're afraid of those strategies, just bring those perks, regardless of if you get to use them in your other matches. Not every build is gonna work for every opponent. Just waste as much of the killer's time as possible, and you've done your part for the team. If your team still loses, such is the nature of the role. You've got to be good as an individual player AND as a team, otherwise why should the killer who's playing really well lose?
As killer, there's almost no good slowdown anymore, so you either have to get a team who will allow you enough time to use those perks, or just be downing people every 20-30 seconds. None of that is in your control. When you tunnel or slug, it goes a little bit towards you having some actual control. But in general I'm just seeing really efficient killer play vs inefficient survivors, and they're still having close matches, because the balance game plan has been to make the uncarryable survivors carryable. So when you do go against good survivors, especially swf, it's like wow, how do you even get more than a draw against them, ever? Literally being their plaything for 5 or 10 minutes, as they're doing stupid stuff in your face at no cost to gen efficiency. They can decide at any moment to just focus gens, and then they're done and the survivors are all out. I know because I've done it in solo in losing matches, like wow, we could have had 2 people jump on gens at any time and finished these last 2-3 gens. 1 survivor knows how to loop, you could lose the whole game, because if their teammates are on gens, that basically equates to gen efficiency.
I would not be asking for comeback mechanics or "better" balancing to make the killer weak enough for us to win. I just want good teammates so we can take advantage of this broken game state and win. If killer's always going to be a sweat fest, at least let us experience the other side of that coin when we switch to survivor. Or if survivor's always going to be difficult, at least give a reason for it, as in making the killer strong. If neither side is happy with their roles, then how is the game balanced?
I've never had less interest in playing the game. I spend more time on here talking about it, than playing it. And even then, that's dropped in frequency. So I think we've got a long way to go for it to be balanced. Bring an outsider and show them this game, and they'd never claim it was balanced.
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@MoZo said:
Trickster, nurse and hag. Trickster and nurse are very difficult for me to play since I play on controller and I don’t enjoy missing my power over and over because im handicapped to using plastic joysticks to aim and flick my camera. Hag’s gameplay has always and will always until they rework her feels incredibly boring. I don’t find joy and fun in camping/locking down a area of the map and wait for survivors to fall into my web of traps.
Oh yeah, I forgot about Trickster. You'd have to be playing on PC just to play him, because the aiming scheme with the left hand/right hand alternation is just stupid, AND you have to be turning your camera at the same time to keep in line with her survivors, especially at point-blank. And then his knives simply dissolve on their own, like what is that?
I actually like Hag quite a bit. I like the set-up killer alternative to Trapper. I don't know how she's boring to play as. Her gameplay pretty much forces you to sweat and juggle 10 things every single match, with survivors constantly tripping your traps at inopportune times. And everyone using exploits to not have any change in speed or direction when they trip traps on purpose, basically making you chase as a 110% every single time you insta-tp to them. If a killer is supposed to have an instant tp, it needs to be INSTANT, and not allow survivors to get away after they clearly fell right into your trap. How few tp tokens she has is another annoyance. I could go on. I like playing against her though, to at least feel how strong that counterplay is against her. For some reason, I'm always the sole player on my team who knows how to play against her.
And if you want my views on Nurse, it's somewhere around here.
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@ManOMaker said:
(or never play again!)
Unfortunately some characters are just straight up bad or have a bad reputation with them.
Personally I'll never play Sable, no hard feelings just don't like her. And I'll also probably never touch Chucky, he isn't that great right now and I don't think I'll ever see the appeal unless I'm somehow able to get him completely for free.
I never play Leatherface. I mean, I have. But that was like 2019 or something stupid. I just can't stand bumping into something and then getting self-stunned, over and over. Especially* in a game where the killer's objective is to cut the loop more efficiently than the survivors, or else they never get caught. I get that that's kind of the skill in it, like with Hillbilly, learning how efficiently you can cut loops without bumping. But I just don't like that, in any killer. I do play some of them, like Demogorgon or Wesker, but their powers are a bit more lenient to hit.
I also really don't like Nurse. Don't like playing as her, don't like playing against her. You just have to guess where the survivors are going to be. If you're a card player, you can just dominate with her. If not, the survivors will ALWAYS be just a bit too far from your reach, or the game won't let you go through a single rock or something, as the survivors are running faster than you (great design! 👍). 🤦♀️
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@WolfePhD said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3902833#Comment_3902833
Most, if not all of his 2v8 buffs should go to live servers. His gun shoots too slow and takes far too long to reload.
You meant he was overnerfed then. We are in complete agreement. His gun is way too slow to pull up, he needs reload or miss cooldown add-ons base, and I haven't seen any arguments that justify his nerfs from way back when, except "He was uncounterable at loops" and "He was S tier." Explain how, if he never saw ANY play at high level or tournament. This is just like the nerfs to Freddy or Chucky, legit nerfing the weakest killers in the game. He's really fun to play in theory, too, as he was before his nerfs. But after just 1 or 2 matches with him, every time I'm like, "I'm done." Too frustrating for too little reward.
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Explain to me how information equates to ez mass slugging potential. My guess is it's all based off the idea that if a killer sees you, he gets you (just because he's faster, or something). We know that's not true, because people loop like crazy in this game all the time. What's more, everyone is capable of doing it. Think about the level of player you're advocating for. They KNOW that if the killer finds them, they're going down instantly, which doesn't buy their team enough time, and then they lose. Why would you recommend anything other than those players getting good? Why should their matches against good killers who are capable of slugging result in a close match? They're not even playing good themselves.
And you make it seem as if slugging is simplistic. It's not. A killer who is slugging 1 to go for another obviously has weighed that it's a more worthwhile endeavor than hooking the person they just downed. That takes thinking, way more advanced than, "The tutorial said I should hook, so I'll just do that." The ones thinking about killer one dimensionally like that, just going for hooks and max gen defence every time, have been left behind. They only ever win vs uncoordinated/weak teams, because the slowdown is only as good as the killer's ability to get downs constantly, which ultimately is in the survivors' hands.
What you're suggesting is super inconvenient for the killer player. There's already tons of killer powers which can't be used close to hook, or they have to stand back from an obstacle to use it, or there's a really long cooldown on it. Nobody likes having to deal with that. They pick one killer, as opposed to any other, because they want to use that specific power. Being dictated that you're only allowed to use it sometimes* is so annoying.
And really, this is another example of "Hate Skull Merchant no matter what." We're not liking her design because it seems really weak and not consisting of any good ideas. Simultaneously, you're not liking her design because you're assuming she's gonna be too strong. How can that be?
