RainehDaze
RainehDaze
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@biggybiggybiggens said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3905895#Comment_3905895
Apples to oranges. You get my point so no need for correction. His skill EVERYTHING is easier than Nurse. There you go. Happy?
Mmm, it's just that having a lower skill ceiling doesn't mean a Killer is "easier", it just means that at some point their mechanics are going to gimp them more. Take Legion: it doesn't matter how good someone is going to get with Legion, they're still basically an M1 Killer, and have a much lower skill ceiling. But that doesn't make them easier to play.
Kaneki's actually got a reasonable skill ceiling in there (and part of the skill floor – the size of the aim window – actually hurts that) when it comes to using his power around loops, so the skill ceiling is fine.
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@biggybiggybiggens said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3905876#Comment_3905876
In general his skill ceiling is way lower so yes for the majority of people that try Nurse 1 time and try Ghoul 1 time, Ghoul will perform better. Please, tell me I'm wrong.
Floor. It's skill floor that you're talking about. The skill ceiling is the opposite (at what point you can't be more skilled and expect better results). Skill floor is about how easy it is to pick up and get results.
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"Killswitch the only thing released in the new DLC less than a week after it releases" would be business suicide. It would also crater the player numbers right before the blood moon event.
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Just making the radius the hitscan latches onto survivors smaller would be nice. I feel like there needs to be some give in it given the combo of DBD's weird hitboxes (see ye olde hatchet explanation) and the second hit being meant to be a ranged attack done at up to 22m/s (if sliding) as this isn't an FPS and missing would then just yeet you somewhere else and put you on CD (so the consequences are quite steep compared to "shoot again").
It'd make using it to go round survivors when they're injured and just play around things more fun, too.
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All the nerf suggestions that are just taking a crowbar to a given Killer's knees so that they drop into unplayable…
Anyway, if I was going to buff someone:
Trapper – if the Killer is the trapper, the maps have more grass cover. Forget map aesthetics, trapper = grass. Maybe the Entity will finally realise humans have eyes and can see things if there's nothing covering them. Also, stop maps working on the poor guy, why does he still have that interaction of all things?
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Honestly, he's a mobility killer, it's just plain weird he doesn't have a scoring event like blight/wesker/nurse just for using the power.
(Disclaimer: I may not have been paying attention whenever using Nurse)
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@biggybiggybiggens said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3905516#Comment_3905516
I mean Wesker as in pick rate. Nothing but Wesker for weeks when he was released. I hope Ghoul gets nerfed sooner, so we don't have to sit through this just as much as back to back Wesker at most levels of play..
It's almost as if releasing a shiny new thing gets a lot of people interested in playing it! Imagine that.
Now, if you don't see a seemingly endless tide of the shiny new thing when it comes out, then you know that you have a problem.
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@XtremeDBD said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/441842/how-to-build-a-strong-and-fun-killer
Houndmaster. Thats it. By far one of the most balanced killers released in awhile. She has a mix of niche traversal and a counterable chase power that relies on both survivor and killer's skill to dodge and land grabs. Camping pallets though garuntees a dog stun, you waste pallets faster, so you can't just camp and make her power useless. Both sides suffer, and thats fair
I feel like houndmaster misses much of the "fun to play" aspect.
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@Trollinmon said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3380505#Comment_3380505
Gen regression can't be strong if healing is going to take this long. The direction they seem to be going here is that slowdown should mostly come from injuring survivors. If they did the healing change with strong regression killer would be too strong.
Then make them do something else, don't make them all incapable of doing what they're meant to. Have CoB reset the usual regression if you drive a Survivor off without needing another kick. Make Overcharge more about skill checks. Lots more.
If you don't want direct regression, change perks that do that to do something else. And stop making them too bad to use instead.
@babayagasaga said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3380505#Comment_3380505
I respectfully disagree regarding Circle of Healing! Again, these changes will make literally no difference to swf, who can coordinate easily to heal, but absolutely kills solo queue players' ability to reset on their own, which you often have to do.
Conversely, SWF could coordinate easily to take advantage of CoH and avoid being interrupted and let everyone know to stay on their gen perfectly.
