danielmaster87
danielmaster87
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@Coffeecrashing said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3739022#Comment_3739022
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/4SR71I2ZF4YL/image.png
The tier list for the average MMR would look something like this. It would be how well each killer does when the average player uses them.
Different killers have different performance levels across the MMR levels. I've said this multiple times, and BHVR has said this multiple times. It's true. When people talk about game balance, they should be talking about how powerful each killer is AT THEIR SKILL LEVEL, because those are opponents they should be matched with.
Yes, the average MMR tier list should have Skull Merchant way up in S-tier, because at that skill level she is overperforming. And it should have Nurse below average tier, because at that skill level she is underperforming.
This is why you can't balance off kill rates, let alone look at them for good data. You can't even look at win rates for good data. Take like 10 matches from low, mid, and high level for each killer, and then look at the other factors of the match. These factors include perks ran, time in-between hits and hooks, time in-between gens getting done, the MMR and hours of each player, SWF or no SWF, the loops that spawned, etc. We still wouldn't know the exact story of the match without spectating it directly, but with this we'd get pretty darn close. I think this is reasonable. Those who don't most likely think that you can do the exact same kind of data analysis that's done in CoD or fighting games, looking at the K/D or who won the round and nothing else.
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It's not toxic anymore than tunneling isn't toxic. It's called being efficient. And there's nothing wrong with getting a 2k in this meta; that's the result the devs want killer to have. Oftentimes, that's the result I have to settle for. Either that, or go all-out risky slug at the last second, the failure of which is usually a 1k or 0k.
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@Neaxolotl said:
Long charge is still a long charge though
That's what they don't get. The killer with an instadown is chasing you. So, what, they down you guaranteed, just from simply chasing you? No, of course not. They have to be so close that they're breathing down your neck, which in most cases means you get to a pallet or window before they're close enough. So Blight stronger than Hillbilly? Major X to doubt.
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Some people you just can't satisfy.
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@Yippiekiyah said:
Pop works best when paired with Tinkerer coz your always going to find a gen with high progress.
Tinkerer hasn't been worth it since it only goes off once.
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@Junylar said:
The target killrate is 60%, and some killers were overdoing the plan up to 70+%, so they decided to nerf all the killers a bit and buff individual killers, such as Bubba and Slinger. Still, with the weakest killers reaching almost 60% killrate, the killer role is far from being weak, it's even far from being on par with survivors.
The kill rate keeps going up despite all the nerfs because the quality of the average killer player keeps going up. The ones who are fed up with the nerfs decide to leave, and the resilient elite ones who stay are becoming borderline tournament player level. They're being pushed so much harder than the survivors to improve, because the determining factor of a loss is not survivors doing well in chase, but doing well on gens. It's been the standout issue in each and every meta. Before, killers could use slowdown without much strategy, as long as they played well, to extend the game long enough so that they could have time to kill all the survivors. Now that it's almost impossible to do that, you're always seeing strategy (camping, tunneling, slugging) and comebacks at the very end (most likely after 5 gens have been done) using NOED, Rancor, No Way Out, Terminus, Blood Warden, Spirit Fury/Enduring instadowns, STBFL x8 + Rapid Brutality, etc. Killers need combos that strong to win, because even before the gen defence nerfs, gen defence was useless vs teams that were fast enough on gens. It's all about getting a random thrown-game comeback at the end because of the survivors' misplays, or simply settling for the draw.
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@Mooks said:
no, there is no officially confirmed date. We just know that there will be more info ‚later this summer‘
Which will be, "It's coming soon! Maybe!"
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Just undo the nerfs. That's all it would take to make him somewhat decent. 🤡🌎
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@GannTM said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3738868#Comment_3738868
Did you play any survivor during the painfully boring eruption meta or ruin undying copy and paste that killers always did?
I didn't see anything wrong with those metas. It was a refusal to adapt, and impatience on the devs' part, that led to those metas getting swiftly and unfairly nerfed.