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It's an obvious cop out choice.
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@iloveandhatethisgame said:
why do people think this?
Because what streamers are broadcasting and what players are experiencing are like worlds apart, quite often. Imagine you get on as killer and get endless close, sweaty matches, like not 1 of them is chill except 1 in like 50 matches. Then you see what the popular steamers are doing: The survivors take like 5 minutes to do the first 2 gens, they get hit through pallets, they never bait anything or run tiles efficiently, don't bring any good perks, hiding fails, etc. And they don't have to bring any good perks to beat these survivors. In other words, the survivors these streamers get are way below what you're getting, and you both play the game a lot, maybe even similar amount of hours played. It's fishy, so people start to theorize, and it doesn't take long before they conspiracy theory that the devs or the streamers themselves are artificially lowering their MMR somehow. I know they get the privilege of a steamer mode, where you can't be put in a lobby against cheaters or something. Maybe that's where it all started.
At this point, I don't really care that their MMR is lower. It's just that it is, in fact, lower. Makes no sense how I can get looped for a 45 seconds at shack, and these steamers' survivors can't loop it more than 10. So what we have to do as a community is sort of agree upon what constituents or indicates skilled/knowledgeable play, and use that to determine opponents' caliber, this determining our own, depending on whether we beat them or not. The problem with that is that it's too much thinking for the average person who plays this game, because they'd much rather be content with "That streamer wins all the time, and that alone means he's good." If we had transparent matchmaking or better win conditions, there'd be no problem. But the devs and a big part of the community love ignorance, because it fosters theories and arguments and football-esq tribalism.
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Really any Michael Myers, Leatherface, and Freddy skins. I was waiting for a Halloween Kills Myers outfit. More original cosmetics for Ghost Face would always be cool. Pyramid Head should get the movie outfit. Pinhead could get other Cenobites as skins, specifically Butterball as @100PercentBPMain has said. There's multiple variations of Xenomorphs for skin ideas. Vecna definitely needs more cosmetics, and there's so much potential. Same thing with Dracula.
Laurie could definitely get a new outfit from one of the several Halloween movies she's in. Bill could get skins of other Left 4 Dead characters. Quentin could get a Glen or Nancy skin from the first movie. A more movie-accurate Detective Tapp, or the cop from the second movie, could be cool. Ash has multiple looks he could take up, or he could have skins of other Evil Dead characters. The sheriff or Winona Ryder's character from Stranger Things could be cool, or 11's "father." Cheryl could get multiple character skins, like that of the evil cultist lady from SH3. Plenty of Resident Evil character skin options, my favorite that people have suggested is Barry. Nick Cage has a ton of looks he could have. Ripley probably has my favorite potential for skins. Plenty of characters from Aliens could be used: Hicks, Vasquez, Bishop, Burke even. Her Alien 3 look is kinda cool, or it could be Morse or Dillon (I was hoping the Alien map would have been the tunnels area or something from 3). Elgyn from Alien 4 could be cool, or Raymond Cruz's character, or Winona Ryder's character (again). Endless possibilities from Dungeons & Dragons. And many character skins options for Belmont.
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@vol4r said:
The walking dead… please bhvr
Literally infinite possibilities for characters from that show.
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I very much enjoy looping. Abusing broken setups can be fun, but I really like knowing what the killer can do and then using that to counterplay him, especially the niche killers . So playing against Wraith, Hag, Doctor, Demogorgon, Wesker, Unknown, etc are some of my favorites.
When Wraith goes to body block you at a window, you can anticipate that and run the loop another way/run away from the loop, and he then has to adapt himself. You can also do the vault/slide spam against him so he has to uncloak, or call his bluff at 99'ing his uncloak at a pallet. Hag really gets destroyed when you wipe away or trip her traps, so that she doesn't have time to set up her web or push survivors into it, so I love being the disruptor and giving my team (who almost never know how to play against her) a fighting chance. Doctors will try to be greedy and not break any pallets, because they have their shock, and that can lead to you looping some really busted setups. You're even safer against him if you just predrop everything. With Demogorgon and Wesker, you're really just baiting them or denying them on their shreds/dashes, but making them use it and then dodging at the last second, or running a loop a way that they can't use it. Wesker is a special case because in his time in-between rushes, that's when you can really mess with him, like running around a single object to make him miss or go into cooldown, unless he's got the Egg add-on which would make him even more tricky to counterplay. Unknown, playing as and against him, is about learning the bounce trajectory, the line of sight (as with all ranged killers), and the explosion radius. If he has you Weakened, it's just a matter of outlasting him until you stare at him enough. You can even run at him to deny him the shot, because it's so hard to hit.
A lot of these loop setups and counterplays, I'll get annoyed at when I'm playing as the killer, but a lot of them like the 99'd unlock bluff vs Wraith or the predrop vs Doctor are really fun, because they encourage either mindgames or counterplay that actually costs you something. It's good design, which a lot of this game lacks. It's not good design when you loop a 110% killer around 1 obstacle (not even a loop) for 15 seconds, or disable the killer's power the entire match with free items like Singularity and Xenomorph.
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@Firellius said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3901602#Comment_3901602
If you're not going to take applicability into account at all and presume that the opposing party does everything they can to maximise the perk's value, which you'd need to put DS that high, then the obvious pick for best killer perk would be Devour Hope.
But in a more general, applicable sense, something like DS would probably be bottom half, and STB probably in the bottom quarter. Something more easily accessible like Sprint Burst or Lithe would be my pick for best survivor perks.
And in general applicability for killer perks, I'd say either Pain Res or Corrupt.
A hex? No way. That's like the least reliable thing in the game. And there's no real "wasting" DS's value. It gets max value pretty much every time it's used, in tunneling situations and non-tunneling. You just stun the killer and force him to go on another chase to kill you, or he leaves you after you use it and basically wasted a chase. Even if you DS him and then just stand there to be instantly downed again, you still ruined his momentum.
Sprint Burst and Lithe are decent, but I'd rather give a chase, DS the killer, and go on another chase than last a bit longer in 1 chase.
But this is the first somewhat logical pushback I've seen. If all these people disagree with my perk picks, or my critique of other people's picks, they should at least make an argument for it. I'm fine having an unpopular opinion - as long as I'm not the only one to give an opinion.
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@Aven_Fallen said:
No. This is just a myth done by people who think that they are better than they actually are. There are content creators who stream for 6 hours a day, winning most of their games. Do you really think they will sit there for several more hours, just losing every game? Come on.
