SuzuKR
SuzuKR
About
- Username
- SuzuKR
- Joined
- Visits
- 0
- Last Active
- —
Comments
-
@StarLost said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2916909#Comment_2916909
Yuppers. And yes, I'm trying to make a point here regarding balancing off kill rates and why it's silly, because these are always going to be heavily distorted by newer players.
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2916908#Comment_2916908
Source?
I’ll link you back to a comment I made in a different thread where I had answered this before:
@SuzuKR said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2903743#Comment_2903743
Just going to preface this with two things first. People usually only upload YouTube videos of wins, and most of the popular content creators are all fairly or amazingly good players, which brings me to the second point. MMR is unreliable, especially at that level of skill, because as even BHVR said, there is not enough of them for consistently even skill matches in pubs. This is why you see good players/said content creators dominate most matches regardless of side or build. Also 99% of videos saying "high mmr/rank 1/etc" are just clickbait garbage. It's pretty clear when players are actually good, because you will see how they change up playstyle against the Nurse. Same for how the Nurse responds to mindgames.
I am not including scrims, as I still consider that part of tournament (since it is tournament practice). However, some videos will be against competitive players/partial competitive player teams in non-tournament settings (eg, pubs or non-tournament KYF, similar to how content creators will organize matches against each other). Finding genuinely even matches for those absurdly good players is very rare. Fully even builds are even rarer, so keep in mind that it won't apply necessarily. (Eg, some people going hyper top meta, others with less meta or non-meta perks, etc). Some are just 1v1 clips between good players, to show that they can run them for a good amount of time in an actual chase.
<https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o4ZHFVowqws> Fubs vs partial tournament SWF in regular non-tournament KYF
<https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q_R-gkMwKpA> SupaAlf on MMR Test Day 3 (skill matching prioritized over queue time)
<https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xnjfG_sLfQg> SupaAlf 1v1s (Yerv/SuperAaronNova/Vizion) - Vizion's runs are particularly of note here
<https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ig_iQ5S-ABA> SupaAlf 1v1s (Fubs/Sweh/Otz)
<https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=30TKsT-s8Y8> Ayrun's gameplay versus a decent Nurse
Hope that helps!
Feel free to ask if there’s anything else you want to know. The above is referencing non-competitive, but if you’re curious about competitive where god Nurses and god SWFs play against each other regularly, the average there is 2K as well with standard tournament restrictions. When all restrictions are completely removed, Nurse’s kill rate average drops to a negative (less than 2/match). However, the above post is to show on the rare cases where MMR does give even matches or high level players do a KYF or whatever together, it very clearly evens out.
-
@StarLost said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/320145/should-nurse-be-nerfed
Eh...
Here's the thing.
Nurse is absolutely too strong at certain skill levels, for sure. A big part of that comes from her addons.
However, Nurse is also absolutely too weak at certain skill levels, as demonstrated by her kill rates.
If BHVR are going to balance around gross kill rates (Wraith and Cenobite nerfs, for instance), then Nurse and Blight get to stay as-is - because otherwise you're endorsing a double standard.
If they were willing to buff the lower B and the C and D tier killers, then go ahead and reign Nurse and Blight in. Otherwise...yeah, again - double standards generally aren't a good idea.
Or - rework Nurse completely.
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2916466#Comment_2916466
I'd be curious to see Blight's kill rates now.
Even skill matches actually average out to ~2K for the Nurse.
-
I’d disagree. The first and second best designed killers are Nurse and Blight respectively.
Nurse ignoring walls is why she is the best designed, because it makes chases dependent solely on which player is more skilled at mindgaming - the most important aspect of chase. It does not factor in map or tile RNG which is out of either side’s control. She cannot auto win at tiles like a dead zone where a M1 115 will just walk up and the survivor has no way to avoid it. She also will not auto lose at strong tile set ups the way a M1 115 will.
Blight is the second best designed because although he is still restricted by physical collision, he is able to 50/50 almost every single tile in the game via mindgaming the way Nurse can.
Blink distance/third blink/Alchemist Ring/Compound 33 need changes. Other than those though, Nurse and Blight are in a perfect spot, and averages of games between even skill players on even maps shows the same.
-
Range and third blink are the only issues. Recharge is balanced and good design.
-
Why would there be? There’s nothing wrong with it. The counter is picking the other person back up.