Eruption could not hit you unless the killer took the time to not only kick all the gens you're working on, but also down someone before they were completed. If you got hit by it, so what? The time you spent progressing the gen was way more value for you than the regression and Incapacitated the killer got. The average player would lose to this of course, because they've never had an incentive to strategize or get better, so the devs nerfed it even though capable teams could just crush killers using this "OP" perk. It's exactly why I hardly ran the perk when it was at this peak, because I could see it was a perk whose only use was noob crushing, or providing a bonus to you when you'd clearly win the match anyway.
Ruin/Undying was super healthy for the game, because it provided slowdown either in the form of breaking totems, which also countered NOED and other hex perks, or rewarding the killer for pushing people off gens instead of camping and tunneling. Either way, good teams could deal with it. Counterforce was also right around the corner; they should have just waited to see if that perk was a good counter. But no, they had to nerf a great and rarely seen hex meta because people kept crying about supposedly getting the worst possible roll on the totems every time. If so, why didn't they just do the gens instead of worrying about the hexes? If I recall correctly, Ruin was about as slow as regressing the gens as it is now, so why aren't people complaining about it now? "Because Undying made it stay up all game." It could stay up all game now and would be a minor inconvenience to the survivors! Instead of doing gens to 15% and then leaving them over and over again, which is what survivors do with this perk even though that's what gives it its max value, they should focus on 2 gens at a time so that no efficiency is lost, because the killer can't be in 2 places at once.
I know this wasn't mentioned, but I laugh whenever I see people reference the "gen kick meta." CoH and Overcharge, you know. The outrage over that "meta" signifies that the average team cannot or will not handle a minor inconvenience brought on by a killer's perks. They cannot handle a killer kicking gens, a base function of the game. Even though that meta required the killer to kick gens (waste tons of time) and hope that survivors won't tap it or finish it (wishful thinking), that was too much for the average survivor. They just leave gens to regress for minutes at a time, can't commit to a gen which was nearly finished, and yet blame the game for being too killer sided. This is what we're balancing for. Can you see the issue?
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You realize that new players are always going to do badly? And it's not as if the killers who are just starting out are playing their best either (important when making balance judgements). The only thing stopping new survivors from stomping those killers is a lack of teamwork, skill, and experience. And that's amplified at the top level, where a lot of the time if you're not playing Nurse or Blight, you're not getting more than 2 survivors, guaranteed.
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The low tiers were pretty predictable. The rest, I heavily disagree on just because I think they also below in lower tiers. Hillbilly is S? Chucky, Deathslinger, and Singularity are A? Like, what?
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@Soundwave_11 said:
I'm not sure if anyone else has noticed, but since the update, playing Survivor has been horrible. I keep getting killers who tunnel and proxy camp the hook. While yes, it does sorta waste their time proxy camping, I feel like it kinda ruins the experience…
Does anyone else feel the same, or this just a me thing I've noticed?
For context, if it helps, I have 1000+ hours.
That's not a word. No, I don't think they are.
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It knocks off a negligible amount of gen progress and shows auras. And you have to stop to kick gens to activate it (heh). When are people gonna learn that perks which require you to kick a gen, and give the survivors who were working on it a full lead, are bad perks? You're either gonna hold W for 40 seconds just to catch up to them, or go to a different gen while they go back on the one you just kicked. Either way, you're gone for too long and so they just finish it.
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Yeah, who could have seen that coming? First they gave us 15 seconds less to use it, then they made it take off percentage of completion and not percentage of total, and then they still lowered that number. It's a fool's perk, just like most of the others.
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@ReverseVelocity said:
Nah, Pop is still pretty good. I'm still using it at least.
People were tunneling and slugging like there's no tomorrow even with the maximum amount of slowdown you could stack, so I don't really agree with the argument that a nerf will make people tunnel and slug more.
Why wouldn't they? They can't slow the gens anymore, so why not tunnel and slug more? That's their only out.
