Stabby_Widdershins
Stabby_Widdershins
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@Gandor said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3302876#Comment_3302876
Make all killers 95% speed and give them 1000bp for every minute in game and consider them happy with the change /s
No BP's don't solve anything. If you can't play the game, the thing is bad experience and BP's will do nothing to fix the issue.
If you can't accept that your opponent is trying to win just as hard as you are; Maybe don't play PvP games?
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@jesterkind said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3302873#Comment_3302873
Because the survivor objective is an inanimate object and the killer objective is other human players whose experience in the game matters.
And that's the excuse to force one side to play worse? Because their opponent are people?
Guess what? The Killer is a person, too! And it's less fun for us when we have no say in who we can hook, and if we'd lose because a mechanic said 'No, you already hooked this injured person. Go spend another 4 minutes finding, chasing, hitting, chasing, hitting, and hooking someone fresh. Oh, they popped 3 gens and 99% the exit gates. Sucks to be you, Killer.'
It's a PvP game; if your opponent trying to win ruins your fun; don't play PvP games. What is with people thinking 'My fun is more important than my opponent trying to have fun & win'?
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Just give the camped Survivor BP for every second they are camped.
Fixed, and Survivors can stop demanding Killers be forced to play sub-optimally.
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Gen speeds go too fast to force Killers to spread the hooks around.
Until that is addressed; there should be no punishments for Killers or safety nets for Survivors that prevent 'tunneling'.
Why is it absolutely no one is able to think 'If Survivors can focus on their objective (gens) so can Killers (kills)'? Oh, right; because Survivors are convinced Killers exist for their entertainment, and that Survivors are owned an arbitrary amount of match time and 'fun'.
Also: Survivors don't deserve immunity, invincibility, and 10000000% stealth just because they think they deserve it.
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@Gandor said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3302445#Comment_3302445
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3302551#Comment_3302551
You just explained how you were denied camping benefits. That's the point. You are arguing that getting free info about other survivors is not enough and you want more (trade on hook? Free hit? Earn it in chase instead).
You already need 2 people to go off gens and then 1 in chase and 2 people occupied by healing off unhook. So only single person doing gens. And that's unfair? Well getting downs for nothing is actually unfair. Earn your downs for a change.
No, I described how this mechanic could be abused. You not wanting to admit that does not change facts.
Survivors don't deserve unhooks just because they think they are entitled to them. Earn your unhookings for a change.
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@StarLost said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3302603#Comment_3302603
I've suggested this multiple times.
I don't see why the devs have not done it. Players would be ecstatic to stop depipping & get more BP.
It would, quite possibly, cut down on allot of toxic feelings and frustrations towards the gameplay loop.
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@Xxjwaynexx said:
What's the difference between a survivor tunneling a gen and me tunneling a surv. We are both trying our best to complete our respective objectives. How efficient is it for a survivor to run past a 90% gen, to a 25% gen? In the same breath how efficient is it for the killer to pass up two surv prob healing under hook to walk across the map to find one of the others that haven't been hooked? Tunnelling I've learned is best countered by not being altruistic, if they tunnel your mate then tunnel their gens, to further destroy tunnelling looping better is the ultimate counter. All that being said I do understand the frustration of solo q which is a problem in its own right.
You are 100% correct, but I still see Survivors pretending tunneling somehow nets 15 kills a match, steals Survivor BP, and uninstalls their game, and thus should be punished.
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Honestly, remove depipping, and give hooked Survivors BP if the Killer camps, to incentivize staying on the hook as long as possible instead of hook-DCing or feeling the sting of being removed early.
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@Ethromel said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3302445#Comment_3302445
That can't be abused IF the killer is NOT camping. It's really not hard to comprehend. Don't camp, no penalty. Very simple. You guys act like survivors or killers who haven't found things to "abuse" that are already in the game. Really?
I just pointed out how it can be abused, and your answer is 'Nuh-uh!'
And 'Well, there's already other abusable things!', as if that makes it OK to add a way to abuse Killers into forcing free unhooks. Really?
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And it could still be abused by Survivors standing out in the open [x] distance away from the hook. Let's say 1 to the North, and 1 to the South, 50M away.
Now the Killer is not in a chase, so he loses movement speed. But if he chases North; South heads in for a save. Killer resets. South backs off.
Survivors were STILL too far away to trigger a Chase, so the Killer is STILL losing movement speed. But if he chases one person; he now slower, and can't catch them, and the other gets a free save.
