alienschmalien
alienschmalien
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I'm about buffing Legion, but I'm actually more about reworking them. There's a reason people still give this killer flack. It's just cause Feral Frenzy much like the Doctor's Shock Therapy and it's effects? Are just not a fun way to stall the game.
And ultimately it's still pretty easy to get a free first hit on a survivor with it. Which is fine. Because Wraith gets this a lot too, but it's significantly less annoying because there's not two layers of stalling to mend then heal back up.
I'd just rework them to give a completely new power that was strong, but also fun for survivors to go against. And counterable.
That should be the requirements of all killers IMO. Strong, fun to play, but fun for survivors to go against, and they should be counterable.
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Try getting a healing daily for your daily ritual then facing Plague.
That's always fun.
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Interestingly:
Killers complained about exhaustion perks. Guess what got nerfed? Exhaustion.
Killers complained about self care guess what got nerfed at the same time as Sloppy got buffed to high hell and back and became meta? Self Care.
Killers complained about Mettle of Man (rightfully so that was ######### trash) and it got nerfed almost instantly.
Killers complained about generator speeds and stalling almost every killer in the last few chapters has had something to do with generators and stalling and tracking their progress? Oh and lower tiers of RUIN got buffed.
Killers complained about Decisive Strike? It got changed into an anti-tunneling perk. Interestingly enough? Killers still complain and now just slug to counter it making the game yet again unfun for survivors.
Please don't start ''Survivors complain to get our side's stuff nerfed and we're so innocent and have never done such things!"
BOTH sides should have fun, and BOTH sides should be listened too.
The most atrocious things survivors ever got nerfed were old Freddy who didn't need it and Legion. Who did need a rework, but they didn't need to destroy them to the point they were unfun to play either.
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@GrootDude said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/701749#Comment_701749
Personally, I feel like the majority of killers, excluding clown and legion are viable in the right hands.
I believe this as well. I also believe there's far too much hand holding in the game as is with perks on both sides and the ''skill" has gone out the window.
So it's kind of funny to hear ''Git Gud" from anyone when we're all guilty of running the good ######### that's gonna change the flow of the game for us.
I actually have went up against some good Clowns though. Clown can shut down a chase in the right hands and he actually has to work to do so.
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@GrootDude said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/701737#Comment_701737
Or a good hag player.
@GrootDude said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/701737#Comment_701737
I don’t think you’ve seen a good PS4 Nurse.
Or a good Billy or Huntress even.
Seriously. This ''Spirit is the only viable R1 killer." is not accurate at all.
I go up against far more skilled people who play Hag, Nurse, Hillbilly and Huntress than I do Spirits.
There are often times where a Spirit is clearly bad at the game and chases and you can just tell it's the killer that got them there.
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@Rin_is_my_waifu said:
Devs if you read this, please don't listen to these survivor mains. They want these nerfs to bully and loop her till daylight. It's the only viable killer on PS4 at R1, so don't touch her please
Signficantly don't listen to these killers mains. They want her because she's easy handholding the killer and need her to stay at rank 1.
Seriously there are so many people who are clearly not good at the game in red ranks as killer BECAUSE of Spirit and how busted she is.
It's not about looping and bullying her. It's about her being fun and having COUNTERS. If it was about ''WAAAA STRONG KILLERS." People would ask for nerfs as much for Hillbilly and Huntress as well, yet survivors tend to enjoy them.
Funny that.
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@GrootDude said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/701686#Comment_701686
I think that’d kill her though.
I disagree. I think if anything it'd make her operate closer to Hillbilly's Chainsaw or Demo's Shred. It'd be powerful still, but she'd have to work for it and it's now able to be juked easier.
She'd still be insanely strong. She'd still have good map pressure. She'd just not be so mindless. You'd earn hits. Like Demo's earn shred, Billy's earn chainsaws, and Huntress earn hatchet throws.
If anything I'd make her ultimately visible at all times. But take away the woosh, so you couldn't rely on it to know that she's using her power, you'd actually have to pay attention and watch to see what she was doing.
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@GrootDude said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/701686#Comment_701686
I think that’d kill her though.