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You can get way more games in these days with the same amount of time as before. People cried about gens taking 10 more seconds, but then survivors just got more efficient and negated the change. I can't believe how easy we used to have it, my bumbling friends and I just beating all these killers. Now that the gen change and MMR is here we have to work for it a little more, and suddenly they don't want to play. They get frustrated and insult the killer because of their own unwillingness to improve. That's why I fly solo in both roles, and don't ever take SWF's feelings into account on balancing. The game should be balanced for the greater good, not people who just want easy matches.
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@Aven_Fallen said:
"I also feel that the kill rate for killers across the board is deceptive and doesn't take into account the pace of play. I've had many games where I get 3 or 4 kills but there is 1 to 0 gens remaining and I didn't start getting pressure until 2 gens were done and a 3rd about to be completed. Point here being that just cause I got a 4k it doesn't mean that pace of play isn't a problem."
I think you dont really understand how the pace of the game works.
The pace of the game works in a way that Survivors are strong at the start, but get weaker over time (Ressources aka Pallets are gone, Survivors lose Hook States, Survivors have to play more careful), while the Killer starts weak and gets stronger the longer the game goes.
Also, when it comes to Gens, you should realize that while a Gen is technically 20% of all Gens which need to be completed, the actual time itself is way different. The first 2 or even 3 Gens can be completey very quickly, but this does not mean that all Gens will be repaired. Especially Gen 5 usually takes longer than the 4 Gens before. Killers should not expect to end the game with 5 Gens still up, if this happens, there was a matchmaking issue because the Survivors were way worse than the Killer they played against.
If you experience games where you get 3 or 4 Kills and there are only 1 or even no Generators remaining, this looks like Matchmaking is working for you. Close games are usually a sign that you play against equally skilled opponents, which is good. And in the end, losing 2, 3 or even 4 Gens early does not really matter, since as long as the Survivors did not repair 5 Gens, they wont have a chance to win.
But if you say you want more 4Ks with less Gens being done, you are basically just asking to get less skilled Survivors, so you can stomp them more. Because in the end, you are winning already, you just want to win more.
The killer in no way gets stronger later in the game, nor do survivors get weaker. You can break pallets, but then there's still more pallets. Good survivors are not gonna give you time to create all these deadzones without also finishing the gens in that time. Besides the time spent on hook, survivors are still at full efficiency while injured, first hook, second hook, until they are dead, simply because they can still work on gens. Not doing your job as a fully efficient killer, aka not tunneling, is basically handing all the power to the survivors to get their objective done at the cost of your own. What we've been seeing for years is killers, whether they're tunneling or not, downing survivors in chase back to back really fast, and the gens got down to 1 or they all got done. Like, "Really? These guys got that far? For doing what?" That should be alarming, because it means that survivors who actually do know how to loop will win by default, even though the killer basically couldn't play better. That's what he's mad about. Of course we want less skilled survivors, which is against my nature because I generally want opponents equal to my skill, because when we do get equally skilled survivors, they can go down in chase constantly and still escape.
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@Neaxolotl said:
First hook in 2 min is borderline winning for survivors, that's literally four gen worth of seconds
First hook in 30 seconds is still winning for them.
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You probably said it better than me, but yeah. Most of the anger towards Skull Merchant is 1) entitlement, and 2) blissful ignorance. They don't want to have to strategize, not 3-gen themselves, actually learning about her power, paying attention to how fast she's moving or if she's undetectable, etc. There are also many who did put in the time and effort to learn her original release form, and now just rage quit out of entitlement, not knowing that she's not even the same killer. "What? She can't expose me with the drones now?" No. That's what the constant balance updates are for. The other practical gameplay scenarios you mentioned are also sound advice. Like really? She can just put a drone down at every loop, or 3-gen from the start, and automatically beat you that way? No. People would kill to have it that easy as killer.
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The MMR has never been friendly to newcomers. That's one of the many problems with it. After losing a few matches, it should put you with people your level/experience. If not, again, that's what needs fixing with this MMR.
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I wonder if you can put Trapper/Hag traps on the exit portals.