And that still leaves one person doing gens freely. So now the Killer is slower, can't chase anyone, and is basically forced to give up a save because Survivors think they deserve free unhooks.
And 'punish gen camping'? So now Survivors think they deserve free gen time, too?
Why not just say 'I'm tired of Killers trying to win. Plz punish any Killer who does anything I don't like'? Because that's all these two ideas are; Ways to 'punish' Killers for doing anything Survivors don't approve of.
No.
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Heaven forbid Killers try to win.
Only Survivors can do that.
Side note: The 'pause hook timer' idea was actually tried in game and abused by Survivors so heavily that it had to be removed.
How 'bout you stop trying to control how your opponent plays & tries to win? Kthx.
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I made a fix for hook DCing and got told that fixing it is bad for the game and 'You can't make people play in matches they don't like.'
So apparently people think it's okay to ruin the match via hook DC. Because apparently being expected to play out a match you queued for is bad. 🤷♂️
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@I_CAME said:
Or they could just remove self unhooks that kill you.
I made a suggestion for this and was told, by other players, that 'You can't make people play a match they don't want too'.
So apparently queuing up, then ruining the match for everyone by hook-DCing the first time it goes sideways, is perfectly fine. Because no one cares about the other players in a match.
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@OPXtreme_ttv said:
Imma even factor lore into this, why do survivors know how to repair a generator and how can they do it so fast?
Because there would not be a usable game if Survivors just stood around scratching their heads?
Not everything needs to be realistic.
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@C3Tooth said:
I think someone posted some inappropriate images here, so they changed that you have to be a forum member for a while to be able to post?
Oh gods. I was not a member here, but I peeked in from time to time, and I remember that.
Someone was posting literal gore. Like, dead and mangled bodies. I really hope the forum mods got their IP and sent it to the closest cops.
No one in their right mind thinks posting pictures of dead bodies is in any way appropriate.
To change the subject: Does anyone miss the layout/UI, at least, of the old forums? It was more colorful and easier to read, IMO.
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@DBDVulture said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3302063#Comment_3302063
This is false and I will provide an example to prove it. It's very simple : If there is a reward that is better than tunneling someone out then killers will do that instead.
Imagine if hooking a survivor reduces the generator repair rate (as well as healing, totems, doors, etc.) for all survivors by 8% if they have never been hooked before. That would mean if you hook all 4 survivors as your first hook then everyone has -32% to all actions. To prevent the rewarding of tunneling : if a survivor is hooked for the first time after someone is killed then that no longer provides an 8% penalty.
That would be better than tunneling out one survivor. Now imagine we got a "redo" to Dying Light so that it offered no bonus to survivors and read : If you hook a survivor that was not the last survivor hooked then all survivors get a stacking penalty of 4% for all actions.
Now in the same scenario you could tunnel out one player or you could get three unique hooks. Getting three unique hooks will bypass all the nasty things like DS and Off the Record. And every survivor in the game would have -24% + -12% penalty to all actions. The first few gens would fly like normal but the end of the game would be very slow. If you got in an 8 hook situation where no one had died then the penalties would be something like : 32% + 24 to 32% slowdown.
Imagine if you stacked Sloppy Butcher and Dying Light with two gen regression perks. Healing would be terrible with a minimum of -75% healing speed (and of course all healing would be reset if you stop).
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3302076#Comment_3302076
-"Survivors have been win-shaming Killers for years ... Don't tunnel, camp, or slug."
The problem with tunneling is that survivors want to tunnel generators and not get tunneled in return. That is a logic fault. Something like Basekit Deadlock would go a long way to prevent gen rushing. Add that and then add a minimum requirement of gens to be done before a player can be picked up to be hooked the last time (probably no deaths before 3 gens makes sense).
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3302064#Comment_3302064
What makes tunneling scummy? One player doesn't get much of a game. Well The killer doesn't get much of a game when all the gens are completed when he has two hooks. I have seen games in the last month where this has happeend to every killer main I have watched (Hens, Truetalent, Otz, Bronx, etc).
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3302085#Comment_3302085
You need to stop this rhetoric. Survivors want to tunnel gens and then get chased when the doors are at 99% and nothing matters because they can't really get killed and are not in any danger. That is scummy.
Remove tunneling for both sides or don't touch it.
Nerf Blight Nurse and SWF (as well as their addons and Spirit's addons).
'No deaths before 3 gens'.Rofl, no? You do realize Survivors would just 99% as many gens as possible, then pop them all.