And if a team-buffing perk was being used because it let solo players heal like they have Self Care, you can immediately spot the problem with it.
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Circle of Healing should still allow survivors to self-heal within its radius
No. That is literally the problem with it. That has always been the problem with it: one survivor and 14s in an isolated area of the map, now everyone has old self-care.
The overcharge and CoB changes aren't really okay, because even if they hadn't touched Pain Res, the only halfway functional regression perks are pain res (semi-unreliable scourge hook perk) and Jolt (half the Killers can't use it). Every regression perk has either been nerfed in 6.1.0, or de facto deleted afterwards. <_>
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@Halloulle said:
There are worse things than manually prestiging a character once - though the way they phrase it makes it sound as though you forget how bloodwebs work with every new character. Which is a bit ridiculous.
you see, playing any new character requires you to beat yourself in the head with a brick until you forget every other character.
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@Deathstroke said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3380373#Comment_3380373
They nerf them because they are popular instead making them partly basekit like with all other killers. I think overall this update has went overboard. I think if it goes live blight, nurse and spirit need to be nerfed considerably.
Spirit has
One problematic addon. That's kind of it; they've already gutted her ability to do much of anything else and made her audio super duper obvious.
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@Carth said:
For sure. All the healing perks honestly need to be re-evaluated both buffs, debuffs, and heal times if the perk opens up a new avenue to see if they're ok with the new baseline or need tweaks to reflect the added time
I mean, self care is now in a comically ridiculous state, but the thing about anything that directly affects healing time and is repeatable is, well... they probably shouldn't change if the desire was to universally alter healing times.
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"Healing will be slower and self healing gets no bonus speed. Clearly, there is nothing that benefits from increased rarity."
Altruistic healing isn't no benefit, but it'll be interesting to see if the limitations on self healing and the slower healing overall push people towards considering fast healing more effective than gen efficient healing.
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@MerleDixon said:
Survivor entitlement where? Your comparing a few small killer nerfs to some pretty huge survivor nerfs
There is literally a thread on the front page that starts with 'I hope you guys plan on refunding people like me who have spent hundreds in the games' over the balance changes, so there's that.
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@Deathstroke said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3379900#Comment_3379900
Some situations is good and when it works it's best exhaustion perk. But actually currently for me it's hard to get value most killers have gotten used to it and bait it out.
And everyone hated baiting it out constantly.
This is likely to make it more consistent to actually use, whilst removing the value of 'people following you unsure if they can swing or not until it's a lose lose situation'.
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@Rudjohns said:
Yep, pretty much
Prove Thyself, Resilience and Adrenaline
Some build variations including Inner Healing and Overzealous
Honestly, as a survivor main, I like this.
oh no, not constant resilience
all the baffling near-miss vaults that have me questioning my sanity
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@Firellius said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3379702#Comment_3379702
How many people complained about these?
Imagine if they made Dead Hard basekit but then nerfed Red Herring, Urban Evasion and For the People and everyone went 'well, they made things better for your side too!'.
Tunnelling, something that did actually get loads of complaints, got buffed, by the way, just as an aside. As did 3-genning, which was the root concern for COB and OC.
Quite a lot of people complained about them. Also the very existence of Knight and SM, but they definitely got complained about.
Your comparison is more for Shadowborn, Spies from the Shadows, and... I dunno, Bloodhound? Grim Embrace? But those haven't been nerfed.
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@sizzlingmario4 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3379540#Comment_3379540
You could gen tap, but it also gave the killer information that you were back as soon as you did a skill check so they could come kick it again. It was like two perks in one imo. Now it’s more of an info perk and doesn’t do much for slowdown. Any killer could hold a 3 gen with CoB + OC, the last couple killers released were just even better at doing it.
As for CoH, I think boons just need a more substantial rework because I highly doubt we’re going to see them much at all now. Make them more useful but give them better counterplay. Having to travel to the top of Ironworks to snuff a totem is dumb.
DH, idk. I don’t think there was a great way to fix it without reworking it entirely if I’m being honest. But it’s still a nerf so I’ll take it.
