Ryuhi
Ryuhi
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@Coriander said:
She can vomit right away, it doesn't have to be charged. In a chase you can hit the person right in front of you, twice. That puts them at one hit. In addition, her corrupted power gives her ranged attacks. I think when people have more time with her they will see if it's fair or not. The pallets and even ground can be plagued so it's not like she can't counter looping.
My biggest gripe so far is the giant cloud you can't sneak around with. How am I supposed to hide in grass or even behind walls?
You can't infect the ground, just interactables. That said, windows CAN be infected, as can lockers and even totems. In terms of the amount of puke needed, it takes a LOT more than just two quick pukes, and there IS a minimum charge required (though short, it is present) meaning that you can't just flick m2 and get free infection. Her most popular (rightfully so) addons are the ones that increase the amount of infection granted from exposure to the vomit stream, and the ones that reduce charge time (which is why you might have encountered that.)
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they're already strong enough without stacking with medkits, and being able to do so would practically remove the penalty for autodidact and make it pretty OP. In terms of the notification, I agree completely.
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@CrimsonMauler said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/375733#Comment_375733
I thought I was the only one. I was told by another survivor that I was being inconsiderate to my teammates for not using the fountains.
thats the main issue with that build, since you will continuously infect other survivors who are not using a "stay wounded" build like that. If they're using Leader or Prove Thyself you're pretty much anathema to them.
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I think a lot of people are looking at this the wrong way. Making it harder to pip in terms of points isnt a bad thing, but there should be more points available per category to compensate.
If you spend the entire game getting chased/tunneled (to the point where you dont get to do a single gen, yet all gens get accomplished) That should be worth a black pip at least. You obviously played exceptionally well with the circumstances you were given, and should not be faulted for something that was not possible. Same with other scenarios like escaping with zero people hooked/down.
On the killer side, a 4k should always be a black pip. Same with multiple DCs from survivors.
I like the idea of making it harder to pip and rank up, but making it easier to depip because of things beyond your control (especially when you actually play well) isn't a very good supplement to it.
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@HorsePower said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/374195#Comment_374195
You're wrong. The game is pretty killer favored with all the buffs killers have been getting ever since the game was released. I know how to loop correctly and from what I've seen as both mainly a Solo player and sometimes SWF, I do have teammates that work on generators. Not sure what you're talking about in the SWF part (because both things of what you said on healing and looping isn't true), but whatever.
80% of killers (or anybody) that think the game is currently survivor favored either don't know how to play killer optimally, they camp/tunnel survivors for no reason, or complain about survivors when losing the match when they themselves couldn't apply pressure (boy oh boy have I encountered this so many times).
You do realize that most of the reason many killer players think killers are underpowered is BECAUSE of their inability to apply map pressure, right? Not as a player, but mechanically. Some killers (mainly M1 killers) need to devote too much time and effort to a single chase, or have telltale signs that they are in a chase and give other survivors the go ahead to rush gens.
There's a reason empathy got its maximum distance nerfed at tier 3, because it was amazing at assessing map presence in addition to knowing where injured survivors were. For example: If you saw the haze around another survivor's status, and they got hit, you knew it was freddy and you knew exactly in the map where he was. This removes a lot of map pressure on the spot since he now has to either break away from that chase and look for other survivors to apply pressure, or continue the chase and hope he downs the survivor before 1-3 gens pop.
Killers like nurse, billy, and spirit are considered as good as they are because they have a good ratio of chase time to map pressure. When killers like the clown or cannibal have to sacrifice map pressure to be able to even down people, it completely opens them up to gen rushing. Myers and the wraith are a bit of an exception to this, since they CAN use their stealth mechanics to apply hit and run tactics (moreso wraith) but they still fall victim to loops so securing downs (outside of Myers T3, in which his stealth is gone completely) means sacrificing map pressure.
TL;DR The best way to actually have a "balanced" killer is for them to have a fair ratio of both map pressure potential and duration of chases.
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I mean grabs fail due to latency plenty enough as it is
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@The_Crusader said:
I can see everyones point and I thought the same too. She was weak at looping and now she's nerfed to be worse.
However upon reflection and at the risk of having the unpopular opinion, I think she might be a little better/easier to use?
If you didn't get a full blast on them before you were punished hard by having to charge her purge and have it slow her down drastically. Now that the charge isn't as slow I feel like she's easier to use. A little less punishing if you miss.