Are you seriously telling me you think it would be fair for the Killer to be unable to get a single kill before Survivors do 50% of their objectives? (5 gens + exit gates = 6 objectives).
Plus, this would make Hexes flat-out trash; Survivors could just totem hunt before doing ANY gens, since they are literally unkillable until THEY decide to pop 3 gens.
Oh yeah, and they can troll Killers non-stop because, again, they control if/when they can die by not doing any gens.
Why should Survivors get to control if/when they can die? This is just an entitled idea to yank input away from Killers and let Survivors control their opponent.
How's this for an idea? Survivors can't raise any gen over 75% until the Killer has gotten at least 1 hook on everyone. That seems fair, since 3 gens always pop in the first chase. Let the Killers control Survivor input. 🤦♂️
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@Brimp said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3301390#Comment_3301390
Never would I imagine that playing to win in a PVP game is considered "scummy".
Survivors have been win-shaming Killers for years, man.
Don't tunnel, camp, or slug. Don't use 'crutch perks' like NoED (It somehow gives mythical 'free kills' and is somehow magically uncleansable and uncounterable). Don't use 'Crutch Killers' either. Or 'OP' addons. There's a list of Survivor Approved Killers and Addons, but it's up to you to find it, and it can change hourly, or even based on the whims of who's in your lobby from one match to the next.
In short: Don't win if it makes the Survivor Overlords sad. And make sure you filled out your Permission To Hook form in triplicate before hooking anyone, because it might inconvenience them. And they can revoke that permission at any time without telling you, but they expect you to know if they did. 🙃
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@Halloulle said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3301820#Comment_3301820
I'm simply questioning if energy should be put into a change that has no tangible impact on how matches play out. i say no.
Making DCing harder will also not solve anything in a constructive manner, imo.
Personally, I hold the opinion that the root cause of a majority of DCs/suicides on hook are due to mechanic and/or balance issue in the game and the frustration about this just adds up until people snap. And while killers can turn to tunneling and camping as a response in that very match survivors don't have that option so they tend to just go next asap - one way or the other.
Personally, I hold the opinion that the root cause of a majority of DCs/suicides on hook are due to mechanic and/or balance issue in the gameI wish they were, but people will DC for any reason they can justify. Hence the list above. I've SEEN people admit they DC 'If I go against Nurse/Clown/Freedy. Because why should I be in a match I don't enjoy?'
Or 'I DC if it's [insert map they don't like]'
Or 'I DC if the Killer is using NoED, or [insert any perk they can call 'tryhard' here]'
Or the people who DC when they are first downed because 'Why should I wait in a match I'm not enjoying?'
Those aren't mechanic or balance issues; They are attitude issues. They are Survivors (Though it happens with Killers, too) who think 'Muh fun is more important' and 'Why should I care about my teammates? They aren't me.'
You can't FIX those. You can only make it as hard as possible for them to ruin the match for others.
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@GRIG0 said:
Those who don't want to play the game will just go AFK, still wont play with the killer and will ruin their teammates.
And that is reportable.
@Halloulle said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3301771#Comment_3301771
No. People who want to "ragequit" will opt for the method that takes one minute longer - e.g. going to the closest gen holding M1 until the killers grabs them off of it. Which means a miserable match will be miserable for one more minute for everyone involved while the overall outcome or quality has not changed whatsoever.
Ok. And that's somehow worse than letting them DC on hook at will?
It's like this community wants to ruin matches for everyone else. Y'all fight back against suggestions to make DCing harder.
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@Halloulle said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3301746#Comment_3301746
. . . that won't lead to any game health or match quality improvements though.
Except it will, because people who can now only ragequit though reportable means will eventually stop playing, and matches will only have people who know good sportsmanship.
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My goal is to remove 'legal ragequitting' so the only alternatives are methods that can be reported.
Ragequitting is against the rules, so a method by which people can get the same result without the punishment should be fixed.
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@Crowman said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3301730#Comment_3301730
Someone can die on their first hook, because their teammates never rescued them.
And that has literally nothing to do with my idea or hook-DCing.
Because I'm talking about people deliberately killing themselves on hook as fast as possible by trying to get off, then purposefully failing every stage 2 skillcheck to die ASAP.
And my idea removes those attempts.
So...what does your comment have to do with that?
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@Halloulle said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3301721#Comment_3301721
I think you might have some misconceptions about reporting bad sportsmanship. - Maybe they're just bad at skillchecks, maybe they didn't see the killer - maybe they needed chase. Who knows. - These things are in effect pretty much unreportable simply because you can't tell from the outside if the player is playing normally and just really bad at it - or wants to get downed. The vault spamming aside, maybe.