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3379547#Comment_3379547
I’m not sure what you mean with not constant application for CoB, are you saying it should have a cooldown or something?
Not sure how I feel about the new Gearhead. It’ll definitely activate more often now, but the gen auras will still block survivor auras a lot of the time.
A cooldown, one thing at a time, anything. Hell, change it from super-accelerated regression to a ruin-like 'this gen will begin regressing at X% speed when it's not being worked on'. I'm sure a couple of people here could have brainstormed ways to remove it from an overbearing 3gen meta without making it totally useless given half an hour.
Rebalancing the game so something's not part of the dominant meta doesn't always have to mean 'not viable to run at all', but here we are.
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Wow, the entitlement on this one.
'I demand a refund because the game has been rebalanced'.
Also, flashbang works, it's just something that can be avoided.
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And some of those are just bad ideas that should never, ever be buffed.
Looking at you, Mettle of Man.
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@sizzlingmario4 said:
DH, CoH, and CoB were all overpowered though. While I’ll admit CoH is most definitely dead now, hopefully now the devs will realize boon totems are a failed mechanic because no one will actually use them anymore. I actually don’t have a problem with any of these perks being nerfed, what I do have a problem with is how hard healing was nerfed when the only problems were medkits and CoH.
BHVR has a bad pattern of nerfing perks by crippling the numbers, and then trying to buff them after by changing how they work.
The obvious fix was to change how CoB worked so it wasn't just constant application, not make the thing useless. And on the flip side, we have Gearhead, where the problem was that it might activate whilst you're still doing something on top of its RNG reliance. Now we have Gearhead, which is almost certainly going to activate when you're doing something, and when you're not doing something, there are other perks that don't rely on Survivors being on gens and getting skillchecks (BBQ, obviously, for one). <_>
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@Nirgendwohin said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3379472#Comment_3379472
the skill curve of killer and survivor is completely different. In my experience, a survivor needs at least 1000 hours of play before he is a reasonable looper. I don't know if such a requirement is healthy for the game which has no casual mode.
The entire game is a casual mode.
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@Laluzi said:
The issue is that BHVR seems more intent on changing the meta than balancing perks. This is pointless, because meta is meta for a reason. If you kill the old one, a new one shows up. You will always have a dominant meta because some perks are just more reliable and help with more vital things than others. The best you can hope for is that the meta is healthy.
You saw this with Self-Care, Ruin, and Pop last time - now it's this lot. Nerfs can be very good, but deleting perks is just unhealthy.
I don't think PR is strictly dead, but CoH is six feet under and I doubt DH is crawling out of its grave this time.
Maybe for dedicated unhook builds.
People actually running DH will probably get more direct value out of pressing it, and everyone else can happily swing away.
It is concerning that we're just building an ever-bigger pile of perks nobody wants to use, though. On top of releasing more dross.
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They want to shift the meta, which is fine.
On the other hand, BHVR seems to have a phobia of perk buffs. We're getting... a gearhead buff. And an overzealous buff.
Because overzealous/stakeous/hyperfocus couldn't already be annoying in the wrong situation.
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Well, provided people don't get even more medkits somehow.
- Sadako - Her hit and run style with wraith can be strong, but probably weaker than wraith still
I doubt it, with the accessibility changes, I'm pretty sure her ability to have even the slightest bit of stealth is going to be dead in the water. Unless you're really confident people will only use it as needed (rather than doubling up, or just using it so they can listen to other stuff than the game).
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@AmpersandUnderscore said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3378244#Comment_3378244
We need to stop referring to the whole 'camp '3 gen from game start' thing 'efficient'. Efficiency has a component of time, and implies that this is a quick path to winning a game, which this absolutely isn't.
Call it what it is: this is an 'easy' way to play the game for any killer who doesn't value their time. It just dilutes a pvp asymm game into a pve gen kick simulator.
Efficient doesn't necessarily mean that it's time-efficient.
It could be described as effort efficient. The output for the input needed is a very good conversion rate.
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@BlueHorkew said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3374980#Comment_3374980
The other problem is that survivors have no reason to mess with tapes.
Her TP cooldowns is bigger than the survivors removing tapes. She also has all the info if a survivor takes a tape.