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@Dwight_Fairfield said:
I mean they gave him one rework already so its not like they don't care. They just prioritized other killers since.
A rework which they nerfed into oblivion soon after, because he was "S tier" and created matches that lasted "forever" and crap like that. That nerf is the biggest indicator of catering to a casual audience in this game's history.
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@MechWarrior3 said:
Yeah……….try tell GeneralV that he is the weakest killer in the game. It wont go over well…
Yeah, I can't argue with that. Literally. Trying to say a killer is as strong as Nurse or Blight, and that everyone's just not playing that killer to their fullest potential... They also do this with Trapper, Wraith, Hillbilly, Clown, Deathslinger. When we all know they're trash.
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@KaTo1337 said:
I have mentioned this topic for years now.
All he received was a new Z-Block/Cat-Block, a nerf to "snares through walls" and a slight buff inside "Adrenaline.
If they dont have interest in doing a bit more than changing a stupid number in a code, just activate Pallets together with Snares.
However, we Freddy-Mains wish for more.
Just sad how BHVR act around Freddy.
Simply undoing his nerfs would be a big win in my book.
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They think he's a model killer! So fun, bcuz easy to beat!
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@Chaosrider said:
Running a perk that barely does anything in such situations. Not worth it.
So you don't think a wasted killer chase is strong?
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@wakesafe said:
DS is still bugged from the ptb and OtR is nullified by hitting someone off hook which happens with tunneling anyways. It’s amazing that the perks survivors are forced to run to combat tunneling aren’t even functional. Tunneling as killer is free wins all day rn but at least Survivors can play a song because haha funny ig
Keep saying that about tunneling. Doing is always different than saying.
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@ChaosWam said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3736898#Comment_3736898
They nerfed DS and they nerfed the two top regression perks. Of course tunneling is getting worse.
And you can buff DS to the stars, it won't make tunneling stop. To some killers, it's better to risk the DS stun and go for the already weak survivor than start a new chase in a new chain of loops.
Yeah, because then later someone's just gonna use DS offensively. Those gen defence nerfs were completely uncalled for, and will cause more tunneling. I was ready to try Pop/Pain Res on certain killers I was good with, but now the regression is laughable. Seriously, compare what they do now to what they did at their peak.
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@HexHuntressThighs said:
All Gen perks got nerfed and SABO got an insane buff across the board. Very limited incentive to hook survivors right now honestly.
I've already faced a killer who ran Knock Out and wasn't hooking anybody. This is what people asked for.
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I didn't think the red realm stopped you from seeing scratch marks or blood. The endgame collapse effects take that cake. Maybe for the people who were using filters it was an issue? I hope that's not the reason they changed it, or I'd be pretty mad.
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@fussy said:
Trapper, Freddy, Dredge and Myers should see some significant buffs, Knight should see minor buffs and QoL changes.
Don't even get me started on Freddy or Dredge. They are so weak.
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Wraith, Deathslinger, Nemesis, and Pinhead could do with their nerfs reverted.
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@Deathstroke said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3737011#Comment_3737011
I don't think huntress needed changes in the beginning. She was most balanced killer before her buffs.
No, she was pretty weak. All the "Cross-map shots!" YouTube content muddies that reality.
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@Junylar said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3737298#Comment_3737298
Finishing gens when there are only 2 survivors left and more than 1 gen left is impossible, but waiting for your teammate to die and then take the hatch or the gates is probable, so they are doing what is the most likely to lead them to the escape. Survivors are not a single organism with one nerve system, however hard you may try to dehumanize them, dear killer main, every survivor plays for themselves and has their own strategy.
That's called not even trying. I could run a killer for 2 gens while my teammate finished them. But that's not what most people do. They just give up and never get good, and then demand that the game be balanced around their entitled attitude. This is a team game. Your last statement is a total cop out and a detriment to the game.
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I've been saying this for years.