And no, it will not change anything about the matchoutcome - or the match quality, for that matter. While there are petty people who DC for literally no reason, the vast majority of people does have a reason and will continue to take the fastest route out of the match because that reason is still there - just the fastest route has become one minute longer.
I mean, what is your actual goal? I assume it's to have more successful matches ....?
Maybe they're just bad at skillchecksNO ONE is so bad that they pop gens repeatedly. It's evident they are trying to draw the killer.
the vast majority of people does have a reason and will continue to take the fastest route out of the matchAnd what reason is there to ragequit at first hook? I mean, VALID reason.
I mean, what is your actual goal? I assume it's to have more successful matches ....?My goal is to remove ragequitting on first hook, since it ruins matches. People should just not play if they're going to flip the table like a toddler for petty reasons.
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@Crowman said:
Rage quitting isn't technically against the rules. It's disconnecting from the match that is against the rules. Letting yourself die on hook has always been allowed. And ultimately the devs can't really punish players who die on hook, because sometimes your teammates just don't save you.
And ultimately the devs can't really punish players who die on hook, because sometimes your teammates just don't save you.I'm not asking for dying on hook to be punished. I'm creating a way to remove using first-hook to ragequit while dodging a DC penalty.
@YOURFRIEND said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3301705#Comment_3301705
In Overwatch people simply jump off the map or run into the enemy team when they don't want to play a match for whatever reason. It they really want to avoid a report they go Lucio or whatever and just go for boops. The Dota equivalent is just running down mid. I'm not sure whether you're trying to gaslight me or yourself by pretending equivalent behaviors don't happen in other games but the assertion is laughable.
I'll say it simply, one last time. Listen. You cannot force people to stay in a game they do not want to be in. They will just sabotage gameplay by other means. Better to get it over with than stretch out an unwinnable scenario.
Sure. I'll try to remember that when I get another 5 matches where I find someone, and they hook-DC as quick as possible because they hated the map. Or my Killer. Or my perks. Or they were found first. Or they hated my keychain-things.
Well just let them continue to ruin matches instead of fixing the exploits they use to get around DC penalties.
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@Halloulle said:
... You do realise that this in no way addresses the underlying problem though, right? - It doesn't even change the match outcome in the slightest. - It just prolongs what's gonna happen anyway.
They're on hook, they get unhooked, they head straight to the closest gen/totem/chest/whatever or want to demonstrate their chasing skills, a few seconds later they get downed and get hooked again - repeat. Then they're dead. It just takes a minute longer. A minute during which everyone is aware this ain't gonna lead anywhere.
You can already report people for running AT the Killer in an attempt to be downed, or multi-vaulting windows or popping gens to draw the Killer's attention.
What my fix does is make it so those are their ONLY options to get out without DCing, leading to more poor sports being reported for poor sportsmanship and banned. Then they stop polluting the game for the real players.
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The problem with moving away from the 'gen stall meta' is that it then leaves Killers with less time to kill Survivors.
That's the point of the gen stall meta; to buy Killers more time. The way the game works is that Survivors try to escape ASAP because the longer they stay, the greater the chance they die.
Survivors can, working as a team, pop all gens in under 6 minutes. That's, literally, less time than it takes 3 Survivors to die if they don't speed up Stage 1 or 2.
If that META is to change, it will only be because Killers no longer NEED to stall. But until that happens; the best Killer loadouts will require ways to slow down gens.
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@[Deleted User] said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3301682#Comment_3301682
"But a punishment already exists. I'm just changing it so toddlers can't use the hook as a way to DC without the DC penalty."
What punishment? The current system isn't a punishment. It's a risk vs reward.
I stated why I'm not a fan of removing skill checks for the second stage. Not a fan of your suggestion for first hook either. How does that "punish" the one on hook?
I stated why I'm not a fan of removing skill checks for the second stage. Not a fan of your suggestion for first hook either. How does that "punish" the one on hook?Fine, remove it all together. But that would lead to every Survivor trying to escape 4 times no matter what.
The problem is that the current mechanic allows Survivors to DC without eating a DC penalty. It's literally abusing a mechanic to get the same, exact effect as DCing, but without the punishment for DCing.
So it needs to change. I'm SICK of watching the first Survivor I find hook-DC & ruining the match for me and the other 3 Survivors. it's stupid, outdated, useless mechanic.
