YuffieGreatestWaifu
YuffieGreatestWaifu
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Shards can buy the premium perks (Shrine when available) off the killers, but no BHVR will likely never allow shards to be used for buying the character themselves. Besides Nurse and blight are Shard friendly and the best killers in the game.
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@HansLollos2 said:
I'm a bit scared about the Phase 2 improved anti-camping, anti-slugging and anti-tunneling in particular. For example if 2 Gens are left and a Killer can't really camp, slug or tunnel and also has to deal with anti-tunnel Perks, quick Heals, Survivors taking hits for each other and bodyblocks, it'll be really frustrating to play as Killer, if all a Killer can do is searching and chasing for the next Survivor in such a already stressful Situation.
Overall wouldn't it be a Idea to implemented a new alternate win condition for Killers, were hooks and not kills count? Like if the Killer gets 2 Hooks on every Survivor, the Killer get's a match result that counts as a 4k. Basically an alternate Option for a Killer to play the game.
I am just as scared for phase 1 the go next who is going to enforce it how it is sefined. For example you have 3 gens and 2 players killer could accuse the player of go next if they purposefully blow hook saves to give his friend hatch or gate.
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@[Deleted User] said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/438979/anti-camping-doesnt-do-enough
Its not anti camping, its anti-facecamping, its not ment to stop camping but facecamping. It works as intented
Doesnt even do a good job there for example you face any good haste character you take a hit they can almost instantly use their special ability to give that death hit and your right back on the ground.
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The problem is SWF bust this game hard and balancing toward swfs makes SOLO Q unplayable. Cote has to allow better communications for players because otherwise killers will complain about SWF gameplay but once you balance toward that you destroy the game for the rest of the base.
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This game has a SWF issue, the mechanics of the game is broken in half by them. Worst is you balance against SWFs you make SOLO Q unplayable.
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This mechanic will just encourage the slugging build and since you can't communicate in game and all the anti-slug perks besides Unbreakable are terrible the only counter is SWF 3rd party VC. But whatever DBD wants to make SOLO Q disappear let them its basically unplayable to play with randoms and this will just hasten that progress.
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The best answer is a non-collusion haste that allows players to leave the area and they cant be interacted with and they cant interact back..
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Its compounded by the AI bots which has much skill in looping him as Nemmy have a good early game.
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I dont mind being at a disadvantage but you listen to people like Trutalent who wants to base the game off the 5% and thinks being survivor is way to easy.
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The problem of bots is they are programmed to hide whenever a killer even touches their radius and 2 v 8 its all the time so they are hiding the entire match and contributing nothing to the game.
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Pretty much nailed it its a solo Q killer perk for slugging.
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@Emeal said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3880776#Comment_3880776
If that was true and happened in all SWFs, then all stealth Killers would have a visible disadvantage against SWF in the stats.
But it doesn't happen in all SWF, now does it?
Because not all SWFs are comp heavy but I am willing to beat Comp Swfs have a much lower kill rate than any others.
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@Emeal said:
Do we have any stats that demonstrate that SWF is having an unfair advantage?
Pretty sure the vas majority of SWF is equal to soloQ, idd like to see SoloQ winrate against SWF winrate over MMR%The Voice chat system itself breaks the game.
1. You have quasi bond
2. If one player know where the killer is they all do and that breaks stealth killers
3. Their coordination becomes very hard especially with Sabo, Flashlights for the killer to deal with.
4. Gen rushing becomes a very hard to beat especially if you have 1-2 people doing Killer diversions. -
@WolfgangGarou said:
That is precisely the problem. But if you try to balance the game around the SWF, you will unfairly penalise the solo survivors.
Hence my suggestion to focus the balancing on the solos and simply compensate the killer for the round with the totally broken balance afterwards. Just a consolation, sure, but much better than nothing.
I tried posting my ideas on SWF balancing giving Solo players the same tools SWFS have and Killers will toddler temper tantrum it would give unfair advs to survivors. My response was then it would be fair for all players and players like Trutalent toddler temper tantrum even more.