The reason that it looks like they go against weaker opponents is simply because the MMR is really bad. Most players (who are not new) will most likely be at the Soft Cap. And once you reach the Soft Cap, you might be at the bottom of it, but you are paired with everyone else who is above said Soft Cap. This includes Content Creators who might be at a really high MMR.
Well, they're getting bad players somehow. Probably via what you explained in the second paragraph.
I'm always amazed that MMR is so low of a priority in topics of discussion, for dev and player alike, when it creates 50% of the game's problems. Like, a lot of this stuff we debate about all the time, we don't have to do it, if only they'd just make the MMR better. They haven't even begun to refine it. They brought it to the game and it was nearly perfect, then they destroyed it by making it way less strict a few months or a year later to cut down on queue times, and since then we've gotten nothing else on it except for "team MMR" a while back, which evidently didn't do anything to help.
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@Chiky said:
No screaming does, It now makes screaming useless unless you're playing with headphones...
And even then, stuff like Scene Partner is omnidirectional for some reason. Even though they're literally screaming AT you, they're perfectly hidden and you have to guess what direction they're in. Makes no sense.
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They're terrible. It's like they spitballed ideas, and just went with the first one. This is not going to be a functional killer if it comes to live. She will not get kills.
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@xGodSendDeath said:
Not a fan of hacking the drone giving aura reading. SWF can just have someone follow her around disabling them like Trapper and basically having constant aura on her. I'm sure the drone will control like crap for how easy it should be to hit conceptually.
No strong feelings towards Skull Merchant either way but I'm not a fan of designing everything towards the bottom of the barrel survivor players that can't be hard pressed to even think for 5 seconds while killers in this game are designed to be clunky and feel awful to use, especially on console.
Who would've thought punishing a killer for using their ability by giving the survivors free aura would be a bad idea?
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I guess I mained Hag and Deathslinger years back, but after every team I went against somehow knew exactly how to counterplay Hag without fail, and Deathslinger lost everything that made him good (the smaller TR and the quickscope), I dropped them for... I guess the killers that were buffed in 5.3.0.
I had mained Trapper when I first started playing the game, thought I was good with him, and then just lost over and over, because his weakness caught up to mine. With the new buffs the update provided, I started playing him again.
Never really played much Myers, but when they buffed his Vanity Mirror to be basically Scratched Mirror, just with a small terror radius and regular movement speed, I became kind of attached to it. I wanted to see how far I could get playing M1 killer, thinking the add-on would help since it gave me basically wall hacks mid-chase. That experience improved my chase skill like crazy.
Never played much Pig either, but when her add-ons got buffed and she could now have an actual functional dash attack, I wanted to test her out. I quite enjoyed it.
The Plague is always gonna have that issue of the puke being really bad with not hitting survivors you're clearly hitting, and taking forever to fully infect someone without the infection add-ons. But her add-on pass encouraged me to experiment with her, and honestly the Prayer Tablet Fragment joke add-on is not bad. I almost prefer it to normal Plague.
And Blight, especially. Once they reworked Adrenaline Vial to where the turn reduction wasn't as bad, I used it all the time. I tried it with Crow so that the turn reduction didn't matter as much, and of course with the Umbra Salts (because it still kind of needed it). But I remember having so much fun with Adrenaline Vial, actually being able to land rush attacks, and having lots of them. In a rare instance on this game, I exclaimed "I feel strooooong!" after a certain satisfying victory, like that black guy in that DriveTime commercial. | They also buffed Summoning Stone, a really unique add-on that was like a mini Blood Favor but for rush hits only. But I guess they were both "broken" add-ons though, because they've been nerfed into nothingness at this point, and I'll never forgive the devs for that. Some pretty good add-ons ruined by casual complaints and the devs' refusal to nerf Blight's PC turn rate, and instead punish the people using add-ons which doesn't even solve his issues.
Ended this on a somewhat negative note, but this was a good trip down memory lane. We didn't know how good we had it.
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@Inosennatoki said:
It looked like biggest nerf for her.
They remove effects- Hindered, Haste, Lock on and Claw trap.
They still give free aura revealing for survivor.
The number of drones has been reduced from 6 to 5 too.
Yeah, they can not only hack drones to disable them (because what player doesn't love having their power disabled all match?), but it also reveals the killer for free. What's even the logic on that? They're such expert hackers, of this completely unique technology that only Skull Merchant would understand, that they not only shut the thing down but also hack the whole system to get a visual on her? How does that even make sense, unless it's assumed that there's always a drone looking at her, which there isn't?! And then they reduce the drone count. They do love their arbitrary power count reduction on killer nerfs, like how Freddy still has less dream pallets now than when the concept was first implemented in 2019, because clearly that's what made "S tier" reworked Freddy "OP," hence why it was included in the nerf to that version.
I don't think we can expect Skull Merchant to be viable at all. I knew that was always gonna be the case, but now we can prove it since we have a blueprint to the new, "fixed" version.
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These proposed changes are really cringe. Let's just ignore that the visual examples for this wannabe triple A game were done in MS paint, with literal stick figures and stuff. I guess the art team was busy with cosmetics. So Skull Merchant's drones don't shoot claw traps or anything out at you, but they still can damage you, and the devs' solution to implementing that was basically the drone headbutting/kamikaze'ing into you, and then it can still fail. What drone, ever, has just flown straight into people as a method of attack, of which a miss will cost them their own life? And they make it seem like she's gonna be simple and fair for survivors to understand. No, even this is too complicated for them, because even her earlier versions were "too much to understand."
And only now do the devs comment, "It didn't match DBD's visual design." It's far too late for that, genius. You've already put a thousand cosmetics in the game which complete clash with DBD's traditional visual themes. We have Naughty Bear and those really cringely done Attack On Titan cosmetics, for example. We're getting FNAF soon, and just like how the series has gone, I'm sure it will feature designs marketed to children (as most of the devs are millennial "adult children," so they market to themselves, especially indicative in Tools Of Torment). It coincides with why, in a rated M game, there are almost zero gorey moris. Demogorgon jump on you, chews your head off and spits it out, and then your head is still on your body.
But anyway, they're not going to get anywhere with these Skull Merchant redesigns. They had 1 chance and blew it, and now the community has eternal hate for this killer. They'd rage quit against her if she lacked a way to damage!
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DS for survivor, No Way Out for killer. DS is the only perk that stuns and forces the killer on a 4th chase after getting downed... again. No Way Out is basically the only perk that makes it to where once 5 gens are done, and they will be getting done, the match isn't actually over because now you have extra time.
Maybe they should add the laugh emoji in addition to the upvote/downvote options. It's just funny to see killer aura perks and gen defence get put on such a pedestal without question. Those perks don't actually matter vs good survivors.