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@YOURFRIEND said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3301682#Comment_3301682
None of the stuff you said is a refutation of my point that you can't force people to stay in the game. It's just bland attitude affirmation. Your idea doesn't do anything to the person actually on the hook being problematic. It just punishes unhookers. The person trying to leave doesn't care whether or not they're harder to unhook; They probably welcome it.
It's ok to have a bad idea and it's a brave thing to express yourself on a public forum. But a bad idea is still a bad idea
None of the stuff you said is a refutation of my point that you can't force people to stay in the game. It's just bland attitude affirmation.How come I don't hear this bunk in other PvP games? No one ragequits in Overwatch and then says 'Well! You can't FORCE people to play in a match they don't like!'
Imagine if that worked in the NFL: "Well, Bob, the Dolphins have decided to pack up and leave early, since they were down 15 points going into the second quarter! Guess everyone can go home! No one can FORCE them to play if they're not having fun!"
It's like the DBD community is uniquely entitled enough to think "I should be able to bail on any match I hate, and screw my teammates!"
My idea PREVENTS Hook-ragequits. Because they are a problem. Which, by the way, you have not refuted yourself. All you said is 'Well, you can't MAKE people stay in a match!'
Yes you can; Toughing out a match you 'don't like; called 'Being a good sport' and 'Thinking about your fellow players'. There, I refuted your non-argument.
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@YOURFRIEND said:
You can't force people to stay in the game. Folks that give up on hook aren't suddenly going to not because their actions affect someone else.
Yes you can.
Don't play a multiplayer game if you:
- Don't have the time to stay all match or
- Don't have the mental maturity to tough it out when you're losing.
@[Deleted User] said:
You shouldn't be "punished" the ability to unhook yourself. It's a mechanic in the game. There are times when I'm literally trying to self unhook. If there are two of us left in the game and I'm on second hook I often miss skill checks so I can speed up the process to give a chance for the other survivor to find hatch.
But a punishment already exists. I'm just changing it so toddlers can't use the hook as a way to DC without the DC penalty.
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How to fix 'Hook-DCing':
- Change the punishment for attempting to get free:
Instead of losing meter, it makes it take longer to be unhooked each time you try.
Or maybe unhooking someone should have a Very Easy skillcheck. Missing it makes noise and stops the unhook attempt. This skillcheck gets slightly harder for each attempt a player made to unhook themselves.
- When in Phase 2; there is no missing skillchecks:
This is a stupid punishment anyways. It does not punish bad play. It just gives Survivors a way to force themselves out of the game. Basically, it's a 'legal DC'. Change it.
Boom; no more 'hook ragequits'. Players can either man up and play a match through to the end or get reported for unsportsmanlike conduct if they afk or run at the Killer.
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@daniel_owenz said:
As a person who mains killer, NOED and the perk that blocks the gate for a whole minute should be removed from the game, I'm not even asking for a nerf, just get rid of those participation trophy perks. You can honestly play the worst most trashiest killer in the game and these perks will give them free kills even if they haven't hooked anyone.
Survivors can prevent NoED from making it to endgame.
And No Way Out only works if the Killer hooks people, so try again.
Also, there's no such thing as a 'free kill'. If the Killer killed you; he earned the kill. 'NoEd GiVeS fReE kIlLs!' is Survivor main BS .
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How about no?
Speaking as a Killer main; The game should not punish Survivors who want to bail & possibly force them into a hook trade, or even feeding the Killer a free kill, because the game won't let them/will punish them for leaving.
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Hexes were almost never woth it. Then the devs decided to give Survivors better Hexes called 'Boons'.
This necessitated moving all totems into easy-to-find areas to be Booned, which nerfed Hexes even more. Which was fine, because it was a Killer nerf. 🙃
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@Jinxed said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3301080#Comment_3301080
I'm not saying punish tunnelling, I'm saying make it an ineffective strategy completely, as in make it more difficult to do. If people want to tunnel they should have to waste time trying to find that specific survivor. I also said that killers should be offered a buff which balances this out
Killers might not have to care about the fun of the other people in their games, but the devs should. If something isn't fun, it shouldn't be in a game, we don't play this as our job.
If something isn't fun, it shouldn't be in a game, we don't play this as our job.Weird, I hear that in EVERY PvP game I've ever played as an excuse to remove anything players don't like.
- Overwatch: Bastion is unfun. Widowmaker is unfun. Both should be removed.