-
The problem with DH is the unconditional distance, nothing else.
-
@eloise said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2915795#Comment_2915795
Nope I had just come out of the basement, he hit me on the steps and then 'hit at the door closest to the market of the killer's hut
He can catch back up if he has enough charges and/or movespeed.
-
Sounds like they need to get over it and learn.
-
@Kurri said:
Hold on, when was unbreakable strong? A second chance perk you get to only use once in a match, if the Killer slugs you, and if the killer can't count to 20?
Combination with DS, faster recovery always regardless of self-pick up, the ability to undo multi-person downs, etc. Killer has to slug in some situations, because not doing so is a dumb misplay. But it's also not unbalanced either.
-
UB is balanced as is.
-
Tunneling and camping are BHVR-acknowledged and supported and balanced strategies this game is designed around from its very core. Tunneling and camping correctly is skillful. Punishing reckless tunneling and camping is already fully easily doable, and is also skillful.
-
Not listening to the majority of horrendous ideas people have on the Twitter/Reddit/forums.
Other than that, general map and tile generation logic improvements, optimization where possible. More info for solo queue to match SWF level, and buffing killers to match all survivors having SWF level info. That’s really about it for the major stuff. DBD is pretty well balanced for most of the playerbase, and most complaints are just a skill issue.
-
too lazy didn’t read
skill issue
-
Streamers that are toxic/rude, have titles like “DESTROYING SWEATY 4 MAN SWF”/“LOOPING BABY KILLER FOR 5 GENS”, or complain about MMR/sweaty matches automatically make me lose all respect for them.
I really respect wholesome and friendly streamers, regardless of skill level.
-
If the Nurse gets a hit with her first blink, the survivor horribly messed up. Also. This kills synergy and diversity for no actually good reason. Exposed perks on Nurse are a non-issue.
-
@indieeden7 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2912798#Comment_2912798
1) You need a flashlight to do that, one of the weakest items in the game.
2) It stuns her for about 1/4 of a second, this is hardly a reasonable counterpoint to OP's complaint.
Mindgames are the strongest counter regardless. Also Flashbangs in the hand of good players are enormously strong because dropping it to where she blinks is a guaranteed fatigue if you correctly read where she’s blinking to and dropped it in the right spot. Not that Flashbangs are a reliable counter, but just wanting to inform you.
-
BHVR already mentioned the problem they had with Dead Hard was the ability to use it for unconditional distance (since that was busted and not what they wanted the perk to do). The reason DH is strong against Nurse is for the i frame. So even if they remove the unconditional dash, it doesn’t affect usage against Nurse.
-
Why would she be reworked? She's the best-designed killer in the game and the one that promotes the most skill in chase both as and against her. Performatively she's perfectly balanced too, when comparing games with players of even skill.
-
@Alen_Starkly said:
The DC penalty is totally fine, as long as my opponent(s) are not way better than me, to the point that I don't get to do anything in the game. I love going against Nurses that I can loop at least for a little bit, even if they kill me in the end. That's fun. What's not fun is not being able to dodge a single blink hit, 'cause the Nurse is top tier, and no juke I attempt works against her. Now add to that me going against a top tier Nurse 4 matches in a row.
Don't care. Play it out. Same for opposite side. Don't like it? Don't queue up or quit the game.
-
@MetaBuildSurvivor said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2912167#Comment_2912167
I really doubt you gonna dodge a high skilled Nurses M1, sure with dead hard. Which just delays your hook another three seconds...
You do realize there are equally high skilled survivors that know how to play against Nurse, right?
-
Skill issue
-
@MetaBuildSurvivor said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2912068#Comment_2912068
Okay. Let's put you into a scenario. You are being chased by a Nurse and already took a hit from her, though you managed to break LoS. Mid chase the perk "Bitter Murmur" pops, due to the last gen being done. She now has 10 seconds to blink directly ontop of you. How do you play around 10 seconds reveal? You already lost the advantage of LoS.
By dodging the blink? It’s like dodging a blink in the open. You can still do it.
-
No one needs to see Grades endgame. People need to quit blaming Grades for their lack of skill.
-
@MetaBuildSurvivor said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2912025#Comment_2912025
Mindgaming an info perk? How are you gonna mindgame someone when they have vision on you through walls? Have you ever played against a Nurse high MMR?