Here's the main issue: There are addons to speed up her charging duration, but none to speed her up while her charge is held. The slowdown while charging used to be something you could offset with addons (which is still bad design philosophy, but it was possible) while here we have her nerf falling on a bald spot that has no way to be addressed. Loops turn her into a M1 killer the vast majority of the time, which hurts her map pressure tremendously on a lot of maps. Ironically I think I've done the best with her on the wide open cornfield map, simply because its much easier to defend gens and not have to deal with loops as much.
Having her automatically gain corrupted purge when all fountains cleanse was a great change though, especially for aforementioned scenario. It helps her defensive strength considerably. Unfortunately the biggest thing any killer player wants in this game is a better way to deal with loops, and this killer ALMOST had a great balance of both that and map pressure.
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I mean people have to do something while they're waiting 20 minutes for a lobby :)
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@Dreamnomad said:
I play on PS4 so I never got a chance to play her on PTB, but all I can say is that after playing her is that she is in a great spot. She is probably one of the more balanced characters in the game honestly. So if she was nerfed a little prior to going live then that was probably a good decision. Cause I love where she is at now.
Don't forget, she's still new and just as many people don't know how to counter her as play her. She is plenty loopable, so you'll see survivors adapting a lot to that.
To be honest, thats the only reason why anyone is disapointed with this change, there are too many busted loops in the game that she is going to struggle with, much like most killers. That said using even the common addon that speeds up her movement while holding charge, it feels like its enough to remove the penalty completely, so it can be compensated for at least. Its also a fairly minor slowdown, so its not devestating to patrol while holding the charge if you know someone is in the area. Its likely the devs were considering that more than her performance in loops, but oh well.
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@Tomas_shtino said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/373016#Comment_373016
What is your rank? If you have ps4 play with me and let's see what you say
PC, so sorry you can't show off to me or anything :) Rank 1 survivor, usually around rank 7 killer tho.
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its almost like its a unique mechanic that shouldn't be compared 1:1 to other abilites, since it functions so much differently.
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@Carpemortum said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/373057#Comment_373057
Clown has DRASTICALLY reduced movement while refilling. Next?
Cant win loops bc of her power? A slight ms change isnt going to change that. If that's really the concern, get better at chasing people, without the crutch of a power....
Have to let them leave to get corrupt power? Really? This farfetched scenario to try and prove her power needs a Ms buff? Why would you ever let then run, just to get corrupt fountain. You wouldnt. Youd either chase someone else, or put them down with m1.
Next ridiculous attempt at changing the point of this discussion?
She shouldn't have full Ms while charging.
and the plague is entirely immobilized while refilling her corrupt purge, which only has limited conditions to even be possible, AND is limited to specific positions on the map when it IS available. Oh, and it has a timer. is that better?
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If they're already broken and you get them with a corrupt purge, that means that you had to go out of your way to get that powerup AFTER already infecting them to the point that they broke. Thats not a one shot, thats two(or more?) shots.
Also, surely you have a video you can link? because in the actual game (and in the PTB) you can only multi hit on the same stream with the vile purge, which is how the mechanic is supposed to work in the first place.
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@Carpemortum said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/373046#Comment_373046
She can hit more than once with a stream of puke. It takes two connects, but only one release if you hit them.
That easier to understand?
Please provide video of hitting someone twice in a single stream. Maybe if you try it to prove me wrong you'd realize its not possible.
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@Carpemortum said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/373007#Comment_373007
I did say most, and didnt mention hillbilly. Because hes the ancient exception.
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/373010#Comment_373010
Her base puke has other effects, as useless as you may consider them. Effects that hatchets and chainsaws dont.
Her power puke SHOULD have conditions, as you can stream someone to the ground with a single release if done right.
She shouldnt be able to move full speed with it held charged, period. It removes any mind games or thinking with her ability other than "oh its ready, hurr durr, theres a survivor! Better let go! Ok hold my button again until I see someone else hurr durr "
You're right, it gives survivors the ability to unlocks free instaheals around the map :D
Also no, you can't down someone with a single stream. Have you even played the new killer? The best you can do is either a full stream into a melee hit (which takes time and distance, has room to counterplay, etc) or if you're corrupted a small spurt to hit them once (activates speed boost) and then need to hit them with a second one from a now-increased distance.
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@Carpemortum said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/373009#Comment_373009
People like me? Calm down with your accusatory attitude hon. I play both sides. Hillbilly is the ONLY one that isnt hindered by his power use, and that's because people would RIOT.