So basically, right now survivors removing tapes is only to stop her from TP in the end game, because otherwise is a death sentence.
My guess is that the condemned mechanic was supposed to be a slowdown similar to pig traps. But right now the balance of condemned is all out of wack. Its hard to create pressure with condmned without using the slugging condmned build and survivors are heavily punished for interacting with that mechanic. So what would be a nice slowdown is just an afterthought.
It would be nice seeing a slight rework to make the mechanic more interesting, but she is functional and not problematic. Which really shouldn't be something to praise, but someone at bhvr thought people would react positively to Skull Merchant
Eh? She doesn't have all the info, unless staring in the right direction when that happens. 'Someone has a tape' when you just straight-up can't see deactivated TVs isn't a ton of info. Are they a little condemned? A lot condemned?
The most inconvenient part, of course, being that a TV you've teleported to and is on its exorbitantly long CD and a TV a Survivor has turned off are exactly the same from your perspective.
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@Ἥφαιστος said:
Borrowed Time exist before all this so why are you complaining now?
people were complaining about BT being used to body block before then, too.
It's the sort of thing that, as a tactic, only punishes the people trying to not tunnel anyway.
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@BlueHorkew said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3374390#Comment_3374390
What do you mean by boons destroying Hexes? I don't understand.
Made survivors memorize totem spawns or made survivors look for totems more? Is that the issue?
Because, i don't see how boons counter hexes, if anything it is the opposite. Since hexes slowdown blessing speeds or remove boon placements.
I think they also had to make sure that all totems could be accessible by Killers, which narrows down the number of awkward corners they could go into where they might be harder to spot.
On top of all the 'spawn in the open right next to a generator right next to where a Survivor starts' ones.
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@Devil_hit11 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3373944#Comment_3373944
disabling killer power is one of the most ridiculous concepts in dbd. trapper and hag definitely suffer from same problem. apart from obvious trapping killers, I think Twins can suffer from victor being disable for 40 seconds if the survivor purposely holds the killer power hostage. Another killer who survivor can manually disable the power is freddy dream world.
I do not think that any killer design that has revolved around the survivor disabling the power has ever been strong. It has always been weakness with no real positive.
Freddy's just a bad execution, the awake/asleep distinction is fine.
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@Dustin said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3373944#Comment_3373944
I absolutely understand where you're coming from and personally I feel that both Trapper and Hag have problems with their kit regardless of that issue. I'd love for things to improve with them as I used to main Trapper at one point so I get how it is. I just feel it's a necessary component enabling the 4v1 Asym game. If it was restricted it would become a 1v1.
Even with the person they're in chase with that person can ruins Hag's chase potential if they have a torch and a good enough loop. Hag is basically confined to her webs on the map to do anything with her power and setup takes forever. This is why you see a lot of Hag players camping because the time investment to leave their web is game throwing. Trapper is similar to a lesser extent but at least they move at normal speed and their traps are deadly when they work.
If we look at every other killer though - Would you ultimately change them? The only one I can think of that's absolutely not shared is Plague and that one is more getting rid of a debuff.
I think it's only the trap-based Killers that suffer so much from denial of power. Then again, that's because they're the only ones that actually leave their powers lying around to be disabled.
Everyone else either gets some sort of status infliction that they need to deal with themselves, but potentially at the cost of using team resources (Plague, Wesker, Nemesis) or isn't affected at all (their power just does its thing, or the resource isn't shared).
The main exceptions are Sadako--who needs a bunch of things looked over, including the same 'one Survivor can go around disabling all your teleports and then return the tape' issue that turns you into an M1 Killer--and Pinhead, and Pinhead's the only one who gets a good balance out of it, since the box spawns out of the way, must be attended to, isn't everything he can do, and he can infer where it is and interfere (plus the teleporting means it's not even risk-free to solve).
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@Dustin said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3373912#Comment_3373912
Compare it to Pinhead - Imagine if you had to do rotations for the Lament Configuration. Solo queue wouldn't survive because even with prompts everyone wants to do their own thing if they're not directly communicating with the other survivors. Having one survivor having the ability to use all their time outside of doing the objectives to focus on killer power is a good dynamic. It gives survivors fleability and freedom to help each other out on a whim. It doesn't mean it will happen all the time but it should be an option.
