SuzuKR
SuzuKR
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- SuzuKR
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Comments
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People acting like DBD is unplayable/anything is unbeatable/etc.
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I think he's super cool and fun to versus.
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DBD players stop projecting your own subjective sense of unfun challenge (very hard)
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@Sumnox said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2933750#Comment_2933750
Theory is great. Do you perhaps have video examples that showcase your mastery?
Do you have evidence that backs up your claims?
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@Sumnox said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2933696#Comment_2933696
I would love to see those games actually. I can perfectly judge if the Nurse is experienced or not.
Still waiting for your evidence she overperforms.
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@Sumnox said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2933675#Comment_2933675
So the answer to my question is no. You can't provide any personal experience as evidence. The videos you posted can't be applied to the average match, because it's a very specific setting with the players involved representing an absolutely ridiculous minority.
Apply all of this to solo queue and this all gets thrown off the window.
Most solo players are not good. Not good players against what will probably be a good player is... very obvious, hopefully.
Which is literally why BHVR is working on closing the gap between solo and SWF by giving solo more information on what teammates are doing, for instance.
Still waiting for the evidence she overperforms.
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@Sumnox said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2933646#Comment_2933646
But it... does not?
Also, are you that famous God-tier survivor who plays solo and wins against God-tier Nurses on a daily basis, or are you one of those who "see a lot of those survivors, but in my case I'm not that good myself. But I see so many of them constantly. They're everywhere. Don't ask me for any kind of specifics or proof though."
If you want anyone to take what you say even remotely seriously, you should probably offer actual meaningful evidence.
Anyways, I've linked a post where I've already explained nuances of MMR and its relation to skill matchups as well as examples of where genuinely good players of more or less even skill play against one another in a non-tournament setting. If you are curious about tournament settings where some of the best Nurses and best survivors in the world face off against one another, feel free to ask for that as well. Spoiler, she averages a 2K there too, and drops to below 2K average when all restrictions are removed.
@SuzuKR said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2903743#Comment_2903743
Just going to preface this with two things first. People usually only upload YouTube videos of wins, and most of the popular content creators are all fairly or amazingly good players, which brings me to the second point. MMR is unreliable, especially at that level of skill, because as even BHVR said, there is not enough of them for consistently even skill matches in pubs. This is why you see good players/said content creators dominate most matches regardless of side or build. Also 99% of videos saying "high mmr/rank 1/etc" are just clickbait garbage. It's pretty clear when players are actually good, because you will see how they change up playstyle against the Nurse. Same for how the Nurse responds to mindgames.
I am not including scrims, as I still consider that part of tournament (since it is tournament practice). However, some videos will be against competitive players/partial competitive player teams in non-tournament settings (eg, pubs or non-tournament KYF, similar to how content creators will organize matches against each other). Finding genuinely even matches for those absurdly good players is very rare. Fully even builds are even rarer, so keep in mind that it won't apply necessarily. (Eg, some people going hyper top meta, others with less meta or non-meta perks, etc). Some are just 1v1 clips between good players, to show that they can run them for a good amount of time in an actual chase.
<https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o4ZHFVowqws> Fubs vs partial tournament SWF in regular non-tournament KYF
<https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q_R-gkMwKpA> SupaAlf on MMR Test Day 3 (skill matching prioritized over queue time)
<https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xnjfG_sLfQg> SupaAlf 1v1s (Yerv/SuperAaronNova/Vizion) - Vizion's runs are particularly of note here
<https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ig_iQ5S-ABA> SupaAlf 1v1s (Fubs/Sweh/Otz)
<https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=30TKsT-s8Y8> Ayrun's gameplay versus a decent Nurse
Hope that helps!
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Even besides intended or not, they are still healthy parts of his skill kit that increases mindgaming potential for both sides in chase, because now there are more methods to play and play against for both sides. Certain tiles prevent bump logic from working well which creates hard counters which are inherently bad game design because that trumps player skill. However, bump logic and sliding have distinctly different mindgaming routes, and so reading correctly lets you evade either. This is directly skillful, as it comes down to which player is better at reading and mindgaming the other.
Furthermore, hug tech was altered so Blight has to look down while doing it, which thus reduces his range to which he can see and thus gives the survivor more options.