She doesnt have to be slug speed, but having her full speed and able to unleash the power at any moment with NO drawback is the kind of biased balancing you're accusing me of.
I didnt say she was broken, or useless, or that I defended any of it.
Just that she is getting the same treatment as killers who we all know exist and dont have issues with.
LF is slower w his because if he was full speed youd never escape.
Huntress does, in fact, have to hit people more than once, and her ability does not give away survivors positions or TRANSFER to other people/objects.
So if anything, making her slower is a good balancing change.
So dont come at me like I'm a biased survivor main, simply because you refuse to accept that every killer cant be a broken train of death.
She can't instadown with either version of her puke, so I don't understand how it could be considered comparable to the huntress (especially since Iridescent heads exist)
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@Tomas_shtino said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/372949#Comment_372949
But you are killer or you play also survivor? Play also survivor and after that speak of this
I main solo survivor. If anything, occasionally dabbling with killer makes me a better survivor, since I get to see firsthand how people counter things.
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@Carpemortum said:
I'm seeing a lot of "shes ruined, because I cant walk around with my power ready to blast the entire time."
GOOD. Huntress cant, LF cant.
Almost nobody can use their power 100% of the game and not get a movement speed reduction.
But I dont see anyone mad that huntress isnt at full speed with hatchets wound up.
Her normal puke does no damage inherently, and her blood puke has conditions (and a timer) to be used at all. Not terribly comparable to those two.
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The biggest issue with addressing the balance is that the devs need to make it so that chases and gen completion times average out better, so that you can't have 3 gens pop within a single chase, but chases last more than a few seconds. Their general mentality is that making gen repair take too long is the worst option, because of how boring and unintuitive it currently is. This is why killers need (and have been somewhat getting) more methods to decrease the length of chases.
The idea is that shorter chases means more potential for map pressure from killers (especially the ones with abysmal map pressure as it is) to try to narrow the divide. The unfortunate side effect is that comms basically nullify a lot of it, which is why to killers it feels like not much is changing and to solo survivors it feels a lot worse.
Even then, chases arent necessarily getting that much shorter. Killers like billy and the nurse have always had short chases, and even with the plague's "instadown" through puking on a survivor long enough, it still takes a decent amount of time (even longer if the survivor can avoid getting continuously sprayed.)
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@TheLastGreatStar said:
I swear the term OP is being overused and misused. Instead of taking the time to learn how to counter play a new killer people just scream NEEEEEERF! It’s ridiculous.
New killer literally gives out free instaheals all around the map, and is easily loopable
"OP PLZ NERF"
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yeah you need to lead the hell out of her puke, so a lot of short wall loops are still rough unless you're shooting way ahead of the survivor. and tall loops are just a joke. And of course, farm map loops are just rude since you can barely even moonwalk them if the survivor is paying attention.
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@LasseDK said:
the new ranking system for gaining pips is trash. you can get 8000bp in all categories and mori all 4 and still not gain a pip.
How exactly would one get all 8k's while mori-ing all 4?
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@George_Soros said:
Yeah it's kinda ridiculous... buying the two new characters with Auric Cells costs about twice as much as buying the whole thing as DLC. Like, what? I mean, most games that feature in-game currency are basically conning dumbass 14 year olds who can't do basic math, but this is DBD. The community is known for being extremely intelligent, mature and responsible. Surely BHVR doesn't expect anyone to buy the same thing for a double price?
"extremely intelligent, mature, and responsible."
dang, I miss that LOL button.
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This change was yet another attempt by devs to punish lobby dodging from killers. The matchmaking gets even worse for everyone every time they try to bandaid it, I swear.
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I was wondering why I had a 12 hook game with only one gen left and didn't break 5k in those two categories. that makes more sense now.
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@Master said:
I dont understand what you are trying to tell.
Streamers looking at their timer to create a lobby, then wait in the lobby to have a red ping? Please explain that
I think they're saying the wait time is extrapolated for streamers since their views are also just sitting there twiddling their thumbs as well.
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@KreepyMF said:
I dunno dude.. as the killer I'm in control of the game so I get to decide who dies and who survives (to a point obviously) I like to praise them for good surviving, like if they're the last survivor but it's about to be their first hook I would instead put them by the hatch to crawl out.