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I feel innovations are like dark bargains with the Entity itself. It would be nice to have perks that trade states of conditions or even allowing a KO hit to thus inflicted upon thyself.
I would then define Martyrdom as a different perk
Martyrdom
When you heal a survivor from a dying state via killer this activates and marks the survivor for 30-45-60sec
When a marked survivor is put into a dying state again, they instead are put into healthy status and get the hit haste speed per usual also get unmarked, and you get put into a dying state and cannot recover via any healing for 90 sec also killer gets killer instinct on you while in the dying state being hooked removes this status.
This gives dark bargains giving the entity what it wants and allowing others to be saved. -
SWF team ie premade teams are not always comp sweaty players. There are many players who just HAD IT with players who off themselves or do nothing the ENTIRE match and want to have fun. I been playing solo and I can tell you there is a certain amount of rage when both happens because I can't quit without punishment, and I have no hope to win besides a pity win.
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The ONLY buff I would suggest is showing if the timer or the Killer removed the status effect of Wiretap something SWFs would know anyways.
One suggestion is changing the sound effect gives us a clue which might be useful for a stealth killer. -
Just increase the range via Kindred
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Okay keep all the distractions BUT have a separate game mode for them. I get sick of games where survivors do everything but gens because the Tomes are telling them do so.
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@dbd900bach said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3878119#Comment_3878119
I don't recall mocking anyone or passing blame onto the players, killer or survivor.
See Trutalent and many other killers who mock survivors. Just have perfect movements and meta perks oh and be SWF too.
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Like it or not DBD is a casual game not designed for SWF gameplay. If they did the kill rate will increase to 90+% and many casuals who make up most of the actual player base would LEAVE. BHVR is walking a very fine tight rope not too hard for most of the player base will still trying to balance against SWFS in some ways.
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Then they will complain about flashbangs, power struggle and flashlights. Killers want easier hooks.
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@jesterkind said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3875681#Comment_3875681
Nope, it offers an answer for one scenario for the killer: Survivors trying to make themselves unhookable as a team. It doesn't help as much for just one survivor doing it, but you don't really need a basekit answer to that, so that's fine.
And, yeah, obviously this is primarily a survivor buff, the issue is a killer action so that's how you'd fix it.
SWFs make playing solo hard because SWFS have hard counters to slugging solo none.
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@Coffeecrashing said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3875431#Comment_3875431
The killer can't force a survivor to pick themselves off the ground, to trigger the extra 20 seconds wiggle time. And the killer really can't be expected to just stand over the slugged survivor while their teammates repair generators. The killer will have to leave the slugged survivor, at which point the survivor gets their base kit unbreakable, even though the killer was forced to slug.
See this is why Solo Q vs SWF are a thing. SWF they can tell players killer is slugging and work on gens harder. SOLO Q you have 3 morsels drop gens and even if one drops gen working Slugging becomes an auto win.
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@jesterkind said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3875493#Comment_3875493
The only proper counters being through perks isn't a great idea, it means you have to run those perks every game just in case.
…Though, OG Buckle Up was terrible, I'm not sure what you're referring to here.
Pre-patch gave both players endurance now it gives a weak haste which fast killers can still out chase.
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PetTheDoggoMember Posts:4505:38PMJust no,I am not fully against antislugging mechanic, but it should work only in early game to prevent killers using slugging as main strategy.Sure, you can go with basekit unbreakable, but put some limitations on it, so it can't be used mid game and definetly not late game.I believe slugging has place in this game and it is needed tool for the killer, it's issue only when it is used as primary strategy and killer simply ignores hooking survivors.
Yea you have players who start slugging from start because the only good counter is SWF teams. They bank on playing solo which makes solo player terrible. -
Slugging had a decent counter with OG buckle up now its worth crap.
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Devil_hit11Member Posts:9,3344:43PM@UndeddJester said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3873334#Comment_3873334
I suppose that would definitely be a case of forcing the killer to slug I guess. Definitely ain't ever picking that up.
