Raptorrotas
Raptorrotas
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Not the original post but this is an explanation done by Peanits.
its not the hatchet hitboxes that are problematic.
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All those "just open the gates"-people are quite the hypocrites.
Survivors dont need the hatch or that the gates activate when the hatch is manually closed, "Just walk to the killer and give up"
Backlash to this post will prove my point.
Also, yes 99'ing the gates is intentionally done by survivors to just not care about the EGC or Bloodwarden. You dont have to care about time limit on getting out if you open the door in a second and can leave immediatly.
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Remember the good ol days of getting spawncamped in TF2 by 6 snipers and sentry guns? Im sure they cared about MY FUN, as i paid for that game too.
Dayum, vs mode in L4D2 was lit, but why dont let the infected let me rush through the level?
Ever went by that door in De_dust2 and got instantly headshot? how dare they ruin my game by removing me from the round!!!!
/facepalm
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- Obligatory reminder "Check Identity V duo hunter rules" for inspiration for DBD duo hunter rules.
- Obligatory reminder that 2 killers focusing 1 survivor leave 7 survivors to bumrush gens.
- Obligatory reminder that "1 camp 1 hunt"-strategies leave 6-7 survivors to bumrush gens.
- Obligatory reminder that DBD mobile copied IDV's skillcheck design ;P
Doctor/ ANYONE is probably the best comp. The madness debuff can be quite devastating. The fake red stain will be devastating, and depending if the other killer can see the illusion doctor, it'd be quite useful for tracking.
Trapper/Hag just for the trap-pairing ;)
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Why yes, grabs definitely are a bad mechanic because they dont work that often.
We should remove them and...
Replace them with making survivors exposed during actions that can be interrupted by a grab. IDV does that during any action, it might be a good start.
*laughs* or we just fix grabs so survivors cant mess them up that easily? Like havcing the grab-timeframe linger a bit after survivors let go of gens/hooks?
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Do you feel bad if you 3-4 escape with barely any hooks?
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@gendoss said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2341221#Comment_2341221
The stats would like a word with you...
Seriously tho the stats show that the average red rank game is very killer sided. There are some killers like Freddy who even have a 75% kill rate. The majority of killers have a 65% kill rate and above. In the average game it is not survivor sided at all.
The last stats were borderline useless as they admitted they only tracked killer rank.
"Red rank" stats actually contained rainbow matches.
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It startles srvivors and messes with their pathing...
Working as intended, duh?
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I never wrote it down or crunched the actual variables....
The Warden - a former prison warden with the ability to spawn walls made of entity blockers.
I though that this game needs another sharply dressed person like the doctor. I think some glasgow scars or something akin a kuchisake onna would be nice.
Basically you cast the primary ability and x eistance in front of you wall fragments spawn and connect to existing structures. Those walls also hinder survivors in a small aoe and lacerate survivors in contact with the walls. The effect extends to affected/connected structures.
It's more intended to herd in survivors than actually hurt them with the laceration ( wrell bhvr wpould definitely use this style anyways), but i wanted something to make survivors not just loop the spawned walls tightly like normal sturctures.
A secondary ability would be to open a small map screen ( crude drawing, but displays some landmarks and maybe gens). The warden then can place an trap ( dont know what object to use tho) anywhere on the map. This trap will trigger if survivors enter a moderate radius around it, to summon a circular wall of enity blockers with a huge radius around it. Those walls last some time or until the trap gets disarmed by the survivors. I guess the killer also gets an notification. Im not sure how many traps this killetr would get, but thered be a minimum distance between thosre.
This is just a crude overview.
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@KateMain86 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2335052#Comment_2335052
My team can't sit still the entire match, do nothing and still escape. The killer can and get 4k after all the gens are done with NOED. Fair game isn't it?...
You literally can do 0 gens and escape by hatch.
WITHOUT the use of perks, items or offerings.
Your argument was pure survivor hypocrisy.
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Hahahahaha. I love this. Have my upvote!!!
If we nerf nurse and spirit because, if played by good players, theyre too strong against bad survivors, then we must nerf survivors because, if played by good players, theyre too strong against weak killers or bad nurses/spirits.
Cant have the balance design only apply to one side.
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Balancing about competent players is always preferable to balancing around incompetent players, because the former would learn to abuse/exploite/exquisitely use the advantages given by balance around the latter.