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Blight was literally designed with the ability to slide in mind. McLean, who is the creator of Blight, intentionally designed sliding mechanics, as well as stating there were intentional QoL fixes on console because it used to be more difficult to slide for console players. https://www.twitch.tv/mclean_yep/clip/SullenProductiveAlmondPastaThat-3gIl_qyQ2UAmaqun
@Bwsted said:
Not bannable because of the way the devs handle unintended mechanics, which they've been consistent about. So, I don't blame anyone who uses them.
Obviously exploits, though (at least the two you listed). Stemming simply from poor coding and oversight, likely becausde the raycast and/or attack cone is tied to the camera on the y-axis for slam detection, instead of being locked at 0° elevation, which allows to bypass triggering slams.
Blight’s collision is of two components, one of which is attached to the camera intentionally. McLean literally made it that way on purpose for the specific reason to alter collision. https://clips.twitch.tv/SaltyBeautifulFoxTriHard-d5EklvyTscZluOLe
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@Sumnox said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2933628#Comment_2933628
Ah yes, that made up survivor everyone talks about but nobody actually has in their matches, ever.
I have yet to see a single person here, actually prove any claims they make about "I win most of my matches as solo against God Nurses lol get good"
The last time I received video footage of consistent good performances of people who play solo and claim "lol its ez" was... never once.
Wow, it's almost like MMR does not consistently give even-skill matches.
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@Sumnox said:
Nurses play against themselves. You're just there to hold W, try to "mind game", try to duble back etc. It still doesn't matter. If they Nurse is experienced there is no counterplay other than repairing gens. And if it's solo queue against any experienced Nurse, just call it a gg because there is absolutely nothing you can do.
Which is why experienced survivors that are equally as good regularly average a 2 person escape even against good or god Nurses.
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Possibly lagflicking. People found a new way to do it after the old one was patched. The only way to hard 90 flick normally is either with Adrenaline Vial or during an attack.
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The wiggling mechanic exists so the killer can’t take you to the basement on the complete opposite side of the map, and so that they can’t take a match hostage (since bleed out timer is paused while being carried). It is not meant to be an actual escape method in normal play ever. Wiggling related perks are intentionally weak because they would be literally gamebreakingly overpowered if they weren’t weak.
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Fun fact, don’t DC and you won’t have this problem. This is 100% your fault.
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Blight is intentionally designed with sliding in mind as a mechanic, and it makes chases a lot more skillful as and against him because it gives more depth and mindgaming possibilities.
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Certain perks seem to be the exception, but they are not meant to be the norm.
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That is literally the point. You are not supposed to reliably wiggle off by yourself literally ever, or that would be completely gamebreakingly overpowered. Hatch needed a nerf, it was a horribly designed mechanic.
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Why would that be toxic?
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@ArchAbhor said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2931713#Comment_2931713
I can tell you didnt read the post. I've already accounted for both your argument and people like you.
Why do you even care what a random person you’ll probably never ever see again thinks? This entire thing is a non-issue.
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Oh boy another thing for people to use as an excuse for why they lost instead of accepting the reality they played worse.
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It doesn’t, but they’re still bad designed regardless. It doesn’t affect the second blink.
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Gen rushing isn’t even real almost ever.
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Corrupt Intervention is a band-aid for excessively large maps and the flaws with having survivors able to spawn separately. If large maps were reduced in size and survivor spawns were changed to either always be all 4 together or in 2 pairs, it would no longer be necessary. Shrouds should be removed entirely.
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Gen rushing is not real almost ever. Yeah, occasionally you’ll face stuff like squads with quadruple Commodious Toolboxes with double charge add-ons/Prove Thyself/etc. That’s basically never.
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Is this thread a joke?
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DBD community stop confusing your subjective "unfun" with an objective "unbalanced" challenge (very hard)
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Second best-designed, second-best balanced killer in the game, tons of cool add-ons, what’s not to love? Alchemist Ring and Compound 33 are the only issues on an otherwise perfect killer.
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@Piruluk said:
Because FOV settings would kill stealth completely
The only thing it would affect is stuff like hiding by a window which is already useless against any decent killer that will check their surroundings.
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Boring and overdone: All characters are cishet until stated otherwise
Based: All characters are LGBT+ until stated otherwise
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lol ok
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lol no learn to bait it out lmfao
Also, DCing cause you don't like how the game goes and think using a perk as intended is "abuse" for some completely moronic reason, cringe.
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Stereotyping a side doesn’t help anyone.
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@Valik said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2928513#Comment_2928513
AH - nono, II didn't mean that in order to use her one must be perfect.