- TF2: Sniper is unfun. Spy is unfun. Both should be removed.
- Counter-Strike: AWP is unfun. Should be removed.
- CoD games: Literally every weapon had part of the player base screaming it was 'unfun' and 'for noobs' and 'should be removed' for 'the health of the game'. Grenade launchers were literally called 'noob tubes'.
It's almost like ANYTHING being 'unfun' is subjective and 'It should be removed if it's not fun' is a paper-thin excuse hiding the real thought behind it: "Anything I don't like should be altered, or removed, because I don't feel like playing around it."
So please forgive me if I roll my eyes at "If something is not fun, it should not be in the game." Because that's a vague, subjective excuse that holds 0 water.
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@Firellius said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3301080#Comment_3301080
"If Survivors can do gens as efficiently as possible; Why should Killers be punished for doing the same?"
What options do survivors have to do gens 'inefficiently'?
How does that matter?
My point being: Survivors can, and will, bring every top-tier perk they can, plus tip-tier items, AND have the option of being in an SWF with Discord.
And yet they scream on here about how 'unfun' it is when Killers play to win and demand the developers 'punish' or 'de-incentivize' tactics they don't like. IE: Camping. Tunneling. Slugging.
And we all know, even if the developers added in punishments for all three; The second Killers adapted, Survivors would then whine whatever THAT new tactic is, is now 'unfun' and needs to be removed.
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@scoser said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3301098#Comment_3301098
Sure, getting camped and then tunneled directly off the hook definitely gives me the opportunity to outplay the killer by burning through at most 5 pallets/loops before I get downed and hooked again. The entire purpose of video games is to have fun. If people aren't having fun, why should they keep playing?
Youa re correct; If you can't find fun in losing as well as winning; Perhaps PvP games are not for you?
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@scoser said:
I mean, by all means, tunnel away. The more killers that camp and tunnel, the more survivors quit the game and eventually it'll get shut down due to lack of players and we'll all be free of this torment.
Or, and bear with me on this, Survivors can accept that their opponent has the same right to win that they have and stop whining about how 'unfun' and 'unfair' it is to lose to 'cheap tactics'?
The only ones who will leave are the ones who invent any excuse to avoid admitting they got out played, and the player base as a whole will become healthier for it.
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@Jinxed said:
I agree with you, tunnelling is extremely efficient (too efficient) for what it is. There is no reason not to tunnel.
Increasing gen speeds won't stop people from tunnelling though, it will just make it more rewarding to do, because there won't be the counterplay of "well the killer is tunnelling so I'll just slam gens"
The only way to end tunnelling would be to make it almost impossible to do. For example, if hooks became like pyramids cages and didn't give a directional notification to the killer upon unhook so he didn't know where they had been unhooked.
If this (or something similar) was implemented, gen repair speeds would need to be increased alongside this to balance things out, and I feel like killers should get basekit bbq to keep the game moving for them.
It's boring to tunnel, and it's annoying to be tunnelled. I wish the devs would just do something about it and then give killers some buffs, then we can all have fun.
The only way to end tunnelling would be to make it almost impossible to doWhy?
Once again, I ask: If Survivors can do gens as efficiently as possible; Why should Killers be punished for doing the same?
The only reply I ever see is 'because it's not fun to be knocked out fast/early'. And that's not a valid reason. It's like people don't understand that the Killer's goal is to knock people out of the match.
Survivors need to stop thinking the game, or Killers, owe them some arbitrary amount of game time, or arbitrary 'fun' quota, before they can be killed.
Bottom line is: If Survivors can try their hardest to win; So can Killers. And Survivors need to get out of this mindset that losing 'too fast' is some flaw. It's a PvP game, and no one is going to want to play Killer if the game starts taking away control, or forcing sub-optimal plays, for their opponent's 'fun'.
Lord knows I'd uninstall and never look back if I lost because the game 'punished' me for 'tunneling' someone just because I found them most frequently and thus could not kill someone and thus could not slow down gen speeds.
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I tunnel (and camp, and slug) as needed (but not all the time) because my opponents are trying their hardest to win, so why would I limit myself just to make them happy?
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Nurse as-is should exist as long as SWF with discord exists.
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@C3Tooth said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3300260#Comment_3300260
What do you mean “stop trying to win which is reportable?”
I understand the Dc when first down, even those who first down when 2 Gens left. Its really questionable.
I dont blame people DC when a teammate is tunneled out with 4-5 Gens left. There is no win there. One DC so the last one can actually “try to win” by getting hatch.