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The stuff you're worried about is so low level, you're still talking about stealth. The game's skill is in looping, and so the balanced (or at least it should) around high level chases. The game cannot be simultaneously balanced around looping and hiding, so the devs chose the more skillful option. Stealth does, however, still have a place in high level gameplay, because if you're dead on your next hook, the best thing you can do to make sure you live is to hide when the killer comes your way. So that's common sense across all levels of play.
The problem with your level is that 99% of looping/hiding done to waste the killer's time actually isn't doing that, because in order for it to "waste" the killer's time in a way that helps the team, people have to be working on generators while the killer is chasing or looking for someone. And if the killer is smart, and only wastes a few seconds looking for you before leaving, he's gonna go straight back to your teammates who might actually be working on gens, and once they're pushed off them, then nobody's working on gens. That's why as soon as the killer leaves your area, you need to immediately find a gen and start on it. If at least 1 person is on gens at any given time during the match, y'all will most likely escape. Prioritizing certain gens is also key. The gens on the edges/corners of the map will always be safest, so do those when you're on death hook. But at the same time, if you only do the ones on the edge, you risk leaving the final 3 gens in one area, all really close together, making it super easy for the killer to patrol them.
I don't think further clarification or strategizing is necessary. The point is that you learn and improve as a player before you start to see mass success. This game is different only in that its matchmaking is screwed up. The likelihood of you getting teammates who barley do anything, at your level, is like 95%. However, since you play with your boyfriend, meaning you're in a 2-man SWF, your chances of escaping skyrocket compared to those of your solo peers, because when you can communicate and coordinate, everything just becomes easier. Play into that strength, for sure. And by all means, if you've got those killers you find difficult to play against, try playing as them so you can see the limit to what they can do. Getting good as one side often leads to you getting better at the game in general. And don't fall into the trap of the overgeneralized "toxic killer" complaints I see on here. Toxicity is about intention; it's about trying to make the other side mad. Chances are most of these killers are just playing the game normally, just trying to win.
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@Thesevenspirits said:
Then let those who don't want to message or receive messages play against other players let that too, and let the rest who want messages play against themselves.
So people actually want interactions in games
It's impractical that they'd adjust matchmaking in such a way, but I like the way you think.
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It's actually the most annoying thing. If the option to message players is not available, I can't physically message them, right? Right. Sometimes, it will say you can message them, but you actually can't. Like seriously. Why would you let me draft a message to send to a player, if I can't actually send it? I don't know whose fault it is, BHVR's, PlayStation's, both, neither, but it's dog gone infuriating. Anyway, once I realize that's what's happening, I'm just like, "Whatever. Let them continue playing bad in ignorance." Or if I was trying to give someone props in the message, I just hope somehow they'll know they did good.
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They really do get punished. And the people who always bring this up clearly don't grasp how punishing misses are for killer. You miss once or twice, maybe still a recoverable game. Any more than that, you've probably lost no matter what at that point, and some of these killer powers and last-second M1 opportunities are extremely hard to hit. Each miss could lead to like 20 seconds minimum being added on to the chase. And the problem is the game state forces killers to get downs back to back to back to compete. You really think the killer still winning, when it's Hillbilly, Pyramid Head, Twins, or Dracula constantly missing, is because the killer's just that strong? No, your teammates definitely had to be throwing, with their inefficiency on gens. The only one who can immediately recover the game from missing a bunch is Nurse. She can play like a 5-hour player, turn her brain on at the last second to get a bunch of blink hits, and walk away with a 4k. Other killers, not so much, not even Blight.
You want to talk about killers not getting punished at all for missing, try old Legion, or Friday The 13th (no successful attack cooldown OR survivor sprint burst). What I want to avoid is killers getting any longer stuns/cooldowns in this game than they already have, because at some point it becomes "Why even use my power? Why even swing at them? Why play killer?" Killers in Texas Chainsaw Massacre go into an annoying cooldown animation if they hit survivors like 3 times, when it takes like 10, it feels like, to down them (and then instantly kill them, tbf). And when they get stunned otherwise, they're literally standing still for like 15 seconds "recovering."
Players don't want to suffer cooldowns and stuns all the time, because that's not fun, and it usually stems from bad design. Why do Hillbilly and Demogorgon go into such lengthy cooldowns when hitting against something? Why does Deathslinger have to wait for the super long "chain coming back" animation every time he misses a shot AND THEN has a slow base reload? Same thing with Huntress with her hatchet miss cooldown and time to reload. You see, it's not just the killer missing and then "immediately" recovering; there's so much more going on, and none of it good for killer. You almost seem to be ignorant to cooldown add-ons, like killer gets that quick of a recovery base or something. And others do have quick-ish cooldowns because they're laughably weak, like Pig's dash attack which is almost always worse than an M1, on an already bad killer. Or Demogorgon's cooldown on portals, because yeah he can go back and forth between portals basically before the survivors can destroy one, but then that's literally all he's doing, rather than commiting to chase or gens. Really, I don't think killers need more or longer cooldowns than they have now.
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Didn't I comment on this already? Oh well.
We definitely need more chase Merchants like you (it just couldn't be me). The chase is always the most interesting part of the game.
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@Aven_Fallen said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3900655#Comment_3900655
I repeat:
You dont go against those teams on a regular basis. This is an absolute outlier. Should it happen? No. Is it worth to put time into fixing this? Also no.
Well, hold on. I've had nights where all I go against is SWF as well, because they're all other platform and always bring the sweat and blatant coordination. Like, of course the people I Knock Out in the far corner of the map get found in 20 seconds or less every time, or of course they come one by one to body block their death hook teammate only after they've been downed and used their DS, all while still pushing gens super efficiently. So your point of them being rare is not always accurate, and even if it was, you're just allowing these teams to beat all these really good killer players with complete impunity because of how broken the game is for them. Any team can have that kind of power, as long as they know how to abuse their tools. And even the weaker SWFs can still dominate, because of gen speed, second chances, and coordination alone. It's why you only Nurse/Blight at top level, and almost nobody else. It's not solos giving them that kind of trouble up there, I can tell you that.
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@Slurpin said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/441084/genrush
So you play one of the worst, if not the worst, killer in the game versus a squad that may or may not be cheating (you don't know) and lost very quickly.
This isn't indicative of anything.
What the heck does "power role" mean? I know extremely jaded players fling that around, but it's never explained.
If the issue is survivors use busted things to win, why don't you? You'll probably win as much if not more.