Every single info perk has a way to play around it.
-
@Valik said:
Everyone talks about her addons and attacks and lunge... why not rework her altogether?
She isn't exactly the picture of perfect balance by any stretch of the imagination - what would all of you do if you were written a blank check and Behavior asked YOU to come up with Nurse 2.0 ?
Why? She's the best-designed and best-balanced killer, if you pay attention to actual even-skill matches/even map matches.
-
@MetaBuildSurvivor said:
even if you tape your W key down, and consistently lose LOS on the psyche ward map, a good nurse will just ignore that and blink ontop of you anyway with her info perks.... So no counterplay at all. At least with baby nurses you can walk towards.
Get better at mindgaming.
-
@pizzaduffyhp90 said:
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/MJMJFWCB13PK/image.png
You had the right matchmaking test right here. Should stick with this one BHVR it's nice for both sides being able to chill and not have a stressful time. There could be more Killer players and some Survivor players would want to maybe try Killer cause I still see people saying I don't want to try Killer it looks to stressful this could help those players want to consider killer.
Grade-based MM is the literal exact opposite of that. It was complete one sided stomps. How is that reasonable?
-
Sounds like a you problem. Stop DCing, or quit.
-
LOL
-
The distance is what makes DH busted.
-
Exhaustion doesn’t need buffs.
-
Why would recharge be changed? They’re healthy and balanced.
-
@Tiufal said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2909091#Comment_2909091
Which is only true to the top 1% where gameplay is fundamental different to casual public games.
I’m not talking about tournament play only. I’m including pubs.
-
@RakimSockem said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2909080#Comment_2909080
I'm sorry, you said Nurse is the most balanced killer. A pro Nurse, and I mean someone who has MASTERED the character can slap any team, probably with no perks, no matter how good the survivors are, what perks they bring, or what items they use. She's literally been at the top of any tier list created since she was introduced to the game
There will always be a top regardless. Top is not synonymous with overpowered. She performs at an average of 2K consistently in even skill match ups. What you claim is just blatantly incorrect. If you take things one step further (into tournament play level), she averages a negative kill rate (less than 2/match) when all restrictions are completely removed.
-
@Tiufal said:
Her basekit is broken, and she has enough mechanics you can put on the cutter. for example you can cutdown/remove her blink lunge, so if you cant blink properly you dont get carried by her "180 lunge around the corner" anymore. You can look into fatigue, into range, into blink speed, into recovery, you can even limit through how many objects she can blink. There are enough option for a basekit change. afterwards you have to adjust the addons. Just chaning addons doesnt do anything. the playerbase has already proven that even basekit nurse is broken.
Which is why she averages out to a 2K when going against players of even skill, yep.
-
I somewhat agree and somewhat don’t. Yes, a good player can do fine on every killer. This is in part due to MMR not giving good/god opponents often (due to how few there are in comparison to the average players). However, they are at a different starting line. Against very good survivor teams, an equally good Nurse or Blight player starts the race at the same line. Other killers would start varying amounts of distance behind. Yeah, skill can make up for the difference, which has been proven before. But they are still behind what is the equal standard.
-
@Firellius said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2908507#Comment_2908507
It had a turn rate limitation back when I played. Unless you're talking about the wind-up before the dash, in which case, yeah, he can adjust as fast as he can move his cursor. But once he's dashing, he can only veer, not hook or flick, IIRC.
I meant flicking at the moment of smashing. For instance, zooming past a wall and flicking 90 to hit someone to the side. While rushing without attacking, yeah, you can only turn normally.
-
@Firellius said:
If you were up against an Oni making a hard 90 degree turn, you were up against a hacker.
Uh, no. Oni can do stuff like 540° flicks by default. Also, 90° flicks are literally intended.
-
No. Split up, play safe early to deny his first hit for as long as possible (he can only 99 with passive gain), hide as necessary, learn where his power is difficult to apply properly.
-
@eleventbh said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2905351#Comment_2905351
Just now saw this, thanks. I agree with everything you said there and I actually used to watch those SupaAlf so I'm surprised this is the first time I'm seeing them.