I meant to say that - if you use her power perfectly 100% of the time, you will always get a hit.
It's not realistic, because you cannot always see where survivors are - or predict where they will be in a second, but that's the point.
The killer requires muscle memory to learn, she needs the human element.
Human elements are really good at guestemating, but not often good at making precise calculations quickly.
If you hooked up some fictional computer to Nurse that perfectly understood the distance and traversal time of her power - and coded it to perfectly land on a survivor, she'd be stupefyingly powerful.
If she was able to land her blink accurately 100% of the time, she'd be absolutely broken.
What keeps her from being broken is the human element - that 'muscle memory' as you finely put it.
Her power demands machine perfection from a person - and punishes mistakes. This is how she is balanced.
Her primary balancing element is not that one must re-learn or anything, sorry if it sounded that way, the primary balancing element is that one must be perfect to excel at it, which means that most humans will struggle to accomplish such perfection.
It is a clever way to balance something that no other killer can truly boast of.
If you play any killer perfectly 100% of the time, you will win. It means you outdid the survivors in every single thing. It’s kind of pointless to even say something like this.
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@Munqaxus said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2928391#Comment_2928391
Her primary balancing element is that her power demands perfect skill
This isn't a balancing element. It just means it takes longer to learn her.
The hard part of learning her is muscle memory, once you've developed the muscle memory to know her blink distances, you just decimate survivors unless it happens to be a really good SWF with comms.
This is like saying a bicycle requires skill to use. Sure it's hard to learn, but once you learn it, you keep knowing it. It's not like you have to relearn the Nurse every time you play her.
So, do you have any meaningful proof to back up those claims yet? Cause she consistently averages out to a 2K in even matches. And no, self-reported aggregation of just a few thousand games is not meaningful proof.
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Killer doesn’t really need global buffs much in the first place anyways.
Base regression could be made less crap (0.25/s->0.5, Ruin changed to 100%, base kick is 5%, Pop is +20%).
Big maps should be reduced in size a bit and tile RNG should be adjusted. But that’s really about it.
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Shadowborn base 👉👈
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That is the point.
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For me? Having fun.
How most people use it? Probably 3-4 kills or escapes (or possibly personal escape).
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@Norhc said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2926379#Comment_2926379
Blight has higher skill ceiling + no amount of skill ceiling should prevent a character from balance changes
But she already is balanced. When she is matched against players of even skill, she gets an average of 2 kills. It is not a Nurse balance issue if MMR puts a Nurse with survivors worse than the Nurse. That is what is called matchmaking problems. It is also not a Nurse balance issue if DBD puts them into a map super good for Nurse, much like how it also is not a Nurse balance issue if it’s a super bad map for Nurse. That is what is called map design problems.
If you want to contest this, I’d like to see meaningful evidence to back up your claims.
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Juke = Anything to try and avoid a thing. Eg, sidestepping a hatchet.
Counterplay = Ability to respond to input from the other person. Eg, ability to avoid a Blight’s Lethal Rush.
Mindgame = Reading what the other player is doing and how they play to predict what they will try and do, and taking an action in response to that prediction. Eg, you think the Nurse will shorten the blink if you look back at her while running, so you do that and then don’t double back. If you did it right/the Nurse read you wrong, you evade the hit. If you did it wrong/the Nurse read you right, you get hit.
Blind chance = Doing something without a specific good plan in mind for the possibility it works. Eg, chucking a hatchet at a gen you have zero info on just in case a survivor happens to be there. You don’t play around anything, you just roll with it and pray.
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@Munqaxus said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2925978#Comment_2925978
She can’t chase via pure move speed (without meme-tier add-ons)
She has teleport, which is much faster than any killers walking speeds, of course she doesn't walk. This is like saying the Nurse can't use her bike all-the-while she's driving everywhere in her Lamborghini. Well let me tell you, every other killer is riding a bike while the Nurse is keeping hers in the trunk of her Lamborghini.
she can’t utilize Bloodlust
Again, she teleports. Would you really walk when you can teleport right on top of people.
window blockers are basically irrelevant to her
So the Nurse ignoring windows that every other killer has to deal with, is a downside...
she can’t use a normal lunge either (her lunge post-blink is 5.667m compared to the standard 6m, her regular post-blink is 3.333m compared to the standard 3m, to punish inaccurate blinks and better reward accurate ones).