A power role in other games is where, generally, the 1 killer has more kind of control over the match, while the others try to overcome that. In this game, it's 1 side making the other side their plaything, which is almost always the survivors unless they're the ones getting smurfed. That's what very low skill requirement gens allow. It's just efficiency; do your objective and you'll win. And the survivor's objective getting finished so fast means the killer doesn't have time to do his. The thing is survivors don't have to use any of the busted perks or items in the game to do that. The gens themselves are busted fast. So while a killer using the strongest stuff in the game might break even with that, the survivors can just equip their strongest stuff and trump the killer still.
It's a different with killer, too. Survivors are all basically skins, all with the same abilities. Killers are all different with their powers and sometimes movement speed. It's not fair to ask killers to be locked into the strongest 2-3 killers to compete, in a roster of almost 40. It's actually ridiculous that people have supported the game getting to that point. And yes, those are basically the only ones that are viable. Nurse, Blight, and arguably Spirit. Everyone else is just subpar fodder. There have been attempts to make those lesser killers viable, through add-ons and builds, like Pinky Finger Clown, Engineer's Fang Pinhead, hit and run Wraith, head trap kill Pig, oh but look, all nerfed. Best thing you can do with those killers now is get lucky to go against weak enough opponents to win.
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You just get lucky that they play bad enough. Otherwise, there's nothing you can do.
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Everyone, including the devs, just needs to stop making excuses for the people who don't read power descriptions, patch notes, play as the killer, or even watch gameplay of a killer. If they cannot even be bothered to do those things, do not balance for them. It's one thing to say, "We should balance for our inexperienced/casual players as well." I don't agree with it, because you don't ever balance for people who don't know what they're doing OVER those who do, but here we are. And this, how Skill Merchant has been handled, goes one step further than that. It's saying that the people who can't be bothered to do… anything... just DC every time they see the killer they don't like and that's the extent of their thinking, that we should balance around them! I mean, if any other game's community pulled this, they'd just be laughed out. "I don't like snipers in CoD. Insta- leave game." "I don't like Zangief in Street Fighter. Insta- DC." That doesn't get you anywhere. It's childish and petty. I don't know why it's put up with it here, because "it's different."
Sadako's current state puzzled me for quite a while, but when I simply took a moment to think about it, and play her a match or 2, I understood perfectly. She's pretty much like her release version, with a few changes. Her Condemned affects survivors around all active TVs, not just the one she TPs to. Her tapes turn off TVs and remove Condemn, but don't prevent further Condemned from active TVs. And when she hooks you, your Condemned you've acquired so far becomes locked in and can't be removed. She has the exact same counterplay as before, minus that last part. Skull Merchant is similar. - You hack the drones, crouch or stand still to ignore scan lines, watch out for stealth, and don't get scanned by a new drone or she gets speed. She is as bare bones as you can get with M1 killer design, besides literal 1-dimensional killers like Myers.
I think we should just make her drones like Nemesis' zombies, patrolling the map, just scanning people instead of inflecting them. If we're gonna force simple design because people can't think further than, "Man, that killer's too strong," and rage quitting on sight, this design is the one I'd go for.
Kind of a tangent here, but you have piqued my interest on one thing though. If they were to push new Skull Merchant and others as these really info-value intensive killers, it would coincide with the devs nerfing Distortion and proposing anti- extended hiding mechanics. That's a good thing and a bad thing. It would be good because killer can always do with more info (still waiting on that individual hook counter), and because the real skill and excitement in this game is looping, not hiding. It could also be bad because maybe the devs think that's enough. Good survivors already don't care if you see them or not; they will just loop you to death. Info disproportionately affects lower level survivors, because they think they're being clever hiding, not knowing the killers can see them, meanwhile they're not doing gens or looking to heal. I'm not saying that it shouldn't be that way, because it's punishing bad survivors and doing basically nothing to the good ones. But we've had it before where if something that was nothing more than a noob stomp tool, because low level survivors lost to it constantly, that would indicate to the devs it must be OP and needs nerfing because it's "meta."
In the end, I'm really not invested in Skull Merchant. I've lost patience in trying to justify her being strong without being OP, because there's too many people thinking a killer can't be the former without also being the latter. I've tried the same with other killers. I think the devs realize it too, that they messed up big time on a killer's concept execution, and are now gonna start from basically the ground up. She's been nothing like I expected from the initial teaser of the cyborg skull on the table. When we saw that, a million good ideas sprung to our minds, none of which made it into her final design. So I encourage you to keep fighting, because you're passionate about the game and about a killer you like, but I'm done with her.
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@Thesevenspirits said:
SoloQ is like going to a Spanish bull run even and the bull is allowed to kill everyone in sight. You can't run or jump into the safety zone and the bull is not stopped or distracted if it got you on the ground. If you want to have a sad and depressing day, play dbd soloQ then check your blood pressure and vitals after loosing 20+ games. Survivors are weak, can't run, can't hide, killers are faster and can one shot you with whatever busted perks or add-ons.
Survivors are simply 4 perks on a slow moving character.
At this point the game should be hide and seek because if you get found except you can loop you will be eliminated almost immediately.
And that end game mori should be removed especially if the player is not on death hook already.
You can run and hide against the killer. You just need to learn how. I'm serious, knowing how to run certain loops like shack, TLs, or jungle gyms, you won't feel so weak. It won't matter that the killer's faster if you waste enough of his time to where he loses.
Not all killers 1-shot. Some have a base ability to do that, like Hillbilly, Myers, and Leatherface. Others need perks to do it, most of which are countered pretty easily. Devour Hope and NOED are hexes and can be cleansed. Hubris, just don't stun the killer. Friends Til The End, just last 20 seconds. Similarly limited time Exposed perks, I'd give similar advice. Just play as safe as possible to outlast the timer.
This might not matter much at your level, but the math of the game, the race against time, says that survivors should basically always beat the killer. That's if everyone is playing optimally, of course. But while you and your teammates might not be playing optimal, the killer usually won't be either. Find out what his weakness is, whether it's that he's bad in chase, that he won't kick gens, or that he lacks match awareness, and capitalize on that. Usually the weakest teammates of yours will always at least go for the save, so unless you're in a situation where someone needs to trade hook and your teammates are unwilling, you basically never have to go do it. If nobody's giving the killer any decent chases, be the one to do it. If there's nobody on gens and you can be, be the one to do it. Survivors can actually afford to stay and push gens instead of wasting time healing, basically until they're on death hook. You're never gonna make any progress if 3 people get off gens the moment 1 gets downed, or if you always make sure everyone's healed before you start to push gens. Your advantage is that the killer doesn't know what you're up to unless he's literally on you or you're on hook.