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@TheArbiter said:
Can I just say while I'm glad they got rid of the red hue for this realm, it's too dark now. This is the only realm where I actively struggle to see anything
There was nothing wrong with the red tint of the map. I've gotten messed up by the very distracting endgame collapse effects, seeing scratch marks that weren't there, than on that map.
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We've got to stop the pandering. People will DC against a killer until they get nerfed. That's how entitled they are. They did it to Freddy, Spirit, and even still do to Skull Merchant. So stop nerfing them. If the complainers want to leave the game for good over it, let them. Because on the road this game's on, we have lost and will continue to lose far more people because of changes brought on insatiable complainers, than if we'd let them pout and go. It's ridiculous what's been introduced. Base BT, anti-camp, anti-power near hook, hooks being further apart, proposed base Unbreakable (we'll never let them live that down). People don't want to improve, so they've been given this stuff. They still haven't improved, because now it's expected that any obstacle they're up against, they can just mass DC against and get a balance change, get their way. You can never satisfy these people, so stop trying.
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The reason most survivor perks "suck" are because the meta ones are too strong. Why would you use Fast Track, Any Means Necessary, or Dark Theory, when you can instead use Unbreakable, DS, and Dead Hard? They don't even compare. Killer perks suck too, but much more equally across the board, to the point where Agitation is arguably a meta perk. I'd run it without Pain Res.
But no, I do advise playing both sides. It's how you get the fullest experience of the game, whether you're casual or competitive.
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I guess how competitive it is, how it pushes my limits. I wish it weren't so much at times, but that's the aspect that remains constant that I like.
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@SkeletalElite said:
Gen speed is mostly fine and there isn't any increase that's remotely fair that would cause the players who say they are too fast to be happy. Playerss that say they are too fast, for the most part, just have bad macro play and pressure. Yes sometimes you lose 2-3 gens in the first few minutes of a game. That's the point of hte game in which survivors are strongest. They have all their resources available, every one of them is healthy, none of them are being chased yet, none of them are on hooks, they're all sitting on gens, so of course that's the point in the game where they are getting the most progress. as the game goes on their items get used up, they get injured, the map loses pallets, they have to go for unhooks, heal, target important gens, and contend with the many powerful regresssion and gen blocking perks of which most killers are using at least one. This all causes gens to slowdown and the rate at which you get hooks to increase.
No. The first error, of the misconception that survivors are steadily drained of crucial resources from the game's start, is that the killer gains an equal amount of momentum. The killer doesn't have any momentum until a survivor is dead. You could make the argument that they've got momentum when they hook someone, but the time and effort required to do that doesn't even make up for the 2-3 instant gens lost. There's nothing about the neutral starting state of the match that suggests that killer gets stronger later on as survivor gets weaker. The killer has minimal control over where survivors loop them at. The survivors can spread out their resource use, pallets, in a way that they've always got one around a gen the killer might contest them at. The killer can get rid of the pallets near the gen, but that means not kicking the gen yet, which can cause it to get done, so that pallet being used was just a waste of time, because now the survivors don't even need to be there anymore. The killer can kick the gen to stop its completion, but then the survivor gets to a further (and usually stronger) pallet, leaving the pallets near the gen still up so they can be used later. Sometimes it's not a pallet, and is instead a window, which can be less safe but can be used infinitely. So that's what killers are up against just as a baseline.
The only thing that generates killer momentum is a kill. An injured, even death hook, survivor is still capable of doing gens, and gens are way too fast. So every second that survivor is alive, they're capable of doing major damage to the killer's game plan, not only through wasting huge amounts of time in chase, but also by advancing the objective. This is why killers tunnel, because in a 3v1 where 1 is hooked, 1 is rescuing, and 1 is being chased, the survivors are mostly off the gens and are all somewhat pressured. No constant looming threat of losing. In the 4v1, 1 can always be on a gen, a source of constant objective advancement no matter what their teammates or the killer's doing. And never just 1 person on gens. The unhooked survivor doesn't have to get healed, and can jump straight on a gen. Survivors really don't need to heal until death hook. It's why 4-man SWFs with a designated We'll Make It healer are so busted, because they're about as efficient as staying injured, except they're all always healed. The moment 1 of their teammates is on death hook, always a healthy teammate around to body block, go back to the healer, and do it all over again.