It's a function that's present with every single killer in regards to interacting with their power in some capacity whether you're physically disabling bear traps or burning a killer with a flashlight so they can't use their power. Also if a single survivor is using their entire time walking around the map disabling a power I'd take that over 2% because a player has willing taken theirself out of the game just to hinder your power.
It'd be like if Pinhead didn't even have the minor anti-looping his chains provided
Although regarding Pinhead and Merchant - Pinhead focuses on slowing survivors down while in chase and eventually the game. Merchant doesn't focus on one particular thing at all with her power and being honestly it's not entirely clear what BHVR even wants to do with this killer. Is she meant to be a stealth killer? A defense killer? She doesn't particularly excel at one thing although I will admit I am glad we're shifting her from gen defense to chase but I don't see it preventing 3 gen situations because it's going to force survivors to rotate around the map more swapping roles.
The fact a single determined Survivor can go around totally disabling Trapper or Hag is outright detrimental to their design and performance, though.
It's generally not needed, but the idea that if 1/4 of the Survivor side feels like it (and for Trapper and this theoretical SM, without any item or investment), a Killer doesn't get to have a power and is in a 3v1 with literally just an M1 and addons denied? That's awful. It might technically be a massive amount of slowdown, but it's well over into unfun gameplay design.
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@Dustin said:
I do feel this will make her stronger in chase but honestly I feel this isn't the right change for her and I'm predicting it's going to be even more of a slog playing against her. Hear me out here with this.
The main issue I have is this.
First, The Skull Merchant will now gain a growing Haste effect for each Survivor tracked on her radar. This bonus starts at 3% for one Survivor, raises to 5% for two, 6% for three and 7% for four. Both Claw Traps and active drone zones will contribute to this, and the Killer does not need to inspect their scanner to gain the benefits. This will reward the Killer for efficiently using their Power to keep tabs on their prey.
My first issue is this - Essentially she gets a buff if someone is either within the range of a drone currently scanning or is wearing a tracker? On its own I find that to be fine but in conjunction with the following I find that this is actually going to cause 3 genning to become worse on this killer and not solve anything.
Second, vaulting a pallet with a Claw Trap will cause that pallet to break, destroying the Claw Trap in the process. This was previously part of the common Ultrasonic Trap Speaker Add-on. With this change, being chased with a Claw Trap attached becomes a lot more dangerous.
Because of this change - If you do not preemptively remove the trap by throwing a pallet down and fast vaulting it early to remove the trap without even being in chase you are either actively killing your teammates or yourself if you end up in a chase with her. I wouldn't have an issue with this if it were not for the final addition.
Second, drones will enter an unhackable state whenever a Survivor with a Claw Trap is near. This will prevent a single Survivor from running around and disabling every drone, meaning the Killer will always have some combination of four Claw Traps or drones available to them. Combined with the changes to Claw Traps mentioned above, The Skull Merchant will always get value out of her ability whether it’s through deployed drones or traps.
I'll just say it - This is a good dynamic of survivors that keeps one survivor always occupied - Now with more limited options it makes the survivor have to preemptively drop pallets and fast vault them to remove the traps or accept that Merchant has free movement speed constantly to patrol and end chases quicker. I feel overall these three changes in combination with each other will make three gen'ing much worse. Because now if a survivor cannot disable drones every single survivor will either risk being exposed or go down quicker in a chase because the M1 killer will be going faster and eventually what ever pallet you fault will just break as if the killer had Dissolution.
I absolutely feel these changes will make her even more unfun to play against from a survivor perspective and not change the three gen situation. She still has nothing going for her in chase except she runs slightly quicker if survivors are trapped and now you are forced to juggle dismantling drones as survivor and in solo queue this will be even more frustrating dealing with.
Do note - I am assuming you can at any time drop a pallet and fast vault it to remove the trap.
If I'm overlooking anything feel free to correct me - I just haven't seen Merchant since the first 3 days and outside of the PTB I have zero intentions to touch her again.