But as a survivor I'm surviving! I ain't giving them pity sacrifices.. surely it's like popping a dummy in their mouth n telling them it's gonna be ok. It's not going to be ok.. you need to learn how to kill more efficiently it's so enjoyable once you do!
Praise good behaviour not bad ;-)
Which is all well and good, but survivors only have a single set of core mechanics to juggle, and consistent stats. There are 14 killers (and growing) who all play differently and have different speeds/heights/TRs/etc. Some people only get killers for their perks and then constantly get dailies for said killer and have to continuously fail at them since there is no practice mode in the game. Its not as bad for M1 killers since they all have a lot of similarities in playstyle (even if limiting,) but for killers like the nurse/hag/huntress it can be a pretty big change to get stuck with.
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Honestly I feel its because the survival scoring category needs a serious rework. making it out of the trial alive is 5k in an 8k category that is near impossible to get points in otherwise, unless very specific conditions allow it (certain killer powers, shaking free off the killer's shoulder, etc.) So that said even if the survivor got a perfect 8k in the other 3 categories, they'd be looking at 24k BP if they die. With killer on the other hand, you can have a game with 0 kills and still end up with more than 24k, capping the other 3 categories while having the sacrifice category over 4k if you 2 hooked everybody. Not only that, but since BBQ is tied directly to said hooks, the payout would be even higher based on that alone.
At the end of the day, its a bigger point sacrifice in a category that can't be made up otherwise for survivors than it is for killers. I guess you could pair that with the fact that most killers willing to spare survivors likely play both sides, while most survivors who taunt bad killers likely never play killer.
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Why are people claiming that getting a 4k before the last gen pops is a counter? Thats like saying getting all gen grabs is the counter to SB, slugging all 4 is the counter to (current/old) DS, etc. It's not necessarily incorrect, but its completely missing the point of balance.
NOED requires the same conditions to be met (5 gens completed) BUT also has the ability to be negated during, and even before it takes effect. If there was some kind of condition where a survivor's adrenaline becomes null if they are being carried/on the hook when it pops, it might be more comparable in that regard.
Honestly the biggest reason so many killers consider it OP is because of how strong it is vs M1 killers, which is more of an issue with said killers than it is with the perk. Pair that with the fact that most survivors run it, and you end up with teflon survivors the second the last gen pops, and an abysmally one sided endgame. Which of course leads to survivors not leaving and holding the game hostage in the exit gates.
In the end there are other core mechanics to the game that are more important to address than the perk itself, but its the low hanging fruit they go after since its effect is so tangible and its counter nebulous.
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Wasnt there just a rank reset like 2 days ago? There's going to be a lot of people with a lower rank than they actually are, and the pool for higher ranks is still going to be very small.
When you run into matchmaking that looks like this a few days before the reset, though....
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absolutely
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@Jake_Parks_prince said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/361053#Comment_361053
Adrenaline is no where near NOED because it doesn't allow an instant win lmao.
it kinda can though, especially since up to all 4 survivors can be using it simultaneously. Imagine being wounded and it activating just before getting hit, giving you time to enter a big loop and draw a huge distance with the speed burst added on, while the guy on the hook gets pulled off and instantly put into full health, while the last survivor already made it to an exit gate and is opening it. All during a single whiffed attack and recovery.
A little dramatic, but it can easily stomp killers under certain circumstances, arguably more than noed. Its most extreme applications do tend to be less common, tho.
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For Freddy, try running perks like Overcharge and putting more effort on map pressure than chases. Throw on pill bottle and each dream transition is almost a free hit. Add sloppy and the new Thana and you actually have a pretty good build for stalling the hell out of the game if you play into it. for the last perk you can either go with something anti-loop like bamboozle, or discordance to help prioritize areas of the map where there are multiple survivors.
For legion, spreading wounds doesn't just mean chaining frenzy constantly. Time survivors spend mending is time they're not spending on gens, and if they actually heal, it gets even worse for them in terms of time lost. He was actually able to use thana to a decent degree before, but the thana-sloppy combo on him is going to be even more viable on him both for tracking and slowing down the game.
For both of them especially, you just have to switch back and forth between map pressure and chases.
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@[Deleted User] said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/360994#Comment_360994
Dull totems ARE important.
Having tunnel vision by focusing solely/purely on just gens is akin to the killer focusing solely on either hooking survivors or just gen pressure. If the killer doesn’t do both, the killer is pretty much guaranteed a loss for the killer.
Survivors need to accept this is a multi objective game, and if they choose to ignore dull totems, that gamble is on them, not the killer.