It'd not kill her. She's still have high map mobility. She'd just operate closer to a Billy chainsaw than what she does now. Billy has to WORK to get his hits against good survivors.
She'd still be strong against survivors weak at mind games and ones that just run in a straight line.
She'd not even fall from grace hard if she lost "I'm invisible now."
Take away the woosh sound on her power maybe as a bonus to her now being visible when she uses her power? Basically the invisible part of her is why her mind games are super strong and mindless.
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This is gonna be a radical nerf no one is gonna like but:
She's visible at all times when using her power. There problem solved. She still moves same speed. Her add ons still do the same thing. But now?
She now has to actually work to get her hit using her ability and not just press the button and wham you've gotten it.
It also cuts down on mindless ''I'm just gonna stand here." tactics.
And it's honestly more authentic to her Japanese Onryo roots. None of those famous Japanese ghost girls she's based on ever operated by the American standard rule of ''Ghosts are invisible."
Nah, they were always right up in your face with creepy movements and spastic twitching.
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I can also say that about how many times you can go on reddit or here and you see a killer also saying something about how a game went and how they didn't get any kills.
Both sides whine and complain. Neither side is innocent of ''expecting" things.
That's the nature of a game. People expect to win no matter what side they are on.
The variable is depending on what the player themselves consider a win. Some survivors might consider getting their teammates out a win, some survivor might consider getting a decent amount of bloodpoints a win, some probably and a lot probably consider it getting out through the gate the hatch.
And some killers might consider a win 2 kills, or at least a kill, or getting a lot of bloodpoints and hooking every survivor at least twice, and a lot might consider it ''I got a 4k and no one left through the gate or hatch."
It still doesn't negate the fact both sides will go on forums and complain though. As many stupid forum survivor quotes there are? There's an equal amount for the other side of the game too.
All based in truth.
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@Tzeentchling9 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/700871#Comment_700871
"Not only is the ''Iron Will" and ''Spine Chill" chants flawed and again relies on a perk to counter a problem that is a base problem."
You don't say? Huh. How come it's suddenly flawed now that it's a Survivor problem when Killer have had to listen to that "Use band-aid perk #X" chant for years now?
Honestly? I agree with you.
The problem at base with this game is? A lot of potential skill on both side is negated by the fact perks in this game literally hold your hand.
Killers have generator stalling perks and aura reading perks.
Survivors have numerous chase perks and generator completition perks.
It's why when people drone on about skill I've kinda just like. ''This game could not be any less skill based if it tried for either side."
Everything is utterly mindless to a degree and we need less of that if we want to claim ''This game is about skill and has a steep learning curve."
The only thing I'd say will take some skill is correctly using killer abilities to the best of your ability. So hatchets, chainsaws, traps like Hag/Trapper/Freddy's Pallet/Snares, etc.
Everything else is just ''Good luck and don't ######### it up." for either side.
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@ArecBalrin said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/88906/should-surviving-be-an-expectation
Who says 'killers expect 4 kills'?
Literally, this meme is spouted only by survivors.
Ehh. The emblem system kind of rewards you for going out of your way to get the 4k.
That and the number of people in game you will see when playing survivor who will straight up leave another survivor on the ground to bleed out and chase the last survivor who is juking that killer for days on end?
Kinda of lends into this meme.
There's a lot of killers out there okay with 2ks and 3ks sure or just getting everyone hooked twice, etc.
But for most memes or things in this community? There's some truth behind it.
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Not only is the ''Iron Will" and ''Spine Chill" chants flawed and again relies on a perk to counter a problem that is a base problem.
''If she just stands still run away."
Okay, so she stood still. I run away. She just uses her power to catch up again and likely gets the free hit or down.
She's the most mindless thing in the game to play and that's why she's so fun to play.
It's like why certain perks are fun to play on both sides. It's all utterly mindless and you don't have to think. You just have your perk and you go. You're good.
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Nope. Neither answer is correct. Why are you assuming things so much? Stop that. Jesus.
If you play 1k hours, you might be decent? I haven't seen you play. So I can't really say anything about that.
But there are a lot of 1k hour people in this game. And a lot of those 1k hour people aren't that great. They wouldn't be considered a ''skilled" player.