'One Survivor can totally disable a Killer's power' is not a good dynamic. It's actually a terrible one if this disabling is the entirety of your power. It'd be like if Pinhead didn't even have the minor anti-looping his chains provided (and a tendency to force people well out of the way, and the chain hunt was terrible).
If one Survivor could run around giving her only a 2% speed bonus and denying any other application of her power, that would be game-breakingly bad. She'd make Trapper look like an S-tier god by comparison.
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It's a large part of what I suggested (making her power more about buffing her than focusing on trying to stick exposed on Survivors), although the route taken is kind of interesting.
Although, I do wonder if being stuck at one trap per initial Survivor might work out too low given you can only reset them at all once the timers expire. 5 wouldn't seem to break things too much--and at least then you'd have some access to stealth, exposed, or other addons if everyone goes and gets a trap.
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Wesker in F and someone likes Nurse's new music and the 1s loop Skull Merchant is stuck with?
Is your idea of musical perfection someone shaking a sack of gravel in a tin?
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@Vhillain said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3372309#Comment_3372309
So, are you insinuating that this mechanic is a positive experience because of how it benefits the killer?
The survivors are using something they have control over, and are eating an injury to finish their objective. Unless it's the last generator and they smack you with an Adrenaline you will get your down quickly after and have free pressure. the surprise skillchecks are something neither side has control over, that is the problem with it. The killer did not earn that skillcheck, it was handed to them on a silver platter by game design, it's in no way an outplay or something to be proud of. If I'm a killer and I see this happen in front of me I will feel absolutely dirty just witnessing it, because I know how that shifts the mental in a game. 99ing is also a very viable strategy that is used commonly in every single game in some form or another, including 99ing a heal for resilience value. Why is this person punished for letting go at the most strategical timing?
No, I'm saying that getting off the gen for 1s to take an M1 instead of a grab so you can finish the gen shouldn't be a thing. You're on the gen and the Killer is literally behind you. The entire point of the grab is that you shouldn't be doing actions when the Killer is right next to you.
This isn't like hook grabs where there's a good argument for why they shouldn't be a thing, it's just nakedly playing greedily.
It shouldn't be a triviality to trade an injury for an entire generator completing.
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@AMOGUS said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3372523#Comment_3372523
Wastes time in the middle of nowhere? Like, what, 5 seconds?
And name the Killers that can't use their power that aren't high tier/can't catch up easily that aren't Trickster.
Not guaranteed either, stop lunging and just follow the Survivor. If you think they're going to DH greed, just wait it out and then hit them. They can't drop the pallet after a DH before you can get a fast M1.
By greed, I mean 'DH if you lunge, drop pallet once you're about to be in normal M1 range'. There's not really a counterplay for that. It's guaranteed value at that point.
And 5s isn't nothing. Small bits of time are everything and add up.
Tier doesn't matter. It's ######### stupid that the existence of one perk makes M2-based killers develop a thing for M1's against an injured survivor. Chainsaw downs? Nah. Wesker's Virulent Bound? Nope. Demo's shred? Nemesis tentacle? None of that, use an M1 instead. It's dumb.
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I just wish DH would change one way or the other to make its mind up.
Either you use it for guaranteed value to greed a pallet, or it's a mindgame and timing trick in an open field that has to be baited out.
Not both, where it can get guaranteed value if you have a tile to loop, and still wastes time in the middle of nowhere because you can't bloody lunge or use your power.
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@Vhillain said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3371930#Comment_3371930
Yeah! Even as a killer i will sometimes get free grabs because of these skill checks on gens that were a fingernail away from completion and they cant let go to eat the M1.
There should be more grabs like this.
Letting go for one split second whilst doing the gen in the Killer's face in order to avoid the grab that penalises sitting on the gen in the Killer's face is just an obnoxiously trivial dodge.
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@ProudRinMain said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3371157#Comment_3371157
Yeah i have no idea what the devs were thinking 🙄 why make her audio crystal clear and easy to pinpoint and not suffer from sound occlusion but the survivors’ sounds are extremely garbage and inconsistent and have sound occlusion EVERY.SINGLE.TIME. It’s getting atrocious.