The unhookable map locations get even worse, I suppose all you can do is permanently take sac wards and if you do wind up on such a map, perma slug the boil over player and tunnel out anyone not running it, then bleed the Boil Over user to death.
Like i said, i think the issue with slugging is that survivor can rush all 5 generators faster than the killer can bleed survivors out. that is why whenever someone faces boil over player or any type of sabotage/force killer slug gameplay, it's always complained about on killer side. in fact, in very first iteration of dbd. Jake used to have a perk called saboteur.The perk allowed you to break every single hook on the map permanently. the funny part is. we're in 2024-2025 and well known players like tru3 are now playing as if Old Saboteur exists. They're just slugging everyone. Tru3 does try to hook people and even with 75% of his downs being slugs, he still kills people faster by hooking 1 person than bleeding out.if that doesn't show that killing people through slugging is unviable, i am not sure what does. vs less skilled survivors, downing people on the floor is very good game-delay but the more experienced survivors can rush gens efficiency while picking people up. so you kinda don't get much game-delay while not really progressing your objective.I am not sure how BVHR makes killer gain kills through slugging more reliable/more risky for survivor to get slugged but I do not think Boil over is at fault.
Against slugging the only counter is SWFs solos its mostly a lost cause. -
@UndeddJester said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3873334#Comment_3873334
I suppose that would definitely be a case of forcing the killer to slug I guess. Definitely ain't ever picking that up.
The unhookable map locations get even worse, I suppose all you can do is permanently take sac wards and if you do wind up on such a map, perma slug the boil over player and tunnel out anyone not running it, then bleed the Boil Over user to death.
Sluggers look for excuses to slug
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@LapisInfernalis said:
@YuffieGreatestWaifu No Mither squad.
The worst perk in the game and you are always a one hit… yep troll squad.
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One massive reason there is no way to escape it. Unbreakable is once per a game the other two methods require a trash Boon or be cursed and how many sluggers run hexes?
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The only way I would agree is having two options base class +2 perks or 4 perks for Survivors and Killer
That means you play your base perk plus two more or pick and choose 4.
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The problem of slugging 4k the ONLY counter is SWF coms. Solos have no perk or counter to it. Buckle up lost its endurance bonus replaced by a terrible 5 sec haste bonus to which against the speed killers does nothing. Even TruTalent admitted it works against Solos not Swfs.
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Bots should have AI levels according to the MMR. A high rank MMR the bots are quicker, the lower they are weaker.
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Nemesis should have a run attack that breaks walls once he gets more powerful instead of having to do a slow animation.
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@smurf said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3871148#Comment_3871148
Slugging for 4k isn't related to SWFs. By the time a killer is able to slug for 4k, the match is already won. That's a decision made independent of whether the survivors were in a SWF.
It would be possible to argue that SWFs on comms make killers feel the need to tunnel or proxy camp. But honestly, that just ruins the game for the people the killer is sharing the game with. The target becomes unable to do anything other than be chased for as long as they're in that match; they don't even get to play the game they should be expecting to play. If my opponents are better than me, that doesn't justify me making someone wonder why they bought the game. Instead, I play it out, take my loss, and get better. And if there's a balance issue, that's for us to come here and talk about so BHVR can solve it.
My opinion is that the only justification for tunneling, camping, or slugging for 4k is if the survivor has decided to bm first. Then the killer can decide if they want to reciprocate. But I think there are also certain mechanisms that could be coded into the game to diminish the amount of teabagging or other bm that players have to deal with. And don't get me wrong, I do on rare occasions see a survivor teabag, then do it again at a pallet, and so I'll decide that bad manners beget bad manners… though I'll also say that I usually just ignore the bait.
However, you're not wrong that external comms create a game balance issue. We can do things like increasing MMR for SWFs, and implementing comeback mechanisms or other solutions, and I think that's the discussion we should be having. What's the way we make most matches worth playing for most people?
It is regarding Sabo or bully squads they are one MASSIVE reason why Killers resort to slugging but the problem is once Killers got used to that strategy they never stop.