This game isn't that hard or as complex or competitive as people would like to make it or think it is. The rank system and the skill fights between both sides are just...the most laughable thing?
Because literally a lot of this started because when the game came out. One side decided to take an unintended thing like running in a circle and make it the thing to do and here we are.
A casual game became a ######### show piss contest between two different sides. *roll eyes*
I didn't say survivors should always be able to loop killers for 5 gens, no they shouldn't. Quit assuming again or reading into my words. However? I don't think that a killer should be able to end a chase with a perk. To fix a problem that should be fixed at base level. And just because there's more pallets? Didn't really nerf Enduring and Spirit Fury. If anything? It means that Billy gets it faster.
Again. If you want to argue skill. Don't think a Billy is skilled because he knew that his one weakness is looping and then slapped on two perks that mindlessly take away that.
Killers should be winning chases and survivors should be winning chases no because of their perks, but because they actually did something to win that chase.
Perks =/= Skill. And that's problem fundamentally with this game for both sides. You can't measure skill when so many perks on both sides can change the course of a chase or objective.
Hence why it's an utterly casual game and not at all competitive or skill based.
And those examples in your Spirit point are so far removed from one another dude. Nice try though. We're just going to agree to disagree on Spirit. I'm done talking about her with you. She's a perfect naturally strong killer to you and that's fine if you want to believe that.
And if I and I others believe she is a ######### show who like Nurse shouldn't exist in her current state? That's fine too.
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Oh boy.
Rank does not equal experience.
Rank is not earned by skill. Not in the current emblem system or the way the rank system is built. Rank is pretty much just time you've played and spent on the game in each period.
So if you get to red or purple ranks every month? It's caused you played a lot. Nothing more. It's why you still have potato survivors and killers who fall for so called ''Rank 20" jukes and mind games at rank 1.
I've run Iron Will, I've run Quick and Quiet. Neither help against a Spirit who has headphones on. Spirit is OP from her very base by the nature of her ability. And just how you have no idea where the ######### she's going when she's in it. When a killer has to have 2 or 3 perks to be ''countered" at base? They've now become someone who needs to be looked at.
And I've said it before in this very thread and I'll say it again. But on either side? If something or someone is so strong that you have to counter them/it with an entire build or perk? That's not on you. That's on BHVR. Perks should not be band aids. And it's their fault they've borked balance on something that bad.
Perks should not work that way. For either side.
Billy's loop weakness is almost virtually negated if he's running Enduring and Spirit Fury. It makes his one weakness MINDLESS for the Billy player. Just get stunned? Easy come back. Kick pallet. Next stun you get an easy hit. Yay. "Skill."
And I've attacked nobody in this thread. But go off I guess. I've offered strong opinions that some people probably don't want to hear or like? But attacked?
Whoooa boy. You are reaching if you think that.
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It sounds like to me you lack experience as a killer and blame it on buffs.
See how ######### that is?
Stop with that. Don't attack me. I won't attack you.
The joke is you legit think Spirit is fine at base. She's not. She's tragically not. More people agree with me on that than they would agree with her being fine.
Hillbilly is fine at base, but slap strong killer perks on him? He's an oppressive monster to go against and there's no winning even if you're a god tier survivor.
And if you think I'm biased, despite my posts being in a completely unbiased manner and bringing up points that both sides are not perfect.
Maybe I'm not the biased one? Maybe you just want to see an ''Entitled Survivor Player" where there isn't one, because they are saying things you don't want to hear?
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@BlueFang said:
I like how people in this thread have been acting like only one side has been getting massive one-sided buffs the past year when it's actually a lot more complicated than that
But hey the "Devs nerfed my free health Mettle. Devs hate survivors, killers ruin game" or "Devs nerfed Enduring. Devs hate killers, survivors ruin game" argument couldn't be used if everyone wasn't super freaking biased to the playstyle they main, and evaluated the game's changes with an open eye
Looking at you @alienschmalien
And trust me I can bring up past history to prove the developers are doing their best to balance the game for both sides this past year and a half
The hilarious thing is? The only thing they've nerfed for survivor that I ran religiously before they nerfed it wasn't even Mettle.
It was Self Care. I never ran any Exhaustion Perks until Head On. I wasn't really a Meta Slave survivor, but still did well.