The same applies to the solo-swf problem. We could add all that fancy aura reading and UI help for "solo", but SWF will just use that crap too PLUS their voicechat.
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With removal/rework of the perk:
Deerstalker, shadowborn, bloodhound, (predator? ) overcharge
Weakening the perk:
Pop goes the weasel, in case a base kick damage is added.
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"Aww geez why are my teammates always such bad pubs" - Survivor 1
"Aww geez why are my teammates always such bad pubs" - Survivor 2
"Aww geez why are my teammates always such bad pubs" - Survivor 3
"Aww geez why are my teammates always such bad pubs" - Survivor 4
Maybe just maybe those kinda survs are part of the "bad pubs" because they didnt swap to swf or cwf groups lol.
You dont need to be better than the other survivors to get a totally skillful hatch escape regardless of your teams progress or ability.
Also survivors complains about "tunneling bad" dont have validity unless they collectivwly start swapping gens every collective 30% of progress or so. Buncha hypocrites complaining about tunneling while doing it rgemselves... tch.
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Do not remove the hooking or give survivors x lives plus respawning. It removes any pressure a killer couldve put on the team.
Thats one of the many things to kill deathgarden.
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Genrushing does exist. Survivors have multitude of tools to increase their
killingrepair speed, and depending on the situation, they can always decide to just focus on their generator. It's kinda "tunneling" a generator, if i were to use the terms of certain survivors. I personally havent played much survivor, but I always priotized doing gens over unhooking just before they enter the struggle stage.Remember good survivor folks, if you want killers to stop tunneling and go for 12 hook games, It's courtesy you should do the same as them, you better swap gens every 33 seconds of repair progress, else you'd be quite the hypocrites. /laughs
I think some sort of proximity or overheat based system could be used to discourage genrushing too much progress at a time on generators. /*laughs more* god damnit its too funny to apply those anti camp/tunnel ideas to gen rushing.
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I have a concept for some sort of prison warden in the back of my head. The main feature of their kit would be to spawn walls that block passages and slightly slow down survivors that touch them while constantly lacerating them. Inspired by Doctor and the entity blockers at the exit gate.
I'd say some area denial killers like clown might be interesting. imagine a killer that pops down mini-traps/totems/objects to spawn spreading infestation/creep/fog that debuffs survivors inside it . It could reuse the models of the visceral cankers for the infection-type designs of the concept.
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Swf changes how survivors play. It turns from a self centered style ( I win ) into a more team oriented (we win).
Although there are some cases that had their perception of the game warped a bit much. Ever had 3 dead sirvs brag they won because the 4th got the hatch?
I just want to point out that the game doesnt adapt to that change in mentality, the swf score judging is still the same as solo.
Swf actually has no ingame difference to solo. Theyre just likely to play more altruistic. Its rather obvious you'd more likely help a buddy than a rando.
Swf wouldnt actually be that complained about if they werent that likely to use voicechat. I'd say its a flat bonus even scribs can benefit from while also getting even better the more willing survivors are to play better themselves.
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@Tsulan said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2305290#Comment_2305290
Oh you´re right. My bad! I´ve never seen a movie where the "victims" run the killer around a piece of wood.
Anyway, since we are at the multiplayer game experience. The gens represent the killers lives. So he has 5, before its a game over. Which in turn means that survivors just tunnel the killers "lives" as much as the killer tunnels the survivors. Only difference is, that since there are 4 survivors, they have a total of 12 lives.
You should watch Scary Movie. I think "Ghostface" gets looped around a table 😆
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Peanits did a good explanation with awesome art lol.
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Do you and your buddies use comms for ingame info sharing and strategizing? Anything like "Let's go save Matt" is already part of the problem. Normal players dont have access to such a rallying verbal option.
"Chilling with my bffs and talking about cute boys, without talking about the trial" -just doesnt happen.
You might have the hint of a point about plyer skill difference. But isnt it nprmal for good players to make better use out of ANY given tool? Let's say 20% bonus for the aversge scrub in comparison to a 70+% bonus for those people who loop pig in their sleep.
Maybe o babbled on too much and should summarize.
"Bad swf" who simply fail to do good or deliberately dont work hard get thrown under the bus because of deathsquads.
Tldr:
Welcome to the top tier killer experience. I bet scrub nurses/billys wouldve loved the coddling scrub swfs get.
No offense.
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Short answer: No.