Because the only acceptable level of counterplay to a power appears to be 'the Survivors must have more knowledge about it than the Killer does'. At some point, you have to wonder why they aren't just making her visible, seeing as the sound has been made increasingly obvious to the point where you're only going to fail to pinpoint her if you're playing with mono speakers.
Take a look at every status infliction power in the game, for instance. I think the only thing that involves some sort of buildup on Survivors that the Killer can observe is Pinhead, and that's just a timer before someone grabs the box.
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@Iron_Cutlass said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3369422#Comment_3369422
I mean what could they realistically do to change DH?
Reduce the "On-Hit" Sprit Burst by 10-20%? Reduce the time-window to 0.25 seconds? I mean they are surely ideas but people will adapt to the changes and people will just go back to complaining again, nothing will have changed.
Dead Hard, as a perk, will never be balanced in the eyes of the community since there will always be something to complain about it, then again, when is this community never complaining about something pointless or exaggerating.
No speed boost and a few seconds of no collision after it triggers.
Still great for greeding pallets, gets out of the way in chases in open space.
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@NewPlayer100102 said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3370289#Comment_3370289
Did they indicate they were going to improve(we assume rework means improve, not safe with these guys) it in anyway?
I mean I'm just not mad about it, its difficult, maybe overly so but in a game full of imbalances that are decided at match making time, I struggle to get angry at one that slights Wesker/Blight.
I don't think they indicated they were going to make it worse by penalising the few Killers who could actually traverse the blasted thing with a bunch more random hitboxes and obstacles. <_>
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@NewPlayer100102 said:
This is a hard map for Wesker/Blight.
The large amount of foliage makes it hard to tell exactly which thing you're targeting for a bounce/rebound.
Mostly its trees, I think they are the same ones from Yamoka.
But, its hard to get too upset about it, its one map out of a lot, and Blight/Wesker have many favorable maps.
And I want to face Trapper here, seems like he could have a good time with the ground cover.
They made the biggest map in the game just as big and invalidated movement abilities on it.
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@VoidOfMe said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3369377#Comment_3369377
It's ok too, we have many other maps in the game, not every single one of them must be good.
It was always like this, some you win, some you lose and we move on.
not every map needs to be good for blight, not every map needs to be good for trapper, not every map needs to be good for killers, not every map needs to be good for survivors.
We don't need every single map releasing as bad for every Killer whose power doesn't pass through obstacles in a straight line or happen to be stationary.
Being unable to play because the map is full of invisible or misleading collisions is bad design. It'd be like a map coming out that's bad for Survivors because one area of it randomly forces you to crouch if you step in the wrong unmarked spot. Nobody would call that a map balance caused by interactions between skill and optimal conditions for a playstyle, it's just a hard 'no, no playing that way for you'.
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@Madjura said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3367652#Comment_3367652
You shouldn't be forced to run a specific perk every game to not have your fun ruined by something like what OP described
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3367655#Comment_3367655
Some strategies / ways of playing like dragging out the game by holding a 3-gen and refusing to leave are so unfun they need to be removed from the game. "Just die" can't be the solution
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3367658#Comment_3367658
3-gens were always possible. Changes to Ruin / Pop Goes The Weasel did not make them possible. You could undo all (or some) changes made to these perks ever and 3-gens would still be possible as they are now. Killers can decide they want to 3-gen and make the game miserable for Survivors with or without those two perks
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3367667#Comment_3367667
Easiest way is probably to add a way to the game that lets Survivors forcefully end a 3-gen. Such as opening the exit gates, but at a much slower rate, and with aura reveal + notification if only 3 generators are left. Something like 3 minutes+ without interruption to open a gate. That would force the Killer away from the 3-gen, at least temporarily, and allow progress. Depending on how close the 3-gen is to the gates is though this may not work.