Mans if, as you say, there is a correlation to poorly skilled killer and NOED at the end game, this should make you MORE focused on finding dull totems if you deem them to not be very good killers in this game.
Seriously, if doing SWF on comms, just all spend 2ish minutes finding, cleansing, and counting out the 5 measley number of totems. If you’re solo, it’s not difficult to find totems and count them out in your head as you cleanse them, including cleansed ones (that aren’t too difficult to spot) as you come across them. Even better, run SG.
Never have I ended up downed, Mori’d, or sacrificed and thought to myself “damn, I shouldn’t have been cleansing dull totems”
That would be all well and good, if totem spawns weren't so horrible and being continuously updated to try to make them suck less.
They're bright, so they stand out on most surfaces and lighting. Their spawn points follow set algorithms, so they can easily be adapted to and memorized where they can and can't spawn. It is impossible to make them line-of-sight proof because they need a direction to be accessable from to be broken (there have been some attempts to minimize this, but they sometimes cause issues like accidental pallet drops or just simply not allowing the animation) and worst of all, there is always the same set number of them in every map. All of these things combined make them a good idea, but a bad execution.
I applaud the devs for acknowledging it and trying new adjustments with each patch to try to improve the situation, but they would benefit from a straight up overhaul with the amount of issues they have.
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@BringBackOldBT said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/361008#Comment_361008
So remove them seeing cosmetics and items as well? Problem solved?
Then those players would just quit the game altogether, just like SWF only survivors would quit if they didnt have the ability to team up. Or just switch to survivor and stop playing killer. And of course these outcomes would make queue times even longer for survivors, extrapolating the problem.
You don't punish an entire group of your playerbase for something like that and expect said playerbase to continue to grow. You have to address WHY people are exhibiting a unified reaction, and respond in a way that addresses their DESIRE to do so. Its literally how BBQ&C happened: it was to incentivize killers to not camp by rewarding them for hooking different survivors, while also giving them the ability to track them (even if its tracking has 9000 counters now, but thats another story.)
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@BringBackOldBT said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/360989#Comment_360989
You can still go to their profiles and see their friendlists, you can recognize their names from earlier games, all that needs to be removed.
Whatever solution they tried last time sucks ass, they should indeed just keep everyone hidden for the killer untill the last person joins and then show all of them at the same time. Not sure how that fix made things worse, my theory is that they didn't try hard enough and need to remove even more information.
It made things worse because killers cherry pick lobbies more than ever now, unless they're incredibly confident. Bad to average killers will lobby dodge the second they see something they don't like (items, cosmetics, pretty much anything,) since they usually assume that at least 2-3 people in every game are a SWF with comms. There are multiple topics complaining about it (including this one,) and from what I see in those its especially bad on consoles.
If everyone but the most confident killers (the power role in a 1v4) are afraid to face readily available items, then there might be something off in regards to both balance and mentalities. Game devs can only fix one and hope it fixes the other as a consequence.
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@George_Soros said:
@Ryuhi it's not "incredibly obnoxious". Your approach (chase someone else while flashlight troll is wasting time by following you around) is the best a killer can do. Especially if a skilled looper is confirmed. Many of those survivors though are hapless Ochido wannabes, and go down in a heartbeat. That's funny too. But if they're not, just hunt down everyone else and deal with them in the end.
All you guys who think flashlight spamming (and teabagging, and sound notif. spamming when gates are open, etc) is "toxic", frustrating and so on, please try to honestly answer this question: would you still find it frustrating if you managed to sacrifice every one of them, every time? My guess is no. Which means it's never the taunting that's stressful, but the taunting following your defeat. So just win the game, problem solved.
I would and do. This game is already hard enough accessibility wise, so I have to make up for a lot of vision issues by focusing on audio. Between the audio level issues (which thank god they arent as bad as they were a few patches back) and the constant clicking, it gets very difficult to listen for things like breathing, grass moving, etc. Win or lose, it annoys the hell out of me because its already hard enough trying to track people as it is.
TBH I'm a survivor main at probably a 80/20 split, specifically because of these types of issues. Its both more accessable and less stressful at the same time, and that's coming from someone who only plays solo.
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Here's an interesting twist: Tie it to the new moving Obsession system. Every time the killer downs the obsession, they get a single token. Maybe every 5/4/3 tokens, they will have a single instadown hit once the last gate is powered, and maybe the speed bonus as well. If the obsession never changes, they can at best get enough tokens for one hit. However, if they get DSed even once, they'll be able to get enough tokens for more hits.