I'm genuinely glad I was able to help! :)
-
@Starrseed said:
The thing is I know why the systems does this so like you said people don't wait for hours but I hate it for one simple reason. Let's say the elit players are 10/10 so to lessen the q times they could be matched with 9 or 8 players. But why in all hells do I a 5 at best fece people that are atleast a 8? That makes no sense it feels like I get them because they have to long q times because we lack killer over all and at peak times everything gets out of control and we basically have no mmr at all
Because unfortunately, the chance the 9-8 players are on, in the same region, and searching for a lobby of the opposite type the same time the 10 player is, is pretty low. For instance, the 9-8 players get into a game and start playing, the 10 player gets in queue later, gets matched with 5 or whatever, the 9-8 is done and starts another queue, gets a game, the 10 finishes, etc etc.
-
“If player plays perfectly they always win”
I don’t know why people keep repeating this utterly worthless irrelevant point. No one plays perfectly. Also if someone plays perfectly, that means they won every single mindgame with their opponent(s). They SHOULD win if they play perfectly. But no one plays perfectly so it’s irrelevant in the first place.
Just like there are god Nurse players, there are the exact same parallels with god Survivor players that will make for an even match against that Nurse. People keep blaming balance for matchmaking issues. It is not Nurse’s fault that there will always be a low amount of players who are good or amazing compared to those that are average. It is also not Nurse’s fault that the good or amazing players get matched with worse players because otherwise their queue time would take hours. When there are actually even match ups both in and out of actual tournaments, it consistently averages out to around 2K.
Maybe take more than 5 seconds to think and realize the reason a god Nurse is winning almost every single pub game is the same as why extremely good killer players kill almost every single pub game regardless what they take or run/why extremely good survivor players escape almost every single match ever.
-
Only range and third blink need reworks.
Heavy Panting could be removed. Kavanagh’s Last Breath could be turned into, I dunno, Infectious maybe. (Downing someone with a hit after blinking = AoE screams)
Torn Bookmark needs to keep the +1 blink for the achievement. But the downside should probably be reverted (can’t blink through areas without LOS). There is no fundamental way to balance three blinks without breaking the rest of the kit. The old version was a pretty garbage meme add-on, but that’s the only form 3 blinks would be okay in.
-
Nurse has the most well designed and balanced power in the entire game by an absolute landslide. Chases are 100% exclusively determined by player skill versus player skill in mindgaming and nothing else out of either side’s control. That is the peak of skill expression for both sides. Range add-ons and third blink are bad design but they’re the only issues on an otherwise perfect killer.
-
Kavanagh's Last Breath/Heavy Panting (blink distance) and Torn Bookmark (third blink) add-ons need full reworks as they are fundamentally unhealthy design, but other than those three, everything else about Nurse is in a spot of perfect design and balance.
-
Take video evidence they are refusing to do gens. For instance, continually checking gens and they have no progress. What they are doing is completely reportable and they can get banned for it. People have gotten banned for it before.
You must report both in-game and on the online support ticket page.
-
@GannTM said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2906505#Comment_2906505
It means Spirit is more punished for a bad read and survivors are more rewarded for a good play. Nurse and Blight’s cooldowns are laughable how little they are.
Nurse and Blight cooldowns are where they should be and other killers are far too behind. Even 6-10s is sizable especially in the hands of better players. Other killers have 15-30+ for mistakes or losing a trade, which is absolutely absurd. Every single second is worth 4x that much to the survivors. 10 seconds is 40 net seconds.
-
Would be interested in seeing feedback anyone else has!
-
@GannTM said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2906356#Comment_2906356
That’s a weird way to spell “Spirit”
Spirit has a significantly bigger power downtime and her anti loop is comparatively weaker to both. Not that she’s bad, she’s still easily #3. But why Nurse and Blight are better design. They can continuously play more so, if that makes sense.
-
@StarLost said:
Eh.
I won't insult the killer, but camping is still zero fun to be on the other end of, especially if it's a Bubba, a Ghostface, a Trickster or a Myers.
If a survivor hides all game, they are going to get AFK crows and be destroyed.
MMR isn't perfect, but it's far better than it once was.
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2906372#Comment_2906372
There's camping and there's camping. The devs want to get rid of facecamping and I support them in that - so long as it doesn't break the game.
It’s extremely difficult to punish reckless facecamping without punishing all other forms of camping, which is why it has been taking BHVR such a long time, as well as scrapping every idea they’ve tried.