All of these issues become more and more impactful as anti-loop and gen slowdown gets nerfed repeatedly. You see 5 killers at the top, and that is it, because everyone else is too weak to compete. Sure, you can beat any mid team with a strongest build Freddy or Ghost Face, but what about high level? They'll just abuse all the stuff mentioned above, plus BNPs and instaheals, plus exhaustion and flashlight/pallet save perks. And these are not hypothetical matches. They happen regularly, and it's pushed many killers away from the role, which is why the BP boost is always on killer, and why solo queue is so hard since you're always facing the most resilient and elite killer's who continue to push through this BS balance. Many times, I've wondered and wished that this was all an exaggeration, a pro-killer propaganda fantasy. But the irrefutable math, and the irrefutable skill ceiling of survivors vs that of killer, has yet to be contested.
It was a nice and well-intentioned experiment, to balance around casuals instead of high level so that they have the most fun. Okay, but there's a reason that no other game does that, and it's because it's oxymoronic. You balance the game for people who play with the game's full potential, not casuals who think gens will just get done if they hide and heal all match. Making the game balance a casual free-for-all, spit balling ideas at the wall constantly, just makes it to where 1 side takes advantage of all the broken stuff there is, and bullies the other side. If you balance off the top, when players go from casuals to learners, and learners to veterans, they'll reap the benefits of their skill and experience, and will figure out how to do all this impressive stuff without dealing with arbitrary advantages given to the other side.
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@jesterkind said:
I think gen times are absolutely fine, and we're in the era of DBD where a killer's actions and skill expression have the most impact on gen times ever.
The only real problem that exists outside of poor macro play and over-reliance on regression perks is toolboxes, in my opinion. At least, from the killer side- from the survivor side, stacking regression perks can be pretty obnoxious, so I wouldn't mind that being tackled at the same time as toolboxes.
It'd be tempting to say that "gen progression" is the problem from the killer perspective, but it really is just toolboxes. Without toolboxes, all the other gen progression tools are totally manageable and fair, even when stacked.
It's not just toolboxes. You don't need gen speed-up to have fast gens. Just efficiency. Killer decisions and actions are actually the least meaningful they've ever been. What's the #1 or #2 most difficult thing to do as killer at high level? Hit a survivor. They'll pre-drop, force the stun, force the entity blocker, whatever it takes to make a hit as difficult as possible. So why people are protesting anti-loop killers when you play to lose as an M1, I'll never understand. Even M2s. Hillbilly, Demogorgon, Wesker have some of the most telegraphed abilities in the game, and people think they're strong. With decent gen defence, they might have been. But look at what we're left with. Nothing.
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Yeah they need to be changed again. Or at least do something. The 10-second gen nerf didn't do a thing because it got more than counteracted by nerfing ALL gen defence. Add in survivors getting more efficient, because they have to or else they'll be trapped in MMR hell (garbage teammates vs decent killer), and you've got drastically increased, not decreased, overall gen speed. On top of nerfing killers, on top of a gen regression limit, on top of leaving in broken loops, on top of... You get the point. I don't know how people are complaining about slow gens at this point, and aren't blaming their teammates but blame "killah OP!" They're so easy to finish within minutes. And gen defence doesn't even help anymore, except against mid or lower teams. They're useless vs the top because you're likely to get no more than 4 hooks before all gens are done, and even less if you're really spreading your hooks. But the point is gen time vs chase time is too fast, dude. It doesn't take a genius to do the math.
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You're exactly right. Sadly I don't think they'll ever address it.
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@Katzengott said:
Don't listen to "just crank up sensitivity and FOV to the max".
Sensitivity was doubled in a patch long time ago, so 50% is 100%, 100% is 200%. For me 75% is the sweatspot with all killers.