And all of that is done without the use of perks or items. The perks you want to bring are ones that make everything you do better. Want to push gens? Deja Vu or toolbox. Want to heal fast? Botany or medkits. Want to be healed fast? Resurgence or Leader. Want to last longer in chase? Exhaustion perk. Want to last longer against a tunneling killer? OTR or DS. Want to know where the killer's at? Object or Kindred. Want to know where your teammates are at? Bond or Empathy. Want to hide your aura? Distortion or Boon: Shadowstep. Using a combination of these perks and items, especially ones that fit your usual playstyle or dilemma, can make you practically unstoppable. The killer can only be in 1 place at once, and there's 4 of you, all with the potential to have these perks.
If your teammates aren't great, just keep trying to win, and take any chance to escape that you can, even a hatch escape. Eventually, your wins will get you out of "MMR hell," we call it, where you lose because your teammates are bad, you get worse teammates because your MMR went down, and so on. If you're good enough, if you've put time into learning the maps, loops, perks, killers, etc, then you'll eventually get decent teammates. If you're faking it til you make it though, you're going right back down. Unfortunately, I believe MMR hell takes up most of ladder. It doesn't take a genius to escape if the gen efficiency is good enough. So you'll get matched with people who have no place being in your same lobby, even really high up.
The reason the game isn't hide and seek is because there's no skill in it. And the matches would just end with survivors all dying anyway if that was the case. The only skillful thing of making the killer lose you is when you do a double back play, running one way, killer loses sight of you, then you go the other way, essentially making him mindgame himself. The skill is in running the killer, and while it may be simple in practice, a lot of people simply lack the game knowledge to pull it off.
You needn't worry about the endgame mori. It was done to 1) cut back on situations where the survivor escapes for free because of a pickup (last person alive but hits DS and then finds hatch, or last person alive but the killer had to drop them and they're near an exit), and 2) to not waste survivors' time. Instead of the killer waiting to hook everyone, because of waiting til 2nd stage on one before hooking another to play around the self-unhook, rinse and repeat. Okay, the killer still has to do that sometimes, but instead of being forced to BM and hook the survivor and wait for the long scream animation, into struggle animation, into long death animation, he can save both their time and do a cool mori animation.
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@AmpersandUnderscore said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3900350#Comment_3900350
This is where the global statistics are an average, and doesn't necessarily reflect the experience of an individual.
There are players who go on 3k and 4k streaks for hundreds or thousands of games. There are solo q players who can play an entire weekend and maybe escape twice in 30 matches. But those aren't everyone's experiences.
People also misinterpret things a lot on these forums, such as: "everyone is a cheater" and "I only ever go against a full 4 man SWF".
This, though, is why I'm glad that BHVR kind of stopped giving out stats as much. This community doesn't know how to understand them or interpret them.
SM was a huge red flag, will a kill rate astronomically higher than every other killer, survivors saying that she sucks to go against, and even killers saying she felt like crap.
Yet with all of those indicators, and statistics supporting that she needs to be desperately reworked and isn't in a good place at all, there are people who looked at all of that, and did what you did: ignore almost all of it and actually insist that she should only be buffed. Which, doing so would've only make the kill rate and the survivor experience worse.
At that point, those people are deliberately ignoring (or intentionally misinterpreting) the stats because it just doesn't suit their narrative.
Well, it's the devs' literal fault for the SWF confusion. "I face SWF all the time" would be instantly confirmed or debunked if they showed and indicator, post-match. So all killers can go off of right now is if the team was all other-platform and/or gave a sweaty match.
At this point, I don't really care about Skull Merchant. They can do whatever with her. I just don't think the level of DC'ing we've seen against her is ever justified, like literal giving up before they've even been able to determine the caliber of their opponent or teammates. What, because you got downed early or something? Countless killers have lost even with an early down. It's about everyone putting in effort.
This might be unoriginal, but maybe they should just change the drones the patrol the map like zombies. That way they don't act like mostly worse, potentially way better Trapper traps that are always at desired gens.
But in terms of reworks they actually gave her, I think the current version, especially before the nerf, was way more preferable and counterable. The scan lines can be countered by standing still or crouching, give a sprint burst when they apply the claw trap, and now only give a speed boost on a recently placed drone scan. And with the 8-kick gen limit, 3-gens are just a matter of teamwork, patience, and getting the regression events down. If people can't handle that, I don't know what to tell them. I would like killers during Undetectable to either be all silent or all make a little noise, so that killers like Skull Merchant don't technically have super stealth, because she makes like no noise.
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@Perrin3088 said:
A big problem is that stats are highly unreliable in a game without a standardized load out and goal.
Games without tomes active vs games with tomes active throw any relevant stats out the window. As do killers that pad their mmr by going 8 hooks then forcing gen simulator. Or how about people going for achievements, running non-standard builds to accomplish a non-W goal... or how about bully squads, that lower the escape rate by not playing objectives and just harassing the killer until they inevitably die off..
Any stats you get for this game are so corrupted variables that could vastly affect them, you either need to track all those variables giving a mess of unorganized data even at your best organization, or irrelevant information.
Kill rates alone are barely anything because of dc penalties. Is doctor good? Or are the numbers just padded cause of the visual pain it causes some people?
Oh, pick rates. Is Myers pick rate not boosted by the est 50-150 games per person it takes to get the achievement? (More if you like scratched mirror and/or tombstone)
Is huntress pick rates higher in 2v8 because she's good, or because it's the best time to get the sniper hatchet achievement?
Even test server is a bad judge, because it centers on new releases, and new release counters (although that would be the most reliable data any stats can give)
Personally, I would be much more interested in my personal stats and picks and kill rates than anything globally that I wouldn't know just how heavily falsely skewed it is.
Them factoring other info in could actually help so much on data collection.
How much time was spent on totems? Were there any hexes or survivor totem perks that made cleansing them necessary?
How much time was spent searching chests? Did those survivors already come in with items or not?
How fast did survivors do the first few gens? How long did it take them to do the final one? How much did each teammate contribute? Who had gen perks?
How many seconds did the teammates wait til unhook? How much did each teammate contribute? Did the unhooker have unhook perks?
How long were the chases? Did anyone have exhaustion perks? How much did each teammate contribute? How many strong tiles like shack or jungle gyms were there?
How much time was spent on healing? How much of it was done? How much did each teammate contribute? Did the healers have any healing perks? Did the killers have any Mangled, Hemorrhage, Broken, or other anti-healing effects?
I don't suppose that the devs are tracking all of this data now, but I hope at least some of it. I mean, you can't possibly expect to balance a game off of pure kills and escapes. But it almost seems like that's what they're doing.