What do you mean “stop trying to win which is reportable?”By my understanding, if someone 'gives up', and either just idles, or actively seeks out the Killer; they can be reported.
I dont blame people DC when a teammate is tunneled out with 4-5 Gens left. There is no win thereI blame them. What about the Killer? How is it fair to them if people DC because the match went sideways?
One DC so the last one can actually “try to win” by getting hatch.That's firmly in 'cheating' or 'abusing exploits' to me. Anyone I see do it is going to get reported. DCing does not exist so players can give the hatch to another player. That's abusing mechanics in ways not intended by the devs.
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Just take all the BP the DCer earned that match and divide it amongst the remaining Survivors and Killer.
Anyone who willingly ragequits is probably entitled, as they believe they 'deserve to DC' if they're 'not having fun' (While ignoring that this logic means no one would complete a match if they begin to lose). So they will probably do it less if they know it's feeding the Killer their BP as well as their teammates.
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@Blink0925 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3300253#Comment_3300253
There is no excuse to be an #########. Absolutely none. I am tired of people trying act like there is. I put that as my bio, explaining my intentions, and that makes me a target. That is the issue. There is absolutely nothing you can do or say that justifies any of it. Its a dick move, and uncalled for.
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3300254#Comment_3300254
Its literally not though. Its a normal match. So giving a player hatch or letting them go at the end is a free escape? All I did was say that it would be cool if they let me get progress towards the achievement. Thats not asking for a free escape. Thats just asking for help. I expect no one to coddle me. Not in the slightest. But when you know my intentions and you make it to were I get no progress, that is a dick move and there is absolutely no excuse for it. It doesnt make me entitled, it doesnt make me a target. It doesnt mean that I expect people to do what I want. Yeah it would be nice if people were willing to help me, but I never said they have to.
So giving a player hatch or letting them go at the end is a free escape?Yes, yes it is. Giving someone the hatch is giving them a free escape.
All I did was say that it would be cool if they let me get progress towards the achievement. Thats not asking for a free escape.You are asking for people to help you with an achievement that requires you escaping. Tart it up all you want; You are asking people to give you free escapes. That's, literally, what 'helping' with an escape-based achievement is.
But when you know my intentions and you make it to were I get no progress, that is a dick move and there is absolutely no excuse for itAgain; if the dude admitted he targeted you BECAUSE of your bio; That is kind of a jerk move.
But ALSO again; It's your fault for giving him the ammo to troll you. How do you not see that? If your bio did not say 'I need to escape, blah, blah, blah' then he would not have been able to explicitly target you to stop it. Because he would not have known your goal.
But you stick it in your bio, which gave him ammo. Also, by the very nature of asking people to help with an escape-based achievement; You are asking them to LET YOU GO. IE: You are asking for a free escape and getting angry that people aren't doing it.
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@C3Tooth said:
They can just suicide on hook.
They should just change the hook mechanics to prevent hook-ragequits.
Instead of each escape attempt reducing your time on the hook (and being able to manually fail so you die faster); attempting to get free should increase the time it takes to be unhooked.
And failing Stage 2 should do the same thing.
This way, ragequitters either have to stay in the match, stop trying to win (which is reportable), or DC (which is reportable).
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@Blink0925 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3300229#Comment_3300229
I literally never said I expect them to help me. All I said was at the end of the match, it would be nice if you let me open the exit gate and escape. Not that they have to. Never said that. And that is my case and point, that they know what I am doing and are being #########. That was the entire point of the post.
I literally never said I expect them to help meOk but
All I said was at the end of the match, it would be nice if you let me open the exit gate and escape.So...you dropped the hint that you wanted them to help you & give you a free escape.
You can do verbal acrobatics all you want; you are expecting anyone who reads your bio to help you escape for your achievement.
If he admitted, he singled you out because of your bio; that is kinda jerkish. But YOU are the one who is expecting people to coddle you and give you escapes because you want an achievement. Or you would not have put it in your bio, and said repeatedly:
All I said was at the end of the match, it would be nice if you let me open the exit gate and escape.and
Hell, it could have been a normal match and at the end let me open the exit gate and escape.That second one is basically 'He should have let me win because I wanna' and now you're shaming people and acting like you never said what people are, literally, quoting you saying.
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And how do you know they read your bio? Or are you just assuming the read it and deciding they're jerks for, again, not doing what you want?