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@Roco45 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3870936#Comment_3870936
No, that's just your contribution, not the actual discussion. There's plenty of people on this thread and on the forums that are open to actual discussion, instead of just trying to shut down every single conversation because of their own personal bias.
You've stated not only actual counter argument to how adjusting SWF mechanics would negatively impact the entire game and instead deferred to "It would just make me feel bad. Punishment bad :(".
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3870939#Comment_3870939
Exactly! If SWF was changed, then Killers could stop being buffed and overtuned to deal with the most co-ordinated SWF as they exist in the game right now. That would in turn make balancing easier and more fair so Killers, SoloQ matches and bad SWF groups wouldn't be "punished", as some people like throw that word around lol
The entire game rn revolves around a very very very small percentage of the community and it's abhorrent how that's been allowed to continue ruining the game.
The problem is Dead by Daylight is balanced for Solo Q and SWFs with coms break most of the mechanics of the game. SWFs can relay information like Killer location, perks, Killer Add-ons and more. This is information SOLO Q teams dont have or have to waste perks to get to the same level. This is why Gen-rushing with SWFs is so dangerous forcing Killers to play very Toxic gameplay like Slug 4k.
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@barbedwire said:
Let's keep punishing the killers like the last couple of updates. Great idea.
Because Survivors werent? They had some of their best perks neutered see Distortion, FTP, Adrenline, Buckle up
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@joeyspeehole said:
…Or change Knockout. Make it so that killers get way more points for hooks instead of deaths. Maybe have a progression option for unbreakable like it starts when more than one person is slugged.
Bloodpoints are pointless many killers have one goal to get a 4K as easily as possible.
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For Killers who think there will be another killer Strike its already happening because Killers want the path of least resistance. Slugging works against all solo teams and it can grant you much easier wins. The ONLY downfall you will have to dedicate the entire build around it and does not work with SWF teams.
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@sanees said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3868628#Comment_3868628
Even swf has to waste time and roughly indicate where the killer is
Giving every survivor a grenade launcher is not a solutionIf your struggling on hook you are not wasting time relaying the killer location
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- Make Bond, Empathy, Kindred all base game features rework the perks to do something else.
- As soon as the killer is revealed its revealed to all players
- Anti-camp bar feature is shown to all players
- Heartbeat detector is when a killer is close by (not in stealth mode) indicator is shown by all players in an icon
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Actually, I endorse this along with stun reductions. Blinding and stunning should start very strong but as the game progresses the entity keeps making the killer stronger to the point where Survivors have to flee. That being said if your going to do this give Survivors abilties to get out of slugging as well.
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Killers that slug DO NOT CARE ABOUT BLOODPOINTS. Their goal is to win.
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@Crowman said:
The reason killers slug for the 4K is because of how hatch works. If you really want to address slugging for the 4K, you have to change Hatch away from an RNG escape for the last survivor.
They will slug either way because they dont want to mess with the hook system even Trutalent admits that.
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Just add the feature to group play already. If your friends in a group you shouldnt have to resort to using discord or other apps you trust them already.
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The problem of 4K slugging the counters to it are coordinated SWF teams and solo Q have no real answer to it. Buckle up is a joke and already I have seen some killers complain (like TruTalent) he is seeing entire teams use Unbreakable and Dead hard which is pretty much the only way to stay up against high MMR killers. The meta of 4K Slugging is simple pressure and the lack of urgency to Hooks means no tunneling or having to deal with Shoulder the burden.
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You do realize every killer has its own matchmaking MMR in regular games (not the Event mode I believe).
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@DNet89 said:
I would just double the tokens from 4 to 8 that seems like a fair buff
Agreed you have to earn them by staying in the killers radius.
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Uses for Stake out
1. HyperFocus
2. Green or Yellow Add-on that gives bonuses to heal checks on great checks
3. Fogwise
4. Scavenger free tool refill
5. Specialist one time but still
6. Deadline becomes more manageable
7. Corrective Action (Gives tokens back)