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@HerInfernalMajesty said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3900091#Comment_3900091
I have a theory that Killer difficulties were placements along the mmr bracket. So Trapper and Legion were categorized as “beginner” which leads me to believe they were mostly for lower mmr. Higher mmr Survivors might have faced less of the “beginner” Killers. I think Plague was categorized as “hard” because the power is so easy to get value from that the player ends up playing against “hard” Survivors.
I’m not willing to die on this hill or anything but it is a suspicion on how I think the difficulty system used to work.
I thought you meant that killers would have a difficult adjustment period, like they did at MMR's start, which would also be fine by me. If I am correct, that killers getting matched against survivors of their own caliber will lead to mostly losses and extremely hard matches in general at the mid and high levels, then that will pretty much force the devs to give killers some much needed buffs. Opposition to that outcome is the only logical reason why my initial comment should have been downvoted; otherwise I have no clue.
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Fix the matchmaking so people can actually play with people their level.
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People think killers playing the game normally is toxic, and think it needs reporting because of that.
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@NewPlayer100102 said:
This map is controlled by that center section.
Do you want the killer to literally self lobotomize so they fail to recognize that the 3-4 generators the room gives easy access to are convenient to the location?
I'd rather players running survivors on this map accept the prominence of the area and equate going down in range of that hook as a massive game play failure, on their part.
Or you could start a public out cry and reward failure with additional balance changes.
I'll be clear. I played on this map last night as survivor. Lost due to similar circumstances and all I want is another shot at the mistiming we engaged in. No more nerfs to things, when adjusting playstyle will suffice.
There's a lot of maps where survivors just need to learn not to go down in certain places. If there's a place where the killer can get a hook trade and then some every time, or can hook a survivor in the middle of several generators, why would you go down there? I don't pay attention to that kind of stuff myself very often, but then I make up for it by playing well in all other areas.
RPD has never screamed "killer sided" to me. I don't think there's any spot on that map where the killer gets a hook and is instantly like, "Yes! Now this match is in the bag!" It just doesn't happen. The map's too big with too many strong windows and pallets to run to.
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He seems extremely basic. A worse Legion (like Engineer's Fang Pinhead), you could say. His mobility is kind of nice, but his power not being able to down, full stop, is gonna probably kill him for most people. I might not even buy him, or I'll do so only to get his perks. He just seems like he can't do much, and isn't much fun.
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All killers should be 115% at this point. I'd almost argue 120%, with how survivors feel untouchable at tiles sometimes. The fact that catch-up killers still need to be 115% are a testament to that. For now, Bloodlust helps fix how broken a lot of the loops in the game are. Which is why people want Bloodlust removed, because they know god pallets are the only thing that straight-up denies its benefit. And so instead of adding in more god pallets, which they know won't happen, they could just axe Bloodlust so that most decent pallets become new god pallets anyway.
You're trying to approach this from a killer's perspective, but all your good points you bring up, you go a completely different direction on. If it's tedious for a killer to have to use their mobility to catch up at a loop (Blight's rush, Vecna's fly, etc), why would them being 110% (even slower) be a good idea? BHVR isn't being lazy at making 115% a new standard (which they really haven't, because Chucky and old Wolf [Dracula] are so recent). They're being smart, because even they realize, "This killer will never catch the survivors at loops if we make them 110%."
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@100PercentBPMain said:
Plz be 110 plz be 110...
A killer being 110% automatically makes them unviable these days.
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@ReverseVelocity said:
Eh, Coldwind is still a pretty good realm overall imo.
Cowshed and Torment Creek are still pretty damn strong for Survivors. Thompson House is very good if you can break the 3 gen early.
I see people complaining about Rotten Fields having no tiles on it and sometimes I wonder if we're playing the same map. That map has very strong fillers and is very good unless you're up against a Blight or something.
Rancid Abattoir kind of got screwed though, it could do with a couple more fillers to smooth out the deadzones.
I don't understand the hate either. I've seen bad Autohaven generations more often than I've seen a bad farm map. Maybe they don't like the junk tiles, but it's been proven time and again you can actually run those. I'd like to see the weakest echelon of maps be brought closer to the upper echelon of them, equalizing them. But I don't think farm maps right now are nearly as weak as most claim.
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I actually am excited for this crossover. FNAF always would have been a better series if they'd stuck to a more horror direction, instead of becoming increasingly marketed towards kids of all people. But hopefully its inclusion in this game will be more horror-based.
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@drunkfistnemesis said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3899581#Comment_3899581
True I have seen that happen too. It's uhm.. strange that it can happen. My guess is there is a delay between their attack animation? I'm not entirely sure though.
No, it's just that for some reason BHVR thought it would be a good idea for them to take a swing and come to a dead stop, regardless of it they hit the survivor or not. And then their cooldown on that attack had to be long as well, because reasons. It's the same process of a survivor actually gaining distance on a killer by 360ing.
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It's only fair that the spot is a good camping spot, because of the anti-camp for free, and because a survivor simply doing a loop up and down each side of the stairs wastes like 20-40 seconds for free. I don't even think it is a good camping spot. You just run up and hook trade, meanwhile everyone else is doing gens. Rinse and repeat once or twice, and you're already at 1 gen left or all gens done. There's not a lot you can do against camping besides that, but then the killer isn't doing anything either.
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The survivors can literally make them whiff, poke their nose, get away in time, rinse and repeat. I've seen it.
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@BorisDDAA said:
Honestly I'm not sure why the orbs give him a speed boost. Made sense when he was 110% in PTB but now it's perma bloodlust 1.
Okay, then play as Wolf form the entire match and see how that works out. Should be about as effective as playing Clown.
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@MoZo said:
I’m not seeing anyone say it so I will, Dracula needs some type of changes to tune him down. Hellfire is fine but is insane at zoning, bat form gives him crazy unconditional map mobility and wolf is just busted. Let me get this straight, I can dodge his hellfire and “make distance” only for Dracula to go into wolf form and instantly catch up with free haste and a very forgiving pounce ability? It’s just stupid. There’s a reason why Dracula players use wolf 75% of the match, it gives them free haste while also lowering the already low pounce cooldown. The growls the wolf makes when picking up the scent orbs is the exact same as when he’s charging a pounce so it gives free zoning since survivors preemptively dodge thinking you’re about to pounce and the size of the pounce is the size of a dropped pallet. I’m tired of people saying wolf is a joke when all the draculas I run into always use wolf and even the main Dracula player (im not going to name drop) thinks wolf is his best form. I just find it so dumb how I can successfully dodge one of his abilities only for Dracula to transform into another whole different power 0.5 seconds after and get a hit. What’s the point of dodging when they have another ability in their back pocket? There’s a reason Dracula is a top 5 killer because he has 3 above average abilities that are almost good enough to be their own killer powers.