And I only ran Decisive after it's change to counter being tunnelled.
But go off I guess. ASSume you know everything about me.
You can bring up all these supposed killer nerfs, and they have nerfed killer things, but outside of gutting Legion incredibly bad. Nothing has come to the grand total sum of how each little survivor nerf and each little killer perk buff and strong killer releases like the Freddy Rework and Spirit's just general existence has made survivor a more and more miserable existence.
Killer is in the best space it has EVER been. Survivor is in the worst space it's ever been.
Neither side is utterly perfect sure, but don't act like killer is in some miserable state right now when the only TRUE issue there is if you don't run the meta or play a certain killer? You stand a strong chance of getting ######### if you're not good at killer.
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There's no way the current path and direction there was in was meant to buff solo survivor, unless I miunderstood that, because honestly? If anyone has suffered most by the consistent killer buffs?
It's solo survivor. It's virtually unchanged things for playing with your friends as survivor.
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Of the commonly thought of as ''best" killers right now.
Nurse takes skill. There are tons of nurses bad enough at her to be juked to high heaven and back.
Hillbilly takes skill. See above. Also lots of ''good" Hillbillys can't even turn properly and miss lots of easy chainsaws because they just zoom forward and hop for the best even with turning add ons.
Freddy takes some skill. His pallets and snares are good. His teleportation requires knowing info about where people are.
Hag....eh...she's debatable to a degree if you use her as high tier camping, but if you use her for other things? Good for you. You're skilled.
Spirit is just ''Hold your action button, go invisible and you're probably gonna get a hit in a chase." Oh and you move around a lot so you're probably gonna confuse a lot of people at pallets anyway and get easy hits that way too.
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@DonnieTheZombie said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/699352#Comment_699352
I feel that same hopelessness. And other then cosmetics ive sank as much money into the game as possible too, so I dont want to just upright leave either.
But you're right about the perks too, i didn't mention it but thats another big problem. I have to run meta perks to stand a chance, on either side, but am supposed to not because thats toxic too. So idk. I hate knowing that I can't even just use different perks and builds for fun because it cant compete with the other meta builds.
I've had a bit of fun added back on the survivor side by running Head On and Quick and Quiet, but like...they aren't exactly perks that help you survive a lot. They're just more of what a perk really should be...a 'little pick me up for funsy." not a ''This will help you win the game or guarantee the win."
And that's the real problem on both sides of this game.
You shouldn't have to run so and so perk to feel like you're gonna have any sort of good time/even remotely get something that's considered a victory.
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@Zagrid said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/699341#Comment_699341
45 seconds to get blood lust 3 to get one hit. Say the survivors finds one of the like 3 or 4 safe pallets on that map, breaks chase, or uses some exhaustion to get away enough to lose bloodlust. You are still talking at the very least 2 min per down. Excluding any BS like insta heals.
2 min for 1 person to go down, you have lost at least 2 gens maybe 3 if the survivors get lucky in finding them.
Not to mention bloodlust was a mechanic implemented as a lazy fix to infinite loops. So in a properly made map, you should never need to use bloodlust to end a chase.
Either way its bad map design and there is no way you can argue having over 30 pallets on a map is perfectly fine. No way.
If there's a total of 30 palles and 27 of them are unsafe and you're still losing chases as a killer?
Maybe the problem isn't the number of pallets?
Just saying?
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I kinda feel hopeless about the game. Namely because of the staleness of the game's meta and the way people play. As well as the direction the DEVS are taking the game.
I've put so much time into the game and so much real money supporting it that I can't bare to give up on it.
But I just feel so exhausted without having to run the same stuff to do well as both killer and survivor and that not even always being a guarantee of having a fun time.
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@Zagrid said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/699329#Comment_699329
Those unsafe pallets are only unsafe when the survivor tries to loop them, if you use the strategy of run and drop and keep running you will contuine to lose distance on the survivor.
And with the amount of pallets on that map survivors can just run and drop run and drop and keep going till all 5 gens are done. They may be unsafe, but you still have to go around them if the survivor drops it.
Bloodlust. You still win. Lol. Eventually you're going to catch up, even if you have drop after drop.