You literally said
Hell, it could have been a normal match and at the end let me open the exit gate and escape.So you clearly expected the Killer to give you a free escape simply because it's what you wanted. And to expound on that, you are assuming anyone who did NOT give you what you want must have read your bio and decided to be a jerk instead of the more logical 'No one cared'.
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@Blink0925 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3299852#Comment_3299852
I never said it was a free escape. I never said that they even had to let me escape at all. I put that in my bio because I wanted to let everyone know. It wasnt about a free escape. I just thought that maybe people would be nice and be willing to work with me. Hell, it could have been a normal match and at the end let me open the exit gate and escape. I never said they couldnt hook me chase me or anything just that at the end it would be nice if the let me get progress towards my achievement.
I never said it was a free escape.Uhhh...
Hell, it could have been a normal match and at the end let me open the exit gate and escape.(That's called a 'free escape')
So basically; you expected complete strangers to:
- Read your name and care enough to
- Read your bio and then
- Give you a free escape
And if they did not do this, then they are 'unkind' for not giving you what you want?
🤦♂️
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@YOURFRIEND said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3300093#Comment_3300093
Ah. The vaunted "pure ideas man".
My scintillating and revelatory idea is this: the devs should fix all the issue problems that folks don't like in the game and make everyone happy. That's it. That's what needs to be done.
Ideas are a dime a dozen. Worthless. The execution and conception of a good idea is where the value lies. Tossing stuff out into the ether doesn't enrich anyone. You gotta put flesh on that skeleton.
I was trying to start a discussion but apparently this player base is so toxic, even benign topics like this turn into 'Bet you said this bcuz U died in game! SAAAAALLLLLT! 🤪" attacks.
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@Rulebreaker said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3300110#Comment_3300110
First playing "optimally" was never a sin, the effect it causes is.
Second when survivors kept try being try hards things did change. No more instant repair parts, no instant heals, true infinite loops gone (admittedly this might be for overall health but..). Unfun things changed. Just because it's back to the killers turn doesn't mean it's always at killer. At best it's just the most vocal.
The problems is that that 'effect' is literally the Killer's win condition.
Survivors are complaining that the Killer's attempts to win should backseat to their 100% subjective and vague 'fun'. And it's been like this for more than 5 years:
- Tunneling? Unfun; fix it for 'the health of the game'.
- Slugging? Unfun; fix it for 'the health of the game'.
- Camping? Unfun; fix it for 'the health of the game'.
If Survivors had their way; Killers would never be able to win, because losing is 'unfun'.
As it is; I can't play a single match without Survivors putting me on blast for 'crutch perks' or 'tryhard tactics' because they genuinely believe their fun is more important than mine or my ability to try to win, and so they believe I was 'toxic first' just for winning in a way they don't approve of.
Survivors need to get it through their heads that BOTH SIDES are human beings. And if Survivors are not required to stop doing gens just because the Killer has 0 hooks/kills, then Killers are not required to stop going after the weakest link just because Survivors don't like being knocked out of the game.
I'm honestly sick of the double standard. If I kill to fast? Insults. Threats. I'm a 'tryhard'. This includes if I don't give hatch. Yes; I'm evil if I don't let someone go, because Survivors are so entitled that they believe they deserve a free escape for no reason other than 'Because I'm Survivor'.
But if Killers talk about genrush (To use the phrase. Real genrushing does not exist. It's just Survivors playing well), or not having any hooks or kills as 3 gens pop? 'Lol, noob KIller' 'git gud' and 'It's not our responsibility to give you kills'.
So how come it's the Killer's responsibility to make sure Survivors have fun, up to and including giving free hatch, but Survivors are not responsible for Killers having fun? 🤔
How come people think 'Take player agency away from Killers' or 'Add a mechanic Survivors can abuse' is valid for 'Survivor fun'? Can we demand Survivors be forced to fail skillchecks if they hit too many in a row? I mean, if Killers should be punished for 'tunneling' their objective (kills), then Survivors should be punished for 'tunneling' their objective (gens). Fair is fair.
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@InvadeGames said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3300117#Comment_3300117
ill say it again.
Its a bad idea. The idea as A WHOLE is terrible. Least as far as dead by daylight goes. but you suggested a whole other game entirely, not the one that I and everyone else spent money on.
not to mention you would have to change the name from Dead By daylight and the entire lore of the game because they would cease to apply to "call of duty but without guns" game.
How does my idea in any way require the name to change? Or the lore?
I am now convinced you just want to attack the idea because you're angry for some reason. Have fun with that, because I will no longer reply to you.