I wouldn't call him a top 5 killer. Even if he was, that's not saying much, because you have Nurse, Blight, and then the power massively drops off when you talk about anyone else.
What you're not seeing with Dracula is the big picture of what the killer is having to do, and how much time is being wasted. You dodging a single Hellfire already makes that a bad chase for him. If he has to catch up with Bats, you get a free chance to Spirit mindgame him, because he can't see or hear you (because the bats are too loud). And Wolf has very few areas that doing Pounce would be favorable in, because you could either dodge out in the open, or it would hit onto an object.
Most of your complaints seem to be towards Wolf. I still think it's a joke form. I actually didn't know survivors heard the scent orb growl as well, which would be confusing, so I'll give you that. I feel it would be a great compromise if he got the scent orb absorption silenced for survivors, and got actually good backwards movement in exchange. I have no idea why he goes like 5% speed when he's backing up, because no other killer has that downside. Still, I wouldn't rely on that top Dracula's opinion too much. Wolf is very tile dependent, and is usually worse than Vampire form in every way. He needs those scent orbs to catch up, otherwise he would be too darn slow.
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They're no good. I've played around with Septic Touch before, and it didn't seem to do anything, even though it's supposed to be good against Exhaustion perks and Windows.
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I don't complain about stuff in DBD being not "on-theme" as much as others do, but that would just be ridiculous.
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It's just a mode you play to get away from MMR. Some matches, we crush the killer. Other matches, my teammates don't have a clue, and he crushes us instead.
I think the less we have of killers not being able to use their powers, the better.
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@chickendrumstick said:
They nerf killer and survivor perks in the worst possible ways.
Killer perks, yes. Survivor perks, it depends on what you mean. I think they play super softball with the survivor perk nerfs. They nerfed Iron Will, but then OTR is there to power creep it. They nerfed DS to 3 seconds, but it still punished people who didn't tunnel, and then it became 4 seconds. They changed Dead Hard from a dash to an Endurance hit, which gives more distance because of the sprint burst. MFT nerf was fine, but then they just pair it with OTR or Dead Hard and it's the exact same thing. Buckle Up went from unfair double Endurance to a literal sprint burst that gives NO exhaustion.
What about killer perks? Pop went from doing 25% of a gen to what is usually 8-10% now. Deadlock doesn't even block for 30 seconds per use, and is 4 uses only. Pain Res has less regression than before and is 4 uses only, 1 per survivor, and requires good hook RNG. Hangman's died when it became a scourge hook. Eruption died when it went from Incapacitated to aura. Ruin does 100% regression speed compared to survivors' 400% progression. CoB and Overcharge do like nothing. STBFL loses tokens on hits that don't even damage, or use basic attacks. NOED reveals itself for free. Dying Light still destroys itself after the obsession is dead. Knockout gives Hindered when a survivor leaves a pallet, but not if it gets broken, instead of (you know) actually having to do with knocking someone out.
The difference is night and day.
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@xCakeStick said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3898434#Comment_3898434
It's quite clear to say you're upset and angry, and falsely assumed I meant that killers shouldn't of strong perks when I did not say or intend to refer to that. The issue with Ruin at 200% is that it would push the game too far in the other direction, especially when stacked with other slowdown perks. The nerf to 3-genning does weaken gen defense overall, but that doesn’t mean Ruin needs to return to its old form. It means other slowdown options should be looked at or adjusted.
As for why Ruin isn't worth running, is cause it's a hex, it's a gamble meaning it is inconsistent and not popular among killers who prefer reliable perks like Undying, Devour, or Pentimento. If Ruin needs to be paired with other perks to be effective, it might require a rework instead of a direct buff.
Killers should have strong perks that encourage counterplay and avoid creating passive, gen-stall-heavy matches. Buffing Ruin could lead to oppressive combinations like Ruin + Pop + Pain Res, and other combos we saw in 2023/2022, hurting survivor gameplay balance. Which is quite obviously what the developers are trying to avoid. Balance works both ways.
Sometimes I'm angry, yeah, because I always have to sweat as killer, get told the game should be easy mode for me, and every little buff that is suggested, you people say, "Hmm. That's not a good idea." You don't even have a tangible alternative. A numbers buff is the easiest, most obvious, most practical solution the devs can do. And we had 200% Ruin at one point. Was it game breaking? Absolutely not. We still didn't run it, because it was a hex and its permanent destructibility didn't justify how little power it brought. All these wannabe Ruin enthusiasts patronize killers with their suggestion of a mere 150% Ruin. Again, if survivors leave a gen going down for minutes and minutes on end, sure, that version of the perk could get good value. But survivors who know what they're doing will not let that happen, because it would be hardcore throwing the game. Some didn't like me saying this stuff, but then they haven't told me where I'm wrong.
If killers want to bring hexes, let them. We'll deal with the risk of it getting destroyed. The only part we don't like about that is the clearly visible spawns, and the fact that Ruin doesn't do enough on its own. You want counterplay? You can destroy it permanently, no matter what level of power it's at. Same with 3-gens, where you don't even have to coordinate as a team very well anymore, because the gens will just block themselves off from the killer's kicks. That is the single most important thing that should alleviate your fears of too much gen defence. The survivors win the war of attrition by default; they do the gens faster than the killer can possibly slow them. If the killer has 3-4 regression perks, that's all he's got. No chase perks, no vault perks, no aura perks, no endgame perks, nothing. Once the killer has exhausted his 4 Pain Res stacks, assuming he even can before the gens are done, they pretty much start flying, whether he's got Pop, Ruin, or whatever with it. The only reason that doesn't happen is when survivors go down constantly and won't do their objective, which I've seen today, so don't tell me survivors are always trying their best. They usually don't.
The balance barely goes both ways. It's not like the devs haven't done anything to help killer. But with the backlash against updates like 6.1.0, they made sure to never give killer decent buffs again. They're scared to, because survivors get all this stuff for free, base BT, base anti-camp, 10-second longer hooks, entire maps that are just 1 big interconnected loop, god windows you can never break, check spots, and scratch marks, breathing/injured sounds, and footsteps not working for the killer. And they still complain that they get nothing and killer gets everything. Killer got gold in 1 Olympic event, and that's "unfair" despite survivors getting gold in the other 9. Survivor mains don't want interactivity and counterplay. They want to win as much or more as killers do, which quite simply shouldn't be possible.