That map would only be a problem for killers when it come to Balanced Landing and Lithe users. Otherwise. Just Bloodlust 4head.
If you never stop to break a pallet? You don't lose distance. And you get faster by the minute.
I only see that map being a problem for Billy because getting around with the saw will be a nightmare and Huntress because of being 110. 115ers with bloodlust?
You're gonna win each and every chase.
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Almost every pallet on that map is the most unsafe pallet in the world.
It's literally just like the Badhams to be honest. There's strong parts, but the strongest defense against killers? Pallets? They're at their all time weakest.
It's another one pooped out of Matt "Loop Money." Walker's factory of bad map making.
For someone who likes to say his new maps will have a lot of ''loop money".
Survivors be broke.
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I'm gonna say this and it might shock someone and the developers because they love creating perks as band aid fixes for problems and this applies to both killer and survivor:
If you have to run a perk in a game to counter something or someone?
You've already borked balance up so bad. You might as well give up and just make everything a ######### show. Lol.
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Spirit is fun? In what universe?
If Spirit was fun? People wouldn't DC or kill themselves early in games against her. Which they do even if Prayer Beads isn't in play.
Passive phasing needs to chill or be nerfed because it makes her mind games super strong.
She's probably the least fun of the top tier killers to go against IMO.
I'd rather face Hillbilly or Nurse countlessly than go against her.
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@FriendlyGuy said:
I think one escape per game is fine. The killer should be a threat, but the survivors need to have a perspective too. At the moment you have to 4k as killer to pip and even then you sometimes blackpip. They need to rework the emblem system as a whole.
I think this another train of thought that is unhealthy for the game. In general there's too much emphasis on 4k or NoK all the god damn time.
If one or even two escapes? You didn't fail your job as a killer.
If I recall correctly didn't they at some point want the balance to be 2 in and 2 out?
Because I feel like for the most part they're failing that lately. It's more like 3 die and 1 might get lucky and get out via the hatch or an exit gate in Endgame Collapse IF they're lucky.
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I think it's more than just reworking add ons. It's reworking legitimately the stuff that is just not fun to go up against as a survivor but no nerfing them so god damn much that they're unfun to play like old Freddy or current Legion.
Nurse, Spirit, and even Hillbilly thanks to the current strong meta builds he's capable of are all oppressive and super unfun and dare I even say? Unfair to go up against.
I know they want to rework things like Doctor and what not, because he is an annoying unfun killer to go against, but priority should really be placed on fixing these top tier killers so they're not only strong but also fun to go up against.
If you're gonna be stuck going against them for a month on end in the purple and red ranks over and over and over?
At least make them fun to go up against. Is that so much to ask? No one wants to play guessing games with Nurse and Spirit. No one wants to have Hillbilly's one weakness lopping be gone, because oh shock wow. The good Hillbilly player thought of that and bought Enduring and Spirit Fury.
There's a such thing as strong killers but also making them fun to go up against. So far not a one of the stronger killers is fun to go against. Huntress? Maybe.
But poor girl really just needs a lot of help anyways. She's fallen from grace hard in my opinion. Mostly due to the bad map design.
Seriously? How does Matt Walker have a job still? Why is he in charge of things like Badham and the New Map?
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I know I'm ranting a lot, but they've hyper focused on trying to fix a lot of killer issues, while making survivor weaker and weaker. And still won't acknowledge complaint after complaint survivors have had about things that make the game unfun for them.
They're slowly gonna killer their game if they only take time to help one side at a time.
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It's pretty much what survivor has become though. You can't expect to survive anymore. The killer meta is ridiculous strong now. Especially on the high mobility killers.
And then you have Hag who is the odd little freakball who somehow defied odds to be a 110 killer who is probably one of the best killers in the game that still has insane map pressure somehow.
You can't nerf survivor time after time after time after time and expect survivors to still have fun. While buffing killer perk after killer perk after killer perk. And the killer after kill with Freddy and Hag's case.
The game eventually becomes miserable for the side that is legitimately the bigger side of the player base.
And that in turn? Causes said part of the player base to dwindle and dwindle and dwindle.
Especially when said part of the player base has nothing going for them game play wise but holding R1 to interact with things when the game isn't about a chase.