This would both give incentive for killers to eat the DS rather than slug, give the survivors the chance to use their DS more, and control the flow of the game a bit. Could always be tweaked to need more tokens, but gain tokens on hit rather than down. I guess mainly if it were going to be reworked in any way, I'd much rather see it be dynamic with the new obsession system than random interactions or totems, while still being weaker than it is now.
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@BringBackOldBT said:
If anyone wants to claim they bought this game thinking SWF wasn't gonna be a thing they're either liars or really really, and I mean REALLY dumb.
Also I think it's a pretty simple thing to fix, just remove the information killers get so they don't know for sure if they're vs SWF or 4 randoms, ta-da it's fixed.
They literally did that, the new matchmaking system makes survivors load in simultaneously regardless of SWF whenever possible, and even lifts some matchmaking restrictions to do so. It has made the problem much worse.
Also, there is no in game voice communication option, so it by definition requires third party software to do, is against the game's design, and gives an unfair advantage. Due to the fact that its both impossible to police and would lose them a very large chunk of their playerbase, the devs have decided that it is not against the rules. That doesn't mean the game is remotely balanced around it, but quite the opposite. They simply ignore it and try to instead base off of other metrics like survival rate at different ranks.
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@George_Soros said:
Because that's clearly how flashlights work in RL :)
I know I know, realism is not the most important factor. But you need to understand, clicking is very much part of the game. For annoying killers, for calling the attention of a fellow survivor to something, and just for fun as well. Don't get too worked up about it. If it truly annoys you, just catch and kill the survivor who does it. I mean, if you can't catch them, that's on you. No need to ask devs to change something only because "I CAN'T TAKE IT ANYMORE".
most of the reason survivors do it to killer is because they are either confident in their looping skill, or at least their ability to waste the killer's time. Also because they are in comms with their friends and can make sure they gain map pressure if you take the bait. I usually ignore them and then let them waste time not working on a gen while i chase other survivors/try to spread map pressure. Its still incredibly obnoxious though, and not intentional gameplay. Wasn't there a point where it could straight up cause people to dc as well?
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@BringBackOldBT said:
First off biggest consumers of this game are SWF so, I understand killers have this "bhvr is on my side"-mentality since they're on your side for the last 7 nerfs to survivors, however SWF is the piggybank and I assume that money is still a priority for BHVR and not how many killermains they can stop from crying.
Second off you didn't buy this game expecting there not to be SWF or them not having skype, you knew perfectly well this would happen yet you still dodge because you're trash at this game.
All the killers here saying "well if you allow SWF I'm just gonna dodge 24/7 teehee" are just fuel to the fire that the devs need to seriously hide survivor names and SWF-status, not even allow profiles to be seen from the lobby-screen, heck not even show them the items we take, we tried giving you some advantages and you're abusing them by dodging BHVR's piggybank constantly so now it's time to take them away.
You know that SWF wasn't in the game at launch, and was incorporated because survivors would CONSTANTLY dodge lobbies to get matched with one another, right? Killers are doing literally the same thing for a similar (but opposite) reason. One would assume they would get something like a separate queue to solve the issue, right?
Instead they tried to make it so its harder to tell when survivors are SWF, and the issue got even worse. Apparently its abysmal on consoles.
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So literally anything is a crutch if someone uses it a lot and struggles without it I guess? How does that have less to do with issues that can exist in the game's core balance, and more to do with "well they must be bad git gud scrub?" It has absolutely no reason nor impact in discussion, and comes off more as gloating than being constructive.
Since there is no colorblind support (still) many people need to use perks that boost their tracking to make up for things that other killer players take for granted, like being able to even see blood. Does that make those crutches since they perform considerably worse without them? According to your context clause, they are requiring them to play adequately and thus they are a crutch, even though they are being used to offset a lack of accessibility in the game. Bloodhound, Stridor, Shadowborn, almost every perk can sometimes be considered necessary by players due to their inability to perform without them for various reasons other than "skill." Where do you draw the line?
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"If all a killer needs is 1 or 2 hooks to get momentum going, then that right there is enough of an impact on the game to say "Ruin did a chunk of the work for you" since you had to apply no map pressure yourself to get that momentum."