And keep in mind that increasing the FOV also makes it easier to get blinded. I also noticed that some cosmetics tend to clip with higher FOVs.
And that never should have been a thing. The blind box for the killer should have remained as it was, because survivors were already blinding you from off screen. Not every killer buff has to be accompanied by a nerf, but hey, that's how we balance on this game.
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@DyingWish92 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3731069#Comment_3731069
Yeah I've heard the whole stepping back thing and I've never really implemented it. Lack of discipline and patience on my part because I have this mental block that if I step back I'm gonna somehow lose distance on the survivor and fail.
Well, you will. They spin, which makes them unhittable, then with the distance they get to the nearby loop. They only lose distance on a 360 if they're hit during it, or they're for some reason doing it way earlier than they need to.
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Tell me about it. When people who play killer and have thousands of hours, such as ourselves, are facing this issue repeatedly, the skill questioning needs to stop and a solution must be pursued. If you ask me? Survivors turn too fast. I really don't care if it screws up moonwalking, fov "techs" (exploits), etc. New animations, or a simple turn rate cap (which would also solve questionable fast vaults), would fix this. Not only is bullying against new players resulting from kicking this can down the road (killers getting farmed for YT content as they're spun 3+ times), but it's even causing experienced killers to lose matches. It's a hit which the killer entirely deserves, and it's getting aim dressed, or auto-aimed to an obstacle, which the OP rightly points out is causing the entire chase to be reset. Bigger hitboxes on killer attacks could also be an easy fix. Killers like Hillbilly, Oni, Blight, Wesker, and even Nurse, are dead in the water on console vs teams who abuse this stuff. They go from A and S tier to mid tier at best, because the survivors know they can just twitch or spin, and the killer's hit will be denied. I will ask again as I have before, how hard is it to make a decent sized hitbox which will hit survivors standing in front of the killer's attack?
I acknowledge that some killer's hitboxes can questionable, especially during bad connection matches, like Huntress's hatchets, but seeing the puny hitboxes of Hillbilly, Deathslinger, Nemesis, Blight, Wesker, miss again and again forces people to stop playing these killers. What needs to be understood is that yes, in spite of their enormous flaws, an experienced player has a chance to beat most mid level teams with them, but swap out the mid teams with the high level SWFs, and their chance of winning is basically non-existent. That, or the killer would have to use their power so sparingly as to never use it outside of a guaranteed hit, and always use their M1 at the perfect time as well, which is asking the player to play out a robotically perfect match. So it's not just the M1s, although that is the more universal issue since not all killers have M2 attacks. It's the hitboxes of all attacks which needs to be looked at. It honestly feels easier to hit a no-scope on Call Of Duty than it is to MELEE survivors in this game. Stop letting twitches and spins be the deciding factor of an all-powerful killer getting a 4k or no kills at all, because believe me it is that bad.
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@hermitkermit said:
As some people have already stated, I think they fail when the killer isn't in the power role. That's why I'm comfortable with a 60%-40% balance, because it's what keeps the game alive, as killer players don't want to play a game where the "survivors" are just as powerful, which makes sense because you're playing an iconic horror villain, and if there are four or more other players that are just as strong as you then obviously it's not going to be enjoyable. Because of this I believe survivors need to accept that they are not meant to "win" as often as killers and that the game should be balanced this way, and that killers need to accept that they do in fact have an advantage.
We'll accept it when it's true. The golden age of DBD doesn't happen until killer is the power role.
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It's because they keep trying to copy Dead By Daylight in all of its faults. Dead By Daylight is an anomaly, in that it's been managed so badly that any other game would have gone under long ago, and yet it's still popular because horror icons. If it was original only characters, the game would be dead. These other games think that they can also become a killer bullying simulator with unfair/infinite loops and stunning/killing mechanics for survivors to use against the killers, and still succeed. No. You don't have Myers, Freddy, or Ghost Face, so your days are numbered.
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@Chaosrider said:
As always killers instantly start overexagerating.
So you think the buffs to sabotaging were necessary?