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@Boss said:
The vision is to keep going for at least 5 more years.
Good luck. At their currrent rate? They'll be lucky. There's a reason killer lobbies are getting longer and longer to find.
It's because the current path they're on is chasing people away. Mostly survivors. The game is far too oppressive on survivor side because the killer meta is HELLA strong right now, while survivor meta perks have all been repeatedly nerfed. As well as window and pallet hits. Being moried instantly out of a game. Constant Ruin and Pop back to back.
But it's on both sides really. Survivors still have things needing address like instaheals, sprint burst negating a lot of killer abilities, most of the maps still in their favor heavily, etc.
The game has gotten to a very stale state in terms of meta and in terms of how the game in overall is played.
It's also why a majority of the Fog Whisperers program seem unhappy with the game or seem to be playing it less.
It's kind of like BHVR is in a state of ignorant bliss about just how bad of a path they are on.
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@Milo said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/620966#Comment_620966
Getting tunnelled? DS.
People not saving you solo? Delivarence.
The crouching is too slow for you? Urban Evasion.
DS is the only good perk here.
Deliverance is situational at best and requires a safe hook rescue. You are not always guaranteed this.
Urban Evasion is the worst survivor perk in the book because it literally encourages people to not be good at the game by crouching around the entire time and not interacting with the killer.
Urban Evasion + Sprint Burst survivors are nine times out of 10 the ones who don't know how to do anything in a chase.
Survivors have the worst meta perks at the moment. Self Care used to be meta but now it's slow and dreadful.
Sprint Burst is lame. Dead Hard either barely works or is bugged half the time.
Head On and Lithe are fine but situational as all get out and Head On shouldn't even be an exhaustion perk.
Adrenaline is solid and along with DS one of the only truly good meta survivor perks right now.
Meanwhile each patch has add more and more amazing options for killers and outside of gutting Legion ever killer buff lately has been a pretty amazing one.
Anyone remember when Hag used to be trash? Remember that? Freddy? Remember when running Sloppy was considered a joke?
Even the smaller buffs like Wraith helped him be a touch more viable.
TL:DR surivor perks for the most part? Really just what a perk is a small boost. Not majorly game changing anymore. They've made sure of that patch after patch.
Killer perks? They're not perks. They can majorly change the flow of the game now. They're hella strong now. Too strong. They need to be looked at.
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It amuses me that no one notices just how hand held killers really are right now.
There is literally a meta killer perk for any situation that annoys you.
Pallets? Enduring and Spirit Fury.
Window Loops? Bamboozle.
Can't find those pesky survivors? BBQ, Bitter Murmur, Whispers, Nurses, etc.
Generators going too fast: Ruin, Corrupt Intervention, Thrilling Tremors, Pop, etc.
Meanwhile, every survivor meta perk is trash to the point you have people excited for a stupid perk where you hide in a locker and get a chance at a stun.
The game is the worst balance wise it has ever been.
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This is ridiculous. You keep delaying. You keep having misteps, yours or Sony's or not.
It's holding us back. It's holding you back.
You don't want to do anything for us but say sorry. Sorry can only get you so far when you say it as much as you have the past few weeks.
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Billy and The Pig.
The Pig's kit is used all wrong by the majority of her players. They use the RBTS as another means of tunneling instead of to stall the game. They waste so much of their time in their insidious crouch mode trying to sneak up on people. She's just annoying to play against because everyone tries to be a sneaky little tunnel machine.
Hillbilly is just in need of a nerf now that BBQ & Chili is a thing especially. He's terribly easy to pick up, zooms across the map at the speed of sound, has a one hit main power that he doesn't have to build up to, has add ons that can greatly change his power to the point of it becomes ridic to counter or predict, and with BBQ & Chili equipped as most run now? He's just a monster who rewards with what is far too easy of a power to use.
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Lil Mikey Myers.
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Cute Asian Gamer Girl.
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To play? Quentin.
In general? Laurie Strode.
She IS the image of a survivor in a horror situation.
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My first idea was the gas was like Scarecrow from Batman, but having you go up in fear and see things might be too similar to the Doctor's mechanic.
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I hear her name is actually Fabio Cortez.