Realistically there are only three ways to stop 3-gen situations:
- make it against the rules and start banning Killers going for it. This has the massive downside of the report system being awful and requiring a recording (or adding a replay system so the support staff can just check that)
- make them impossible by forcing generators to spawn far enough apart for it to not work anymore. This most likely requires an overhaul of most (or all) maps and/or map generation
- add a mechanic to the game that forces the Killer to leave the 3-gen. Such as being teleported away if they are in one area for too long (similar to how Survivors get AFK crows but with a forced teleport) or another way for Survivors to escape that is ideally only viable if the Killer refuses to leave a 3-gen
Nothing else works.
Some commonly suggested solutions and why they don't work:
- anything to do with perks: you should never just lose or risk being dragged into a 30+ minute game if you don't always run a specific perk
- Killer buffs: you could make an overpowered Killer that can mori after the first down so they don't "need" to go for 3-gens but they still could if they wanted to. The problem is that some Killer players apparently find it fun, but their fun comes at the cost of four other players. Just because there are better ways to get kills doesn't mean everyone will stop going for 3-gens. It's still going to be a miserable experience for four players even if it's not the optimal or even a good strategy
- "just don't get 3-genned": Killer can decide to 3-gen at the start of the game and there is nothing you can do about it as Survivor. There is nothing forcing the Killer to care about the other four generators. They just ignore them, you can work on them for a few minutes but then you are stuck in a 3-gen
- "just give up and let the Killer kill you": "just don't play the game" is a bad solution for obvious reasons
I don't think the teleporting would be a good idea.
It totally inverts the problem; "If Survivors 3-gen themselves, you're going to automatically lose because you're not allowed to stay in the area and must take a chase that lets the gens complete".
We don't want a solution that just guarantees an eventual survivor victory after four gens are completed (the above powering-on would be a similar one--at that point, the Survivors can just refuse to engage on their side and will win)
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@Nirgendwohin said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3368774#Comment_3368774
survivor and killer has to go to the boon, so its a loss for both.
hex totems are covering the whole map, what about these?
It's more of a loss for a Killer--a lot of totem spots are in places the Killer has no place going to, or no place going to after the nearby generator has been cleared--but the boon still goes right through the area. Main building on Eyrie is a massive offender: it's a huge detour for a Killer to go up there after one Survivor has, and then you get this big safe area covering the entire main building and possibly another generator if it's positioned well. Or something like Midwich, where you could just spawn near the totem, and then the Killer would have to go out of their way to find it whilst the Survivor, uh, didn't.
Hexes are designed around covering the entire map, they're not even slightly relevant. I mean, seriously? The issue is that boons and drone placements going through floors means they're covering literally double the space they should and it makes it super annoying for the other side to try and deal with it if it keeps coming back. Hexes are affecting the area they're meant to. <_>
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@Nirgendwohin said:
A boon takes 14 (28 if its a hex) seconds to set up if you dont count the time to go to the location. meanwhile the survivor is not on a gen, so the pressure on the killer is reduced. it also give the killer information over the location where survivors go to heal after they lost them in chase.
losing a drone has little to no drawback on Gideon Meat Plant, Midwich or RDP. it even creates passive pressure on the respective survivors.
so why should both be treated the same?
Why SHOULDN'T they be the same? You still have maps where the Killer would have to take way more time to go out of their way to get the boon because the totem spawn was on another floor, and where the effective area covered by the boon is over double what it's designed around being.
The entire point is that these things are covering way more than they're supposed to.
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@Chocolate_Cosmos said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3368723#Comment_3368723
Then how would you change her? That's like the only way in her current state to prevent holding games forever.
Rework, probably. Maybe make things less about exposed (and not something Survivors can disable) and just buff her and give info. Maybe pivot hard into something weird like the maximum deployable increasing over the course of the match so if it does get dragged out, that's almost universal coverage (or universal over what's left)
I think the distance limit is already pretty daft, it's already annoying enough when you get powers that go 'can't be used you're too close to a hook' and you just have to guess at it.
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@Chocolate_Cosmos said:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3368707#Comment_3368707
Better at 3-gen? No, she can't have a drone next to every gen anymore + she has longer cooldown.
Only thing that would buff her is her chase.
"You can only cover two gens if three are close together" would suggest a Killer who's screwed out of using their power half the time because 'no, you're too close'. Imagine that restriction on the Game or Midwich. <_>