Every other killers teleport-lunge is much worse than Nurse's teleport lunge. When I was teleport-lunging with Trapper, it just didn't seem to work.
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I'm going to list the downsides to each killer.
- Nurse: Some Mindgames
- Trapper: Mindgames, Windows, Pallets, Loops, Walls
- Wraith: Mindgames, Windows, Pallets, Loops, Walls
- Billy: Mindgames, Windows, Pallets, Loops, Walls
- Michael Myers: Mindgames, Windows, Pallets, Loops, Walls
- Hag: Mindgames, Windows, Pallets, Loops, Walls
- Doctor: Mindgames, Windows, Pallets, Loops, Walls
- Huntress: Mindgames, Windows, Pallets, Loops, Walls
Do you notice a pattern here. 1 killer in the entire DBD roster gets to ignore everything except for mindgames. And by the way, the Nurse can actually ignore a lot of mind games that every other killer doesn't get to ignore. Specifically, the Nurse ignores every mindgame that doesn't break line of sight.
So if a survivor is on the other side of a short wall, all the other killers have to try and force the survivor toward the shortest side of the loop. Nurse just teleports across and completely ignores the short wall.
Nurse is not and will never be balanced while she can teleport through objects.
It’s almost like chases being heavily tilted in one side’s favor due to RNG is bad design because it makes skill irrelevant when you auto win or auto lose a chase based off the tile setup. Also just cause there is LOS doesn’t mean she can’t be mindgamed. Read what she’s going to do and play against it.
Still waiting for you to back up your claims with an actually meaningful show of proof.
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No? It’s not by any means.
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@Munqaxus said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2925925#Comment_2925925
Nurse is like any other killer except you can't use loops, you can't use pallets, you can't use windows. Nurse is exactly like all the other killers, except she gets to ignore every defense survivors get to use against all the other killers.
So technically, she's unfair not only for survivors but all the other killers that don't get to ignore all the defenses survivors have, except for mind-games.
So it kind of amazes me that people continue to defend the Nurse even though she's like every other killer except she can ignore everything every other killer cannot ignore, accept for mindgames.
Yeah, and she can’t use any other killer assistance method either. It’s almost like she eliminates all clutter from both sides and makes it only skill-dependent on who is better at mindgaming.
She can’t chase via pure move speed (without meme-tier add-ons), she can’t utilize Bloodlust, window blockers are basically irrelevant to her, she cannot realistically utilize most mindgames 110-115% killers can (eg double back walking around a loop), and she can’t use a normal lunge either (her lunge post-blink is 5.667m compared to the standard 6m, her regular post-blink is 3.333m compared to the standard 3m, to punish inaccurate blinks and better reward accurate ones).
She doesn’t nullify chase. She makes it different rules, and one that still performs at a fair even level when players of even skill go against each other. If you want to contest this, you should go ahead and cite proof. The aggregate self-report collection-only site of a few thousand games is not proof.
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@GoshJosh said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2925942#Comment_2925942
I would like to see Distortion block killer instinct too. Besides survivors not having a perk for blocking it, it’s one of Jeff’s perks.. who came with the Legion DLC!
The entire reason that isn’t the thing is cause killer instinct is only used by powers and nullifying a core aspect of a power would be dumb.
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Don’t miss then. Skill issue.
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It’s amazing how many people continue to use the same inane argument she ignores every defense as if mindgaming wasn’t the most important aspect of chase for and against any killer anyways.
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@Aurelle said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2925681#Comment_2925681
Only inexperienced Nurse's do those things. You can't do anything against a good Nurse that knows what she is doing.
Why do people keep using this absolutely moronic argument? There are equally good survivors that know how to match the other player evenly. Yeah, maybe if they’re better than you, but that’s a skill issue. She performs at 2K average in actually even matches at high levels of play, both in and out of tournament settings.
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@GentlemanFridge said:
https://us.v-cdn.net/6030815/uploads/XGA5UZVEUPF0/image.png
This is from the wiki. Dunno if it helps you at all but there you go.
Oh huh, didn’t realize that was in the wiki because it wasn’t there in the past. Thanks! Now I’m realizing I don’t remember enough math to figure out the distance from those sorts of interpolations. The first question I had seems to be answered at least though.
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The problem with Dead Hard is still DH for unconditional distance. This is one way to do it, but why not just fix the problem instead and make it so you can’t dash unless you dodge an attack?
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It’s a cool and balanced add-on.