Lets plug in the example I mentioned about Myers:
"If all a killer needs is 1 or 2 hooks to get momentum going, then that right there is enough of an impact on the game to say "Dead Rabbit + M&A did a chunk of the work for you" since you had to apply no map pressure yourself to get that momentum."
That combo does literally nothing for map pressure, but it can lead to downs/hooks due to it masking your TR and allowing you to get very close to survivors before starting a chase. Hell, you could even apply it to just the clowns bottles as they make is so you don't need to know how to mindgame loops very well. It just becomes such an arbitrary line in the sand to use as an absolute measure of whether someone is "boosted."
If your counterargument is that you need to not be seen while approaching in the example I mentioned, then there's nothing more to even be discussed tbh.
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I mean you keep calling it a crutch by saying killers rely on it too much, but again that makes almost anything a crutch by that logic. I meantioned M&A and dead rabbit on myers because it makes his TR super small when not in a chase and T1/2, but massive while in a chase and/or T3. And thats a yellow addon (not even a purple like you mentioned) paired with a teachable. The entire concept of builds is that there are things that synergize well with one another, and people based their game off of it. If you consider any killer boosted unless they avoid using Ruin, and consider it a crutch in the same context as NOED, then your definition of boosted becomes incredibly arbitrary.
Its a high risk, random reward perk. Its effectiveness relies entirely on a combination of the competence of survivors, and flat out luck. At high ranks it becomes abysmally inefficient, yet the small change it makes to early game momentum is why people still run it a lot. Again, I'm interested to see how much the new gen blocking perk for the plague affects it, and whether it will subsequently be deemed a crutch too.
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@Apoch said:
Let the clickers click, it doesn't do anything other than waste their battery. Only a prolonged concentrated beam straight in the eyes brings on the blindness effect.
With the way the system works currently, if survivors macro the activation it will waste a single charge per click. Throw some batteries on there and you can click an absurd amount of times without wasting even a small portion of its duration due to how the charges convert to seconds. Its an annoyance especially when sound can be fairly important to tracking for killers.
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you know that KYF isn't a ranked game mode like SWF, right? and that it requires multiple people, thus removing its ability to be a solo practice mode? Its literally just for a group of people to either practice vs each other, or to have for fun games amongst themselves without needing to worry about wasting addons/having unlocks.
"invite-only unranked mode"
There are no blood points, there are no emblems. Its not comparible to normal ranked mode in any way.
If you were trying to retort when I said that "Killers can't queue with friends," you'd still be incorrect as its not even a queue.
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MYC is really good with killers who have high mobility, which is why it tends to synergize well with the hag if she traps around the hook properly, or even windstorm wraith. Its another one of those perks thats kinda bad on the killer who unlocks it, but you know.
Even when you dont get the hit, it DOES make players play a bit more scared/cautious while its active, so there is that at least.
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"You can say it's anecdotal but I see it all the time." Thats literally what anecdotal means. You're making a presumption based on personal experience, and ignoring the fact that the contrary can exist beyond your personal perception. According to your stance that "you can clearly tell the killers that know how to play without Ruin in their ability to continue map pressure when it's gone." then the vast majority of killers are so good it has no impact on games in itself, or the latter must be a rare mythical unicorn. For killers to rely on ruin as hard as you're claiming, they have an abysmally low chance of getting into single digit ranks, and even worse are playing on hard mode with only 3 perks most of the time. The reason why its not even close to comparible to NOED in this regard is because NOED causes abrupt dynamic changes, and almost entirely guarantees kills when it procs. THAT is what makes it a crutch perk, the fact that it can turn a 0 kill game into a 1-4 kill game in seconds. It doesnt directly adjust the speed or flow of the game, it just faceplants survivors and forces them to either find the totem while at a large risk, leave, have a slight chance of actually outplaying normally, or fail and give the killer more kills for free. They're incomparible, especially in regard to their affect on final outcomes for games overall.
With NOED you can play pants-on-head potato tier and still get at least 1 kill, but with ruin you're more likely to be punished for even taking it than you are to get any sort of victory for using it.
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I feel like it should be like that for survivor, while the killer ones should pick the map. There are some builds like scratched mirror myers that pretty much require specific maps, while many survivors will use them to abuse specific perks (like 4 balanced landings on haddonfield of the game) It might sound like a double standard, until you play both sides of it.
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I would be ok with all of these changes, if totems were jet black, and didn't light up when they were hex totems. Or even if they were just hidden properly, and were more obstructed from the third party camera.