- It's fine
- They did it for a reason
- It's more balanced
- It was too strong compared to other anyway.
- It was ised in unintended ways
- Bad players get carried by it.
It doesnt deserve or warrant a second usage. Its stun wasnt even nerfed.
"it got nerfed but the devs have to give it a huge buff to compensate"
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The lack of survivor conplaints about him is worrying.
You know what it means if survs dont call q released killer op....
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It just got adjusted. Take the nerf and let it go.
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@Demogorgeouse said:
There not a point, it already takes forever to finish a genwith gentapping.
The discussion is about tapping gens mid chase. It's basically running by a generator and repairing it for just a frame. It doesnt break your running speed or animation.
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@Marik13 said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2270481#Comment_2270481
The whole "it's just a party game, don't worry about wins" argument is honestly a real bad one. Super Smash Bros is a party game. Mario Party is the definition of a party game. In both of those games you have friends who are competitive with each other to try and win. So "its just a party game" is not an excuse. Other party games, again gonna use Smash Bros here, still tends to their game and releases balance patches to make sure the game isn't too lop sided and broken. No one likes playing a broken game, regardless if it's "a party game" or not.
And yes I understand it's an asymmetrical game. Again that doesn't mean that you can't fix and better balance it. Again, at base 80 secs vs 5 min, 5 gens vs 12 hooks. The numbers are a little too broad just at the base level, and get worse when you factor in perks and add-ons. You can still balance the game by tightening those numbers just a little bit. In regards to the regression numbers, to me anyway, it doesn't seem like good game design when you have to run certain in game perks that essentially function as a bandaid solution to a problem.
People friction-burned their ######### hands to win in mario party minigames. That game is such a perfect example for "its just a party game, bro" being a stupid argument.
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Swf is stronger than "solo"/"default" because theyre able to use third party software unaccounted by the game's design. Oh and obviusly they care more for each other than pubbers. You just dont consider calling that buddy you know your anger induced slurs when he messes up.
Swf changes a survivors perception of a trial ("we" win) and that sticks with people so they compare the default with it.
- The only mechanical advantage is comms, the rest is in the survivor mind.
- Any goodie added for those poor pubs will also be used by better players and *le gasp* swf squads.
- People tend to want to add stuff that has nothing to do with that solo-swf gap ("basekit ds or bond etc")
Of course solo is weak when its compared with a stronger version of itself.... duuuuh.
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@C3Tooth said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2255675#Comment_2255675
There are many perks that benefit killers more than increasing FoV, so Killer rather not picking Shadowborne. But having ShadowBorne as basekit is another story.
And once people have it, they will ask more. Why it should only stop at 102 but not 120? And so on.
FoV slider is pointless, everyone will just pick the highest option.
I would increase FoV to even larger to make it worth a perk slot, like 110 degree, or maybe even adding Survivors glowing (similar to Shape's stalking), make killer easily spot survivor in the dark (someone suggest Shadowborne should increase the brightness, but people can just increase their screen brightness anyway, so I find this idea is better)
Of course some players are gonna ask for more.thats normal. They love to bargain and beg.
I personally are against a slider. But we can raise the base FOV and remove it as variable from the game. Thats infinitely better than bandaiding it with a perk.
But survivors dont want killer issues be fixed in favor of keeping subpar perk solutions....
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"Acessible fov for people that get sick by normal fov? " no no no thats too strong
"Pls gib kindred bond, DS voicechat totem counter, current action icon and other stuffs to balance swf"
And of course theres a siggestion of nerfing other significant mechanics as compensation for a slight buff... why is that only with killer stuff?
If shadowborn gave such an advanrage these kinda people are advocating.... why isnt it meta?
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The answer to 4 slugs is to give survivors an option to surrender once all remaining survivors are in a failstate (hooked, slugged, afk? ). Obviously WITH killer bp bonus, as this might interrupt a hookibg in progress.
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@Artick said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2252306#Comment_2252306
So when killers whine about the same freaking thing for months and years is fine, but survivors aren't allowed to?
"wahaaaaa keys are so op"
"wahaaaaa DS is so op"
"wahaaaaa whatever perk I don't like is so op"
"wahaaaaa this map is so op"
Moreover, killers constantly link otz's videos as proof of why something should be nerfed. Survivors do the same thing once to justify Spirit needing a nerf and it's the end of the world. Hypocrisy much?
Also, no one believe you are actually a survivor main. At least not at high ranks where 1 out of 3 games is Spirit. You are probably a killer main afraid you'll lose your busted killer.
The difference is that survivors get a slap on the wrist while killers get gutted like a fish.
What survivors are currently doing to spirit is what gave us cooldown nurse with meme addons and overheat billy.
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Why is this suddenly about EGCbeing x sided?
Its about people being able to absolutely ignore it by prepping the door. Which sucks.
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Most people misuse the term, but by design of being an asymetrical 4v1 scenario, there is a number role ( survivors) against a power role ( killer).
Most people complain that the supposed number role is too strong.
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Swf is the same mechanically as solo.
The difference is a mental thing like altruism and " we won", even if 3 die.
Oh and theyre more likely to use voicechat. Which is what most people complain about.
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Regenerating evil on survivors and an addon rework.
His cheap addons should have effects for more tiers of his ability.
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Caatlevania dracula's most rwccuribg attacks are teleports and fireballs....
Kinda want to see the survivor meltdown over a nurse/huntress hybrid.
Although in my opinion an OC vamp would be enough.
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So someone escapes and you suddenly get 60% of the escape points just for being sacrificed?
This would boost sirvivors ditching each other, because the difference between escape or not would shrink.
(Its kinda the same BS with the escape points attached to the hatch points)
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Im really amused.
This basekit demand is soooooo much less impactful than whats constantly demanded for survivors.
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@NMCKE said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2224800#Comment_2224800
Doesn't matter, if you're being camped, you're freeing pressure from you teammates to do objectives.
You SHOULD get credit for generator progress, healing, totems, and so on that your team does.
Of course, this alone won't be much to pip, but say you got chased for a while then camped since the killer got salty. The camping credit you get should make the difference!
Sorry, but i'm pretty sure we shouldnt give BP to someone who's literally doing nothing except hanging around.
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Best take on the situation so far.
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It's an interesting concept that could also be appliable to other killer's tools or objects.
Trapper maybe? Demodoggi?
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@CoalTower said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2217855#Comment_2217855
What exactly does RNG stand for? I more or less know what it means, but what is the exact acronym?
Random number generation ( or generator? )
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Friendly fire allows for finer skill expression.
*dedinitely doesnt just want to burn survivor retina*
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The doctor illusions should spawn outside the survivors FOV or LOS and then move towards them.
That'd be increasingly frustating or annoying, so perfect for Dr. Annoying
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Take the zombies and make something like Identity V's Hell Ember out of it .
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I'm not sure if it's actually toxic to swap characters in thr lobby. Last second, definitely.
It definitely hinders with the killers ability to prepare in the lobby. ( which might be outdated in general).
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I'd prefer few balanced maps over many trash maps.
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@HungTop said:
-All survivor loadouts are visible to each other in pre-game lobby
-Ping system similar to IDV that lets survivor relay basic information such as: im working on a gen, im being chased, im going for save etc.
Tbh i think thats really all solo q needs to be 100% less frustrating and bring them a little but closer to swf
This.
A ping or quick message system is all thats needed to emulate oicechat. Or just add voicechat.
This would obviously require some basekit killer stats buffs as compensation.
If the devvs add free info instead of just ways to relay it, it will require major compensation, not just base stuff but also buffs to killer abilities.
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Dunno about the pallet break, she seems more of a pallet vaulter because of her size.
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@NMCKE said:
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2198761#Comment_2198761
I prefer bringing solo queue to SWF level, then balancing accordingly. However, I'm afraid that this process is so utterly slow that we'll be better off doing the boring route by nerfing SWF and calling it day.
I don't want to nerf SWF by any means, but I barely seen any progress in the past years to address the gap between solo queue and SWF. The obsession mechanic being basekit, amazing... but that's only one of three things they changed to close the gap and make the experience for solo queue better. They could've had four, but they wanted it attached to Small Game instead of it being basekit. 🤷♂️
I don't know, I support the developers regardless if it's questionable, but I'm just worried that keeping the gap will be unhealthy for game as the developers can't find a clear point to balance around.
Depending on the type of solo-gap closing, meaning anything except some message system or ingame voicechat, there'd be no nerfs on any killer though.
I'm really killer biased, but I understand the need to close that gap, BUT just adding all that free aura and UI stuff as people demand isnt really closing the gap. IMHO it'd make it likely for even nurse to receive buffs.